HOW TO get STARTED in RC TURBINES - THE AIRCRAFT

#howto #rcjets #turbines
This is the start of a little mini series on How To Start In Turbine Jet Aircraft. The Equipment is the focus of this first video. Thanks for watching!
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common questions, what do I need to get started in turbine aircraft. goal of the series is to cover these questions. What plane? What Equipment? How to start? Best plane.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Video #2 in the Series! Thanks for checking it out!

[@velvetblue2327]

thank you finally!!!! we need more videos like this to get in the hobby and can you do one like building a kit RC turbine

[@crunchied8]

I like the Facet 2300 and it can be test plane for the engine mate also i like the bvm jet bobcat as well

[@VictorHugoRC1111]

Having flown EDF jets for the past 12 years I felt that the next step is going into turbine jets. Foam EDFs are really enjoyable and affordable and with the proper care, the batteries can last more than 200 flights. I'm well aware of the turbine response lag. I'm currently converting my 1/12 Su-30 to a K45 as my first turbine jet. Wish me luck.

[@thelightersideofrc]

AWESOME! Congrats! and Good Luck! Be Careful! The sound, The Smell and Just the cool factor is so dang Addicting!

[@R.B_B]

Nice! What's the manufacturer of that SU-30

[@VictorHugoRC1111]

@@R.B_B FMS

[@richardk302]

Just put my Swiwin 80B in my HSD F-16 yesterday (with the help of a very experienced turbine pilot) it's only a matter of time now...I'll be up in the air soon with this one!

[@thelightersideofrc]

Awesome! Congrats!

[@RcpsychoRen]

Nice séries....good advises ✌️. One day i ll make thé first step in jet RC...i m in RC car for more than 30 years!!.but first i start in fan one..i vé got allô thé lipos and charger needed.i ve chose this way to amelior m'y skill in air🤣🤣.thanks folks👍

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thank you and thanks for watching!

[@philippebaudon]

you known what, for me your suggestions are always very impotant and help me. keep going and kiss for Luna !

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks Philippe!😊

[@DonDegidio]

Hi Jonathan, I had won a Foremost 160 at an auction from our local club. It is a knock off of the 76" Boomerang that they say could be turbine powered, but there were many threats saying it was not strong enough for turbines but great for EDF. I bought a JP Hobby 125mm 12S EDF for it and is another project for the future. At least this one is an ARF and just need the the EDF, radio gear, and batteries. You and Katie stay safe.

[@mlrocketeer8961]

Thank you for doing this series

[@thelightersideofrc]

You bet! More to come!😊

[@dont6441]

I've had several foam turbine aircraft over the last several years. They fly amazingly well and they fit my budget. Composite aircraft are great but generally are heavier and more expensive. Another benefit of foam jets is replacing a wing or other part is much cheaper than composite. The 30x turbine foam is much stronger than standard EDF foam and holds up very well. Smaller engines work well with foam jets which also helps to keep the cost down. If I had a large budget, I'd fly mostly composite but since I don't, foam turbine jets work very well and give me the full turbine experience at a lower cost.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Totally agree Don! Fly what makes you happy!

[@eduardocalderon1469]

In my experience there are some scale, o semi scale jets that are good trainers. For example, the BAE Hawk (Carf or Skymaster), The Viperjet from any manufacturer. Also I think F-16's are pretty easy to fly. The Carf Rebel is also a very good. it has a wide flight envelope, so you can start with it as a trainer and it can grow with you. Also it sells in 3 or 4 different sizes.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hello Eduardo. Yea absolutely! Great suggestions!

[@andrewwelsh2581]

I just recently got into turbines using a HSD L39 Albatross. Such a thrill once you have dialed in the model. Pro's are its a turnkey solution. Easy to add radio and a delight to fly/land. My only Con would be its easy to dint during transporting. BUT there is a solution to that! Ive seen someone add a couple of coats of Minwax Polycrylic to the foam skin and its impressively hardened the model up. So much you would think it was a glass model. I hope to fly mine for years. On the EDF topic, Ive flown many EDF's over the years. Its just not the same as flying a proper turbine. The wing loading is completely different which changes how you have to fly when transitioning from EDF to turbine. Let alpne the spool up lag Great channel BTW, been watching from all the way over here in Australia (Queensland) since I started into turbines.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks Andrew! Yea you hit the nail on the head with the EDF Stuff. It's just not the same. Sounds like a great start to the turbine world with the HSD L38. That's a great aircraft! Thanks for watching!

[@russellvoth5161]

Oh man, using my landing gear pin issues that arose this year, also having Electron on Vacation for three weeks in Aug didn't help thinking. Ah landing gear , Lol. Yes the Carf viper has been a greating start jet and thankful input from guys like you who help me.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Your not the only one Russell. I went through the same growing pains my first couple years. I Think it's pretty common.

[@rcswissflyer9393]

It is second or even third time I view this video. Excellent each time I get more interested into turbine, but each time I resist. Reason is, that less airfield you are allowed to fly, less flights means less possibilities to learn and get confident. Whereas EDF is almost allowed everywhere on flying fields. So this is unfortunately a reason why not to chose a turbine jet, a lot of efforts and money and less opportunities to fly. This is why I am on gliders, towing machines and 3D. But I like your videos and hints and solutions, suggestions. Top Thank you

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thank you for watching! It's a very addictive side of model aviation!

[@irvinparadizo6616]

Outstanding video..let you know I get a twins boom as my first turbine jet. The person who coach me told me what you just suggested twins boom jet, I guess I'm in the right track..

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hello Irvin! Absolutely!

[@davidfaltus4492]

I have had a slight interest in turbines for years, but after watching your videos, and getting some great info from them, I decided to take the plunge. I have just recently bought my first turbine, a HSD T-33 with a Swiwin 80. Very happy with both the airframe and the turbine. I also have already purchased my next turbine, a T-1 F-16. Keep up the good work!

[@thelightersideofrc]

Awesome David! Sounds like your off to a great start! Thanks for watching!😊

[@thercf16guy35]

The t1 f16 has been on my wishlist a looong time, lemme know how it flies if you've used it yet!

[@davidfaltus4492]

@@thercf16guy35 The F-16 flies very well. However, T one has changed the placement of the turbine and fuel tank from the early ones. The instructions still call for the cg at 160mm, however with the new placement of the turbine and tank it seems to be too far back. The first flight was a near disaster, with the jet too tail heavy it almost went in several times. We moved the cg about an inch forward and it flew great after that. I checked with Dirk and he said the cg had not changed from the redesign, but mine was completely unstable at the recommended cg. I am using a Swiwin 80, which is more than enough power. It is also very tippy, especially in crosswind situations, but once the cg was adjusted it is a great flier.

[@gregoryh4601]

Well Done Jonathan on this Video. I still learning to fly and just like how you Build and your Tips on tech and Repairs. Thanks and Happy Holidays. Hope the Snow holds off for you.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks Greg! We are all still learning.......I hope! Winter finally hit this past week! COLD and SNOWY!

[@gregoryh4601]

Jonathan will you be getting a Snowmobile since you out in the Country? lol. Thanks for the Jet video . I will never afford a Jet but make build a P51 Mustang someday . But still learning to fly my Sailplanes. Well be Safe and have a Great Holidays. Take Care.

[@DaveZotzman]

Loved the video! I built a Jetmach 44 as my first jet as I do like to build traditional balsa/ply airplanes. I figured this one was simple, no retracts to deal with, a basic shoulder wing plane with an easy to access turbine. I had a mentor do the first three flights on it to work out any bugs, mainly the down trim as flaps are deployed so it's good to go for my first flight. The only major trim was I didn't have the flaps and ailerons lined up from left to right sides very well, so first flight required a lot of aileron trim, but that's been worked out. Unfortunately, last year, my turn on it never came, just bad timing with things, and this year, both mentors busy with moving, renovations, combined with covid fun, it just never happened, so next summer it is. I'd rather everything be right than rushed. A quick clip of the maiden with my friend and mentor Renie at the sticks. kzbin.info/www/bejne/fGasl5iVqbuqppo

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hello Dave! Great to hear! Thanks for watching. There will be much more in this series to come. Sounds like your off to a great start! That's a great looking plane and a great way to start! Keep is simple and get the hang of it. Well done!

[@DaveZotzman]

@@thelightersideofrc I FINALLY got my first jet flight. Quite honestly, that Jetmach 44 at half throttle flies like my trusty old Sig Komander. Yes, its that gentle. just have to remember to not yank the elevator in a turn as hard as the Komander LOL. Had one moment, got a little slow in a turn resulting in a little low, but easily recovered. Got that first flight in, looking forward to many more.

[@kazama6245]

Trusty Bent Screw Driver Jon! As always very informative!!

[@thelightersideofrc]

HAHA. Thanks!

[@gregmcgee4430]

THIS IS OLD NEWS. But I'll watch.

[@thelightersideofrc]

HAHA. Thanks for watching!

[@chrisgruendemann9100]

The Ziroli Panther is a great first jet also. No bad habits and very reasonabley cost. 60-80 size turbine and 72" all around.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Great Suggestion Chris!

[@Midwest-RC]

Watching this now !!!

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks Tim!

[@victorrcjets7660]

I am definitely leaning towards a sport jet as my first with a 80 to not be crazy fast but I see the more experienced pilots putting a 120 to 140 also depending on the location it seams. I thought about the scale foam jets too because I been doing the EDF version for many years now. Getting use to the delay will be the hardest thing for sure. Thank you for your suggestions too and mainly the starting items needed. 😀

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks Victor for watching! Add a 3 to 4 second delay on your throttle channel on one of your EDF's and it will give a realistic experience of what a turbine is like. Just be aware that it's there while your flying it!

[@victorrcjets7660]

@@thelightersideofrc That's the plan my friend!

[@davidmuse7004]

This has been a great series of videos to watch, not a beginner o R/C models, flew as powered models up until about 20-25 years ago. Always wanted to get into gas turbines powered aircraft but hesitant to get one, build and fly so I went to model trains. I think it maybe time to take to the air again. lol Thanks for sharing you knowledge, been watching your videos all morning now at work, now I need to think about getting a aircraft and turbine. Really cool stuff you are doing and sharing with the hobby community. I will be watching more as you post 👌👌👍👍 Muse

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks for the awesome Feedback David! It’s nice to hear when someone decides to make the jump! 😊😎

[@davidhollfelder9940]

I’ve had an HSD Super Viper 105 (Avanti copy) for several years, it has about 60 flights on it. The servos, especially for the flaps, were barely adequate and poor quality (twitchy), as I’ve replaced them all with better ones. BTW, I’ve been on hiatus for a few years, and back in the hobby again now. The HSD out of the box, needed a “going over” in detail .. as I said, the servos, linkages, brakes, fuel system, UAT, etc., needed lots of rework. The airplane flys very well. I initially used a K-45 .. it was OK, but then I swapped in a K-60, and added a aux tank .. for a much better satisfaction point. I built 3 jets prior (Boomerang Sprint, Falcon 120 and a BVM Bobcat). I would only recommend the foam turbine jets (or any jet model), to a new turbine pilot, if they’re working side by side with an experienced jet modeler, as there’s no substitute for experience (ask me how I know).

[@thelightersideofrc]

Great Suggestions and info!

[@kazama6245]

Jon I love your channel bro, and I'll be sending my contribution to the shop "studio" BUT, lets get back to the Huracan PRO-jet! 😉👍

[@thelightersideofrc]

Tomorrow 😎👍

[@kazama6245]

@@thelightersideofrc 😉👍

[@DadsRCHangar]

Great information as usual, I wouldn’t dream of flying a turbine yet, but enjoy the series 👍🏻

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks 👍😊

[@almostspace123]

Good video! Have a Ziroli turbinator kit sitting in my shop right now I need to build for my first. Bought a spektrum nx10se, but sounds like spektrum isn’t very popular in the jet community :/

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks. Lots of strong opinions when it comes to Spektrum radios and products.

[@janarthanamsubramaniam]

Hi Jonathan, just like you, I've have always been intrigued by airplanes since young. I'm old now but that love have not waned but where I live the opportunities to learn and fly RC planes is very very limited. I wish I could retire and come over and become your apprentice and learn all that is about building and flying turbines. You see, just like you, I love to use my hands to build and play an instrument. What should I do?

[@thelightersideofrc]

Easy! Dive in and learn to fly model airplanes! It's a fun challenge that keeps the brain and fingers active!

[@alric9562]

I got tired of buying a plane (ARF) to see it discontinued a year or two later. So building one is my go to process. If by any chance an atmospheric anomaly occurs causing sunden shift in magnetic field resulting in an sudden uncontrolled and rapid raise of the ground that so happen to hit my plane the wrong way, it can be rebuilt with in the same week. 😉😀 I would say starting with an EDF is not the same as GT. However, it does provide a different throtle responce and flying habit. EDF won't turn on a dim like ia prop plane does. Star jet with 70mm Turbinator, building the 90mm version this winter and my GT version will be ready to fly a year later. All that while drinking a nice salted caramel whisky glass. 😀

[@thelightersideofrc]

isn't that the truth! It seems like the good ones get discontinued! Thanks Al for your comments and input!

[@enterstreng]

As much as i like foam planes, it s true they get bad very quick, they will still fly but the look will fade everytime there is a small contact somewhere while landing or in the car. So Fiberglass Planes will last longer and yes bigger plains fly better. I just use foam for DIy Plains but i won t buy a foamy again on the market, except something small fun and cheap lol

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks for the info and feedback! Great Stuff!

[@gogianyee5002]

Hey Jon! Nice Intro video. In regards to EDFs you can on the computer radios, you can set any amount of throttle delay you want to emulate a turbine. That’s what I do for my HSD Super Viper V2 and the Freewing A10 Twin 80mm. I have the delay set to around 4 seconds. Happy flying!

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hello Gogian. Yea absolutely! If someone is using an EDF as a learning platform for turbines, setting the throttle delay as you mention is a perfect idea!

[@FlyguyXII]

What are your thoughts about the EA BDX as being a first jet? I've got 25year flying RC of all sizes and speed ranges. I love the look of it as well as the size. Also curious about the Turbinator 2.

[@thelightersideofrc]

BDX would be a great choice! it's on the higher end of things but it's a big aircraft which will be much easier to fly than something smaller.

[@darrylpenson]

I have been flying edf for a few years now and have been thinking this year I will make my first turbine purchase. Was wondering your opinion on the Aviation Design Phoenix as a first. I also like to support a fellow Canadian so was thinking A Swiwin 80 from yourself. Guys at my field recommend Boomerang, I prefer the looks of the Phoenix

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hey Darryl. Congratulations on thinking of making the jump! Careful! It’s addicting 🤣. The Phoenix is also a great first jet. Your starting off in the higher end bracket but the aircraft is on a different level than a wood aircraft. When your need the engine or if you have any questions reach out to me by email. [e-mail]

[@michaelhodges-y6z]

Have you ever built a Boomerang Turbinator 2 or know where I can find a video on it. Their manual leaves a lot to be desired. Thank you for your help.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hey Michael. Sorry that’s one I haven’t built before.

[@michaelhodges-y6z]

Thank you for getting back with me. If you do hear of anything I'd appreciate you letting me know. Have a great evening.@@thelightersideofrc

[@corbystarlet]

Gday from Australia. I’m wanting to start in rc turbines… I’m looking at a Jeti ds16 and a 2nd hand toprc f16 that’s rtf. Do you have any good go to websites that ship to Australia for parts and stuff for on the field. Thanks

[@thelightersideofrc]

Welcome to the turbine side! Great choice on the radio! Not sure of the North America sites that will ship to Australia. We have shipped a few swiwin turbines from our site to Australia. Obviously shipping is more but not crazy.

[@michaellussoro2295]

Great video, I’ve been flying and converting turbine size jets to edf just for ease, they are cheaper by the thousands for one and most ama sites around me have banned turbines for their immense fire hazard . I’ll agree to disagree with ya in the are that edfs aren’t a good training aid to turbines.

[@thelightersideofrc]

EDF's are fun but not the same thing as a turbine with delay. if you program delay, great! Much more similar. As far as fire hazard goes I disagree with anyone that thinks just turbines are a fire hazard. I think Big EDF's are the same or worse. you crash an EDF and short out a battery, it has a ton of energy built up and going off. Gasser using gasoline has a much more combustible fuel on board than JetA, Diesel or Kero.

[@steamer401]

Great video we’re do you purchase your planes ?

[@thelightersideofrc]

Sometimes I do and sometimes customers do.

[@jaysonfarmer157]

I want to get into turbines. Been flying EDFs for years. Can you do a video(s) of the steps to set the planes up (gas, air, power-up, etc...)? There is probably more but I am not familiar with what goes into getting one of these in the air. Thanks.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Great suggestion Jayson for the "Getting Started in Turbine" Series! Thank you for the suggestion!

[@jaysonfarmer157]

@@thelightersideofrc Thanks. I willl be watching for it and hoping it's really done in laymen's terms. Jayson

[@Sivaneswaran]

I wonder if you made the suggested video

[@dustinwhitrock1418]

That is one of the problems I’m working through is being super nervous. I’m getting better the more I fly .I have been flying for 25 years on and off and I can fly but going from edf to turbine you pickup bad Edf habits wich cost me an hsd viper airframe getting to slow and rolled over . But you have to keep going

[@scottbuck9348]

I have the same problem, I fly Sab goblin helicopters like John in this video and have a few edf jets and I get extremely nervous when I know I have 3000 grand flying around, I couldn’t even imagine a 10k dollar turbine. That’s why I went with HSD f16. I’ll buy a cheap used 80 turbine and I’ll have under 3500 into it. Still might need a glass of wine before my first flight !

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hey Dustin! Yea your not alone! As I mentioned, many fly the $ and not the aircraft. At the end of the day it's just another plane with a different power plant. If someone is using EDF as a stepping stone to turbines, adding a delay of 3 to 4 seconds on the throttle channel will add some turbine type characteristics which can help with the learning. Thanks for watching and keep flying!

[@stark1758]

questions, before getting into turbine power how much experience flying RC aircraft.I currently fly EDF jets all the way up to almost 2 m. Also is purchasing used aircraft the way to go in your opinion and if so where does a person start looking for used in the US? Thanks Tom Wisconsin

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hello Tom. More the better but more importantly in my opinion would be to take things slow and get some help. I went from Heli's (where I learned) to fixed wing for about 1 year than into turbines. Used aircraft can be great and terrible. I would suggest going with a local used purchase first from someone you know. There are forums (RCGroups, RCUniverse) type places where you can look and also Facebook plane specific buy/sell groups.

[@octane2099]

Got my waiver with Aero foam L-39 with a swim 80 I’m on flight 25 with it

[@thelightersideofrc]

Awesome! Congratulations!

[@canadianrcpilot9048]

I agree and don’t agree with the concept of EDF to Turbines transition from a Cost perspective- Most ARF /PNP or BNF EDF models just require a typical 6-10 channel TX , batteries and charger - the throttle response will be different for sure - however just getting used to the techniques of flying and landing jets in general they have their own unique flight characteristic - otherwise if one jumps into Turbines as a transition from EDF in general I agree on all your other points ! Cheers 🇨🇦

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks very much for watching and adding your input. I find making blanket generalizations on a topic like this is so difficult as it ultimately comes down to pilot competency among other things. So it's a bit tough to put a video like this together and just say do this as there are many paths. Thanks for watching!

[@harambe1356]

Hey, nice vid. I really want to ask you something, what do you think about converting a foam edf jet to a turbine jet?(with a small turbine) like mentioned in the vid,(hsd) there are few videos about it on yt as well. I'm thinking about it bc its pretty affordable. I would really appreciate an in-depth reply if u got time! Nice vid as always! Cheers!

[@thelightersideofrc]

Hello. Thanks for watching. The EDF Conversion is a very popular segment in the turbine world right now. You touched on the reason why......Cost. It's also easy to transport compared to the larger aircraft. Smaller aircraft don't fly as nice as larger ones but from a simple cost standpoint it's affordable.

[@harambe1356]

@@thelightersideofrc agree, thanks for taking time to reply, I really appreciate it! :)

[@kchong9035]

Hello, after watching your videos I’m thinking to cross over to Jet from giant gas model. I’m looking at carf model ultra flash eco, skymaster viper jet and toprc odessey, I could nor find wing loading info for these planes, I m trying to get the one with lowest wing loading for easier landing. I am curious to know from your experience, how would you rank them as first, second, third options for first jet? Any other model you could recommend? Thanks!

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks! It's a fun addicting side of the hobby. You won't find posted wing loading numbers from the manufactures. from your list, a viper will be the lowest wing loading. Odessey next and ultra flash at the bottom.

[@abyssalreclass]

What would you say about turboprops as a first turbine aircraft? Good or bad? Do they have maintenance issues?

[@thelightersideofrc]

Probably not the best option. They can be a bit sensitive to setup and any prop touch, even the tiniest one can wreak havoc on the bearing section.

[@abyssalreclass]

Thanks, love the series. I don't know if its planned, but a video on fuel systems would be great. I've been binge watching a few of the build series and it seems more complicated than "plug tank into engine", especially on twins.

[@Cowboylifesaver]

The first turbine should be the CARF Rebel always.

[@thelightersideofrc]

HAHA. Sounds like your favourite!

[@matheusmariano4891]

Oops already bought a Carf UltraFlash as my first jet lmao. Still need the turbine engine for it though.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Have someone help you! it's a great jet but it can get ahead of you if your not used to the speed!

[@matheusmariano4891]

@@thelightersideofrc I have a friend that builds jets and gives lessons and he will help me.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Perfect 👍

[@jessemarkle5413]

Have a really high paying job!

[@thelightersideofrc]

🤔😎

[@jamilsabbatt9942]

I’m looking to start with the freewing F-22 with a xicoy X45.

[@thelightersideofrc]

FUN! Great flying combo!

[@stark1758]

is turbine delay the time it takes to spool up from low to high throttle?

[@thelightersideofrc]

The true delay would be from idle to full. An engine at idle will take longer to throttle up than an engine at just a blip above idle.

[@martinj9251]

Really enjoyed this, And nice to know how much it can cost to get into JET Turbine . All be it scary figures

[@thelightersideofrc]

Thanks for watching Martin!

[@crunchied8]

I am just wondering how about a delta wing plane like carf rookie style

[@thelightersideofrc]

Rookie is a great plane but can be a bit of a handfull on landing. It used to be called a Kangaroo and if you didn't stick the landing right it would definitely do the Kangaroo!

[@crunchied8]

@@thelightersideofrc i was going to say kangaroo then i thought not to i know what the kangaroo landing is its rough on the plane mate

[@alignwelding6160]

Yes sir bigger it is better it flys, same with helis.

[@thelightersideofrc]

Absolutley!

[@Scottg1014]

Idk where this guy gets his battery's but I get mine for less then 50 for s 6s

[@thelightersideofrc]

🙌🥳

[@gregmcgee4430]

Machinist. Can make parts.

[@thelightersideofrc]

🙌👍

[@CH-RC]

Not to mention, all the foam and electric junk is not nearly on the same level of flight performance, sight, sound or smell. The EDF stuff is much more kiddy-toy territory, than hobby or hobby-enthusiast grade gear. Though if you've never flown before, I can see the appeal to dropping a smaller amount of money to test the waters

[@thelightersideofrc]

Yea exactly! " why would I buy a turbine aircraft for $XXXXX when I can buy 5 foamies for the same price".

[@noahcosben2235]

What makes turbine engine so expensive

[@thelightersideofrc]

Good Question Noah. It's not a mass produced item. The manufactures have lots of output cost for equipment, engineering etc. The tolerances are very tight as the engines will max out at 100,000 rpm to 200,000 rpm depending on the model. So things need to be made accurately, strong and properly.

[@joeys5429]

Elf’s are quicker than gas

[@thelightersideofrc]

🙄🤔

[@neomatrix3612]

In summary: Get rich..

[@thelightersideofrc]

HAHA. No really but SURE!

[@arifsedele8546]

Come to a point man. Just saying same things like a loop...

[@thelightersideofrc]

Well. Thanks for watching!

[@horrorgamer6687]

Foam is trash.....never liked it never will....its like you are flying the packing off a real plane lol

[@thelightersideofrc]

HAHA!