The "REAL" State of Hit Registration - Hunt: Showdown 1896

[@HuntCraft24]

Crytek finally respond!! x.com/HuntShowdown/status/1852397318273691912

[@WhiteSharks-wz6kn]

3 years for a fix. That seems actually on the faster end for Crytek. Congrats and thank you for being probably one of the biggest influence on this topic on Crytek. We did it, next time maybe it will only take 2 years.

[@HuntCraft24]

Haha better late than never 🤷🏻‍♂️ Thank you 🥰

[@C_A_I_N_N]

Thank fuck because this is the reason why solo necromancers quite frankly needed... Like legitimately it being dropped to only being a burn trait made it practically useless because good players weren't using it to save themselves from random encounters or shit like that since usually that wouldn't happen if you're not triggering sound cues which as a solo you shouldn't be especially now where you can be even more stealthy with the real reason is because trading is way too fucking frequent and so you just end up getting blasted away by a motherfucker shotgun after you had already killed them because of how they perceived it on their screen....

[@mkcompy]

I'm not a trader. I'm a "Gets headshot immediately upon showing myself." player. Don't even get a chance to shoot. I just figure it's the latency between my eyes, brain, and fingers. :P

[@HuntCraft24]

AND the servers 😆

[@DonWeLLozzo]

Dude, I'm 40 and playing FPS games, tell me about it XD

[@cyphersuit1]

Same for me. Best i had was to survive a round of bounty hunt unseen. 😅

[@Bejk707]

Hello, don't be mistaken its a curse, we call it a magnet on your head :-D

[@FaidedChainsawGuy]

I always pick the hunter with a massive magnet on my head.

[@MajorWhite]

Trade Showdown: 1896ms

[@xornedge8204]

😂😂😂

[@bornlivedie]

I love the game but this is hilarious.

[@Jalbesbe]

For real, had a kill where stabbed the guy, waited a second and started looting him and almost fully looted him and then his shotgun fired. Almost a 20-30s delay

[@play4774new]

Comment of the year

[@RachtaZ]

Very well made and explained video. Shows every problem and explains WHY it works like that, I like it!

[@KungThulhu]

You should react to this on stream so more people see it!

[@HuntCraft24]

Thanks bro 😍 Appreciate it! hope they fix it one day 🤷‍♂️

[@whywhywhy9659]

Shame you only give praise since being partnered rachtabrah

[@RachtaZ]

@@whywhywhy9659 You should stop by on streams

[@KungThulhu]

@@whywhywhy9659 He literally made a video about trades years ago and is calling out the problem here so what do you want lol?

[@quinx]

One of the biggest, arguably the biggest issue plaguing the game right now. Thank you for bringing more light to this topic - 10/10 video 🙏

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 😍

[@DonWeLLozzo]

Totally agree. It's the one thing that really gets under my skin in-game... well, that and the cheaters, obviously 😂 I've rage-quit more times than I care to admit over ridiculous kill trades. I’ve even had new players hit me up on Steam after a trade, asking if this is normal in Hunt. They’re all like, “Is this how it is?” Because they haven't experienced trades on that scale.... Welcome to the wild world of Hunt, folks!

[@nightmareTomek]

Is it even correct though how he describes things for example at 20:50 and 22:50? Sounds like a salty players rubbish to me and I would never code it like that if I were at Crytek.

[@tomiik5195]

@@nightmareTomek Yes, what he said there is correct.

[@nightmareTomek]

@@tomiik5195 Yeah, probably not.

[@Otterich07]

Finally, someone who addresses the biggest problem in hunt in such a professional way.

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 🥰

[@MrNocturnal1]

I was expecting a lot of things when I clicked on this video, but what I wasn’t expecting was the incredibly detailed technical breakdown. This video was *chefs kiss*.

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 🥰

[@domaspaukstys]

I really liked how BF solved this issue. They have a cap as well (I think in BF1 it was 150ms), if you're under the cap - your client can be authoratative. If you're over the cap - you get an icon on your client and basically you're playing server authoratative game. And it's not only for deaths, but for everything, like bullets, etc as server will take your inputs and see if the bullet lands on the player on the server. So if you're 300ms behind - you need to lead a running player by whatever distance he'd run in 0.3s. You can't abuse your high ping to kill someone who was running to cover when in their screen they are behind cover. Sure, you still have the peaker advantage if someone's sitting in the corner and not moving, but it solves most of the trades, it solves most of getting damage when just gotten to cover, etc.

[@TheBestcommentor]

And someone in the subreddit literally tried to tell me Battlefield had worse trades than Hunt when I asked them to name anything that was remotely close to Hunt in terms of trades. The sentiment about trades in there is completely devoid of critical thinking.

[@zombieranger3410]

No guys, you don’t understand Hunt has a built-in Last Stand mechanic that gives a player 800ms of delayed death to react, it’s all intentional and a well-understood mechanic.

[@HuntCraft24]

Game design basics! 😆

[@nightmareTomek]

Well-understood 🤣🤣 One can hope and dream, right...?

[@Sylense17]

"seems fine to me" says Dennis hiding in a bush.

[@HuntShowdownLab]

Oooo! I've been wanting to cover this. Haven't watched this yet, but i'm looking forward to the video!

[@HuntCraft24]

Hope you enjoy it bro! 😍

[@L4dy_Kum]

Just had a game where I shot a guy in the back with shotgun, he then TURNS AROUND AND SHOOTS HIS and only THEN he dies as we trade. Like wtf it took like entire second till my shot came through allowing him to do 180 and retaliate WTF!

[@DonWeLLozzo]

What do you mean? Crytek said it's fair! XD lol I know the feel!

[@underdog353777]

On his screen he likely heard you, turned around, and shot around the same time you did. Latency is a pain.

[@motionsam]

Time is relative. In reality he heard you, panicked. Went to the fridge, eat some snacks. Came back, made a shot. On your screen it was milliseconds, but in his universe...

[@nusretabi7222]

Bro I just romeroed one guy running at me with knife got hitmarker and he still keeps running killing me and then dying like wtf

[@BourbonBiscuit.]

As a shotgun user, when I go up against other one shot weapons it usually ends up with a trade. I can shoot extremely late or early it doesn't matter, it's unfair for both sides and my internet is perfect.

[@HuntCraft24]

Same

[@psyantologist]

Unless you're in the same room where the server is (and your opponent is too), your "perfect internet" is still subject to latency. Every client has their own view on the game world and no two are the same. All a server can do is juggle to pair them up into one reality (that nobody ever gets to see) There's no way around it. Only ways to mitigate it. Deleting bullets isn't it. That was significantly more unfair. And restricting ping limits only works for highly populated regions - but here, I tend to think crytek could be way more strict. I don't want to make finding a match impossible for some poor sod in Australia, but EU and the US coasts could benefit from that - and the devs could leave a higher-latency opt-in so you can play with folks from across the continent (or Atlantic) but otherwise (not opted-in to higher latency) benefit from more coherence and less trades

[@BourbonBiscuit.]

@@psyantologist I’m just saying out of all the multiplayer games I’ve played with a short TTK, Hunt feels like flipping a coin rather than it being about reaction speed

[@schlomoshekelstein908]

@@BourbonBiscuit. too many fucking asians playing us west

[@ComfyChroma]

@@psyantologistI am of the opinion that the devs have been able to implement a kill cam for a long time, but when they watch the matches they see how often things play out in a ridiculous way, and they know it will make their game seem terrible. For example you get killed by a guy that you could have sworn you outplayed, then you watch the kill cam and he’s 3 feet away from where you saw them. 😅

[@kobi399]

The big problem is that hunts tolerances are insanely high. You could fight your next door neighbor, your sent packets could do a 360 around the planet, arrive at Hunt HQ, get processed at 30hz, get sent via another round trip around the planet to your neighbors'client, once again get sent back around the planet to hunt HQ, and it would still register because it still wouldn't have been long enough to trigger the 800ms "limit" I'd much rather have the occasional ghost bullet giving me the chance to shoot again than to die almost a second later.

[@TheBestcommentor]

800ms is enough to go halfway to the moon.

[@diabloterrorgf]

Hunt does have a ping limit of 300ms though, so 600ms would be the worst maximum despite 800ms being a thing. 800ms probably accounting for weird packet arrival times at best. The problem is that trades happen with people around 100ms anyways. Shortening even the accepted time to 300ms would not change anything about 99.9% of trades. Any other ""fix" would result in latency advantage and at that point it would just be favoring people closer to the server since Crytek has few servers and the playerbase isn't large.

[@snakev7140]

​@@diabloterrorgf Trades happening at lower latencies are not an issue. Human reaction time is about 200 ms.

[@Krunnky]

This is, hands down, one of the best illustrations of server/client gaming I've seen in a long time. Maybe forever. Kudos, instant subscriber

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 😍

[@GuardianLords]

The worst part is Crytek and the unpaid intern in charge of the networking will never see this.

[@LewdCowboy]

“Welcome back to Trade: Huntdown”

[@Ajattaro]

Hunt: Tradeshow

[@LewdCowboy]

@@Ajattaro 🔥

[@greyche]

Thanks for putting words to this problem, unfortunately Crytek made it clear to us that this would never change. Personally, I stopped all in-game purchases several months ago for this reason.

[@DonWeLLozzo]

More people stopped after seeing that they've brought in this "New Era" update lol Including me.

[@sethyus232]

Thank god crytek is by no means a company of Word, they also said that there will never be something like bulletdrop. Here you go :)

[@Tacti_cat]

​@@sethyus232 Promising a feature isn't possible and then later discovering a solution, Is not the same as saying a fix for a problem is not possible. I'd rather Crytek take back the new engine, take back the graphics upgrade and the new map and just try and fix the piss poor hit registration and latency between players.

[@gregorh.3919]

@@Tacti_cat amen

[@AceofArcadia]

feel like the simple fix is shortening the trade allowance. 800ms is an eternity.

[@TheBestcommentor]

All they would have to do. Unless the reason it's like that is because their servers and optimization are just that bad.

[@nightmareTomek]

I think you misunderstood the trade window. If player A has 100ms ping and player B 200, you make it sound like player B has 800ms to return the kill. That's a crybaby's salty interpretation.

[@Micromation]

Also, invalidate bullets in-air under specific distance. Trades should happen, but not in situations they currently are 😂

[@TheHardWay71]

@@nightmareTomekWhile you’re correct that that’s not how it works, the window still needs to be lowered. The vast majority of players do not have above 100 ping. But lowering the trade window will mean that maybe if player A has 30 ping and player B has 200, the game will not allow them to rewrite the server state. But if player B has let’s say up to 80-90 ping, then they can. That is a MUCH more reasonable trade window. The argument he’s making in the video is that the vast majority of players should not have their experienced worsened because there are people who unfortunately live far from their closest server (people playing purposefully on further servers SHOULD ACCEPT they will be at a disadvantage). It’s not a worthwhile compromise. It’s unfair to a lot more players than it’s trying to benefit and also, the experiences of the high ping players aren’t even getting better. They still die in trades. Sure they got the kill I guess but it comes at the cost of denying players who rightfully got their shots off first a won fight.

[@nightmareTomek]

@@TheHardWay71 Yeah see, I think it's mostly bull what the content creator says, or people here in the comments, including the explanations how when server or client decides who wins, at 20:50 and 26:50. I don't think there's any disadvatage at all. Because the information is delayed by high ping people experience victory for a brief moment before the information that they traded reaches them, I think that's the true worsened experience you're talking about and the true problem. What they want is what you said: for players with high ping to just accept to be target practice for lower ping players, like in other games as well, because well screw them, right? With some honey on the pig that it's so "unfortunate" that they live too far away from the servers. I don't fall for that bull. Also to what value you want that cap lowered?

[@MrNocturnal1]

I was expecting a lot of things when I clicked on this video, but what I wasn’t expecting was the incredibly detailed breakdown at the start of the video. This videos was *chefs kiss*.

[@wzrd.7471]

With the advent of 1 shot headshots at all ranges and the shotgun buff issues like this should be paramount. Great vid 👍

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank You 😊

[@babalonkie]

Region Lock or lower max ping allowance. Simple. The only people protesting against it are those who jump into other servers for this "benefit"... and that's 100% accurate.

[@Alex-oj8po]

So it turns out Crytek actually likes it when the lag abusing blockletters are playing on your server instead of their own region. Very cool

[@Tacti_cat]

According to them, the Region block is racist or something. Imagine having to play on your own servers against your own lag abusing cheaters LMAO. Crytek should region lock China already. Playing Hunt on US West servers on the weekends is atrocious experience.

[@Topo842]

Right imagine not being able to play with your friends just because You are in East NA and they are on West NA

[@HuntCraft24]

@Topo842 Right Imagine being able to play with your friends on the opposite side of the planet at the expense of ruining the experience of everyone else while not even having a good experience yourself 😂

[@Topo842]

@@HuntCraft24 I think having the option is always good. btw, very well made and explained video, even if I disagree with some of your final thoughts. Thanks for shining a light on the mechanics of trading shots in Hunt :)

[@4nlimited3dition_4n3d]

@@HuntCraft24 I think they should just nerf the high ping players. So change the netcode to favour low ping players actions much more and at least invalidate the high ping abusers again on trades.

[@kataratak33]

800 ms window seems crazy

[@Japabartz]

10/10. Detailed, easy to understand, on point, informative, entertaining.

[@HuntCraft24]

Glad you liked it! 😊

[@eon2330]

Ah yes, lets let a maximum of 1.6 seconds plus latency from server to exist between 2 players in a shooter with instant death as the main mechanic.... What could possibly go wrong...... 1.6 seconds. Just think of how many kills can occur in 1.6 seconds. How many guns fire 2 or more bullets before 1.6 seconds. George can peek and fan the hammer out 4 bullets before all 4 people shoot him 1 time..... just imagine the server trying to explain that george 1. Stood up in view of 4 people aiming at him. 2. Fired his first shot 3. Fired his second shot. 4. Fired his 3rd shot. 5. Fired his 4th shot. 6. Got shot by the first person 4 times himself. 7. Got shot by the second person 4 times himself. 8. Got shot by the 3rd person 4 times himself. 9. Got shot by the 4th person 4 times himself. And all that happened....... and was registered? Yeah... no. But thats what 800 ping and 800 more allowance override does... thats just NOT something a server can handle without TONS of issues. Multi kill trades when someone shouldn't even get 1 kill are gonna be a thing.

[@Sp33dGames]

If you try to explain these issues to players on Discord or Reddit, they just defend the game blindly. In my experience, this is the only game that has this issue.

[@KungThulhu]

I die a little inside every time i see someone on reddit comment "its realistic" or that the alternative is bullets disappearing. Like no bro the alternative is doing it like every other game where neither is an issue.

[@DonWeLLozzo]

@@KungThulhu Right?! Reddit brains man...Also, there is a fine line where if "realism" is implemented into a game in wrong fasion...it ruins the fun.

[@Sp33dGames]

@KungThulhu FACTUAL on the "alternative is bullets dissapearing" They are clowns. Battlefield games have 64 players with bullet time and bullet drop. Somehow everything works and bullets don't disappear.

[@Jhintingbot]

On the discord you can send blatant bugs etc, they will 90 % of the time defend it saying it's a skill issue, or a you issue, or a "RARE" bug , or something else X ! D ! It's the same for Escape from tarkov discord. So crazy

[@DonWeLLozzo]

​@@Jhintingbot Last nonsense I saw: report of only half of XP gained in game being applied to bloodline. Dude was a veteran player - they started explaining him basic mechanics and at the end told him that it's a visual bug XD !!

[@SnakeSyxx]

I love this game. Been playing since early access when duo was the max and butcher was the only boss. I would take the ORIGINAL UI if it meant better ticketed and actual ping limits. Matchmaking changes too but one step at a time. I’m permanently 6 stars and tired of super sweats from other continents coming to US servers and either abusing the ping window or cheating their asses off. There is rarely an in between.

[@sikk8813]

My team and I went up against several full chinese teams last night over several games. We play mainly in US servers. It got to the point where we didn't even wanna peak and fight because we where dying after shooting and taking a couple of steps into cover. How is that shit fair? How is that ok? We are prestige 100 players with a ton of experience. We don't like holding up in compounds, we like to fight? Why can't we enjoy the game just because those guys don't wanna play fair. It's stupid and I wish the fix the ping limit asap. Thanks for the vid HuntCraft. Really good one!

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you! 😍

[@michaelgehling6742]

The Chinese team shot you while you was peeking... they didn't have any more time to react. The video explains it well. From their perspective you started peeking late and got back to cover late, too.

[@sikk8813]

@@michaelgehling6742 Thats what Im saying. On their screen I am peeking longer than what I really was. It takes server longer to update them as to where people are. So while on my screen I am already moving towards my next peek spot, they are still seeing me peek, giving them a slight edge. He also said that in the video as well. So how is that fair? I mean shit if you've ran into high ping players many times in one night you would know exactly what Im talking about

[@Ryan-jl7jz]

800ms trade windows is nuts. it feels so terrible to trade with someone nearly an entire second after you killed them. even worse if youre playing solo with the necro changes

[@sirminty8495]

"What we noticed is that many hits were invalidated around the player while dying. So the problem was that the shots were invalidated because they hit something after you were dead on the server and that was basically the majority of invalidations."

[@gobomania]

A very well crafted and well explained video about something I've be screaming on top of my lungs about for years. What really hits me is the last point about "who "deserves" a good gameplay experience" often when I have voiced a "harsh" ping limit of 100ms, it usually people from the US voicing themselves with arguments that they don't want such because they want to play with people from Australia or Europe. Whereas most European people usually voice something akin to "It would suck not being able to play with my US buddies, but I understand it would be better". Guess it is just a cultural difference between a huge continent as the US vs a more tightly packed and dense Europe.

[@HuntCraft24]

It’s a matter of priorities. And reason. I like to play with my US friends too. I Already do sometimes. But is it fun having my experience or theirs be bad and unenjoyable?

[@gobomania]

@@HuntCraft24 Exactly, also what do you think would be a fine ping limit? I always says 100, but that is just my starting offer to bargain it up to 125ms.

[@HuntCraft24]

In most games I can notice and i don’t enjoy anything over 60ish

[@V-Lenzr]

Thank you for the effort of going over this topic in detail. This video should be a pinned comment in all Hunt streams from now on until Crytek finally decides to fix their mistake from 2021.

[@HuntCraft24]

Haha, thank you! i gotta say that's a brilliant idea 😆

[@sethyus232]

@@V-Lenzr Thank you for your Service mr Lenzr :)

[@HuntCraft24]

Seems like they’re finally fixing it! 😁

[@MoonLyteV2]

makes playing long range more rewarding too which is boring, i want to be in close range in compounds fighting like the game really is supposed to be played and where the gameplay shines the most EASILY, trades makes it just so much less rewarding.

[@negative6442]

Banger video, thanks for breaking it down so nicely

[@HuntCraft24]

Glad you liked it! 😍

[@darkanviii2182]

Really well explained video! As a game dev who did a bit of multiplayer netcoding, I found a lot of what you said validated what I thought was happening with hunt's hit regristration. It makes me mad how the hunt dev seems to think he did the only correct thing. Hit registration in multiplayer games is never perfect. It can't be. But that's why that hunt dev is telling bs. I like their approach to allow for trades. But then reduce the allowance time to something like 250ms. And experiment with it. Changing that window would take seconds... And what I didn't know yet was how low hunts tick rate is. Increasing that would probably take more time, but would be very worth it.

[@HuntCraft24]

Well i think increasing the tick rate has a cascade effect on their infrastructure and cost, and potentially many other things, we don't know what their code is like, but the trade window, it's just objectively inexcusable. Thanks for the comment 😊

[@arnocrafford2277]

Really well explained and researched. I never really understood how exactly latency and tick rate worked, but now I do! As somebody who plays with 190 ping from South Africa since 2019, I genuinely and respectfully hope they don't lock me out of playing a game I really enjoy. Since I and many others don't have a server, I think being able to play on the nearest server, regardless of ping should at least be an option.

[@HuntCraft24]

I agree, they shouldn't lock you out, and also shouldn't force you to play a game you spend money on, on 190ms. They should serve you properly in your region.

[@malandewaal8522]

@@HuntCraft24 Another South African player here, the thing is, if we had our own servers we'd most likely get the same, if not worse, problems than other low-population servers like Oceania, where there aren't enough people to fairly or consistently fill lobbies. Even if they did open servers, I'd stay on EU since that is where I have met and currently play with the vast majority of my Hunt buddies. Plus, if I'm being honest, Hunt has had some of the best hit registration from a multiplayer shooter that I've ever had, with only a handful of invalid shots over the past few months. It can absolutely still be improved, I've definitely gotten a better understanding of the server systems from this video, but I honestly believe the best service Crytek could give me and other South African players would not include our own server. Do I get disadvantages from high ping? Absolutely, but that's kinda the norm for a lot of South African players over a number of games, with a few exceptions.

[@radekdusicka1114]

@@malandewaal8522 for you it looks great because you are the guy with high ping, for us on EU servers, you are the guy ruining our fun. Because your higher ping makes the hits for us weird as explained in the video, we also meet a lot of intentional ping abusers. They intentionaly make their ping higher to improve their peakers advantage. Thats the most problematic thing about hunt. Thats why you feel like Hit registration is ok, because you never play with correct low ping, so you are the one getting the advantage. Not to blame you here, just an explanation why you dont see the hit registration problem.

[@malandewaal8522]

A little while back, I had the privilege of traveling to Germany, where I brought my laptop and played on 20ish ping. Mind you, it was on lowest settings and 50% resolution scale, yet I still did better than I had ever on my normal 180ish ping. Not only that, but my hit registration was immaculate throughout all of my matches while I was there. Experiencing Hunt on low ping is simply better, but when I don't have another choice, I will continue to play my favourite game despite my normal ping. The thing is, with the exception of the one push peeker's advantage, high ping only brings disadvantages. Delayed hitmarkers, delayed doors/interactables/ai, defensive peeker's disadvantage and of course me getting killed when I'm behind cover since I was shot where I was, especially when I peak. I've yet to see people who claim that high ping bring advantages try to play on high ping themselves, since I'd bet most would see that in actuality these "advantages" are only really seen on paper and are few and far between in reality. The thing is, it doesn't bother me much, since while I wasn't there on my end, it's not like my ping made me stay out of cover longer than I was, nor does it make other hunters stay out of position longer than they had been. It merely shifts my, and their, movements back, without adding any time. My deaths, as well as many of the ping-related deaths I've seen people complain about (not all mind, but at least half) come down to their positioning and movement. In other words, they would have been killed in any case. I do, however, absolutely agree that, to minimise these discrepencies, people should stick to their own servers, especially those who try to gain the supposed "advantages" among a sea of disadvantages, since it messes with the user experience. The issues that other people are experiencing, as well as the 800ms discrepancy gap, do need to be addressed, however as mentioned in the video, Hunt is far from the only game with these issues. Yes, many of these complaints are warranted, but there will always be something to complain about with internet-connected games. Edit: my reply doesn't seem to want to send, sorry if there are multiple instances.

[@josephrobinson6171]

Honestly they should just make clients with a ping of over 100ms subservient to the server, and clients with a ping of below 100ms more authoritative.

[@Koh_TheRat]

I'm a player from SA, my country has no servers so I constantly play with a bad connection whether I want to or not. I really wish Crytek wouldn't sell hunt I my country because, as you said, it's just bad for everyone. But I'll never get a refund (because of hours played) and never get servers either (only counter strike has servers in SA)

[@HuntCraft24]

Yup, you’re right it is 100% on them they cared about the initial sale and you become just a number for them. As soon as you have some hours and can’t refund, then they don’t need to serve you any better with any sort of support. Really a shame 😟

[@Koh_TheRat]

Thanks alot for this video. Alot of people from my country would rather be sold a terrible experience like this and hope that it becomes better over time than be sold an experience that is actually fair from the get go. I'm happy that you don't agree with that sentiment. Also this video is really well made and informative.

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 🥰

[@psyantologist]

Really good summary :) I feel your frustration and agree with your conclusions - Dennis' reaction video about the UI was probably a result of the tanking steam reviews - and the silence since then with that one patch that fixed the player-opens-map--during-banishment-crash and the amd-cards-now-render-gameworld patch was nowhere near enough to make the game live up to what the new map could provide. And that's a shame. The rascals also promised "Stillwater within the first 30 days" - 30 days since 15th of August is to-freakin-day

[@HuntCraft24]

ya, it's a shame really 😕

[@psyantologist]

@@HuntCraft24 yeah :\ the map is so gorgeous and filled with so many nifty details - and (even though it's stressful to get used to it while not knowing my way around 100% yet) I do like the new approach about more entrances into boss lairs. Less stale-matey, way more effort required for the rare but annoying concertina-gopher

[@mathieugirod6485]

3 hours later and we got the annoucement for stillwater. ^^ I guess if we follows cryteks latency rule your comment still count right ? right ?

[@LeMicronaut]

Soo, it has been teased? But not returned? I do really like the new map better, but I was shocked how many people were shutting me down when I said removing the 3 maps from the game was a bad precedent for the industry. A lot of people lose interest when they perceive a lack of content and gutting 4-6 years of mapping because the textures and lighting might not be up to snuff sounded risky. Also no legacy server that out of spec or bug ridden players could use for a few months during the growing pains was also less than ideal cause you hemmorhage some of your veteran player/payerbase (would also put less stress on the team to race for things like the out of spec amd fix). Many seemed to not understand that ONLY stillwater was promised a month later and that was likely assuming a smoother launch. I wasn't expecting to see desalle until late november or december, but it might be longer now.

[@acfangaming]

This is a well done video. The complicated topic is shown in an easily digestible format with good visuals. You should be proud.

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 😊

[@riadakhundov14]

Thank you for all this work. This is probably the best video about biggest Hunt problem right now. Hit registration right now is absolutely abysmal. This needs to be pinned by Hunt Showdown.

[@FodderForFreedom]

The complete cartridges flying through the air at 25:50 made me giggle.

[@HuntCraft24]

😂😂😂 not many would notice and it’s a cooler illustration I thought 🙈

[@KungThulhu]

The trade window is like locking everyone at 30fps because some might not reach better performance. Its especially frustrating because there are several easy to implement fixes that would improve it significantly. It has been complained about ever since it was introduced and the majority of the playerbase hates it. But for some reason Crytek still sticks to this terrible system. Unfortunately some players have been conditioned to defend this and will say "but the alternative is bullets just disappearing". Weird how every other video game on the planet does not have either of these issues. Amazing video that should reach a million views and that should make everyone demand Crytek to finally do something about it.

[@Thekilleroftanks]

besides it hasnt? i mean there were some who bitched about it being added, but theres never a time when someone isnt bitching about something new being added, like fuck the community thought beetles were going to break the game so hard its gonna kill the game. and after a massive 5 times damage buff, theyre still a rare item to see. so ya it wasnt until about a 2 years ago when people started actually bitch about the trade system, which is about a year or so after it was added and most people forgot how bad it was before hand. as for other games. thats just not true. games either have a trade window or they dont, the ones that dont arent noticeable because theyre mainly using hit scan weapons. at which point it doesnt matter if trades were a thing, you wouldve died before you couldve fired. and the games that do use a projectile system and no trades, either have a high time to kill time for guns, where you would never notice you getting a input removed, or have respawns so even if you get cucked from a kill, it doesnt matter, wait 30 seconds and youre back in the fight. this is why people who propose going back to the old system, are idiots. and likely will be the first people bitching about their totally legit knife kill that was stolen from them, and asking why doesnt hunt have a trade window.

[@sikk8813]

I disagree, he even said in the video that Hunt isn't the only game that deals with these same issues. I agree they should be working on it. But its not players being conditioned. Its players trying to understand that this stuff takes a lot of time. They are having to fix issues while also keeping the game relevant so it doesn't get dropped from the company. They need more people working for them

[@DarthZombie510]

I love the disappearing bullet argument. It's as if there aren't any timestamps when actions are made and validated lol. I genuinely believe the guy who """fixed""" this was unable to keep a fired bullet still be validated when the shooter presses the trigger right before the server confirms his death. There's no other reason for the nonsensical explanation

[@KungThulhu]

@@sikk8813 But Hunt is by far the game with the most severity of this issue. I personally have never experiences trading in other games with one exception in CSGO within 500 hours of playtime. You need to stop cutting them so much slack. It takes time? Okay they had literally three years of daily complaints. Lowering a ping limit and reducing a trade window are things they can "adjust any time" (their own words). Also doesn't get dropped by what company? Its their only active game. You need to get this idea out of your head that the game will go offline the second its less successful. Its okay to have some standards.

[@KungThulhu]

@@Thekilleroftanks I hate this "people will complain anyway" argument when the video explains in super great detail why this isn't just some whining but an objective issue. You are just blindly defensing a company. You are basically saying we aren't allowed to dislike anything crytek does. I stopped reading after that since the rest is just cope anyway.

[@Brotatochip_Kun]

If the [][][] could understand you, they'd be very upset right now. Excellent video.

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 😊

[@f.calamo6658]

Yesterday I played few hunt matches and what made me quit was my whole team dying to a guy who didn't even had his hunter load before I died, he was just his sprite shadow and gunflash till I died, and even his gun skin awaited few seconds to load on the kill screen.

[@raygunner6656]

Just stumbled onto your channel. The thoroughness of your work earned my sub. Well done, and thank you for making the video.

[@HuntCraft24]

Awesome, thank you! 😍

[@CeceliPS3]

At the peeker's advantage portion of the video you didn't cover a scenario that is happening a lot in Hunt nowadays. I have 2-5ms ping and I play against people with 100ms on SA servers. I peak/bait shots/get info, get to cover and literally 1 second later I die behind the cover. Something weird is happening. I'm either slow af on their screen and/or the hitbox of my character is being dragged and expanded throughout the whole movement I just did. So no matter what I do, they can always get a perfect hit with something that is almost impossible to do. Human reaction time + all the delay times from everything combined dictates that this shouldn't occur that frequently, specially in Hunt where you have to compensate bullet travel and to do so the character being shot at is already behind cover, so you don't have a viable time to lead the shot since you'd need more space and in that 'more space' there's already cover. So, this issue is way deeper than your depiction of it.

[@HuntCraft24]

There’s many variations of such scenarios. And also when i explained peeker’s advantage it kinda belonged to the general basics. I wasn’t really explaining it specifically in hunt i was just demonstrating the basics of the concept and picked whatever clip i had to illustrate with.

[@CeceliPS3]

@@HuntCraft24 fair enough. But if you keep on fighting the good fight making more videos forcing Crytek's hands and bringing awareness to more players (good job, btw), please do make sure you add this particular scenario. It highlights how insane this has been. It needs to get fixed.

[@osterhai]

The tickrate in hunt is abysemal in comparison to other games.

[@snakev7140]

The reason they implemented the trade window was so they don't have to fix their dog-shit servers.

[@dumbdaiki6424]

Thank you for the video! There were so many things, that I questioned, but didn't understand, such as these time travelings. Hope to see more from you. (and your voice and diction are so nice, it's so pleasant to listen it, especially as a foreigner))

[@HuntCraft24]

That's so kind, thank you 😍

[@enigmatvarence4319]

Now I just need the explanation of why I consistently jump to 200+ to 300+ ping in Hunt than any other game I play lol

[@HuntCraft24]

🤷‍♂️

[@BassFischLP]

Thank you for explaining a complex topic in such an understandable way. Really good to know how trades work .

[@HuntCraft24]

Glad it was helpful! 😍

[@pondopondo1497]

Good video. I'd bet my money the "Velocity experiment" won't hold up on live servers. The thing is - there are ways to combat all of these issues, its hard but not rockets science. But for the past three years we've seen no improvements and we are pissed.

[@SoleSan]

Best video I've seen in a loooooong time. The delivery, examples, and logic is spot on. Congratulations!!! 🎉 PS: trade window soo long and unfair I've died from players already on the ground, smelling the flowers at my feet, from my perspective...

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 🥰

[@tni333]

If Reddit taught me anything all this tech gobbledygook is irrelevant, crytek is just too lazy to fix trades

[@9hundertfels]

I didn't expect such a good video from such a small channel. I definetly subscribe!

[@HuntCraft24]

Thanks you! 😍 are you saying size matters? 😱

[@9hundertfels]

I would never say something like that, if only to boost my own self-confidence.

[@calmly1316]

Thank you for the video. As a player, is nice to see a content creator talk about the issues of a game in a professional way

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 🥰

[@rubberducky704]

For the love of god I hope this video gets traction. I've been trying to say it this way and people still defend the built in "trade window". It wasn't always this bad. Great video!

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 😊

[@Lpxable]

I love Hunt, and really hope they can adress this issue on how ir really works after this video. Thanks for this deep tech analysis🙌

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 🥰

[@nickaustin4428]

I appreciate someone who is knowledgeable on the topic actually going into depth on the issues in the current game. I’ve been playing for five years and I haven’t seen much of that. We need more people that can articulate the issues at hand without seeming like another frustrated player who dies to trades crytech really needs to get their act together because the game has gotten nothing but worse in the last few years.

[@lucass.6546]

Man THANK YOU!!! Finally a video which explains this problem in such detail. I really hope Crytek sees this. Especially your words at the end perfectly wrap it all up!! Amazing work, you got a new subscriber and a like!

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 🥰

[@L1vv4n]

What I guess Cryteck need is more authoritative QA. If QA have enough manpower and have authority for more then just reporting issues, changes to the game might become better guided and resolve actual pain points, rather than being reactions to irritated people latching to the most obvious problem. Overall I think client authority should end at reporting time and vector of the shot. Might be some slight correction allowed. After that server should coordinate timeline with info from both clients and than decide if bullet was already in the air or could not be shot. it also might reduce possibility for hit reg exploits and cheats, because actual decisions about hitting is made by server.

[@bakercompanygaming947]

This is a banger. This was like I was sitting in networking+ class

[@HuntCraft24]

😂 Thank you 🥰

[@ryandobbs9270]

Bullet velocity seems cool until you trade with nearly everyone you engage with. 💀

[@charliebartlett5768]

It's not even an issue with bullet velocity as most trades happen at close range where bullets travel to the target almost instantaneously. Other projectile games like battlefield don't have this issue, and you only typically trade in those games at long range where there is feasible time for a player to fire a shot whilst an opponents bullet is mid air.

[@HuntCraft24]

@charliebartlett5768 word!

[@Jalbesbe]

This explains why when I have gotten into full cover and suddenly drop dead. Had many cases where I killed a player and a huge delay later I get shot by a dead player. So many times where I get killed by a player that isn't even visible, not wall banging, just not a single frame that they show up on video Also why trades happen so often. I don't have high ping at all

[@kalizii]

you sound like you could be a narrator for a nature documentary 👍

[@HuntCraft24]

Thanks! Idea for my next channel 😆

[@thevampirekiller123]

I dont think I've ever seen such a well explained latency video, thank you so much yeah i agree 800ms window is actually giving so many lagging jackasses infinite time to shoot back

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 😍

[@FirekingBarong]

I am completely fine with trades, that stuff just happens sometimes and is natural. Im not fine with trades where the enemy's gun fires when the person is already on the ground, as if the trigger hit a rock and went off into my face. And with a ping-limit of 250ms, those asians and russians fall into the 2nd type of trades way to much for my taste ^^

[@DreadZep]

I've been killed so many times only to check the killshot angle and see it was through a solid object that could not be penetrated. I guess that's the aftermath of the server trying to make sense of the two realities of me and my killer or trader

[@ComfyChroma]

32:46 I think the issue with this for the developers is that they need as many people as possible to be able to play the game in order to keep their revenue high. If they made it so people with bad internet would lose every time, or just couldn’t play then that’s less people giving them money. Also even if the people with bad connection lose all the time is fair, that’s still a bunch of people that are going to review bomb the game, saying that there is something wrong with the game. I think they are just trying to please everybody, but I agree with your opinion where it’s just making the experience worse for everyone. This video was so eye opening for me, and at least made it easier for me to understand why certain things might are playing out the way they do. I also feel like they removed the ping limit that they use to have, or loosened it heavily, again so they could keep people in areas with bad internet playing the game. Edit: I’ll also add that even if they wanted to add a nice low ping limit, or if they had before, and made it really wide again, I’d imagine it’s because of the people living in these places with bad internet, or not enough local players buying the game, and can’t either find matches or all the matches your only fighting one person, so they go and make a review telling everyone it’s a dead game with nobody playing. A few of those types of reviews are whatever, but if a ton of people are saying that then why would people want to give an online only game a chance if they think it’s dead? The devs want more and more people to play which is why they keep adding more spammy weapons and making it semi easier for the average fps player to get into.

[@HuntCraft24]

I think they had a limit at 225 at some point, not sure if that's still the case or they ditched that, who knows.

[@FirekingBarong]

@@HuntCraft24 It got increased to 250, it is even worse than what you thought it would be, sadly.

[@raskolnikovsghost2701]

You’re wildly underrated and I appreciate all your hard work.

[@HuntCraft24]

🥰

[@Kenlaboss.]

I think that if players understood how the system works they would be less frustrated overall, while not completely agreeing with everything, it's a good video!

[@HuntCraft24]

Thanks 🙂

[@TheHardWay71]

What a fantastic video. Perfect explanations.

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you! 😊

[@El_IsraPS2]

Yesterday I killed 9 hunters with katana just to trade with a spear. I killed him first and 1 second later I died. I didn't even see the spear throwing animation

[@mightypigeon836]

You’re using a katana… I have no sympathy for you XD

[@El_IsraPS2]

@@mightypigeon836 I hate katana players. But I was playing premade with friends. And they insisted me to try it out. So I took katana and Krag. It was my first time trying katana lol

[@ThwriktoKavlerwf]

dude i was playing while seeding one day and i kid you not i thought my shots were more accurate. and i actually tried it again and it seemed the same. now it makes sense

[@ip0rter846]

This is one of the best videos I have ever seen of this topic. Realy good job dude!

[@HuntCraft24]

Wow, thanks! 😍

[@r4tte]

I did not expect such a high quality video. Very informative and well researched. Thanks for explaining this complicated, yet very important and annoying topic to everyone. Great Job! You easily earned that sub!

[@HuntCraft24]

Appreciate it 😇

[@KingMcKerchar]

Super interesting video, my dude, excellent job! Trades have always been a very poorly implemented solution that has irked the player base from newbie to 6*, and it's sad they don't feel the need to reassess the situation, especially since it is one of, if not, the top point of contention for the PvP experience. On a side note, you're definitely not the only person getting fed up with the absolute state of this game. I've recently experienced over half the regular players from my hunt discord call it quits, or slowly ebb out from regular play since the update. Crytek promised so much and delivered such a subpar experience in this update, as well as not addressing the trade window and the region lock. I love the game but they're losing players fast and their radio silence, so quickly after saying they would do better with communication, doesn't fill me with confidence for the future of this game. They're like an abusive partner saying they'll change if we take them back one more time...

[@Tyr4xx]

from our team's pov it feels, that trades got clearly more present on 1896 patch. They were an issue before, too, but kinda less annoying, most likely, because they were not that much common and "overlapping"... I definitely would like to have the pre-1896 trade situation back...

[@Happy_Sailor639]

I had alot of strange moments where headshot would register as bodyshot, shot missing, and body hit count as arm, I also had shoulder counts as head lol. But the huge issue for me was broken MMR, I was solo 4 star, and one of teams was 4 and 6 stars. The heck I'm supposed to do here? :D Shit like this happens to me constantly, I get a full 5 star team with me and my friend having only 4. This last update is the worst update I witnessed, the only thing it did good is chosing legendary hunters. Edit: Oh, and I forgot the very small amount of trades. It got even worse in this last big update.

[@Ryan-jl7jz]

just be glad you're not stuck in solo 6 star hell. i typically hovered in the 4-5 range prior to the update. in 50hrs of playtime for the update i have been completely unable to get out of 6 stars. problem is even if im dying a ton its to other 6 stars so it doesnt move you down a lot, and youre killing 6 stars so your mmr is always high. you check the team details and youre going against full 6 star teams, or mostly 6 stars and a 4 or 5 star, its quickly sucking the fun out of the game for me

[@Happy_Sailor639]

@@Ryan-jl7jz I got my 5 star today, this sucks. Btw, it appears if you actually do a SINGLE kill, you by default not going to lose stars.

[@gregorh.3919]

Hunt devs basically say: We want you to trade and we won't change it, because we already did change it. Engine upgrade made Trading so much worse, for me it's actually ruining the game because it sucks that you trade yourself with the other dude after a big teamfight. Same goes for all these stupid extra ammo types like dynamite stick on a crossbow bolt, but that's another topic.

[@andibpunkt-o8c]

Didn´t know Eminem is into game development, nowadays. Great video.

[@HuntCraft24]

😄

[@RedshirtAfficionado]

Excellent, very informative video! Bravo HC. I really liked the lawbreakers example you showcased.

[@HuntCraft24]

Glad you enjoyed it! 😍

[@Lothrean]

As a game designer, I have to say: Perfectly explained and analyzed. To answer some of your questions: "Why the bad tick rate?" -> Money / server cost and a terrible engine to run on servers (cry engine was made for single players). "Why giving trades to the players with terrible connection / why the 800ms window?" -> prgrammers are no game designers, they don't see the issue and QA seems unable to communicate it properly to them. "Why no ping limits?" -> low importance issue. The thing I am really confused about as a game designer is: Why not make traits like death cheat easier to gain? Why not make it so that you can revive yourself with necro when you are the last player who died on your team (or on the server)? Just to flatten the problem at least, if there is no other practical solution.

[@Thekilleroftanks]

actually there is a ping limit, just that the games breaks from updates so we get the current situation where the new update didnt have a ping limit. which has, supposably, been fixed back to 250ms so the current max trade time is 1050ms, but its pretty impratical to get single digit ping numbers so its more realistically 1040

[@ojjagg9387]

As a 10+ year QA guy, I don't understand why you would assume QA is unable to communicate it properly to the production team? I am 100% convinced that QA has flagged the bad trades situation years ago but production/leadership simply doesn't see it necessary. Also think about the fact that most of Crytek is 3-4 star mmr. That says a lot, doesn't it? I don't think this is on QA, it's obvious that after so many years passed, this would have been obvious to ANYONE at Crytek that bothered playing 3 games a week.

[@HuntCraft24]

@ojjagg9387 let me be clear, every decision making problem is a high up problem. That’s where responsibility and accountability should be. Even if QA are incompetent useless bots. The higher ups should’ve fired them and got better ones if they want what’s good. Ultimate decisions made about Hunt like any other company is the responsibility of the decision makers. I would never solely blame the employees even if they’re doing a bad job.

[@maverickclips62]

That explains why when I hit a guy yesterday with my ax and saw blood, but didn't get a hit marker nor did it kill him 😅

[@anadevisto1906]

You've missed something here regarding the trade window. If we have equal ping, I'm using a mosin at 600 ms bullet velocity and you're using a Winfield at 400 ms, prior to the change if we shot at the same time my bullet would kill you every time and your bullet would be removed every time. This wasn't fun either.

[@HuntCraft24]

True, the problem isn't in one aspect or another, the problem is that the combination of features or design goals together, end up giving everyone a bad experience overall. it's not about fully removing this or that specific thing, it's about tweaking it more resonably.

[@TheBestcommentor]

This has already been fixed. But now there's an additional window to account for latency.

[@jako800]

This might be one of the best ways I have ever heard this explained; well done. Also, I work on networking for a living; 800ms seems far too generous for a time-sensitive application.

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 😊 I work in the field too 🙏

[@bumf1677]

great video, would love to see how they would address this problem. but I have a feeling it wouldn't fix anything in a meaningful way.

[@HuntCraft24]

It’s been 3 years 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@motionsam]

With all the love to unique hunt's atmosphere, you won't find as bad hitreg anywhere as here. Thanks for covering the topic in detail

[@HuntCraft24]

Thanks for watching! 😍

[@perritrue]

From a south african like myself. I get more trade kills than anything else. Always had the suspicioun its because of my 180ms ping😅

[@HuntCraft24]

could be the case 😄

[@ojjagg9387]

Rofl, I get trades often with ~40 ms ping. 180 ms ping is definitely a HUGE factor in your scenario but it's not the only one. If I get trades often with 40 ms ping, it must be hell for you on 180 ms. It's hell for me most days. I'm literally scared to turn the corner because I know I will trade. And most times, I'm right.

[@Colloth]

Great video, well explained and I really feel you. I'm really frustrated, too, by the "Upgrade and Relaunch", so much wasted potential and return/rise of a lot of bugs that simply do net get adressed properly and thoroughly as it seems. (Or isn't well enough communicated, if at all) If you read/hear/see the different statements of Crytek personal I often wonder wether the right hand knows what the left hand is doing ...

[@NickName-nc2ld]

Hit reg in this game is the worst I have ever experienced

[@PedroPedroAbrunhosa]

really good video. have been trying to understand these concepts and you explained them really well!

[@HuntCraft24]

Glad it was helpful! 😊

[@PayKay96]

Great video, lots of (in depth) information, thanks!

[@HuntCraft24]

Thank you 😊

[@Titan_Guard]

i had a match recently (like September 14th 2024) where i had a levering Terminus with Slugs, and the enemy had a throwing spear, i shot him point blank ( < 1 meter away) at a sliding door, we somehow traded and he STABBED me to death, when i had already retreated behind the wall, half a second AFTER i shot and killed him. (i had 40-50 ms ping at the time, idk what his was)

[@Jordan-ev5uk]

I love Hunt, only been in to it properly for the past say 5 months. The sever issues / latency however seems to be worse than ever at the moment. Alot of screen tear, stutter and FPS issues on the PS5. Its not my set up either. I have a C3 LG OLED and 1,000 mb broadband which i have wired in to the console. Its really ruining the experience of the game at the moment as it feels extremely unreliable. Some games feel okay, but alot don't and its getting very frustrating 😢

[@HuntCraft24]

I Know how you feel 😕

[@Jordan-ev5uk]

@@HuntCraft24 hopefully some stability updates in the future! Great video by the way, subbed! 👍🏼

[@MrNocturnal1]

I’m relatively new to the game and honestly… I’m not a fan of trades, but I always feel relieved when I die and realize he died as well.

[@TheAnesthetics]

The main issue is that they allow Chinese people with 250 ping to play on NA servers. At high MMR where people peek properly and quickly, sometimes you'll just see a gun and instantly die because of pretty much what you've explained. I don't see how a company can possibly allow this. We've been begging to region lock the Chinese to their own servers.

[@nycetry961]

Thanks for this video, really well put together! This is btw the reason why the state of pistols is very bad in the game right now. They are no valid 1shot weapons, that's why they give you in almost every scenario a disadvantage.

[@Deathwhisper2]

Higher tick rate would help. But the issue that it would cost more money. And since people shitted on the game HARD, the game lost players and thus revenue. While the UI is bad, it is not THAT bad. I'm not sure if I have that good of internet, but I only experienced trades when I played with friends who are across the ocean. And it was like once or twice per 3-4h session. Guess I should go buy a lottery ticket or something. Besides that, knowing how net code works, good job on explaining it.

[@HuntCraft24]

It's not about how often it happens, it's about the emotional damage 😆

[@Deathwhisper2]

@@HuntCraft24 I suppose. Guess I'm at the point of not caring. Just "eh that happened" and reque or get revived.

[@canobeans1210]

last night me and my buddy’s got in a cluster fuck of a single bounty fight only for everyone but me and the last guy died only for me and him to trade with my heavy knife and his bow, I dont get mad about people killing me in this game but man it’s feels so bad and frustrating to have a massive fight get down to the last guy only to trade with him