THIS Would Improve Spider-Man 2 Swinging Physics

[@DarkSpaceStudios]

Play Enlisted today using my link for a free bonus pack with soldiers, weapons, and more: playen.link/darkspace Insomniac's Spider-Man Series is a series that I love so much that I want it to be the best it can be. Unfortunately, I don't think these Physics are the best they can be. (They're perfect for arcade swinging.) But they didn't really change anything from last time- except for adding an optional slider that essentially just decreases the strengths of various aspects of their (already bad) swinging system. I'm not claiming to be absolutely right, but my opinion is that they should aim more toward physics simulation, like Spider-Man 2 (2004).

[@sirvko]

s

[@vaskoz3700]

enlisted is my favourite ww2 game tbh best mix of milsim arcade ive ever seen in any ww2 fps

[@Lonelysum]

Umm bro I watched your video on improving the first game swinging I used some of your points In their feedback do you maybe have any more maybe I can get insomniac to hear it its not guaranteed though

[@farhanchoksi98]

Im sure you've never once hung upside down from a swing without L2, sad you're missing out on animations in the game xD

[@Robin_Is]

Ok.

[@DrEcho]

Technically, a loop in a faithfully recreated physics system would still require a dive or at least a fall from an adequate height for it to work. In fact the only reason it could ever work the way it did without that prerequisite in Spider-Man 2 2004 in its otherwise realistic engine was because of the boost mechanic that let us delete real-world conservation of energy laws.

[@YOEL_44]

And I think that's perfectly acceptable, you should tweak your game mechanics to make them actually playable and fun, but when the game decides what you should do at every corner...

[@DrEcho]

@@YOEL_44 I agree. My point is that the fact that Spider-Man 2 2023 requires a dive in order to enter loops shouldn't be held up as a point against it if "realism" is the metric by which we're judging.

[@Bwoodlyy]

@@DrEchoIt’s a problem when you can’t naturally do loops tho. He explained that in the vid. The loops have to be set up in engine by a button press. Your momentum has almost nothing to do with it.

[@zeyyyboggiee]

@@Bwoodlyyyour momentum is in the dive?

[@danieleanzaldi]

@@zeyyyboggiee but it has to be the L3 dive or if you just fall and naturally dive you're not going to loop and you'll automatically let go of the web at the highest point

[@manukau5271]

All the gameplay shown still has Swing Assist on

[@Gensis]

hahhahahaha

[@Young_Special]

Exactly... dude should've focused on 0% Swing-Assist instead of blatantly speaking for the sake of speaking.

[@StuartLugsden]

You can find unused sliding mechanics in the game files for the first game. I was hoping to see those return in the second one.

[@deadspace297]

Sliding? What do you mean?

[@akira17_samurai]

​@@deadspace297 grinding

[@deadspace297]

@@akira17_samurai Like web wall running type shit?

[@Door3234]

IVE BEEN ASKING FOR GRINDING EVER SINCE WE SAW SPIDERMAN DO IT WHEN HE FIRST GOT THE ADVANCE SUIT WE WERE SO CLOSE

[@jonathanw3909]

where can we see this online?

[@amysteriousviewer3772]

My guy you do realise that the original Spiderman 2 could get away with a lot of things due to how rudimentary the graphics and animations were, right? Making a fully physics based swinging system with this kind of graphical fidelity and detailed animation is an almost impossible task. The amount of animation variance and blending it would require is almost incomprehensible. And no, Euphoria alone can not handle or fix this. In fact, it would probably just make everything feel slow and sluggish like GTA 4 or RDR2 which is fitting for those games but not at all fitting for a Spiderman game. I agree that the swinging could still be better but saying it is the same or worse as Spiderman 2018 is simply not true. 0 swing assistance absolutely makes a difference and you can absolutely not swing across the map just holding R2 with it turned off. Realism for the sake of realism is not always good especially when you are playing a superhero game.

[@dennisderelict2597]

🤡

[@DarenKajiWolf]

PS5 bro... We are not talking about ps3 or an Indie...

[@amysteriousviewer3772]

@@DarenKajiWolfIt's not really hardware limitation, it's a limitation in how engines and animation works. They would basically have to develop a system like Euphoria or heavily modify Euphoria specifically for use in a Spiderman game to make full physics viable behause I don't think anyone wants Spiderman to control like Arthur Morgan or Niko Bellic.

[@Phantomof_83]

It's far easier said then done

[@HOTD108_]

My guy do you realise that we are THREE ENTIRE CONSOLE GENERATIONS into the future from the PS2 days, and yet we're going backwards. Not to mention that the Insomniac games have a thousand times the budget that the PS2 game did. Being critical of the mindless swinging of this new game is 100% valid and called for.

[@suicidalloafofbread2009]

*These aren't timestamps. They're a part of a later section of my comment (also read the conclusion if you want a tldr) Swing (no assist): ~2:27 Wing (no assist): ~2:27 Wing (default): ~2:21 Swing (default): ~2:15 This video is a real mixed bag. There are some points I agree with (the webs ineracting with the world, parkour, wall running/crawling, etc.), but others are so off that Im just convinced you dont know what you're talking about. So I'll try and point out specific points I disagree with in a numbered list. 1. Game Dev is hard. You don't know anything about game development. Point blank, your suggestions for fixing these issues (most of which you're intentionally causing) are so laughably nonsensical, it's apparent that you don't understand the trial and error of making a game. Game engines and physics systems are limited. Sometimes work arounds are necessary, especially when making a game this big on a deadline like this. Insomniac has an extensive history with crunch culture, and every decision they make is to actively combat crunch in their development cycles. So no, they're they're not going to completely change the swinging in a direct sequel when the swinging already worked more than well enough. Also, they don't have as much "status" or "power" as you like to imply. I'm not sure where you got that idea from. 2. The swinging isn't obsolete. You're just bad. While, yes, it is possible to only use the web wings or to hold R2 the whole time, you ignored the biggest factor of this conversation: neither of these options are what anyone would call fun. Seriously, you completely neglect the fact that no one in their right mind would play the game like this. Instead of using the tools the game gives you, like spider dash/jump, doing tricks, or point launching, that actively make the game more challenging and engaging (which is exactly what you claim you wanted), you decided to play like a 5 year old that can't read the tutorial. This is most apparent when you compared the webwings to swinging, so I did a little experiment. I went from the northern most point on the map, the roof of the church in the Harlem cemetery, to the southern most point, a flagpole just off the shore of the financial district (it's in direct view of Lady Liberty, can't miss it). I did two runs only swinging (I included zips, tricks, point launches, and dashes/jumps) and two runs with only web wings (I was only able to use one dash and one jump), one run each with swing assist settings turned all the way down and one with them on the default. the times for each run are at the top of this comment for simplicity sake. As you can clearly see, my times for swinging were equal to or faster than using only the web wings. Not only that, using the tools given to me by the game (zips, tricks, point launches, and dashes/jumps) made the swinging so much more fun. I'm really not sure why you chose to swing with little to no input on your part. It's clear that you either intentionally made the swinging look bad to deceive your audience, or you're just bad at the game. I'm inclined to believe the latter. Obviously this isn't the most scientific, or even accurate, experiment, but I just wanted to make a point that the web wings don't make the swinging obsolete. The swinging is just as viable and just as fast if you're good at it. You're just not. 3. Speaking of swing assist... You'll notice that both my times were slower when I had the assist settings turned down. The reason for this being that you're really underselling the difference between having them turned up or down. While yes, turning the assist to 0 does remove the barrier above the ground when you swing, that's not the only thing it does. In short turning the setting down makes the physics affect you more realistically. So things like air resistance and the length of your web can slow you down. Objects like trees, lamps, and cars actually get in your way. When the setting is turned up, it flubs the numbers so you stay more centered as you swing, whereas when it's off, you'll swing closer to the building you're attached to. All this to say: turning off the assist settings makes it more challenging to maintain your flow, which is the whole basis of this swinging system. The fact that you just brush this off as a slight change leads me to believe you didn't even play the game with these settings off. If you had, you would've definitely noticed the way it affects your gameplay. 4. Web of Shadows who? This is just personal bias, but I'm so sick of people claiming that Spider-Man 2 (PS2) had the best swinging ever. It didn't. Case in point, Ultimate Spider-Man released literally a year later, and was already a more refined swinging system than 2. But I'm not here to talk about that game. I want to talk about what I think to be the best swinging system (until SM 2018), Web of Shadows. This game goes hard. If you haven't played it, you should. The swinging is just as physics based as the '04 game, but it's visceral and acrobatic. In short, it's fun and not enough people bring it up. 5. Conclusion. I don't want to be an ass, but its clear that you misrepresent (or don't understand) the game's swinging system and it feels like you're just trying to rag on the hot new thing right now because you can. There's more I could mention, but this comment is already way too long and too negative. I will say, the editing and presentation of this video are absolutely fire. No hate from me, I just disagree with your points. I'm more than willing to have a genuine conversation on this topic.

[@Goufuem]

I largely agree. The biggest problem with this video is that it largely ignores the benefits of the swinging system they have in place and the significant improvements the sequel made. It also spends an odd amount of time lamenting the loss of small things like climbing your own webs or slightly more involved webcrawling, features that ultimately wouldn't have had much practical functionality and were merely neat things you can do in those games moreso than anything else. The level design alone is already vastly superior to any other Spider-Man game. Pretty much every object serves a purpose now thanks to the addition of corner tethering. This allows you to continually circle around objects like water towers, poles, antennas, and pretty much any vertical object you can think of to gain speed and potentially redirect your direction, in addition to its obvious function of facilitating tight turns at high speeds. The sheer density of the city also provides a litany of traversal obstacles, which often become more difficult to avoid at high speeds, but the density also provides tons of traversal opportunities like point launching or wind gusts. The risk, reward trick system that was introduced in Miles Morales thrives in the 0 swing assist environment as it inherently rewards swinging low to the ground if you want to be speeding through the city as fast as possible. Pulling off tricks as quickly as possible to fill your boost gauge and keep boosting in rapid succession pretty much necessitates that you're not high off the ground and are threading the needle close to ground, rewarding skilled play. The Activision Spider-Man games are definitely very physics based, but people completely ignore that the extremely simple geometry of those games made that sort of gameplay extremely easy to accommodate. You think of webs getting caught on snags in these high model detailed environments (fire escapes, tree branches, the other myriad of uneven surfaces) and it would likely lead to an annoying experience. One where there's too many geometric variables at play for players to make reasonable predictions and plans regarding their trajectory and momentum like those older games. It's part of the reason corner tethering is able to work as it does currently, since it doesn't have to worry about wrapping around any of the various objects in an unpleasant way. The video places such an emphasis on "realism" when that wasn't what made Spider-Man 2 (PS2) good. It was how how the physics system worked in tandem with the level design and allowed for creative play. Something which Web of Shadows pushed even further by just going bonkers with the swing system and saying screw realism let's exaggerate it for the sake of playability (webs don't attach to buildings in that game but most people don't even care, the boosts can propel you to ludicrous speeds but most people don't mind). Another thing that doesn't seem to get enough appreciation is the sheer variation there is in traversal in this game, each with their own use cases. High speed swinging genuinely requires you to use all the traversal methods and switch between them on the fly (switching to the glider when you think starting a swing arc might cause you to touch the ground for example). This is a far cry from other Spider-Man games where swinging is the primary and only means of moving around besides the various wall movements which were more powerful in those games. I genuinely feel if Web of Shadow's wall movements were added, like sliding up buildings after web zipping up them (something which could transition into dives really nicely I think), being able to web zip off the side of buildings and carry that momentum into a swing, and generally more impactful wall jumps, I think there would be very, very little to actually complain about. Spider-Man 2 fixes the main problem with 2018 and Miles Morales, which wasn't that that the skill floor was too low (holding R2 and automatically swinging), but rather that the skill ceiling was too low. Now there's a very tangible difference between how a novice and a veteran traverses through the game world.

[@calebmcclure3893]

Web of shadows does not physics based swinging, the webs don’t even attach to the buildings.

[@kidsseeghxst]

i agree lmao some of his points makes no sense whatsoever, they can all be countered😭

[@suicidalloafofbread2009]

@Goufuem I appreciate you so much 😭 You articulated every point I ever wanted to make much better than I ever could. Also, the idea of putting Web of Shadows style wall sliding is absolutely genius. I'm mad I didn't come up with that.

[@Bwoodlyy]

The best comments and replies on this entire video. Everyone here knows ball. Spider-Man 2 is undoubtedly the best Spider-Man traversal we’ve ever had at 0 swing assist. Yeah I kinda wish it wasn’t so clunky to swing low however because you know it’s really hard it gives you an actual challenge. Every single swing low to the ground has the “oh shit am I gonna make it” feeling because you don’t know if the game will abruptly stop you or not. Web wings when used properly are pretty much a safety net anyways. You can pull off almost any low ground swing if you time your wings into your swing. There’s real depth here. You can only find that depth after a ton of hours at 0 swing assist which most people would never want to do. The reason 0 assist is in the game is for the minority of people who do. I would assume the creator of the video would be in that minority yet it seems he didn’t give it much time. The difference between 0 and 1 swing assistance is so vast that you can’t get the best of both worlds. 1 fudges things enough for me that it feels pointless, I might as well be on 10. Imo we need an advanced swinging mode. Either you have 10 assist or you’re playing advanced mode. No in between.

[@ipool20]

you showed off absolutely brain dead gameplay of you swinging through the city and said the game does not have an advance swinging system

[@kimetsunoacademia3528]

You always talk about great swinging mechanics in older spidey games but i am just wondering on why you actively avoid Web of Shadows in this topic. Because it in my opinion has the most freedom in its web-slinging system, from the various moves it provides, to the absolute bonker speeds it allows you to reach to without any cap if you really get good in it.

[@TR58699]

And also, you can run along the ground while swinging, climb your webs while swinging, it had good web physics. That game is basically what you get if you blend all the good features of other spiderman games

[@kimetsunoacademia3528]

@@TR58699 yup Wall grind, 360°wall running, upward and downward wall sliding (which preserve momentum), wall zip 360° (increase, and also preserve momentum from a wall run), Wall slide jump (from either the edge of a building for maximum height, or while sliding to directly transition into a swing), wall holds (to quickly adjust directions while swinging into a wall without transitioning into a wall run, and it also preserves momentum of done in quick succession), web zip up (to quickly gain height), physics based swinging (carry momentum that continuously increases speed at mid section releases, and gives height accordingly during high section releases depending on speed and release timing), pole swinging (which also preserves momentum if done in quick succession), web climbing (which provides base max height without resorting to momentum), regular web zips (which are pretty useless in most situations but provide a smooth way to quickly scale over a building rooftop without resorting to manually walking off the edge). And all of this is button sensitive. Web of Shadows pretty much provides the spectacle and ease of use of Insomniac's swinging without sacrificing player control.

[@Bruzewane]

@@kimetsunoacademia3528you forgot how web of shadows webs don't attach to buildings half the time lol along with other physics breaking quirks that game never was the pinnacle of traversal, the only noteworthy thing it did was allow you to go extremely fast

[@kimetsunoacademia3528]

@@Bruzewane oh FK off with your webs attach to buildings bs. Half the time I barely even look, and I won't deny the game is janky, but its a goddamn 2008 early gen PS 3 game, cut it some slack, even the likes of Arkham asylum and Infamous have jank on a similar level to web of shadows, but people don't use that as a complaint to detract from their overall enjoyment do they? You can't just disregard superior gameplay mechanics just because it does not "attach to buildings". I am sick of this bs, argument.

[@aminulhussain2277]

​@@Bruzewane While the webs don't always attatch to buildings they do attatch to something, the swinging is still physics based.

[@bramreijrink4931]

You know realisticly, if you would swing from a web you also wouldn't be able to decide which direction you would go in exactly

[@calebmcclure3893]

thats why you'd web zip in the direction you want to go, you would predominantly be moving forward with each swing though. And if they added the ability to climb webs like in ultimate spider-man, that would also help with having more control of your swinging

[@calebmcclure3893]

@@darker2920 Spider-Man does have super human strength

[@nishikantpanda8211]

Again if you do that, it takes away the player's freedom of expression. The system we have now also does that. We are asking for a middle ground. Just don't take everything to the extreme. Whether it be realism or hand holding. Your comment is very disingenuous, acting like you don't know what the guy wants. You know he wants a swinging system similar to SM2 on PS2. You know how that works but still you typed this shitty take thinking that this is your Dr House moment where you show the guy opposing you the flaw in their beliefs. But to have a moment like House you actually have to be as smart as House. Which you, clearly, are not even close to.

[@chaosspider5765]

Something that the lead developer of Spider-Man 2 (the 2004 one) explained in an interview, how they traded that piece of realism for a better swinging experience.

[@bramreijrink4931]

@@chaosspider5765 and I agree. The swinging could be a lot better. But the guy in the vid was talking about realism specifically

[@SyamDaRos-EndoManno]

You've talked about Euphoria Physics as a possible improvement. I have an issue with that: it makes different games look the same. It's very good looking, but also easily recognizable, while hand made / motion captured animations are different in every game

[@calebmcclure3893]

Rag doll physics look the same in every game, but nobody ever complains about that

[@abuabdullah9878]

It looks the same to the extent it looks like real life

[@Webofshadowsclips]

I feel like you'd be able to control the influence of the hand-animated animations with euphoria's physics-based ones.

[@thabreez456]

They should motion sickness and Peter puking after every swing in the next game to truly make you “feel like spiderman”

[@aidanshowers8366]

The thing is insomniacs spider man games aren’t trying to be overly punishing, they push the player through positive reinforcement. And this game gives you multiple options your supposed to use in succession of each other, not individually. It’s like using one of Dante’s moves in devil may cry to combo and complaining the combat is shallow, your not playing as intended.

[@NoCluYT]

@@kwk111 it's hard to call it an auto correction if you're mistakes can result in death or losing your swinging momentum.

[@lm_slayer1]

​@@kwk111 this argument is a double edged sword. Because dante wouldn't awkwardly stand in front of a demon messing up his combos lmao. Also, these animations completely halt your momentum, so you are punished. Severely. What is the point here exactly?

[@Robbinson98]

​@@kwk111considering that the recovery animations tend to cut your speed down, I'd say they're not really bailing you out.

[@Young_Special]

​@@kwk111 Ya' know... that little flip animation that he does when we fly towards an edge of something can be remedied by upgrading the (Corner-Tether) to as well work forward instead of "Left/Right" specifically.

[@Young_Special]

Which is why they like to use improvisation as their slogan. 0% swing assist has delivered a lot of things! But there are still things that can be fixed and improved in Spider-Man 3. Especially when it comes to mechanics. Even though Spider-Man 2 wasn't fully there mechanically and physically? They have opened new doors for themselves. I can see it through what i've been experiencing with the system. Spider-Man 3 can deliver something that could be remembered for generations! All they gotta do is listen to the right things. *And deliver.* Especially if it's their last title.

[@lmaoqasim]

You see I understand your view and the points you make but my only issue is, Insomniac Games *never* promised physics based realistic swinging therefor I cannot be upset at the arcade style mechanics. If they had promised realistic swinging and then didn't deliver, then yeah sure I'd be upset. But for what its worth, I think Insomniacs swinging mechanics are some of the best ever made in ANY traversal game. Another thing I wanna mention is Insomniac when presenting their first Spider-Man game back in 2017 did in fact say that they wanted their web-swinging to feel nonstop. As in nothing will stop your momentum. That's why there is seamless swinging to wallrun transitions and also why the game will help correct a mistake like if you were to hit a wall near the top, it would automatically adjust for you with an preset animation. Its to make you feel unstoppable while swinging and personally, I don't see anything wrong with that.

[@Jay-ph7ni]

I completely agree. The improvements made only add more complexity with players now able to take more ownership over how they want to swing, maximising style or speed or both and in a beautiful presentation of NY. I think this system is the best for the widest player base, with new and veterans being able to gain something from it. I grew up playing SM2 as a kid and absolutely adored swinging in that game and I feel that insomniac whilst aren’t completely physics based are building a system with nuances and complexity for expression without removing that heroic edge and feel for the casual or ‘arcade’ gamer to appreciate

[@radar4104]

What even is this argument, just cause it was their creative decision doesn't mean it was a good one, or shouldn't fall under criticism just cause they wanted it that way. Not to mention that they *did* say that they wanted the swinging to be physics based.

[@CarnerioTostado]

​@@radar4104they did say that, but the whole presentation where they said it was about why they didn't go with it and went with a more animation based system, which was much more successfull during playtesting.

[@abuabdullah9878]

“They didn’t promise anything interesting, so I wasn’t disappointed” Nice defence of the game.

[@radar4104]

@@CarnerioTostado I'm not talking about their presentations, I'm talking about this 3 minute video where they straight up market the game as having physics based swinging, which is just not true lol kzbin.info/www/bejne/jmjCpXaNmLupqdkfeature=shared&t=36 In the same video they also said that they wanted the system to have depth, which is also not true, they just wanted it to be accessible to the point of tedium. Boasting that they "perfected web swinging" by making it braindead is pretty absurd. And even if you ignore all of this, the argument that "they never said it'd have depth so it's ok" is wrong on so many levels

[@markjackson1989]

Euphoria and NaturalMotion are owned by Take Two, and it's no longer available for licensing. So, in effect, only Rockstar can use it.

[@ak-t7d6f]

that sucks

[@jazzy_burrito]

I had a feeling this guy didn't do his research on that. It isn't common tech after all.

[@StuartLugsden]

@@jazzy_burrito He dose know that as he mentioned it in another video. They can either create their own or ask Take 2 if they can use it.

[@watermelon5159]

@@jazzy_burrito I mean it's not like Insomniac can't develop their own method. It's a lot of work sure but that's just the nature of game dev.

[@Jamushu]

​@@StuartLugsden I don't think he knew. If he did then he'd know how redundant bringing up Euphoria is, because that's not the simple solution he think it is. Also; *_"They can either create their own"_* And absolutely get sued by Take-Two, the same guys who will threaten teenagers with lawsuits for making a few RP Mods in GTA Online. *_(Though I think Insomniac should try anyway. It would be just the thing to get everyone against Rockstar, which is always good.)_* *_"Or ask Take-Two if they can use it."_* *That, **_is definitely_** not gonna happen.* That's not how these Corpos work. *They never share.* Why do you think we never see other games using WB's Nemesis System? Never improving on it?

[@FullMetalVevo]

This "essay" reminds me of the ign reviewers who sucked ass at DMC and docked points for the bad music without realizing the music only picks up when you're doing good. I guess rent was due cause why else would you just lie for 21 minutes

[@Young_Special]

For real... like. Bro's coming at the problems at 10% Swing-Assist instead of giving GENUINE feedback for 0% Swing-Assist. Bro was just... nagging for no reason.

[@bsn0730]

The web passing through buildings legitimately pissed me off. I was trying to swing my way up around a building and wondering why I wasn't gaining any speed around corners and looked up to see my web just going through the building... I was like, oh come on!

[@amadeusk525]

I had the exact same experience in the first game. It's, frankly, embarrassing

[@thedarkroom6416]

@@amadeusk525if this was in the game all your web tethers would break

[@thedarkroom6416]

If this was in the game it would break your web tehers

[@bsn0730]

@@thedarkroom6416 it should create a new tether on the corner which would make the line shorter and increase your speed. I'm pretty sure it did that on ps2 because I think I remember using that to quickly make my way up a skyscraper.

[@Lahiss]

@@bsn0730 That's exactly how PS2 Spider-man 2 works, as showcased in this video too. Corner with web and it attaches new tether to the corner and adjusts the swing speed and arc accordingly.

[@DjKat-10]

Just the 2 cents of an engineer with a degree in physics. Nobody would want a 100% or even 50% physics base swing system. That really would kill the fantasy of playing as Spider-Man.

[@A.H.goose1]

As a current engineering undergraduate, agreed. I don’t think these guys understand what physics based swinging would actually mean 😂

[@jacobharris3002]

Yeah, I mean do people think that Toby 2 had accurate physics? To start with you can change your trajectory midair without a source of propulsion, you can artificially boost the speed of your swings with skills from the spidey store, you can double jump and they had to increase gravity by a factor of 10 so you could pick up enough speed with your swings.

[@Itmeb]

It would also probably kill spiderman cause his web swinging is almost impossible

[@jacobharris3002]

For humans at least. Those are more biological than physical limitations though. @@Itmeb

[@Itmeb]

@@jacobharris3002 true

[@raymax_1071]

Basically, you want a "hardcore and realistic, just for real fans" game instead of a... superhero game.

[@blushed787]

ikr like just cause im a real fan doesnt mean i want to have my webs sling me into a wall

[@keelanbarron928]

You know, maybe you could actually prove your point if you didn't have swing assist on. (Also doesn't help that your swinging is terrible even though you said that it "does the swinging for you")

[@DonDeLem]

I don't like how you're not allowed to hold your web, but I can't agree with the "It doesn't make me feel like Spider-Man." User input is important. You don't swing without touching R2 and you don't jump out of your swing *effectively* if you don't time X at the appropriate time. Sure, you can just hold forward and R2 the entire time, but that is not the intended method you're supposed to do, and you're certainly not gonna be moving pretty fast if you continue to do that. That's where skill gap comes in. They gotta make the game playable for those who like Spider-Man but aren't exactly gamers. As for the swinging forcing you to go in a certain direction, that is physics-based and realistic. It's even more prominent with Swing Assistance lowered because when you swing from something, you are not supposed to be able to go all the way to the left when you've shot a web to a building on your right. The wall-running is absolutely shit tho.

[@FeliciaHardy]

Exactly, just because you can do something that makes the game hold your hand the entire time doesn't mean you should or have to. A lot of people have brought up the web wings and wind tunnels but the only problem is you aren't forced to use them to get everywhere, saying that they're faster than web swinging doesn't mean much when there's instant fast travel. I didn't use the wind tunnels really at all to get around the map and it's because you're supposed to enjoy the game and web swing but if you wanna get somewhere faster you can, nobody's gonna use it to get from one end of the map to the other unless it's just to say you can do that, if you wanna get from one end of the map to the other really fast you wouldn't swing or use the wind tunnels since there's instant fast travel. What I did and a lot of people I know or have seen play the game use them together without the tunnels, they do need to improve some things but nobody plays the game like how he says, nobody holds R2 the entire time, and nobody I've seen uses the web wings to fly everywhere. If you're a lower skill player it can be useful to get to places faster but most players won't actually use them like that I don't think especially as someone who's completed the game twice and didn't use them once in that way (pardon my awful use of periods and commas I'm way too tired to be typing)

[@wolfkane1986]

True,most of the time when swinging i touch the road its like when i press r2 he reacts to slow and when i go between buildings i most of the time i end up on a wall.

[@calebstevens9446]

The second half of your comment is confusing. He said he didn’t have a problem with this per say, it was that it was animation based. So not only are you not allowed to make a mistake, your mistakes can feel janky and awkward with animations starting and stopping improperly, and once again takes control away from the player. I’m not the one flipping around this corner, matter fact I’m still pressing the same buttons I’m using to swing so why is this happening? I think that’s the main point there.

[@nishikantpanda8211]

Why is it so hard for you guys to understand? No one is asking Insomniac to take away your movement system of choice. All we are asking is to add another movement system of our choice. That way everyone can be happy. Instead they just keep introducing new playable characters and now have to dedicate time and effort in creating new animations for their part of the gameplay. Like WTF?? First they introduced Miles. Who has his own animations for his own game and some new animations for this new game. And now they are introducing another spider character Cindy. Who, obviously, is going to have her own animations with her own gimmick and on top of that Miles and Peter will have new ones too. And the slow walking Life is Strange, MJ and Haley sections will make a comeback for sure since the creative director said on an interview he doesn't give a shit. Which would require their own set of programming and their own set of animations. So why are they, instead of solidifying the core gameplay mechanics of their franchise keep on diluting it with as many characters as they can. Even when the Arkham devs added new characters they were smart enough to restrict them only to the challenge sections so that they don't have to put extra effort into making them fun to play as in the free roam. The only exception was Catwoman and she felt like shit to play. They kept on improving on the core gameplay mechanics of Batman and look how it ended. Even if you don't like the tank sections in Arkham Knight, you cannot deny that it was leagues above Asylum and City with its gameplay mechanics and how every mechanics flowed from one thing to another so smoothly.

[@suicidalloafofbread2009]

@@nishikantpanda8211 Maybe you should just get good at using the existing mechanics in an interesting way instead of just holding R2 like a 5 year old

[@sandro6479]

Last year, I didn’t buy the game because of this video. I just bought it last week, and boy, it was SPECTACULAR. I realized that this video doesn’t really highlight the challenges of 0 swing assists and reviewing without playing the game as intended.

[@Young_Special]

Brother was unprofessional and in his feelings because they didn't remove that barrier whenever players reached their highest arc. 0% Swing-Assist has PHYSICS. It is extremely physics based, and you can be pretty experimental with it. Well... to a point. The only thing that RESTRICTS its physics is that whole HANDICAP nonsense that keeps cutting players off from their web whenever they reach their highest arc. That thing truly restricts the physics to be at its fullest potential. It kills the freedom of expression within ot But they might potentially fix that in Spider-Man 3... but it really angers me that i'll have to wait THAT LONG for such a minor thing to be removed.

[@legalwaiver]

Good for you. This game is amazing, sure it has bugs, but this game is really good. (i might be biased)

[@antonn.mp4]

Bro played on max swing assist and wondered why the swinging was playing itself and had less detailed physics 😭😭😭

[@Webofshadowsclips]

He literally showed the zero swing assist in the video..? and talked about it at length? also, i tried it on zero and it was a *challenge* to hit a wall or to hit the ground or take damage. this game really does play itself for you.

[@Jose-ci3oi]

@@Webofshadowsclipshe played on zero assist for one clip…

[@Null._]

@@Webofshadowsclipssure bud 🤥

[@Webofshadowsclips]

@@Null._ I swear I tried showing my friend. I said "watch this" and then proceeded to try intentionally messing up my swings and hit a wall for 5 minutes to show him the new damage feature and got nothing. I could be mistaken, but I don't think it's even possible to slam into a wall in this game. Am i wrong? And if you ask me that's far too handholdy for a *spider-man* game. Especially for a supposed "zero assist" feature. One that will still not even let you literally "swing" back and forth. Which should be the most basic benchmark of any spider-man game's swinging physics. Can you actually "swing" with them? 👀

[@kj_i_guess1079]

He's just bad at swinging with 0 swing assist is all, no hate towards the and a lot of their critiques can be disproven ​@@Webofshadowsclips

[@totallyVoxel]

So I'm gonna start by pointing out the few things in this video I agree with, just to start on a positive note: I agree that the wallcrawling is very flawed, it doesnt work that well outside of the main story, its very buggy and definitely needs a lot more attention. I also agree that the webs themselves clipping through buildings does look odd, trying to stay in place while on a web is also disappointingly buggy. Now for why I don't like this video: Most of your criticisms in this video are focused on web swinging with swing assist on, which I would understand if this were spiderman 1, but now that swing assist is a toggleable option, everything you said against the web assisted swinging is irrelevant, because the game lets you CHOOSE whether or not to use those mechanics, so the people that enjoy the easy web swinging can use it, if you don't like the swing assist then dont use it. This also invalidates your argument about just being able to hold r2 and go through the whole map, because turning off swing assist essentially makes that impossible, since you actually have to steer where you're swinging. Now, about the wingsuit, you talk a lot about how it "makes swinging completely irrelevant", which even though the wind tunnels do make the wingsuit faster than swinging, is completely untrue. Sure, the wingsuit will be faster than swinging in certain conditions, but this observation is completely ignoring the fact that using swinging AND webwings in tandem is significantly faster than using only one of the two, the webwings aren't just an alternate mode of transportation, its a tool to unlock speeds you wouldnt get overwise, which is exactly how they should be implemented. Also, in your speed comparison showing web swinging and webwings side by side, you clearly are using miles's venom abilities, which kinda ruins your point about webwings being too OP if you cant even fly with them without using other mechanics, which OH MAN, WHAT A SHOCKER!! Its exactly what the game wants you to do! It doesnt want you to just choose one and run with it, it WANTS you to use everything you have together, thats what makes insomniacs web swinging challenging, its not about fighting physics to keep yourself moving forward, its about using everything you have to not only maximize your speed, but to look sick as hell while doing it. The game uses animations in its webswinging to make each movement look smooth, and flow nicely into the next, so that swinging feels AND looks cool, so yeah, the game DOES want you to look like spiderman more than it wants you to FEEL like spiderman, but even then, it still does a great job at making you feel like spiderman, just tweaked a bit to make people like you who swing like an NPC not suck too bad! Though, if you REALLY want that insane physics nonsense you endlessly hunt for, then play 2004 spiderman. Also, I want to mention that the physics engine you mentioned, euphoria, cannot be used by insomniac for legal reasons, though I may be wrong about this. Edit: I dunno why I went off so hard on this, it really isn't that serious 💀

[@FeliciaHardy]

You said everything I was thinking but my haven't slept in over 24 hours brain couldn't put properly into words so thank you, it's unfair to compare completely different games when they both have different approaches to web swinging. You can prefer one or the other but imo they all have things that make them fun and unique and none of them are better than the other (except for that avengers game Spider-Man web swinging that came out a few years ago that is an abomination and should be destroyed)

[@wdp1a73r]

I agree with what your saying, as a spiderman fan my self I went and 100% completed ps4 spider 1 twice for the platinum and I still found it fun to play, even with the animation snapping and swing assists, because I couldn't care less when I was immersed in the world. I felt like spiderman, because I was spiderman in the moment. honestly this video seems to be the weakest one Dark Space has made so far.

[@totallyVoxel]

@@FeliciaHardy nah even avengers has swing mechanics that uhh... Its uhhh.... Nah yeah thats completely valid.

[@daily6633]

Fanboy. Did you even watch the video?

[@daily6633]

Have fun with Superman simulator!

[@arxci9402]

Complaining about the wingsuit is the most moronic bullshot ever. YOU are the player. If YOU choose not to fly through the entire map, then thays YOUR decision. It does not force you to use it. It adds so many cool possibilities when navigating the map.

[@abyssalhunta]

bro doesnt wanna talk about how swing assist can be turned off which fixes a lot of the problems he had

[@Thonato420]

The only things I agree with this video is not being able to do flips with the wingsuit, and some small stuff being automated overall, the dodge button and tether swing kinda saves this game's traversal system on top of new tricks, slingshot, loop de loop (No, you don't HAVE to dive to do loops, just be faster), that one glitch where you can fly across the map (with no loading screens),no invisible walls in the map

[@hurrikanestudios5992]

You know what is also so ironic. Majority of people that make all these complaints do not have the skill/ability to create a better game. ANYONE can provide feedback/complaints...............you want a better game? Then MAKE A BETTER GAME; so we can complain about how your game falls short in different aspects.

[@ThisIsGlitch]

you seem a bit misinformed on some matters in play here...

[@werewolvzombi]

Some of the complains you made wouldn't occur if you turned off the swing assist though? I understand the intention of this video but some complaints felt like unnecessary nitpicking. Also, catering towards casual fans makes sense since, you know, it's a Spider-Man game.

[@ridleylegassy]

So I like a bit of criticism, it’s always warranted. However a few of your points are repeated often. It’s not as egregious as you make it out to be, the swinging they’ve designed is heavily animation based. It looks right because it feels right. The movie game on PS2 is heavy, fun to swing in? Sure but it’s aged. Now I get it’s a good thing to talk about how “auto pilot” the swinging can get but in reality, who swings like that? Just holding one button the whole time. Everyone is doing something. The wings I will agree are the most auto pilot, put the controller down and you’d get somewhere. But as a whole the game engages the player and wants them to do something so they can look cool and then feel cool once they figure out harder things. I pretty much fully agree with what you said at the end. There should’ve been more however they didn’t do everything they should’ve since they wanna try to keep it from becoming over complicated for those with accessibility issues considering they catered a lot of new settings towards that.

[@joshuaveal7013]

This whole video contradicts itself strictly off of him showing only clips with Swing assist on. To sit here and say it’s not physics based and it holds your hand to much proves you have never played it without swing assist on. This is such a bad video lol.

[@theREAL_xarooo]

Ain’t no way Blud was yapping for 21 minutes and 57 second.

[@francisdrake5322]

Dont let bro cook anymore pls💀

[@burritobowl0190]

found the braindead colin fanboy 🤡🤡🤡

[@sovietraccoon6007]

A reminder that insomniac made sunset overdrive a game where its movement mechanics encouraged the player to get better and build a combo meter like a tony hawk game

[@DirtyDev]

Oh how the mighty have fallen

[@X-EN7171]

TF are you on about

[@DatPRGuy2017]

Yeah but that game didn't do too well compared to other Insomniac titles despite the great reviews. It's only been recently that it got a cult following due to Insomniac reusing the engine for Spider-Man

[@thedarkroom6416]

@@DirtyDevlol how

[@Im.myfuture]

@diamond_dogsThat’s what settings and lower difficulties levels are for.

[@TheMikey2207]

This video all feels like nitpicking tbh… We shouldn’t need a super insanely precise swinging mechanic in a casual single player Spider-Man game in 2023. People just want to have fun and enjoy themselves. The game works and is a critical success. Nobody really cares about any of these points.

[@Dogbrainsyndrome]

My nigga wants to do math and play spider man at the same time

[@keelanbarron928]

Counter-argument: These games are not made for the experts who practice these things over and over. They're made for the most casual of casuals who want to play a spider-man game and look cool. Did previous games do swinging better? Probably, but that was them putting extra effort into it that most people playing it aren't going to care about. (For example, do the webs need to stick to buildings? Not really. But the games that do are because the developers put extra effort that wasn't necessary into doing that.) You may think it's broken, but these games were not made for people like you. It's working as intended. Edit: I just want to clarify that it would be nice if insomniac added this stuff in, but it's not a requirement. Saying that it's a "problem" is ignoring the point of these games, which is to both appeal to a super wide audience and to make casuals look cool. You may not like it, but it's the truth. (Also about trayarch spider-man 2, the reason why that game has a lot of swinging features is because it was the first of it's kind so they put a lot of extra effort into it. Expecting that for every game is just going to leave you disappointed in everything spider-man.)

[@TheNightsfall1]

Did you even watch the video? It doesn’t take an expert to want to express movement and experience being Spider-Man BY YOURSELF. If games like apex thought like you did there wouldn’t be movement techniques or they would remove them all

[@metalrex2480]

So you say that a sequel to a well acclaimed game of a really big company, didn’t put the effort to upgrade the gameplay to make sure that casual and expert can play with the same enjoyment (a problem who was already in the first one) because that would need to much work… im not sure i agree with this one

[@keelanbarron928]

@metalrex2480 I'm talking about spider-man games in general. To use as an example: Do the webs need to be attached to the buildings? Not really, but insomniac and the trayarch decided to put extra effort into it because to them, they felt it was necessary.

[@keelanbarron928]

@@TheNightsfall1 ........what the hell are you even talking about? Nothing you said has any relevance to what I'm talking about.

[@dolphin-studio]

Argument is not really solid, what he means is that you can increase the range to include both casual and pro players, casual players praised the complexity yet natural feel of OG Spiderman 2, the ability to have almost anything you want to do whether you use it or not is what makes the game amazing.

[@momomoore379]

They literally did not copy-paste. Play the game with 0 swing assist and say it again. Also, loop de loops, swinging around corners quick, web wings, better air tricks for peter, the ability to jump and dash in the air (yes, this was in Miles Morales as well, but it does it better here since you don't lose speed from jumping and you can't just spam it)

[@mexicanboystudios2103]

actually watch the video and then comment because he literally adressed everything you said lmao

[@hazelcrisp]

It's still piss easy with 0 swing assist. Doing maneuvers takes very little skill. The game hold your hand. And setting it to zero just makes it hold you hand less tight. There's no challenge or difficulty to traverse the game. It needs more depth. Low swinging is also ass too. And web wings aren't swinging either.

[@momomoore379]

​@@mexicanboystudios2103no he didn't. He hand waved and just it was copy pasted

[@momomoore379]

​@@hazelcrispIf it's so easy, then why does this bozo in this vid not demonstrate all the stuff in the vid and how different it is with swing assist off? Because he's 100% playing with swing assist. And also you can call it brain dead, but hell, anything that's easy to do but hard to master I think is a sign of intelligent programming. And if you've seen any swinging compilations you'd know how difficult swinging can get and how complicated it can get

[@Young_Special]

​@@mexicanboystudios2103 Moda sucka... that dummy was complaining all over 10% Swing-Assist when he shouldn't even *BE* in that settings in the first place. He knows he doesn't like it. Better yet, he can turn that down by turning Swing-Assist at 0%. I admit, there are still some things that insomniac needs to sort out for that settings, but it delivered almost EVERYTHING that this sucka had a problem with for the first game. It gives us a physics based experience (to a degree). It gives us a challenge. We have better control. Yet this this dude was nagging at useless things that he shouldn't even be talking about in the first place if that's not for him. He should've delivered **GENUINE FEEDBACK** on what insomniac could go further upon for 0% Swing-Assist. Bro was speaking unprofessionaly. Either he was in his feelings for seeing 10% Swing-Assist, or his rent was due. This video was widly illogical the way he approached it. Stupid. Bro complaining on 10% Swing-Assist... when 0% Swing-Assist is right there? What a freaking donkey 🫏.

[@BarcodeGamez]

This is the craziest, disingenuous, and/or misunderstood take I’ve heard about Insomniac’s Spider-Man 2. Spider-Man’s 2 swinging combined with the wing suit is the most advanced video game technology we’ve ever had! And it’s pretty incredible! If Spider-Man 2 didn’t do it for you I would highly suggest you stick with the OG Spider-Man 2. While I understand your gameplay desire of it all being 100% physics based this would never work in actual gameplay practicality when you are going at such high speeds with so many obstacles in the way. A game has to use game rules. And I think Insomniac’s traversal in Spider-Man 2 has done an incredible job at giving you control and not let you see too much those game rules. But if you look for them they will be there! I you can say that about any game.

[@hazelcrisp]

It's still piss easy with 0 swing assist. Doing maneuvers takes very little skill. The game hold your hand. And setting it to zero just makes it hold you hand less tight. There's no challenge or difficulty to raverse the game. It needs more depth. Low swinging is also ass too.

[@BlackJacked]

​@@hazelcrispJust because its easy doesn't mean the game holds your hand at all. Try doing those drone missions or chasing after a car, you still need to think about where you go

[@hazelcrisp]

@@BlackJacked I have done. And they were easy...

[@jaymessmoyer340]

​@@hazelcrispEasy to you. To some people that might be hard as hell to do, even with days of practice they still might struggle alot with the swinging on 0 swing assist. Not everybody is gonna be as good at the game as you. You do realize that right? People aren't God dang robots who can learn and master to do something in a matter of minutes. And everybody is gonna be different when It comes to skill at a game. Whether it be game combat. Traversal, puzzles, or anything else.

[@DiZZiEntertainment]

HELL NO, I don't want web shooter catridges.

[@Ebakthecat]

My issue with your criticism (and it is legitimate criticism, I just don't see anything you mention as a 'problem') is "Yeah...but who tho?" "You do 100 loops in Spider-Man 2 if you wanted to." "Yeah...but why tho? You're not exactly traversing." The moment from 5:36 where you're just hanging from the web trying to go slowly over the building to show the anti-grav-like effect likewise has me thinking "yeah...but who would actually do that?" Like you I've been playing Spider-Man games far before Spider-Man 2 (2004) and I still think Marvel's Spider-Man 2 is a good iteration.

[@Jamesonn404]

I agree with the parts of letting the player have more control over the web swinging and not doing everything for you, but I personally like this arcade style. At the same time, I don't want it to be so realistic to the point that is trying to implement it as a reality. Spider-Man games are supposed to be fictional, not web swinging similators.

[@sergiosarmiento4371]

You can't possibly mean that the breaking physics moments shown here make the game more fun. The video makes a comparison between the old spiderman 2 game, proving that you can have a sort of realistic game with actual physics and be tons of fun.

[@Jamesonn404]

@sergiosarmiento4371 There you go, that's subjective. How can you tell that the physics of the web of Spiderman 2 from 2004 is fun and immersive to EVERYONE? That seems more of a challenge to master something rather than feeling the sense of speed. This guy's argument is based on nostalgic bias and that pisses me off. This game's physics is enough to give you a fun challenge while playing and enjoying the story. Besides, you can have the enjoyment and feeling of being Spiderman here, but people in this video are asking for a realistic experience. Games are supposed to give you a fun time, not a 9 to 5 job of how to master a web swinging physics, but unfortunately this is the modern mindset. Anyways, a solution for this is just Insomniac give a choice to the player if they want advanced swinging physics or just the default ones.

[@sergiosarmiento4371]

@@Jamesonn404 but that's what the video is suggesting, he praises insomniac for giving the players the option to choose the difficulty but it wasn't enough, even the hardest of difficulties are still very flawed, and the main cause of it it's that the game doesn't really have a good physics engine to begin with.

[@Jamesonn404]

@@sergiosarmiento4371 alright, fair enough.

[@laug0]

@@sergiosarmiento4371 The difficulty choice is not meant to be a switch between "arcade swinging" and "real physics." They made the unilateral choice to lean the entire game towards arcade swinging for the sake of accessibility, immersion, and a fluid experience of the narrative. To the point that the inaccurate physics elements break immersion instead of enhancing it, tuning out the fact that your web clips through buildings is less immersion breaking than constantly halting the player because they didn't execute every input precisely to your high standards.

[@icarusgaming6269]

Swing assist also causes you to be pulled in the direction of the line instead of always going forward. It's in the name: Swing *steering* assist. Please include all of the relevant information The rivers are filled with boats for you to point launch from so you have some other moves to mix things up while crossing without relying on the wingsuit. In Assassin's Creed: Syndicate you can parkour access the Thames by jumping between *moving* ships like a game of 3D frogger. In Sunset Overdrive you have to do another move before you can surf again. This is a perfect example of how you approach these games with a closed mind. Rather than suggesting ways to make surfing more interesting, you criticize its existence because it wasn't in Spider-Man 2. Rather than suggesting ways to make what the game *is* better, you criticize it for not being something it's not trying to be. Your points would be much more palatable if they weren't presented from such a heavily nostalgic position You can hold trick while attached to a line to swing upside down, which was introduced in Spider-Man: Miles Morales. Please include all of the relevant information The following is the most important section from a reply to my comment on the last video. I hesitated to write a full critique at first until you prompted me to give feedback, so it was buried under a very short comment and you may have missed it. It's just as relevant to this video as it was to the previous because you still conflated the ideas here: Expression is the subjective player choice of optimizing your character's actions for the fantasy you're trying to achieve. At 19:21 you miss a button input, causing you to fly off the top of the wall and gain height in a direction where there is nothing to swing from. I would consider that a failure of expression, both because it wastes motion where you could have redirected it in a more productive way, but also because the flip over appeals to my personal interpretation of the Spider-Man fantasy and looks fucking awesome. For all I know you may have done this intentionally, considering running off the top of the wall more expressive. Failing to look cool or preserve momentum *is* irrevocably failure of expression. What you struggle with in regards to Insomniac's Spider-Man is delineating contextual player verbs from artificial safety nets. Because of this game's aggressive air control you can choose exactly when you'll perform recovery moves by visualizing the range of your pendulum in relation to upcoming obstacles and aiming for the one that will give the preferred outcome so you hit the corner at the just the right height or smack right into the fire escape so you get a different wallrun animation. That's not a mistake - I did it on purpose! This is what separates the skill floor of holding R2 and going that way from the skill ceiling of improvisationally charting your most expressive route through the level as each layout is presented to you

[@flaymadan5579]

Well said

[@Teamfortressjunkie]

You more or less typed out everything that popped up in my head.

[@noicoiner6151]

Thank you.

[@TempusVulpi]

This is everything I wanted to say.

[@BigChillenXD]

Treyarch really knew how to make us really *feel* like Spider-Man

[@MichaelM28]

No they didn't. No one comes close to Insomniac

[@DarenKajiWolf]

​@@MichaelM28Ok

[@StuartLugsden]

​ @MichaelM28 Your here as well?! I just can't escape you and your horrible takes can I?

[@igorbrandao6735]

Although the physics in the 2004 Spider-Man game were cool I think people just forget that it isn't nearly as fun to play compared to some Spider-Man games we got later (including the Insomniac ones). The game now is dated in several aspects and the swinging overall just feels stiffy to play even if you can do some cool things with the physics. Insomniac's SM games may not be the ones with fully physics-based swinging, but they are the best middle ground in terms of actual fun and style with some kind of realism.

[@UltimateSpiderMan]

@@igorbrandao6735 insomniac games have the weight, web of shadows has the control and angles, ultimate has web bending, spider man 2 and spider man 3 have the best wall running, tasm has webrush and spider man 3 has a quick webzip, all make perfect traversal if combined in my opinion.

[@Sea-Bird..]

This is just wrong... Everything you said about it not having real physics was right, but it does not do most of the work for you, unless you only hold down R2. But here's the thing, no one who's actually familiar with the system and has fun with it will ever just hold the trigger. If you're a casual player who's only here for the story, the game will do most of the work, but if you want something more, you absolutely get it. It's a safety net for sure, but it doesn't remove your freedom, expression or movement, and it does allow you to fail.

[@FeliciaHardy]

I agree 100% I could definitely use the web wings and wind tunnels but I never did, I swung most of the time I used the web wings to compliment the swinging and is it the perfect swinging system? No, is it fun? I and many people think so. I hope they improve some things later on but if you're actually playing the game you won't just hold a button or use the web wings the whole time

[@aolson1111]

"You're completely right, but criticizing the game is wrong."

[@FeliciaHardy]

@@aolson1111 I know this is supposed to be a joke but what? Read the first few words and wrote a comment. Also why does KZbin notify me when someone comments on a comment I commented on? I shall have to comment my frustrations about the comment section comment notifications about my comment

[@Young_Special]

0% Swing-Assist has good physics, tho.

[@Young_Special]

​@@aolson1111 You think Dark Space criticized CORRECTLY? What a joke... dude spoke nonsense. That can easily be countered.

[@crissdace8358]

I happy yall aint the devs because some of these ideas are horrendous

[@JohnDoe-ou7mq]

the biggest thing I got from this video is WHY THE FUCK DOES THAT MATTER?

[@elviswilliams1131]

That's what I'm saying.

[@Mad.v2]

Insomniac likes fun more than realism. And i think it kinda works. In the first titles you couldnt disable swing assist or didnt even have the option. With Spider-Man 2 you can disable or decrease swing assist to add more real life-like momentum build up and other stuff to make for a more challenging swinging experience. It works beautifully in my opinion, because new players can pick up the game without issue and experienced players can still enjoy a more challenging swinging.

[@xtrwq]

The issue is where is the fun? It looks cool, especially in a video on KZbin but it's boring to play and uninteresting because there's no challenge.

[@whatsupssj]

The swinging accessibility should be pushed more, similar to a racing game, where you can make it more or less an arcade experience. Maybe even also similar to Marvel v Capcom easy button layout vs more complicated one. I kinda have an issue with the run and swing are tied together, which is the reason for some of his issues in the video

[@fernandowong371]

The lack of realism leads to a lack of fun imo.

[@unknownidiot4001]

Every clip you played when swinging was you hitting something and loses momentum clearly not a review 🙄

[@Ty-xb7dj]

Bruh at 11:42 you are CLEARLY holding R2 and running up the wall stop complaining blud😐

[@vulcanrampage4015]

That happens in both Peter and Miles games when you flying towards the wall and press R2, they would automatically wall-running. Overall his criticisms towards the game is nothing more than just a misleading complaints and nitpicking lol

[@skywalkaias7809]

you describe it as a more arcade game then cry when it's not pushing full realism

[@vulcanrampage4015]

Dude if I were you, I would play this game while turn off the swing assist if I don't want to be forced to release the web swing or preferred to have the swing mechanics more challenging just like the OG Spider-Man 2 game. Or maybe do a proper research next time before you even think about criticizing the game. And perhaps you shouldn't have to compare this game to that 19 years old game. There's a lot of shits that this game can do which the movie game couldn't do

[@ShaunBarlow-c3g]

Ur spending 90% of the video criticizing swinging on high swing-assist as if it shouldn’t be easy and hand holdy on those settings. Ur also describe it in an insulting way, like saying it’s easy for kids to pick it up. The setting is for impaired players, newer gamers, and people who just want simple traversal and it’s weird to describe it as if it’s for kids or bad players.

[@morganf.1562]

Should have mention the "Prototype" wall running physics. Alex actually had inertia and could slide up and down on the walls.

[@riley5722]

Oh that's right I remember that, it's a good feeling. I can imagine Insomniac's Spider-Man version of that. Skidding and sliding along the sides of buildings.

[@Juancho-05]

Tbh I don’t agree with most of it, I’m pretty happy with the current state of the swinging cause is not just only about swinging, it’s about keeping that momentum you get from the leaps, web zipping, wall running, power dashes, tricks, web wings, and of course, the swinging, still, I’d like it if they added a new completely different and realistic swinging mechanic, it’d be fun to learn it and try to perfect it like a souls game or doom eternal

[@guwopman3503]

Some other features I’d love to see with traversal: - When doing chase sequences, I wish you would have to utilize specific air tricks as dodges from bullets or attacks. Almost similar to the Martin Li subway station fight in the first game where you had to either jump to the side or ceiling to properly dodge. Tricks being used for practical reasons as well would be awesome to see. - We should be able to choose how much web we are letting out on the downswing. I want to be able to jump/swing from skyscrapers and keep reeling out web to get a massive downswing. I’m sure there’d need to be a limit to how much can be reeled out because in canon Spidey doesn’t have unlimited web fluid. The hope for this goes hand in hand with being able to climb back up on webs while swinging. It’d make swinging close to the ground more challenging if you didn’t want to hit the street you’d have to start climbing back up an appropriate amount of time before. - Id love to be able to choose which hand we shoot a web from while swinging. It’d give more control over which direction Spidey leans towards and would make tapering your way to your selected destination a lot prettier. - We should be able to shoot a web from a standing position without needing to jump first. He does it in plenty of cinematics and almost every single Spider-Man media. The huge leaps are fun but I don’t like starting swings off like that every single time.

[@calebmcclure3893]

Amazing Spider-Man 2 game had the feature where the left trigger controlled the left arm when swinging and the right trigger controlled the right arm when swinging

[@guwopman3503]

@@calebmcclure3893 I honestly think they could just utilize the d pad. Imagine this: while swinging (holding R2), if you press down on the d pad you reel out more web. If you press up on it, you climb back up your web (shortening its length). If you press and hold the left or right before pressing R2 it controls which hand he shoots the web from. All of that is easily implemented and entirely up to the player to utilize or not. Simply, if you don’t use the d pad controls, the web swinging is exactly the same. Let the game decide which hand shoots the web and let the web’s length be predetermined and unaltered. This works without redoing the entire framework they’ve built. I just wish they would consider more customization. It’s like tricks. You never have to use air tricks but they are fun and add to the experience. In this case, you’d never have to use the d pad controls. But if you choose to, it heightens the experience.

[@hopefullyanonymous3466]

Yes! Shoot a web from standing position is such a good idea

[@Young_Special]

1. (Catapult) - When running on the ground, if there's buildings or something high around, press (🔺️) for Spider-Man to shoot two webs to launch himself high up into the air to start swinging. 2. ( Directional Swinging ) While swinging, hold (❌️) and turn left or right for Spider-Man to switch between webs to swing on. This is the successor of the corner tether. 3. ( Air Dodge improved ) - Whenever you're about to perfect dodge from a bullet? Instead of Spider-Man shooting a web forward, he will do a cool flip to not mess up your speed and momentum. 4. ( Web- Climbing ) - While swinging, tap (🔺️) to make Spider-Man crawl up his web to avoid incoming obstacles. Respectively, these are logical mechanics that fit far more perfectly with insomniac's system. Btw, about the web-line reeling? Whenever you shoot a web-line in 0% swing assist? They are inconsistent enough to make low swinging challenging, so you'll hit the ground a couple of times. They only need web-climbing.

[@guwopman3503]

@@Young_Special I’ve always wanted to be able to climb up the web, but I’m specifically talking about instances where you are on massively tall buildings. Being able to continuously reel out web gives you more freedom at tall heights. At lower heights, it increases the difficulty of mastery. I’ve gone over ideas with my friends since making my initial comment and perhaps utilizing something on the d-pad could be how to grab the web. Imagine you have to shoot the web and instantly hit the d-pad to grab it at low levels, but you could wait to hit it at higher heights to have a bigger pendulum. This doesn’t get in the way of being able to climb up the web to correct a deep swing. I also wouldn’t want it to be the standard swinging controls. I think they could introduce an advanced swinging system that just utilizes unused buttons rather than redoing the entire system like I’ve seen some people suggest.

[@supgent]

The fact he even lies about first game to prove his argument is truly amazing.

[@jingleballs9935]

Where?

[@Webofshadowsclips]

Where?

[@thoroffdagoop]

Where?

[@necrago]

Where?

[@AmostheArtman]

Play Web of Shadows, like now. Its like a mix of Spider-Man 2 (2004) and Ultimate Spider-Man traversal. Very fast swinging, actual swinging physics, web climbing, web holding, web jumping, low swings/ground contact don't force you out of a web hold, 360 wall running, wall sliding, wall launching, wall cornering, great wall crawling, pole/beam swinging, summersault chaining, parkour animations, actual useful web zipping, jump charging and best of all no "safety zones" or forced animations. Everything you mentioned in this vid is practically in Web of shadows. Its not as complex as 2004 SM2 or as flashy as insomniac, but its got the tool sets for really fantastic web swinging.

[@fazelfarrokhi1998]

yes right thank you we need him to play

[@Forsakenruler]

Yeah no

[@ItzApotato5907]

Nah bro Web of shadows lacks any real momentum Sure u can go fast but it doesn’t feel like there is any weight And webs dont even attach to building half the time The guy in the video had one or two good points but most were complete nonsense This guy said that the swinging is too easy and automated while he was going not even half as fast as top speed while playing with swing assist at max lmfao I hate people like this

[@paris5831]

This is a insane nit pick

[@BubatzBoss]

This Video makes no sense. The swing assistance setting makes it like you want it. The only thing different is that hes not really crashing in the wall. They could change that. But you want that hes just dying when you press forward and r2. Its not an issue. You can swing good and fast in this game or you just press r2 and forward and you will need 4hours longer. What are you talking about bro

[@StuartLugsden]

This is what I like about Dark Space. He not a "hater" he's not a toxic arsehole, he's not a guy who complains for the sake of it and he's not someone who says everything is perfect and theres no need for change. He’s a guy who finds real flaws in things and gives constructive criticism through well narrated, well edited videos like these. I don’t agree with him on everything but that doesn't matter. + I like that he's branched out.

[@sleepdeprived1812]

Real wish more people were honest and respectful like him

[@StuartLugsden]

@@sleepdeprived1812Yeah I don’t get how anyone can say “This is just whining and nitpicking”. They clearly didn’t watch the video and think 2004 was yesterday.

[@sleepdeprived1812]

@@StuartLugsden 100 percent agree

[@BiggieJ4224]

Exactly, and honestly Spider-Man D-riders have been getting on my nerves, I’ve seen people like colinswrld attack SOME channels that have been perfectly constructive and not toxic at all, purely because they find a flaw in his precious game. If I’m going to be honest, I have no hope for the third game, insomniac, and the fans whatsoever. I’d rather accept that, then have to deal with the casual fan base that quite honestly just lack comprehension skills, so they shoot down any honest thinking

[@newdraftanimations]

That's true, and as a player who played both, everything he said is justified and correct here. I have a PS2 and find myself having more satisfaction in playing with the old one because it has depth, you feel like you're improving as a player and because of that, so is Spider-Man. Insomniac are wizards, but not in every regard, nobody is perfect at the end of the day and for a gamer who likes to earn everything and not having things gifted to him just for accessibility, this ain't it.

[@ayobruh_5]

7:54 NAHH ITS NOT JUST LIKE YOU'RE MOVING THE ANALOG STICK, WHICH MAKES YOU MOVE no no no never let bro cook💀

[@calebmcclure3893]

????? he's right though? in the OG spider-man 2 on ps2, you can't just hold R2 and have spider-man infinitely thwip new web strands and release when he reaches the peak of the swing. you have to manually release from the web and then manual shoot another web, requiring more player engagement. Whereas in insomniacs spider-man all you have to do is hold R2 and push the left stick forward and spider-man will literally do EVERYTHING automatically (spin new webs, let go at the peak of the swing, spin another web, automatically begin wall running when he hits a building, automatically jump off the building when he gets to the edge, spin another web line to a building... etc)

[@legalwaiver]

@@calebmcclure3893 Okay, but who the hell decides 'yeah, how about I go AFK for funsies'? No one, that's who.

[@thedarkroom6416]

While I agree with a. Lot of your points i think this video is a bit disingenuous as you didn’t really go in depth onto the things they did add and the things they changed only the things YOU think would improve it even tho the ideas you have are form very diffrent swinging systems from various games

[@jingleballs9935]

He did fine lol.

[@Young_Special]

​@@jingleballs9935 no the freak he didn't...

[@JustCyclaReal]

Bro the old games let us go to the Statue of Liberty and insomniac won’t let us go to it as it’s not a part of the playable area like bro the island is smaller than Astoria for example

[@-JEZ123]

The Thing insomiac has to introduce is aim to swing feature. You see in games, spidey always shooting his web by raising his hand upwards, even if he is near ground or in mid air, but aim swing feature has to give that he can shoot webs to any buildings or object below him from mid-air. In games you first dive, by reaching the ground u shoot web which will give momentum, but if we dive first and then shoot web to the building we like to go, give momentum by gravity along with the web, as we can see in amazing spiderman where he shoots web to crain when he is going to oscorb. i think some one going to understand this comment. an d forgive my RIP english

[@calebmcclure3893]

21:00 Insomniac be like "tHe WeBs AtTaCh tO tHe BuiLdiNgS"

[@beach9131]

Bro has a dark space in his brain.

[@fro_e]

I get what you're saying about how there's not much challenge and the wind tunnels breaking the game. But I think it's important to realise that most players won't exclusively use the wingsuit, even if it's technically better, they will switch between them because it feels better to play that way. And I think a lot of the challenge comes from trying to look cool whilst swinging. The game focuses a lot on style whilst swinging, and when the animations are this good, I can't really fault them for that.

[@hogindoz]

0 swing assist does more than make you able to hit the ground, the physics are much different. If you web a building far to the side, 0 will harshly pull you toward it where 10 will let you go forward still and do whatever you want. You might say that the game is "making you go where it wants you to" but thats how physics work. Later edit: Being able to release L3 and ride the wind tunnels only realy works because most dont have sharp turns. The ones next to EMF and Madison Square Garden will 100% shoot you out the sides if you dont actively steer with them.

[@amysteriousviewer3772]

Yeah exactly, I’m not sure he realises that physics doesn’t mean “you can do whatever you want” it actually means quite the opposite. Ultra realistic physics are usually not fun in games. The original Spiderman 2 was not entirely physically accurate either.

[@Judefluff525]

@@amysteriousviewer3772imo the original spider man 2 wasn’t *fun* either. it was clunky and a drag to learn, and even after getting better at it you still slam into shit all the time because of the building layouts

[@Owen-sx4jj]

@@Judefluff525 you were allowed to shoot out to webs for a reason to drastically change your trajectory. If you were going straight go could shoot another web while still holding on to the first and then let go.

[@harakiseshou3572]

There‘s some things I agree and disagree with in this video. One thing I disagree with is your opinion on the wingsuit. You compared speed of wingsuit with the speed of swinging, but in your clip you were swinging by releasing your swings in height instead of releasing when being on the bottom of the swing. As you said releasing earlier will push your speed vertical distance while releasing later will push your horizontal height. I think by using this method you‘d eventually be as fast as with the wingsuit. Also I barely noticed anyone only use the wingsuit, I only see people mix between each other for more diversity or using the tunnels for height push, other than that they stay on swinging because it’s obviously more made more satisfying

[@iczev]

Those wind tunnel rings bring back flashbacks from a certain game

[@ALMOSTNKKD]

Asking for 100% realistic physics in a game where you olay as a guy who can walk on walls is weird. I mean in real life infinite loop de loops arent possible because of gravity. I personally think parkour should be implemented into the swinging. I think it would really help Insomniac's system stand out by melding the two together.

[@bloodstone1992]

when it comes to some of your points like with swinging and the wing suit you often claim something is bad or doesnt work but clearly mess up in the video then try to cut it out of the footage. stop lying to try to make a claim sound genuine. be better.

[@Ivvelis]

im sorry man but i played the og spiderman 2 on the gamecube at age 6 and not a damn thought was between my eyes, and i was still decent at swinging.

[@elgusanito4971]

I feel like this a double edged thought. On one hand, yeah the swinging mechanics could be Miles better that what we have, with having more expression on the swinging and making it more satisfactory(and with Euphoria the animations might be better, but in its entirety). On the other hand, it would or could become insanely annoying and with way less style and less eye-catching substance(imagine swinging and then a random pole or small branch made you lose all that momentum out of nowhere). I personally think that some changes must be made, but it shouldn't be swinging in the SP2(Activision) way (at least not in its entirety)

[@semvision]

It should be just like Spiderman 2 from 2004. Why does that game have more advanced features and mechanics, despite being a rushed movie tie-in, than this large budget AAA release at $70. There is no justifying it.

[@YOEL_44]

That's where the optional helping festures should have a place. You want a more forgiving gameplay that tweaks your path to dodge small obstacles, that could be a toggle or a slidder, or you could even dedice what objects to auto-dodge and which ones you want to crash against. What is not ok is for them to decide when and where you swing, run or flight, that's just playing the game for you.

[@TheKanistan]

you lack imagination. making the swinging more skill-based doesn't have to cause any compromise in style (or, "eye-catching substance" as you put it). edit: insomniac claimed 7 years ago to be the studio to finally make the spider-man game that had been long overdue, and what have they done that entire time? insomniac chooses over and over again to prioritise flashy visuals over good game design. and these arguments about it being "harder" to make a good game these days, in a sense are true, because all the game dev leadership does these days is pump millions of dollars into making the graphics look good, and clearly not into hiring people with talent for making actual GAMEplay (imagine being a game director and deciding to pour so much money and man-power into the graphics that it literally restricts the player from moving faster than a certain speed due to hardware limitations, in a SPIDER-MAN GAME). really pathetic that we can't do better than a game from 20 years ago. and the fans of insomniac are so rabid that if you criticise them you just get called "someone who probably loves spider-man lotus" aka a racist. maybe if millions of rabid zoomers who aren't even old enough to know what fun gameplay is would stop brigading anyone who criticises insomniac, then they would actually hear valid cricitism and make their games better. but no, instead we get bryan intihar's stance that "we decided not to change the swinging because why fix something that isn't broken?"

[@Lameawsome]

@@semvisionmate you are living in the past, if you like the swinging in that game so much go play that and stop whinging cause I think most of the internet loves the game and 1% of spider-man fans hate it, the people hating MSM2 are prob the same people that love the lotus movie

[@dragonskinner7109]

No It shouldn't. I respect Spiderman 2 swinging but god fucking damn even if you were good at it it was slow af and not nearly as flashy as the one in Spiderman 2 ps5 @@semvision

[@dutchoriginals6482]

Have you ever been positive about anything? This is by far the best movement system in gaming and you're STILL complaining?

[@PanicB]

He doesn't even know how to web swing and plays using max swing assist

[@infamousplayer8772]

You know you can just go play the old Spider-Man 2 instead of complaining about how much you suck at the new one and wishes it was more like that instead, would cost you a lot less.

[@DarkSpaceStudios]

But it wouldn't make me as much.

[@infamousplayer8772]

@@DarkSpaceStudios it would make you look a lot less like a pretentious douche who acts like the only people who like this game's swinging are "casuals" and "kids" too, but hey, maybe that's just me.

[@salmannader1762]

Come on man, you can not tell me there is no challenge or "figuring out where to swing" when turning off the swing assist, if you swing at the wrong building in the wrong height with the wrong amount of speed you will literally lose all momentum. While playing with swing assist off, I had to always look at where and when I would want to push the R2 button in order to maintain speed and gather more momentum, so you just can’t say that there is no challenge when it comes to swinging without the assist 🤦🏽

[@Owen-sx4jj]

I agree this was my highlight for the game which is sad because combat was literally the same. If I didn't change the assist I'd literally be playing the same game.

[@sortacoolmaybe]

pretty sure he did in fact acknowledge the swing assist mode, and called it a good step. maybe you missed that part at 12:15

[@salmannader1762]

@@sortacoolmaybeyeah I kinda get it but afterwards he argues that there is no challenge of navigating the city more realistically (his words) which I literally had the impression of doing my whole playthrough playing this game with now swing assist

[@CrimsonWolfStudios]

@@sortacoolmaybe My issue is that he made it sound like all the swing assist determined was the barrier with the ground existing, which is blatantly untrue

[@moglu837]

if you are brainless yes, figuring out where to swing could be challenging for you

[@ashtalkes6745]

3 things 1.Turn off swing assist 2. Actually get good at the game 3. Stop glizzy gargling Spiderman 2 PS2

[@hazelcrisp]

It's still piss easy with 0 swing assist. Doing maneuvers takes very little skill. The game hold your hand. And setting it to zero just makes it hold you hand less tight. There's no challenge or difficulty to raverse the game. It needs more depth. Low swinging is also ass too.

[@emancules]

@@hazelcrispthis gotta be bro’s alt account cause this guy is another professional yapper

[@hazelcrisp]

@emmanuelakalusi3690 Cus the game isn't that great. I guess people have low standards and easily pleased by a system that looks good but not complex or depth

[@headshotmaster138]

@@hazelcrisp It's that regency bias.

[@A.H.goose1]

⁠@@hazelcrisp Straight up lie. If you just press R2 and forward you’ll either go into a building or hit the ground. He literally kept swing assist on in this video because his point doesn’t work without it 😂

[@This-is-a-commentt]

50% of this video is just skill issue The other 50% is just disingenuous and dumb

[@Eleyrica]

Exactly

[@chewie-v9546]

I had zero issue getting out of wind tunnels but I did notice even on zero assist settings I noticed the game helping me and not letting me hit things I should have. What you said about the game forcing you to let go of the web was my biggest gripe with the physics .

[@Axolotlaxe21]

What's do bad about that.

[@eem2wavy133]

@@Axolotlaxe21people don’t like automation

[@mrdimma6713]

the difficulty affects how much it holds your hand, increase it. itll traverse the wind tunnels for you if youre on a low difficulty.

[@crissdace8358]

​@@eem2wavy133touch grass then tf

[@eem2wavy133]

@@crissdace8358 what?

[@Skywalker-lz5qj]

I agree with you but the wing suit argument i found kind of dumb. If you don't like the wind tunnels just don't use them thats what I do, I only use the updrafts. This game is a superhero power fantasy while I agree with you that I want to see more difficult traversal I doubt that's what the majority of players want and that's pretty important to consider. If it is the case the majority of players don't want more difficult web swinging insomniac making it harder despite what the majority wants it would be relatively idiotic

[@calebmcclure3893]

Everything he said about the wingsuit is not dumb. It’s absolutely facts. Spider-Man swings, he doesn’t fly. They shouldn’t have enabled Spider-Man to fly in this game , just glide

[@Skywalker-lz5qj]

@@calebmcclure3893 But i mean if you want to look at it like that he isn't flying he's still gliding he's just getting pushed by the wind. Listen i agree it 's stupid theres such highly pressurized pockets of wind constantly flowing through the city but he isn't flying and again just don't hit triangle when you're swinging Its a feature you don't need to interact with and if you don't use the web wings you wont see the annoying aI from the tunnels. How does it affect how you think is best to play the game when it's a system you are only forced to use 3 times in the story and can just actively ignore for the rest of the game?

[@garblol]

the amojunt of people who havent played the game and is just taking this shottily made video as their truth is crazy. this game's swinging is 100x more intricate and not to mention FUN! you dont lose creative control by a web you cant see unless you actively search for it going into a wall, and the game clearly does not play itself, evidenced by your OWN gameplay!

[@CoffeePotGames]

This video is wrong. Turn off swing assist

[@PerkolatorTheTerminator]

“That game had ACTUAL physics” *shows clip of the most laughably busted PS2 physics possible lol. You’re not thinking about any of this practically. They have to allow the player to move through a MASSIVE map constantly rendering, so the less obstacles, the better. Also, while it may be fun to fuck around and break a physics system, from a quality, gameplay and artistic perspective, having the superhero move and act like a superhero instead of constantly fucking up slamming into walls is the better way to go. Sure they could have a “wall slamming active mode,” but as a default, this makes much more sense. Edit: It would be good for them to make it so, instead of clipping through the buildings, the web bent along side them, either bringing him into a wall run, or spinning him into a following web shot for a slight speed boost upon release though. 🤷‍♂️ 🕸

[@Zakietos]

Your version of "better" is sply a mindless fanservice shitfest game which is what this game is. To say that the physics in spiderman 2 2004 are broken is a testimony of how little you understand. "The less obstacles the better" im sorry but that's just idiotic. "Have webs coil instead of clipping" that would be a physics based system if te webs are real and not just animated as coiling around. If theyre animated that way but they dont get any shorter, then it's just more useless cosmetic crap to fool mindless players. This game fooled many into thinling that it has any actual physics, because i keep being told to turn off assist to "make it more rrealistic". What youre dewcribing is exactly the issue,you thimk a good game is a game that makes you look cool, this is what a good game is to a mindless player. To anyone who wants to do tje actual swinging, this game is boring as hell after like 4 traversals.

[@PerkolatorTheTerminator]

@@Zakietos Yawwwwn, you made the same dumb point in 5 paragraphs. Go play a Souls game for pointless difficultly. It's a fucking super hero power fantasy, Sherlock and if you can't see how blatantly broken those 04 physics are, your eyes are as bad as your spelling and reasoning.

[@BlackJacked]

​@@ZakietosMost boomers who hop on the dick of the older games really have nothing to say other than "the modern games suck!!11"

[@ChocolateMilkDawg]

dude turned on his mic and started yapping for 21 minutes straight, no one is forcing u to use the web wings either lil bro 💀

[@Baby_Jeebus]

He makes great points, they didnt nail everything

[@This-is-a-commentt]

Edit: fun fact: this comment I made was stupid and dumb, and I don’t know what I was talking about

[@ChocolateMilkDawg]

@@This-is-a-commentt shut up you’re wrong delete your youtube account

[@romuloprieto2529]

What about when there arent any tall buildings to swing from? Dumba$$

[@thegreatacolyt1277]

😂real

[@frmnwhere]

You would think for a developer that made a game like Sunset Overdrive they would take more risks with their traversal mechanics

[@MacenW]

didnt that game come out like 10 years ago? Theyre not the same Insomniac

[@House_of_Green]

I think it’s this pandering culture we live in, gotta make things easier so everyone can play.

[@moody1965]

@@House_of_Green Jesus lord you people are never happy with anything these days.

[@House_of_Green]

dont stop being you, you're killing it@@moody1965

[@elusive7732]

@@moody1965 idiots have 0 clue about game design & production LMFAO its ridiculous tbh

[@Tiagoconsan]

Your critique its fair for the most part, but i think u dont elaborate enough with 0 assist. I played all the game in this mode and makes spidey more manageable when u swing in the city.

[@YOEL_44]

More, but not enough.

[@Mr.SuperPerfectCell]

Keep copeing yall. For all the things you dont like and think got worse others enjoy a lot and think are great. Being picky does nothing. What's the point of this video? Telling people the game could be better? Yeah ofcourse it can. So can every game to exist. Insomniac isnt going to go back and change it so why bother? To stir controversy and gain veiws? Even if thats not your intention that's what it looks like. You keep bringing up the same exact points. I'm not saying you can't have opinions or state them but you also shouldn't say the same thing again and again you loose the meaning and point its practically beating a dead horse. At this point your flat out annoying. I dont hate or even dislike your criticism I agree with your points but when repeating yourself and restating the same things for 22 minutes it becomes worthless. Thats all I wanted to say I hope you all have a wonderful day.

[@itzjustboris7395]

Grr make my game that’s supposed to be a semi realistic representation of what Spider-Man in real life would be like as cartoonish and unrealistic as a game that came out on ps2!! I hate how fluid the animations are and how the game corrects my mistakes for me rather than allowing me to hold onto a web line until a lose all inertia and just drop to the side of a building like a twat or defy the laws of physics by spinning in an indefinite loop how dare they!! Disconnecting your webs automatically is seriously not a bad thing, I bet more people would be frustrated if they took away quality of life features like that. Also comparing the wings suit with the one in just cause is wild that shit was janky as hell you could almost glide near the ground indefinitely. I swear people cry about a lack of realism in a game about a guy bitten by a radioactive spider until that realism takes away a feature they like, and then they start saying “well the game doesn’t need to be fully realistic it can be unrealistic for these specific couple of features I want even if they make no sense at all next to the rest of the mechanics which are a lot more realistic”. Turning off the swing assist completely literally makes you go in whatever direction the web is attached in, it requires so much more mechanical skill. I swear all the stuff he mentioned like spinning on lampposts indefinitely or running along the ground while still attached to a web do the exact opposite of make the game more grounded, if the game was full of shit like that it’d look ridiculous. It’s a semi realistic game with realistic character models. If they start spinning around lamp posts at Mach 10 or doing ridiculous animations that are way too fast for a game that’s supposed to look not very cartoonish, it gets into uncanny valley territory. If you wanna play a game that looks and plays goofy as hell then fair enough, ones like just cause are a load of fun, but trying to act like games like that are some sort of super realistic physics based simulator shit is very disingenuous. These two Spider-Man games are the most realistic we’ve gotten in both looks and mechanics. Going on about how you want your game to be more mature and grounded because it’s story based then complaining that you can’t spin in a circle forever and generate infinite momentum out of thin air is kind of contradictory

[@itzjustboris7395]

My immersion would be broken way more if Peter and miles started doing shit at the speed of light (because fast choppy cartoonish animations are the only real way to pull a lot of that shit off in a game) in the open world and then slowing down to a comparative crawl and start moving like actual humans for e cutscenes it’d be so jarring to watch Peter do half the shit you mentioned then transition to a serious cutscene. I can way more easily accept a web being disconnected automatically immersion wise than them doing the kind of janky cartoonish shit they did in those previous games. For a lot of those animations and actions in the old games to work they need to be very fast and as a result cartoonish and very unrealistic. Also why are people literally swinging long enough for the web to get disconnected that literally is telling you that you should have let go yourself sooner. You move way faster and more fluidly if you aren’t literally swinging as highly as humanly possible with every swing you do until the game forces you to let go that’s literally one of the slowest ways to get around. If you want to be propelled forward as fast as possible, letting go of the web yourself is the way to do that. You lose way too much momentum if you hold on all the way until the game makes you let go. And again I argue that the game not letting go unless you tell it to would make it a lot more janky and less streamlined as people would often be just falling straight back down in the direction they were swinging from. Yeah sure it would be more realistic, but would it seriously be more fun? You really can’t fault them for going with the option that made the game accessible to the biggest amount of people possible, the zero swing assist setting is really as challenging as a game like this should be, you can even turn on fall damage for gods sake. Why should the game be more difficult and challenging to satisfy people who want a borderline simulator web swinging experience that’s more realistic (except they don’t really want more realism they just want realism in a few aspects but want to add in features that are blatantly unrealistic because heehee web go weeee). Wanting the game to pretty much be a simulator then cherry picking your favourite features from older games regardless of how unrealistic they were that weren’t included because they’d look out of place but still trying to maintain you want a realistic experience is a little hypocritical. Just say you wish it had more of the features from the games you enjoyed as a kid because they were fun there is nothing wrong with that, don’t make up a whole spiel about how you want the game to be more grounded yet have features that directly oppose that notion. Yeah they could include different swinging modes in theory to cater to peoples preferences but the way you’re talking it’d be so vastly different to what we got it’d be like them making two different games in one, one of which pretty much gate keeps certain features behind a difficulty wall that some people will never be able to scale. Yes the game isn’t perfect, yes it could be better and some things could have been done differently, there are certainly features I myself don’t particularly enjoy. But these two games are the best representations of spider man we’ve gotten in a video game format in terms of a mix of gameplay and realism. Also the notion that this game should have completely reinvented the swinging system from the game before it is silly. It’d be extremely off putting for players who got used to the swinging system from the first game and enjoyed it (most of the people who played the game) to suddenly be faced with a game that handled totally differently from the first one. There would be an uproar. Anyway I’ve gone on for a while and probably repeated myself a bunch but yeah hopefully I got my points across coherently

[@loothhussainfazeel855]

swing assistance should be an entire section in the settings menu. Even though the protective barrier is the only thing adjustable, these options should also be adjustable: -impact into instant wallrunning -floatiness to avoid obstacles -wingsuit feeling automatic -auto parkour

[@CrimsonWolfStudios]

It's not just the protective barrier. It effects the physics of your web swings. You will actually drift towards the buildings you swing, and depending on when and where you direct your line to can completely change your trajectory. Did he even spend more than five minutes experimenting with the swing assistance? Because it feels like he didn't.

[@loothhussainfazeel855]

@@CrimsonWolfStudios he talked a bit about that in the last video iirc.

[@TyandOnGoing]

That cuz the game was never made with that kind of swinging in mind. No web assist is just an option more than a gameplay option

[@disrupt_-4054]

0 swing assist doesn't have floatiness to avoid obstacles, you have to get way higher off the ground to be able to swing

[@loothhussainfazeel855]

@@disrupt_-4054 that's what I said

[@arthurdurham]

The more mainstream games become the more fear devs have of letting the player fail. But failure and overcoming it is one of the things that games can do other entertainment media can't. I do think though some of these issues has to do with the graphical fidelity, like trying to make a more open ended swinging while also maintaining a level of polish is a tough, maybe impossible task. And I get why Insomniac chose what they did. But I think if that was a setting or even unlockable feature it could be a good middle ground. Let the people who want it find it and they'll acceot things looking worse for more depth. Though the wing suit I think is poor, it really became my main mode of transportation bc the map is unnecessarily big and it was often the objectively faster mechanic.

[@Leo-yn5fx]

ummm no no and no these developers played it incredibly safe all around. This game rating keeps slowly creeping down lower and lower the more i notice how much it pisses me off.

[@NakulKrishna]

Good points Arthur. I agree with it being hard to give total freedom to players while maintaining animation consistency and polish. Though I do think they were a bit lazy. I didn’t see the point of the increased map size personally, I’d rather theyd have worked on combat, traversal animations and more freedom in both. Web wings with increased map size is lazy and I hate wind tunnels because it’s weird and there’s no challenge or skill to flying around, I mean you don’t even have to fight to stay in the tunnel you can just put your controller down and have spidey fly. Overall the game emphasised boss fights too much, which will get boring after the 2nd time playing. Bigger map, lesser to do = lazy from insomniac for this 2nd entry.

[@AstralLaVista]

Lack of fail states more than anything else is something that plagues playstation first party games, unless they're made by fromsoft

[@JamesslashTry]

Crazy how now accessibility options are built in as the default experience.

[@Young_Special]

​@@AstralLaVista Fall damage is right there, dog... it even works through swinging on 0% Swing-Assist assist.

[@Geo-di7yf]

I don't think you guys get what Insomniac is going for. They playtest their games, a lot. They see that players don't want a complex and hard to master mechanic for the most part. People like us, who enjoy complex traversal are a minority, so they add fun stuff like loop de loops, swinging around corners or the no assist mode to keep us engaged, but they won't spend time and resources on a mechanic that most people won't enjoy. What they will spend resources on are cutscenes and epic moments, because that's what most people love about super heroes.

[@Young_Special]

1... you gotta understand that insomniac were rushed. So they couldn't deliver upon a lot of content they'd plan within the development process. 2... if they don't listen to hardcore fans? Calling us the minority? Why did they deliver 0% Swing-Assist? A settings that actually makes web-swinging feel physics based. Why did they include fall damage? Especially when it works coherently with web-swinging. Why did they add a Corner Tether mechanic? To make players strategically turn corners amazingly. Why did they gave us a canned animated loop de loop feature, instead of upgrading their physics engine to go 360°? Maybe becuase they were rushed. Why did they give us web wings? Maybe because it helps to cross over to Queens and Brooklyn... and to avoid close calls for strategic gameplay. You guys are absolute dumbasses to say that they don't listen to player feedback that come from hardcore players. To put it plainly? 10% Swing-Assist does not feel any different from the 2018 Spider-Man game. Yet... they started to make a change in web swinging fundamentals when they delivered 0% Swing-Assist??? You moda sucka's are unlogical and speak through unprofessional feelings. They may not have delivered upon EVERYTHING in Spider-Man 2. But i for sure now see insomniac potentially setting a bar that well set the stage for Spider-Man 3... where they will truly deliver a legendary web-swinging experience when they go all out. Spider-Man 2 was just them placing their footing on where to go next for the future. You'll understand soon enough.

[@Terraw77]

You can turn swing assist off in the settings, im only halfway through the video so idk if he mentions that

[@Terraw77]

He did but only mentioned the hitting the floor :/

[@gregorycorela2719]

Have you tried turning the web swinging assist off, its like someone complaining about a game being to easy while playing on the easiest difficulty. (The web swinging from spiderman 3 was the worst)

[@sortacoolmaybe]

he literally does at 12:15, you probably just looked at the title and ran to the comments to complain

[@ryanneale6501]

@@sortacoolmaybenah he barely addresses it and mischaracterizes the change

[@deadspace297]

​the fact most of the shit he complained about is addressed by turnind the swing assist down, I bet people don't like it as much as SM2 on the ps2 but I played it recently and it took 30 minutes to piss me off.

[@IAmOnHereBecauseYes]

@@deadspace297fr i swear this game fixed half the issues in the first one and if some people would open there eyes they’d see these changes 0 swing assist is only about you knowing how to shoot your web correctly where to dive where to loop where to web wing where hold on to your web while turning And while combat isn’t too amazingly different it was still nice to have extra details like kick enemies stomachs into walls and stuff like that Like what are these people asking for.

[@Vintagesonic1]

Did none of y'all watch the video????

[@chicagobigchungusbobungus8842]

Okay. This criticism is awful and here's why- The core problem with this video is the assumption that swinging being slightly more accessible = bad. But why is a game having a system that is much smoother to interact with and easier inherently bad? You use a completely nonsensical claim that racing games are fun because you are in control and it takes skill- but racing games are competitive multiplayer games about who can control their machine better. Spider-Man is a single-player, story-driven action-adventure game. The skill ceiling being higher, doesn't have ANY purpose to the greater design goals of the game. Just because games can be more complicated and skill-based, doesn't mean they always have to be. You constantly compare Spiderman 2 to the original Spiderman 2, and I'm sorry but just because certain features haven't been brought over doesn't mean that this game failed to provide a proper swinging experience. As someone who played both types of game, I can say the short list of things not included- are incredibly minor features that I either barely used- or were honestly jank. The only thing I can agree on is the web running when you hit the floor- but that also invalidates your argument that the game is “on rails” if you hit the ground and lose momentum, and you are in control of what angle and directions you chose to go, that's not arcade-like and simplified. That's what a swinging system Is and should be! “Spiderman's web breaking on its own is a failure-” Why? You can still hold on incredibly long, you get maybe a couple of seconds less of Spiderman awkwardly floating at a weird angle. You constantly say that “more realistic swinging makes a better game.” when let's be real here- both look and feel completely unrealistic. When Spiderman holds his web too long he looks like he's floating on the side of a building. He floats slowly, stopping in mid-air when in reality he should plummet and hit the side of the wall like a ton of bricks. The web wing argument feels basically like paper. As someone who plays Spiderman games, it always sucks to be in areas with low roofs because unless you just web zip you’ll have to stop swinging entirely. the roofs are too low to get a good angle to keep momentum. Web wings alleviate this issue by allowing you to glide, the wind allows you to get around every section of the city. you still have to swing and combine your tools to get to places faster. The web is only faster if you just care about getting to different districts and not playing the game. This is like saying fast travel invalidates swinging! It lets you get to certain out-of-the-way sections of the map better, it's only used in areas with roofs so low that swinging wouldn't be optimal anyway, and the comparison to Just Cause feels like such a reach because you know Just Cause has a ton of space in the air- whereas new york is dense with buildings and stuff to hit! It's like saying Counter-Strike is worse than Doom Eternal because it has a better combat system- no they are different games designed for different purposes. I’m not gonna rant about this forever, this video is filled with garbage but here is my ultimate point. The idea is that the decision to not make this game just Spiderman 2 for the PS2 is not because they are lazy. I think you have to be a pretty entitled person to make that argument. This game oozes effort, but because the swinging isn't exactly like that game you played as a kid- insomniac is lazy. That’s childish and shows a complete disregard for the complicated game they are making here. Wall crawling sucks as a result of the hyperrealistic buildings having way more complicated geometry. It's not some simple fix- this isn't a burger joint. It's a multi-million-dollar marvel of art and engineering. Having a system that automatically accounts for your failures and corrects them is harder to make- just saying that out loud should make it clear. There is the constant smugness that the swinging in this game is mindless, super easy and baby-proofed- which is just insecurity. Original Spider-Man 2 swinging, is still easy. Kids beat Spiderman 2, I beat Web of Shadows and loved doing tricks. It's not that hard. To be honest, I barely noticed assist was on when I played the first time, I noticed it more as I came back but the system worked amazingly. Spider-Man is a fantasy superhero game- these games never emphasized complex movement tech even if they had them as an option- because people wanna play a Spiderman game to feel Spiderman. It's only a d-measuring contest to you and a small section of people who want the game to be a remake of Spiderman 2 on PS2. But PS2 Spiderman was easier to make and for a considerably smaller audience than these new games are. Some of these criticisms are valid, but this video has this smug vibe I can't get behind. This system is not bad because people who don't want to worry about angles can enjoy the game now. Ifs a great system because more people can enjoy this game and experience Less of the weird jank of the old games. You aren't better than people because you enjoy a kids PS2 game. Grow up.

[@shadowanderson2004]

I played the first mission with swing assist all the way on (because that’s the default) it felt like the first two games. Then I turned it to 0 and fall damage on. It felt completely different. The things I would do to make the swinging in the first 2 games more fun became almost impossible while some became necessary. If you just go through the game holding the swing button down like your playing assassins creed it won’t feel intuitive but if your play how the game tells you to (by releasing at the point of your arc you want) it feels almost completely different and extremely intuitive. Also I tried your experiment with just holding the web swing button and forward. I fell face first in on the street not 45 seconds in. I then tried the jump and swing and he’ll go in the direction your facing. Yeah I was immediately able to go backwards. I also think you don’t know how real physics work. In order for a loop de loop to happen you’d have to dive no matter your speed.

[@lololo]

You wouldn't though. He literally shows clips of PS2 Spider-Man 2 where there's no diving involved and you can loop at your leisure.

[@shadowanderson2004]

@@lololo that’s because Spider-man 2 ps2 doesn’t actually fallow the laws of physics. The clips he showed used the manual boost mechanic instead of real physics.

[@Jose-ci3oi]

@@lololoand that’s not realistic 🙀

[@Young_Special]

​@@lololoBro looped around a wall...

[@Young_Special]

PREACH, brother... but yes! A dive makes the loop de loop. But insomniac's version is most definitely animation based. Their physics engine has the speed and momentum to achieve a loop de loop without the need of a dive. They just need to make it happen.

[@bennytenny4662]

I’m satisfied with the swinging, would be dope if it was like the OG SM2 too tho, like a mix minus the assistance, get the best of both worlds that are realistic to achieve. The webwings are cool and yeah you can heavily depend on them but you don’t have to, it’s up to you how to use it, I use it to reach a building to swing from that’s just a bit too far and also to gain speed to resume swinging fast. They for sure got to add wall combat in the next game, I think that’d be dope and is very possible, like press X and SQUARE together near a wall and while you’re on it to enter wall combat and press it again anytime to exit wall combat or web strike a grounded or in flight enemy to exit, but of course we’d have to have certain enemies that are able to stick and fight on walls too for a good reason and they’d have to be more resistant to being pulled off the wall and being webbed to it, and they’d have to have an attack from the wall hitting you while you’re grounded. The enemies should be split, types that are always on the ground and types that can do both ground and wall combat, just so that they aren’t always retreating to the wall and forcing you to always fight on the wall with them after you knocked them off in wall combat or gadget hit. Idk, a group of smarter people that make games can figure it out better.

[@Wertyber]

5:35 if you don't do this and actually swing normally, maybe you'd actually have fun with the traversal