This ability is OVERPOWERED and is making us worse players.

[@henrysmithtv]

that thumbnail is heretical

[@themarlboromandalorian]

The placement is awesome.

[@onisparda2546]

Cadia Stands...🥵

[@willb1405]

Nay. Tis approved by the holy emperor himself.

[@ViktorOcurra]

Whew, I was worried he was gonna talk about nerfing my crutch ability. Thank god it's just a plank with some nails in it.

[@MisterEtide]

Yeah… just talkin bout nails

[@xavierwong1889]

Personally disagree with a lot here. Pretty disgusting hot takes to be honest. Finishing nails get a lot of hate, but I feel are clearly superior to framing nails in 90%+ of situations.

[@MisterEtide]

I was considering banning you from the channel since you clearly must be trolling with that opinion, but i saw you were subbed so i will let it slide

[@Dave-dl6ql]

“Why does the game seem way harder when I’m not playing VOC vet?” Anyway it’d be cool if ogryn had a way to give himself gold toughness to play into the “tank” concept

[@pognava]

Man throw that on the taunt (but only for yourself maybe for a tiny bit of diversity), would be pretty cool.

[@shanehunt3019]

I'd love to see the middle tree have an option of spending stacks to put yourself into gold toughness

[@berserkerpride]

Yeah if anything Ogyrn should have the gold toughness ability. Something to do with Feel No Pain probably.

[@pognava]

@@berserkerpride god please

[@Random_Tech-Priest]

Nah, nerf ogryn again.

[@MyRedHulk]

I like the third nail on top, the one right next to the bent nail.

[@Nickesponja]

People go on about how balance doesn't matter in a PvE game, but things like this show how important balance is to build diversity.

[@swozzlesticks3068]

Doom 2016 vs Doom Eternal is a perfect case study for this. Eternal is an infinitely richer experience in large part because of how balanced it is.

[@Underground_Owl]

I think it's worth pointing out that the other abilities are part of the problem here, they're kind of bad. When sniping specials what I want isn't more damage (things get one shot anyway with a competently set up gun) but rather it's being able to shake off melee attackers so I have a moment to snipe in peace and not worry about taking chip damage from swapping off of melee. The stealth is great at cheesing objectives, but it's no zealot stealth and I generally don't care for the displacement it lets me do, I can once again just create breathing room in a better way and not grief my team (keep in mind stealthing shifts your aggro onto them!) by shouting. And then there's still the problem of which nodes precede the abilities, I think it's safe to say that both of the talents above VoC are leagues above the ones that you have to take for the other abilities.

[@thehermeticgamer3736]

One hundred percent. Even if you nerf golf toughness everyone will still play VoC. Hell, even if you remove gold toughness, and make VoC only regenerate Vet's toughness it will still be his best ult because it does the exact thing you need in a horde shooter where you are constantly being swarmed by melee fodder which is giving you space to shoot. Even CCing stuff like bulwarks and bosses, and allowing you to confirm a huge chunk of head-shot damage. The other abilities don't give you anything you need. The double-whammy is that if you pick them you're going to get point taxed on Vet's grenade generation node, and that's your second best tool to make space. The issue is the other abilities are just slop-jank. They're poorly designed. They brick your builds and offer almost nothing that is going to feel clutchy or impactful in high stress situations. If you have the space and time to sit in exey stance hard-scopping in on gunners and shooters then you are by definition not in a serious engagement. It's an ultimate that lets you win harder in situations where there are minimal stakes (sniping ranged enemies prior to a drop down) or when you're being baby-sat by a competent team. In other words trash. Stealth isn't trash, but sits in such a terrible location on the tree it doesn't matter.

[@triplebub]

I'd like to use Infiltrate more often, but that takes brain power and my marble smooth brain can only shout. Also dumping aggro on teammates feels bad.

[@JonathanB00K3R]

I cant seem to nail down what your point is.

[@sumdudefromthemoon2401]

The 2nd to last nail from the right looks like a modern art installation ngl

[@aidanthornton173]

**Beholds The Thumbnail** *Astartes: Really Mister E, right in front of my Codex Astartes!?*

[@LeadbelcherPaintPot]

The thumbnail is my favorite nail

[@MisterEtide]

sussy

[@gryphon_Space]

I disagree with this video's premise, the reason VoC is the most used ability isn't just because it's the strongest, it's build pathing. Only VoC goes through demolition stockpile and field improv, veteran has such an expensive tree that going any other ability essentially has a points tax which in particular cripples infiltrate, the Complete lack of survivability on exe stance is the only thing that really holds it back. say you got 10% toughness back on ranged weakspot kill while it was up and you'd start seeing it more. The way veteran is built with its peaks and valleys of power in the tree is what really crushed its build diversity in the tree IMO. VoC could handle a nerf but it's the wrong way to address the class considering out of 98 nodes, maybe 50 of them are worthwhile and a good 15 of them could use with being entirely removed to encourage build diversity. At its peak of strength the class is strong but its valleys are awful.

[@thehermeticgamer3736]

One hundred percent this, and the fact that VoC and the ability to throw lots of grenades (tools to create space and CC) just flatly work with Vet's playstyle. Other nodes don't create space so you can safely shoot, and place a points tax on grenade generation which does the same thing. It's a double-whammy, and their benefits are dubious. Exy stance's extra damage is meaningless if you're too crowded to shoot which you often will be without lots of grenades and VOC. Stealth is helpful, but in an even worse place on the tree. Even if VoC didn't give gold toughness it will still be used by every Veteran who isn't grinding a penance or memeing for funsies. Not because it's too good, but because the other abilities just don't provide anything you really need and scuff your build to add insult to injury.

[@wheetshire]

im a big fan of the nail in the side it's like a glimpse into my dark and twisted reality

[@MisterMelt]

The not getting damage bled through the healthbar while having gold toughness was something I wasn't aware of while I was leveling veteran and playing zealot. That's pretty valuable for survivability!

[@neptune3326]

My favorite nail is the one on the front left, thank you for the amazing video Mr. E

[@whinemax]

It's insane that I get better results on my Vet with VoC, whom I barely play, compared to my Ogryn that I've played the most. From build options, to the better skill tree, to being a smaller hitbox. Everything just seems to favor non-Ogryns.

[@moemothmann6760]

Nerfing voc risks alienating a chunk of players who will either stop playing vet or leave the game all together.

[@swozzlesticks3068]

The problem with this argument is that it *always* applies to whenever a nerf of a powerful ability/character/gun/etc is in question. This is not a valid argument unless you want to assert that nerfs are never appropriate.

[@Slough_Monster]

Let me get no downs in havoc first. Thanks.

[@MisterEtide]

Theyll never nerf it, dont worry

[@bannedmann4469]

@@MisterEtideI’m going to laugh at this in the near future.. in fact this notion paired with the video is some BS.

[@triplebub]

@@MisterEtide I mean, they did once. Remember when it gave +100 Gold Toughness?

[@tomohawkfive]

I feel like a quick fix would be to take the cooldown increase from 'only in death does duty end' and put it on 'duty and honour'. Maybe even the 33% radius decrease as well.

[@MisterEtide]

Nice idea

[@Kaninjäveln]

As a previous Vet main (before moving on to Ogryn), I always felt a bit self-conscious when not taking VOC. I personally love Excecutioner's Stand as it is peak image of Veteran to me, but it can't rival with how good VOC is for the team.

[@JPG.01]

I didn't even consider that when creating my Vet. I just went: I want him to be like Kruber. And like Kruber I made him. Slap a powersword on and I'll gladly leave the sniping to anybody else as I charge in with the Zealot for the glorious melee.

[@heftyjo2893]

It'd be interesting I think if the middle talents were geared more towards buffing one character archetype within the party so their is a more synergistic effect of diverse party composition. Like the Veteran shout can buff the Ogryn, and the Ogryn shout can buff the Psyker, the Psyker can buff the Zealot, and the Zealot can buff the Veteran; so that it is like a circle that can be completed. It could even have a roleplaying element applied to it: like the Veteran is commanding the Ogryn to do his duty (hence the "Voice of Command"), the Ogryn is protecting his squishy little psyker buddy that talks funny, the Psyker is provoking the Zealots divine fury with the use of heretical chaos powers, and the Zealot is inspiring the Veteran with the glorious power of the Emperor.

[@J.B.1982]

That’s a good idea. It would create a significant change in the game dynamic, which is probably why they wouldn’t do that.

[@heftyjo2893]

@@J.B.1982 Yea, and it'd prolly work better if you could change your operative in the group lobby.

[@cherryrook8684]

@@heftyjo2893 Majority of the playerbase uses quick play, you can’t even see who you’re matched with if the game is ongoing as it‘ll just be you in the dropship. But even if you could its gonna be a ”hindsight is 20/20" moment cause it‘ll be useless info when you’re already in a match with randoms. What if there’s no Ogryn? Or an all Vet lobby? It‘ll just put us back to vermintide 2 character lock or nobody will pick the ability or even the whole character (look at Ogryn player count). It sounds great on paper but horrible in practice, no offense. This type of thing only works in games where you can assure there is at least one of each character like Deep Rock Galactic

[@J.B.1982]

@@heftyjo2893 That's an interesting idea. I have a weird feeling there's a technical reason you can't switch that easily.

[@coffee0093]

It would be cool if it gave you like +100 toughness and suppression immunity instead, have it specifically counter shooters n gunners

[@Faeris_]

I like the nail at the top right that's slightly angled. It's a vibe. Possibly unpopular opinion, Voice of Command should be a 45 second cooldown like it was when update 13 dropped because it meant you had to shout at good times (usually) to get proper value out of Gold Toughness instead of shouting whenever it's off cooldown and having like 75%-100% upkeep of golden toughness. Iron Will being active above 75% toughness makes VOC feel like a necessity as it doubles all gold toughness values on Vet, Infiltrate is hard to reach unless you grab a stinky poopoo aura that's not Survivalist and Executioners Stance needs Unwavering Focus back from pre-update 13 (Toughness damage reduction when in Volley Fire/Executioners Stance) as an ability node but maybe nerfed from 75% so that it can compete with VOC-Iron Will.

[@ExRosaPassione]

Personally i’d like to see VoC get tamped down a little bit, and Exec get buffed up a little bit. I’m fine with it giving gold toughness, it’s meant to be the Veteran’s support ability. What I think would help would be make Duty and Honour confer a 50% CD penalty, much like how Only in Death has its range penalty (which should be removed) and On Overwatch has a CD penalty as well. And give Exec stance back either its instant reload, or give it something like a 50% toughness refill, because right now it’s the only Vet ability that doesn’t give you survivability vs enemy fire, and is the one most themed around counterfire. At least for internal balance for the class abilities, I think that would help. Exact numbers could be tweaked, like the base CD, CD penalty if applied, etc. That’s my take anyways.

[@IceCreamed]

Fatshark will nerf Ogryns after watching this.

[@stoshkrupsky9621]

Last nail on the top right, reminds me of working on projects with my dad.

[@troller9838]

Don't nerf it, Havoc is literally unplayable without gold toughness.

[@mining_master57]

PUT THE KARKING BOOT IN💥💥💥🗣🗣🗣

[@cherryrook8684]

GIVE 'EM THE 'OL KASRKIN DOUBLE TAP 🔥🗣🗣🗣

[@srreina8117]

GRIND 'EM DOWN 🗣️🗣️‼️🤺

[@eggycroissant0778]

my favourite nail is the far right nail at the back sticking out the side of the plank :)

[@itsyaboymarcelluswallace]

Counter argument devs should fix the audio bugs first then nerfing it should be fine

[@MercutioUK2006]

It (Golden Toughness) is probably broken to the point that alterations would destroy the game as practically all the challenging content feels predicated towards it's use. Of course, that content CAN be overcome by sufficiently able players but Bubble/Chorus/VoC could, especially with the cooldown reductions available, stand some alterations. Vet does, absolutely, need some variety.

[@Sir_glizzius]

Or maybe buff the other abilitys to be useful outside of niche use cases so they have diversity and doesnt cost a arm and leg to run or play around 😅

[@MisterEtide]

They deserve buffs too but they cant be made as good as this thing is

[@Sir_glizzius]

@MisterEtide yeah but in havoc 40 that ability isn't as overtuned especially with the prevalence of gunners and also the many specialist running at you 24/7 with pus armor. It feels almost nessacary in that mode with 35 and above.

[@SaltyStufon]

i told this to my friend. imagine krubers mercenary shout giving you golden grey health. and you would not to be able to get green health dmg as long as you have that golden grey health. it just sounds so strong.

[@zacattack32441]

I mean that is just how grey health works. It's just green health that decays.

[@J.B.1982]

It needs a slight nerf. I don’t agree with some of the reasoning though. If you get upset that a Vet isn’t bringing VoC on a mission, what is that really saying? And if you think it’s that broke, you would prefer not to see it. I don’t care either way. If someone needs it as a crutch and it prevents them from going down, I’m all for it. I like to use it sometimes to chill the game out. I don’t need meth head level gaming all the time. I also like not seeing VoC or Chorus. I like the dynamics.

[@joseph1981]

the far left nail is my favorite. It goes against the norm. So brave.

[@nicolasvillasecaali7662]

That's an interesting type of thumbnail mate. My fav nail must be those big round ones with big mauls that are trying to squash you, it makes the hammering work more sportive if they can try too, I think some folks call them "crushers" which make sense i guess.

[@armintor2826]

My favorite nail is the one on the far right on the top. It's a lil bent but its holding on, thugging it out if you will.

[@britinmadrid]

The second vertical nail from the left, obviously!

[@TheFlyingslug]

I like playing Veteran. I'm a Vet main. I like the theme of a class that can hybridize gunplay and melee combat more effectively than the others. I love the theme of laying down suppressive fire or breaking off in stealth to assassinate Specialists or secure objectives. Instead, the only build viable for high level content is to play an offbrand Zealot who staggers enemies in a wide area instead of suppressing them and gets to throw lots of grenades instead of a lot of knives, and at that point, why not just play Zealot? Zealot's better at melee and gets access to *most* of the same guns, while being far, far better at melee combat.

[@dibby4482]

Came for the thumbnail, stayed for the slop

[@Ace11Sky]

I'd got to go with the nail on the right at the 20~30ish degree angle hanging out the side of the board.

[@KyleDoesntSmile]

Petition to make voice of command 60s cooldown, free nails for signature

[@zacattack32441]

Make it blue toughness instead of gold and buff Stance. If shout is still to powerful make Duty and Honor have add 15s to the cool down like revive shout.

[@kainepeterson6638]

I think taking Gold toughness from VoC is perfectly fair, but Book Zealot having the only source of Gold toughness would make zealot even more oppressively the best class in the game. I think Gold toughness should just go in general. Make Book give you even more overheal toughness, or maybe make the current node purge corruption to your next wound like Vet's box upgrade does, but leaving Book with gold toughness mean no matter what you're playing one player is going to be out of the fight just holding their hand up channeling Book so that the other three can stomp on the baddies, and if 2/4 of them are Book Zealots they'll just chain gold toughness back to back for the whole match.

[@whatisgoingoninmiami]

low key, nail number 6 is the one

[@thunder2434]

I mistook the thumbnail for Fury of the Faithful and Immediately though "oh no Mister E, please don't get it even more nerfed" and then starting the video it was obvious it was the Vet shout. Yeah, it's OP and for veterans the only build to take now. Imagine having 3 or mpre players taking turns overlapping their shouts throughout a mission. That got me thinking though, one way to fix this is to only allow one team-member to use the shout...

[@CasualSlayer]

I dont even actually have an issue with it being op, just make it fun while being so. An example I'll use, the purgatus staff is absolutely busted but it does so through the use of good positioning and movement tech. Meanwhile shout vet just needs to press a button and they are saved from most situations. Make us overpowered as a reward for good gameplay

[@nidus7274]

i like the bent fourth nail

[@dannylew8299]

Fatshark be like: we hear you *nerfs ogryn again*

[@Zero2552]

You really nailed it with this video, Mister E. Keep it up

[@MisterEtide]

Actionable pun detected.

[@robertmartinez601]

i like how u start the video with the next ogryn melee

[@Jelloz104]

Right nail sticking out the front.

[@joshizfly]

I like the third nail

[@howlers8]

Don't nerf Voice. Give us better options and buffs for infiltrate and execution. Execution for my money is unplayable at higher levels.when you've got mobs coming at you from literally every direction. You have no breathing space to take some time and murder the specials\elites.

[@Imperatoroth5th]

Hard disagree with nerfing. The problem is is that is the only decent ability. Most other have some random triggers that are not casuel friendly. They should focus on improving the stability of the game (runs like a potato) and reworking the other abilitys. After that we can talk about “nerfing”

[@eyeofrage7025]

Don't be silly, only Ogryns get nurfed

[@clevergoblin1714]

As a new player, when i play Veteran its almost a mistake to pick anything but the shout. Giving me and my allies gold toughness at the press of a button and it comes back so quickly, it lets other new ps5 players learn the ropes with a bit of safety while I also learn the ropes. But I'm not getting good at avoiding damage, im just negating damage completely and making other people not learn either. So.. idk. It feels like a mistake to not use and a mistake to use

[@skymaw2601]

I mean, learning to avoid damage is one of the core things you should be learning, not avoiding it completely at a press of a button kinda defeats the purpose of learning the ropes of gameplay especially if youre gonna start climbing higher in difficulty.

[@angelman906]

@@skymaw2601 it really doesn't inhibit learning if you don't dodge specials, or any of the elitists you will still take a lot of damage or even die in the easiest difficulty.

[@richardforde1]

The other 2 veteran abilities suck. Book is worse, oh I can turn the AI off for 6 seconds. You see book less outside cheeseball havoc because it is boring. If the vet shouted for 6 seconds to get the same effect it would all be shit stealth builds with the talent tax to get over there.

[@akujie4821]

Ooo I like the second nail from the left.... That's a niiiiiiice naaaaaiiilllll.

[@Geadly]

Yeah, I also think we should nerf Ogryn I really liked the one in the middle, which is to the left of curved one

[@saverofthehumens]

Until toughness is fundamentally reworked alongside gun enemies, no. This is often borderline mandatory cause for us cover is selective when it wants to block the aimbot shooters. Toughness (regen), staggers and stunlocks are also fundamental issues; imagine playing any other shooter with a shield mechanic and you flail about uselessly every time it breaks.

[@zacattack32441]

Just make gold toughness blue instead. If it's still too powerful give Duty and Honor a 45s cool down like revive shout.

[@MandoF]

Bottom left nail. Speaks to me.

[@swaggadash9017]

Thumbnail is my favourite nail.

[@dlodortyjobs5618]

Might sound odd but what if the skills scaled with the difficulty you play at. That way you can avoid being OP in lower difficulty and it all comes down to your skill level... IDK its an idea

[@peterolson2407]

OGRYN PLAYER HERE. I REEEEALLY LIKE THE TALL NAIL.

[@zhihou9972]

Instead of nerf vet, buff ogryn

[@ali18y84]

I agree that gold toughness is too much I think vet would have better build diversity if both executioner’s stance and marksman’s focus didn’t actively punish you for having situational awareness and not hard scoping the whole game (funny because meanwhile VoC lets you get away with bad situational awareness) or at least thats what it feels like using them, the game is so melee and especially mobility heavy, having marksman’s focus remove stacks for not being clueless and not staying still is reeeeeally counterintuitive imo, same with executioner’s stance, to get your worth out of the perk you really need to hardscope the whole time also unless your teammates are helicoptering you you will have melee enemies constantly disrupting you Imo, marksman’s focus just flat out needs to not lose stacks with movement, and executioners stance needs an intrinsic toughness regen on elite kill or something similar and give it another node that gives flat melee damage DR while active, idk if they’re really good changes but def needs something

[@Zino145]

Damn mr e playing overwatch now, did darktide fall off :(

[@thunder2434]

It's not OP if the veteran player forgets to use the shout for a whole mission. ;)

[@Torinatorr]

actually based mr e opinion

[@MisterEtide]

I know you only clicked for the thumbnail tori

[@Torinatorr]

@MisterEtide YOU GOT ME BUDDY AND YET THE CONTENT WAS GOOD

[@dimreaper8883]

i just wnat reload on volly fire again man

[@Bakamelon69420]

Let's play Overwatch...

[@TheRealSykx]

some overwatch gooners are gonna be so confused..

[@DundDjinn]

Kept watching.

[@dbank6107]

Just wanna have fun. I love gold bars and even with them being used its not a guaranteed win, especially in pubs. So leave it where it is. I dont have a team to play with, but im sure YOU could create a team without shout being used. Leave it be.

[@Dac85]

People be hating Smite psykers for trivializing the game but this shit is as bad.

[@1monkey1typewriter]

Clickbait thumbnails. I’m seeing a a shift downwards with this channel.

[@kommissarantilus3742]

Hard agree, patch 13 ruined this class for me

[@MisterEtide]

RIP original executioner stance resets

[@kommissarantilus3742]

@@MisterEtide and rip to the free reload on ult been playing exe stance with bolter last patch and it was pleasing (with maxed out reload perks), but at every failure you get the maximum guilt for not picking voc

[@Dave-do3vh]

OP Ability indeed

[@Gurgleschlortz]

I think that they should just buff the other abilities to be in line with it. People who are ass at the game will continue being ass regardless of whether or not they have gold toughness.

[@MisterEtide]

i would be very hesitant to buff things ot that extreme. as i said here, that power level would make everyone absurdly overpowered

[@berserkerpride]

Stop him!

[@joshizfly]

From the left

[@gadflyofhumanity_6847]

KarkTide Vet Players "Yoy shut yo damn mouth and let me shout harder than a zealot"

[@MisterEtide]

Funny that ogryn calls zealot “shouty”

[@Lionheart40529]

How are we complaining about lower difficulty when it havoc you can go from full toughness to zero, voice, then go back to zero and down within a second if you get caught out? I think everybody's expectations is to push the limits of how hard the game can get and win.

[@MisterEtide]

most people are playing at low difficulty and using this skill gives a false impression of how the game is actually played. even at high ranks i feel like im crutching on it 50% of the time, and there is no reason to play anything else on vet when the ability is this good.

[@TrainingToRipTheDevilsHeadOff]

They cannot nerf shout until they figure out a way to buff the I.Q. of the average pub team.

[@buhphoon]

Thumbnail is not befitting of the Imperium

[@U.U-lw4ee]

Bruh randoms are still dying left right midle and center even with these abilities VoC or Shroudfield.Now we have havoc if the game is too easy. I dont care about these at all i can go a bit faster to solo stuff and then rotate back.

[@MisterEtide]

it just makes choosing other ults a bad decision, i want there to be more varietybecause that is more fun

[@U.U-lw4ee]

@MisterEtide for veteran yea i dont play anything else than shout cause i only play with randoms i never even tried other abilities in all of mine 700+hours.for zealot all 3 ults are good but i play mostly double dash or sroud zealot, chorus is good but boring for me at least. Psyker aswell has a lot of builds to play. Ogryn, well it was my starter champ but now i cant rly play him anymore unfortunately hes just very boring and slow.

[@ZappBranniglenn]

At the risk of making the game baby easy, another way to sort of nerf VOC is to jam a bunch of gold toughness talents into the game. Because part of why VOC beat out the Zealot's Book is because the Zealot provides more of it than you reasonably need for any emergency. And new access to gold toughness can really make less-picked branches of the talent tree immediately competitive. The kind of talent where you give it to yourself through skillful play rather than waiting for your buddy to press the Safety Button. Keystones like Feel No Pain or Martyrdom make sense too

[@nathanjohnson3668]

Nothing in this game should be nerfed. Other abilities need better buffs and poor ogryn needs a rework. VOC is like the only medic class in this game and even at that, I see more teams dying at harder difficulties than winning despite the “overpowered” VOC ability. To be fair to your points though, I think this particular ability suits the ogryn better thematically than the veteran and the veteran shout should be more of an increase damage type of ability. Would be cool to see more buffing type of shouts in game imo. The game is meant to be a team game and more often on higher difficulties it turns into who can be the better all rounder and clutch the round. Personally, I like the idea of a medic type class for veteran but think it should do something different instead like you were saying. So more of a solo gold toughness and increase for ogryn tank with taunt and maybe more of an increase toughness regen/delay type of ability for a veteran medic but keep it blue for those in coherency when used. That would be cool to play and more thematically “correct.”

[@MisterEtide]

its not overpowered iun that it wins games, its overpowered in that it removes all sense of choice from the veteran class. the other abilities are like, the wrong choice , because this one is SO good.

[@Blunderbussy]

@@MisterEtide then buff the other ones

[@gerbmcderb8048]

@@Blunderbussy He's wrong about how it doesn't clutch every game, it does bc its way too powerful in the right hands. 1 point of gold letting you tank a crusher overhead is ridiculous. I agree they should focus on buffing things like executioners stance, bc it's way too niche. Infiltrate is more or less fine i guess. I agree with you though that Ogryn tree is broken and not in the good way, but Vet already has massive support potential just bc of VOC, you don't have to make hardly any damage sacrifices to fill that role. Also the game only turns into a clutch-fest when the team has failed to work together, aside from the games hardest possible modes, and even then if youre losing it's likely due to poor planning and execution, lack of synergy, or a team mate is just incapable of playing at that level, yes sometimes you just get "unlucky" but in reality its usually poor positioning and timing. There's a lot of things that need buffs but if everything was as effective as VOC the game would be a cakewalk which would make players worse and make the game too easy, he is correct about that. There are people who can true duo the games hardest difficulties by abusing mechanics, that should tell you something.

[@HarryO_Possum]

​​​​​@@gerbmcderb8048By saying that it's only effective in the right hands, you're saying that it doesn't "clutch every game," whether you realize it or not. People aren't dying en masse to Crushers. As a matter of fact, I'd argue that Crushers are pretty low in the totem pole for most players. To me, as a Psyker player, they're a nuisance because they conceal Maulers and Ragers. Using the fact that it might save you from a Crusher overhead strike to illustrate how it's OP is frankly silly, as is claiming something is OP because 1% of players can use it to great effect.

[@gerbmcderb8048]

@HarryO_Possum Imma just see myself out bro. IDK if you realize it but you're totally missing the point and just ignoring and misconstruding information ive presented to make your argument. Like no where did I say it's ONLY effective in the right hands, no where did I say it's OP specifically bc people who are good can take advantage of it. Like dude, not sure if you're genuinely misunderstanding or something but like for real? This is what you're going with? Nah, ✌️

[@samotnick]

It is plain stupid to nerf one good ability just becouse it is usefull. Thing is to change OTHER two to make them usefull. Invisibility and smoke are just tricks that doesnt work that much and do not benefit team play. Highlight of gunners? Sounds great tho with mass of bodies on aurics, even hi intensity damnation is just not worth it, one can shoot them ONLY using plasma, no other gun have capacity to blew thru horde/specials to reach gunners in time when it could make difference. Darktide difficulty is base atm on number of enemies mostly and due to map design that makes it more and more melle heavy. Guns become situational only more and more. By straight NERF to VoM question will be, what for do we need vet in group at all.

[@MisterEtide]

Everyone seems to be ignoring my point that you simply cannot buff everything as powerful as shout. It would absolutely break the game in a bad way. Overperforming talents need to be brought down, underperformers need to be brought up, to somewhere in the middle.

[@dinkdadink]

Nailed it

[@ClassicBeatBox]

I started leveling my Vet a few days ago and after looking at the skill tree, I can't see a reason why I would need the other two ults. I don't need extra ranged damage if I'm already 1-2 tapping specials and the stealth is infinitely worse than zealots. The other two ults on Vet are not stellar. Even if you nerf VoC, I'm still going to take it, its just going to make the class feel worse.

[@EKk8819]

Nah it's not just that you're a sweaty try hard who's played this game waaay too much, it's cuz the abilitys are all OP and need nerfs... Bro go play something else, you're clearly at the level where the game is too easy for you. Not right to ask for nerfs cuz u play too much... Nerf your time in this game lol. Unsubb'd for asking for nerfs tho..

[@LegateSprinkles]

I feel like even if VoC was nerfed, Exe still has the issue of well "what is it really bringing?". VoC is still a AoE stagger and toughness restore in a horde game if gold toughness was removed. I mostly run Exe but what is it really bringing to my games vs the other 2 abilities unless Im bolter/revolver magdumping a boss. I like shooting up a room of highlighted enemies but a good number of good weapons dont need the extra dmg Exe provides. So besides my personal satisfaction in shooting out highlighted enemies, the other possible benefit is that my team gets highlights. It feels 50/50 if I get someone in my games that either likes it or they go "I wish I didnt have trash highlights on my screen". Now Infil will look like an option but yea I think VoC is gonna stay the go to even with gold toughness removed because its a lowish CD AoE stagger with toughness restore in a horde game. Then CD being shorter with a psyker aura on the team and Vet's own Tactical Awareness talent.

[@rouge9133]

I have to say i disagree First off call to buff the other ultimates. Second the player base isnt exactly huge an people like this ultimate so maybe not piss off an already low player base. Also im pretty sure the motto is "the emperor protects" not the emperor helps out alittle bit.

[@bannedmann4469]

Here we fuckin go..

[@brockroberts7243]

You want less shout veterans but my alternatives are the stealth one which is just a worse version of the zealot stealth ultimate and the volley ultimate which just feels shitty when scriers gaze exists.

[@MisterEtide]

Yes those need buffs too

[@dlodortyjobs5618]

Thumb nail

[@shotgunammo]

Lets nerf something instead of fixing the undertuned other options :> we shpuld nerf 2/3 options for zealots too while we're at it, fck em

[@MisterEtide]

Well that’s what my other videos are about, but we can’t make everything as good as shout