MIxing with TONS of plugins??.. You NEED to hear this!!!!

[@PaulThird]

Unfortunately the Produce like a Pro multitrack was caught by the demonisation police so I had to remove it from the video but instead I uploaded it to soundcloud so you can all still here the rough. Forgot to add that I've got mautoalign for fixing drum phase and mautostereofix for the stereo guitars. Again.. Thinking tools haha Listen to Renegade Rough Mix (KZbin EXAMPLE) by Taysound Studio on on.soundcloud.com/EzkXa Also the final finished mix (mix monolith still making level decisions) Listen to Jeremiah Red - Renegade (Paul Third mix) by Taysound Studio on #SoundCloud on.soundcloud.com/SpEug

[@TonyJBrennan]

Sounds good already. Has a kings of leon 4 kicks vibe. Id use that as a reference. brighten and tighten the drums a touch.maybe some parallel comp. and the vocal . Bit of mid poke thru on the bass and some guitar bite. then fx. It dont need much.

[@andrewkaiser7203]

Have your ever used Melda's Spectral Dynamics for ducking? It seems perfect for that.

[@PaulThird]

I prefer trackspacer 🤓

[@realraven2000]

@@PaulThirdfor vocals, I wouldn't apply it to the whole mix but only to the guitar bus - maybe on some keys where needed. might be interesting to put it on Reverb returns as well - you got the old nogging going.

[@PaulThird]

It actually only ended up on the guitars cause the instrument bus is only guitars haha purposely chose a pretty simple mix for trying this method out. But I did try using it on the mix bus (bar vocals) and it didn't work as well as its getting in the way of the drums for me so I think I'll continue just doing it on the instrument bus or alternatively whatever bus that I feel is conflicting most with the vocal 🤓 Ps I use it on vocal fx bus as well haha works really well to blend it all in without getting reverb, delay, harmonisers, in the way of the vocal. Basically like the most advanced predelay you can think of haha

[@gooshie3]

I once did an experiment based on Bob Katz's "Mastering Audio: The Art And The Science" book. There's a chapter where he says to try mixing without any compression whatsoever - Try to use only what is needed. I created a small mix with 2 synths, vocals, guitar and strings. Took me 1 and a half days to mix with only automation - NO compression whatsoever. It's still the one of the best mixes I ever did. That was 15 years ago. Got lazy again and here I am. I don't mix much anymore - but that was an eye opener - I recorded everything well and only used 1 eq.

[@PaulThird]

Tbh the best mixers are using a shit ton of compression but in parallel. Spike Stent uses a LOT of compression and will sometimes have 2 or 3 comps in parallel on a vocal and use them for certain parts of the track but he's not shy that he hits it hard. He wants to hear the compression for the diction. Compression is a huge part of modern day mixing but it's more for character a lot of the time. I've noticed that a lot of pros are from the school of "actually compress the f*cking thing and blend it in or don't bother compressing at all"

[@gooshie3]

@@PaulThird Yep, and that's mostly the way I approach things nowadays myself, but only if needed, and I suppose for certain mixes, a more natural sound is better. Cheers, Paul.

[@lozzauk372]

This is so true. I've done so many mixes where I have more than 20 revisions and end up going back to the 2nd or 3rd mix because I had ended up over processing and losing site of what made the song work in the first place. I then think that I won't repeat that mistake but then later on I repeat the same mistake🙈. I've lost count of the times I have learned then forgotten this😂😂 Great video👍

[@PaulThird]

The Billie Jean story will always be the biggest reminder of not over analysing haha

[@st33Npuist]

This is so true. That's why I love total recall and work on more projects at the same time.

[@jloiben12]

I have really simplified how I mix. Now-a-days, I use Sonible’s Smart EQ (mainly for getting a good “base” sound when stacking takes), nectar/neutron, and Plugin Alliance’s API channel strip on the individual tracks. For busses, I use Softube’s SSL 9000K/Chandler Limited Zener-Bender. I primarily use the Sunset Sound reverb or the Seven Heaven reverb. For delays I mainly use the Soundtoys delays. My mix buss is pretty loaded but it is largely due to utility tools than anything else (ie - to isolate/mute the bass, to standardize volume, and monitoring tools). I am able to work so much faster now that I am far more… limited then I used to be. I am focusing so much less on what to do and more on why to do it

[@PaulThird]

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[@rossbalch]

What I like about your channel the most is that you don't present yourself as an expert. Just a guy learning like the rest of us. I like that you cite your sources instead of pretending that you're some mixing genius who came up with it all on their own.

[@PaulThird]

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[@ralphfokkema2316]

Get the source good. You can’t make a crappy recording sound great. If I have to fix to much in the mix I ask for better recording and coach the client in how to achieve it. My own recordings already sound as if it’s mixed. Therefore I use very little plug-ins. Paul is right about the balance. Most important before starting mixing with too much plug-ins. Otherwise you will chase your own tale. This took me years to realize.

[@PaulThird]

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[@duttons1]

One year later since this video was posted and still enlightening people. Got Mix Monolith on sale for $70, just tested it on a mix and wow. Always going to use this going forward

[@PaulThird]

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[@larrys2065]

I just got mix monolith a week ago and it is the best money I've ever spent on a plugin. Works great for getting to where you can start really making decisions about the mix without a bunch of pain on gain staging.

[@PaulThird]

Totally. So glad it was reccomended to me. This and izotope tonal balance have been my most important findings this year. Almost feels like cheating haha

[@kellydonnelly7828]

I worked with Andy Johns on Eric Johnson's Up Close mixes before I took over Eric's work in 2010. Andy didn't even use eq on the bass for the 1st few mixes. A touch of 1176 and the perfect fader position. Levels and pans are the foundation of mixing. The most impressive thing about Andy was his balances. In less than 5 mins after the 1st listen it sounded like a mix. Balance Engineers used to be the title before Mix Engineers. I generally use 3 or less slots on most channels. Guitars 2, an eq n compressor. With E.J's lead tone usually just 1 eq. Use your ears and your mind. My templates are minimal. Having a template dictate how the mix is goin to sound nakes no sense to me. I try to stay old school in approach. With the exception of FX, I have about 20 plugins in my plugin manager. Good segment Paul.

[@PaulThird]

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[@delorusclaiborne3274]

Empty 500 rack there in the background... the uad interface on the recent short... Pauls gone to the dark side 😉 i have used mix monolith for over a year now it is pretty good it looks simple but it actually isnt... I dont use it much anymore just because ive gotten so used to my own workflow manually gain staging it works better for me 👍 appreciate you paul vlad your feeling good brother 👍

[@PaulThird]

All for the persuit of science 😜 haha

[@wowflower]

Very true. When I'm not happy with my work it's always over production -also, I'm enjoying my topping L30 II, thanks for the rec!

[@PaulThird]

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[@memeswillneverdie]

I spent ages getting out of the over processing phase, I now make sure all of my editing is done first and sit back and think about where things should be, I rarely use more than 3 or 4 plugins on a channel and not on every channel. I became to technical too quickly in my mix to get what sonically sounds good rather than what creates the most emotion, when I started using the science to achieve that emotional response, my mixes got soo much better and now I can get a few mixes done in a day, I’m no expert by any means, I found the biggest leap for me that helped was working for people, it caused me to work faster and focus on the essential stuff rather than being bogged down on what specific compressor or eq should I use or trying to try this trendy technique I just thought “I need to do this quickly and I need to do it well” and to achieve that I asked myself “what do I and the client want for this mix” and I stuck to it, that focus will be very apparent in the final product whereas when your just trying stuff out and have all the time in the world your just thinking “what if I do this “ and you end up with an unfocused mess rather than creating a narrative from the song. Listening to Andrew scheps really helped easy my mind and really put things in perspective “the only thing that matters is what comes out of the speakers”, who cares about the fancy plugins/hardware you used, or how complicated your techniques are, all that matters is what comes out of the speakers.

[@johnplainsong9769]

I wholeheartedly agree .... Ayaic's Mix Monolith is incredible software IF you learn how to use it. I started using it a few months ago and it truly has been a "game changer" for my mixes. Thanks for this video, you're ideas are always a breath of fresh air...

[@PaulThird]

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[@tonedowne]

One of the positive aspects of working on a console, was the number of monitor mixes you would pull up while tracking. It helped the musicians feel good about what they were doing while giving you a feel for how it all fit together in a mix, but starting from scratch at mix time. Not physically having endless amounts of gear helps as well.

[@PaulThird]

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[@alsoulmusic]

I can vouch for mix monolith. It just gets the mix to a great starting point. I completely trust it. Like Paul said, my faders are at zero. Because of this plugin I don’t use my console 1 fader much when I am doing the final mix. It is still useful when I am doing the initial production.

[@PaulThird]

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[@BILLY-px3hw]

You have to remember before the digital age most studios only had a handful of actual effects and processors, much of what they did was with EQ and faders, they did however have the most realistic analog emulation. I think people forget that a mixing engineer's job is to actually mix the tracks. If you approach the job with the idea of avoiding plugins whenever possible your mixes will improve significantly and your job becomes easier because you do not have to worry about the 50 plugin levels you are monitoring

[@PaulThird]

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[@RealHomeRecording]

Have you used a hardware Neve or API, which came out in the 1960s and 1970s? Although they are not pinpoint equalizers like an SSL console, they can certainly elicit a great sound. Don't forget the solid state logic console came out in the late 1970s and they became very popular in the 1980s with the 4000 models. 100% agreed mix engineers need to remember that you only really need a few plugins to equal what great music was once recorded with. I personally stick with EQ, saturation, tape and compressor plugins for the most part and use them as if I owned the real hardware. Delay and reverb on a few tracks.

[@worksofein6449]

Something I noticed about pro mixes while watching nail the mix, is that they do relatively little to the individual sounds. It deffo helps if you've got excellently recorded material to start with too. 😅

[@PaulThird]

Yes, I'm still waiting to see a MWTM with a bedroom recording through a behringer and a 57 😂

[@RealHomeRecording]

@@PaulThird me too. I'll send them some tracks!

[@RealHomeRecording]

Are they seriously doing that? Mixing well recorded tracks is like cheating on a final exam!

[@worksofein6449]

@@PaulThird that would be rad.

[@worksofein6449]

@@RealHomeRecording I know. Here's me struggling with whatever crap I can churn out. 😅

[@mageprometheus]

Hi Paul. I only produce synthwave and electronic. I use a fair number of plugins during sound design and production, and loads of automation. Before I do any mixing I create stems to avoid the temptation to mess. Next is the rough mix then trim all the faders to zero. Only then do I add mix level EQ, compression, mix automation, etc. I thought that was how everyone did it. I didn't realise you were making things so complicated for yourself. Anyway, thanks for the plugin tip. I'm going to download Ayaic Mix Monolith and see what all the fuss is about. Have a great weekend.

[@PaulThird]

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[@dominykascivilis7003]

Paul's impressions are so accurate, that every time he does one, I think he's mocking me personally. :D

[@PaulThird]

😂😂😂😅😅

[@JakeyWakey]

These plugins really help. I put them as the first process on my channels and last on my mix bus. Once I got used to where things "should" sit. I stopped using them because I like to mix loud af.

[@PaulThird]

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[@Randuski]

This is something I've discovered recently. Looking at pro mixers thinking where are all the plugins? But engineering is a big part of it as well. The recordings their mixing were recorded in perfectly treated rooms. And usually they were recorded with the rest of the track in mind. A massive stereo acoustic guitar with a wide frequency range isn't gonna work for a sense mix. You need to record it in a way that fits in the mix. You have to consider the end result when your recording, and make sure it's a good recording in a room that sounds good. Then it might just need some light EQ, maybe a little compression, and you're good to go

[@mixphantom0101]

Mix Monolith is like having a keen intern to get all the channels up on your console before a session! 😁 Since you asked... I happen to watch KZbin videos in my mastering room so this is what I'm hearing. Drums sound like they're in the room next door... the kick in particular sounds like a 60hz sine pulse - like the beater has a towel wrapped around it... bass guitar bottom is perfect but could use a more definition up top... guitars actually sound pretty decent too, but that'll change once you get some sizzle on the drums... cymbals, harmonica are almost non existent... vocals are on the edge of too loud, but again once the cymbals and drums are less foggy they may be OK. I hope these notes don't hurt Mix Monolith's feelings! I did an experiment with MM where I did a quick EQ of everything before MM and let it do it's stuff... because it's using Loudness to mix it gets fooled by boomy sounds and wide dynamics.

[@PaulThird]

Yeah I know once I eq the kick and snare things will become a lot clearer as there a lot of mud to my ears that needs taken out. Might even take the 2 mono rooms and push them L+R to give the drums a little more space and stop it clouding the kick and snare so much. Maybe smart eq them just a tad to clean them up. Guitars maybe just need some upper midrange to cut through a little and my verbs and delays will take away that dry feeling of the vocal punching through. Then I'll. Re-assss the levels but I know the fx will play a big part on how everything sits better. I agree with the intern thing, that's how I imagine it, getting the tea boy to put up a rough mix for you to get started haha

[@GregoryKeithe]

This is a good healthy non'intmidatimg way to thimk about approaching a song mix. I think that helps alot! Thanx

[@PaulThird]

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[@eccentricworx]

Organising tracks to Subgroups, Fixing/Aligning Phase, Gain-staging to VU Level and Balancing are the first steps for me before touching anything else. This would also be the 1st time I listen consciously to a song in full, getting a clear image for the target in my head and making decisions what I want/need to change...

[@PaulThird]

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[@eccentricworx]

@@PaulThird 😄

[@GabePlaysYT]

Mix Monolith is fantastic because, doing the rough mix first and hearing the automation changes makes you more able to give the mix what it needs versus what you THINK it needs. Most producers tend to EQ/compress and then mix after, but I think it's better to do it the other way around. Mix Monolith is a great way to help get there :)

[@PaulThird]

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[@yikelu]

I fully agree with your approach. First thing I do in all my sessions after basic organization is normalize to a LUFS value (typically -24), then bring up the faders and listen. Do the usual phase checks on any multi-mics, then volume/pan balance everything. Then it's problem solving. It's about fixing things I dislike. I do not mix into a template, though I am thinking about having a default ambience section (verbs+delay) with things setup just for workflow speed. The reason I don't have a template is that I have a big tool bag of processors that each do a specific thing, and that needs to be tailored to the track. A HUGE determining factor of how many plugins I use is how well produced/recorded the track is. If it's poorly produced, essentially a lot of my job becomes production and that's where plugin spam happens. Shaping the kick and snare, fixing all the problems with vocals (breaths, plosives, esses, over-dynamic-ness, proximity effect, intonation), reshaping guitars recorded using poor mic choice/placement. If it's well produced, then all you need is one channel strip worth per track at MOST, some light buss processing, and special FX. Pan, volume, automation, does the rest. It's partly why I like CLA Mixhub so much, or any console-like UI. You can do it all from a single screen essentially. Only thing I would add to your description here is: use a reference. I cannot overstate the importance of this. Without a reference you can easily completely lose perspective on the mix and mess up your balance, even if it "sounds fine".

[@PaulThird]

A reference is my next port of call when I've got a rough mix up 🤓

[@TangleWireTube]

“What does this track need?” Love how concise that thought is.

[@PaulThird]

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[@CLdwyer]

Thanks for raising the conversation! When I consider mixing, I’m thinking about the work the producer likely did. They probably went for vibe, feel and emotion. If they’re very experienced, accuracy can be included, which makes mixing even simpler. A mixing engineer’s job is to understand the intention and make that accurate and translatable. That requires specific tools but not many and usually, not all of them. Balances, audibility, emotion, energy. If those are prevalent in a project already, mixing is simple. Mixing shouldn’t have to hit our CPU threshold to be complete. That likely means we have a ton of processing on one thread/one track in multiple places. I’m of the persuasion of send me stems. Send me fully wet vocals. I don’t need itemized tracks if your vision was clear. That already cuts down on my over-processing and need for control. If something needs attention I can request the dry or have them revisit their wet tracks & stems. That being said, there are certain plugins that will almost always be useful on a scientific level. (I.e. Basslane Pro on Low End or a saturator/Clipper/limited threshold on drums, etc.). As a mixing engineer, everyone has their flavor. Cuz on a mixing level all those things affect headroom, audibility and loudness. So a template to some degree is both sound and reliable. Especially when using very versatile or effectively niche processors. But if those are all on when I open mixing material, I’ll never know the original intent of the song.

[@PaulThird]

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[@FursAndMasksMusic]

Wow, for a rough, automatically adjusted mix, that's bloody decent.

[@PaulThird]

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[@DrMarlowski]

So much wisdom and knowledge in a relatively short video. Keep up the good work! Subbed!

[@PaulThird]

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[@chris-rb7bm]

love your videos Paul. Make me laugh too with those edited video audio bits lol - excellent sense of humour! :) - good video always :)

[@PaulThird]

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[@deadlinkofficialartst5592]

i use alot of stock effect plugins in Ableton for mixing and sounds design

[@PaulThird]

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[@MedicineofSound]

I just came across your channel. I like everything about your content. Thank you for your assistance! 🙏✨

[@PaulThird]

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[@AKA47]

Can you do a studio one mix monolith how to once you fully figured it out. I bought it cause I kinda agree with your points but there isn’t a lot of studio one videos for mix monolith on KZbin.

[@PaulThird]

It works the same on every daw

[@erkamau9629]

Hi Paul, ok to use it on every single tracks, and how do you use it about parallel buses and fx ones ? And close the end of the mixing do you check again or not with another two steps process by Monolith before the usual last decision on the mixbus (or master bus) about glue and final dynamics, widening and 6dB of headroom for mastering ?

[@akagerhard]

So the obvious things to me are: mud in the guitars -> EQ; helping the snare cut with EQ and probably a transient designer to add a bit of punch (keeps from overEQing); helping the kick punch through with help of sidechaining it to bass and maybe even a little into the guitars, as well as boosting the ~100-130Hz of it, as well as a midboost on it (or adding a transient designer or sample if that doesn't do the trick). I really like the vocals and think they can stand proud, so I'd make them bigger, probably with heavy parallel-compression, because I don't want to kill them, but add a lot of balls at the same time. When it comes to the tool: Maybe use it as a reference in the beginning. Do your own leveling first. Really finish it. Then add the tool and compare. As long as you feel it can do something you can't, it's not an assistant, it's a dependance. You never let your assistant do something you can't do in your sleep. So at first I'd treat it like a study-partner to compare mixes and only once I beat it everytime, I'd consider using it as an assistant (if it really was faster than I am). Skills (especially those needed for your craft) are not something you want to sacrifice or outscource, because they remain when everything and everybody betrays you. Leveling is a skill. What if the plugin stops working with a DAW-update? What if you're asked to do a mix on a console without a DAW? But: Great video! Like it a lot.

[@PaulThird]

Yeah there will be definitely a bit of eq added but I don't think I'll go overboard. One eq move at a time and re-evaluate. In regards to mix monolith I just see it as a good starting point and I've been using the level planes which is a manual thing if I feel I want something to sit back or come forward. It's an interesting method to get your head around making 3,5 or 10db moves but I get the ideology around it. Almost like it's either there or it's not. Stops you making subtle level changes no-one will hardly notice. Like all of these tools available I always feel its about being in control. Letting the tools do what they do but always being at the wheel. Like a pilot. All about the setup that goes into it. Mix monolith takes a bit of time to setup but when you've got it setup right you feel like you can let the mix fly itself to a certain point and it's really just a case of keeping it on course as you try to reach the end of the journey. A modern day plane or train still cant do a full journey completely on its own but it can do a lot of it unaided with the right driver behind the wheel. Its all about balance in my head. Knowing how to set the tech up right and then using your expertise to know when you need to interject and do the manual "human" stuff

[@Bthelick]

Regarding what it needs vs what you want, there is a great saying I heard way back: "it's not your wedding" haha

[@PaulThird]

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[@legacyShredder1]

I've got a large collection of microphones, preamps with EQ's, and compressors I can choose from when I record so later on down the line when I'm mixing I don't need to rely heavily on plugins. I find mic choice alone creates a lot of space and contrast between sources so I don't have to carve out a ton of space in the box. I use different preamps depending on if I want something to be subtle and smooth, punchy, forward, wide, or right down the center. Long story short, I record sources in a way that I want them to be heard so by the time I've panned the tracks where they need to be and set the automation and fades everything should be 90% there or better. Edit: I also have a large collection of instruments that plays a huge role in creating space where the instruments and vocals sit well together.

[@PaulThird]

It's something I've been thinking recently that modern mixers trying to get up the ladder are missing. Not thinking enough about how much work went into the recording and production. You cant stay close to a rough and their vision when you are battering away on top of the decisions they've made in production. If you go bashing away at plugins from the off youll never hear where their vision ended at before it came to you. Wee things like that I've taken got granted over the years. Trying to be a superstar instead of an actual engineer respecting the work of another engineer

[@legacyShredder1]

@@PaulThirdI was taught in my early years of being a session player that a mixer's job is to make it sound like the band or artist is as brilliant as the audience believes they are. I.E. smooth out the rough edges and polish it to a presentable level without trying to put your own mark on it. I was taught that a mixer shouldn't have a sound. I was just a session player at the time, but I had to live by the same rule. I can shred a guitar behind my head or with my teeth as well as most people spend a lifetime learning to do properly with a guitar pick, but that has about a 0% chance of being useful to the artists I'm recording guitar parts for. I'm there to make them sound good, not me. Absolute basic fundamentals was all that was ever required. If I stood out on the record or gave it my sound then the band's sound was lost.

[@587583922]

So...I don't really mix anymore. But if i were to go back to it, I'd go pretty minimal with it and treat the DAW like a console. Pick one good channel strip plug-in that does a touch of saturation, eq, and dynamics. Put one on every channel and every bus. If some specific thing needs special treatment, it can get it, but it shouldn't be everything. Delays, character compressors, saturation things, etc on buses for whatever i want to send to them. Mix bus would get a VERY light reverb, probably a colorful EQ, maybe a bus compressor, and a limiter for client previews. It actually wouldn't be that many things. Imho, all the fancy plugins are for the sound design phase of a project.

[@PaulThird]

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[@CheloScotti]

nice resume 58723497759247

[@raymondmeers]

The mix was kind of hot and close to attacking my ears with my sub-woofer on full BUT i think it is a good rough. Going to bring it up in the 12/02/2022 Feedback Friday on Warren's Channel and see what others might think.

[@PaulThird]

I think once I eq the kick it'll help the low end. Drums could probably do with some compression on the tracks, maybe parallel. I've got that going into a limiter at - 10 lufs as well just so I can hear how it's gonna react in mastering. Be interesting when I go back to it and compare it to a few references and look in tonal balance and stuff That'll give me a good idea of where to go with it

[@tomvice]

I think using a reference mix and levelling is way quicker and better. The plugin can't know the intention you're going for

[@PaulThird]

A reference is for after I've done the rough mix. That's just me though

[@djerikfox]

...one of the best production channels ever!!! respect Paul...!!!

[@PaulThird]

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[@queenpurple8433]

I’m just gonna get the trial and study what it does and take notes and do it manually with loudness meters etc

[@PaulThird]

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[@joshviggiani9844]

You're such a lovable guy Paul. And such a thick but great Scottish accent lol (I'm assuming, because you sound Scottish to me). Very funny edits and such. And great music production education/topics. I don't know how big you are into sound design but I for one would be very interested to hear your unique techniques and views on that kind of thing. And some writing as well because who wants a non captivating song. Cheers mate 🍻

[@PaulThird]

Sound design is way too much of a rabbit hole for guys like me haha

[@dansmithdks]

Good vid! That mix monolith thingy sounds interesting. Will check it out. Cheers

[@PaulThird]

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[@suarezlifestyle]

Man... in my best vocal chains, one EQ,2 compressors, 1 dynamic EQ if need to control some problematic freq, de ess, saturation if needed only (I always mix through 2 saturation plugins in the mix bus), and for the rest, eq, compression, dynamic if needed and Fx/clipping/etc depending on the material or what u want for that piece

[@slash196]

The one feature that I could really use here is to make the whole session autogain every time you made any move. We gainstage everything but our listening setup and we get tricked ALL THE TIME into thinking something is better just because it|s louder. It seems like mix monolith COULD do something like that if the right feature were configured.

[@PaulThird]

Just learn the monolith instance after every move you make 🤓

[@henrikpetersson3463]

I've never really gotten into the whole throwing plugins on a mix just for the sake of it, and the things I put on usually does very little. Unless it's poorly recorded material that is, then I sometimes have to use a lot of tricks to get it where I want it. I like using channel strips, and try to do as much as possible with the tools it provides. I have a collection of plugins that I know really well, and I usually know what to pick when the track calls for something. Now there's a place for dabbling around with various plugins on a track just to try things out. That's how you get to know the tools. But it's a good idea to try to limit that kind of activity otherwise you will quickly get lost in it and end up spending way too much time on a mix.

[@bontempo1271]

I see a little 500 series rack there 🕵 just itching to be filled ..

[@PaulThird]

For future testing but waiting 2 months for the first module 😅

[@CheloScotti]

Paul, .. you got me .. + 1 subscribed . really wonderful content and tips. thank you. Cheers from Argentina

[@PaulThird]

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[@electreelife]

“Fkn Parallel this and that”lol, again I can’t agree more!!! I suffer from the worst kind of GAS (a guitarist and keyboard freak…imagine that), but put hardware gear aside, I took weeks to hand pick the best VST tools for any given task and finally I have a really short list with Only the stuff I need! What you are preaching here is truly valuable and I hope people listen and get back focusing on creating music rather then live in the parallel world of fuckingaroundditis❤

[@PaulThird]

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[@mrmorpheus9707]

This video...every word, FACTS! FACTS! FACTS! FACTS! FACTS! 👍👍👍👍👍👍🥰👍👍

[@PaulThird]

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[@frankymino8773]

When I begin a song in the early stages of selecting instruments/drums etc.... I usually make sure they sound good from the get go without any compression/eq or other dynamic processing. Except for an element that I've put effects on to create a certain sound I'm looking for. (Based on samples and vst instruments. Even with live recordings though that's a different kettle of fish) I always make sure I can get my song/mix sounding great without any processing from the beginning. If it sounds good... then it sounds good yeh? From there I tend to focus on song arrangement and editing. The song is the most important feature of any mix in my opinion. Then if my ears tell me I need to control something in the mix or need better placement then I may begin to delve into some processing when panning fails me. But I'll end it here cause I could go on. Thanks Paul.... and cheers big ears!

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@HOBBITSODYSSEY]

I thought about it but there's no individual orchestral instrument settings.

[@PaulThird]

I think there are more presets available but you have to download them from their website.. I think. I may be getting mixed up with ceilings of sound

[@HOBBITSODYSSEY]

@@PaulThird I searched everywhere Paul, most plugins they cater for rock, pop, hipop, orchestral presets are rare, would be impossible to use Mix Monolith with the music I produce, its a shame.

[@yungthug7351]

what a nice fella! thank you c:

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@curtisburns]

If you don’t wanna spend money on a plugin for gainstaging, you can Normalize Drum and Percussion tracks in any DAW. I Normalize Drum tracks to Peak at -6, and Percussion tracks to -9 or -12. Then everything else can be gainstaged with clip gain and your meters. Unless you’ve got a shit tonne of tracks it shouldn’t take more than 10 minutes to do a whole session.

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@theboogiemayne2454]

Very Interesting!

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@kalyugitansen]

I am new just few years in music Just using sidechain kick , snare, , 808 and vocal with Instrumental bus nd I feel my mix is sounding better 😁 I am not a mix engineer👨‍🔧

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@ritchxmusic]

Paul what kind of panning or widening tools do you like/use?

[@PaulThird]

Panning is just daw. Widening I dont do much but sidewidener is good

[@joeycovington4681]

Thanks!

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@jarrodolman5828]

inspiring video! just what I am going through at the moment, and Monolith has been helping me out the last few days.....what about the Ceilings of Sound eq????!!!!

[@PaulThird]

Next week I plan on doing a video. Might change but I think it's gonna be next week. Interested to see what COS can do to the kick snare and vocals. It's a very interesting concept eq'ing to noise profiles

[@zwsh89]

I spent way too much money over Black Friday and sat down recently to mix and was like “how did spending all that money actually help me??” At the end of the day, it’s soooo much more important to have shitty tools and know what to do with them than have great tools that you don’t. Having the different tools can help me achieve a vision when you actually have one, but spending $600 instead of $200 doesn’t make me a better LISTENER. In fact-the opposite. All that time I spent deal hunting is wasted time I could have been AB testing the gear I already have, doing ear training, and actually making myself a better engineer-rather than a better plugin consumer. I’ve been thinking about these exact points you made a lot this week, great video!

[@PaulThird]

🤜🤛

[@zwsh89]

@@PaulThird not to mention that spending all that money did nothing for making my studio feel more “complete.” In fact-the opposite there too, every time I crossed something off my wishlist, it just made the items left feel that much more important, like my goal was to cross everything off after buying it all, rather than prioritize and make smart choices. That’s total marketing voodoo BS and not at all helped by the thousands of “here are the ‘can’t miss’ deals this Black Friday” videos that your home studio KZbin peers are putting out left, right, and center, so thank you for not falling into that trap and making videos like this instead! We need more people who can balance sponsorships with doing what’s best for their audience and I’m glad to see it seems you’ve found a way to both keep your corporate support base while also rejecting the dozens of emails I’m sure you got asking you to pump various plugins while they were on sale. I know not everyone appreciates your matter of fact laying down of the cold truths of the world, but I certainly do and I know I’m not alone! Keep it up, bud!!

[@PaulThird]

I got a bit pissed cause somebody commented that the mix monolith part of the video was a commercial when in reality it wasnt sponsored and they didn't even know I was including it in the video. I suppose that's my KZbin pears setting the standard that you only talk about a plugin unless it's paid or there's something in it for you, which is a shame. Its genuinely a tool I was reccomended to help me out and I really liked it. Those are the videos I wish to keep making. I'll do the testing side and stuff and make a bit of coin at the same time when the plugins right but on the most part I'm more interested sharing tools that I actually believe works better for my progression

[@zwsh89]

@@PaulThird that’s frustrating that people assume any recommendation you make is staged. I can imagine that makes you want to second guess making genuine recommendations, and who does that mindset help? No one! Of course the ideal situation is that content creators would only talk about the plugins they genuinely want to support, and whether or not they are paid to do so, those quality plugs would be the ones getting the “advertising”, thereby getting more exposure, selling more plugs, and become the companies with the recorcources to continue developing good gear and buy sponsorees to continue the positive cycle in an industry that would self-project quality gear towards success. Meanwhile the hope would be that the brands that are just interested in marketing would fall to the sidelines because no one would be talking about them if no one actually uses their gear. Unfortunately, as we all know, especially with examples like unison, enough home producers are hungry enough for cash to take the bait, and those companies can afford to “stay relevant” by force, and lead us to a well over saturated market, also skewing what it LOOKS like consumers want so we end up with 1500 1176 clones, but none of them have reliable auto gain, or other simple features that have been ignored in favor of flashy GUIs and famous name associations. Yeah, of course you gotta make some videos about plugs on request from companies to stay afloat, but the hope is you can connect with the developers of the gear you actually use and kill two birds with one stone by getting paid to speak your truth by a company that cares more about how their gear really helped you make good mixes rather than just having you make up reasons why it could be useful. The testing videos you do are great because no one else is doing that regularly, and I’m sure plug-in developers appreciate you proving on screen that there is value to their claims, like with acoustica. Harrison may not be as happy with your analysis, but again, that’s kinda the point, now isn’t it? To wake them up and hold them accountable for their claims if they are going to charge money for lies? So it all goes to the same purpose in my eyes, but to be able to focus on what really works for you and share true educational tidbits rather than plainly promotional content for its own sake is so valuable and rare these days. Back to Aiyac (or however it’s spelled) I really like their COS2, I haven’t quite figured out how to make best use of it yet, but I got it in a package with mix monilith which I assumed was more of an auto-leveler with some generally unusable presets added just to give the plugin more wide appeal, but seeing you talk about how it helped you is making me want to give it a second look. Maybe it can help speed up my mixing, who knows, but THATS the value of these vids. Aiyac didn’t ask you to promote them, yet their gear might start saving me time and improving my own workflow, and if that turns out to be true, I’ll tell my friends, they’ll support Aiyac too, and the company that deserves the attention-despite their promotional outreach (or lack there of) will be the one to sell more gear, and have the recourses to reinvest in making more good gear. Maybe one day they’ll reach out and ask you to do a full breakdown for pay. Until then though, don’t let the trolls stop you from continuing to share when there is something the rest of us really could benefit from! There will always be trolls, but if you build trust with your audience the way you have over the years, your regulars will know that a plugin recommendation-paid or not-comes from a genuine place, and that you’re only accepting the money to make a video in the first place because you’d make the video for free anyway, they just happen to be paying you. In those cases, I know the rest of your fans would be with me in wanting to support you getting some extra scratch from a company you’d say good things about regardless, as that frees you up even more to be even more truthful, and less needy for pure promotional sponsorships, and that positive cycle continues again! (Edits for spelling)

[@TheStuderman]

Agree with your approach.But also if possible get things done in the tracking in terms of tone.

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@youngmetroh]

@PaulThird how heavy is mix monolith on the cpu?

[@shanehen]

The best “plugin” is the fader.

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@bugeyedmudafuka2]

The volume fader is definitely the most useful mixing tool. What's the console plugin you are using there? I Only know of the slate and waves consoles. Never seen that one before

[@PaulThird]

Sonimus a-console

[@BRIGGS2710]

This is why 'minimal', is a thing. Find a few favorites, and stick with them.

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@bluematrix5001]

Gordito Boogie Boogie!!

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@DerekPower]

So … I have accrued more than 800 plugins and 75% of them are processors. Granted this has been two decades in the making and the biggest increase happened in the last five years when I was going back into making music and was looking for ways to expand my toolkit tastefully. At the same time, I have also been minimal in my processing. Unless there is something very deliberate like creating a particular creative effect, I have found myself using anywhere from zero to two inserts. So what’s all this then? Personally, I like having options and thus the large library. I see it being a way to fulfil whatever intent I want. Do I want some modern and transparent? I know what to use for it. Do I want something that evokes a particular time period? I know what to use for it. But in the end, yes, it’s about “usin’ the noggin’. Or as Warren Huart succinctly put it: having intention. Knowing what you want from the start will go a long way in deciding what to use in any given session. (Again, I know I want to do a lot and hence having a lot of options on the ready.). Furthermore, there is nothing wrong with having rules and limits if it will help you to realise that sound. I have thought of mixing as bringing together elements to form the whole. And honestly, if you have good recordings, good takes, good performances and it’s starting to sound right even at the start, mixing should be easy. And really, the only thing you need to do is either address technical issues (and by that, I mean issues that will be audible/noticeable detriment to the whole mix) or bring in creative enhancements (usually done to add some sonic character). And yes, volume and panning should be the first priority as that can often get that end result quickly. Finally, don’t ever think you need to do something because you should (i.e. must resolve bass drum/bass guitar; put low-cut on everything; etc.). So like you, I have a lot of thoughts going on about this. And this has been going on for a long time too. But the most important thing is to do something and keep doing it as much as possible =] Cheers, you lovable bastard 😁

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@stevedoesnt]

LOOK. Just TELL me what plugins to buy so I can get back to work.

[@PaulThird]

Mix monolith.. Now get back to work!!

[@shuplitz2257]

Instant like for the accent as soon as he said ‘mecks’

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@stanc2288]

Great video. My mixes don't have much plugins anymore. Sounds more organic, rather than fake plastic sheen.

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@JamesJones-th3ml]

We need to learn to use less and less plugins YES... I totally agree man! It's been my secret sauce here lately... If you keep focusing on a tone hunt you will find that you can make excellent mixes with less and less!!!! I only use compression, saturation and Eq plugins these days for a mix and effects for individual instruments and vocals of course... Certain plugins seem to help if they look simpler... Less bells and whistles might help a beginner mixer... Just sayin... Like Paul's favorite Magma saturation compared to Fab Filter Saturn. HAHAH just kidding.... But yeah, it's just simpler using Magma BUT we still need Saturn on the important stuff like the main mix... Subtle saturation really sweetens a mix. I am on the Dan Worrell advise using two different Saturn plugins on the master buss. I got one pre and one post! I use Saturn on vocals mostly BUT I use whatever flavor looks tasty for the day... LOL

[@Sance21]

What do you think of their EQ plugin, COS Pro?

[@PaulThird]

Liking it the more I experienced with it but I'm relying a lot on mennos videos

[@Sance21]

@@PaulThird I've been relearning the EQ over the past few days. I'll often follow it with an instance of Bertom Curve Analyzer so I can replicate the COS curves with a more colored EQ. I find the COS one extremely transparent.

[@PaulThird]

Yeah it's definitely a very interesting concept

[@matt_nyc_audioengineer]

Great video Paul! This sounds like a nice tool for some people but here is my issue with it. If you are using this plugin to do all of this stuff, what are you learning? Take the plugin away and you are left right back where you started. As I said it seems like a very useful tool but I'm worried people will use it as a crutch. One day the plugin doesn't work and you can't replicate it on your own and now you can't earn a living. Do you think clients are going to want to hear that the plugin you used to gain stage your mix won't work?!?! 😂

[@PaulThird]

Tbh I think of it this way.. the Grammy guys all have editors and engineers on their team who fix certain things and set up the session for them so they can get to work quicker. Mix monolith is my engineer setting shit up for me so I can get to the finish line quicker. Behind every Quincy Jones there was a Bruce Swedein and Quincy got more help from Bruce than anybody. Think about when your on your own without a trusted team of people that allow to do your job more efficiently. It's time consuming and easy to get dragged into micro details pretty quick Plus when you try and set mix monolith up yourself you need to have a good understanding of what you are doing anyway as you may want to set it up a certain way to hit your tape or console plugin. Plus, if lots of engineers purely stick to the reccomendations then they'll find out via the artist feedback pretty quick whether it was right or not. And even then it's an easy fix if you use the level planes method. Seriously dude, the AYAIK guy is a very clever engineer. I think I watched every video he's done using monolith and ceilings of sound and he's really created tools that give the user years of experience as a guide

[@matt_nyc_audioengineer]

@@PaulThird Hey, to each their own! You aren't wrong about big-time mixers having assistants but if the assistant didn't show up for work, they could still gain stage themselves. This one just isn't for me lol. I'm not hating on anyone who uses it. We have a feature in Logic that does this for us anyway so that's probably one of the reasons I see little use in it. I highlight all my tracks and click " Normalize Region Gain". Set the level I want, BOOM! Done hahaha! I have no doubt for some this is a game changer. That's one of the best things about mixing. It's all subjective in the end and no matter how much we may dislike something, for others, it's a gift from the heavens! 🤣

[@PaulThird]

It's all about finding the tools that actually work for a specific person and remembering that just cause a tool works really well for you doesn't mean it would work well for another. Im in a psychological flow just now so it's all very methodical in my head haha

[@matt_nyc_audioengineer]

@@PaulThird 🎯 That's it right there! There are so many things that I do on a daily basis, in every mix I work on, that so many people would tell me I'm wrong for doing. Or, I'm not supposed to do something some way. Guess what tho, it works for me! I have 16 open projects and 8 clients waiting. I must be doing something right hahaha! So many people take these "tips" or "tricks" and turn them into absolutes! Then they wonder why they don't progress in their mixes and their stuff doesn't sound like everyone else. There is a reason why you can flip through 10 videos on the exact same topic and hear 10 different ways to do it lol. It's because if it works for you that's all that matters. There is no right or wrong, mixing isn't black and white like that. No art is, or should be! People get so caught up in this persons mixing style or that this person said you should NEVER put plugins on your mix bus hahahaha! It's almost nauseating lol. The best part is if they would just shut off KZbin, pull up some multi-tracks (not stems dammit hahaha!!!!), open some plugins, and just start using them. They would figure out all the answers to their own questions. There is only ONE thing that will get you good at mixing. MIXING! I think it's just human nature to overcomplicate the shit out of everything tho lol. Great topic tho Paul and what a great conversation! Thanks for chatting with me here. 🤜🏻🤛🏻

[@MankyFrilla]

Paul yer so right man.. I've been ruining mixes with plugins and therefore not finishing them, I was playing a song to 2 separate people this week live on acoustic and singing, both said 'that's some fkn track' I bit I can't get it right on the computer' so you have just made a great video here.. I Got that mix monolith for £20 when they must have been looking for new customers.. Its a class plugin. Their other one 'Cos' is great but I've no bought it yet, its an EQ curve matcher with several bands but they sell bands as extras but it might be good I don't know.. Its that busy time Again so Merry Xmas to you and your family mate... 🎸🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

[@PaulThird]

Cos presets is great on kick snare and bass and using his vocal technique with cos is probs the best Ive heard

[@Fwuzeem]

Really good, getting the static mix is pretty much most of the work done. Next comes refining. UPDATE: Wait, so this just normalises channels to -25 LUFS and then does a bit of side-chain compression? I really don't get it, it just gets something else to mix the track for you. It looks like a lot of work to find the presets in the plugin and then it just normalises it for you depending on what instrument it is. If you have a DAW with LUFS normalisation why not just use that with a chart of target LUFS levels for each instrument?

[@PaulThird]

The -25 lufs default is just for gain staging, not the main purpose of the Plugin. The main point of it is to give you level targets via the presets. You are essentially paying for a tool to give you a pre-determined balance that has been tried and tested. You set them up once in your template so every time you place in the files in the sessions you just have to learn them all on one passthrough of the song. You don't need to gainstage with it but it's easier for me cause I've got it all pre-set up. This plugin is all about the set up. You set it up right once it's super quick. Getting your head around the level planes is another thing as well. You've gotta look into the psychology. Watch some AYAIK videos. Menno is a VERY clever guy. There's a logical scientific reason for everything he makes

[@nealo814]

You have an empty 500 series. Get some panel blanks! I got black lion audio auteur pres. Great for money

[@PaulThird]

The panel blanks are coming start of next week. Was I f*ck paying the prices for the branded ones haha

[@nealo814]

No stupid prices

[@jcpuga]

Choosing between Audient id44 w/Softube Console or SSL 12 w/UC1&UF8…I started working on Contemporary Rock, Ballad, Gospel, Latin styles. Some electronic music. Stuck on REAPER for now. It’s my hobby right now but this is a BIG decision for me. Any input from the community will help 🤗

[@hockeytalk6084]

Personally I’d go with the SSL. The UC1 basically gives you the feeling of the analog workflow without the hassle and it barely costs more than what you would be paying for the included plugins alone. Obviously if you just want the SSL sound there are cheaper ways like Waves and plug-in alliance for example, but if you are looking for a plug-in controller that gives you more of an analog feel I think you would definitely enjoy the SSL more but that’s just my opinion. I really want to try the console 1 because I have a couple softube channel strips that I absolutely LOVE but I’m put off by the digital UI of the console 1. I don’t know if that helps at all sorry lol, but I’ve specifically been researching which one of these to buy as well and I’ve landed on the SSL and I’m just saving up for it. But yeah I don’t have the Console 1 but I do have all the channel strips that work for it and I love all of them and don’t really feel the need to buy the hardware at all. In my opinion the SSL stuff is more true to the original hardware but that’s just my two cents, I’m not an expert. Good luck!

[@jcpuga]

@@hockeytalk6084 Thanks 😊 I hadn’t thought about the feeling part/workflow. I can totally see myself right at home with the SSL controller. Have you seen a petition going on for Plugin Alliance? They’re asking for Console 1 support.

[@PaulThird]

Tbh I don't get the SSL 12 for anybody in a home studio. What I've learned is that in a home studio most only need 2 mic pres in reality. For $500 I would expect SSL 12 to at least have adat in and out. Adat in only is so limiting in my opinion as it means when linking devices you are stuck with that interface as the master so you couldnt utilise the conversion of another unit. With id44 mk2 you have 2 sets of adat in and out, workclock out as well as the send/return feature on 2 pres for using external hardware so you can completely bypass the pre's and run directly into the converters. So if your recording a vocal you can send your mic signal into your pre, compressor, eq or whatever and return that processed analog signal straight to the ADC to go back into your daw. It also allows you to bypass the pre's for hardware when mixing. Cause you've got 2 sets of line outs. First set would be for your monitors. Second set would be for hardware so line out into line in of gear then line out of gear to return 1 or 2 (essentially interface line in) .. Signal goes directly back to the ADC. Where with ssl 12 your line ins are connected to your preamp and you can't bypass them and run directly into the ADC. Between the two. Id44 all day long for me. I personally believe ssl 12 is a real con for the money. Just using the SSL name to sell a basic as fuck interface.

[@Mike_Benz_]

I destroy my own song mixes all the time with too much processing and trying to make it absolutely amazing, which never happens. Other peoples stuff I tend to do a much better job as I am thinking more about serving the artist wants and not myself, if they are happy I am happy.

[@JakeyWakey]

Same

[@PaulThird]

It's VERY easy to get too close to a mix when it's your own

[@Mike_Benz_]

@@PaulThird 100% It is my one of worse trades to be honest

[@Super-id7bq]

It also really kinda depends what you're going for. NOISIA are known as the "producer's producers" and they are famous for insane plugin chains but they are complete masters of detail and dynamics with 20 years of sound design experience. But if you're recording like an indie band or an orchestra, if you spend the time getting the source as good as it can be you shouldn't need to overbake it to make it sound good. Just a little compression and EQ here and there. Plus maybe a little reverb goes an insanely long way. I often try throwing subtle short reverbs on stuff instead of EQ, even if I'm going for more of a "dry" sound.

[@TheRobGuard]

I do the same, over-using effects (plugins). Cause have so many and so fast to use them., but quickly get a bit too much... But lately try to discipline myself a lot more to level-match my every move before moving on and a/b-ing before deciding, very tedious and time-consuming, but it makes me use less plugins I guess, theres not enough time lol...

[@callehellstrom]

Great 👍

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@PharaohLawLess1]

I should have bought monolith when plug-in alliance had it on sale for $69

[@PaulThird]

I didn't know PA had association with AYAIK

[@PharaohLawLess1]

@@PaulThird They do 1 offs with other companies from time to time

[@PaulThird]

Ahhhh

[@magneticpitch]

hmmmm... Which DAW has this built in? Cuz that would be a great selling point. And why haven't DAWs thought of this years ago? (or have they?!)

[@PaulThird]

That would be actually be huge if a DAW had that baked in!

[@Rio-uv1gs]

Then the next video shows a nice mixing plugin thats better than the last 3 😁

[@PaulThird]

We'll see. If it works for me then yeah it'll bypass a lot of eq plugins

[@thegroove2000]

Ayaic will checkout. Thanks.

[@PaulThird]

If you do and want to use it how I do, don't use the sidechain ducking. I have that off. I use monolith purely for level. You may like the ducking feature of monoliths presets but I prefer trackspacer for that job

[@tonyrapa-tonyrapa]

Hey Mr.Third. I'm not sure how to phrase this but.... a lot of times, when I'm watching a mix or mastering video on KZbin, with my trusty Beyerdynamic headphones on, and the mix/production dude is saying "I'll just add a little comp/eq/whatever" and I honestly can't hear any difference. Are my ears past it? Or is it a case of the Emporer's new clothes? Honestly, I don't know. But when I'm sitting at my own DAW, I start adding a bit of this or doing a bit of that and by the end I'm saying to myself: WTF am I actually doing? And probably the one thing that I really find hard to understand is when to use compression. I understand from a technical point of view what compression does but when it comes to one of my own mixes I often find myself not really knowing when or if to apply compression. And eq is similar. In all honesty, I have learnt that less is more - apart from FX plugins, I very rarely use eq and comp plugins. I should add that levels and panning go a long way!

[@PaulThird]

I've been doing parallel a lot. Hitting certain compressors hard and blending in instead of compressing the source itself. Much more audible to me when blended in as the compression is really audibly doing something. Especially on vocals. That's why Stent and Brauer use multiple parallel comps

[@tonyrapa-tonyrapa]

@@PaulThird Thanks - I'll give it a go.

[@blackorangegraphite]

How does Monolith would compare to Neutron Visual Mixer by iZotope?

[@PaulThird]

Never heard of that neutron module tbh

[@timsarlos6403]

That’s exactly what Mike Senior is teaching too. 🎉😮

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@racializedkanadian]

Hey Paul, is this 'NOGGIN' plugin you speak of still on sale for BF?

[@PaulThird]

Just know it's $99.. I think it is anyway

[@vicneve1169]

Mixing = think before touch Mixing = less is more Book tip: mixing with impact by Wessel Oltheten

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@GoodmanRecordingsTokyo]

Really though, great video.

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@jmizzbeatsj-jigga7888]

paul in the house what up❤‍🔥📊

[@PaulThird]

🤜🤛

[@periurban]

It's probably easier to mix a track you've recorded yourself. You already know the song, and you were present for each take. I treat every mix as conditional. I spend ages listening to the "finished" mix, and sometimes I need to go back and finesse volumes, or add or subtract wetness. But I haven't struggled for years!

[@PaulThird]

I've always read that producers and recording engineers can sometimes get too close to the mix and that's why it's best to send it to a mixer as they won't suffer from tunnel vision however there loads of amazing records recorded and mixed by the same person

[@legacyShredder1]

You know what's funny is I replied a similar comment to him earlier but I deleted it before I sent the reply through. What I said was: I much prefer having songs and albums that I tracked and produced to be mixed by a different engineer other than myself, because they are going to emphasize parts of the recordings that I overlooked or I thought were mundane. I like mixing songs tracked by different producers and engineers, because I get to sus-out those little parts they too would overlook. For instance the breathiness spoken about in the video; I could easily delete the breaths with the line of thinking that the breaths are a sign of poor recording. A different mixer may easily think that the breaths add a ton of character to the recording. Being a guitarist I want the cleanest guitar lines possible, but go listen to the acoustic guitar breaks in John Mellencamp's 'Jack and Diane.' If I had tracked those guitar parts the little squeaks would have been covered up or deleted while the real engineer emphasized the squeaks adding some character. (Funnily enough I'm friends with the guitarist in the band who recorded those parts. He has long since left Mellencamp's band.) Listen to the out of tune 12 string acoustic fucking up the electric guitar in David Bowie's 'Ziggy Stardust.' If I had recorded that I'm positive I would go back and fix the acoustic guitar's tuning problems. As it turns out that's a super iconic guitar song, and the dissonance adds extreme character and life to the song. Instead of hiding it they emphasized it.

[@periurban]

@@legacyShredder1 Well, I come from the Frank Zappa/Holger Czukay school of production. Unlike them, I don't always know what I'm doing, but I for sure know I'm the only one who can do it. I've been producing my own music since the seventies, and I cannot imagine doing it any other way. The examples you give are interesting. Do you think the audience would have cared either way?

[@periurban]

@@PaulThird Sounds like "jobs for the boys" to me! Don't have the talent to record amazing music yourself? Let someone else send you theirs to mess with. No thanks! I've spent half a century learning how to do it properly. It's just a shame I can't hear anything above 10kHz!

[@PaulThird]

It's not as easy at that in the industry though. It's the labels that call the shots at the end of the day. Spike Stent did an amazing lecture where he discussed artists and producers becoming too attached to songs and losing perspective due to the amount of time they spend with the recordings. It's a long process. Tracking, producing, building a rough, overdubs, further production etc etc it's easy to lose perspective of the vision. and many many artists will go to Spike like..."we dunno where to go with this".. And he listens with fresh ears to a multitrack that an artist and producer slaved over for 10 days and knocks out a radio mix in an afternoon that the artist and label accepts. Mixers like Serban and Spike know what a top 10 record should sound like and its their experience that results in them getting the sound the artist wanted from the beginning. You pay for experience and taste when getting a top drawer mixer. Thats why Serban and Spike mix practically every top 'elite' artist single every year, and they have no input into the recording and production process (spike on occasion but serban definitely not)

[@intranexine8901]

Every time I don't use too many plugins I start to second guess myself and throw crap in just because I think I need to, time to stop doing that :D thanks

[@PaulThird]

🤜🤛

[@jamesjames77777]

Where do I get the noggin plugin?

[@PaulThird]

www.ayaicinc.com/mix-monolith

[@thegroove2000]

Plug in addiction is real. Call the audio samaritans.

[@Fwuzeem]

Why not just use LUFS normalisation with a chart of LUFS levels to hit depending on which instrument or instrument group you have?

[@PaulThird]

Cause its not as quick. As I said earlier. All in the prep. I dunno a quicker way of doing it without having mix monolith pre set up in my template

[@Fwuzeem]

@@PaulThird with LUFS normlisation it's not done in real time, so if you have a long project it's going to be done in no time at all rather than in say 15 minutes if that's how long the song is. Mix Monolith is also on the high price of plugins, and there are a bunch of similar ones around the

[@PaulThird]

Does hornet have the lufs presets for most instruments including buses? Mix monolith is all about utilising Menno's reccomendations. The gain staging is just an added bonus. To save time you need a plugin that can learn all the lufs targets in one pass. Mix monolith has all the presets predone for you. With variations like subtle, tucked upfront etc and many different instruments and sources. Is it just level if you don't use the side chaining and grouping? Yup, but as I said I don't know a quicker way of getting a solid rough mix which is also gainstaged quicker Honestly done the right way with the passes in the right order his lufs presets are SOLID. And can be fully done 3 passes max. If it's a 3 minute song then 9 minutes

[@Fwuzeem]

@@PaulThird you can easily make a preset for Hornet plugins to save time in the future. You can also do LUFS normalisation automatically depending on the instrument using Keyboard Maestro if you want to save some clicking. The point is there are a lot of ways of doing this job without having to shell out £82 for a gain staging plugin. Technically you can just get a standard LUFS meter and pull down the faders a certain amount if on busses depending on what it says. This is too simple a plugin to pay that amount of money for, and for just some presets on mixing levels. I don't understand why anyone would do that without considering alternatives.

[@PaulThird]

I just watched Hornets video on it and you can't get the workflow of mix monolith. The gain staging with the grouping, yes will work just as fast. But the channels no. The learn all function with the channels is what seperates it from others. You can have 50 tracks with differing lufs values and they can all learn at the same time with one click of a button. With hornet you have to learn them all individually unless you can group the lufs instances that are the same but that's still a pain in the arse as you have to know which are which and enable those seperately. And as soon you changed a target (subtle, tucked, upfront) you would have to move it into a different group. From a workflow aspect it's a nightmare and still won't be as quick as mix monolith. Its possible to set it up where you could maybe emulate the same end result but you'd have to save every mix monolith preset into hornet which is gonna be difficult as they don't work on lufs, it's vu. So you'd have to figure out what vu is equivalent to each lufs target, and set your session up in a way where the groups are named in lufs targets. It could get messy very quick, especially as you've got to remember to individually switch the AGC off in all the instances once you are done. and you'd also need to double check that the levelling is actually the same cause if it's not then you won't get the mix monolith balance. Could you do the level planes with the daw fader as its post fader, sure.. But at the click of a button, no Its all little things that add up. When you speak to guys sometimes mixing 3 songs a day.. Its all about workflow and saving time. An hour saved each day to them could be the difference in completing all their mixes or not. In a home studio setup where you've got time. Sure you can pain stakingly copy everything over and manually turn the AGC on and off and run through a few extra passes but at the end of the day it comes down to cost vs time. If cost is more important than time then sure spend hours on hours copying all the presets over and ensuring that the AGC both result in the same end loudness but if you were tell that process to most engineers they'd be like.. Nah, it's fine I'll just leave it and do the rough mix myself. That's why mix monolith costs what it does, cause they know 9 out of 10 people can't be arsed to try and even get close to that workflow. In theory, your idea could may work, but in practice I very much doubt anybody would be able to do it as fast and also set it up exactly right.. But there's a task for you if you so wish haha

[@Michael-vk6ws]

Warren Huart has a video where he talks about a session sent to him to fix, he does so and the other mixer says, "Wow, this is great, what did you do?" Warren says, "I turned off all your plugins." This realization, imo, is a level up in a mixer's journey; "What does it need" rather than "What can I do". That's engineering. Experimentation/learning notwithstanding. No one cares if you're using Grammy-winner soandso's plugin chains or presets if it's overcooked and/or doesn't fit the client's vision of the song. A mixer who can engineer will always eat the lunch of one who can't.

[@PaulThird]

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[@PharaohLawLess1]

I try to use as minimal plugins as possible

[@PaulThird]

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[@subterraneanpimpernel9455]

always lugs before plugs.listen. listen. listen. I always limit myself too. get a rough live mix up.

[@PaulThird]

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