The Wyrm And It's Split Personalities: World Of Darkness Lore

[@devoureroftheworlds4764]

On the one hand, Wyrm is the worst of the evils of the World of Darkness, but on the other, I feel sorry for him. In those distant times when the Triad worked as a whole, he was an integral element of balance, benefiting the world, and not a monster who wanted to destroy it. And we must always remember this. The hydra cannot be killed by chopping off its heads, and is it worth destroying death, because without it, the world will face terrible consequences. The only way to avoid the Apocalypse is to restore balance. As always, the video came out great. Thanks! And yes, it would be very interesting to hear about the Croatan tribe.

[@TheMapleTable]

There are several lost tribes, the Croatan being one of them. I see this getting a few thumbs up so... Ill see what I can come up with for the Croatan.

[@greysnake2903]

To you

[@brianzmek7272]

I agree you can't use destruction to defeat the spirit of destruction my take is trying to will only make it stronger. It needs to be purified which interestingly was part of its primordial preview thus purifying it should in theory also make it stronger but in the end will make turn quickly if that aspect gains critical mass.

[@wiilov]

Is Wyrm the evil? Or is it the Weaver being SO much of a control freak?

[@papadaddio866]

There is some OWoD lore out there that indicates that Wyrm is not only older than Gaia, she successfully traveled the cosmos and consumed countless other worlds whole before the Earth came into existance. I like the concept of Wyrm as an ancient alien traveller who became ensnared when she visited our little rock to have a snack

[@TheMapleTable]

This is a cool take on the triat. I am not as well versed in the original history and i have been finding some differences between the versions

[@papadaddio866]

@@TheMapleTable I don't think there is one "right" answer. I think of Gaia as the spirit of this planet and the triat as even larger conmological archtypes who's consciousness spans all reality. By virtue of the fact that Gaia exists, she and by extension all of her creations are subject to the influence of the universal forces represented as creation, stasis and entropy

[@papadaddio866]

@@TheMapleTable even that explination is imperfect. If Gaia is just the spirit of the Earth itself, what is her relationship to Helios and Luna? Are there other planetary consciousnesses out there of equal or greater influence to Gaia? By virtue of the fact that we are mere mortals, we simply are not capable of fully comprehending the relationships of celestials. The best we can do, much like our ancestors is spin yarns and speculate as we try to make sense of our own place in the universe

[@TheMapleTable]

@@papadaddio866 its a benefit of the system i think, its specific enough to get a general idea but at the same time vague to have a personal interpretation

[@Gangrel442003]

@@papadaddio866 The Triat in a nutshell is order, chaos, and balance. The Wyrm is nature corrupted and perverted. It is nature run amok...

[@MrFantocan]

The Wyrm does have a physical form, and it is locked inside Malfeas by the webs of the Weaver, the Urge Wyrms are the emotions that the tormented Dark father let loose, like Desire, Hate, Pain... Emotions that grant tremendous power to the Maeljin Incarna.

[@floral_comet]

I'm here from Watato

[@lumski]

WATOTO

[@yukiritocq]

WATOTO forever

[@asdrubaelvect8038]

Did you get lost I'm sure you'll be all right

[@szymonskalka3319]

In the day of D&D oversaturation, it's great to see a video on the Wyrm Triat. Such a niche topic, in such a (nowadays) niche game. So seeing a video on the Wrym just makes it all that much sweeter.

[@skullman-us7wn]

I like to imagine the weaver, while responsible for the wyrms current state, is fully aware of what it’s done, but is far too proud to admit it fucked up. So it’s fully lost in sunk cost fallacy. Committing itself to further imprisoning everything in a mad fit of “No but I can fix it. I can fix it, it’s still good.”

[@wiilov]

That's the usual outcome of Control: Unforeseen consequences.

[@RageArmor]

The way i am handling the wyrm in my game, which as a note is working in elements from vtm, wta, htr, and story elements from a D&D game i ran a while back. The world (previously the prime material plane of toril) had a grand war between all the races, and gods. Ao getting tired of everything's shit, cast down a divine edict banishing all races to their own individual planes. Leaving humans on toril later to become earth. To maintain the system with the absence of the gods of the pantheon, Ao created gaia to maintain the earths functions, and the three grand spirits to maintain the functions of the life cycle. The wyrm after being imprisoned and its mind breaking saw the truth of the cosmos, that the labyrinth not only connects to oblivion, but all the outer plains. That the labyrinth is the wall that Ao set up to keep all the plains apart from each other. In having this vision of madness, it has been attempting to right as it calls it "the great wrong" and tear down the barriers between the other realms in its own corrupted way.

[@BlackIce3190]

Here’s a fun fact for ya; You know the Necronomicon of Lovecraft fame? It and it’s writer, the Mad Arab, Abdul Alhazred, both exist in the World of Darkness. It’s about the Wyrm.

[@Giles29]

Chronicles of the Black Labyrinth might also be a stand-in for it

[@pitchforksdragon1252]

DO THAT VIDEO ON THE CROATIAN PLEASE (And congrats on 1.2k subs)

[@TheMapleTable]

Yikes I guess i need to get this done lol

[@TheMapleTable]

And thanks for the support!

[@XenoZillaArt]

Another really good video. Took a lot of notes, this will help so much. I like that the characters of the great spirits seem to have more depth than I thought they would. I also kinda find it funny that the Weaver seems to be big on order but pretty much threw off the order of things and caused this chaotic mess in the first place. Apologies if this ramble went on too long. Really cool video.

[@TheMapleTable]

No worries, glad its helping! Yea the weaver caused a lot of problems :p

[@XenoZillaArt]

Congratulations, by the way, it is nice to see your channel grow. I apologize for not saying that sooner.

[@TheMapleTable]

@@XenoZillaArt all good, you comment and watch the videos! Thats all the support I really need :p

[@louiemercado5595]

A good job on the Wyrm my friend! Imagine Satan and the Demon Lords will use the Wyrm as his pet. And I imagine him as a three-headed hydra with four wings, and six tails. Plus according to the Get of Fenris, they called the Wyrm Jormungandr naming after the World or Midgard Serpent and brother of both Fenrir and Hel. And of course son Loki.

[@TheMapleTable]

White Wolf and Onyx Path have done a fantastic job weaving their world into real world history.

[@louiemercado5595]

Exactly @@TheMapleTable . Plus dragons and dinosaurs are both are number 1 favorite animals in the world of since when I was very young. And the werewolf (Garou) is my second favorite monster too.

[@devoureroftheworlds4764]

@@louiemercado5595 By the way, a fun fact, the Black Spiral Labyrinth (Wyrm's home and his prison) has nine circles, just like hell.

[@louiemercado5595]

That's right@@devoureroftheworlds4764 . It was mentioned by the story of Mockmaw a Black Spiral Dancer who was trying to free the Wyrm and eaten by him. Check on him on the top werewolves of the Black Spiral Dancers. A video by @Lazar of Stygia.

[@devoureroftheworlds4764]

@@louiemercado5595 Yes, I've seen all of his videos on the Top Ten Werewolves, as well as The History of the Garou. It was pretty interesting.

[@arnoldtabor3767]

When a whole wolf tribe takes their own changing ability and future just to yeet part of the wyrm back

[@TheMapleTable]

The Croatan made a noble sacrifice kzbin.info/www/bejne/j5TSamWke66VZqc

[@arnoldtabor3767]

@@TheMapleTable but a costly one

[@gameon_ct]

I have a split personality And so do i

[@TheMapleTable]

Im the best company to keep!

[@gameon_ct]

@@TheMapleTable

[@malonemalo]

Maple, been watching some videos for a while now, because I love Garou and want to get more into it.. Have to point one thing out, though, oblivion and the Wyrm are not the same. At least, the Wyrm is part of creation, twisted as it may have become, from its imprisonment. However, Oblivion is the metaphisical concept of non-existence. Not even black, just the fall into nothingness, into the primordial nonexistence of before creation. The Kuei Jin diferentiate between the two, one being the Yin aspect of entropy, the other being the Yang.

[@TheMapleTable]

Yes you are correct, and I realize that my verbiage might say that they are the same thing.

[@Stormg0d]

Thanks so much for making all these awesome videos! You are my go-to resource for all things Werewolf and Starfinder, and are responsible for getting me back into both games. Please keep up the great work! :)

[@TheMapleTable]

Thanks for watching! Im glad I rekindled your passion for the games

[@AmityvilleFan]

So, not Wyrm is the problem. The Weaver is the problem.

[@TheMapleTable]

Yea, blame the weaver

[@AmityvilleFan]

@@TheMapleTable The Wyrm is just a reaction. The problem is the Weaver. Fighting the Wyrm is like giving antipyretic to the infection: you only make things worse.

[@Fintago]

I have really been enjoying youe videos. My only criticism would be that it would be nice if you kept to a single call to action and keep it either to the start or end of the video. It gets a bit frustrating having the lore broken up with "remember to like and subscribers!"

[@TheMapleTable]

I really toned it down in my later videos compared to what I was doing before. Tha ks foe the feed back though.

[@natebush8217]

I heard the Wyrm is identified as a male, the Weaver as female and I'm not sure what the Wyld is identified as. Do they really have genders or is that just a concept the Garou give them?

[@devoureroftheworlds4764]

I dont think that they have a specific gender identity. It most likely depends on who you ask. For example, in a similar story of the creation of the world as interpreted by Rokea, they are all females, three sisters. In addition, being one of the most powerful spirits, they can take any desired form, be it male, female, or something completely incomprehensible to our understanding.

[@natebush8217]

@@devoureroftheworlds4764 I figured that's how it worked. Thanks, bro. :)

[@Giles29]

Sometimes the BSD's refer to the Wyrm as It too...

[@griff9473]

I'm surprised no one has asked, but do you think the Eater-of-Souls is Cain from Vampire: the Masquerade?

[@TheMapleTable]

That wouod be an interesting take on things, i would have to look into him in the context of vampire lore. It does say that the eater was a bane, just a big one. Vampires are not banes to my own understanding... Just undead :p If you are running a combination game this would be a creative use of the lore

[@griff9473]

@@TheMapleTable in the Apocalypse book (from way back before W20 when they thought they were going to really end the line), there was a throwaway line about Eater-of-Souls being Cain. Considering who Cain is, and what vampires can do to other vampires (diablerie is literally consuming another vampire's soul), He's either the actual Eater-of-Souls, or the avatar of it. Also explains why he hasn't been seen in centuries; sleeping down in Malfeas.

[@TheMapleTable]

@@griff9473 i didnt know this, i don't have the older versions outside of pdf. Its a good argument though even if it was a throw away line. I always imagined it as some giant monster but it changes the mental image if it was a vampire.

[@griff9473]

@@TheMapleTable I mean, Cain being who/what he is, turning into a giant monster isn't really out of the question.

[@ferrous412]

One thousand subscribers! Congratulations!

[@TheMapleTable]

Thanks so much! Its been a little over a year! Its crazy.

[@Razamaniac]

🎶🎶We love the Wyrm coz it is close to us🎶🎶

[@BeardClipper]

wahey!!! Adverts to watch (I watched them through) and then more lovely tasty interesting content to watch also :) Another well presented and informative video :) cheers buddy!

[@TheMapleTable]

Finally made the big time! Raking in that sweet advert money... Honestly though thanks for always watching and commenting

[@OverboardDM]

Cool lore

[@TheMapleTable]

Thanks dude!

[@uglyweirdo1389]

Crunchy but still juicy and always well seasoned. Humans are the Elvis Presley of snack foods.

[@teyanuputorti7927]

It sounds like a neat concept

[@wendigowithaninternetconne9594]

The eater of souls should be the wyrms original function. And the defiler is like the weaver tbh

[@TheMapleTable]

Defiler and weaver are different.

[@scientistx5717]

How would Wyrm act if it was not insane

[@feruspriest]

this might not be the exact place for this question, but: Do you prefer to think of the Wyrm as a tellurian-sized force, or do you localize it's influence to being a threat bound to Gaia? Is the Wyrm equally powerful in the Mage universe, or does Mage reframe the threat level of the Triat? I prefer W:tA as my "core" WoD mythology that the other entities only partially understand but I'm curious how you balance/deal with the intertext between Mage, Vampire, and Werewolf.

[@TheMapleTable]

Im unfamiliar with the mage lore to comment on the Wyrm for mage but vampire and werewolf are the same thing just different names and slightly different historical accounts. I would imagine mage being the same. As for how i work it, i view the wrym as an entity not really with corporeal form. It can exert its force and influence but its unlikely that you will ever encounter it directly

[@MrFantocan]

@@TheMapleTable The Wyrm does have a physical form, and it is locked inside Malfeas by the webs of the Weaver, the Urge Wyrms are the emotions that the tormented Dark father let loose, like Desire, Hate, Pain... Emotions that grant tremendous power to the Maeljin Incarna.

[@Razamaniac]

In real life the Cosmic Web is so vast that you will never be able to hope to measure it, one can not hope to see it either from close up, this is how vast the Cosmic Web is. Now if the same, or similar, thing does exist in the World of Darkness, aka Gauntlet Web, imagine how vast is the Weaver that created it in order to wrap the WHOLE OF COSMOS inside the webs of Law and Order. And now imagine how vast is the Wyrm that could destroy the Cosmic Web if there was no Weaver, or Wyld, to oppose it. And now you should ask yourself: ''why these impossibly vast cosmic powers clash in a tiny mini maini mo place like Earth ....''

[@Razamaniac]

@@MrFantocan Relatively physical form which is not physical at all, since you know ''Umbra'', noone ever met the wyrm and those precious few who did, like Zhyzhack and Antonine in the Final Battle novel can never be sure if this was actually the Wyrm itself or its shattered sanity personified as its viewers willed and wished to see it.

[@feruspriest]

@@Razamaniac the fact that the weaver and wyrm are so interested in a single point in space/time in the tellurian is an indicator for me that the Triat is a localized phenomena in the universe. Like, there may be other manifestations of the weaver, wyld, and wyrm, but they aren't the same as their earthly avatars/incarnas.

[@lornbaker1083]

I always found it funny that the Weaver in trying to do the good thing becoming an enemy equally as bad as the worm. It's not given nearly as much effort as the warewolves put against the worm but they are constantly also looking out for the Weaver. Because They are both 2 sides of the same very stinky poop penny

[@sabithasajan5564]

Sounds very similar to Hindu mythology. Brahma - God of Creation, Vishnu - God of preservation and Shiva who's the god of destruction.

[@TheMapleTable]

The old world of darkness writers took inspiration from all over

[@sabithasajan5564]

@@TheMapleTable not just inspiration,if I remember correctly Egyptian gods literally exist in WoD ryt? Plus Helios worshipped by werewolves is literally a greek god.

[@ferraniglesias7269]

Awesome as always!

[@TheMapleTable]

Appreciate it!

[@coyotepoars]

I have 1 theory, about the eater of souls, I think it's linked to vampires, I think it would be Cain personified.

[@JohnDowson100]

Great video Nathaniel. Hard to say if the Wyrm and Obvlion are one and the same. It would tie things up quite well.. but I'd say no: Oblivion seems to be a much more passive and uncaring force than the Wyrm, which instead seems way more actively involved into bringing the end of the world. :)

[@krispalermo8133]

Wraith the Oblivion core book, don't know which page, but paraphrasing. Those who seek Oblivion can never touch it for it is always just out of reach and specters will fly right by them with a lack of interest. Those who scrap and claw to their former live and current undeath will find the pits to Oblivion around the next corner just below their feet. Unresolve issues with their fetters. Some about Star Wars in Return of the Jedi where Luke tells his father Vader to let go of his anger & fear. Honestly, that game system was written to be power game in dealing with the character's angst and balancing the PC's wraith/specter.

[@DrabeLord]

Cool stuff thankks

[@Agent29416]

I don't think the first nation would like sharing names with the head of the wyrm

[@TheMapleTable]

They didn't take on names of the Wyrm, just what they called the triatic wrym. I don't think anyone wants to be associated with the wrym :p

[@Agent29416]

@@TheMapleTable you called them older middle and younger brother witch is what the first nation tribes called themselves

[@TheMapleTable]

@@Agent29416 in the lore of the game, thats what the first nations tribes also called the wrym heads.

[@TheMapleTable]

@@Agent29416 the Croatan though also had specific names for the heads but I was only able to find the one name

[@AkiKii519]

I think a mistake here is the whole idea of "out of control weaver" and it's connotation with technology. The rate of overall change in modern world is higher, not lower then historical average. It should be Wyld that gone out of whack.

[@astarteswillum5259]

The Wyrm is a three headed dragon?

[@____________838]

Beast-of-War has such a strong connection to the Garou…

[@TheMapleTable]

Its almost their god

[@____________838]

@@TheMapleTable dun dun duUuUun!

[@Shiftready]

Excellent! Thank you! I was following Primogen, but appearently he dabbles in political opinion, now 😒 so I unsubscribed. I look forward to more of your WOD videos!!!

[@TheMapleTable]

I highly respect Primogen and his Indepth lore videos around world of darkness but im also happy to have you at the table!