The Wasted Potential of Carl Grimes

Carl Grimes was a character in The Walking Dead that seemed untouchable. The Walking Dead followed the story of the Grimes family, starting with Rick waking from the hospital and doing everything he could to reunite with his family. As the years passed by and we started seeing Carl as an actual character instead of a kid growing up in the apocalypse, Chandler Riggs really started coming into his own as both an actor and as Carl Grimes.
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[@imlinkzAnimeLIVE]

Carl had one of the biggest impacts on the Walking Dead. I personally think his character could have gone a lot longer , especially after Rick left he would have been a good leader. I think Killing of the character was the biggest mistake that The Walking Dead made. It also would have been pretty cool to see Carl with grown-up Judith working / fighting together as a duo.

[@laleema6845]

This is exactly what I would have loved to see, Carl and Judith duo, Carl and Michonne duo, or even growing on a Carl and Maggie duo similar to the comics. Older brother Carl raising Judith and RJ, and leading the groups was such a missed opportunity.

[@deathkage779]

In the comics Rick gets murderd and Carl lives to the point where there is barely no walkers left. The last comic book ends with adult Carl reading a book to his daughter. The book is about Rick and the events that Rick and the gang whent through ( or that's what I think the book is about ) I think that Judith in the show will get Carl's comic book story/ending.

[@Rknowles813]

CHANDLER CANT LEAD A SHOW lmao

[@jamesburlingame8893]

If Carl wasn't killed Andrew Lincoln wouldn't of even left the show

[@blackcatgat5836]

Wrong

[@jwaximus1113]

Carl should’ve been the last man standing. A Cowboy/Samurai carrying the legacy of everyone we loved

[@azahora22]

I really wish he would've been Thry could've literally killed anyone butbhim n it wouldn't be as bad.😥

[@Steezealways]

I’ve seen fan art of him using michonnes katana and ricks python it with a poncho on it was sick asf wish we could’ve seen this in the show it would’ve been so bad ass

[@joypurchase7728]

Yes I agree, Carol was the future of the show,it still could have gone on for more seasons. WITH him and then Rick gone the show had no hope or interest for the fans.

[@PedroLucas-mg5je]

@@Steezealways Imagine if he was carrying a crossbow (like Daryl), a staff (like Morgan), Rick's hatchet, Tyreese's hammer, a precision rifle (like Sasha or Dale) and a shotgun (like Shane) alongside Rick's revolver and a katana... Man, this Carl would've surely beat that world, as Lori said!

[@Steezealways]

@@PedroLucas-mg5je Carl would be fucking encumbered with all that gear on but yeah he would wreck some walkers though 🤣🤣

[@merlin8046]

Totally agree. I'd love to see a grown up Carl. Also, killing Carl was one thing, killing Siddiq was sad too. Carl literally sacrificed his life so Siddiq could live but they killed him just a few years later so it felt even more pointless

[@mizumiraccoon5687]

this bothered me a lot too, because like if ur gonna kill a beloved character, at least let their impacts on the show remain. his impact was siddiq in this case

[@cayluhb1113]

@@mizumiraccoon5687 I disagree, Carls legacy is what saved Negan’s and the other saviors lives .

[@mizumiraccoon5687]

@@cayluhb1113 i hadnt thought of that while commenting and i agree, he lives on in negan still, i just wish he could live on in siddiq too

[@0neiros.]

@@cayluhb1113 Negan is a shell of himself now so idrc, plus he fucking coerced women to marry him lol, basically raping them.

[@Horns897]

Well siddiq had survived like 7+ years more because of Carl taking him in, plus he got to have a child too.

[@idkwhattohaveasausername5828]

Killing Carl off is what made me quit watching. The show is supposed to be about him and Rick. There is no walking dead without Rick and Carl. Compared to the comics, the show version of him had so much wasted potential.

[@harukuroma376]

Me too, the moment i saw him die i quit the show. And tbh no matter how much praise the new season got i just cant get myself into it, and then i heard Jesus got killed too (per request of the actor) Which made the littlest hope of going back to the show die harder.

[@KostasCh08]

@@harukuroma376 rick is coming back in October

[@DopelyTV]

yeh its where walking dead began to die, then when rick left, thats when i stopped, i tuned in for a few newer episodes and it doesnt even feel like the same show or universe

[@southernvader]

It’s cause the actor went to school

[@simoncowell3171]

It's unbearable to get through season 10, the only og characters are daryl and Carol now and even they changed a shit tone. It doesn't feel the same at all anymore, what's the point of watching without Rick and Carl? The show changed a lot when they killed off Glenn but now it's just painful to watch

[@asainman8012]

As negan said "That kid was the future"

[@mikeweimer4783]

Dang I just made this comment somewhere else. Totally agreed

[@azahora22]

I also agreed when he blamed Rick for his death. If Rick had helped the one guy Carl wouldn't have gotten bit.

[@loopooh1632]

That scene just felt like Jeffrey Dean Morgan actually upset about the writers killing Carl

[@TheJotaroKujo]

@@loopooh1632 the Negan and Carl dynamic was such a great thing in the comics. JDM must have beyond pissed.

[@abramsullivan7764]

Yes Carl was the future if I was Carl I would enjoy playing the role being 13 to 20.

[@phantasm_4638]

It’s just so annoying that Carl finally turns that page and comes full circle to choose peace and compassion over revenge and bloodshed, and his payoff for that is dying BECAUSE of that correct choice.

[@bubblewrapstargirl]

Tw@ts like Scott Gimple don't realise the moral message they are sending to the world when they make mistakes this bad. They had a brilliant storyline to use from the comics for Carl. It would have been amazing to see Rick struggle watching Carl respect Negan and come to learn from him. to see Maggie battle with Carl respect Negan. Judith and whoever else could not and do not replace Carl play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Scott Gimple played a stupid game with Chandler and we all now see him for the stupid tw@t he is

[@lapplandkun9273]

Not to mention it was a sudden shift and turn. Carl wanted negan dead as everybody else did, but suddenly he decided that Negan should live because he wants to be a pacifist and wanted peace and love?

[@nostalgiafactor733]

@@lapplandkun9273 His mind changed after he spent time with Negan and realized that he really isn't that bad.

[@mercenaryknight5419]

@@nostalgiafactor733 Too bad that turn in Season 8 was not well handled at all and is so rushed and/or abrupt.

[@Zeroshiki]

​@@nostalgiafactor733 I don't get that, though. We're talking about a man who beat two people to death for defending themselves against his people who attacked them first, tortured Daryl for trying to defend his people, and basically enslaving all the other communities while preaching that he was _"saving"_ them. Rick's group never needed Negan to _"save"_ them and all he did was kill half of them off, anyway. He wasn't The Governor bad, but he was pretty damn bad. Letting him live really pissed me off, no retribution for all the good people we lost.

[@kaz101]

I always believed that Morgan should have taken Carl's death. It would have been so fitting and made so much more sense for Morgan to get bitten, and his final request to Rick would be to spare Negan's life. And Rick would grant that, being that Morgan was the first person Rick met when he woke up in the apocalypse, and saved his life multiple times. Plus the obvious "all life is precious" thing.

[@00piumSora999]

I was thinking the same thing too but with morgan being killed instead of glenn

[@RadioUgly]

I wish you was the writer.

[@TheJotaroKujo]

Ah but you see Gimple had already sent Morgan to his little spin off show to make more money.

[@thelegacyofgaming2928]

@@00piumSora999 Morgan taking Glenn's death wouldn't be good because Glenn had to die for the story to push forward

[@Whehbd]

And not only would Morgan’s death push the story and would’ve been really fitting considering he used to be very pro peace and it would’ve lined up around the comics since he died when the walkers overran Alexandria in the comics

[@kompst_tu]

They did Carl dirty. I could forgive killing Glenn off, but killing Carl was the worst mistake they've ever made. I would honestly be totally okay with them finding a way to retcon his death so he could be in the show again.

[@elizaneja]

literally, even if they used magic or something, idc just please bring TWD back to life...

[@JyNx_]

Glenns death was supposed to happen bc of the comics but carls death was distasteful and just unnecessary. The showrunners are the ones to blame for his death.

[@jameslewis3929]

That's why imo the real end of the show is season 6 episode 9 when he wakes up after losing his eye, cos after that, everything goes downhill. The show just doesn't work without Carl and that moment at least felt like some sort of ending, and they just did not finish the show after that. Plus that means Glenn is still alive which is a nice little bonus. I did like season 9 tho.

[@tfcbioshock]

@@JyNx_ y'know the actor for Carl actually wanted to leave the show for college right? They killed him because he wanted to do his own thing

[@cakecrumb095]

@@tfcbioshock I would have been ok if they recast him. That would have been totally fine. The character was crucial to TWD.

[@MANB91UK]

As far as I was concerned TWD was really supposed to be about Carl. Growing up in the new world, seeing how his Dad, Hershell, the Governor and Negan ran their groups before becoming a leader in his own right. Rick was the present and Carl was the future. They killed it

[@BadCodPlaya]

Almost exactly how the comics felt lol

[@azahora22]

It sure seemed like they were getting ready for him to take over last couple seasons he was in.

[@grove5456]

We got Judith or rick jr anyways so both of them gon have carls ending

[@thelegacyofgaming2928]

@@grove5456 Those characters simply don't have the same impact. I like Judith, but the history just isn't there.

[@grove5456]

@@thelegacyofgaming2928 the history is there, carl had to die so judith and rj can live and make rick a better leader.

[@jimmydcriket4086]

Carl's death was the single worst decision that I've seen in any show

[@PedroLucas-mg5je]

Same goes for the deaths of Jesus and Andrea...

[@kaylee3044]

@@PedroLucas-mg5je Andrea was kinda annoying

[@innavision1920]

⁠​⁠@@PedroLucas-mg5jeAndrea was worst character in twd

[@nenep1872]

​@@innavision1920I liked Andrea lol and I'm rewatching the show too, I mean she would of still been good for the group, she knows how to hold her own and help.... maybe I'm not seeing it🤷🏾‍♀️

[@innavision1920]

@@nenep1872 I think she had potential for a character arc like carol but it just panned out badly

[@thezoinksguy]

Carl's death was definitely one of the reasons Andrew Lincoln left the show. I mean the father-son relationship of Rick and Carl was his favourite thing about the show, what do you really get after that ends.

[@lanaab19]

Wait he left the show????

[@thezoinksguy]

@@lanaab19 Yeah

[@666.hellprincess]

Andrew Lincoln left the show for his personal family. Not because Chandler left.

[@thezoinksguy]

@@666.hellprincess He said he was thinking of leaving the show for years but he stuck with it, and when he did eventually leave it was a few months after Carl dies. It's blatantly obvious he thought there was no point in doing the show anymore after the way they treated Chandler and practically ruined the whole purpose of the show by killing off Rick's main motivation, his son.

[@666.hellprincess]

@@thezoinksguy from my understanding, they only killed of Carl because Chandler was going to college.

[@zeinobeid6810]

Carl and Glenn were two kills that even though shocked the audience, causes a lot more problems .After for the story.

[@0neiros.]

Glenn was needed, Carl wasn’t

[@treceslez]

Steven Yeun wanted out and at least his death was loyal to his comic death. Chandler didn't want out, Carl wasn't supposed to die, so his death feels like a slap in the face honestly.

[@franpazc2714]

@@treceslez yeah, i feel Glenn death make us realize how real the danger was(?) Carl dying was pointless, fighting with walkers almost everyday for him dying so easily 🥸 🥸🥸🥸 and about Negan, imagine Carls relationship with him while being alive 😭😭😭

[@samelliott5922]

@@treceslez Chandler Riggs moved closer to Atlanta and went to a college there so that he was closer to the set, not long after did stupid ass Gimple decided to kill him off. Apparently he thought he needed to die to “give Rick a reason to kill Negan” even though it wasn’t Negan’s fault that he died?? My theory is that Chandler was going to get a raise because 1., he was turning 18 and 2., his character was going to become a much bigger role in the show. That is why Gimple most likely killed him off.

[@treceslez]

@@samelliott5922 Yeah I know the whole story, it's what makes Carl's death more infuriating!!

[@alyssavance9838]

Since Chandler was turning 18, he was eligible to earn A LOT more money. They wanted to negotiate it (he has very....involved parents and they always have been; Chandler's dad even runs a TWD tour bus), but Scott wasn't trying to shell out that amount of money. Terrible because he did it right after Chandler bought a house as he thought he would be continuing on the show and wasn't given any indication he was in jeopardy. And yes, part of Andy leaving was due to Chandler.

[@Mar-sm6hk]

that's terrible. fuck them. i didn't know any of these. 💀💀

[@damianashcraft1635]

I thought he want to go to college

[@rockerdude8000]

He was going to do both but he did buy a house near set because he thought he be there longer​@@damianashcraft1635

[@jasminda2401]

@@damianashcraft1635 He was planning to go to school in Georgia, from what I've heard.

[@tokyodeathghoul2313]

I remember the rumors that Chandler was fired because he was into horse porn or some shit like that lmao.

[@randompebble9605]

When I got to the episode of Carl’s death, I literally stopped it halfway through and never went back. What a terrible decision to kill him off, in my opinion he was the most important character in the show because he represented the future of humanity. Would have loved to see the show end similarly to the comics. I might one day come back to finish the series now that it’s finally coming to an end, and I’m getting tons of twd content reccomwnded on KZbin as well, but Carl’s death was the breaking point for me

[@xkinsey3831]

I'll be honest, it is still worth watching the rest of the show. Seasons 9-11 are really fantastic, but there is a certain emptiness to them that doesn't really go away after Carl dies and Rick leaves. But if you like Daryl, his character is expanded almost more in those three seasons than the rest of the show altogether, as he really kind of fills in for Rick as the centrepoint of the show. Judith is also a joy to watch.

[@notBrocker]

@@xkinsey3831 season 10 is horrible and the worst season imo

[@mr_titty_wiggles1516]

Why are we caring about the random pebbles opinion like i dont even know which pebble they are very emotional indeed

[@xkinsey3831]

@@notBrocker that's fine you can have that opinion but you are in the minority, most people love it.

[@notBrocker]

@@xkinsey3831 and I stand with my point and if you actually loved twd and knew twd you’d say the same

[@primroseprom]

Honestly, if the writers brought Carl back and every character just acted like he never died and he’s been here the whole time, I think the audience would just go along with it. Carl was, and still is, one of the greatest characters in The Walking Dead, and as much as I love Matt Lintz and his portrayal of Henry, I’ll always hate that Gimple decided to kill off Carl for (what feels like) no other reason than cheap shock value.

[@treceslez]

Right? Lol, there were so many inconsistencies, continuation errors and just unexplained plot points (or I should call them plot holes?) from season 8 to 10, that bringing Carl back from the death wouldn't have surprised us at all (I honestly would have felt relieved). I mean, the show already has a lot of fantasy elements. They could have brought him back if they wanted, sadly I think that now it's way too late to try it.

[@bubblewrapstargirl]

tbh if they announced Carl was back in the show, I'd watch it immediately and I've not watched a single episode since they killed Carl off. he was the archetypal farm boy who is secretly destined to be king character and they. killed. him. off. I will never forgive them for it. I will never recommend the show to anyone. and I have never watched a single thing made by Gimple or TWD related since. I once got up and walked outta family tv hangout with extended fam when I saw his name come on the screen and realised he had a part in it. I just noped outta there. my folks were like... da fuck??? 😂 TWD is dead to me without Carl

[@digitalbritt2k]

With AMC announcing a bunch of TWD spin-off shows, I’d like to see a “What If...?” type series chronicling what it would’ve been like if Carl never died. An alternate timeline. That way the main show doesn’t need to do any crazy retconning and we can still get a valid Carl story.

[@tonyparra8459]

Same, even if Carl is still alive I rather have him stick with Enid instead of Lydia, which is shown in the comics.

[@TroySoy]

Yeah just like how everyone just rolled with Glenn's dumpster death 😂.

[@gamer42go21]

Just imagine how much older and more mature carl would have been in season 11

[@steamsleeper]

It was pretty obvious they didn’t know what to do with Chandler since he kept aging. He started down a darker path closer to the comics when he killed that boy in s3, then turned almost full pacifist by S4 and onward

[@SloopyBjDevil.]

Killing the boy in s3 wasn't a mistake. When you have been told to throw down the gun you were expected to do that not coming close as Rick did to Shane.

[@onemicyeehaw1583]

How was aging an issue? He already looked like an adult in season 8 if u did a time jump it would have fixed itself on it's own if u did it by just a few years

[@denisucuuu]

@@onemicyeehaw1583 Carl being as stupid as his 8 year old counterpart to attack the Saviors on his own? There are so many scenes that just don't fkn work since he is supposed to be a LOT more mature. Like in 7x4 where he still points a gun to Negan's face despite knowing what would happen. It's plausible for comic Carl since he's a kid. Carl in season 7 is in his late teens...

[@onemicyeehaw1583]

@@denisucuuu I was replying to the aging issue of the future. The time jump would've fixed Carl's aging issue completely. Also nah Carl could still easily have a rebellious stage and do shit like that

[@brendandulaca3147]

@@denisucuuu Well teens often can be pretty stupid so...🤷‍♂️

[@Firecraicr]

Carl definitely had massive potential. I could even see him outshining rick in a lot of ways if he were to get the torch passed to him. Common Gimple L

[@testpilotian3188]

He wasn’t fired and was even paid the three years he had left on his contract in full, said this on a podcast iirc. Gimple now admits it was a mistake killing Coral off and the only reason they did it was because they didn’t know how Rick would change and let Negan live because the source material didn’t make sense, so killing him off for the shock value seemed the only way to change Rick’s personality the way it did. What an utter twat.

[@brianachim2670]

They could of used Morgan instead

[@dbtv4691]

@@brianachim2670 wym? Replace his death to Morgan or?

[@brianachim2670]

@@dbtv4691 Morgan dies instead

[@ryanelliott71698]

@@dbtv4691 have Morgan die since ya know, he had this whole “life is precious” persona since season 5.

[@bridgethammond7]

Literally it pisses me off so much because they could’ve just explained Rick changed his view because he wanted to set Carl on a better path and teach him to rebuild they need to do more than just kill their enemies if they were so hell bent on Negan surviving

[@mattyl8746]

I definitely feel Carl's death was a mistake. We spent the series watching him grow up, hoping he would eventually become a leader only for him to be killed off just as he was reaching that point. If he had stayed on, and Rick still suffered the same fate as he does in 9x05, it would've been the perfect opportunity to push Carl in that direction. Obviously he wouldn't have become the new leader right away, but the remainder of season 9 would've consisted of him dealing with Rick's "death" as he feels he is not prepared to live up to his legacy. On top of this, they are now also dealing with the whisperers. By the end of season 10, he likely could've garnered enough respect from the others to be at least on par with Daryl as a leader through those developments. Then season 11, still the final season, he could've finally reached a point where he no longer struggles with leadership and has ultimately become a capable survivor. No spinoff required. Instead they kind of lost the plot in some regards. Definitely a mistake and definitely a lot of wasted potential in storytelling for Carl. This is actually something we also missed out on in the comics as there is a time skip to a grownup Carl as the leader of Alexandria. We never got to see any of his journey getting to that point.

[@bubblewrapstargirl]

Your idea is all I wanted from the show once we were a few seasons in and it was clear that Carl was Rick's driving force. But what is done can never be undone and TWD will get no more time or investment from me. the show was dead to me the moment Carl died

[@CaptainPikeachu]

Carl was my favorite character hands down and Chandler Riggs always deserved more credit for his performances than he normally gets. I have never forgiven TWD for killing him off and wasting all of that build up and growth for the character. All of those years of set up just to absolutely waste it is the worst thing this show could have ever done.

[@azahora22]

Mine too. I thought he was the hope in the show. I thought he turned out so much better than his parents and then they just killed him and for what? He could've been a better leader and he had a good heart. In my head Canon he gets a happy ending with Enid. He deserved better.😥

[@holymolystudios8467]

Im sure the show would feel a lot more warm if we got to have scenes with Carl Being a good older brother to Judith and teaching her stuff about survival and their father . I never really like his story lines, but I do think there’s a lot they could of done with him .

[@fizzy_buzz]

Bro this made me cry :(

[@MisoSoup247]

I 100% agree. I've been re-reading the comics and I hate that we'll never see Chandler Riggs grow into the role that he was supposed to. Would have been so amazing with him having a more central role on the show during all the time skips...

[@thepaceyturtle7182]

There is no way chandler would’ve been able to pull off such a role.

[@averie3881]

@@thepaceyturtle7182 literally. chandler’s acting went downhill quickly.

[@thepaceyturtle7182]

@@averie3881 I just cringed everytime he came on screen. I'm genuinely so surprised that alot of people enjoyed him as carl.

[@averie3881]

@@thepaceyturtle7182 it’s so clear that this decision wasn’t for the plot and was just the quickest way to get rid of chandler. his acting was not worth the extended hours and pay that he was supposed to have in s9. while I think that Carl’s value outweighs chandler’s bad acting, I can’t say that I completely hate this decision. 😭

[@thepaceyturtle7182]

@@averie3881 If it was me, he would've been gone in season 4 LOL. It sucks cause Carl in the comics is such a badass character, I really wish we could've gotten to see that in the show, but Chandler just would have portrayed it awfully. It would've been nice if in the earlier seasons they done a time skip of some sort and maybe recasted him.

[@aimeewilson4505]

I was Carl’s age when I started watching the show too, so whenever Carl died, a weird part of me felt like I had died. Like part of my immersion and connection to the show was that i could’ve survived with Carl on this journey. So when he died, I entirely checked out and no longer care at all how the show turned out.

[@siarah3410]

His death was terrible mistake, the show would have went completely different if he was still on the show especially after Rick departure. Now that Siddiq is dead , Carl death was for nothing. Really wished to see the all the Grimes family on the Richonne spin off 😔

[@digitalbritt2k]

With AMC announcing a bunch of TWD spin-off shows, I’d like to see a “What If...?” type series chronicling what it would’ve been like if Carl never died. An alternate timeline would be ideal if they ever wanted to bring Carl back. That way he could actually have a chance at reaching his potential that we were robbed of seeing in the main timeline.

[@ninxq4980]

i was just thinking this, and a ton of different scenarios, What if Negan killed Maggie, etc.

[@yusra3994]

Good idea but i think it would've been exausting for the actors and the directors to go through some scenes all over again, or maybe it can only be about the present day they would just start with after the Commonwealth and how the present would be with him around leading Alexandria waiting for Darryl to comeback or to go with him idk

[@digitalbritt2k]

@@yusra3994 Well, I thought there’d be different/new scenes because the point is if Carl had lived things wouldn’t have necessarily gone the way they did!

[@yusra3994]

@@digitalbritt2k Yea that would be interesting!

[@BB-tg3rm]

Same as you, I didn’t think much of Carl when he was alive. In fact, he got on my nerves. But when he died, I cried and cried. Somehow throughout the show and all of his character development, he had become my favorite character without me realizing it.

[@playingmsplikealoser2000]

It’s actually so messed up what happened to Carl and his actor. The actor was starting college and chose to go to one where they were filming when they told him they didn’t want him on the show anymore

[@liamphibia]

I 100% agree with everything you said about Carl Grimes. He was kind of my favorite of the cast, I too always thought that he would stick around for a long time, yet for some reason the writers wanted to kill him off & for what? Shock value?!

[@Chaziedaa]

bro imagine the reunion between rick and carl if he were still on the show and rick had still left. id actually CARE about it but idk if i’ll care about judith lol

[@treceslez]

Like Judith isn't even his biological daughter and he only got to share like what, at most 4 years with her (out of which they only spent like months, at most a year, actually coexisting, because most of the time Rick was away and when he was there Judith was being taken care of by someone else?) And she was a toddler? It's not like they could have made many wonderful memories together and bonded over that lol. Ugh, that's why that drawing Michonne found in the ship doesn't make sense either because why would Rick remember Judith more than Carl? (if the drawing truly is of Judith, as many theorize, I honestly think it'd make more sense if it was a drawing of Carl and Michonne).

[@branpod]

Yeah, Judith still _kinda_ shares the Grime’s mentality (although I think she’s a bit *too* empathetic for the apocalypse), but she’s just too young to lead. The Grime’s were always most interesting when they had the freedom to lead and/or make independent decisions.

[@darkuse1370]

Carls death has to be the biggest mistake of the show, His death was truly heartbreaking 😭💔

[@twdtwd1196]

I also think Carl had a lot of potential. If he had not died and after the war with Negan in season 9, CRM took Rick, then Carl would most likely help Michonne in managing the community. Most likely, she and Enid became a couple. And here is a variant of his development: after the fair in the Kingdom, Alpha kills Enid by sticking her head and the heads of other people on spikes. Naturally, Carl becomes depressed and angry. He tries to take revenge on Alpha at any cost, becomes cold-blooded, makes rash decisions. He already has a beard and hair like in season 4, not too long. And it is he who releases Negan to freedom so that he kills Alpha. After Alpha's death, Beta seeks revenge on Daryl's group and marches on Alexandria with a large horde of walkers. During the fight, Daryl and Jesus get into a fight with Beta, in which Beta wins but doesn't finish them off for some reason. After the fall of Alexandria, the group heads to the same 10x16 hospital. Daryl, in a serious condition, cannot participate in the battle. At the end of the episode, a fight could be arranged between Beta Negan and Jerry, during which Jerry dies and Negan also almost dies, but Carl sticks 2 knives in Beta's eyes and saves Negan. Negan and Carl ended up killing the two leaders of the Whisperers. In the Commonwealth, he could also be developed somehow. And after the release of the Rick mini-series, bring Rick back to the main show, add conflict between the Commonwealth and CRM. After that, a war will begin, in which Rick will sacrifice his life to save two communities from complete destruction. Daryl becomes the leader and the two communities become allies, years later Daryl got old and all our characters died. Carol, Michonne, Maggie, Kelly, Eugene, Rosita, Negan, Yumiko and others. And Daryl sadly remembers Beth's words: ... and you will be the last man standing. For all those years of government, Daryl trained Carl to manage communities and at the end of the series, he dies. Carl becomes the leader of the Commonwealth. And with him next to Judith and Hershel Jr. end of series.

[@ivanofrankovsk6855]

great Alternative but dont let Jerry die

[@jiffy6969]

Wow this was a great read

[@themagnificentorange672]

This was a sick storyline ngl 👏

[@twdtwd1196]

@@themagnificentorange672 what do you mean?

[@Nurse_Shelly44]

This is how the show should've played out. It gives the fans closure, and there's no need for all the spin-offs.

[@woodchopper6962]

I actually cried at Carl's death, he was an absolute badass.

[@azahora22]

A brass with a good heart and he was smart too.

[@jamessantos9861]

Killing off Carl was the biggest mistake TWD show runners ever made.

[@ryanelliott71698]

Carl in season 8 doesn’t feel like seasons 1-7 Carl. Carl, a kid who’s a very impressionable young adult being a pacifist makes no sense

[@Mikehowarth1988]

His mothers dying words always lingered in the back of carls mind though. He thought that the world was pointless unless he atleast tried to make it better.

[@BadKidBillyBoy]

Carl killing that kid that was "surrendering" in season 3 was absolutely justified. That kid could have easily just dropped the gun, but instead he gets closer to him. That kid could have tried something. Great video, love your Walking Dead content!

[@mason4777]

the entire point of ricks journey is carl taking the leader position and him telling the story of rick, not a reason for rick to kill negan, which he ended up not even doing

[@goldfishgallant1432]

Always bothered me that they suddenly turn Carl into a pacifist outta nowhere to do this whole thing about not killing the saviours when they had a perfectly good pacifist (Morgan) ripe for killing off and impactful on a similar magnitude for obvious reasons.

[@dougwilson6778]

That was probably the biggest gripe I have about the show killing off carl, it made absolutely no sense! Chandler did not want to leave the show and Andrew Lincoln was not happy they did it and it was one of the reasons he wanted to leave the show for awhile along side going back to his family

[@Zeroshiki]

His death kinda makes what Lori said about him beating this world kinda pointless, that's one thing that stuck out to me immediately. That was the best moment Lori had on screen, too. He would've been a decent and fair leader.

[@le_mythic]

I hate how instead of just going through with Carl's story they decided to kill him off and pass his story like it's a game of hot potato. At this point we've had like 4 other characters that have tried to fill in that hole and none of them have worked as well as Carl.

[@azahora22]

They couldn't. It was a Carl sized hole.

[@joeyplaysandtv7275]

I never really thought it was realistic for Carl to die by a walker bite.

[@TheHumbleWaffle]

Imagine if Carl held the mantle after his dad left, shit would've been awesome

[@fav76gaming]

I really wanted to see Carl and Judith grow up together as like a final scene in season 11, like in the comics how we saw an older Carl.

[@sabrehollowell9392]

Carl should’ve never died In my head he is still alive, like in the comic

[@azahora22]

I didn't read the Comic but in my head hs still alive too. He's the new leader n Enid n him have a family.

[@lilbapple4106]

I dont know if I was sad about carls death because it was one of those "you don't realize it till its gone" situations or if I was sad because of how it affected the characters around him especially Michonne, Rick, and Negan.

[@Cal24440]

Don't get me wrong I love the charecter developments after rick went especially daryl but I have goosebumps seeing carl and daryl as a team and potentially seeing carl in s11 as rick was in s5.

[@TheRealKarmma]

Carl death was the movement for people to really leave the show I mean Glenn hurt a lot when he died but I stuck around to see negan die but they killed Carl off so I left at the end of season 7 but listen can’t redeem this he’s dead in the show waste of a character that was set up to be top 5 best characters in the show but honestly they should just do a animated series and just hire the actors to play their roles again and start over in the animated but literally follow the comics 100% basically no Daryl nun of that I wanna see ricks hand cut off and everything full adult walking dead animated series let that blow up just like invincible they could do it Robert Kirk needs to redeem himself

[@kanden27]

The Rick and Carl dynamic was one of the last ones that kept me connected to the show. Killing Carl was the end for me. I kept up hope in that mid-season finale that Rick was stressed and saw a bite mark. Then when he cleared his mind and with Daryl’s help, just saw shrapnel in his side. Still something urgent, but he held out hope.

[@coreyphillips8352]

Absolute waste to kill Carl, how he died was bad too, a off screen killing.. that just seems more insulting killing him that way

[@JacksWorldYT]

instead of paying “Carl” as an adult, they lied to him about having this job at least another 3 years then blindsided him with the news he was dying shortly before his 18th birthday as per info given in now deleted posts (but still viewable on YT/google if you look hard enough) by Chandler’s father. They legit did this for shock value & nothing else & it will forever piss me off. From taking out Sophia, to then making Enid have zero depth in S9 before killing her off & leaving ALDEN alive…the show really could’ve had Carl & sophia/Enid around still with tons of development but NOPE 😒🤬

[@Nurse_Shelly44]

Exactly. The characters chosen to be the pike victims we're meaningless for me. Tara and Enid had already lost their depth.

[@bishbosh4815]

Carl is the most wasted character in TWD, hell in a lot of TV

[@logger22]

I’d have to disagree with the kid that Carl shot. The clip is on KZbin and if you watch it, Carl and Hershel ordered him to drop his gun. The boy slowly walked closer and kept eyeballing them to see which one was gonna look the other way first so that he could kill them. Carl remembers that Rick pulled a similar trick on Shane to kill him, and how prisoners are too dangerous to keep because the guy at the Farm. Carl wasn’t going to take any chances and decided to be safe than risking them and the prison. Carl does bring it up at Alexandria and says he feels guilty probably because it’s the first human he killed. Carl understands the consequences of keeping a dangerous person alive. He didn’t kill Ron because that would just make things worse for Sam and Jessie, latter had built a relationship with Rick. Despite Level Headed Carl vs. Broken Ron being a mirror of Rick vs. Shane, Carl attempts to be more optimistic, he’d rather try to help than just be safe. This leads his demise with helping Siddiq, whom Rick deemed as a threat, and his vision of a peaceful world.

[@thedeets_]

Yes I agree! It always bothered me that they acted like Carl was a monster for killing the kid back at the prison. Carl clearly ordered the kid to drop the gun, not slowly approach him with the gun still in hand. If that scene was supposed to make Carl look like a monster then they should have had Carl kill the kid even after doing exactly what Carl said, then that warrants some genuine concern about who Carl is becoming.

[@tonyparra8459]

They didn't just kill Carl, they also killed the show for me. Somehow I lost trace on the Walking Dead forever. I've even written a fanfic where Carl is still alive and living through the Whisperer War.

[@oliverread1060]

the way you timelined and explained the show really bought to life not just carls arc but the development of the entire group and cast. And how even some boring storylines actually did add something deeper we perhaps miss while watching. Great insight man

[@DontLook2265]

Carl building a life with Enid in Season 9 only for it to be taken away (if Enid is killed by the Whisperers too) would be a very interesting thing to explore in a post-Rick TWD

[@federicorapisarda4844]

When i saw the season 4 Ice cream episode you mentioned in the video, I really thought it was the starting point to make Carl a more important and impactful character who wouldn't always rely on his father or other adults. We kinda got that, but imo he was still too underdeveloped. Also back in the day with season 9 I didn't understand why this "random kid" Henry, outta nowhere (since he was a minor character in s7 and s8) basically became a protagonist. But after knowing that his storyline with Lydia in the comic was meant for Carl, it all made sense. I really would have loved seeing Riggs in the whisperers arc!

[@M00nPh0enix]

I actually cried when Carl dies, and I never cried over a character's death before then. He was my absolute favorite character on the show

[@ArlGrmes]

They did Carl so wrong in the TV Show, especially his death. Like, really? A walker bite of all things is what takes him out? Whatever. I guess that was their way of trying to write off his character without Rick completely destroying the Saviors, even though that's what happened in the next season anyway, with Oceanside killing the Saviors that integrated into the groups and then Carol and the Whisperers wiping out the rest, save Negan. But at least there was peace throughout al the communities, right? NO. As stated, pretty much everyone except for Rick and Michonne wanted the old Saviors gone. Then after Rick left the show there's a time skip where all the communities have cut each other off because... reasons? Alexandria becomes more isolated after an event involving kidnapping, murder, and branding, plus they still had Negan under lock and key, so Oceanside and Hilltop resented them for that. But it's not really explained why Oceanside and Hilltop stopped caring about the Kingdom? Like, the Kingdom and Hilltop had good relations even before the Saviors intrusion, so what gives? Hell, Jesus, the man who introduced everyone to the Kingdom in the first place, was in charge of Hilltop at the time, so it makes even less sense for them to not be on good terms. Okay, but at least Siddiq lived and became an integral part of th- nope, strangled to death after Alexandria falls for the most obvious trap ever. Well, at least the surrogate Carl, Henry, will be able to fulfil Carl's comic legac- got his friggin' head chopped off... Story stuff aside, the behind-the-scenes, aspects of Chandler Riggs' departure is truly atrocious. So, graduates Highschool, and puts off going to college to continue doing the show. Then in early 2017, he gets a call from the showrunners telling him that he'd be on the show for at least another 3 years. SO, he thinks that's neat and buys a house closer to the set and plans on attending the University of Georgia to make filming the show easier for him. Then in June 2017, right before his 18th birthday, they call him up again and fire him. And while Andrew Lincoln was considering leaving the show for a long time before Carl's death, I think it was the last nail in the coffin in solidifying his decision to leave. *TL;DR* *Scott Gimple did Carl dirty.*

[@0neiros.]

Scott Pimple did do you dirty, I’m sorry lad, If only Frank was still running it

[@azahora22]

What makes it even worse is that Chandler Riggs seems like one of the nicest celebrities ever and mature from what I've seen.

[@herbivi-cus5382]

He had an insane character development. I was crazy impressed with Carl all the way. He started as a peaceful kid who believed in a good world. Then his worlview was crashed and he realized he lives in a brutal world, so he adapted very quickly, to the extremes. Then, when he matured and was able to look back at his life, he realized his kid-like hope wasn't all wrong. Carl went a full circle and it would be amazing to see him further in the story. I'd say young adult Carl would be a perfect "replacement" for Glenn, whose spirit was gone after his death. It felt like Carl's compassion and intuitive vision was cut short when it just started to blossom. I think his development would have continued to grow on so many characters, like Rick, Daryl, Maggie, Negan. I wish I could see Carl being a very important part of building the future.

[@azahora22]

He really was impressive. I thought he'd be a good replacement for Rick in a few years. The new leader and a better leader keader at that.

[@dannaherrera9944]

Carl was literally the future of the walking dead, now the plot seems to be all over the place, Carl had a purpose, he wanted to create a community and I would have love to see how he would have lead with Shane and Ricks’s influence, that would be an awesome parallel, now I feel like the show has no reason to go at all :(

[@smsnixs3372]

i always loved carl. he was really a good representation of what a kid would be like in his situation. once he was gone i knew it would leave a sort of gap in the show. it was a pointless death that doesn't really leave a huge impact on the show and how it is now especially with how they set up his death. i remember when his father tweeted about his departure then deleting it quickly after. apparently scott gimple did fire chandler on his 18th birthday according the the deleted tweet. i think it's probably cuz they didn't wanna pay him like an adult too. sad to see him go

[@yoloswagthuglifeselfie568]

Great video. So true. The show could’ve been redeemed after Glenn, but Carl was the nail in the coffin. They should be ashamed of killing off such a badass legacy character when his story was just really getting started!

[@PedroLucas-mg5je]

They should've killed Daryl or Morgan instead of Carl!

[@viddog6457]

I watched the show first. I don't plan on reading the comics because of Koroto's Mystery Shack's retrospective. I loved his character in the comics compared to his character in the show. I don't blame Chandler Riggs but I semi blame the writing. I mainly blame the age because the best parts of his character are based off his age.

[@bishbosh4815]

Carl may not have been as popular in later seasons, but I firmly believe after the time jump and a better script, with the role he plays in the Whisperer war and the story going forward, he would be a much better character. Imo the show writers completely neglected his character and never gave him the same depth, complexity and importance in the story as comic Carl, and the actor aged too fast (although realistically of course) to continue playing the role of a 14 year old. But again, the time jump soon after his death would've solved that. Gimple just wanted to get rid of Chandler for some unknown reason, despite the fact it completely changed the direction and narrative of the whole show

[@bubblewrapstargirl]

agree completely. they did Carl and Chandler dirty, and the show will be remembered as crappy because of it. it's just like GOT. the last few seasons did all the characters dirty and now no one gives a shit about it.

[@riverjourney704]

Carl was my favorite character and it hurt so much to see him go.

[@tova1412]

Carl was my favourite character, and even though I had already started losing some interest in the show toward his character's end, it was his death that made me stop watching the show completely. I haven't seen TWD since that episode aired, but all these videos in my recommended has made me want to start re-watching it soon. it will be interesting to see now that I'm older since Carl was my favourite character partly because he was a similar age to me when watching the show, I wonder if I'll feel differently now

[@kaoruyaoi]

Carl had so much potential in the show and was and has been one of my favorite characters since i got into twd. killing him off was honestly such a bold move and i think i can speak for most twd fans when i say that we would have all liked to see him grow up a bit and become a great leader just like his father.

[@joeyartone9378]

I’m glad to still see quality walking dead content thank you keep it up

[@Crizzzy12]

I would love to see retrospect for 'the grove' where carol and Tyrese have to deal with the kids. In my opinion it is one of the best episodes of all time. And of course, I would also love a retrospec episode of season 5 episode 9. Tyrese's death episode. It is horribly underrated with the last 20 minutes being perfection. The episode starts the wolves storyline while also acts as an episode to mourn the death of Beth and Tyrese of course. Directing in this episode was phenomenal

[@Crizzzy12]

"How Carol changed" and talk about episodes like the grove and the one where Sophia was found.

[@KasamiKun]

i totally agree with you. i also think killing carl was the biggest mistake they could have made. i love the walking dead, but i think it would be much better if carl was still alive.

[@tillytomjones]

Carl was one of my favorite characters in the show. I loved his character progression, I loved how he played a different role from any of the other characters, and I thought he and Rick were the true heart of the show. Everything you said about Carl taking the torch up after Rick felt so solid for the show until he was gone. I felt that Carl and Rick were the heart of the Walking Dead, and so with both of them being gone the show just feels completely different. And Rick's character also felt hollow without Carl as his driving force. Carl had, arguably, one of the biggest impacts on the show as a whole, so taking him out of the story just removed an entire mood and dynamic from the plot that I think was necessary and made the show what it was. I don't necessarily think the show needs to be watched after Carl dies. It can definitely still be watched as there is still a lot of great stuff that happens in the following season, but it's a different show without him. Even season 9, with just Rick, felt completely different and thrown off. I'm always going to be a little upset that Carl was killed off when he, out of everyone, should've made it to the end.

[@Barren_soul]

3:33 nah. Hershel told the kid to drop his gun but the guy kept inching his way towards Carl and NOT dropping the gun but instead pretending to hand it over.

[@jay2thaudy]

Scott Gimple brought the show to a screeching halt with that edgelord decision.

[@naeunprint]

carls death was the last straw for me, i stopped watching afterwards. twd has left such a big impact on my life like i still have thoughts about how i would’ve fixed the show to this day. I really want to rewatch it and finish all the seasons but the thought of not having Carl just blows my motivation. I honestly think carls death was a last f u moment from Scott gimple (i think that’s his name) after he was fired as a show runner. The fact that chandler riggs bought a house close to the filming set just to be let go pisses me off every time i think about it

[@cirquedefreak7329]

It’s so upsetting, esp knowing he became such an important characters as he got older in the comics. His death was such a waste. Glenn dying made me begin to loose faith in the show but then they killed Carl and I stopped watching completely

[@romanj5256]

At least glenn’s death had impact. They just zipped carl right out of there and tried to pass it off as meaningful. Complete trash way to do it

[@cirquedefreak7329]

@@romanj5256 exactly. Like did Glenn’s death have me sobbing bc he was my favorite? Absolutely. But everyone knew he was going to die there and like you said Glenn dying was vital to progressing the story but Carls was so un needed. They could’ve achieved the peaceful life without Carl dying so it makes zero sense why they killed him off

[@octavianmihu7861]

Glenn also dies in the comics, by Negan's bat, so that was always the case, but I think it was kinda thematic. Glenn's first ever was in the Satellite episode, so it was kind of like a loss of innocence, of humanity, which led to his downfall.

[@Jackson-jd1um]

Even though Carl was barely in the show, even though every time he showed up I sort of rolled my eyes, even though he was top 5 most inconsistent characters on the show. He WAS this show, he was the heart, he was the purpose of the show, he was the reason this show went on this long. Killing Carl hurt the show more then Rick leaving ever would

[@rubixfilms687]

Rick is like Anakin Skywalker and Carl is Luke. Take both those characters away and we have no legacy 😢

[@S1ashr.R6]

Thank you sm this is what ive been saying man. Carl grimes is my all time favorite character and will always be. there is such a big hole in the show without him. There was so much potential with him and Enid as well I dont know what AMC was thinking when they did this.

[@mckennalauren]

i met carl when i was 14. and he was 16. it was about season 6 in the walking dead so his hair was extra long and fluffy, he was a sweetheart. i was a shaking, crying mess and i went up and met him and his mother first for an autograph. i gave him my iphone which was the worst decision considering i don’t have that iphone anymore lmao. but i still have the picture of us on my wall. he said my hair was pretty and i had a nice name. i almost blacked out LMAO

[@effectedgamer6451]

THE biggest mistake AMC made. Once Lincoln left it was a golden opportunity to give the rains over to Riggs, but they couldn't. Had they done it over again they probably wouldve kept carl alive and built his character as a leader from seasons 9-11. So insanely sad at how bad amc messed up in the last handful of seasons.

[@sirsaturn9994]

Bro I’ve been saying the same for years. Killing him off was the biggest mistake they made and especially with Rick gone, they could have definitely filled his place with Carl and have it make so much sense for the story. I would have loved to see Carl take on his dads role and learn how to lead with the help of those around him. Also, I read the comics from start to finish and the fact tv Carl didn’t get the ending that comic Carl got was always really disappointing. Great video tho bro, keep it up 👍

[@deisygamez2133]

Carl is one of the best characters. For the reason that he had so much potential for that he could’ve had become the new leader when Rick is gone

[@alexbumble]

The Walking Dead seems to have a habit of killing off characters as soon as they reach their peak in character development. It isn't always a good thing. The nature of his death almost seemed like mockery of his character. We have a kid who's survived through so much; he's been shot not once but twice, the second time losing his eye, and a walker bite is the end of him? It felt so unfair. I will admit that through the beginning I actually found him annoying a lot, but his character was changing in such a good way and I really started to adore him as a character and saw his potential. You ended up getting a sense that Carl might even outlive Rick. Carl was completely necessary to give the show a push forward nearing the end of the story.

[@ruthrobinson2232]

I am still not over Carls death. I was (and still am) heartbroken about his death. He should have survived. The Gimple kiss of death 🥺

[@ZombieKiller2019]

I didn’t care for him at first either, then I learned about his story in the comic and thought “yes they are grooming him to take the show over one day” and totally expected that to happen and NEVER would have thought he would get killed off, much less in the way he did but I guess that’s a different topic, so when it happened and all Gimple had to say about it was give it a chance to see how the story plays out, it’s genius, or something along those lines, I’m paraphrasing, and we still haven’t seen any kind of good pay off from that death. I guess we still have Neegan but I feel like we could’ve kept him and Carl and we would have a better story and another original character

[@denisucuuu]

Carl didn't need to die for Negan to be spared, we've seen that in the comics, Gimple is just an idiot in seasons 7 and 8

[@d3adpegasus]

@@denisucuuu right. all he really had to do was follow the comics. he RUINED this show.

[@clairsy4365]

I agree with everything you said. Killing Carl was a huge mistake that made me stop watching the rest of the parts😢

[@fatmangaming9325]

This is what happens when killing of key characters for drama effect can go wrong

[@bridgethammond7]

I haven’t watched the video yet but I have to say I already agree with just the title. Carl had so much potential as the one character who was the last shred of his dignity from the moment Rick handed the sheriff’s hat down to him. Carl I think represented that goodness in Rick as a father and killing in him off in the show was in my opinion, one of the worst if not the worst decision Gimple ever made. Not to mention how cool it would’ve been to have seen Carl in the whisperer arc, losing Rick, and finding the Commonwealth

[@Trabsol]

The writers confirmed this was their biggest mistake on the show and they did it at the time because they couldn’t figure out why Rick letting Negan live made sense.

[@lukezyx8031]

Really liking these videos man I used to watch this show a lot and my interest gradually faded. Love the summaries and analysis

[@dmongru]

Incredible video and commentary. Absolutely agree

[@angie-bk1yc]

I loved Carl. Watching him grow and learn from Rick, he was a badass kid. When they killed him off, I was so angry. I might have kept Watching, but Rick left and to me the show was about Rick and Carl's survival story.

[@AntiSunshine101]

Personally if the what if series gets the green light they should do a what if Carl survived and show the ending of the comics that “what if the world could’ve looked like”

[@mrsensible3560]

Carl, Henry and Judith tearing shit up and growing in to leaders in their own right would’ve been a hell of a thing to watch. I dropped off after Terminus, I just stopped watching, life happens. I’m rewatching the series from season 1, I’m on season 8 now and have JUST witnessed Carl’s death. I can’t tell you how disappointed I am that they chose to go down this route. Carl is such an iconic character and his line “My mom told me I was gonna beat this world.” Going back all that time to that very line from Lori, it’s such a kick in the gut.

[@DarkMockingbird]

Carl could have had a spinoff with Daryl in france. It would have been awesome to see these characters have a better screen time and character arcs.

[@SportsWithPace]

hate how they killed him off and wasted his potenial

[@NoizyInSeattle]

I was so pissed that they killed Carl--and in such an ignominious way.

[@thomaswillard6267]

That kid wasn't surrendering his gun, he was committing perfidy

[@spfadden082711]

Well done with the breakdown. Brought back a lot of things I forgot about. I thought to was something about having to pay the actor an adult wage. They have done very well with Judith.

[@tetsushatarii2108]

Killing Carl was a selfish decision made by cooperate pieces of trash because they didn't want to give Chandler Riggs a raise in 2 weeks. It was disgusting, it was lazy, it was a slap in the face to the actor and the fans and it ruined the future of the show.