THUMBSTICK vs GYRO vs MOUSE in Aim Lab

[@JibbSmartGD]

Your results will vary based on how practiced you are with these different input types, but also based on the scenario. The scenario I showed here only tests big/close targets with very little time to shoot them. Check out Nerrel's video on the Legacy of the Steam Controller to see what a difference it can make to play a slightly different scenario: kzbin.info/www/bejne/a5XWfWStnNplm5o SPOILER: With much smaller targets, frictionless gyro aiming can offer even better precision than a mouse! (Again, this will depend on the player, too)

[@hack_jammer]

I make gyro controllers that are actually good. I would send you one for testing. Makes Dualsense look like dog crap.

[@acyned8079]

Interesting! I'll definitely use this training program!

[@Ao1Trigga]

@@hack_jammer how do you get one of these?

[@hack_jammer]

@@corpingtons sick. make it super easy to use and cheap if possible. have a good one dood

[@Lawlerboyful]

One day gyro aim will be standard for console shooters ! We must continue to make our voices heard. As dramatic as it sounds.

[@bensmart92]

Kabel yeah it really should be. Developers need to get on to this

[@CandarianGaming]

It should be apart of the console interface. For example on pc you can add gyro to any game through the steam interface

[@Lawlerboyful]

@@CandarianGaming That would solve virtually all problems i have with shooters on PS4 but, alas. Obviously gyro aiming takes development time to implement, but from what I understand it's identical to mouse aim so it's not that much more difficult. Plus we've seen a small few devs implement post launch (Paladins, Days Gone, Overwatch, Doom) so at least we have an idea that the devs can learn it fairly quickly. If Blizzard does not include a gyro update for PS4 the day the Switch version releases I'll sigh.

[@CandarianGaming]

@@Lawlerboyful Hopefully gyro becomes a normal option going with the next playstation cos playing games like uncharted would be sick having that feature. But yeah it literally is the same as aiming with a mouse just takes getting use to as I primarily play on pc and it's always with a controller

[@Lawlerboyful]

@@CandarianGaming well i've been asking naughty dog to include it for The Last of Us 2 since Bend studios did it for Days Gone. Not saying they've actually seen my requests but if more people ask they might just do it

[@osidufg]

gyroscope has already been a standard on mobile gaming like pubgm. i can say that gyroscopes combined with analouge is better than using analouge alone.

[@dranclitar9878]

Yes this is true I can aim easily on the gyro in pugM and I struggle playing COD warzone in my ps4

[@dranclitar9878]

@Quality High but its not on modern warfare warzone.

[@osidufg]

Bogodo yeah, but it doesn’t matter. if you get used to it, you’ll have more advantage in aiming

[@allahbless2278]

@Quality High 😳 never knew

[@thearmyofiron]

haha, I believe there's more people using claw than gyro

[@tinymosesofficial]

Splatoon was the first shooter I really got into because the aiming felt so much better than other games thanks to gyro controls. When I started playing Fortnite, I told my friends, "I'll be better at this game when they add gyro controls to the Switch port." Now I have to turn down or turn off aim assist in Fortnite because I can feel the effects. I can understand when mouse and keyboard players complain about aim assist because it feels more drastic than it is if you're not used to it. I started playing Battlefront 2 on PS4 and I see my player following someone I'm not trying to kill just because he ran across my view. This wouldn't happen if I could use gyro with no aim assist. I just want gyro to be implemented into more games. More play options in this regard cannot be a bad thing. And it baffles me that Xbox, despite making big leaps in accessibility, doesn't have gyro for their current controller. Maybe things will be better next generation.

[@JibbSmartGD]

✔️✔️✔️ It's hard to go back! Gyro is spoiling us! And yeah, it's wild to me that with so much talk about accessibility lately gyro aiming doesn't come up at all

[@Celtic_Mav]

And now fortnite's gyro is broken with a deadzone

[@tinymosesofficial]

@@Celtic_Mav I thought I was the only one!! I've been struggling for weeks about it and everyone is confused what I'm talking about since they don't use it. I can't even use a scoped weapon because of this. It irritates me even more because I use pistols for less drop off damage at medium and long ranges and I use to be able to hit every shot, but now can't adjust enough to hit anything. Work the revolver out I could use it instead for even more damage and use it as almost a double pump attack but now can't hit anything.

[@ItalicMan420]

Well you got your wish they nerfed it to the point where it's hard to even compete as as a controller pro.

[@aperson7329]

Gyro in Fortnite ps4

[@blaynestaleypro]

The way Breath of the Wild did it was perfect. Use thumbstick for less accurate quicker aiming, use gyro for more precise aiming. This should be standard.

[@Maddoxmaddox-bk4sc]

You are probably gonna scorn at my comment but I have to say that mobile gaming have added a new dimension to it by introducing gyro aiming. I was about to buy a PS4 two months back but backed out once I realised that console controllers don't have gyro aiming. Decided to just play Cod on mobile

[@blaynestaleypro]

@@Maddoxmaddox-bk4sc Whatever floats your boat. Its stupid that these big companies can;t add gyro support. So many good gameplay ideas can be basically ripped off from Nintendo games, but most developers are dumb fucks.

[@marving.8868]

@@Maddoxmaddox-bk4sc Nintendo Controller have it. Im not sure if PS has it. But you could play on pc and use a Switch Controller

[@VagrantValmar]

@@marving.8868 Dualshock has it but only paladins uses it

[@lnkp-nut9564]

​@One Thou Wou chill nigga he just likes mobile gaming i like pc though so fuck maddox3791 maddox

[@Agos226]

I would be very curious to see this test done again with someone who has no prior experience with gaming. No matter what, our past experiences influence what we're comfortable with and it would be interesting to see which one is most intuitive for new players

[@LeoSRL300]

Agree, this would be a great idea

[@aboveaveragebayleaf9216]

I've found most new players for sure do better with mouse than joystick, but struggle a little sometimes with the left hand coordination.

[@Deyne547]

I feel like gyro might be more intuitive because its the closest to aiming in real life I.E. using a gun

[@shortbreadhead]

@@aboveaveragebayleaf9216 Gyro feels like the best option for me, I'm left handed but I do a lot of things right handed, like using a mouse which I have done my whole life. However for finer things like aiming with a mouse it's just not as easy for me and because I've used the mouse right handed my whole life I just CAN'T use my left hand with a mouse. It's a totally weird situation and I wonder how many left handed people have the same experience as me. Yeah I can aim "fine" with a controller, but obviously there are levels of assistance going on there, even though I am fully capable with both hands in any position on a controller since, the same as a mouse, I've been using them my whole life as well. So I'm in the odd situation where I can't win either way, that's why gyro genuinely feels like the honestly superior, ultimate answer. I remember I got Kid Icarus: Uprising for the 3ds, this is slightly unrelated but it might highlight the weird issues I face. It was very genuinely impossible for a left handed person to play. Having to hold the stylus with your right hand for aiming and moving the character with your left was not going to work because I can't hold a writing like tool properly in my right hand, and I definitely can't aim that way. The other option they gave you was to move your character with the face buttons using your right hand like it's the d-pad so you could use your left hand with the stylus to aim and that's just not a solution, when every single controller I grew up with had the d-pad on the left, controlled with my left hand, I couldn't do that with my right hand in the opposite position, never mind the fact the solution involved an inferior input method for movement. I know that was a tangent, but I thought it might help explain how there's never a REAL solution for left handed gamers, but gyro, that's different and it's much quicker. I consider it an actual accessibility feature, not just for those reasons but I also experience pain that personally prevents me from doing things I'd always like, but gyro doesn't affect me as it takes stress off of the affected areas.

[@IceBreak23]

Splatoon 2 changed my gameplay with Gyro, wish they did more support for gyro on steam like joycons, Gyro is a lot better than mouse and keyboard for me

[@chan13153]

Gyro has many advantages over mouse and keyboard. For me it's a more fun way to play the game. It feels more like your actually aiming the weapon which makes the experience more immersive. Also many games work better with a controller over mouse and keyboard. Games like GTA5 plays better with a controller + gyro. Also the final advantage is being able to play games laying on your sofa on the big screen TV versus hunch over a desk.

[@Matt-kl7qc]

I agree with you 100%

[@tostadorafuriosa69]

@@chan13153 I play mainly on pc but i dont like the keyboard and mouse at all. Gyro game a good option.

[@meachew]

@@chan13153 so true and gyro seems to have similar aiming to a mouse and your correct gyro is really fun.

[@jordisimons8976]

So true there’s nothing better then quickly turning your whole body to the side like some yoga exercise and clapping some guy trying to sneak up on you from behind.

[@StoneMountain64]

Bro this is insane!

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thank you kindly! This input remapper (and others) puts gyro aiming into Warzone, too ;)

[@techyguyaditya]

​@JibbSmartGD warzone already has gyro aiming, and it's really good, supporting aim assist.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Yep, Warzone has gyro aiming, and its settings are largely based on my work. From what I've heard, active gyro disables aim assist (which is great)

[@techyguyaditya]

@JibbSmartGD wow that's great bro! For mobile gyro players like me, warzone got a bit more easier to play newly on consoles. Do you have similar configs for apex legends?

[@JibbSmartGD]

:) I know some people who use input remappers to play Apex with gyro, but I have no idea if they're gonna add it to the game

[@jamienava6750]

Gyro is a lot of fun. You can tell right away how sloppy and slow his aiming is with a analog stick. It's a shame most console gamers dismiss gyro (or motion controls) as a "gimmick".

[@MoonyTheBat]

Hey hey! I just found this channel through Nerrel's latest video about the Steam controller! I've been using his two videos about gyro aiming to help tell people online about how good gyro is and why it should be standard, and now I think I'll start linking this video as well! Keep up the good work, gyro really should be mainstream on every console by now (looking at you Microsoft).

[@hack_jammer]

Lol those gyros are trash. Check me out. I did it for real. Can go diagonal and upside down and it won't drift like crazy and crash your computer like jibb smart's lazy trash software

[@JibbSmartGD]

If my "lazy trash software" is crashing your computer, please report an issue. No one else is reporting such a problem. As for diagonals and upside down, JSM's "gyro space" options give players a few ways to handle weird orientations. Check out GyroWiki and you might learn a thing or two

[@hack_jammer]

@@JibbSmartGD by the way the reason is obviously drift + hours of use. if you haven't reached that yet you haven't tested your software as well as i have. figure it out genius

[@hack_jammer]

@@JibbSmartGD oh and it doesn't surprise me that I'm the only one to have used it for more than a couple of hours at a time. because your vision of gyro is extinct. i'd explain but i think you've been too lazy to keep up.

[@varoennauraa]

A lot of PS4 games could use a gyro update!

[@Vinnay94]

Well PS5 is around the corner so hopefully Sony keeps the gyros in the Dual Shock 5. Microsoft should jump on board especially for the new Halo. Analog sticks are ancient. They are only good for move, strafe and quick turns.

[@JibbSmartGD]

I think Sony will keep gyro in the DS5 both for backwards compatibility and for VR :)

[@glenncolina4353]

same goes for PC!

[@varoennauraa]

@Hannyabal yeah. That’s why I mostly play on Nintendo. Gyroless controls feel so ”last gen”, that I cannot go back.

[@varoennauraa]

@Hannyabal I’m fearing that too!!! That really makes my spider sense tingling!!!

[@seto007]

As a PC player of over a decade and a half who's started testing out Gyro, while I'm a lot more comfortable with a mouse in 99% of applications, one thing that I've really noticed is that gyro really beats out mouse when it comes to precise adjustments, like when adjusting a sniper shot to account for a target's movement. You can get better flick shots with a mouse, but the friction of a mouse pad makes subtle movements less precise.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Yeah, I'm with you. I'm pretty sure I hit smaller targets much better with gyro than with mouse

[@godmodecheater153]

Gyro aim has the advantage that you aim with your motion just like with the mouse. Way more fluid, faster and accurate that with thumbstick, where you just can choose the direction

[@augustofretes]

I'm actually better with the gyro than with the mouse on Aim Lab, as crazy as that might sound. I find that the lack of friction with the gyro means I can make small adjustments faster. Also, with the mouse you rely only on your muscle memory, with the gyro you develop something else on top of that: you literally feel the angular displacement on your wrists, which is very, very helpful. My average score with the gyro on gridshot ultimate is 55k (my record is 68k), my average with the mouse is 48k and my record is 57k.

[@zerarch77]

What you described for gyro is also muscle memory, but for muscle groups which might not be used for mouse. The more muscles you can use for inputs, more precise those inputs can be.

[@HenrikMyrhaug]

​@@zerarch77 It is not really the number of muscles you use, it is how precise the muscles are. A gunman laying down will be more accurate than a gunman standing up, even though more muscles are used muscles when standing up. Mouse allows the use of wrists in addition to the fingers, but limits certain wrist movements. The gyro does not limit wrist movements(at least not with joy cons), so it allows more precise aiming, but it does not allow the same big range of motion as a mouse, meaning you still have to use the stick to aim, wich is much less precise than mouse for fast turns. A mouse also has the ability to stand still and not move, meaning it is possible to line up a shot and have it stay perfectly aimed, whereas that is hard (but possible) with gyro aim. TLDR: Gyro > Mouse > Stick for small movements, but mouse has other advantages.

[@pinospin9588]

but if the gyro drifted and you have to set deadzone for it you'll know how hard it is to make a slight movement

[@HansGruberX1]

@@HenrikMyrhaug sorry to tell you but you have the most precision in your Fingers, not your wrist not your arm. Thats why when you write something you just move the pointing finger, the middle finger and the thumb. Try to write as small as possible without moving your Fingers and just move your arm and wrist. Tell me how it works out :D

[@astrea555]

@@HansGruberX1 You have more leverage when using the whole arm for wider movement though, this is why artists draw with the whole arm and why esport mouse players play with lower sensitivity to use as much of the arm as possible. Same applies to gyro

[@rufex2001]

Nerrel brought me here! I am one of those who is amazed by the lack of OPTIONAL gyro aiming at the, say, PS4. Gamers need to be less obtuse and give it a shot. After some quick getting used to, there is no way it isn't better than using the stick. It's basically position vs direction + speed. Which one do you think makes more sense for aiming?

[@therealperfectname]

I'm surprised new shooters don't have gyro controls already. It seems to be the next step for console aiming

[@sleepingturtle32]

Yeah

[@michaelcamacho3717]

Sony's PS controllers and Nintendo Switch controllers have gyro builtin, however, Xbox controllers don't. But there are 3rd party controllers, expensive ones, that have gyroscope.

[@Creshex8]

Microsoft and Sony need to get a special award for setting the industry, the quality of play, and the fun of games back 15 years. Their refusal to innovate, support their own product, and outright suppression of gyro has held back so many people from enjoying video games.

[@qwertyasdf6589]

Might be too broken and unfair for keyboard and mouse players

[@JibbSmartGD]

It actually makes things more fair because it puts controller players in direct control of their aim instead of having unnatural aim assist

[@JibbSmartGD]

This video is frequently used in discussions about the benefits of gyro aiming. I usually find out about this through spikes in views, but usually don't know where they come from. If this is your first time seeing this video: 1. I'd love to know what brought you here, and 2. If you want to see stuff like this in actual games, check out my other videos :) Thanks, Jibb

[@crazyboyandyomama]

Reddit

[@JibbSmartGD]

Much appreciated :)

[@TwigglTheBird]

i would like to see this as a new standard for consoles, this debate about aim assist and mouse and keyboard aim is so annoying, especially in crossplay games like cod warzone. I am a pc gamer, but playing sometimes crossplay with friends

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thanks, Simon :)

[@Crlarl]

Nerrel: kzbin.info/www/bejne/a5XWfWStnNplm5o

[@nebuluna78]

I find it interesting that in splatoon gyro is default and your handicapping yourself by using thumbstick, while some other shooters don't even have gyro options. Though it's probably just because it's a Nintendo game.

[@JibbSmartGD]

It's surprising how little Splatoon has influenced other shooters

[@geremysorlinigiguere9535]

@@JibbSmartGD What's even more surprising is how some people stubbornly refuse to use them on the sole basis of "ew motion controls" despite it being better by such a massive margin that it borders on shooting yourself in the foot to go stick only.

[@DiskusGames]

Gotta say though. The gyro aim in Splatoon isn’t ideal, since you can’t use the stick for vertical aiming anymore.

[@chan13153]

@@geremysorlinigiguere9535 I find Xbox players to be the most stubborn when it comes to embracing change. They go and yell about how amazing there controller is. How it's perfect and every way possible. "AA batteries are superior because in 5 years from now I won't be able to undo a few screws and replace the internal battery. I rather just keep buying AA's. Motion, get that waggle shit out of here." You try and tell them unscrewing a battery cover isn't hard and they tell you your wrong and you need an advance engineering degree to replace it. You tell them you don't have to swing your arms when using gyro aiming and they keep yelling wii, and how motion has been dead for years now. It's It really is like talking to a brick wall.

[@chan13153]

@@DiskusGames I find gyro on steam to be superior to all implementation of gyro I have seen on all switch games and PS4 games. What makes gyro so much better on steam is how much you can customize it. You can have it turned on only when aiming down the sights. You can change the sensitivity to make it much more sensitive. Most gyro aiming on the switch I find to not be sensitive enough and most games do gyro wrong. Fortnite for example theres too much of a dead zone for the gyro aiming making it very hard to do precise aiming. As you said with splatoon you can't use the stick for vertical aiming. Though the one big advantage with splatoon gyro compared to steam is the ability to recenter with a single press of a button. That is extremely useful and needs to be added on steam.

[@vladimirpolnikov]

How did you make an overlay at the left corner? Which app provide this?

[@JibbSmartGD]

It's a program of my own making. It's called JoyShockOverlay, and I hope to get it ready for others to use it this year.

[@vladimirpolnikov]

@@JibbSmartGD Looking great 👍

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thanks very much :D

[@PalaKThkaur]

@@JibbSmartGD you made it on coding on your own😱

[@drippeeboye607]

I’m bookmarking this video my brother wants to stream and I’ll be sure to give him this program it actually looks great

[@khaledassaf6356]

I watched this about a year and a half ago along with your video showcasing flick stick in Doom. Decided to give it a try. It sucked, couldn't hit a thing. I had to relearn everything, practice, and play with configs till I found what worked with me. Now it feels much more natural, and I'm better with gyro than I am with mouse, and can actually play comfortably for longer periods of time, which I couldn't with M/KB due to an old injury. Thank you for that!

[@ItsBoyRed]

i started practicing gyro aim seriously in Aim Lab 4 days ago using the SC, i`m already rank: Platinum I i have been using the SC non-stop for 1½ year now, for desktop and games, from CoD/BF to WoW/GW2. gyro and the right controllers are competitive! even against the "perfect" kb/m combo i dont believe kb/m to be the ultimate, but just the most intuitive for most people, and sadly most people dont care enough to really try something else.

[@ItsBoyRed]

steamcommunity.com/games/714010/announcements/detail/1682540619726231969 Diagram over all the ranks, its from 2018 so i dont know how it still holds up, but as far as i know its the only real info about ranks for now.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Nice work! I'm keen to see more and more people spend a lot of time with gyro aiming, and then we'll have a much better idea how things compare. But even as is, I'm confident it's good enough to replace thumbstick + aim-assist as the default on consoles.

[@ItsBoyRed]

@@mwwwww648 - wrong.

[@denisn8336]

@@ItsBoyRed is gyro that good?

[@ItsBoyRed]

@@denisn8336 yup

[@kulot1272]

I'd actually prefer using Gyro on consoles if I ever try playing FPS games in consoles. I play a lot of mobile games that has Gyro aiming in it such as Apex Legends Mobile and PUBG Mobile and I must say it's actually fun and helpful!

[@michaelcamacho3717]

Same here, playing CoDM and other mobile shooters usually with aim assist off but gyro enabled.

[@Ramishhh]

As someone who has played gyro both on mobile and ps5, gyro on mobile is a lil different than gyro on controller, not that much of a difference but yeah its a lil weird

[@glenncolina4353]

Got here because I'm looking for PC games that implement motion aiming. I really hope what Nintendo did with BotW becomes the norm for all platforms, including PC

[@elman1610]

You can use motion aiming on any PC game by setting up your controls on Steam's controller settings. You basically just have to bind your mouse or right stick to the controller's gyro and then bind a button (usually the "aim gun" button) to enable the gyro. I do this all the time with a Switch Pro Controller. Even if it's not a Steam game, you can launch it through Steam and it'll work the same way.

[@glenncolina4353]

@@elman1610 Sounds interesting. I'll look into this. Meanwhile I've been using JSM and it works like a charm

[@IceBreak23]

@@glenncolina4353 you can use as Desktop controller on steam, also works, you are like emulating mouse + keyboard on controllers, it feels weird first time but works pretty well and the good part is... no more pain in the wrists lmao

[@Creshex8]

Hi @Jibb Smart, After using gyro for a few years, I’d claim that even if a mouse might have a slight speed advantage with experienced users, the gyro seems considerably more precise at similar sensitivities. If the sizes of the balls were set to smaller and smaller, I think eventually the performance of a gyro would outperform a mouse.

[@CapyBardo]

I tested your program today and noticed a great reduce in the input lag, compared to steam controller configurator. You do a awesome job man! And thanks to introduce me to osu! Hahahaha

[@JibbSmartGD]

I'm so glad you like it! Thank you! :D About the lag with Steam -- if smoothing isn't already turned off, that might be the cause of your input lag there

[@xd-qi6ry]

I’ve been using gyro on pub g m for over 2 years now and it was pretty hard to get used to and very different because you prefer gyro over every other sensitivity but once you get used to it and good with it i really think you can become better than a mouse and keyboard player and really push the boundaries as when you combine the two your aim is always precise you will always hit headshots and lock on target tracking is 10000000x’s easier and there will virtually be bo recoil because when you are aiming with gyro you pull down with your finger inputs and as a result lowering vertical recoil while keeping a steady spread on target with the gyro controlling all angles. It’s definitely not for everyone and until you see results which might not be as fast as you’d like you most likely would have already gone back to your normal inputs. I’d sy the main successor of gyro is being able to hit very small targets at higher speeds as larger targets in most cases will either force you to turn too much causing you to increase your sens which will make you inconsistent in areas you want gyro to be used.

[@daddykarlmarx6183]

I'm sure you could get similar results to mouse with gyro with enough practice, I think gyro is the future of controller gaming but I still rarely use it just because it's kinda confusing for me to use both the stick and the entire controller to aim

[@RealInnerG]

You think he hasn't practiced? 😂

[@BakedKipling]

I picked up Splatoon 2 and thought that gyro was just a gimmick and quickly realised it was not. The Splatoon 2 players to this day are insane and truly a great example of skill that can be achieved with gyro aim

[@ThomasDailey]

I've done this comparison myself and scored much higher with Gyro than I did with Thumbstick. I can't say for sure that the same would be true for everyone, but at the very least I can say that Gyro makes aiming easier over Thumbstick for some people (like myself). And actually my Gryo scores were very close to my Mouse scores although to be fair I didn't try it very many times with the Mouse.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Yeah, I did the comparison without thumbstick a couple weeks prior, and Spidershot worked a bit differently -- targets could be much smaller, but they'd stick around a little longer. When accuracy was more important, my gyro score was much closer to my mouse score. I might have to try other modes to compare.

[@CapsuleCorpDude]

I just picked up a steam controller man they have gotten super expensive as of late! Very excited to try the Gyro out for the first time.

[@arabianchad4578]

Underrated Channel 😞💔

[@timbomb374]

I find gyro to be more intuitive then mouse to aim but it dose have a down side of not being able to mitigate hand shake like a mouse. Though combined with down barrel sights it can be allot easier to manage. I think it dose great when used in tandem with a stick so you use the stick to get close to the target then do the more precise movements with the gyro

[@JibbSmartGD]

I agree. It's tough to rely on just the gyro, but in combination with a stick it does some cool stuff. If you haven't seen flick stick yet, it features in a few of the other videos on this channel.

[@rtd4413]

If you Have played or watch mobile games such as Pubg or Codm You'll see the full potential of gyro and thumb ish,,why i say thumb ish because mobile touch screen is way faster than Joysticks and that with gyro is as fast if not faster and more precise than mouse only downside is finding a hand placement that doesn't affect blood flow in hands

[@eldiegoetc9257]

This is what I use to show why you should use motion controls in splatoon

[@timbomb374]

Using gyro feels so good, i'm probably still better at mouse than gyro but i like the way it feels even more and i could imagine people becoming really good at it if they had even half as much practice with it as they do with a mouse

[@JibbSmartGD]

Yeah, it's a great balance of the comfort of a controller with somewhat mouse-like precision. I can't wait to see what people can do with it given more time!

[@waynelok6831]

Splatoon and splatoon 2 should be an example on how to make gyro controls good Use analog for big movements Gyro for small movements No aim assist needed because gyro lets you move your aim better than sticks

[@JibbSmartGD]

Splatoon 2 is so much fun, but there's plenty of room for improvement on the gyro aiming :)

[@jibaycay]

Your video is clear and nice made, I'm linking it almost everytime I discuss about gyro aiming (I wish so much this feature in Cyberpunk 2077 😅).

[@notmoriarty2541]

What brought me to this video was your gyro / flick stick video on doom

[@GamingDreamer]

Remember that GYRO is a new thing while you playing with MOUSE for years now, same as any FPS player who used Thumbstick for years and now want to use mouse

[@JibbSmartGD]

For sure. Another thing is that I carefully tuned my thumbstick controls for this specific scenario. Real games have targets more spread out and much further away.

[@GamingDreamer]

@Bogodo on console it the best option and for someone like me who hate WASD for movement and can make it PC used both , this is better option too and even so, if Mouse is better for you someone my like Gyro more than mouse, so what we take the option away, it just small click to pick what you like

[@MGMan37]

@Bogodo I dont think the point of this video is to say that mouse is always superior, but rather that gyro gets you pretty damn close vs. traditional console stick aiming

[@Msf1011]

@@MGMan37 Exactly, we need a way to comfortably be able to aim with a controller since it's a more comfortable and intuitive device to use for gaming, and gyro makes that incredibly viable. Over the past few days I've committed myself to mastering gyro aim and I can already see that games like Wildlands, Zombie Army Trilogy and RE4 are INCREDIBLY fun and smooth to play with a controller now that I can aim so well. Mouse and keyboard will obviously still be superior, and in some more serious PvP competitive multiplayer shooters like CoD or Insurgency Sandstorm it is undoubtedly the way to go. But in many other games where you need to aim accurately, gyro aim makes playing on a controller far better, to the point where I'd say I'm comfortable using it over mouse and keyboard.

[@teneesh3376]

So the moral of the story is that gyro is better then stick, but not as good as mouse. Still, an input for most games, I would use a controller with gyro aiming for shooting. It is a good all round controller. Now if only Microsoft will listen and PUT A GYROSCOPE IN THE XBOX SERIES X CONTROLLER. Also adding gyrp aiming to vanquish on the ps4

[@JibbSmartGD]

I think that's about the size of it. Come on, Microsoft!

[@teneesh3376]

@Andrew Spliffilin nuts I know. Would still love for more ps4 games have gyro and stick aiming in shooters. I still have hope that doom eternal on ps4 patches in gyro aiming

[@JibbSmartGD]

If you haven't seen it already, check out flick stick, which closes the gap even further: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eWavkIOuaMl5qqc

[@darlingtonvelandzie5750]

MY GOODNESSN MAN... YOURE AMMMMAAAAZZINNNGGG

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thanks :)

[@Autotrope]

Controller = comfort Mouse = accuracy Gyro aim = best combination that includes both? I would be interested to know where touchpad comes in, eg for steam devices that have a right touchpad

[@Wherezz]

Nerrel brought me here.

[@FatheredPuma81]

Really sucks that Microsoft couldn't be bothered adding Gyro to the Xbox One controller. Have to get a PS4 controller because I want to try out Gyro aiming (and in general need a controller to replace my Xbox S controller). Pretty sad that Gyro isn't the stable for console gaming but I guess it would result in the skill level being raised too high for people used to having an aimbot...

[@JOVAHK11N]

Obviously gyro aim is meant to be complimented with the thumbstick, if you want the best results a high sensitivity thumbstick to make quick turn and leave your pointer in the general area where you want to shoot and then use gyro which is fast and precise to aim accurately. I don't know why Play Station game don't implement it.

[@Msf1011]

I think because console gamers on PS4 and XB1 still have this social stigma against gyro aiming. They probably still think that it means flailing your arms around to aim a la Nintendo Wii era, while that's absolutely not the case anymore. That's why I really think Sony and other devs on the PS5 should finally kick the door down and implement gyro aim on all of the games where possible so that people will drop these prejudices they have against gyro aiming. Everything has a learning curve, and I'm confident they'll come to accept gyro aiming, since it's actually very intuitive and accurate.

[@ecinZtark]

@@Msf1011 i honestly couldn’t get through the right stick learning curve. I used to be good at unreal tournament with a mouse and decent at it with a gyro mouse on PS3. Haven’t played with on a PC since now I suck at all forms of input. I’ve been using gyro on fortnite the few times I play, but my settings aren’t the best for me.

[@Msf1011]

@@ecinZtark I totally get you actually, personally for me it also never seemed to get off the ground, but at some moments while I was using it in numerous shooters on PC I felt like the potential was there. That if I used it for a really long time, like maybe a year or something, that I could click with it in that time and be opened up to sublime accuracy that I would never have had with a stick. It's simply extremely demanding to ask of gamers who have gotten used to an input method for so long to accept a new type of input, let alone flick stick. With time though, it really could become fully accepted by all gamers. I mean, weird comparison, but in the 2010-2015's people were still quite displeased with DLC practices I believe and now it's not only become standard practice, but people have come to WANT DLC for their favorite games. Maybe the same can happen with gyro aim if they would ever try.

[@MoonSarito]

I really can't understand why it hasn't become standard yet, aiming using a motion sensor is much faster and more accurate than with analog, gyro helps a lot in FPS on consoles. I'm sad that even today there are very few games on PS4 or PS5 that use this (only Paladins and Days Gone come to mind), even games that have a Nintendo Switch version that offer gyro aiming like Fortnite and Doom Eternal don't have on PS4 for some reason.

[@hack_jammer]

Because the gyro hardware nintendo and sony uses hasn't been updated since 2006. I fixed that.

[@CinnamonOwO]

Not true though?

[@solo4o6]

Holy crap the deadzone is crazy on the thumbstick. Never seen a thumbstick move so far to aim 2 feet away

[@JibbSmartGD]

No matter what the deadzone is, it has to move far to move quickly. That's one of the problems with thumbsticks.

[@ratlinggull2223]

I discovered it while playing Dragon's Dogma on Steam. I'm surprised that there's not even a third party app on PS4 that supports the gyro, let alone devs actually implementing it in game.

[@jaye7679]

Try comparing a normal mouse with a vertical mouse (I use Logitech MX Vertical). The vertical mouse should be even more accurate because you can pivot/anchor on your palm bone instead of the wrist where the skin slides more. It took me over a month to properly get used to the vertical mouse though.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Interesting. I just happen to have a vertical mouse that helped me when I had a wrist injury from too much use of the traditional mouse. A lot of players pivot from the elbow rather than the wrist, but off the top of my head I'm not sure what I do.

[@Refreshment01]

Great stuff, thank you. im assuming you were using a traditional 2 handed controller for the Gyro aiming part? i point this out because motion aiming specially in the X axis works better in a split type controller such as the Wii Remote or Joycon controller because the motion in that axis is less restricted. Would be interesting to see how much the Gyro aiming part would change if you practiced in that setup.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thank you :) Yes, I'm using a 2-handed controller for gyro aiming -- the Switch Pro Controller. You can see it and everything I'm doing with it on the left side of the screen. Before I made this video, I was working on a comparison video between split Joy-Con, 2-handed controller, and mouse. I didn't include those here because, due to a bug at the time, the game mode had changed when I went to record thumbstick-only aiming, so I re-recorded gyro and mouse for this video. Single Joy-Con (held like a Wii Remote), while still probably much better than thumbstick aiming, was not anywhere near as good as 2-handed gyro aiming. You're right that there is more freedom of movement, but it doesn't make up for dramatically less stability. Players with much steadier hands might have different experiences to mine, but I've seen other players experiment with it and come to the same conclusion: 2-handed gyro aiming out-performs 1-handed. Your results might be different. If you wanna give it a go yourself, I'd love to hear how that goes!

[@Refreshment01]

@@JibbSmartGD For static targets @ a narrow angles like in this video 2 handed might be the way to go. But when you have moving targets @ wider angles the value of 1 handed increases, specially for leading targets in the horizontal axis. The thing with motion controls is that they are optimal when implemented in a split controller configuration, in a 2 handed configuration the potential is handicapped. 2 handed feels good when mostly limited to titling the controller for aiming vertically, but horizontal motion becomes quickly becomes awkward for wider movements. Also we should think beyond just aiming in shooting games, applications like UI/Interface navigation and alternate camera control methods benefit from a split configuration. Simply put the amount of available inputs at a given time and without unnecesary finger motions increases significantly, not to mention the motions are more natural. For example, something like having menu selections mapped to each hand independently in a game with vast menu options like an strategy game. Or having the option to lean the camera by rotating the left hand in a shooter.

[@JibbSmartGD]

I find that when I play 1-handed, I have to lower the sensitivity to get the stability and accuracy I need. This more than cancels out the wider angles I can move the controller 1-handed. You can get past this with acceleration (or sensitivity ramping) settings, or by using thumbstick aiming for the bigger turns -- whether playing 1-handed (or split) or 2-handed. Of course, thumbstick aiming is usually slow, so you can either crank up the sensitivity of the stick or use something like "flick stick" demonstrated in some of my videos (with DOOM, CS:GO, Quake, Halo, and others). Still, I do find that sometimes I'm chasing a moving target and find myself having to turn uncomfortably. I haven't yet found 1-handed settings that make this happen less often without sacrificing too much accuracy. Another solution is to have a button for inverting gyro so you can continue big turns. It takes getting used to, but it has lots of potential (this is demonstrated in my JoyShockMapper 1.4 update video). Again, you might do better 1-handed, but it is certainly not universally true that 1-handed out-performs 2-handed. I agree we should think beyond just aiming in shooting games. I have a video playing the rhythm game Osu, and other non-shooters like Age of Empires 2, Crayon Physics, and Cities Skylines feature in my JoySockMapper 1.4 video, JoyShockMapper 1.3, and videos on GyroWiki, respectively. I do want to explore more of the possibilities with split controllers. It's harder to test in real games that don't allow so many analog inputs at once, but when I have the time, I'm experimenting with prototypes that aren't ready to feature here yet.

[@docteurcontroller]

​@@JibbSmartGD ​Your conversation is very interesting and I have trouble finding it in the Steam Controller community. I've also given a lot of thought to the question of splitted controllers and I've also come to think that it would make sense for them to work better than two handed controllers. If I knew how to draw and manage electronics, I probably would have made at least two splitted controllers prototypes by now. I suggest you go and see my little movie about the Steam Controller, which I made two years ago now. Because I'm talking about this subject in its second part. In the last third of this second part more exactly. On the main page of my channel, you'll see this 2 parts-video directly, but in French version. But I subtitled it in English more recently to make it more accessible. It's called "What's Steam Controller ? And why use it ? To make a long story short, I would say that Estregan must be right, and somehow Gyro Aiming, you prove him right in this video. The mouse and keyboard are already splitted controllers for video games and the mouse is the most precise controller we have right now, and it's only held in one hand. Of course there's the table that stabilizes the aiming with the mouse, but that doesn't change the fact that small objects are made to be held with one hand and offer a much better range of motion this way than when they're held by two. And one more time, the mouse and every small object of the every day life made us remember that. Just imagine yourself turning off your tv by aiming it with a two handed controller instead aiming it with a one handed remote...? And the funny thing is that the mouse is a controller that's not made for video games in the first place. But that's the one that allows us to play them more precisely. It's still quite an ironic twist of fate. I won't dwell too much on it for now, but I'm glad I came across this channel and the two of you. Have a good day.

[@JibbSmartGD]

@@docteurcontroller Thanks for joining in! I think even more than the mouse portion of the video "proves" one-handed would be better, my experience actually testing and comparing one-handed "proves" otherwise. I was originally making a video that compared one-handed with two-handed, and completed the "experiment" which showed a big gap in accuracy. In the end I decided gyro vs traditional thumbstick-only aiming was a more important video to make. Now, I don't think my experiment proved anything once and for all. I'm just saying that the mouse performance doesn't prove anything about aiming one-handed without the support of a mousepad. Aiming a remote (which requires no precision whatsover) is different to aiming a gun (which is much more precise with two hands), and of course both of those are different from aiming a mouse and aiming a controller. A one-handed controller definitely, without question, offers more freedom of movement. A two-handed controller definitely, without question, offers more stability. And we can always trade one for the other by increasing or decreasing sensitivity. For me, for the same stability (by changing the sensitivity), I have better in-game range of movement with a two-handed controller. It's cool to see you're exploring interesting uses of controllers. I'm glad you joined the discussion! I haven't had the time to watch your video yet, but hopefully I will soon :)

[@Vulcanfaux]

I hope one day the other two consoles will follow Nintendo and give the gyro aiming option in all games that can use it. Yall in PC can already use ot if yall want. But its ps4 and xbox players that still seem somewhat resistant. Hope you and other making similar videos talking about this stuff will slowly convince those still anti gyro to actually give it a shot. For me gyro is the biggest thing I want now that cross play seems to be achieved.

[@Vinnay94]

Why would people be so resistant towards it? It literally makes you a better player.

[@cj_suaverino]

I used it for the first time on the switch when I got it and it was so amazing that now if I’m playing an FPS on PC it HAS TO be enabled. I love that I can just force any game to use gyroscopic aiming along with the thumb stick. Thanks Valve. It’s weird, Xbox controllers don’t have the capability but PS4 controllers do. How come PS4 games never use it Or the touch pad? Why did Sony cram so much stuff into the duelshock 4 but not use a lot of it?

[@nebuluna78]

Agreed, I struggle trying to play splatoon without gyro

[@Vulcanfaux]

@@cj_suaverino I think only 2 games use the gyro on the ps4, gravity rush 1 and 2. As for the touch pad, well outside of a few launch titles like kill zone, you are right, I have not seen any other game use it. Its a shame too cuz horizon zero dawn could have used it in the exact same way as breath of the wild.

[@JibbSmartGD]

I hear Days Gone uses it, too

[@Stealthydoughnut]

It would be interesting to see the comparison if you played games as much with gyro as with keyboard and mouse.

[@JibbSmartGD]

I think so, too. I play games almost exclusively with gyro now, but I don't have time to play much at all, and it's hard to compete with many more years experience with keyboard and mouse

[@WhisperWorksGaming]

1. I'm found this video because I'm writing an editorial piece on gyro controls. 2. I've been using gyro controls on Switch for the past few years, and have found it difficult to go back to traditional analog stuck controls. I plan to go through a few more videos that you have posted to see what concessions you've made while adapting to gyros.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Great! Feel free to reach out if you have any questions. My DMs are open on Twitter.

[@allahbless2278]

What are good games to try Gyro on,on the switch?

[@tinymosesofficial]

@@allahbless2278 Splatoon 2 is a most. It's hectic and made for using gyro controls. I also recommend trying Fortnite on the Switch. Even if you don't get into the main game too much, you can go into Creative and make your own or try other people's training maps which can help with getting used to aiming and moving in a 3D environment using gyro. There is also Doom, but I haven't played it myself. Just thought I'd mention it in case you want to try it out.

[@WhisperWorksGaming]

@@allahbless2278 In my opinion, Panic Button games have the best gyroscopic support - Wolfenstein, Doom, Warframe, etc. I've continued to play Warframe on and off since launch, which that is my litmus for solid motion controls. The last motion control enabled game I played was Overwatch, which is a surprisingly enjoyable experience, but the community has dropped dramatically since launch. Paladins is also a fun game, which I can't go back to Xbox after playing the Switch version.

[@littlehelix]

🙌🏼 ...gyro aiming is not only more precise than stick aiming, it also just feels way more natural. Don't understand why they didn't implement it in more games on playstation, it seems like such an obvious thing. Hope they will implement it in more games on the ps5. Also Last of Us 2 got a gyro update, it made the game really better for me.

[@Pedro_Le_Chef]

Horizon Forbidden West just released and it has gyro aiming settings for both the ps4 and ps5. Couldn't be more happier. Wish rdr2 had a gyro option for consoles as the tumbstick aiming is rockstar's worst in that game.

[@unggoyfarmer]

Great video! I tried out Aim Lab after watching this video and tried the tests out myself. Being predominantly a controller player, the setting options for the controller are pretty trash not gonna lie. even when dialing the settings and all, you cant eliminate deadzones which you can do in some xbox games like Halo MCC (to the point where there's stick drift in all directions), and you also cant really get the sensitivity that responsive/fast. I understand this is targeted towards mouse and keyboard and you have to adjust the mouse settings for the controller but I'm hoping they add true controller support in the future. I feel like if they at least let you do true 0% deadzones you'd have a huge bump in your accuracy.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thanks for the feedback! I actually didn't use Aim Lab's controller settings. I did it with the same program I used for gyro aiming. It gives me complete control over deadzones, response curve, acceleration, etc. Deadzones seem to be a big obstacle to precise stick play, hey? I'm exploring the idea of removing deadzones and disabling aim assist as a way to let expert players get more out of controllers without the game offering them unfair help, while new players can play with big deadzones and aim assist to make it easier to pick up for the first time.

[@unggoyfarmer]

@@JibbSmartGD Honestly if they can completely remove deadzones in software and make actual quality analogue sticks on an elite controller without a physical deadzone that would be huge for the competitive controller gaming scene. Would love to see Gyro aiming incorporated into future elite controllers too.

[@Vinnay94]

The main reason joystick aiming is not precise is you can't stop the input right away. Now on Steam Big Picture Mode you can convert the Right Stick to give out Mouse Inputs, preferably you will wanna use Mouse Region and set a large radius. What this will do is turn your Joystick into a Track Ball except the 'Track Ball' doesn't freely spin so your Look/Aiming will be restricted within a Radius of Mouse Input, but wait, you can Bind Buttons/Keys to toggle between custom inputs so what you could do is Bind say L2 (Hold Aim) to turn Mouse Input on, then when you stop aiming, back to normal Joystick aiming.

[@kadebass6187]

It’s interesting seeing the gameplay with gyro then going to mouse because they look essentially the same but it just seems you’re more used to mouse so it appears merely sped up by like 1.25-1.5x which with analog sticks it looks nothing like either of them

[@cmnweb]

i remember being very accurate with the wiimote

[@allahbless2278]

Not the same,new one are alot more accurate

[@FatheredPuma81]

I don't. Input was way too sensitive and could just lose you at any point.

[@Fire-in-the-sky]

@@allahbless2278 nah, wii notes are still more accurate than gyro controllers

[@allahbless2278]

@@Fire-in-the-sky wii mote plus/switch nunchuks sure. Regular ones nah

[@Fire-in-the-sky]

@@allahbless2278 I never tried regular ones but the motion plus ones are much better than my steam controller

[@auringtail]

Analog sticks is the past, gyro is the future.

[@Khorvalar]

Found this through Nerrel's steam controller video!

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thanks for letting me know :)

[@juancelzeg.mu.3555]

Una comparativa absolutamente genial !!! Me informó mucho :D

[@ZzVinniezZ]

technically speaking...gyro aiming is the way for console to adapt instead of thumb control as it is now

[@Sid271]

Dude if people started playing cod or pubg (pc version) with gyro everyone will become shroud

[@elmerhouston5915]

I wish I could get used to gyro aiming.. anyone have any tips? It just feels so weird to aim w it.. I want to master it

[@palpee8820]

Turn off mouse smoothing and use it in games not made with controllers in mind (don’t play games with aim assist) to get you out of your comfort zone. What I found was playing the Stalker SoC was just perfect with gyro aim at 49% sensitivity on a ps5 or ps4 controller, using gyro for precision and the right joy stick for quick 180’s was great.

[@TheNinjaCrash]

It may not be easy to set up, but I'd like to see how the Wii's IR pointer would fair in this test.

[@poulpysplash1408]

Thank you for answering me, hoping that a gyroscope training software for Steam controllers players will see the light of day, and that you and your friends and family will be well.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thank you very much :) You and yours, too

[@TheLiasas]

what controller were you using for this? since after the vanilla xbox ive never used a controller for games again, but now im feeling like trying them back and would like both an assymetrical design (as the xbox's) but gyro seems like a must too since I do appreciate being accurate... and since the model thingy that shows your controller input is assymetrical with gyro... :P

[@JibbSmartGD]

For this I was using the Switch Pro Controller :) It's pretty good, but it might feel a bit stuttery if you play at high framerates on a high refresh rate monitor (70Hz or higher). Also its triggers aren't analog. But if you don't mind those it's a good controller. Another way is to use an Xbox One controller with a Brook X One Adapter, but that becomes an expensive combo

[@TheLiasas]

@@JibbSmartGD tyyyy so much for the reply. hmm I would like to be able to play at 144hz snappily + have analogs for the tangential speed control. also would like to not have to spend that much as it may end up not being my cup of tea... I checked the X one adapter you mentioned, If thats the veeeeeeery best option I could see myself going for it, tho looking at its features I worry about: does it keep working after the internal batt inevitably gives up the ghost? ive looked around for other options, and this one is catching my eye, but Im worried about the mention of how it connects to pc only via bluetooth, like isnt the bt polling rate too slow for this purpose? www.amazon.com/Controller-PS4-Wireless-Playstation-Vibration/dp/B07QR7ND4X/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=asymmetrical+ps4+controller&qid=1603609703&sr=8-2

[@TheLiasas]

aaactually nvm. I just rechecked that and it seems it doesnt has a gyro (or isnt mentioned) guess i was too sleepy when I saw it yesterday

[@JibbSmartGD]

Some third party controllers don't work with JoyShockMapper, which is what I use, so I can't vouch for them. The gyro gaming discord has lots of users of different controllers who can give recommendations, though

[@TamarinPamarin]

There needs to be triple A console multiplayer game with gyro option and no aim assistant. After that everyone will switch to gyro.

[@oswaldotorre6047]

Ps5 and Nintendo and Steam must push harder devolpers to use it, then MS will be obligated to work it

[@KinkajouJL]

now it's up to the wiimote pointer

[@JibbSmartGD]

Yeah, if I had one I'd love to see how it compares

[@KevinGeneFeldman]

One of the big problem gyro has is resetting to center, so if gyro also controls camera rotation, you have to rotate the controller back to center and try to aim in a deadzone that moves if you aim too far to either direction. Your wrists get all jumbled up in positions it cant move any further in and resetting to zero pulls the aim away from what you were aiming at.

[@JibbSmartGD]

This is not as big a problem as you might think. Mouse has basically the same problem, and all you have to do is learn to lift the mouse off the mousepad and reposition it. It's the same with gyro -- with a button to disable it, you can reposition whenever you want.

[@KevinGeneFeldman]

@@JibbSmartGD I think I'll never get into it until they include sensors that always keep it calibrated for angle being center. The Wii U actually had this, so it wouldn't lose its vertical orientation, though it did lose its horizontal orientation. I find myself having the controller pointing up while looking down. I am interested in seeing changes because I hate trying to aim with dual analogue.

[@JibbSmartGD]

There are disadvantages to absolute aiming like that -- you still need to rely on sticks for turning the camera fully or reaching your full vertical range. I mean, there are ways around that, but they either sacrifice responsiveness or precision

[@oswaldotorre6047]

Even the cheapest mouse over performs my Xbox elite 2 precision... Luckily I have switch pro controller and I am about the same performance than mouse

[@r57zone]

Hi, I'm also trying to promote the idea of using a gyro in games. I made the NexInput standard on github, with gyro support. If you are suddenly interested in participating, it would be great.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Hey, I had a look, and that's really cool. XInput has been the standard for so long, and it makes sense since Microsoft makes both the Xbox and Windows, but we need a more modern standard!

[@stevevee8332]

This looks cool, Imight try it out

[@nerdshadow3272]

My eyes could barely even keep up with your gyro and mouse gameplay. Did you speed the recording up at all to make the video shorter, or was that real-time?

[@JibbSmartGD]

That's real-time :)

[@nerdshadow3272]

@@JibbSmartGD I'm in awe at your skills!!!

[@JibbSmartGD]

Thanks very much! Practice helps, but I've got a lot of improving to do

[@MrHerky61]

This will be a long one; I’ve been working on my gyro. Hi, Thankyou so much for flick stick and your great tutorials, I’ve been enjoying gyro aim quite a bit but I have problem I cant solve. I’m afraid it’s just a permanent weakness of gyro aim. When I pull the trigger (or press the bumper) I bump my aim off target slightly. This is horrible for semi auto weapons that require repeated tapping. And anticipating the shot usually results in worse results. I’ve tried maximizing the minimum movement threshold which reduces but not solves the problem and also makes the movements feel a bit delayed, I’ve tried dampening the gyro on trigger pull which does not solve the problem as the shaking happens both on pull and on release, I’ve got decent trigger control (I’m also a real shooter and that helps, and firmly gripping the control with counteracting forces has honestly been the biggest help which is also a real shooter thing) but it feels a little excessive to rely on personal mental and physical exertion on par with my 1 MOA 100 yard shot groupings to play a video game. You make trigger control seem so easy and idk what it is. I currently have my gyro setup through steam big picture mode.

[@MrHerky61]

Oh, and I currently use my bumpers as my triggers because a shorter crisper trigger is better (also a real gun fact but I think we all knew that one from gyro too)

[@JibbSmartGD]

Hi! I appreciate the amount of practice required to hold a gun steady and not pull your aim off when firing. This is something I've never been very good at. With gyro, it also takes practice, but perhaps the skills don't transfer, since a controller is much lighter, players don't need to brace against recoil, and the buttons/triggers are much lighter. I'm afraid I have no advice to offer here, but my personal experience that I don't have particularly steady hands, and keeping the controller steady while firing was something I had to be very conscious of when I first started. But it got better over time, and now I don't really think about it. I don't really mind that players need to train to get good at this kind of thing -- it's the same (and typically worse!) with traditional stick controls. It probably helps that I play with a relatively low sensitivity (I play with 1-2, while a lot of better players player with 3-4, and some as high as 6). But I don't think I'll ever be able to play at that level with that high sensitivity. How long have you been playing with gyro controls?

[@CandarianGaming]

Always make sure you hold the controller resting in your lap to hold it in place and only ever use the bumpers for aim and shoot. For semi auto weapons/pistols, set up the right trigger for rapid fire in steam. So you just hold the trigger and it just keeps firing as fast as you set it. Then whatever was suppose to be on the right trigger just assign it to the touchpad for example

[@maxtoke5557]

I play overwatch on the steam controller and you would not believe the kind of shit I get if i mention it to my team. I just got off a game today after this dude furiously rejected gyros and the steam controller in general for any kind of FPS. Says it looks weird and stupid. He went off about how scuff controllers are the best way to play competitive shooters, and that analogue sticks are better than gryo. Its so hard to get through to these people that don't like to give new things a fair go. I have a lot of ligament problems, RSI, Carpal Tunnel, you know, the usual wrist issues that exacerbate when you're gaming for a long time. None of that is an issue with the SC. I can play for weeks straight without any pain or fatigue in my wrists. These new schemes should really be a more readily available option for console gamers. I personally believe that when playing a game, your input should be as close to 1:1 as you can get it without actually jacking your brain in like its the matrix. SC gets closer than anything I've used otherwise to that dream. Really feels like an extension of my body after so many years using it!

[@JibbSmartGD]

Sorry to hear players give you such a hard time :( I'm hopeful players will be more open in future when games start providing the option natively. And I'm hopeful that developers will see how important gyro aiming is as an accessibility option. We've just gotta keep telling them!

[@ClarenceSampang]

Resident Evil 5 on the Switch with gyro made me realize how great it is.

[@Waddlejpg]

The wii's infered aiming was the best

[@JibbSmartGD]

It's really good for when you don't have to turn the camera. All they needed was a decent thumbstick on the Wiimote to use at the same time to turn the camera and it would've changed console gaming forever.

[@reachthroughreality]

The absolute worst part about gyro aiming is that I use my PS4 controller to do it on PC but can't do it on the PS4, and you have to use JSM to even do that. lol wut? Why isn't it standard on PS4 and PC? Why is the Switch the only one that uses it? The worst console has the best control? (I mean, it's the best console, but it's a potato)

[@KevinGeneFeldman]

I've never played any kind of gyro aiming that didn't feel like I was dragging a delayed cursor across the screen. That and the fact that I still had to control continuous camera movement with another disjointed method at the same time made it too frustrating. Like splatoon. I hate dual analogue for aiming, all I can stand to do is mouse and VR

[@JibbSmartGD]

The gyro controls here are tighter and more precise than Splatoon, even though it's the same controller :)

[@Waddlejpg]

The wii's infered is the best

[@Bumble-d1e]

Please redo this video with even better settings for gyro mouse and thumbstick ! Thankyou

[@aus.RE7]

Everybody slept on WII aiming tbh

[@JibbSmartGD]

It's true. I wish the Wiimote had a stick on it. Would've been the best of all worlds

[@rn3561]

bruh my high score for this task went from avg of 30k to 50k with 93% accuracy and 340ms reaction time in literally 2 weeks of using this trainer. aim lab is rly good if u wanna improve on mnk.

[@NicolasSilvaVasault]

nintendo thumbstick are so limited even compared to ps3/xbox360/ps4/xboxone so the gyro IS A MUST

[@JibbSmartGD]

That's true of Joy-Cons, but even the best controller thumbsticks are pretty bad for precise aiming, so I'd argue that gyro is a must on any platform

[@NicolasSilvaVasault]

@@JibbSmartGD i don't feel it that way, at least on ps4, but sure gyro should be mandatory for every console that supports it

[@saland705]

Agreed. I used the wiiu pro controller for splatoon but the sticks suck for anything other than basic camera controls, so I had to change to gyro. If switch controller is as bad, this guy did really well.

[@Rockyroad321]

Man Xbox really fucked up with the series x for not adding gyro

[@Pyroteq]

This is very cool, however unfortunately it's usless to use this information for actual games... Most FPS with controller support have absurd levels of autoaim which means even god tier Quake players using a mouse will get killed by Timmy-no-thumbs with their autoaim in modern shooters.

[@savibb9830]

I think its useful in other ways though as it allows me to hit the face buttons while aiming which is useful in pretty much every game. This is why claw grip got so popular although its not ergonomic and healthy for your hands people were doing it so they can hit the face buttons to keep their thumb on the stick to look around.

[@NGAMAKANUI]

Gyro controls are awesome. You just need to position your seating first

[@thetraveler2224]

But if your hands shake then gyro sucks.

[@notturok7841]

That gyro is giving me some duck hunt vibes

[@drewzi2044]

Hi, I was looking for a demonstration of motion controls on Borderlands and found your video. Gyro seems to be unfairly malined. I bought bioshock for switch and I hated the controls, thinking they should now implement gyro, but ken levine thinks they are gimmicky. Oh well

[@jmp01a24]

Gyro seems ok when target are pretty close and not to far distance between each target, but once you get out in the edges I notice your hit ratio goes down by 50%.

[@JibbSmartGD]

50%? I didn't see that reflected in the numbers at the end, but if you're making a calculation of your own about the outer-most targets, you may well be right. In games I'd normally take an extra fraction of a second to line up those edge shots rather than just going for the flick -- whether I'm using gyro or mouse -- but the targets here were disappearing too quickly for me to do that.

[@ACupOfAbsinthe]

Now do touch pad vs touch screen vs eye tracking

[@LiamYager]

I took the challenge and tried myself. After only maybe 3 attempts I was scoring better than my controller (controller player here btw). I still beat my score with a mouse but it was only a few thousand points better. Not like my controller attempt. Although aiming was better for snapping to the target I found I just could not for the life of me adapt to strafing and shooting at the same time. I will keep practicing but after nearly 3 hours in aimlab I could only just manage it. It makes me wonder if I used something like the razer hydra would I do better?

[@JibbSmartGD]

It certainly takes some practice. In a regular game, you'll probably be using stick and gyro at the same time (stick for big camera movements, gyro for aiming). But with a bit of time it becomes second nature :) I haven't used the Razer Hydra myself. I'm mostly interested in unlocking the potential of standard controllers that millions of players around the world already use

[@Z3t487]

My God Liam, you can't become a good aimer with only 3 hours of practice with the mouse in your life.

[@s_9089]

Mouse is very overpowered Would you say that the gyro is better than a normal controller?

[@JibbSmartGD]

Gyro is much much better than a normal controller, for sure. It's easy to forget how difficult traditional controllers can be for newcomers, and so (anecdotally) I see newcomers pick up gyro aiming much quicker than thumbstick-only aiming. They'll always be better with gyro than with thumbstick-only. Established players who have already learned to be comfortable with thumbstick-only have a big headstart. In a training environment like this I see them aim quicker and better with gyro than with thumbstick-only within 10 minutes, but it'll probably take more practice for their comfort level with gyro to overtake their comfort level without it. But of course some people have special needs. For some, their circumstances make thumbstick-only even worse, and gyro makes unplayable games playable. But for others, the compromise of thumbstick-only aiming is the only thing that works for them, so it's important to support both options.

[@s_9089]

@@JibbSmartGD Can gryo players keep up with mouse players ?!

[@JibbSmartGD]

For me, it's close enough that I can enjoy playing with skilled mouse players even when I'm using gyro. I'm still better with a mouse than with a gyro, but the difference isn't enough to take the fun out of playing with gyro. There are others who are far better with a gyro than I am, and I've been playing with mouse for far longer than I've been playing with gyro. Besides basic aiming, gyro opens up other options like "flick stick", which changes the way we use the right stick dramatically. It might improve the balance some more, but in my personal opinion mouse still probably has an edge.

[@sleepingturtle32]

Do you hold your controller in the air when using gyro?

[@JibbSmartGD]

Kinda. I usually have my forearms resting on my legs. As things get more intense I might lift it up more so I can move around more freely, but I'll usually recommend at least some support, like maybe supporting your elbows on your armrests. Some players have much steadier hands than I do and don't have to worry as much about that.

[@sleepingturtle32]

@@JibbSmartGD cool, I will try!

[@warriorking9885]

Splatoon has really popularized gyro hasn't it

[@JibbSmartGD]

Kinda :P It deserves a lot of credit, but I wish it had a bigger impact and influenced developers on other platforms, too

[@padrecharles_]

it makes me angry that people still don't consider gyro and think of it as a childish casual gimmick, they are so stubborn

[@Rap-o33]

My gyro on my sc usually falls within about 1k to 2k of my mouse score in spidershot.

[@JibbSmartGD]

Yeah, at the time there was a bug where spidershot would sometimes default to a variant with bigger targets that disappear quicker. Standard spidershot favours gyro more because it requires more precision. I should come back to it one day

[@KiLLJOY1056]

Gyro is one of the most fun ways to play any game

[@inceptional]

Rotating around the Z axis (depth) to aim seems like completely the wrong way for this to work. I think it should work by tilting the controller around the x and y axis, like if you were using one of those two-handed mounted machine guns that have a grip on either side.

[@JibbSmartGD]

If that's how you hold your controller, you can configure it to work that way. The two-handed mounted machine gun is a very helpful image to explain what you mean. But many (maybe most) people hold their controller so that the shoulder buttons are roughly facing the screen anyway, and that's how I show it here.

[@inceptional]

@@JibbSmartGD Ah, okay. Maybe you should have made that clearer by the way you showed/rendered the actual controller image on-screen. Because you have it shown flat on the screen visually (as though the screen were a window and the controller was pushed flat against is then being rotated like a steering wheel turning left and right), rather than it looking like it's being held flat as if it were placed on a table and in correct perspective relative to how you were in fact holding it. If it were being represented in a very clear and accurate way to how you were holding it in the real world, it should have the triggers pointing into the screen and us primarily seeing the bottom of the controller. I would have got better what you were doing and how it matched your on-screen turning and tilting with the controller displayed that way. But now I get what you were doing better after you've explained it.

[@JibbSmartGD]

The "correct perspective" wouldn't be very useful because the buttons are no longer shown clearly. I get the confusion, but I don't think there's a universal solution. Think of it like I have a top-down controller cam (like many people do). It represents very accurately how I'm holding and moving the controller. Since this video I always show a clip showing the virtual controller and my real life controller side-by-side to make it clearer. Thanks for your feedback :)

[@inceptional]

@@JibbSmartGD The shoulder buttons are already cut out from the image of the controller in your video anyway. So you could tilt the main controller to correctly reflect the angle you're actually holding it at, as if we were looking at it held out in front of us at the same angle as you, and the shoulder buttons would still be 100% visible. But do whatever you feel is best. I'm probably the only person who thinks about such things, and most other people will just be happy with whatever.

[@georgeaird4637]

I bet you could get alot closer if you had a few years of practice with gyro under your belt like you probably do with the other two input methods.

[@JibbSmartGD]

I think so too :)