Harley Davidson Warranty: What's The Deal?

Harley Davidson does offer a two year warranty, but is it worth anything? What can you change? What can't you change? I'll give ya some how it works and some tips on what to do or what not to do.
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[@aronsingletary]

I appreciate you making this video regardless of what other channels are doing. You are the only Harley tech channel I watch.

[@mkalthouse]

Think my stator failure was due to my 49-state FP3? Thought not - even the factory reps at Black Hills HD during Sturgis last year knew that. Magnusen-Moss clearly states that a warranty cannot be denied unless an after-market component can be shown to be the cause. Fact. Yet my warranty was voided and my stator was not covered - until I threatened a law suit and a whole bunch of noise. They finally coughed up the $750 bucks for my stator repair, but my power train warranty was still voided. To think that HD is not benefiting from this "deal" is naive at best. The stench is enough to drive me to my nearest Indian dealer. Having said that, I will say that this is the most unbiased (either way) and most informed video regarding this cluster-fuck yet. Kudos for that.

[@TheHarleyTech]

Oh I’m not saying it doesn’t suck, and any help it brings H-D won’t last long. I know more people waiting to do performance than people that are buying HD performance.

[@oldcratch]

You're not wrong, what Harley is doing with warranty these days is illegal as hell (Magnuson-Moss act). Yes, this will absolutely benefit them in the long run, they void warranties (lots and lots and lots of voided warranties) for customer installed items not attributed to the/any initial issue, they'll save millions. It'll take a huge lawsuit to correct this, until this happens (potentially decades of litigation), they bank the money. It's win win for them. This isn't about not covering customer installed items, but voiding entire warranties strictly based on a customer installed item, even with no issues present. Get you bike dyno tuned, bring it in for warranty work on a cracked fender, the the tech plugs in digital tech (now mandatory for shops), it detects tuning software, Bam!, your warranty is now void with no issue present. This is a really big problem here in Cali. 20+ years (and currently) as a Harley tech.

[@paulb354]

Its not a matter of proving a part causing the failure, so Moss Magnusson doesnt apply. Its a matter of EPA compliance.

[@mkalthouse]

​@@paulb354 - I suggest you read Magnusen-Moss AND the consent decree (the latter is a "ruling" by non-elected bureaucrats and the former is an actual law enacted by our elected representatives). You obviously have no idea what either one actually says.

[@paulb354]

@@mkalthouse Ha, yeah, ok.

[@seH2i]

I purchased a 2018 Heritage, color red denim oxide February 2018. It has 10,468 miles on it now. At the bottom of the rear fender behind the plastic chrome edge piece the paint has chipped because of rust underneath. Above the plastic chrome edge piece the paint has a bubble in it the size of a dime. At the top of the rear fender above the license plate bracket the paint is fading. I maintain the bike, always clean and I use the Harley Matte Paint Cleaner. Harley refuses to address the rust and paint bubble because they feel; " the bike has not been maintained and it's been used in harsh conditions. " ( they don't even know me or my riding habits ) I never took it off road, I ride only paved roads and it is cleaned regularly using Harley products and in a accordance with the washing procedures described in the manual. Bubbling paint is NOT a maintenance issue!

[@roberthodges1650]

So far my warranty covered the locks on my saddle bag and my fogging speedometer which btw doesnt fog up anymore. Thanks Harley .

[@AV84USA]

Harley-Davidson’s powertrain warranty IS the Harley-Davidson warranty. A friend’s CVO engine burned up (sumping) while riding next to me. A common problem that required a new engine, however, if he’d changed his muffler he would have been screwed. Sumping is unrelated to the EPA or slip-on mufflers and is a shitty copout by the MoCo.

[@2004sadmanco]

AV84USA my thing is, if you keep your factory mufflers and put them back on before taking the bike to the dealership (believing that they’ve never recorded the aftermarket part being installed), will it still be “ok.” I’m sure mufflers aren’t shown on ECM scans

[@road_king_dude]

@@2004sadmanco that's a great question

[@jeffreycarroll5920]

The dealership here in Jacksonville puts aftermarket slip ones on some of their new bikes on the floor. They use it as a sales point to sell the mufflers. Example, I put MK45s on my bike after hearing the ones on the sales floor....had them put them on.

[@KeyResults1]

Oh man, one of the rare times I have been disappointed by you John. The ONLY things that I believe people want to know is If you have a new stock M8 Harley and change one or more of the following does it void ALL Factory (MoCo) Drivetrain Warranty claims: Mufflers Air Cleaner Tuner Head Pipes CAM And, in each of the above, does it matter if it’s an official HD part or an aftermarket part? And, lastly, in each of the above, does it matter if the owner installs it or the dealer installs it? We get the first 60 days new bike stuff, so let’s just say that it’s after the initial 60 days. Thank John. Kenny

[@TheHarleyTech]

I thought I answered that. I mean, beat it to death in over 20 minutes. Any change to the exhaust voids your power train warranty, and the tuner is read by the computer and will auto void power train. I also explained why this is happening.

[@KeyResults1]

John Maxwell you’re making a blanket statement that I find hard to believe. I bought from HD a SE Stage 1 kit, and installed it per the instructions. SE Pro Street Tuner, Ventilator AC and Mufflers, 100% HD. And, you are saying that MoCo will no longer warranty my 24 Mo drive train? Really? This is REALLY important John. Urlacher said the same on his channel, which just cannot be reality.

[@mikedanaher3413]

Great content again John Maxwell. Between you and Matt Laidlaw , you guys are my go to for information that is sound. Not just internet crying. Thanks. PS more blooper reels. 😂😂😂

[@yarply12]

I bought a two year old 2006 xl1200c from a private owner and immediately went and bought an extended service plan on it. Had the starter go out about 6 month later, and it cost me 50 bucks to get it fixed, then paid out of pocket for the dealership to do a stage two upgrade with vance and hines pipes. within two months my front cylinder head gasket started leaking oil. It cost me 50 bucks to get it fixed. Now I had heard that if any after market parts are put on your bike, including after market pipes it voids all warranties and or your extended service plan. it didnt effect me on my bike, but maybe where I take my bike cares more about their customer service than other dealerships. Smokey Mtn Harley. Maryville Tn.

[@ntdfmaverick]

I knew about all this in bits and pieces... the EPA and a "tougher" stance on warranties... but I never had the connection spelled out to me. Thank you for the video. I watch them all!

[@mikeskidmore6754]

Here Harley-Davidson also purchased most of Castalloy, a South Australian producer of cast motorcycle wheels and hubs. The South Australian government has set forth "protection to the purchaser (Harley-Davidson) against environmental risks".[149] In August 2016 Harley-Davidson settled with the EPA for $12 million, without admitting wrongdoing, over the sale of after-market "super tuners".[150][151] Super tuners were devices, marketed for competition, which enabled increased performance of Harley-Davidson products. However, the devices also modified the emission control systems, producing increased hydrocarbon and nitrogen oxide. Harley-Davidson is required to buy back and destroy any super tuners which do not meet Clean Air Act requirements and spend $3 million on air pollution mitigation.

[@bradleyalexander5821]

Thanks “thumbs” I’m thinking that was a good perspective from a tech/consumer point of view. 👍🏼 😎

[@alterchristopher]

To answer your question mr Maxwell yes in the automotive space they have to prove that the aftermarket part caused the damage ie muffler on a civic dose not automatically void the warranty claim for a faulty clutch in the trans. I would support Harley if it was just about falling into epa compliance and voiding warranty with race tuners or if someone put a aftermarket cam on the bike ect. But to void say a claim on a transmission because i put Vance Hines slip on mufflers on my bike is a major reaction going along way. Not only that i have been told that even if i use screamin eagle parts if install them it would void my warranty the same. Basically my take away is dont buy the extended warranty because you will do something to void it save the 1400 or so bucks. I will be getting with Harley about what i have to do to cancel that for sure lol. I get why Harley Davidson is reacting this way i just think they have overreacted.

[@gpaje]

There's no smog test or inspections of motorcycles in California. The second a bike leaves the dealer, almost always the cat and other smog stuff is thrown in a dumpster. However, there are emissions laws for new bike sales manufacturers have to meet to sell them. Once they are sold, they are not enforced.

[@CarlRecktenwaldJr]

Why doesn’t Harley just come out and say if you do this than your warranty is void. Etc.

[@stucrisco4790]

I was on a trip to the NE, my speedometer and all front gauges went out. I took the bike to Boston HD and they replaced the speedometer cluster and then told me my bill was $158 which included a 15% discount. When I questioned why I was being charged labor on a warranty claim I was told that even though it was warranty work I did have to pay the $50 deductible but I was also responsible for the dianogistic labor which is not covered by my ESP plan. after some arguing back and forth I was "allowed" to just pay the $50 deductible and the dealership said they would "eat" the labor costs. I do believe they were trying to take advantage of me because I was traveling.

[@TheHarleyTech]

ESP does not cover diagnostic time, which sucks for us, but sucking for us doesn’t mean it has to suck for the customer. You learn to diagnose really fast!

[@anitabonghit266]

One thing you missed is it can still get voided even if you don't plug into DT. They have gone through past work orders and voided bikes. In the past and still right right the only way to void warranty was to let tech services know the bike has been modified in anyway and then they would flag the bike for powertrain or cosmetic stuff dependingon what was added. There is two more things that will void powertrain and that is trailers or trailer hitches and massive flags on the back of bikes.

[@Jeff-em7zs]

I my dealer actually sells woods cams and tts tuners. I asked about the sepst and they recommend the tts. Said if they did the install they'd stand behind it. Did BBC a 22x cam full exhaust and tts. It's so much fun now.

[@SteveLyco]

Been watching you videos for some time and just noticed the TAB on the wall of your work station brother!! RLTW!! Class 8-89 1/75 3/75

[@jeper08]

The Screamin Eagle heavy breather for an 88TC says its for race applications only. I didn’t care because I’m in Pa and we don’t do any emissions crap on motorcycles.

[@TheMachoGabacho]

Just so you know, we don’t have motorcycle inspections in California yet. However, CARB, the Cali version of EPA, has made it illegal to dyno tune a bike here. I have to go to Nevada to have my bike tuned. There are massive fines for shops and dealers who dyno bikes here. My local Harley dealer has their dyno collecting dust in the back of the shop. It’s really sad. California didn’t go after consumers who illegally modify their vehicles. They went after the shops who have the money to pay outrageous fines.

[@4paulseyes]

So stage one your bike, me> Vance & Hines big radius exhaust, Screaming Eagle heavy breather and a new ECM mapped and tuned Not stock and my warranty for the power train is null and void. I get it, don't like it but in the end I want my bike to be as I want it. Lesson here is be in good with your dealership or be really good with your hands and tools !

[@simmon81au]

I'm in Australia and ride a 18 SGS with a SE Stage 4 and a Redshift 472 cam dyno tuned with a Race Tuner. Bike sumped ounce at about 7k kms and I took it back to the dealer and they changed my oil pump under warranty no questioned asked. Sucks that your EPA is fucking HD around

[@PanM8]

There have been EPA warnings on our vehicles since the 70's. (Sound emissions and exhaust emissions) It was rarely enforced. There is a push in this country, by the left, to change our culture. They eventually want to do away with focil fuel engines. By making the regulations tighter, it's more expensive to design these engines. It's a long game. On the other hand, the EPA can be a good thing for keeping things clean here. But like every government agency in the U.S., they take things too far. Everything here in the states has politics in it. On a lighter note...hope to visit your country someday. I watched Million Dollar Bogan's trip around Australia. Looks like an awesome place.

[@BobBob-fp5fn]

My dad was having a stage 4 installed on his 2012 road glide and while the bike was taken apart the tech noticed the crank was cracked... bike only had 1300 miles on it at the time and was still under warranty. Harley made my dad pay for half of the crank to be fixed... fun shit

[@TheHarleyTech]

What the hell?

[@BobBob-fp5fn]

​@@TheHarleyTech True stuff. It wasn't the techs fault, the tech was actually trying to get the dealership to pay for it but they only would pay for half. The stage IV turned out great though.

[@graemewilliams1308]

If you have a problem, swap out all non Harley stuff before you ride in for assessment.

[@IrishBOBSister]

Motorclothes are also covered under warranty!! 😁 Most have a 90 day warranty; helmets, rain gear & functional outerwear (like nylon riding jackets) have a 1 year warranty; Leather Riding Jackets, Vests & Chaps have a 5 year. You can take your Motorclothing to any H-D Dealership with your proof of purchase (same with your parts & bike warranty) to ask about warranty repair or replacement.

[@TheHarleyTech]

True story.

[@tonyj8947]

Great info bro! Im in NY and the EPA laws are strict. Nobody will pass the yearly inspection if the bike isnt EPA compliant.

[@staffordguitar]

Buying a new Heritage check the panniers on the inside before you take it out of the showroom. Didn’t look inside my 2019 panniers for two weeks and found the leather inside pulling away from the plastic body causing the panniers top opening to rub and wear the out body leather covering. Harley warranty have said this is WEAR AND TEAR ! After two weeks? Come on. Anyway end result is Harley are ignoring me and the dealer is ignoring me so it’s either put up with the problem or go to court. Slightly spoiling what is a great bike. Harley warranty is not the best in my experience.

[@michaeljohn3559]

Thank you for the video man, very good. I have to admit i am a tinker with all of my bikes, came from having Triumphs to Harley, did not think much about anything when i bought my 17 Road Glide. So on went the slip on's and the 447 cams and intake and of course now i need a tuner, what? HD tuner does what? or the lack thereof? I mean a good tuner and a good tune has never hurt a thing i have owned and was almost assumed in most dealerships that changing pipes etc meant a good tuner. Never ever have i had an issue. And bye the bye no one said a thing to me while i was buying the bike and talking about my plans, not one peep. Now i am being "forced" , "leveraged" to by the HD tuner or possibly void the power train, heck good dyno guys won't even look at that tuner on their units. So the market is captured, no choice mine or no ones, pretty sure their is a law about such things. Anyways i rant, i do what i want and if HD black lists me for something very simple then the only way to reply is not buy another one, share value is a very large stick. Peace

[@Cwra1smith]

With that cam you won't gain much anyway so you might as well use the Pro Street and tune it at a dealership.

[@VRRider]

I don't know how can they void a power train warranty for a different exhaust? Say the exhaust you bought and you put the oxy sensors on it how does that void it when exhaust is the last place in the chain before it vents to the air? The oxy sensors should be doing their thing for engine management. If your engine blows up from say an oil starvation problem but the bike was full of oil what does the exhaust have to do with it not getting enough oil and voiding the warranty?

[@jamescrane3086]

Too happy to hear that the warranty deal is reactionary to government oversight rather than the company's insecurity over the quality of their product. Appreciate the info and the help your videos give.

[@joezednick3197]

Support your dealer,,,,,they will support you. I trust Harley or my dealer to take care of me if there is a "gray" area.

[@TheHarleyTech]

Very well put

[@annafraser8654]

Harley loves to screw their customers with voided warranties. I work at a police department that for years would use these www.mtcvoyager.com/standard-trike-kit/ in the winter months to allow the officers to ride in the winter. One day Harley decides we didn't make those and we are not making profit off them so we would void any suspension warranty claims as a result of the voyager kits. Anyone who knows how these officers ride their bikes they beat the hell out of them hoping curbs, riding them down stairs, etc, it is not beyond the realm that these suspensions will get beaten up, but they used these as an excuse to force the department to buy their crappy side car addons that cost 3 times what the basic voyager kit does. If they are not making the profit off the addon they will do everything to try and convince you with the threat of a voided warranty to change your ways.

[@TheYAMAMAHA]

Fuck yeah Black silk it is! Can you make a vid on rider to rider program and what warranty is done there.

[@patrickfreed8178]

Happy 4th Brother🎉🎆👍 thank you for all of your hard work you put in to your videos. Please keep them coming.

[@TheHarleyTech]

Happy 4th!

[@joecolbert2077]

I have a fluid transfer problem with my 17 limited, this seems to be a common problem that is not reported very often. Is there a fix, can you do a video on this major problem.

[@tannergemmell6428]

Something I wanted to be sure of, I just bought a new road glide and I'm looking to have a few things put on (SE Cams and Tuner, for the warranty) but I'm talking to my dealership and throwing on S&S pipes and intake, both of these components are CARB compliant. The dealership says their should not be an issue with voiding powertrain warranty because they are CARB compliant. What are your thoughts?

[@buckshot3495]

That was was your best video yet so far Mr. Maxwell! It SHOULD push you well closer to 200K subscribers. Keep up the good work John. And as for the epa? Well it needs to find out why farts smell bad? and we do humans exhale carbon dioxide.

[@garysmith3835]

John I would love to hear the story behind the folded flag on the wall.

[@jedicazador]

Gary Smith me too, RLTW

[@drtub92]

moss magnuson warranty act will explain who the burden of proof falls on.

[@danjones9007]

EPA stuff

[@hiposho68]

HD was using HD branded tuners.....most every other manufacturer use 3rd party tuners that is why they went after HD

[@TheHarleyTech]

Great point.

[@Jnu925]

John, outstanding, and now I'm late for work

[@road_king_dude]

I know the feeling well.

[@LuckysLair]

As always, yer a common sense kinda guy.....simple easy to understand video

[@bryanpatrick2073]

Dealer installed parts through GM is parts and labor.

[@nicksundby]

Ride with an armored jacket, it hurts a lot less when you come off

[@EddieG]

Best explanation.

[@garryvest687]

Warranty sucks I've had mine to 3 dealerships 5 different times fir my fuel door and they still refuse to just replace the $40 button they refused to warranty my clutch because I have aftermarket exhaust wouldn't warranty my tire tread separation on the stock tire and now I'm waiting on a headlamp because its flickering I'll never buy another new Harley

[@tcatnat70]

I bought a used '18 Road King last October with 157 miles on it. It has a dealer installed stage 1 (the dealer I bought it at did the work) and they insisted the warranty was valid through June 2020. However, online I keep on reading from fellow riders that the addition of any stage, 1, 2, 3, or 4 voids your powertrain warranty, mainly because of the aftermarket tuner.

[@scottscaneh]

Stage 1 is supplied by HD, and installed by HD dealer, you will have warranty

[@tcatnat70]

@@scottscaneh But they used a FP3 tuner so it sounds like they won't honor it based on John's comments.

[@PanM8]

@@tcatnat70 you have to talk to your selling dealer. They will probably honor the warranty through them. Not the factory. Sucks if you are on a trip and something happens in another dealership's territory. Talk to the general manager of your selling dealer! Not the sales dept., they will tell you anything.

[@johnscott5662]

How much warranty work actually gets done? My 2007 XLR and 2009 Dyna Lowrider never needed work. Experience factor with M-8? Maybe just screw the warranty.

[@joshrandall5297]

Good info, John. Where did you get the Ranger Tab and American Flag?

[@TheHarleyTech]

Ranger tab was a gift from a local viewer (he’s a ranger), and the flag flew over Afghanistan at a coworkers location when he was serving. He gives the low down in a video, but I don’t remember which one.

[@Cohiba6969]

What about using another brand of oil? Amsoil, Redline etc. How does that affect warranty? Harley warranty and gray area go hand in hand !

[@AkicitaWaste09]

I bought tires from RevZilla Micheline Cooper tires anyway went to have dealership install and they said they couldn't due to insurance. I was upset. Figuring just the fact paying labor on tires. But it is what it is I was gonna not buy anything from dealership any more but I like your channel so I haven't boycott. Anywho thanks for putting vids out. I ride 2014 Softail heritage

[@quidestnunc9238]

Here we go again, only this time it is The Missenden Flyer Engine Noise Technique rather than the typical KZbin pseudo-music overlay!! One thing Matt Laidlaw usually (but, unfortunately not always) does is record what He Has To Say separate from the Video events. Man, do I ever have an issue with listening and paying attention to What You Are Saying when the motor, wind and peripheral noise Intrudes !! Please check out some Fort 9 Moto Videos. Please.

[@TheHarleyTech]

What a weird comment. If you don’t like my style, you can just skip over them.

[@smoothoper8r5]

Looked at the comments right quick to see if it was asked, didnt it. But completely unrelated to the topic, whats up whith the ranger tab at your lift? You a ranger? Your dads or something? Just wondering. Good video.

[@neilreid4916]

Watching you in Saudi Arabia, you know that troublesome bit in the middle, great videos....👍

[@gimmieliberty6514]

In the UK, certain city's (london)are saying that bikes have to be euro 4 emission spec,if they are not there's a daily charge of about $20,life expectancy is higher than it's ever been,the green party gets 4% of the vote nationally, what the he'll is going on

[@MattLaidlaw]

Great video. Great to hear this from a technician. Great content John.

[@TheHarleyTech]

Thanks man! Looking forward to seeing you next month!!! Congrats on the Coast Glide!

[@350anthony]

Hi please respond to this, so I bought a new fat bob 114, I Took it in for a 5k service, with the service for 5 k mi. All oils are changed correct? Transmission, primary, motor oil a 3 correct? Well I just did my 10 k oil change and they did not change the TRANSMISSIONS OIL was red because I use redline only, so does Harley have any red transmission fluid??? Thanks, please respond!!!

[@jerecohan3944]

Can it catch you if you restore to factory tune before service? I have to do that with my truck and there doesn't seem to be a changelog in the system.

[@clarkbabin9799]

That guy was following you closely and rode around you ending g up in front of you. Couldn't tell who he was because he was shadowed.

[@AbbadonXII]

How about Canada ?

[@GalvTexGuy]

John, what if the customer removes the non-compliant tune and flashes the ECM back to stock before taking the bike into the dealer for warranty work? Would the DT II software still show a pop-up on the screen indicating the tuning parameters are out of Harley-Davidson specifications or that the ECM had been previously modified? Would the powertrain warranty still be voided?

[@TheHarleyTech]

I’m not sure if DT knows that it had ever been flashed or not.

[@glenhodgson6493]

Hey John, really enjoy your KZbin channel learn a lot from you thanks for that, I have one question if I put tab slip on with a zombie baffle do I lose my power train warranty? And would I need to do a screaming eagle fuel pack and a hi flow air intake? I bought a 2020 Road King. Would like to make it sound a little better. Without losing the warranty

[@arrowrod]

Buy a Harley. Get a warranty. Two years. Ride the Harley. All of your buddy's on Honda 500s blow by you. Get Stage I, II, and III kits. Harley blows up. What will Harley and the dealer do?

[@Skeetersbuzz]

Great video John!

[@Lurch301]

Bought used bike from Harley with 2 year warranty. Hate the stock exhaust doesn’t have that sound that I want, worth it to add slip ons/exhaust even though voids warranty on powertrain? Or deal with it to keep warranty?

[@DoubleJ74]

What if you have aftermarket slipons but the harley street tuner....Does that still void the powertrain warranty?

[@jerryhurst396]

John great video. If I used the Harley Davidson tuner is the warranty still voided because I had the dealer install new head pipes? Thanks, Jerry

[@robbierussell9536]

Happy fourth of July John!!!uh one question. My 2017 Sportster low-t...1200 has 31/2 Vance Hines slip ons..it's been serviced at Stormy Hill Harley. In Clermont,FL..they haven't said anything does that void my warranty????.I had them check it I. Still have warranty till 2020..the ECM was never touched by me. I boo

[@HDman62]

So by using an EPS certified exhaust system like the S&S Sidewinder with the Harley tuner, that would not void the warranty ?

[@kennethreynolds8]

Good info JM, maybe that subject finally got put to bed. 👍😊

[@TheHarleyTech]

Nah, I doubt it. Can’t say I didn’t try though!

[@The10man81]

So questions...Riding buddy bought a brand new Softail low. Got a Stage 1 upgrade at time of purchase. The dealership told him he couldn’t get a full exhaust without voiding his warranty. I witnessed this conversation personally. So he got slip-ons installed by them. Is this really a Stage 1 upgrade? Seems like an air intake upgrade/mild tune for a stage 1 price. Am I off base, or are the stages something worth holding off on until after warranty? Also I just purchased a 2011 FXDB if I have upgrades etc will it affect the ESP I bought, or is this the initial warranty only?

[@IanLandesman]

F warranty. That’s why I buy my shit old and broken. Fix it myself for cheap. The motor company is shooting itself in its foot. Had a bud over TODAY asking about changing fluids so he doesn’t have to pay a dealer who doesn’t want to work on his evo anyway. I’m a friend and charge nothing.

[@rayking5851]

I thought I was the only one on a harley wearing a full helmet

[@TheHarleyTech]

I see more people in full faces than half helmets anymore

[@jimweagant8920]

Great video thanks for sharing

[@jamesskadsem5963]

When I bought my bike with extended warranty the dealer had Vance Hines pipes on it. Last year had stage two installed by dealer but the ecm was bad and didn't catch it right away. My right exhaust turned blue. Will my extended warranty cover that. Warranty did cover ecm of course.

[@yelwing]

Had many many bikes. BMW was the worst. HD was the next worst. My victory was fantastic

[@james6275]

Hey John great videos . I have a question will slip ons void my warranty on my 19 Street Glide Special? Thank you sir

[@024nad]

So what your saying is put my stock parts back on if I want warranty work done ?

[@TheHarleyTech]

I didn’t say that. You said that. You do have a good idea, though....

[@rantabsolain1759]

This is why I never buy new. Do what I want.

[@shawncandler1960]

What is the name of the gloves? Really nice looking

[@hughsnyder891]

My experience with Harley warranty work is it gets denied. The dealer I bought it from denied it because they were far away so I had some routine service done at a closer dealership . And that dealership wouldn’t cover it because I didn’t buy it there . Tried to call the factory customer service which no one ever answered . So I bought the parts and did the work myself. If you bought the bike it shouldn’t matter what dealership does the work the company should compensate the dealership no matter which one it is .

[@nsajgalvan]

I bought my from a dealership that is 60 miles from my house, but I get it serviced at our local dealership that is 9 miles from my house. I've already have had some work done under warranty. So you are correct, it shouldn't matter where you bought the bike from. ANY Harley dealership should provide warranty work.

[@hughsnyder891]

Jenna Talia good to know.

[@peterjones6945]

@@nsajgalvan Pretty sure its HD company policy that any HD dealer can carry out warranty work. It's down to the dealership to honor it though. Many dealers don't want to do any warranty work as they can't make enough money out of it. Personally, I found warranty work was great during slow periods and some we found 'alternative' methods to cut 5 hr warranty to about 45 minutes (that was on a Yamaha though and they changed the time after we submitted 5 for the same day)

[@philipcarhart7447]

Peter Jones that’s when unfortunately pencil whipping is a necessary evil. Sorry for the reply 9 months later.

[@tonyj8947]

@@nsajgalvan Warranty work can be done at any HD dealership. They should not have denied you because you bought the bike somewhere else. I sold my HD and transferred the warranty to a person 150 miles away from me in PA and I live in NY. He has had no issues with HD in PA honoring the warranty.

[@WSKeys1]

Something is not right! A Maxwell preferring Folgers over Maxwell House?

[@LifeontheBlacktop]

Best comment of the week lol

[@rocketracingtv1897]

Beat me to it.

[@robbierussell9536]

I bought it at Brandon Harley new. Just like Clermont I think their the best..plus they sell Amsoil!!!!

[@overland_dadsfl]

That is actually really funny....🤣🤣

[@RossMalagarie]

Big Coffee got paid John to say that. You can tell in his eyes he doesn't feel that way. ;)

[@bleepbloop117]

In relation to the warranty on your powertrain being voided because of aftermarket pipes (11:30). Your warranty is not void simply because you put on non-HD slip ons. The Consent Decree (www.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2017-12/documents/harleydavidson-cd.pdf) does not state anywhere that aftermarket exhaust will void your factory powertrain warranty. What it does say is this: Defendants shall deny all warranty claims for functional defects of powertrain components for any Harley-Davidson vehicle (Model Year 2017 or later) registered in the United States, if any Defendants have any information to show that such vehicle was tuned using a Tuning Product that was not covered by a California ARB Executive Order or otherwise approved by EPA. The confusion over this has been insane. The motor company has been intentionally vague in communicating this to it's dealers which has lead to some dealers treating this as nothing and others claiming that anything outside screaming eagle parts void warranty. The only ways that you can lose your powertrain warranty legally is A) that you install aftermarket parts (such as intake and/or exhaust) without tuning that causes issue with the motor because it's running too lean/rich. B) you tune (with or without aftermarket intake/exhaust) with a non-EPA compliant tuner. I don't know how many EPA compliant tuners are available for Harleys but I do know that the Screamin Eagle Pro Street Tuner IS EPA compliant. So, you may visit a dealer that claims any aftermarket intake/exhaust will void your powertrain warranty. This is false and your option is to visit another dealer or fight to get that dealer to play ball. If you install full exhaust (headers back) and do not tune, you're going to cause issue with your motor, that's on you. If you install slip ons and don't tune and it somehow causes issue, it is on you to fight. That said, if you install slip ons and an intake and use the pro tuner to keep it within EPA compliant range, Harley CAN NOT deny your warranty claim for oil pump UNLESS they can somehow prove that your non-factory additions caused failure there. This is really standard stuff. The reason this has gotten so blown out of proportion is only because the EPA forces Harley to void warranty if the ECU is mapped outside of EPA range or mapped with a non-EPA compliant tuner.

[@JD-ed1uq]

Although many dealers would have you think otherwise, simply having an aftermarket part or modifying your vehicle cannot void yourwarranty. ... The Magnuson-Moss WarrantyAct states that a dealer must prove thataftermarket equipment caused the need for repairs before it can deny warranty coverage

[@user_mac0153]

Thanks

[@overland_dadsfl]

Did you say Commufornia?🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@joser5193]

Bro It’s real Simple If your gonna play You gotta PAY. Right.

[@richardedwin5980]

Hey John. I am going to post a letter that was titled "US EPA tuner calibration communication reminder." I have connections and I was able to get my hands on this letter shortly after it was sent out on March 29, 2019. This letter was put out to dealers by Rob Bradford Director Global Service, Warranty and Customer Care. I think it is only fair that all consumers KNOW the exact verbiage that was submitted to the dealerships regarding this topic. This is straight from the Mo-Co and clear and concise. Here goes.... Dear US Dealers: Harley Davidson service has received questions regarding warranty coverage on motorcycles that have calibrations installed on them that are not approved by the California air resources Board (CARB) or the US Environmental Protective Agency (EPA). This message is to remind you of the details of the EPA - Harley Davidson settlement. As communicated in both the dealer letter and dealer news communication of August 18, 2016, Harley Davidson informed the US dealer network of the settlement between Harley Davidson and the EPA. As part of the settlement all 2017 model year and later Harley Davidson's that have been tuned using a tuner or calibration that is not covered by a CARB executive order or otherwise approved by the EPA would have no powertrain warranty. When Harley Davidson is made aware of such modifications a vehicle identification number block is placed on the powertrain; meaning we will, per the settlement deny all warranty claims for functional defects of powertrain components for any Harley Davidson vehicle (model year 2017 or later) registered in the United States. The definition of the powertrain in this instance pertains to the engine and all of its components including the ECM (engine control module), primary drive and transmission including all of its components. As always, if we are made aware in any way of a non-EPA compliant tuner being installed on a model year 2017 and later motorcycle, those VIN numbers will be placed under the VIN Block for the powertrain warranty. To help you reduce the likelihood of completing warranty work on a motorcycle that has a VIN block placed on it and subsequently having the powertrain warranty claim denied, the Digital Technician (DT) tool is positioned to protect you and we suggest as a best practice the following steps be followed. 1. Instruct your staff to plug the motorcycle into the DT during the service intake process to see if a non-compliant calibration change has been made and the VIN has been blocked. 2. Check the H-DNet, drop-down tab, "my tool box" then "Vehicle Information" to see if the motorcycle has had a VIN block placed on it for any other reason other than a non-compliant calibration under the EPA settlement. These steps will inform your service personnel have of a non-compliant calibration, prior to starting any warranty repairs and will provide you the opportunity to set the appropriate expectation with the rider. As a reminder, all Harley Davidson branded tuner calibration performance products meet EPA compliance requirements. We encourage you and your staff to watch the video titled "2016 EPA Settlement Compliance" on H-DNet which discusses the settlement and warrantee implications of non-compliant calibrations. Thank you, Robert Bradford Director Global Service, Warranty & Customer Care.

[@harley5588]

Richard Edwin this letter clears up a lot. Thanks for posting. Also, as always, very informative video John.

[@richardedwin5980]

Phil Scott please feel free to copy & share this as well. This is a genuine authentic letter straight from the MoCo to the dealers. There is way too much speculation about what does or doesn't void the warranty. This letter is verbatim.

[@tskuligowski]

So for my 2016 RGU, if I use a FP3 tuner and I have a esp, is it going to do the same thing where it voids and blacklists my bike when its plugged in?

[@harley5588]

Tony Kuligowski according to the letter, that “blocking” of your VIN for powertrain warranty only applies to 2017 and newer. However, the FP3 is a flash tuner, so depending on what problem you may have, they may or may not cover it under warranty or ESP

[@Wildman4x4nut]

Richard, in reading this letter it would seem to me that if I have a 2016 or older bike I can install any tuner I want and if I had bought the ESP for it then warranty wouldn't be voided because I had use an aftermarket tuner. Am I understanding this correctly or if you have a ESP on an older bike do you still have to ONLY use a SESPT on it?

[@sjc1825]

John...great video and content as always. I have a question for clarification dealing with the M8. I was told by my dealer here in Florida that I can have after market head pipes, mufflers, and air breather and as long I use a Screaming Eagle tuner it will not void my power train warranty. I understand it should not cover those specific parts, but will the engine components still be covered by using the Harley tuner??

[@AmericanPatriot-cw9xe]

Dealer told me same as you with the header pipe, I went with Vance N Hines Power duals same as on my last bike, it came with reinhart slip ons, i only kept the reinharts on because a close friend passed a couple yrs ago and had them reinharts on his bike always, other wise it would be all vance n hines

[@CreedComander]

What about exhaust that is EPA compliant but not Harley or Screemin Eagle? As far as powertrain warranty is concerned? For example, my Khrome Werks slip ons state thet are EPA compliant by the manufacturer. Is my powertrain warranty intact or am i SOL if my motor goes boom.

[@NoName-vz1ob]

You are fine. If the mufflers themselves have an issue you are subject to the MFR warranty of that part. That's all.

[@redrider0151]

So in basic terms, Harley is FORCED by the EPA to deny ALL POWERTRAIN WARRANTY on any vehicle that has Non EPA compliant parts...whether the defect is related to that part or not....which in turn is a direct violation of the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act which prohibits product manufacturers from conditioning consumer warranties on the use of any original equipment part or service (ie if Harley wants to deny service because you used aftermarket parts, they have to prove that part caused the failure). I would assume with all the lawyers who ride Harleys now, that this will all end up in court someday when someones motor seizes due to a faulty oil pump and they say they have no warranty because they put on aftermarket slipons... :D I dont get how the EPA has the authority to force a policy on warranty like that, as they are definitely hurting HD's business...I know a LOT of people who wont buy a new HD just because of this warranty situation... I mean lets be honest, the BIGGEST reason to buy a new bike over a used bike is the fact that you get a warranty. well if you are not going to have a warranty because you want to customize your bike and your warranty will be void then why not save 1000's of dollars and just buy a used bike instead...which is EXACTLY what is happening...and HD's business over the past few years proves this out.

[@mikeez5455]

Bingo!

[@redrider0151]

@The CSRA Harley Tech Just so we are clear....I cut and pasted the short definition of the Moss Magnussen Act and put it there....thats not an Apple and Oranges statement, thats the exact overview of the Act..LOLZ. It LITERALLY states that you cannot void a warranty for using aftermarket parts unless the Manufacturer of the vehicle can PROVE the parts are what caused the issue....

[@redrider0151]

@The CSRA Harley Tech If you look at what you posted "Defects or damage to the motorcycle caused by alterations outside of Harley-Davidson® factory specifications or caused by alterations or use of parts"....you see those words "CAUSED BY"....yeah...thats the important part...its on the DEALER to prove that part......IE the Magnessen Moss Act is there to ensure that a Manufacturer cannot leverage revocation of your warranty to force you to use their parts. Harley also leverages the fact that there are ENDLESS companies making parts to allow you to modify your bike to "Make it your own"....they use this CONSTANTLY to promote sales. This is fine....however the EPA has now made it legal for them to violate the MM Act (in my opinion). The EPA makes it EXTREMELY expensive to have anything certified as CARB compliant....in turn burdening small companies to compete. Also, even if they were carb compliant, in Harleys new policy it doesnt matter, your warranty is still void. I am not saying that Harley shouldnt be able to void your warranty if you use an aftermarket tuner that actually causes damage.....however they shouldn't be able to void all drivetrain warranty because I added a different exhaust to my bike....if say my oil pump seized up, they shouldnt be able to say they arent covering that under warranty because I added a different muffler....one has zero to do with the other.... The fact that they are is going to affect their sales...and it IS...I am proof of that, as one of the main incentives to buying a new bike over a slightly used one is the fact you get a warranty. If that incentive is taken away, then they are going to suffer with the loss of new bike sales....that is absolutely happening, if you think it isnt then you are lying to yourself.... The fact they have been allowed to void warranties in a simple blanket statement is a violation of the MM Act IMHO....we will see how that works out for them. Is it Harley's fault...I would say no, its not...its the EPA's fault, however Harley is the one that will be damaged by this.

[@Wildman4x4nut]

@The CSRA Harley Tech Yes I just bought a 2015 CVO RGU and got the 5 year ESP on it. Now I am wondering if that was the right choice? Because it basically limits me to only being able to use the SESPT until the warranty is over OR I void my powertrain warranty by using a non-EPA compliant tuner to make the bike run better. What I have asked on many forums and not gotten a good answer to is "Why all the hate for the SESPT?" If I can still add aftermarket exhaust and cams to my engine will the SESPT be able to tune for these parts? Most answers I get are no it won't. If the bike is tuned to be EPA compliant will it run properly? Yes it may not make MAXIMUM HP & TQ with the SESPT but will it still run and properly? Maybe you can answer this?

[@patrickhollis5332]

At the end of the day all of the crap it is money because epa is government and all government is about the next dollar they can get out of business are individuals just like ole John Kerry’s climate bs and all his epa fines are his company

[@yeolderooster8050]

What if you just added some aftermarket slip-on Mufflers without a tuner I don't understand how they could void your entire powertrain warranty over some slip on mufflers if you didn't mess with the tune of the engine, and if that was the case could i not just take off the slip on mufflers put the stock ones on take it in to the Harley shop I mean would you even really know

[@codylee5466]

EPA shit. It's not harley it's the corrupt EPA making them do this

[@cembanditx1]

Slip ons on the softails remove the cats. On touring it doesn’t....

[@hammerstube76]

When Harley starts going to small claims court on a frequent basis then they will start changing their powertrain warranty voided. If you put a set of mufflers on and your oil pump seizes the two items have nothing to do with each other. harely will lose that case

[@TheHarleyTech]

I agree 100%

[@jamessmoth8683]

And what if that tuner allows the motor to rev 500 rpm higher that the MoCo wants and they say that is what caused the oil pump to go out?

[@mikephilpot9214]

The law are pretty clear on this stuff. If a component fails and the unit has aftermarket parts, it is the responsibility of the dealer/manufacturer to prove the aftermarket part was the cause of the failure. It all gets very touchy when you start talking money. I work for a manufacturer and I always try to be fair with my dealership and customer while trying to keep the interest of the manufacturer. I have even covered some stuff out of warranty (goodwill). Good video.

[@ramonburgos6351]

Will slip-on mufflers void the power train warranty? No tuner or air intake. Just the slip-ons.

[@charlieb378]

No according to my HD dealership

[@TheHarleyTech]

Most dealerships agree slip ons are ok. Particularly on a touring bike that leaves the cat in the head pipe.

[@ramonburgos6351]

Thanks @@TheHarleyTech. keep up the great content!

[@cembanditx1]

John Maxwell not to go to deep down the rabbit hole, but what are your thoughts on slip ons and back pressure, no tune, on a m8. I bought Vance and Hines 3” slashcuts and a new 2020 Fatboy but haven’t had the pipes installed yet. Considering holding off, as I heard the m8 doesn’t remap well. Warranty aside, would you put slip on your bike.

[@busaboy6345]

Thanks for the insight. Dammit now I’m craving subway.

[@Wise__guy]

Dude gross

[@ChrisLonsberryMedia]

So.. funny story that I'm guessing doesn't happen a lot... I never had a warranty on my '13 DWG after the original ran out. But I knew I couldn't get ESP after 75k. So.. when I hit 73k, I took my bike in for service because my dealership offers a service package.. oil, filters.. any of the maint. stuff.. including labor.. prepaid for 3 years. I can tell you, it pays for itself in about 6 months. Honestly, I feel guilty renewing it. But I do. AND.. for a little extra.. they throw on new tires when I get under spec. No charge. It's like.. just under $2k for 3 years and I get service every 2500 miles. (Doesn't cover brakes). So.. I'd be dumb not to do it. But I digress.. I took it in for service and, thinking that 70k+ was about when major stuff may happen, I bought the 5 year ESP. I mean.. really.. the only thing I have to pay for is brakes and gas. Took my bike in for the 78k service and they said the engine was pretty warn. New engine. $78. I've got about another 150 miles to go in my break-in 500. My goal is to put another 80k on in the next 4 years to get another engine before the ESP runs out. ;-)

[@alecboswell5527]

Sounds legit to me!

[@SUPMO14]

But is that ESP good at any Harley dealer or only the one where you bought the ESP ?

[@ChrisLonsberryMedia]

SUPMO14 ESP .. or the Extended Service Plan .. is a Harley program and good at any dealership.

[@mesflyer]

Since there seems to be credible disagreement in the comments, can Maxwell settle it saying whether slip-ons void the powertrain warranty or not if no tuning is done....

[@jetag93]

If the slip ons are EPA compliant than your warranty is good; if not compliant, then the terms of the agreement with the EPA force HD to void your power train warranty.

[@rickcastillo3573]

Damn. Well I guess I’ll be re-installing the stock ones when it goes in for service.

[@markraney8131]

@@rickcastillo3573 Good idea, it voids the warranty if the cat or the oxy sencers are in the muffers you take off.

[@richcanfield1387]

John, your explanation of the warranty issues with Harley were made very clear in this video! All the rumors about voiding the whole warranty when using after market parts were laid to rest! Thank you for your "Common Sense" approach in your explanation!

[@RobertOrtiz1015]

Rich Canfield not really! I have lots of friends that had their bikes tagged with a sticker that says warranty is void... They had harley install parts on the bike! The reasoning was that it was not screaming eagle parts! Even tho they sold and installed it...

[@richcanfield1387]

@@RobertOrtiz1015 Wow....thanks for the info! Wonder if Indian does the same thing?

[@RobertOrtiz1015]

Rich Canfield i think harley also has issues with certain dealerships doing things one way and other dealers doing it a different way... for instance... when I bought my fatbob i was offered a lifetime warranty on drivetrain! Hell yeah i said! Well... it was only at Caliente HD in San Antonio.... second! Caliente HD had to do every single one of the services on my bike! So... i move every couple years so that sucks and i am not taking the bike in for a oil change that i can do... This lifetime thing was a dealer only thing also

[@Wildman4x4nut]

@@richcanfield1387 It isn't JUST HD that does this. Go buy a new vehicle and put a tuner on it that makes it perform outside of it's stated parameters and I'll bet you if you take it to a dealer for service it will be flagged. Example: I just bought a 2018 Ram 3500 with a Cummins 6.7ltr engine. If I install a Edge or Smarty tuner on it I will void the powertrain warranty. Heck I had a 2002 Ram 2500 and the same thing applied to it. This isn't anything new, why do you think all the aftermarket companies have the little discloser at the bottom that says "FOR OFF-ROAD USE ONLY"? The only thing that isn't happening right now is that the EPA isn't going after the consumer for breaking the law.

[@richcanfield1387]

@@Wildman4x4nut Wow Wildman...many stories out there, thanks for yours. I guess if I was a manufacturer, I would have the same concerns, and liability being the way it is...my reaction my be the same as HD and so many others. Too bad so many people have warranty issues simply because they make a couple modifications.

[@robtoma5650]

Fu**ing CA.. What complete bullshit.. Here in Texas I see crew cab diesel trucks the spew out large amounts of black smoke whenever the driver hits the accelerator aggressively, but that’s okay right EPA? Normally I wouldn’t care, but having a new bike with the M8 concerns me because It’s still a fairly new design, and I can’t afford to jst say screw the powertrain warranty. I have V&H slips ons on my ride so i suppose my warranty would be voided. My solution if I ever have a power train issue will be to put the stock mufflers back on before going to the dealer. what bullshit