Running Multiple Locos Together With DCC (215)

[@jasonworden8209]

Just ran my first consist today thanks to your video! I just got my second SD90MAC, & also my NCE Power Cab Smart Booster. I'm so thankful for your informative videos! You make the best and most detailed vids! Thank you Larry! Now I just need to speed match them so they're not fighting each other. They are both Athearn SD90MAC's, but they're just a hair off speed wise & starting voltage wise. I'm new to all this stuff and it's kind of overwhelming, but I'm loving it!

[@stuartaaron613]

Something to remember about using the NCE system with Advanced consisting. The consist addressses, 1-127, are Short addresses. If you have a locomotive with a short address that is the same as the Consist address, it will run when you run the consist. One way around this is to take advantage of the fact that NCE allows you to create Long addresses from the Short address range. When programming the address for a locomotive whose number is between 1-127, select Long address, and then program the address with a leading 0 (zero). So locomotive 125 would be addressed 0125, locomotive 89 would be 089, and locomotive 5 would be 05. When you select one of these locomotives the NCE system recognizes them as long addresses because of the leading 0.

[@KingTrump2024]

So with Advanced Consist on the NCE, do I need to set the consist address and other settings in the decoder or just go to town with the long address ? I tried Advanced with Atlas Gold / QSI with less than desirable results. I do remember setting consist addresses in the decoders, which I'm not sure I should of done after watching this video.

[@stuartaaron613]

@@KingTrump2024 When you program consists with NCE Advanced Consists, the system will automatically program the consist address into CV19 in the decoder. Then you can control the consist either with the consist address, or using the address of the first or last locomotive (when using the last locomotive, the direction is reversed). As for QSI, their decoders are garbage. They do not do well being programmed for consists (personal experience).

[@tonyrobinson362]

Thankyou so much from UK its easy when your shown thanks again.

[@michaelfedora5630]

Love your videos they are super informative

[@DelayInBlockProductions]

Great video!

[@davidsheriff8989]

This is very informative and simple to follow...great stuff..

[@barry3573]

Thanks for the video Larry it's a huge help for me. I'm new to the hobby and have become obsessed with it lol. I really enjoy your videos and they have a lot of helpful information.

[@cherijim2911]

You're right, I probably need to look at more of your "consisting" videos. I have an NCE Power cab and have used the "advanced" method of setting up the consist before, but now I'm confused. I was trying to run a couple of my locos at Just Trains in Concord, CA on their layout using their NCE Power cabs (I forgot to bring mine) with no luck and ended up running the locos individually. I'm thinking what I may do is set up the consists at home and make notes of which loco is in which consist, direction of travel, etc. and then run them like that.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Maybe this will help you understand the difference between NCE consists and others ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/210072746-NCE-consisting-VS-the-Others and also ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115001112643-Setting-up-an-Advanced-Consist-the-NCE-way

[@richardnelson-ux1zz]

Another great video thanks

[@peterfarrington3702]

Thank you Larry, you have just removed a load of the mystery of the whole Consisting system, I use the NCE Power Cab system so when I can get back outside to my layout I will be giving it a try with now a lot less apprehension than before your video.

[@mckerrowsiding]

Thank you so much. This demystified consisting for my. Great video now in my saved list

[@thebfsniper1869]

On the NCE advanced consist you can also "switch" locos by selecting the other loco in the consist. You can also delete the consist by typing in the lead loco number so you don't need to remember the 127-1 address

[@peterjhillier7659]

Thanks Larry, I use Digitrax, so I’ll try the Universal with my Norfolk Southern Genesis SD70m2 and my SD60E. Many Thanks looks like it’s going to be an early Fall here in southwest Britain this Year. Keep safe.

[@elsdp-4560]

Thank you for sharing. Love my Digitrax, this is what I cut my teeth on.

[@robertheroux2402]

Great video Larry!

[@roberttrains8696]

Good video larry Thanks for sharing Robert Trains

[@fiercetrains4052]

Very helpful

[@alanmusicman3385]

Larry! You missed out ""Double Heading" as one of the other names for it (I think in the UK that's the only name we use for it?). You know I had never thought about how this might work in model-world, but now I am intruiged - going to watch this again and the previous sessions as well. Many thanks!

[@TheDCCGuy]

We call a consist of 2 locos a double header and that most often refers back to steam locos. Most railroads here run more than 2 locos together so the term consist or multiple unit is more common and I fell back into my habit of using North American nomenclature-mea culpa.

[@alanmusicman3385]

@@TheDCCGuy No problem :-) Quadruple, or quintuple header is a bit of mouthful to say anyway! I don't think in the UK we ever saw more than two locos on a train, of course the trains are seldom, if ever, as long as North American ones - neither do they do such long routes.

[@ingor.522]

In some european countries the prototype stare railways do not allow to work more than three active locos or railcars in their systems at all in general. Private city networks with own track systems have other rules and can make their own rules. Metropolitan or subway cars as example can run into more than three combined units as well as possible, limitations are mostly the platform lengths. At Frankfurt City on River Main in middle of Germany, the city networks of the Vgf using a 5 Unit Consist or Railcars during the rush hours in the morning and afternoon hours on workdays. There is one network station with a very short platform so the first railcar unit and the 5th railcar unit standing both inside the tunnel and only one door are at the platform when servicing this tunnel station. The mostly done multiple units are double header with pushing loco in the rear onto state railroads in general use, where it is needed i.e. onto deep grades at Austria as example so two very powerful old style electric locomotives came up to bring such heavy passenger trains up hill to the summit across the alps. In other causes by steam locomotives double header abd pushing locos where a comon practise in the past to move heavy weight trains in service.

[@dundasjunctionmodelr.r-jam8267]

Great video Larry, I guess NCE pro Cab set up the same but I am getting the new TCS throttle when it comes out

[@TheDCCGuy]

The last I heard from TCS they are still waiting delivery of the throttle cases.

[@yzfmike84]

Great video! As a note you are not required to use the consist address. You can use the locomotive number (6547 in this case ) for the Kill Con and it will do the same as well for NCE.

[@tinytowntrainstv]

Thanks...just getting started with my layout building series and I am always looking for tips and tricks when it comes to automating some of the operations. T4

[@1701_FyldeFlyer]

Good vid, Larry. It seemed to me in the digitrax consist one loco was slower stopping than the lead? Over here in the UK we tend to call consists 'double heading' as it is unusual to see more than 2 locos, especially diesels, working a train as one. In the days of steam there were occasionally 3 locos but that was not the norm. We call DMUs, diesel multiple units which are passenger carriage trains linked together that run under their own power. An electric powered unit would be called an EMU. Nowadays modern UK stock is built so it can run on overhead electric power cables or diesel generated electric motors.

[@TheDCCGuy]

We often call it double heading as well.

[@scottwendt9575]

When you upgrade from PowerCab to PowerPro the Old Consist limit goes from 2 to 4 locomotives in addition to all the available slots for Advanced Consists… As for Digitrax…. While the universal consist register in the Command station may not be a limitation on home layouts, I have belonged to 2 clubs that constantly ran into problems with too many members and not enough consist slots to go around. The result was only basic consisting was allowed during open houses to prevent embarrassing system errors in front of the public. Those of us with NCE systems were also not allowed to use Advanced Consists programmed at home on the club layout due to Loconet conflicts in those low address ranges.

[@434srt90]

Love the videos but just returning to the hobby after years, dcc is still new but can seem to figure out the cv values for advance consisting, sucks being mechanically inclined then book smart, idk if there is easy way to approach for nce pro cab

[@TheDCCGuy]

I covered consisting in videos 53-55 and advanced consisting was in #55 so go back and take a look at that one.

[@434srt90]

@@TheDCCGuy saw that but does it also work with using esu decoder from scaletrains and broadway, been searching how to use either and everything, still trying to get use to speed matching also

[@TheDCCGuy]

It works with all DCC decoders that support advanced consisting and to my knowledge all in current production do that, it is a standard. Now some companies like SoundTraxx may provide additional features but they still support the basic features of advanced consisting.

[@Stilicho19801]

A nice feature of Advanced mode is that you work with head and rear loco numbers for control, instead of the consist number.

[@colinhamshaw1468]

Hi Larry, I’ve just returned to model railways and DCC. I’m using a NCE Powercab unit and have a naive question about consists. I assume that the initial thing to do before consisting is to individually program each loco to check that the basic functions are working. Should this be done on a program track or on the main before adding the loco’s into the consist program? Does it matter ? Also on the Powercab system i keep seeing different answers to how many consists ( and separate loco’s) a basic Powercab can hold in its Recall function....Have you any info on this please? Any advice on these questions would be appreciated, if you can Larry...I’ve been “ playing” with the Powercab for a short while and gradually finding my way around its functions etc... I think ( for me anyway) it’s a great piece of kit... The information you give on this controller ( and all aspects of model railways) is very informative!...Thank you for your tutorials .. Regards.. Colin Hamshaw ( London)

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, you need to get the decoder programmed and running as smooth as possible. You also need to speed match the locos so they respond the same to throttle settings. See my video on speed matching. Programming can be on the main or service mode track. The advantage of using service mode is you can read back CV settings but not on the main. My manual says recall can be set up to 6 and can be different for each cab or throttle. However I fond 2-3 to be the most convenient number when actually running trains.

[@colinhamshaw1468]

@@TheDCCGuy Thank you Larry.. I have purchased your manuals and the information you have given is very helpful starting out with DCC ( after a 40 year gap and leaping into this era from my DC days). Thank you again. Colin

[@tommynorton9811]

Hi Larry, quick question, This is my first time running a layout with dcc so I’m pretty new and don’t know much. would it be possible to run a consist of 2 locos back to back? I have a digitrax dcc controller if that makes a difference. Thanks for your help

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, and it is actually quite easy with Digitrax universal consisting. Get out your manual and read the section on universal consists and do a step by step operation. The command station will actually keep track of the correct direction of each loco in the consist.

[@gmcliff555]

once the 2 locos are consisted, how would you adjust the horn and lights to work (or not work) properly ?? Example, horn and bell, only on leading loco ??

[@TheDCCGuy]

See my videos on advanced consisting, that allows you to predetermine which functions respond when in a consist. That way you can specify that only the lead loco responds to horn and bell commands.

[@Phil-wq9uq]

I am looking at upgrading the old DC trains (track was disassenbled 15 years ago when I got cancer. So I am still looking at what "system" to get. You called the Digitrak 602 somerthing after you said "the 600 series of" ?????? at time mark "0.53". What was it you called them?

[@TheDCCGuy]

600 series of throttles.

[@brianwebster4858]

Will this work the same with the NCE PRO CAB...also how can I get the used amps on the PRO CAB screen.

[@TheDCCGuy]

No, it only works with the PowerCab and only in the as built configuration. When using it with the SB5 or other NCE systems you lose the feature.

[@KingTrump2024]

So if the PowerCab has a limit for Universal (old) consisting, does the same limit exist in the ProCab throttle ? If so, you just sold me on Digitrax. I have bricked more locomotives (Atlas with the QSI garbage decoders) with NCE Advanced consisting then I can count, just can get it working on NCE.

[@TheDCCGuy]

For the Power Pro system: Number of consists: 127 advanced consists of unlimited number of locomotives each. Plus 250 old style consists up to 4 locos each.

[@lowliferedneck]

So which one is better to use on the nce powercab - old or advanced , and do you have to speed match the 2 locomotives ???

[@TheDCCGuy]

Depends on which you prefer not what I prefer-I can’t make that decision for you. They both work.

[@claytons8263]

Is it possible to consist two engines in DC with out using a dummy engine? Last question can I add a decoder to a dummy engine?

[@TheDCCGuy]

I am not sure what you are asking in your first question so please reword it. You can put a decoder in a dummy engine as long as it has power pickups or a way to get power to it from the track.

[@claytons8263]

@@TheDCCGuy Other then DC CAN can you run duel engines that are not DCC?

[@TheDCCGuy]

I don’t think so unless you are asking about some of the European command control systems and that would depend on how operate.

[@claytons8263]

@@TheDCCGuy Ok that's what I thought but I wasn't sure.I Love the videos very informative please keep up the great work thank you.

[@jonahbernatz7709]

Are you able to through switches with the NCE procab DCC system?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes

[@jonahbernatz7709]

Can you point me in the right direction to do that?

[@jonahbernatz7709]

Never mind I found one of your videos that show me that, thank you!

[@JPOGers]

Would I need a controller like this to run multiple DCC locomotives in lashup at the same speed or is it possible to do so with something like the Zephyr Express DCS 52?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Instructions for MU operations start on page 28 of your manual.

[@billwells6160]

Did you previously speed match the locos?

[@TheDCCGuy]

In that case it wasn’t needed because they are identical locos with the same decoders. So they could be expected to run well together right out of the box.

[@adrianolsen-woodhamwoodtur4980]

Hi Larry. Two questions on consisting. 1. Do the decoders have to be the same type/brand? …..and 2. Do the motor CVs (2, 3,4,5, and 6) have to be set to the same values? I have the Digitrax system. Thanks so much for your excellent channel.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Watch video #244

[@alanwiggins8073]

Hi Larry This question may have been answered before and if so I apologise, but how do you get the loco headlights/taillights to come on automatically when the loco is on the track and to change when the direction is changed? I'm using a Powercab and can't find the answer online. Many thanks in advance Alan

[@TheDCCGuy]

Do you want to use universal (old style) or advanced consists, it makes a difference.

[@claytons8263]

Can I consist a diesel and a steamer ? I want to Consist my proto 2000 SD-60 (2) ( has a sound traxx decoder)And my Big boy (4014) The decoder in my big boy is unknown. I have a per cab system. Thank you

[@TheDCCGuy]

I have no idea what a “per cab” system is. It is possible to consist them but it may take a lot to speed match them. Try doing a universal consist of them and see how far off their speeds are.

[@claytons8263]

@@TheDCCGuy Power cab NCE

[@claytons8263]

@@TheDCCGuy ok great thank you

[@geraldjones2278]

What is the advantage (if any) of the "old" vs. new "Advanced" systems of consisting?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Advanced consists can be taken form one layout to another and still operate as a consist since the consist address is stored in the decoders. However there are also a lot of CV settings you can make to customize loco responses using advanced consists. Unfortunately these are not written into the decoder when an NCE advanced consist is made, only the address. I guess the main advantage is it takes some of the processing load off the microprocessor in the command station, but for most folks that is not noticeable.

[@cherijim2911]

Bearing in mind there's no such thing as a dumb question, how do you operate the consist after setting it up? Do you need to select the consist number or the lead loco's number or something else? Thanks!

[@TheDCCGuy]

Depends on now you set the consist up. If you use universal consisting then you will have already entered the lead loco address and that is the one you would use. If you use advanced consisting then you use the advanced consist assigned to the locos in the consist. If that doesn’t make sense then you need to watch the various videos I have done on consisting.

[@rhythmrailroad1101]

Excellent video Larry. Will you be doing a video in the future about consisting w/ sound decoders? I have a Digitrax system and while in consists will not turn off the bell and horn of the trailing locomotives. Thanks for your help. 🙏

[@TheDCCGuy]

Assuming you are using universal consisting then you probably at some point turned the headlights on while in consists and that is stored in the command station memory. When you send function commands to a consist they only go to the top or lead loco. Try activating each consisted loco by calling it up on the left hand throttle knob and then turn the lights off.

[@mattomon1045]

How many Consist can I do with an Nce power pro?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Power Pro Command Station Specifications: Cabs: 63 maximum Number of simultaneous trains: 250 Number of consists: 127 advanced consists of unlimited number of locomotives each. Plus 250 old style consists up to 4 locos each. Range of locomotive addresses: 0-9999 Range of consist addresses: 1-127 Range of accessory addresses: 1-2044 Range of signal addresses: 1-2044 Computer interface: RS-232 included Of course it all depends on how many boosters you have, their collective amperage, and how that power is distributed around the layout.

[@ronduz1281]

Great video Larry! Should the locos be speed matched?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, but easier to just use similar models with the same decoder.

[@graemehansell7642]

Hi Larry. Greetings from Austria. How do you cope with making a consist with locos that have marginally different speeds at the same throttle setting?

[@TheDCCGuy]

See my videos 21 & 56 on speed matching. In the end though it is easier to just consist locos from the same manufacturer and using the same decoder.

[@ChristopherBaskerville]

I have one locomotive that will not consist but runs fine by itself

[@JacksonSubNScaleModelRailroad]

And what no one ever shows is how to do a consist back to back. One facing forward and one facing reverse. Its very hard to do on the DT602D. PITA. The older 4 and 500 series throttles were so much easier to consist with.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Just set them on the track back to back and make sure they are running that way. Then make the consist. On NCE Set them on the track back to back, and when the throttle asks the direction of the locos hit enter when it shows F on the lead loco and then on the rear loco hot the direction key to get it to display R then finish the consist. Easy, peasy