Thanks for being so eloquent and well-spoken brother! I genuinely appreciate the fact that you don't dumb things down too much, it helps me develop and utilize different terminology properly. Ironically I've been in the market for a power supply. Couldn't have come at a better time! 🍻 cheers
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Markion, I hope it helped, just to be clear, this is only advisable on certain pedals, if you want a real power supply I suggest looking at Cioks, Strymon, and Truetone.
@MrHeliosoul3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc Crystal clear, much gratitude!
@andybungert3 жыл бұрын
Whoa, I'm actually amazed by the difference. Very cool!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching!
@roadshowautosports3 жыл бұрын
WOW! Nothing like a live demonstration to demystify what benefits a battery will do for your tone! Amazing sweet and easy on the ears! No better way to show the feeling you get from batteries that I, as an example, never had the chance of experience it side by side! Great product you came up with! Cheers!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Glad you liked it!
@JazzRockswithAdam3 жыл бұрын
The battery gave each pedal less gain, and sounded warmer. Less top end. Kind of almost like the difference between using a buffer and not using a buffer. If you're playing a guitar with "ice-pick-like" tone, a battery would be a nice way to tame that.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching Adam!
@ifodaniell Жыл бұрын
OR...just EQ the pedalboard. A Boss EQ-200 could have EQ settings for several devices stored at the ready.
@JazzRockswithAdam Жыл бұрын
@@ifodaniell There are so many options, right?
@gonzalozech3 жыл бұрын
Thanks Mason, I'm always learning new stuff from you
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Amazing! Thanks for watching!
@Prettynoise Жыл бұрын
Mason. I have a Mission Engineering 529i that I am using to power my pedal with lithium ion. I'm thinking about picking you battery case for my fuzz and wah. Best of both worlds!
@bpsiloam2 жыл бұрын
Bought one of these and holy cow what a difference. It honestly blew my mind how much more quiet it really is. And the tonal differences are no joke either. I think the praises of this addition cannot be sung enough. Might even buy another. That being said, I did find that I can't use it with all pedals I would think. So you do kind of have to try things out and see what works. I'm also experimenting with battery brands to see what's good for the money. Such a fun rabbit hole to go down, thanks Mason 😁
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
Glad you dig it!!!
@bpsiloam2 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc absolutely! It's actually kinda off-putting right now because it's so quiet. The hum was like background noise before. Well I guess I have to buy more pedals to fill that void now haha
@ScottyBrockway3 жыл бұрын
Thank you for this, it's so hard to argue with people that a fresh battery does indeed sound different. Fuzz pedals like the Fuzz Face, boosters like a Rangemaster, compressors like a vintage Dyna Comp, and even Phase 90's sound way different with a battery. They also feel different, more spongy and compressed, like tube amps do that don't have a choke in the power supply design.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching!
@waynegram89072 жыл бұрын
Kingtone Vintage fuzz pedal has an Internal switch which has an internal "battery simulator circuit" which uses a 9vdc power supply voltage waveform and converts it into a battery simulator waveform. This is a major big difference because the battery simulator circuit changes on how hard your picking dynamics are. Most fuzz pedals don't have battery simulator circuits but vertex should come out with a battery simulator circuit that works with any fuzz pedal, wah pedal, etc
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
If I'm remembering correctly it removes the DC power input cap making it more sensitive to the power supply. Perhaps there is also some other treatment as well? The challenge in doing this is that carbon batteries are variable in nature, they're not constant. The voltage and current is constantly moving in real time with the player and the pick attack. Setting a constant for voltage or current limiting won't properly simulate a battery like a real carbon battery, high impedance source, can.
@waynegram89072 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc the battery simulator circuit has to be more advanced by simulating the current to not be constant which you can program code and also save the carbon battery profile curve into a wave table log. They have data logs that will save the voltage and current into a wave table to have the profiles curve.if you don't use a prom chip or chip you can do this with hardware. Google has battery simulator circuits to take a look at. The guitar pedals input jack gets connect to the "sense" circuit of the battery simulator so depending on the microvolts to millivolts range it will trigger the battery simulator circuit to have NOT constant voltage and current. The carbon battery simulator will have a high impedance output.
@waynegram89072 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc simple battery simulator circuits is removing the filter cap and adding a series resistor to create sagging effect but this is a poor man's battery simulator circuit. A more advanced battery simulator circuit will convert a constant voltage and constant current by converting it to being my varying in real time by a profile curved to simulate a carbon battery profile curve depending on your guitars picking attack
@felixiiisoriano1163 жыл бұрын
I wasn't sure about this until I tested it on my own rig. I use an eventide cioks and walrus phoenix to power all my pedals. Then I bought 9v carbon batteries and put it on some of my overdrives and fuzzes and it sounded fuller and warmer on which I like and the pick attack is somehow more responsive. My friends also tried it themselves and they were in awe. Eric Johnson was right
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Yes indeed!
@michael_caz_nyc3 жыл бұрын
Very apparent with the Fuzz - warmer, less shrill & ice-picky. Nice man. I like the MkII upgraded battery unit.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Agreed!
@BoboRenthlei3 жыл бұрын
Battery sounds warmer. I prefer the power supply though.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
I get it, the convenience of the power supply is also a huge benefit.
@martysradioshow59796 ай бұрын
Thanks for this episode Sir Mason I wonder if there is a power supply with both Rechargeable Batteries and DC nice demo
@onewiththings3 жыл бұрын
Your videos are always so informative and clear!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
so glad you dig it!
@CalebMcLellan3 жыл бұрын
Thanks, my friend!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@CalebMcLellan thank you so much!
@liquidrpg3 жыл бұрын
Love your channel and the way you go into very into the very fine details of electronics and tone! Personally, I liked the brightness of the PSU better in all 3 cases.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for sharing!
@Shudog9911 ай бұрын
Huge difference, even on my computer speakers the battery supply was much more muffled (less bright.) It's quite easy to hear.
@charlesb78313 жыл бұрын
You can definitely tell that "high voltage " sizzle and extra treble. I love the warmer sound of the battery, however I try and compensate through the eq on the amp. Just don't want to spend the money on batteries all the time. I have a MXR power brick, about 15 years old and works great. I only have a few pedals and some I think are voltage sensitive like my Ibanez Nu-tube screamer, which I run in the 18volt setting because I like the extra headroom. , also run a MXR stereo chorus and a MXR Zakk wylde overdrive and MXR Zakk Wylde wah pedal and all get plugged into my Earthquaker Swissthings pedal going in to a stereo setup. My Carvin X50B with 4x12 cab and Marshall jcm800 4010 combo. All comes out of a ART power conditioner. And an Old ART sge through the effects loop of the Carvin. Took me forever to get this dialed in. The stereo chorus is also a 18 volt model. Great video's love the content!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching Charles! Super appreciate it!
@craigwarman883 жыл бұрын
I dig the attack with the battery. more direct. Almost sounds like a phase issue with the highs rolled off.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Glad you dug it!
@LeviBulger Жыл бұрын
I have always preferred batteries when it comes to certain pedals. Klons and Fuzz pedals especially sound so much richer running on a battery. Old Boss pedals with ACA requirement are another group that I use batteries on over a 12v output. HUGE difference in those pedals.
@neve40203 жыл бұрын
The design is damn cool!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Glad you like it!
@slash0abid7 ай бұрын
hey mason! Thank you for what you do for us! Can you please explain what you mean when you say carbon batteries being a high impedance source? how do different battery types have an impact on impedance? Thank you so much!
@robtog3 жыл бұрын
Very well done, I'm one of the biggest skeptics in regards to guitar gear, from my own experience as well, you are bang on
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Glad you dig it!
@cyberpunk409 Жыл бұрын
Mason, I just bought this based on this video. Yet to arrive. Fantastic that you reply quite frequently here. I'm planning on running the following with this power supply: Vintage 1979 MXR Dist+ MXR Dyna Comp '76 reissue MXR CSP026 '74 Phase 90 None of these have LEDs to test like you mentioned. Will they react favourably? And lastly, MI Audio Neo Fuzz (germanium), but the LED does stay on after disconnecting mains. Have I got this all wrong? Cheers
@TheAjCalvillo3 жыл бұрын
Couldn’t really tell with the TS, subtle difference with the Klon, HUGE difference with the Fuzz. Question on the fuzz, which I doubt would make a difference, is the Fuzz reverse polarity? My fuzz is, and I know on a battery it sounds way better than on power supply.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
RP won't make a difference. No this is standard polarity.
@ckjjclan3 жыл бұрын
It’s like the battery sort of rolled off the highs, or that the power supply had more “sparkle” highs. They were def different, but not necessarily better than each other... great info though... the fuzz sound was wayyyy different to me.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching!!!
@Ram-zw7qz2 жыл бұрын
Hi Vertex! I have the Ultraphonix MKII and I love it!!! Best drive pedal out there! I made a mistake at rehearsal and connected a 12v adapter for like 5 seconds when I realized it was the wrong voltage. Could this have damaged the pedal? I hope not...keep making awesome products! The Ultraphonix is superb! Thanks!
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
If it's still working it should be fine, if it blew the diode protecting it, it just won't work.
@VodkaSelekta3 жыл бұрын
Are there any power supplies out there like this that also charge the batteries automatically, so you wouldn't even have to replace/get out the batteries and charge them? I think that could be a good idea if it's actually possible in the first place, as I don't know a thing about electronics. ;)
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Not quite like this. The Volto from Pedaltrain is rechargeable, there may be others. However, it won't act like the batteries did in this video. The Rechargeable types are almost identical to the standard power supply in terms of how linear they are. Only the cheap carbon batteries will do this as you heard in this video.
@thechronicnoizeco.66753 жыл бұрын
I like the klon better with the battery, for sure. Batteries and fuzz belong together too.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Yes indeed! Thanks for watching!
@Frankyandhisguitar3 жыл бұрын
Nice A/B, you could really hear the difference.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching!
@antman28263 жыл бұрын
Night and day difference. So much so that I can't say that one is better than the other. Both the power supply and the Battery signals sounded incredible. But the Battery tone sounded much warmer and smoother. I feel like it just depends on what tone you are going for. I preferred the tone of the power supply Fuzz to the battery one.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
For certain pedals it really makes a difference.
@ItsJuuj972 жыл бұрын
Is there an alternative battery power supply with a 12v output? I need to power an rc300 while busking
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
The point of using this is to use 9V batteries. You likely need a power supply if you need 12V.
@ChrisLeggTurtleDucksAreReal3 жыл бұрын
Is the light going out immediately the ultimate way to tell if it might improve it? Obviously there's a chance it will sound the same or sound better. And it's all subjective. But is it worth trying it with a battery alone even after it to be sure
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
No, it's just one measure. Ultimately your ears should be your guide. I would only suggest it on Overdrive, Distortion, Wah, Fuzz however.
@robertmiranda85873 жыл бұрын
Do I have to be the spelling nerd today? (Guess I do...) The word is "sensitive," not "sensative." Otherwise, great video!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Robert, glad you dug the video...our copy editor is fired (me) LOL
@chrisyoung80623 жыл бұрын
Robert stop being so sensative.
@FLdb-wj4wc2 жыл бұрын
Okay I'm sold......stay with my power supply.
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
If you don't have battery sensitive pedals, there's no reason for this.
@WickBeavers3 жыл бұрын
The Klon was MOSRT obvious of all in being effected by the Battery vs wall power/adapter. Much fuller in Battery power. So since I sold mine, it doesn't really matter!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Perhaps with some of the other clones???
@WickBeavers3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc I’m tempted for fun by those Chinese clones of the Klon Horsie. They’re around $60. Music is Win bought one and did an actual side x side comparison with his real Klon (he recently bought for over $5K) and found the Chinese version isn’t too “far off.” Of course, “not too far off” is all the world in a drop of water...
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@WickBeavers hopefully it's actually a 1:1 clone, most aren't.
@bbkoopmeiners88163 жыл бұрын
Ok, so the battery sound warmer then the powersupply. But how does this come? Is this cos the voltage from the battery is a bit lower? Then there is also the point that the battery voltage will change over time. So that the sound of your pedal will also sound different over time. Best option would be a power supply with voltage level control, wouldn't it? That way you can dail in the correct voltage on what the pedal sounds best, and let it be. It won't change like a battery.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Voltage is the same on both. Batteries are brand new. The reason is, like I said in the video, you have an interplay between the current restriction of the battery and you have a voltage fluctuation at the same time. So the voltage goes down when you slam a power chord and the current spikes up. This is the result of having a high impedance source like a carbon battery and why even power supplies with a SAG control for voltage don't do the same thing because it only lowers the voltage and that voltage is constant, not variable in real time like the carbon battery. Nor does the SAG control do anything with current limiting. The Power Supply simulations only do 1/3 of the total thing that a carbon battery does and arguably the least important part of the equation.
@fodaseodinheiro3 жыл бұрын
Even the smell of the pedals changed when switched to batteries!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
hahahahaha
@kastor82743 жыл бұрын
Mmmm makes you think ! Could you get the same effect by droping the voltage of the power supply ? It seems like thats the thing that causes the impact ?! So that you dont get 9V output but 8.5 or something alike
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
This has been addressed in several comment here. The power supplies only do SAG with voltage as a constant. Not variable. A battery like this is variable in the voltage and current simultaneously - in other words, you're getting voltage drops and current increases in real time depending on how the circuit is hit with signal, and is fluctuating in real time. It's not a steady voltage drop that hangs at 6V or 8V, etc. like the power supply options do. Even at 9V the battery will be different, as shown here with fresh batteries versus the supply.
@cryodemic3 жыл бұрын
I want to get one of these to run my fuzz and my wah. I'm running an Analogman Sunface and they are very particular with how to power them. I know this power supply is isolated, but I wanted to see if there's anything you know of that could cause some issues with the Sunface. See this quote from their website and let me know what you think: "The germanium versions are reverse polarity, so sharing a non-isolated power source with a normal polarity pedal will blow out the power supply. It blows because the normal pedal's negative ground flows through the patch cord shield to the positive ground of the fuzz, shorting out the power supply. Here is an article about the problems of using power jacks on reverse polarity pedals from Andreas in Sweden. Using a single power cable from the Voodoo Lab or other isolated power supplies is safe though."
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Battery is the most ISOLATED you can get. If it's quite (relatively) with a battery inside it, then it will be with our Battery Power Supply.
@Cerusicus263 жыл бұрын
My opinion: klone battery - fuzz power supply. - ts9 nice with both.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching!
2 жыл бұрын
awesome video man, you are very intelligent man. Quick question, do you recommend a carbon battery in a Maxon 808?
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
You can test it and see…perhaps???
@jacobblount25003 жыл бұрын
Would this make a difference on a modern built/designed for power supply fuzz?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Depends on if it’s modeled after a vintage device, you can do the test they suggest where you pull the DC out of the back and see how long the LED stays eliminated four, this will give you a sense of whether there’s a giant power supply a cap or not
@Shankdv83 жыл бұрын
What are the RCA connections on the Cioks DC4? They look so much better then the stock ones
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Switchcraft
@raffaele71853 жыл бұрын
it acts like lowering the voltage for an amp. It loses high end, it's a more 'brown' sound, I prefer power supply.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Definitely creates a "Browner" sound for sure.
@mitskoski3 жыл бұрын
I'm really shocked!!! The battery sounds way better! Sweeter...round...I would say, by loosing the highs ( which " shine " with the cioks) ,you get the best sound for this style of playing!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Definitely something to consider when powering certain pedals.
@mitskoski3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc indeed! It's a must!
@zvenx3 жыл бұрын
I was shocked at the difference. I was not expecting this. In all cases I preferred the Battery.. sounded less bright (warmer?), more in your face. and quite frankly more 'alive'....rsp
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Glad you enjoyed the video!
@jpistolas3 жыл бұрын
The TS9 sounded kinda louder with the power supply. Rest I could barely tell any difference.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Really...I thought the fuzz was the most obvious.
@jbcarseiii3 жыл бұрын
I was just thinking about this. It seems like the excited top end from the power supply provides an ideal environment for RFI. I think that I probably need to get one of these. Can pedals that take two 9v batteries be powered with voltage summing cables from this?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Yes 👍
@megahurtz303 жыл бұрын
It's like a tone control lol. But were the batteries new or rather worn, in this video?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
All brand new
@megahurtz303 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc wow, that's a very dramatic difference then. Very cool to know this, thanks for the comparison test
@chrisyoung80623 жыл бұрын
Using your test on a few OD pedals I own, I find the only one whose LED reacts immediately to the PS being turned off is a genuine Hermida Zendrive2. My Tchula gold and my JRocket WTF both take several seconds for the LED to turn off. I know Josh Smith says battery powering the Tchula makes it sound better. I think your logic around this test is sound but if most pedals have enough power input capacitance to even out the sags I'm not sure how useful battery power would be? Thoughts?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
It's a good litmus test, but there are guys that say they hear a difference with other pedals, no doubt. If you want it to be more sensative you can always clip the power supply cap or change it to a lower value.
@smashallpots14283 жыл бұрын
im more interested in the power cable free aspect with a wireless from pedal to amp i can put the pedal board where ever i want and not have to worry about finding and outlet near stage front or running an extension cord across a room
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Bluetooth power...that'll be interesting.
@sargentppeper3 жыл бұрын
Excellent comparison Mason! I definitely hear the tone difference especially with the fuzz pedal.:)
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Yessir! Thanks for watching!
@BigHairyGuitars2 жыл бұрын
holy crap!
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
Yes!
@HristoRezher6 ай бұрын
EQ pedals??
@RobertNolan3 жыл бұрын
Do I detect a drop in treble as well as a little bit of noise reduction when switched over to the 9V, or is that just the atmospheric sounds being captured prior to switching? It's very hard to tell, but I do notice a little treble drop, slight but only the top end.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Batteries will be quieter than the power supply. There can be some EQ changing with the voltage restriction and current limiting in real time.
@michaelnagher67193 жыл бұрын
Does this battery power supply have to be also plugged in to a wall socket to work ?
@efsglass3 жыл бұрын
no, he said so at the beginning of video
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
No, you can have that option to auto-shut off the batteries when the pedalboard isn't used, or you can flip the slider switch to manual mode and the supply will work independently of any external power supply.
@ronkauffman41843 жыл бұрын
I saw a video with josh smiths pedal board. In it, he had a version of this power supply. The difference being that it had a fail safe where if any of the batteries died the unit would still supply power to the pedal just like a standard dc power supply like a Truetone power supply. Is this a modification you can do to this product?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
The early one that Josh had was impossible to make marketable (on price alone) and for most people it was impractical. For this reason, the battery power supply wasn't made this way in production. With carbon batteries, every brand is a bit different and every pedal is different on how few volts are required for operation Some pedals can run down to 3-4 volts, others 7 volts or higher before they stop operating. The issue with the change over to the supply power from the battery was - when do you make this transition? Every pedal has a different threshold. Secondly, voltage will dip when you dig into the pedal and then regenerate. Often, on a meter, you'll see when a player digs into on the guitar, the battery will current limit and drop voltage - where the steady state voltage might be a 8V, but when the player is digging in - it drops a half a volt (or more). This would inadvertently trigger the change over to the power supply prematurely. What this meant was that each pedal would have needed to be calibrated manually by the customer with each carbon battery type to tell the supply when to switch from battery to power supply. This would be putting a big burden on the user to figure out the voltage limitations of each of their pedals in addition to how fast their battery of choice would degrade and how much fluctuation and tolerance it had with its pedal pairing. Separately from the expense to build in this circuitry - which would have made this product at least $200 at market, I don't think the average customer would have wanted this complication added to their rig to do it right.
@ronkauffman41843 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc thank you so much for the quick and detailed response. That makes sense. I am not turned off from getting the product without this feature FYI, it just sounded like a useful one and I thought I’d ask. Thank you for making such great information available for the public. I’ve learned so much from you and it has helped me help other guitar player friends who have asked me for advice.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@ronkauffman4184 my pleasure! Hope that all made sense.
@gonzalozech3 жыл бұрын
Hey Mason, one quick question. The idea of the B switch is to turn off the batteries so they don't keep on discharging while not using them? (But only while I don't have a power supply connected to it, right?)
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
The slider switch will turn on the batteries when you're not using an input feed. When you use the input feed, the batteries will automatically turn off with the power supply, and power down when the entire board is disconnected.
@gonzalozech3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc On some cases batteries remain discharging themselves if the pedals have the jack plugged in (correct me if I'm wrong). Does this mechanism avoid this from happening or should I unplug each of my battery powered pedals?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@gonzalozech correct, if it's powered off, no batteries are being used. This is true of both ways of using the product whether you're using the input power to turn on off or you manually turn off. The batteries aren't being used when the device is "off".
@gonzalozech3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc Thanks a lot Mason, you make your customers really enjoy buying your products, as we know how you take care of everything :)
@windowsoflife3 жыл бұрын
Mason, what’s your take on... Voodoo Lab PX-8 PLUS True Bypass Programmable Pedal Switcher
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
They're a good simple solution...I prefer the Boss ES-8 for a budget one.
@windowsoflife3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc thoughts on the Morningstar mc8?
@windowsoflife3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc thoughts on Morningstar mc8 midi w ml5 looper?
@FuzzFace Жыл бұрын
The problem is nominally the power to pedals. The real problem is noise in AC mains to amps. Make a battery for tube amps or a AC power regenerator for guitar tube amps and you will be a pioneer. Too much crappy power in venues and US in general.
@michaelgregory22313 жыл бұрын
Substantial difference
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching Michael.
@waynegram89073 жыл бұрын
What is the reasons why the carbon batteries roll off the high frequencies because of the batteries DC impedance/DC resistance or what? You mentioned that Carbon Batteries are High impedance so that is putting a high impedance LOAD on the guitar pedals circuit? The newer pedals that remark older guitar pedals or new guitar pedals have changed the filter capacitor value so you would have to change that DC filter cap with a smaller cap value or just remove it and add a jump wire so that the guitar pedal will be more sensitive to the DC batteries DC resistance/DC impedance? I have tried to find Carbon Batteries that list the mAh milliamp per hour rating but on the carbon battery package it doesn't list the mAh. I have brought the carbon batteries at the 99cent stores and they don't last long because of this mAh issue that they are bstock batteries or the shelf life is old that is why they are at the 99cent store.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Wayne, batteries do several thinks a linear source wont. 1) voltage fluctuations in real time - depending on how the circuit it hit on the input you'll see voltage drops and regenerations occur in real time. 2) batteries will current limit and spike the current as the voltage drops, again in real time. Alkaline behaves more like a linear supply until the very end of its life - so not much of the sound of the batteries you hear in this video would be much different from the supply sound. You could cut the power supply cap on some pedals, but depending on the bypass and circuitry you may need to put in a small value no matter what otherwise you can have an issue with it turning on off.
@waynegram89073 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc Can you make a video showing the voltage fluctuations and current limit and spike the current as the voltage drops? Because most digital meters don't have a very "fast response time" for this, plus we are talking about measuring milliamps since most overdrive and fuzz pedals are only drawing very little current in milliamps. I understand what you're saying about the push/pull affect you're getting from the carbon battery from the voltage drop and current limiting when the guitar input is being driven harder, but when you put a fluke DMM meter measuring the voltage the guitar pedal is only drawing a few milliamps of guitar so the voltage is not doing to drop because the battery has many amps of current stored inside the battery. When measuring the voltage using a fluke DMM the response time is not going to be fast enough to see visually the voltage dropping in real time because its to fast. Maybe show a video if you have a Voltage meter and current clamp they have max/min button the current clamp to see what the min or max current is to catch it in real time. Power supplies use a transformer which is low impedance I'm guessing which puts a low resistance LOAD on the overdrive or fuzz circuit.
@waynegram89073 жыл бұрын
Duracell datasheets for a 9vdc Alkaline battery say that the impedance is 1700 ohms at 1khz and that 1.5 AA Alkaline battery impedance is at 81 ohms at 1khz. This Alkaline battery Impedance must change based on frequency and the fuzz pedal or overdrive DC rails impedance. The Battery Impedance is nothing going to MATCH the fizz pedal or overdrive DC rails impedance. The older fuzz pedals used two AA 1.5 vdc batteries which when converted to using a 9volt battery it wouldn't sound the same at all. I think its because of the batteries impedance. I'm not sure why in the Duracell battery datasheets the impedance is rated at @ 1khz because DC doesn't have frequency so it doesn't make sense to me what this 1Khz DC impedance means.
@mishadoumnov2 жыл бұрын
hi there thanks for the vid. What is the Current output in milliamps for each supply please? I need to know if I can run some of my more modern pedals. Thanks :)
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
Each output is the battery...nothing else, so what the pedal current is versus what the battery you use is. It's not ideal for anything other than vintage style drives, distortion, fuzz, wahs, etc.
@mishadoumnov2 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc ok thanks a lot
@DARKLYLIT3 жыл бұрын
Seems like rolling off the tone knob on your guitar would achieve the effect.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Not even close…you’re not getting the interactivity of a high impedance source like a 9V carbon battery - there’s a dynamic thing that happens with pedals that are sensitive to batteries that can’t be replicated any other way.
@antonioaleman11233 жыл бұрын
Will a GigRig Virtual Battery do the same?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
it only simulates the voltage at a constant, it's not variable like it would be on a battery. Also the current limiting doesn't happen in this either. So it's only replicating about 1/3 of the equation.
@rocknrollguitar3 жыл бұрын
How long does a battery pack last, when i play an all night er, i dont want it to die on me
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
If used continuously and the rig was never powered down, with most pedals about 20-30 hours.
@rocknrollguitar3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc thats awesome, an all nighter is for me usually about 4/5 hours of coversongs
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@rocknrollguitar you'll be fine
@JosePineda-jn8jk Жыл бұрын
Bat-sim?
@MultiZaphod3 жыл бұрын
Big difference in sound. Is there a voltage difference between the batteries and the power supply? Is there a voltage difference between the batteries themselves?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Batteries were all brand new. Both were putting about 9.6V (power supply and batteries).
@MultiZaphod3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc Thanks! Then current is the culprit, similar to when a tube amp sags.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@MultiZaphod the voltage and current are fluctuating in real time. If you had a meter on the battery and dug in on an A chord you'd see the voltage dip and the current draw go up and then regenerate back to their last stead state voltage and current draw. It's very interactive.
@jabez14093 жыл бұрын
Tried any BOSS pedals?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Most shouldn’t be that sensitive, maybe the new tone bender pedal.
@KRayxKodessA3 жыл бұрын
Fascinating... But, *sensitive :P
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching!
@JohnnyOpus2 жыл бұрын
Wait, so carbon batteries are better but don't last as long?
@VertexEffectsInc2 жыл бұрын
Better for sonic reasons with specific pedals, and also don't last as long as alkaline or deliver the same voltage consistently.
@thecutfighting3 жыл бұрын
Awesome ! Hey what are these plugs out of the cioks power supply ?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Switchcraft
@thecutfighting3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc Thanks so muck (so quickly) cheers from France ! Keep up the good work
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
🙏🙏🙏
@thecutfighting3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc Hey sorry to bother you again on this topic, do you think you could give me the reference of these switchcraft plugs ? I'm finding multiple length and I'd like to use the correct ones (same as those in this video) Thanks a bunch, cheers from France !
@Burnt_Gerbil3 жыл бұрын
The battery into the fuzz was the biggest difference, in a bad way for me anyway. I’m not into the gated, sputter-y, fuzz sound. Plus having to carry around batteries seems like a hassle. If you need that sound, buy a power supply with the sag feature. Cool idea though.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
The supply makes it about as easy as possible to use batteries. SAG doesn't address this because the voltage is the only thing it controls and it's static. In the battery both current and voltage are fluctuating in real time - not static at all. The SAG is not reactive, so it's really only doing 1/3 of the equation.
@Burnt_Gerbil3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc - All good points. I just like fuzzes to sound almost like distortions and not gated. I’ll stick to my power supply. I’ll leave the battery debate to Eric Johnson! ✌️😄
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@Burnt_Gerbil Fuzzes will behave different depending on the circuit. It's worth a try just with batteries internally in the pedals to see.
@dylanlee47763 жыл бұрын
Hey man I ordered a SSS from Chicago Music Exchange like over 2 weeks ago-jw how long it usually takes to ship there or if things were on back order or if you know whats up I just wanna try this pedal out thanks!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Hey Dylan, I'm not sure what the delay is, have you talked to CME?
@bigtsshackfestival95633 жыл бұрын
I got a jazz master bridge from Wiltshire sooner than that. Vertex has absolutely nothing to do with cme. That’s like ordering an iron man watch from Walmart and asking timex what the delay is. Good luck Brother.
@dylanlee47763 жыл бұрын
Sorry I know it’s an odd question for KZbin but thought maybe there was a simple reason. I have talked to the guys over there and they only just told me that they’ll let me know when it arrives lol. I live in Chi so I was gonna pick it up in store just to get it sooner.
@dylanlee47763 жыл бұрын
@@bigtsshackfestival9563 lol idk man I thought it was weird I legit have ordered small no rush packages from the other side of the world and taken less than 2 weeks
@georgepeirce44153 жыл бұрын
Mason, do you think this would help a fuzz pedal that picks up AM radio at my house? Thanks!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Likely not, some of these old fuzzes can have this issue inherent in the circuit and is unrelated to power. You could compare by putting a battery inside the pedal now and if it works, then this device of our will also work, but I don't think this is the culprit.
@georgepeirce44153 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the reply, I was afraid of that!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@georgepeirce4415 depends on the device...what do you have? There can be some work-arounds.
@georgepeirce44153 жыл бұрын
It’s a Mythos Golden Fleece.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@georgepeirce4415 maybe email Zack?
@jcripp79743 жыл бұрын
The fuzz is better with power. Like mud on battery. The 2 drives were nicer on battery. But its all subjective. Some may like it the other way. People get lost in technology. Trying to sound like somebody else. Maybe impossible but even if you do. Whats the point?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
All for the tone! Thanks for watching JC!
@vminator3 жыл бұрын
Who makes your enclosures? asking for a friend, hah
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
We design them, Robert F. Chapman fabricates the metal, powder coat, and silk screen.
@vminator3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc They always have that heavy duty look. Very nice!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
@@vminator Glad you dig them!
@bobbarcus83103 жыл бұрын
It would be good for recording so that you wouldn’t have to replace your batteries that playing live it really doesn’t matter that much but it’s still an OK tool to have if you have the money I never use a power supply for my why are my first tones anyway so it doesn’t really matter to me
@bobbarcus83103 жыл бұрын
Wha and fuzztone
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching Bob!
@truthseeker0573 жыл бұрын
The battery supply really sounds more compressed to my ears.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching!
@clemguitar633 жыл бұрын
Now I know, I'm Not CRAZY!
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
hahahaha
@Superedge-ph6my3 жыл бұрын
Batteries don't make pedals sound better, they just sound different specially if you are looking for a more vintage sound.
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching and your feedback!
@bobbarcus83103 жыл бұрын
Please no reverb when you test
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the feedback Bob. We'll consider that next time.
@cardbored_3 жыл бұрын
LOL only takes 10 seconds to change a battery but he only did it half way 😂💀 the KingTone design is way better...
@colsontowingllc33093 жыл бұрын
dooode...i got both so i can say it....they both good units...on my desk i like the jessy d one for plug and pay...but you gotta have the power plugged in...vertex can be use with or wo power...and if you got a pedaltran like me, the batteries would come loose when i use dull loc under the board...batteries fall out and they aint protected...vertex if build more solid and if you don't use flat rig you screwd with jessy d's bagttery box
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
I'm presuming that you'll have another battery at the ready, this would be the same of any other device where you'd have to change the battery in terms of additional time. The intent was to show how long it takes to remove the top cover and remove the dead battery so that it could be replaced. I don't see anything objectionable here. I haven't tried the King Tone version, but it looks pretty slick. My main concerns, from an outsiders perspective, having not see it in person, is that 1) the additional LEDs will draw down the batteries faster, in particular if you're using carbon batteries (only alkaline batteries are shown in the website photos which won't have the same high impedance source characteristics of a carbon battery, and will behave more like a linear power supply). 2) the batteries aren't protected, which is fine on a flat board, but problematic, as Colson mentioned, for those that use Pedaltrain, Temple, Wawick, Rockboard, and the other more common pedalboard platforms where the supplies are mounted under the pedalboard surface and are exposed. This also defeats the accessibility aspect that would be present in the top mounted scenario. 3) you can't use it on it's own without sacrificing one of the batteries/outputs or paralleling it - drawing down the battery again more quickly and/or sacrificing an output if the input isn't paralleled with another pedal. Our Battery PSU can work with a supply on the input or without a supply independently. I'm sure it's a fine product and perhaps there is information that I'm missing in my "fly by night" overview of concerns - not having seen the product. I think it's one of those things that depending on the price and application there will be customers for both our products and loyal fans of each that will buy the products just because King Tone or Vertex makes the product. I hope King Tone sells a bunch and hips more folks to the benefits, tone-wise, of using carbon batteries.
@xReisendenx3 жыл бұрын
M K 2? LOL Its called Mark 2 dude, have you never heard that phrase?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Who's mark?
@xReisendenx3 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_(designation) Come on man really? 😂
@Hehehehhehehehehehehehhe783 жыл бұрын
How about we just play our guitars?
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Not sure this video disqualifies that.
@Hehehehhehehehehehehehhe783 жыл бұрын
@@VertexEffectsInc well everything with guitar now is "toan this toan that"
@VertexEffectsInc3 жыл бұрын
Do 9V batteries improve the tone of these pedals? Let us know in the comments! BUY NOW: Vertex Battery Supply MKII vertexeffects.com/battery-power-supply
@the_nuckelavee10 ай бұрын
so nice! i theoretically knew batteries make a difference BUT i didn’t expected it to be SO SIGNIFICANT. thank you! i want to run my analog effects from zinc‑choride batteries from know! sadly i have only TC Electronics "Crescendo" (swell) by now. i am going to buy Hizumitas & Carcossa later -can any one inform me on their behavior on batteries?
@the_nuckelavee10 ай бұрын
oh i’ve forgotten! i had bought four more analog pedals half of a year ago! [i have a little bit of a major depression after news (Ukraine, Israel), so i was not playing for three months, was just singing [i am a soprano & bassist]]. EHX "BassSoulfood" [no‑batt], "Knockout" [no‑batt]; Joyo "Taichi" [no‑batt], "Uzi" [no‑batt]. i am going to try them with Zn‑Cl batteries, btw can any one tell about effects like EHX "Bass Mono Synth"? a hybrid effect that includes digital circuitry, maybe a synth is not a good example but anyway.