The Fellowship of the Ring: Tolkien's Themes | The Red Book | Episode 9

[@josephraffurty9293]

I feel one of the strongest messages of The Lord of The Rings is the concept of change. You can never go back to how things were. So true of real life, and reminds us to cherish what we have while we have. But also, to try to find acceptance of the inevitability of change, and make the world a better place while you can. We all contribute to that change, for good or ill. Frodo ultimately made the world better, and so can we.

[@josephraffurty9293]

@creationbroszone Yes, absolutely. Choices to intervene when there is change can often be difficult and sometimes dangerous. Frodo definitely was brave to make those choices to take the ring to Mordor in the council of Elrond.

[@TheRedBook]

That is pretty much something I will discuss heavily in The Return of the King episode. I did mention "home" in this episode but it will be brought up again in TTT and RotK in relation to Ents and especially in relation to Hobbits and the Scouring of the Shire. Some themes clearly cross over the entire story but I am trying to frame each discussion about a specific volume.

[@josephraffurty9293]

@@TheRedBook I’m really looking forward to all those videos!

[@Pyr0metheus]

They say you never cross the same river twice.

[@danieldeclue1466]

You gotta respect and admire just how relevant tolkien's messages have been for multiple Generations now. The themes and messages of his stories are not modern and yet they are arguably more relevant today then they were when he wrote them. They are timeless, and borderless.

[@samuelvine]

Yes, please consider doing more chapters to this series! I loved it.

[@TheRedBook]

Definitely is on the cards. I'm going to do TTT and RotK. Then a fourth episode will be the topics I missed or couldn't fit in.

[@iamiam2574]

@@TheRedBook looking forward to it

[@Yesica1993]

The theme of friendship is one of my very favorites in this story. Not to get too personal/creepy, but the past few years and especially recently have shown me how rare it really is, as people that I assumed would be there for me... were not. But, as always, we can't control what others do. The only thing I can control is to double my own efforts to be that loyal friend that I desire and value, knowing that, at times, I, too, shall fail.

[@mileswright7294]

This is one my my favourite videos you've made. I haven't read the trilogy since 2010 when I was in 8th grade and I'm reading The Fall of Númenor before I start it again. I love listening to podcasts like these to pair strongly with my love of literary analysis. All your videos on Sauron and the One Ring are very enjoyable to me as last year I bought the 1:1 movie ring replica from Jens Hansen and I wear it around my neck every day.

[@TheRedBook]

Thanks :) Most can probably tell that the Sauron videos are among my favourite discussions because I think I made more videos about him than any other character, maybe Morgoth? I have a feeling episode 10 will go straight into The Two Towers with this. I had planned on maybe splitting them up with other episodes in between but it's all fresh in my mind at the moment and I am enjoying this type of content.

[@mileswright7294]

​@@TheRedBookI would love to see this series continued. Even if this book needs a second video to cover the other themes, it would be worth the screen time. So would a master video on the One Ring and Sauron. I don't know what social media you have, but I have several photos of the ring and its chain that I'd be happy to let you use for future videos.

[@TheRedBook]

My favourite type of content to make: Tolkien analysis. I hope you enjoyed this one. I cut about 25 minutes from it but that could work its way into another thematic analysis episode. I may do TTT and ROTK then a final one that just discusses themes I left out from all 3. We shall see. My community post explains why this was re-uploaded (kzbin.infoUgkx4lWaiXgJdfby-2wJFE6_lydteo5sADSt) You can find the Podcast on Spotify at (open.spotify.com/episode/3hLnlP7uFGWsZrqWD4bmGi?si=b4605e0964cb4822) Or you can find it on other platforms at (anchor.fm/red-book) You can get early access to Podcast episodes and videos by joining Patreon (patreon.com/theredbook) or checking out KZbin membership on my homepage.

[@mikeburke1881]

Thank you for another excellent episode.

[@item6931]

Coincidentally this is my favourite type of content to listen to.

[@sainiharika]

My favourite content to listen too ❤. Tolkien says that it is applicable to our world. He didn’t want twisted and over use of allegory. But allegory is the natural extension n takeaway of the legendarium according to me. & your work stands apart from other Tolkien channels because you centre the content around themes mostly. Some themes are universal, especially the corruption of power. This is what many brings are victims to without even realising just like gollum & Boromir n it can happened to anyone, of any stature. This is the biggest message of legendarium n should be applied in our lives. Even Melian warns against sword Gurthang to Beleg.

[@Enerdhil]

Those themes you mentioned sound great to me. You can add "restoration" as another theme. Also fulfilling one's responsibilities might be a theme.

[@istari0]

Great video as always but there was one part that really jumped out at me. Your analysis of Tom Bombadil and his role in the story was unlike anything I have previously read or heard and extremely insightful. I believe I have a much better understanding of this character now. Thanks!

[@TheRedBook]

It's a little bit of a preview from a long-awaited look at Tom Bombadil in The Lord of the Rings on this channel. Still not made a video about him but 2023 is when it will happen!

[@istari0]

@@TheRedBook Excellent!

[@Enerdhil]

It is interesting how Saruman was so corrupted by the Ring just studying it. He never saw it as he was not at the Council of Elrond. To me, that really shows the corruptive power of the Ring, that it could affect an Istari in such a way.

[@timcarpenter2441]

Your work is distinguished by a determination to analyse and interpret, instead of recount. For that, as a reader of Tolkien’s works for over 40 years, I thank you.

[@ghrosenb]

I loved this. Thank you. The depth of Tolkien's themes is an undercovered topic even though it's the most important to understanding his work. I'd request covering the theme of faith and trust in doing the thing motivated by virtue, even when it seems like it will lead to hurt or disaster. For example, to any sensible person Boromir's argument was right: the quest was hopeless and it was a fool's errand. The ring was being taken to Sauron, he would recover it, and the free world would fall to him. To all sense, Gollum should have been killed, if not by Bilbo then by Sam and Frodo. To all sense, Aragorn should have followed Frodo and left Merry and Pippin to their fates. Frodo should never have volunteered to go to Mordor, as he was the weakest and least likely to succeed. In each case, Tolkien allows the characters to make seemingly bad decisions motivated by nothing more than faith that eschewing some corrupt motive and trusting in the path laid out by some virtue would work out in the end, in some unforeseeable way. I think the tale gets most of it's beauty and power ultimately from this theme.

[@CertifiedFreshMemes]

Watching it again!

[@sainiharika]

I love your work n sooo grateful 🍀🍀🍀 I totally agree to what you said about allegory. It’s soo needed too. I love the line, like gollum we should pity Boromir. It’s really sad.

[@mattmccartney5996]

Top quality Tolkien talk as always.

[@drewp9819]

I enjoy this channel for the analysis, for sure. There are plenty of other channels that summarize plot points (and there's merit in that too, just for different reasons). But analysis produces something a little more unique, something to mull over.

[@TheRedBook]

There are channels out there with 100's of videos and I don't actually know what they think about anything in Tolkien's Legendarium.

[@Strider-bl5sq]

One of your best episodes yet!

[@NMahon]

I really enjoy the themes of environment, nature, and industrialisation

[@quillpen815]

Running this and commenting for the algorithm. I hope you're doing well TRB. 🙌

[@Hetpust]

this one is better than the first one👌

[@freddaniel5099]

The topic of "the corruption of power" is one of my favorites and perhaps one of the best discussion points to be found in LOTR, and Tolkien's ME writings. Unfortunately I think that we are mostly confined to examination of the written texts as I find the popular film adaptations lack much of what Tolkien wished to express on this topic. The theme of friendship by contrast, does come across in the films, so I don't think they are a bad introduction to ME and the legendarium.

[@ironblue4593]

Time to watch this again, great video as always

[@An-Ma]

Ooh, nice. Like button activated before I listen. Go, Red Book!👍🌷

[@billzoaiken]

Great video and commentary. It'll be great to hear a breakdown of major themes by book, but once you've covered all three individually, I think it would also be worthwhile to both revisit themes that didn't fit nicely into any specific one as well as cover themes that span across the entire story. As far as I recall, Tolkien had wanted LOTR to be one collection, so I would imagine the book-by-book dissection will cause a fair amount of arbitrary disjuncts (e.g., not being able to reference Denethor on this video). Thanks for the content!

[@TheRedBook]

That's pretty much what I have decided to do. I will do an episode for each 'volume' then do a fourth episode that just talks about what didn't fit into other episodes, or themes that I can only really discuss for a minute or two. That will tie it all together nicely, think. And you are right about the problems with splitting them up. But in that case it just means I will talk about the same theme from the place of another volume. So, Denethor will still be discussed in terms of good and evil (Tolkien's complexities in that regard), there will be other cases like that.

[@Yesica1993]

I can't imagine anyone reading LOTR and finding it simplistic. Yes, there was clear good and evil. But there were always complex personalities and motives.

[@TheRedBook]

I've talked to quite a few people who have said it but I have found that none of them finished it and quite a few were just basing their opinion on the movies. Of course, plenty of people will have read the entire thing and found it quite simplistic, would be interesting to hear their thoughts on that.

[@Enerdhil]

Not to mention the historical references mentioned..

[@Savrho]

Incredible analysis and content! Please keep doing these!

[@nickolas.vicente]

I'd love to see a video on your collection, or even just your preffered editions and versions of the books. ✌️

[@TheRedBook]

That sounds like the type of video I'd do for members/supporters of the channel rather than a public one but it's a good idea. I'm not a mass collector of Tolkien books with 20 editions of everything but I do have a pretty big collection with quite a few versions. Some for just displaying, others for taking with me somewhere, others for reading at night, some bought just because of how they look :D .

[@Davlavi]

Great podcast for the algorithm.

[@franciscordon9230]

Really incredible. Amazing content. Thank you!

[@BerenWolf92]

Making sure you get the view and comment you deserve, sir!

[@gabrielfavu8479]

Thank you!

[@glennr2358]

Brilliantly done… thank you.

[@victoriakidd-cromis1124]

At some point in the Harry Potter series Dumbledore is trying to explain WHY Voldemort is the way he is and he says he believes that Tom Riddle had never been loved by anyone, that he does NOT understand love and sees it as a weakness. Sauron has never known love and he does not comprehend the concept of doing something for someone without recieving something in return. It is so far beyond his comprehension tha at anyone would want to destroy the Ring that he is blind to what they're doing until it is too late. Many, if not most, true villians are surprised when they're stopped because they are unable to comprehend that everyone else doesn't think the way they do. Sauron EXPECTS that a warrior of the West will try to destroy him in battle wearing the Ring becasue that is what HE would do if thier positions were reversed. Gandalf says that is why Frodo will succeed.

[@chrisbroussard9759]

Here for second viewing. Thanks for the hard work

[@beegnutz]

Young Gandalf Team💪

[@item6931]

18:29 I always found it hard to disagree with Boromir here. Imagine if you were told the same: that your fate and that of the world depended on a creature when adult is the size of a human child with no outstanding intelligence, must walk into the most hostile place of a strange and deadly land and by his own wits successfully destroy some object? My scepticism would be 11/10 too.

[@TheRedBook]

It is relatable and understandable but I think the idea is that he had given up hope, essentially having no faith in the wisdom of the wise and forces of good. Yes, it seems mental that a Hobbit has the ring and is taking it to Mordor but "chance" led the ring to him and "chance" led all of these figures together and "chance" had the ring remain with Frodo and set out on his quest. Having hope that it could succeed is then seen as a wise path. Falling to despair is then tragic as it is a loss of hope.

[@item6931]

@@TheRedBook Thanks for your analysis - love it! I know in the FoTR movie Gandalf says to Frodo that Bilbo was meant to find the Ring and Frodo was meant to have it and that was "a comforting thought" but I can't recall from the Council of Elrond in the book if Boromir was aware of these series of "chances" that seemed to be something more than chance? Assuming no, would it have made Borimir a little more resistant to corruption and had more hope if he had known? If yes then his actions are less defensible and corruption more blatant. My impression from the Council of Elrond was that Gandalf had a bit of a "trust me bro" moment when it came to sending Merry and Pippin and even Elrond didn't seem convinced. Would be hard to blame a lesser being like Borimir for doubting too. Please don't get me wrong: I'm not arguing with you, I'm trying to learn from you :) Boromir was for me probably the most relatable character in the book because he was so conflicted (probably reminds me of me lol)

[@TheRedBook]

@@item6931 - Yes, the idea of chance is mentioned at the Council. Elrond refers to it when Frodo volunteers to take the ring, saying he was 'meant' to have it, and it is mentioned earlier when he speaks of chance bringing them all together. It would not matter to Boromir because his fall wasn't really an evil one. It came from fear, loss of hope, and a sense of duty towards his people. Meaning, if he was aware of this idea of a greater purpose, he would had to have carried faith with him the entire time but the idea of Gondor falling would gnaw away at him the entire journey. We aren't meant to hate Boromir but pity him. Even Gandalf talks about this in TTT, the task being too much for him.

[@item6931]

@@TheRedBook Awesome reply. You really have read the book 50+ times I think! I won't bother you anymore. Thanks so much.

[@TheRedBook]

@@item6931 Not bothering me :D even if you disagree with my views on it!

[@Enerdhil]

Even better the second listening.

[@TrevvorStewart]

Love it.

[@blaircolquhoun7780]

The One Ring could be taken as drug addiction, power addiction, and the other weaknesses of humanity.

[@item6931]

Thanks for discussing and answering my questions (Only option to donate $1 ? Can't even give you enough for a Mars Bar and a can of Coke...)

[@TheRedBook]

Thank you kindly. I haven' looked much into Super Thanks. I think more can give me given but it's not necessary anyway. Happy to discuss and answer questions :)

[@Enerdhil]

I am not sure that Tom Bombadil is a "pacificist." He is more like a recluse. He doesn't seem to think much about what goes on in the outside world. He seems to be sheltered from it, perhaps a kind of "Girdle" by Eru Iluvatar himself. I know what Gandalf said, but Eru would still have a say in what would happen to Tom and Goldberry if Sauron won.

[@TheRedBook]

If you disagree with him being a pacifist then you are disagreeing with how Tolkien viewed his own character. I'm quoting him when I talk about Tom's role as a pacifist. Of course, I'm not saying everything Tolkien wrote was absolutely correct and not up for discussion but just wanted to be clear that it wasn't my opinion of the character when it came to that.

[@Enerdhil]

@@TheRedBook I am just questioning calling someone a pacifist who would never be forced to choose to go to war or not in the first place. I suppose everyone who will never participate in wars could be called a pacifist, but isn't that obvious unless they join the military? I'd like to ask the Barrow Wights if they think he is a pacifist.🤔

[@TheRedBook]

Most pacifists have never faced war. It's a belief. There are also those who aren't pacifists who have never faced war. If you believe that war is unjustifiable and wouldn't want to take part in war for any reason, you are a pacifist.His dealing with the Barrow-wights is a completely separate matter unrelated to the overarching threat of Sauron - which is what Tolkien is discussing. It was honouring the offer of aid he gave to Frodo.

[@TheMarcHicks]

Is this a repost of the video you posted last week?

[@TheRedBook]

Yes, go to the community tab for details on that.

[@TheMarcHicks]

@@TheRedBook ...and I was so looking forward to the next part of the video, & so was so excited to see this in my feed.

[@TheRedBook]

I am currently working on a regular video for the channel but I do think March's podcast episode will be the next part of this - if I get it written in time. This was a very long script that was even cut from what it was originally going to be. I think my original episode would have been about an hour and 15 minutes or so just for Fellowship!

[@Enerdhil]

​@@TheRedBook One hour and fifteen minutes?! 😁🙏

[@TheRedBook]

I think most people would be bored :p

[@Slechy_Lesh]

2:50

[@caligulawellington3171]

Saruman went woke. ;)