Balance Changes: General and USF - COH3 Patch 1.8.0

[@TehGnomeh]

One thing I learned and love about Tightrope... this guy brings RECEIPTS

[@tirushone6446]

he cooks

[@civilprotection3114]

One thing people haven’t noticed for the last few patches is that Costal infantry can be transferred to become Panzergrenadiers or Jeagers.

[@akaobjects6536]

this is wild lol

[@janknutter1489]

WTF!!!!

[@SneakyFridge1]

You forgot about the most devastating USF nerf, the SSF commandos no longer have a throwing arm that can break masonry

[@TrueKaras]

I can't believe those megaminds at Relic "Sniper too good now?Nerf it" "But also nerf his main counter! Light Vehicles!" Even if there were only 2 problematic units (Wehr 8RAD and Chafee) Infantry Spam is ALREADY a problem We will soon end in a CoH2 situation

[@oscarbarrios]

It is ridiculous now, before at least we had some way of stopping blobberkommando blob but now is just bresa/gren spam into tiger. There is not mid game, i just tryuing to survive the blob (mgs? hahahahah the blob is so big they just walz by while one unit is supressed) then you realize you don't ahve the manpower to make the AT needed for the tiger. The onle thing you see ow in 3v3 and 4v4 is a hughe unstoppable blob that pushes forward until they pop the tiger. A big chunk of the lifetime of Coh2 was the same because lelic does love giving that lowkey support to the right-wingy power fantasy

[@pascalbourelier3463]

ridiculous take, interaction balance is MUCH improved now, it's gotten the game into a really nice flow where LVs are a decision and work out perfectly. Stop hating changes, CoH2 can't even be put in perspective to Coh3, the latter has a much stronger build diversity & every unit scale into late game super well. Greyhound is still amazing, chaffee too - it's just been brought down to the power output it should have for a cheap 50mm gun that has APC rounds. All in all, amazing patch! Panzer grens' rate of fire buff is the only thing that feels a bit too much in regards to combined arms. Have yet to experience it in a bad way though, it's only rifle weapons, not lmg, so it feels good, especially after opel blitz supply being nerfed by half.

[@SleepySoviet]

@@pascalbourelier3463 are the diverse builds in the room with us?

[@giogio6086]

​@@pascalbourelier3463 greyhound has 37mm, chaffee has the same gun as the sherman

[@bubbasbigblast8563]

I'm happy with most of the patch changes, but the Chaffee nerf is downright asinine: all the price of a Stug, except with zero late game potential. If the Motor Pool didn't hold the AT gun hostage, I'd never build it at all now. In fact, the USF changes really just make the current problems even worse: the Chaffee isn't worth buying, so it's more sensible to use ISC Rangers and Rent-a-Blob to contest the points while teching to Hellcats, or go Airborne to avoid needing a Motor Pool, and the Armored Battle Group is still going to have to blob Riflemen, just relying more on the Scott to survive while doing that until the Easy 8s come out.

[@CHEESENSPIEL]

I don't really buy that the Chaffee isn't worth it anymore. Maybe it's a bit overpriced for what it is, but the nerfs only really affect the lategame swarms of them you saw in team games and a single midgame Chaffee is still going to be an excellent mobile deterrent for other Axis LVs like the 8rad. Even lategame they're still useful as a cheap-ish dive for medtrucks and Wespes and stuff

[@wickedgunguys8144]

Agree. US is already weak v light vehicle rush. Almost impossible to get any sort of effect at out v a good player with team Africa . Haha

[@DerFuchsJr]

relic can thank tighrope for how much bugs and quirks he reveals with these patch videos

[@CharlesConover]

he was thanked in the deluxe edition artbook thingmajig

[@diego2817]

Fire dmg against buildings was over exaggerated, now it is OP

[@schmidbag]

thanks for the video tightrope!

[@AstonHodge]

The AA damage to planes are still out of scale. The Flackverling is very OP vs planes. They can change the shared plane cool down all they want but I’m not getting it still as even in 1v1 they can solo a plane before it fires. In 4v4 the planes die on the edge of the map 😂

[@zbigniew2628]

This one is done on purpose.... You have a recon plane + its HP upgrade to use it as a decoy or use other immortal planes. Without it you should try to make flak busy, before using planes. In team games planes should have just more HP, by using different values than in 1v1... But Relic can not do comples fixes, when they can not manage even simple ones.

[@zbigniew2628]

Btw, squads should take best positions by default! Why the hell we should micro manage it? Did they fix flamethrower guy not getting in a firing position in half trucks? And I hope to see controll and gamepaly improvements or at least some stuff from even COH2 (a cancel "stance" for" AT guns, so they are not following targets when they get out of range). Or something like a stance for CQC squads to close in to perfect range, when clicking on the enemy.... Squads with flamers already do it, so they should be able to trick squads to close to 10 range and follow. Not to mention double click retreat as an option in menu.... Vehicles not stopping when choosing target.... Units shooting at planes ONLY WHEN AA MODE IS ENGAGED. Being able to edit a command card order on every unit to fix ourself their placing. and many more....

[@ThijsB-se5ir]

thanks man

[@Lord-Andre]

Nice Video 🎉

[@wako388]

I really want to like the M3 75mm barrage, but the fact that it shares a cooldown with the vet 1 ability makes it a risk to use. I don't want to barrage a target and then, 30 seconds later, be caught with my pants down as I can't activate the 'target weakpoint' for another 15 seconds. At least the M3 vet for salvage can be used on the medical variant and guarantees fuel from vehicles that usually give none. I have had it bug out occassionally and the salvage crew just stand by the vehicle until I give the M3 a movement order, then it puts the ability on cooldown.

[@citygent101]

Shame they didn't nerf the M3 Grant

[@jayros4269]

It needs a health decrease.

[@davidliu7125]

Wow first to comment! Has been waiting for this video. USF is now officially the weakest faction after the patch… Motor Pool has been nerfed out of relevance and USF trying to play the support weapon game with the Axis usually won’t end well.. Tbh, I think the US needs the LVs just because how its tech structure is designed. Going WSC and directly into Tank Depot put USF player in a lot of disadvantage mid-game. Also, RIP Chaffee.

[@tightropegaming]

It kind of feels like motor pool now needs 1 more unit in it, even if it gets locked behind an extra side tech.

[@Raven5431]

With as bad of a position usf was left in coh2 I didn't even bother buying coh3.

[@misterchoc2893]

​@@Raven5431 Yeah most usf units in coh2 are useless especially in teamgames (no late game units and shity light veh). And again usf in coh3 dont have late game non doc arty options against mass team weapons except grayhound but now its nerfed.

[@Raven5431]

@@misterchoc2893 yah they did same thing in coh2 I remember nerfed the hell out of the greyhound then litteraly no one used it. Attached artillery call in to the utility car so you had no off map artillery to take out german on map lefh. Got rid of the bazooka on the m20 crew which you needed to be really really good at micro managment for. Took away stuart engin crit and gave it a temporary slow down. Even though you were lucky to even be able to pull it off to begin with due to any movement causing it to just not fire that's how janky it was. Most everything is locked behind commanders and you don't get extra vision easily like the other factions makes Jackson even harder to play then it already is because you know they will eventually get to the point of just rushing you as you reach pop cap and either lack anti infantry or tank can't really get enough of both. I'm sure you know most of it but anyway I played the Beta and first thing I experienced was how over powered the flame throwers were and how fast the tank guns moved and I'm like nah I can already see how this is going to go.

[@zbigniew2628]

They balance this game in a stupid way... They are making more and more units irrelevant, rather than making other useful...

[@gadsby]

Just curious Tightrope, has Relic ever offered you some form of employment? They would be silly to not have.

[@Spinffx]

He's done official videos for Relic's youtube channel (showing off some of the new battlegroups in the past) so at least some contract work has come his way.

[@gadsby]

@@Spinffx Well at least they have tipped the hat somewhat

[@tightropegaming]

No

[@zbigniew2628]

@@tightropegaming They should hire you or other player as a QA for gameplay. Thier QA is almost non existent.

[@gadsby]

@@zbigniew2628 Im a big fan of the Civ franchise as well, and Firaxis fly out their ambassadors like what Tightrope is to the COH franchise, do interviews with them and keep the community engaged and action their feedback. For example kzbin.info/www/bejne/nH-9YoaJlsiolZY

[@Robyn_Bank]

i hope they bring back the ability to destroy transport planes carrying troops, i don't care if you lost 400MP on a commando squad, its your problem to try dropping them directly into enemy frontlines/AA guns. you can easily counter that by droping the unit into the base completely safe, it would make suicidal frontline dropings an actual bad idea while making AA much more important to obtain, rather than only serving to shot down loiters and slow pass planes.

[@buivietdungtran3065]

L6 cheese is back. Rip 1v1 and teamgame 😂

[@andypandy2848]

you are right . just played a game as brits and had 4 l6 with flames in my base on 10 mins. wiped everything including 2 at guns. do relic test anything?

[@zbigniew2628]

@@andypandy2848 They for sure can not do test or they are not doing them. How you can miss sooo clear things like it? Imagine 4xDAK in team games, where 2 of them call in 2x 2 L6 = 8 of them, which later dive base and kill your base in one burst or when they flank whole battlefield and wipe stuff.

[@strategist6962]

I feel like the greyhound and chaffee are only strong in 1v1, and mostly just with the now nerfed (twice) armored BG. I already pretty much never use them in team games. Huge liability. And now with the 75mm being really good why would you ever go chaffee? Motor pool definitely needs a buff, and I think having to pay 120 munitions to make your greyhound perform as well as an 8rad is absurd. I also think generally they could have started with a 5 fuel increase on most of these units instead of 10, regardless of faction.

[@theorobinmeyer]

That L6 flame that can be out in less than 5 minutes destroying tank depot is gonna be a huge exploit problem. Brace for hotfixes.

[@fabianbreijer2792]

Not really much more of a problem than engineers riding into bases and satchel bombing axis buildings.

[@theorobinmeyer]

@@fabianbreijer2792 nope. Did you know there are machine guns nest in front of bases?

[@leevin7546]

@@theorobinmeyerThey come in half tracks

[@theorobinmeyer]

@@leevin7546 there is so many ways to counter this I don’t even know where to begin. Contrary to the double flame L6.

[@leevin7546]

@@theorobinmeyer I agree, but since the other dude brought it up

[@jayros4269]

I just started playing again after a while. I really dislike the TTK changes. I feel like there's no margin of error anymore for handling infantry. And blobs are way worse now.

[@zbigniew2628]

Welcome to Relic indecesive design or they just outof people who had vision for it.

[@CanDooBU]

And for us console players you should mention when the updates are comming if you know anything about it.

[@tightropegaming]

Console version got abandoned like 6+ months ago

[@zbigniew2628]

6x L6 are going to kill buildings in one burst, it is goign to bring only more frustration in team games and relic probably never tested it vs base buidings. I got so fed up with their mindless changes and QA, that I got toxic, or at least to soft speaking enough to be handled by them. The same with Pgren buff + bike CA, at the same time as vehicle timing nerfs.... No risk of vehicle = more inf or early upgrade and more overextensions without punishment. They killed fancy DAK and dance of vehicles, it is going be inf base now + bloobs even more. Not to mention snipers being even more frustrating and they helped to solve it only for UKF... Oh and this recovery truck one shooted while recovering.... Peak QA from Relic, and John got angry when I told mean stuff about people who are resposible for QA.... Maybe he does it himself + others? IF he is to lazy to use hotkeys in showcases, then maybe he is to lazy to do effective procedures for testing? Yeah, it is BS, hotkeys talk from me, but I am just angry about their lack of commitment to do their best. 3 players can do better QA in days, than Relic in months, not to mention 1 player can find obvious wrong things in hours, but probably not all of it. I have no hopes for meaningful control and gameplay improvements, with the 1.90 update. They just can't handle it. You can find gameplay and controll improvements topic on their discord / forums. I hope Relic is going to release their IPs and tools to someone else, who cares about good management and have good focus on priorities. Sorry Tightrope, I cannot pretend longer, than it is rain... it is a piss.

[@catb5726]

What were you doing while dak was stacking 6 L6s?

[@zbigniew2628]

@@catb5726 I am giving an example of future possible coordinations... In team games you need only 3 players to do one call in each, but even in 1v1 it may be doable with tech skip. The first wave should wipe at least one squad and take over map.

[@catb5726]

@@zbigniew2628 Your assumptions are extreme and unrealistic UKF can use Humber, USF can use Bazooka Squad or 75mm HT. If DAK piled up 6 L6s, flame upgraded them, and let them take over the map, that's a skill issue. It's so much easier to deal with than the disgusting M8 spam that USF used to do, so what's the problem?

[@zbigniew2628]

@@catb5726 You still do not understand.... L6 are acumulating while you keep doing dmg. 4x is enough to wipe stuff like crazy and kill bases. Even 2 are enough without enemy AT + grenades at the same time. You go 2-3 Pgrens, bike. maybe Agren and then L6 +call in kfz250. I was doing it vs ~1550 elo and decent way to survive is to go hmgs + sniper + zooks + para.... But you go it blindly.

[@andypandy2848]

l6 flamers are killing 1v1

[@MasterSteve_117]

Why does every firing sound of vehicles basically sounds the same. I just can't get use to this audio and can't tolerate it either.

[@yuzhuocao5663]

Really? I don't use light vehicles at all. Lol too fragile

[@calvinking5835]

Sure is balance having gustari 25% damage reducation and 105 hp each model

[@davidhughes8795]

Rangers.

[@mariusjansen5345]

imagine they would have MP cheats and would be good against vehicles too....oh wait thats rangers!

[@Bountyxandrew]

I don't know, maybe nobody saw the meta, but USF with inf support upgrade become so strong. USF still dominate because they didn't have to build veh at all. Also i have no idea why they kill 8rad. It only been used as a Wermaht. Now it's officially useless

[@fabi5544]

you are oblivious my friend. the 8rad was completely steamrolling players across all ELOs

[@agourent]

8rad was a menace

[@Bountyxandrew]

@@fabi5544 lmao what? 1 AT counter all 8 rad , ofc if there is not 5 of them

[@Bountyxandrew]

@@fabi5544 8 was strong just because wehr call in was too early. Cant imagine situation when 8rad win condition unit

[@TrueKaras]

@@Bountyxandrew Atgun was THE WORST counter. It could take SEVERAL AT shots and you could get just one shot in because it's so fast. At high ELO it was basically unkillable. Lelic being Lelic of course didn't address it in nerfs at all so it still will be god because ALL LV got nerfed.

[@zbigniew2628]

Here are my copy pasted hopes of controll and gameplay improvements, no longer seen on their forums, coz I was banned. It should be still on discord, but I left it myself earlier. Tightrope! I think it is not worth supporting and carring about them anymore... They are to slow and last update added another bugs, like tactical map having delay, bonus dmg to recovery vehicle, and whatever more. Carring about it, turned me from a positive reporting guy to a toxic, bug and wrong designs digger. "Some ideas, which accumulated over time + some new. Feel free to pick whatever suits your vision for this game. It is copy pasted from a discord, after I edited it a lot from its first form, so it is more readable + a bit changed order. -when games disconnect it should pause on both sides -double click retreat as an option in menu to split it from reverse -if a target move away from a team weapons range, they should stay set up, not moving closer I heard COH2 has values like it (ignore, cancel, follow). Nowadays everything seems to work with this follow value. -keep similar abilities on the same grid keys! A customizable command card would be great. -units with an ability to shoot planes should do it ONLY WHEN AA mode it turned on -all units should take a high ground in buildings, if position is in range of a target -handbrake for indirect fire units, so when you click on the map it is going to turn there, not move, like emplacements -an area to monitor for an indirect fire units, so they should aim at limited area in their arc of fire, not closest units. A size of areas should be adjustable by scroll. -mines can detect camo units in a ~10 range, set their detection range to 0 -some transporting still needs tuning An update long ago broke a kfz250`s transporting, coz units spawns inside it, which count as an obstacle in movement and can make a kfz250 rotate. -immortal planes should be untargetable OR scale their HP with player count OR during a heavy AA fire should land only inside your territory or base sector. OR make units take more dmg soon after they are dropped, so it is risky to drop them on enemy positions. -a stance for inf - "spread out" to avoid AOE dmg in light covers, left from indirect fire. -stances for at least assault units, so If you atack move, they should close in, so every model is in an optimal range, when activated Ideas about breach ability: -breach should block a door, which it is using, unless enemy retreats -if enemy leaves, then squad should enter instantly or / and -breach should disable abilities of units for ~5 sec so using grenade on a breaching squad is not possible. -allow other squads members to shoot, so they are not ducks to aim down for free And way less important: -a tank ridding command should work in a different way, to avoid misclicks -add harder to hit values and other vet bonuses to some spreadsheet, so a community can put them on display -tune noises in the fog of war Some vehicles are easier to spot than others, even from far away, maybe tune it to a distance. -a bit faster build time for sandbags, but add large penalty, when in combat -some grenades do silly dmg to inf inside buildings -vehicles on the move maybe should give directional light cover around them? -if unit wants to help with construction make it focus on an another structure -an option to set up reinforce per squad, so they are going to reinforce as soon as they enter range of it, no matter the source and amount of units -automatic build for X amount of units, so we can set up build order, which happens as resources are available, cancelable by a hotkey. One unit per click, and cancel should clear all of them. -it is an old idea, add a road priority as a toggle, to use predefined paths during long movement orders to avoid obstacles -split some balance decision to 1v1 and team games, or even only for big team games, like transporting, healing, forward reinforcement, some atack speed of indirect fire, the cost or CD of some abilities, CD of some call ins..... for example 250/9 with transporting and healing may break team games... Use hidden tunning packs for it or something"