Lazy Eights - CFI DEMO with 4 Camera Pilot Perspective™ - flying lesson added to Ground School

[@JavaSQL]

My goodness Jason! I'm in commercial training I admit that Lazy Eights was the maneuver I was most nervous and concerned about - get this - BEFORE even attempting one. Then I watched your video with "The Candourist" and now this video. I gotta tell you, after eventually demonstrating Lazy Eights in practice with my flight instructor, I said to him "how does anyone not love this maneuver?". The truth is that you, Jason, make it so difficult to mess this maneuver up and consequently, you make it just as difficult to dislike it. I really don't believe anyone else can articulate and demonstrate this incredibly fun maneuver better than you have. So, thank you and make more commercial maneuvers please.

[@mikelombart]

This is going to be an awesome teaching aid. I really love the fact that you've started shooting these videos with a camera set at the pilot's eye level. Thanks Jason!

[@mrkc10]

Less is more…I like it. Again probably one of the best demo videos I’ve seen.

[@SVSky]

Our 10K hour hang glider pilot mentor said something that stuck with me into my PPL: Aircraft are primarily turned with pitch input. Had the wife and I doing lazy 8s over the coast, tried the same thing in planes and worked like a charm!

[@masontubb1476]

Nicely flown Lazy Eight! Thanks very much for putting your videos out...There a lot of help!

[@TheFinerPoints]

🙌

[@dr.aviator]

Much needed! I have my Commercial Checkride tomorrow.

[@EvanDaFish2012]

Thank you for posting. I’m a Commercial student struggling with this and your 4 camera video answers a lot of my questions in time for my checkride in 7 days time.

[@ArcticMayhem]

Jason I love the way you fly Lazy 8's. They have become my absolute favorite maneuver and I use your video to teach my students the maneuver. That usually leads into a conversation around the question: "What control surface did we use to make that turn?". It's an interesting discussion with a lot of head scratching at the beginning, because they really didn't use any control inputs besides elevator and rudder for coordination.

[@benrich6423]

Your intro gets me hyped up about flying every time

[@Kevlux86]

Excellent help with the multiple cameras!

[@rupunnb1458]

@TheFinerPoints Hi Jason, At the 45° point, at cruise speed, 15° bank with the maximum *pitch-up attitude* what would the acceptable climb? Thanks!

[@BobbyChastain]

Mt. Diablo is always a visual point for me 😜. That and the snow capped mountains 180 from it. So fun to see you fly my airspace.

[@norivera88]

Nice! Thanks for the additional tips. Love watching your channel. Have my Commercial Checkride tomorrow.

[@TheRealYaro]

How did your checkride go? Hope all went well!

[@pdawdy]

Thanks for having Mount Diablo as a reference. I grew up staring at it. I think your other reference to the south might be Mount Hamilton.

[@rickairs551]

Nice demo, greetings from the Netherlands , crew ph-hms 👍

[@stangshorts2504]

I started my commercial training this semester! I'm looking forward to flying this!

[@martinko2110]

I will try this on my next flight for sure! Thanks for your effort you put into making these videos :)

[@goatflieg]

Of course I'm familiar with Mt. Diablo and the Skyline ridge; I'm guessing that your 45 degree point was Fremont Peak. I'm grateful for the reminder to practice this maneuver some more the next chance I get to fly... and thankful as always for sharing some of my favorite views, making a cold gray snowy day in Michigan a little easier to bear.

[@jamdown1981]

I love this video. You make Lazy 8s look so simple. Can you do a video on chandelles and accelerated stalls?

[@TheFinerPoints]

There is a Chandelle video on the channel ... and you can find the accelerated stall lesson in our Ground School app www.learnthefinerpoints.com/

[@abbieamavi]

*im in commercial training rn and these videos are the best!!*

[@TheFinerPoints]

Awesome! Thank you!

[@Chiefpilot414]

so you don't have set angles of pitch and bank at each segment of the turn!?

[@ThatWasLoud]

Absolutely brilliant.

[@seanmcerlean]

Great video Jason

[@TheFinerPoints]

Thanks! 🙌

[@deltaVrich]

Thanks for all the videos. Always great stuff.

[@c_kemper]

Definitely going to try it. Just waiting for lock down to end so I can finally do my check ride!

[@bollewillem1]

I am also waiting, waiting to do my final exam to get my private pilote licence.

[@triboarder06]

Do you have recommendations on how to do this in a constant speed 182, do you use full fine, does it matter?

[@SoldiaT]

Nice video, thanks again. I love these demonstrations. One question though: What about the Polarized Sun Glasses? No big deal for gauges, but for the Displays it's causing troubles for sure.

[@FlyingRagilein]

How about power? Do you have to reduce it slightly at the start of the maneuver to prevent ending up with a higher speed at the end? This might be aircraft specific, though.

[@JohnDebrey]

How important is it to be on exact bank angles for each point (45,90,135) whenever I teach this maneuver the biggest issue is students rolling out to quickly. It seems like you always need a little bit of extra bank carried through from the 135 point.

[@BK-it6te]

Why do you need Lazy 8 ?? For

[@gabby6139]

it looks like you use a lot more than 30° of bank, is that okay to do?

[@snowman1987]

When do stop applying back pressure and then when do you start releasing back pressure?

[@tianyangsun8107]

Stop adding back pressure after 45. Release back pressure at 135 . And just before the entry pull your power back slightly.

[@nghicks42]

@@tianyangsun8107 why pull power just before starting the maneuver? Doesn’t that leave you energy deficient by the time you finish?

[@tianyangsun8107]

@@nghicks42 yes, that’s true theoretically. But what I discovered is that pulling the power back by roughly 50-100rpm on a PA28 or equivalent will actually give you much higher success rate on lazy eights. This gives you minimum speed at 90 point, increased ROT from 90-180 so that you can actually be at 15 bank angle at 135 point, and lastly no more high and fast rollouts at 180 point.

[@nghicks42]

@@tianyangsun8107 my CFI had me going full throttle at the entry, and chopping power back during the descent. I practiced it that way while under dual instruction, but practiced it using constant power when I was practicing solo. 😏 The 172 I used was pretty good at starting/ending at the same energy level.

[@tianyangsun8107]

@@nghicks42yep, the ACS gives you lots of freedom how you do lazy eights. I usually do the power back method to force it to meet what the AFH suggested.

[@kyqx]

Is than bank rate not supposed to be consistent throughout the maneuver?

[@lg4136]

I would say this looks pretty constant. The only time it won’t be would be when straight and level in between turns, which should only be for a brief few moments and in a *perfectly* flown lazy 8 even less than that. These are definitely “within standards” but you can certainly hold yourself to higher standards if you dare!

[@kyqx]

@@lg4136 At 3:16, he rolls about 20+ degrees of bank in the last 10 degrees of heading. That would not pass the ride back in my day but I'm getting old;).

[@lg4136]

@@kyqx you should be a patent lawyer! (haha). I'm sure if you verbalized the situation to the examiner and explained how you would fix it everything would be okay. Examiner might request another example but I think it could work. Not sure!

[@bryan.meijer]

Very nice 👍

[@TheFinerPoints]

🙌

[@suzukitlr01]

It looks so easy in the Cessna, I don’t find it nearly as simple in the DA-40. Any tips for how to do it in the diamond specifically?

[@chrisborozan5129]

What speed are you starting it at?

[@suzukitlr01]

@@chrisborozan5129 around 90 knots

[@chrisborozan5129]

@@suzukitlr01 Try starting at ~110 Knots it gives you more energy to convert into altitude. Both the DA20 and 40 are very responsive. Little inputs will go a long way, plus do your best to let the airplane, airplane once you've gotten past the 90 point.

[@mattyflying5483]

Cool vid!

[@JasonWoodard]

I like it

[@YouLoveMrFriendly]

You should put your videos on Rumble. I've just about left KZbin but I miss the flying videos.

[@TheFinerPoints]

Got an account set up and will be starting this week. All videos going forward 👍

[@ehuntley83]

@@TheFinerPoints super exciting news! I'll be subbing there too ✌️

[@YouLoveMrFriendly]

@@TheFinerPoints great! Love it

[@adjuaadama6623]

It's true that sharing advanced maneuvers to those who are presently working on certifications that don't require it help to make stronger pilots and give them more of a "global" big-picture perspective. Both the Chandelle and Lazy-8 helped me iron out my landings, and I would add both VMC demo and drag demos for multi-engine as well. I had a tendency to yank the yoke too much or prematurely when learning to land, and it followed me somewhat even after PPL and instrument. While during multi-private they still taught me the drag demo even though that's an MEI requirement (learned a lot more about single engine performance that way), and I was better because of it - especially once I was ready for the commercial multi checkride. But those commercial single-engine maneuvers gave me better control, as you said, in other aspects of piloting.

[@bigal1863]

Love Lazy 8's, but I still suck at turns about a point

[@mannypuerta5086]

That’s really good, but I have to tell you I never liked Lazy 8’s and haven’t done one for years. I really never saw the value to spend time gaining proficiency on a maneuver that didn’t contribute anything to the the art of professional flying. Pylon 8’s, yes. I use a single pylon turn during ground search for the Sheriff’s Office. Lazy 8’s are a waste of 100LL and an impractical application in a practical world. Sorry FAA. I obtained my Commercial in early 1968, taught for awhile, corporate flying for awhile, airlines for a long time and now that I’m retired I teach tailwheel, mountain and backcountry flying...all successfully without involving Lazy 8’s during any of the training other than the FAA mandated SE Commercial training. The only 8 I ever really liked was a DC-8.

[@jonathanguthrie9368]

Some maneuvers are tested, not because they're especially useful, but because they require that the candidate know things that a successful candidate should know. The easiest example to illustrate this that I can think of is parallel parking on the driver's test. It's tested, not because parallel parking is an essential skill for drivers, although it can be useful--I got really good at parallel parking when I drove pizza in college, but because when you successfully parallel park, you demonstrate that you can estimate where your car's front, back, and right sides are, all of which are kind of important if you're going to drive on a road with other cars. I've seen the claim that lazy 8's are like that. You don't demonstrate them on the test because it's a maneuver you're going to do, but because if you can do them properly, it shows that you know how to handle the aircraft the way someone with a commercial certificate should be able to handle an aircraft. Mr. Miller spends the very first part of the video explaining why he thinks it's important for all pilots to know how to this maneuver, and he never once says "this is a maneuver you will do all the time as a pilot." Instead he explains that it is useful to learn because it demonstrates an important part of the way airplanes fly, including in situations all pilots find themselves in.

[@mannypuerta5086]

@@jonathanguthrie9368 You might have missed my point. If the Lazy 8 maneuver is as valuable and important as you describe why is it not asked for during a Commercial pilot Flight Review? I would think that if demonstrating that particular capability is so important for the candidate to “know how to handle the aircraft the way someone with a Commercial certificate should be able to handle an aircraft” that it would be a recommended maneuver for Flight Reviews by the FAA. It is not mentioned anywhere and I have never heard of a Lazy 8 being requested during any Commercial pilot Flight Review. I certainly haven’t ever requested one. In reality, evaluating how one flies a traffic pattern, making short, normal, no flap and XW landings (if available) has realistic value and demonstrates the pilot’s capabilities in a more practical manner. The traffic pattern and landings reveals a lot about a pilot’s capability, understanding of all the components of flight involved and level of experience during real world conditions. If the evaluator needs to see more, he/she shouldn’t be an evaluator. Maybe a military pilot could chime in and tell us if he/she was required to perform Lazy 8’s during pilot training. If not...? I understand that we may have differing opinions on this and that is OK. I’m just relaying my experience on demonstrating and evaluating pilot capabilities.

[@MAGApepe]

kool :))

[@garycharpenter543]

Jason, the intro to your videos is way to long. It isn't the great content we come to watch it just gets in the way. Try cutting half of it out.

[@downwithreactionaries9031]

Lazy eight in skyhawk is too boring -- only gain 300 ft. :) Try it in a mooney to see how exciting it would be.

[@bigal1863]

Don't tease me ;)

[@DJ99777]

Ttbatiud Doo Doo Doo.