Titans Have an Identity Crisis: My Thoughts On The Problem And How Bungie Can Fix It | Destiny 2

The recent discussion around Titans in Endgame PvE has highlighted some issues with their kits. I wanted to throw my thoughts out there too, so here's 15 and a half minutes of me yapping about Titans.
Sections
Intro - 0:00
Why do Titans Have Issues? - 1:20
One Dimensional Kits - 3:12
Subclass Diversity For Warlocks and Hunters - 3:39
Lack of Subclass Diversity for Titans - 5:48
Why This Is Worse on Prismatic - 7:30
The Melee Problem - 9:39
How We Fix Titan Identity - 11:24
Instead of Just Buffs, Rework - 12:42
Conclusion and Outro - 14:15

[@conversefall5928]

The issue with Titans is that Respawn deleted them along with Titanfall 3 and instead gave us Apex Legends. Damn you, Respawn. I want Titanfall 3 already! /s

[@kzungu4717]

@@conversefall5928 real (I miss peak titanfall 2 every day)

[@RUGER5264]

😂

[@theEquYnoX]

100%. Titanfall had so much potential

[@bjcooper4365]

If they want the Titans to be the melee class, they need to stop demolishing every melee build they have. We all know Peregrine greaves is next on the chopping block because it can one shot most things below boss level

[@AxisChurchDevotee]

Problem is it's going to still homogenize due to arcstrider and now prismatic hunter doing the same thing.

[@Swagceus]

So can Hunters with their throwing knives and Warlocks with their finger snaps and handheld novas. Allowing Titan to one shot with their shoulder without Peregrine once more would actually be a good thing specially in PvP.

[@gigablasterfire299]

As a noob titan main, I've had to change builds so much and I still have no idea what it is actually ideal numbers for my stats

[@b0ld651]

Bungie: "Due to an issue where titans can do damage with their melee we will be nerfing banner of war, synthoceps, wormgod, and make one two punch not work on half their melees. We will also be buffing Celestial nighthawk and giving hunters an infinite golden gun."

[@imuz8644]

In my opinion, titans should have inherently more resilience than both other classes making them much more survivable in pve. If we’re expected to be up front, we need to be able to survive there. I can barely survive playing the class the way it’s currently designed to be played

[@theEquYnoX]

I agree, however I see the classes more as positions roles. Warlocks are back line, Titans front line, Hunters flankers. With the front line role, these does not mean melee, but more of a " the line in the sand" role. They are good at melee when something crosses it, but protects those behind them. But with the mobility of the game, the line has to keep mobile. I think that Bungie already has the mechanics to fix this role with Strained BANNER Titans. Banner of War is a roaming buff, that keeps pace with the flow, and if needed a barricade can be set to reinforce the line. So how would I fix it? Take the other melee aspects (Knock out, Roaring Flames, Offensive Bulwark, Howl of the Storm), and add a different aura buff to them. Banner of War heals, buff swords and melee, Banner of Flames could buff rockets and team ability recharge, Banner of Bulwark buffs Grenades launchers and provide a pulsing void over shield. Banner of .. etc etc. Now on those static boss DPS phase, the Titans gets its 3 stacks of buffs, and can provide more for the team then just a bubble or barricade, but also stacking with those. Warlocks and hunter now have a reason to RALLY around the Titan for protection and support. 😊

[@theeternalslayer9513]

Not to mention, it would GIVE people a reason to play Titan in endgame content, because those buffs could be valuable for contest, or master raids. I've seen and have been kicked for playing a Titan in Pantheon, day one raids, and Master raids. Hell even NORMAL RAIDS from lfg, all because I want to run Titan for pinnacles or because I feel like playing Titan. However on the other two, I'm NEVER kicked or asked to swap. Why? Because you could always use another wellock, or another DPS hunter. This just proves that Titans have no place in endgame content because they are useless and offer nothing for teammates to play with other than just lost damage, or lost survivability for the whole team

[@badacid7388]

I like it!!

[@RememberTheDuck]

The stasis one is interesting. Maybe give everyone slow on their guns (chill clip style) and stack Frost Armor over time (but that could be going too deep into Renewal Grasp territory)?

[@yaboyospoons7570]

I'll start with this, I like melee Titan and I think Bungie views Titan and the melee bruiser/tank. it shows in how Bungie writes and how the Titan kit is played usually that being close to the fight is always where titan wants to be. They can either put out loads of close range damage or protect allies from the enemy and enabling them to be more aggressive with things like Overshield and Ward of Dawn. The issue is that they have made close range virtually impossible for most subclasses in moderately hard content and made tanking very unrewarding for the titan player, it's an issue Overwatch is facing right now. Thing is, unlike Overwatch, Bungie does not off to balance around PvP (I believe they've shown enough to prove they COULD make PvP and PvE have separate sandboxes, and I believe they really should because this is the big reason why tanking will never be rewarding otherwise). The issue comes from "How do you reward players for tanking damage for their team?" and that is a hard question to answer in a PvP context, especially when most of the tanking occurs from barriers. Barriers put the enemy in a position where they have to shoot it to get to the juicy little people behind it, but if you reward a player by giving them something like super energy, or even ability energy, then you can't shoot it. So the player is punished for both shooting the barrier and not shooting it. Of course, if we ignore PvP then you can integrate this and there would be no problem because it purely rewards the Titan for doing their job well. As for melee Titan, this issue is more a grand scale Destiny issue than just a Titan issue. At higher levels, enemies deal so much damage so quickly, with little to no counter play, that it is fundamentally impossible to play melee titan unless it is broken. That is why Solar Titan was so good for so long, because it very heavily sustained you for being in the fight and even just the 3 seconds hammer reset was enough to make the class impossible without perfect play for the entire duration. Destiny, as a game, punishes aggressive play at high levels because you'll just get shot and die, and punishes passive play, because you have very few buffs up at a time and little to no way to keep using your abilities. And because enemies deal so much damage, tanking is the only option you have, but most players find it boring because Void Titan is poorly designed and balanced, so even tanking just delays the inevitable for a few seconds with pretty much no upsides. This is a Destiny as a whole issue, but Titan suffers the most because we are punished the most for the two reasons most people play Titan, tanking and melee fighting. Hunters and Warlocks just simply don't have this issue because their kits don't "require" you to get close to properly utilize it (with a few exceptions). Now, what do Titans need to make both of the commonly desired playstyle viable? Well Titans need to be rewarded for doing their jobs, so giving players ability charge for absorbing damage with their barrier would be a great way to reward tanking (if they make PvP a completely separate sandbox, if not then there is no good way to reward this playstyle to my knowledge, most of my changes will follow this philosophy (making two separate sandboxes)). For melee titan, reward them for being closer to the enemies. As of now, Resilience, while a phenomenal stat, has nothing that really makes it stand out aside from GENERIC DAMAGE REDUCTION. For Titans, give them more damage reduction while closer to targets (try 50% and see where that goes). This way Titans can get in the fight, and actually apply certain buffs to themselves to stay in the fight. For Void Titan specifically, give Offensive Bulwark Overshield when you hit with a melee ability, and more for getting a kill with it. And let Titan more Overshield instead of maxing out at the halfway mark, nothing feels worse than being so good a certain class and playstyle that the game is physically limiting you from doing your thing better. Also allow the titan to give nearby allies Overshield better, expand the range, give them more, something. Void Titan wants to be supportive and tanky, let them do that. I would suggest changes for Unbreakable, but I abhor using that aspect and just do not care enough. I think it's...fine though, just needs to be more rewarding in PvE. Solar Titan is fine, I'm not changing anything here, if anything I'd nerf it with the rest of these changes. Arc Titan DESPERATLEY needs more survivability. This is an issue for all Arc subclasses but a few of these could carry over to the others and be fine so moving on. Firstly, AMPLIFIED SHOULD HAVE DAMAGE RESISTANCE BY DEFAULT I DO NOT KNOW WHY BUNGIE HAS NOT DONE THIS ALREADY DEAR GOD JUST DO IT FOR ALL THAT IS HOLY. Secondly, Thundercrash and Fists of Havoc are doodoo. TCrash is just worse Twilight Arsenal now and Fists of Havoc is probably the worst super in the entire game. For Thundercrash, screw it, double the damage. The damage it does now with CotFS is less than Twilight Arsenal at base, that should never happen, I don't know why it did. Then give CotFS like 67% more damage to Thundercrash to get it close to a million. You're going to be right in front of the boss after you hit them, you should reward players for becoming an ICBM but reward them more (shooting a gun) for getting away and doing the rest of the DPS phase normally. Third, buff Fists of Havoc damage and duration, and make the slam work right. Maybe I'm just bad but the slam does the same damage no matter how high I use it from, fix that. Maybe even give Fist more time for killing an enemy with it up to a maximum amount of time to like 30 seconds so it can be the ad clear super it wants to be. Thunderclap is great right now, just kept in check by all the other dog doodoo going on with Titan so unchanged for now, same with the shoulder bash, all the bashes for PvP abilities so fine. Ballistic Slam is just so clunky to use, I don't even know why this was added because it is just so buns. It has so many terms and conditions that have to be met that I'm just in favor of removing the frickin thing because there is no reason to use it over one of the other two melees. Best thing I can do is give it synergy with CotFS. Strand Titan is also fine right now with BoW existing. I'd revisit it after all these other changes, but in fear of it becoming even stronger than it currently is or just pointless I'll leave it alone for now. Stasis Titan, needs a lot. It wants to be the shatter class because does nothing special when it shatters. How about when you're near a titan shattered crystal, you get a stack of Frost Armor (maybe with a half second cooldown between a gain to prevent crazy shatter combos for high DR. I think that is the most titan change I could offer specifically then give Tectonic Harvest the old Stasis Overshield for picking up the dropped shard. Maybe more than it used to give but not much. I don't think there is anything they could do for the melee to make me even consider using it as anything other than a movement tool to shatter initial crystals somewhere else 90% of the time. Maybe when you kill an enemy with the ability to shoots out 3 crystals for your shattering needs but I honestly don't know. For Glacial Quake, honestly I think it needs a separate light melee because all that ends up happening 90% of the time is you just spam the heavy attack and spawn a ton of crystals to shatter. Then again, maybe the change I suggested to the default melee would be enough to make it more worthwhile. Prismatic Titan is just..weird. I can't really talk about anything around it because a lot of the issues are more with the tools they baked into the kit like fragments being predominantly based around buffing and debuffing on a class that just doesn't do both of those well at the same time. I just realized how much I've written. Dear God, I need therapy. Anyways, I hope whoever might be reading this enjoyed the mad ramblings of a Titan main who has too much thinking time. Some of these changes could just be outright busted I'll admit. And again, I think of most of these on a PvE basis as that is my preferred content. I wouldn't expect or even want most of these in PvP. I hope this will get more people talking and sharing ideas, because I personally love hearing them. Anyways, I'm gonna step away from my keyboard now and go touch grass.

[@lancebaggaley9433]

I wish we were back to our actual class identity of the soldier/warrior class and not this weird insistence on melee.

[@basedlibertyprime]

It would be so cool the have built in weapon buffs for titan, like making to easier to get and keep volatile rounds or other such buffs.

[@yaboyospoons7570]

I don't think that was ever a Titan thing, but more of a hunter. Hunters were always the "walking arsenal" so to speak with things like Shadowshot and Golden Gun, and their core kit rewarding precision damage. Titans were always more focused on brute force and using guns was just a way to keep themselves going when brute force wasn't an option. Even in lore, Titans are less about guns and more about using our bodies to protect the weak and fight back against our enemies. Zavala is a great example of this, because, SPOILER ALERT FOR FINAL SHAPE, Zavala loses his light and the first thing he does after mourning is ask Ikora to teach him Stasis. Guns have never been a part of the Titan identity, the only reason it may feel that way is because of how old Destiny used to be played, with minimal ability usage and a stronger focus on guns, but there was never anything in the titan kit that rewards using a gun aside from using it to fill the gap between abilities.

[@shivernaut8607]

@@yaboyospoons7570 this mindset is what's limiting titans, you want a domain to exclude titans so that it can be used to further define hunters. "guns were never a part of Titan identity" in a first person shooter is WILD. Hunters do not own "guns" lol. And insisting that you can't share your toys is what corrals titans in the tiny tiny hyper limited melee only identity they're been saddled with now, even though in the past they've been capable of a lot more.

[@yaboyospoons7570]

@@shivernaut8607 Firstly, I'm a titan main, not a Hunter. Secondly, I should have clarified, nothing in the titan kit inherently plays into gunplay at base, but making guns better in certain ways through your ability and subclass usage. Every class uses guns, but Hunter's are the only class that truly rewards good gunplay. Things like Gunpowder Gamble, throwing knives, and Golden Gun reward good gunplay and even require it. Titans and Warlocks do not, and never have had an equivalent to this in their kit. Guns as just the filling between abilities isn't anyone's in particular, but in their specific kits, an arsenal of precision or very dexterous weapons were always part of the hunter in a way that it isn't a part of other classes.

[@shivernaut8607]

@@yaboyospoons7570 Headshot rewards are pretty unique to hunter but I think that's pretty different from just "guns" I mained Titan in destiny one so when I think about what defines them I think back to those tools as well. I think about Ruin Wings and Iron Harvest.

[@nappy6806]

Don’t forget touch of thunder storm grenades got nerfed to the absolute ground, so I the one thing that was different got nerfed and arc titan pretty much turned into another melee class with slightly flashy gernades. Then bungie keeps trying to find a way to nerf melee builds AND the way game is designed it’s not melee friendly aka boss stomps or hovering boss or just way to dangerous to get close and personal in gms or master raids

[@MaddixCuhming]

I miss old synthos. The longer melee range was kinda the only thing titan melee had in pvp. Maybe shoulder charge but they also nerfed the hell out of that

[@badacid7388]

Shoulder charge should one tap in PvP.

[@MaddixCuhming]

@@badacid7388 still does but ya need a exotic, be in the air for 1/2 second, and if missed leave you in a animation and makes you lose like 1/5 of the charge making you wait till you can use it again. All this against a target that dint see a charging titan and dint just dodge or shotgun him Hunter has a 1 shot ranged knife throw no exotics or anything

[@slayernano4163]

Hell, even the old D1 Armamentarium had built in bonus reserves alongside the additional grenade.

[@vpgvolcanopokemongaming8380]

Change Titan from a melee class to an Armorer class. They have done it about 3-ish times now. First was Diamond Lance, which lead to tangles (but every class can make those). And now Twilight Arsenal. Let Titans prove unique armor and weaponry.

[@sharcblazer99]

Aspects make zero sense, Bastion and Bulwark need to be the same fucking thing. If youre not using volatile you are suffering, if you're using overshields, they break in one shot. Woven mail banner of war, thats it, thats all you need there. Solar has roaring flames and sol invictus, which makes consecration look like garbage. Then you have behemoth titan on stasis which is aids for dps... Titan needs a complete overhaul.

[@ccynth4060]

My idea would be give titan the ability to consume their grenade and have a shield that replenishes on every kill.Almost like devour but for a shield. Giving over shield and melee energy.

[@kzungu4717]

@@ccynth4060 I also think Bastion should probably get modified to give an enhanced version of overshield similar to Feed the Void’s enhanced devour. Void overshields are a lot of the void titan power budget but they don’t block enough to be worth it in my opinion (compared to just building into healing)

[@ccynth4060]

@@kzungu4717 titan should move into a tank agro role. Like the threading decoy have all agro go to a titan and make them really tanky

[@RUGER5264]

Offensive bulwark working for your teammates would be nice aswell.

[@Sam-vw4ks]

@@kzungu4717I forgot the name but there’s a titan exotic that perfectly describes what you were talking about with titans being able to deploy cover but I do think it’s not just only aspects that need work exotics also need complete changes (similar to the exotic I was also talking about)

[@noahyoung5620]

Something that I would like to see would be maybe reworking Citan's ramparts to let you shoot through bubble and give bubble weapons of light back. Then you could basically use bubble as a stronghold during damage phases and bo have to step out and back in to fire rockets and such that would likely kill you in the process. More burst supers would be great too. Maybe an exotic like pyrogale gauntlets that turns twilight arsenal into one super damaging axe, and if it buffed the total damage like nighthawk does, then it would be a lot more viable than the very slow base super.

[@Diiv_Tiid]

The citan rampart would be too op in pvp

[@noahyoung5620]

@@Diiv_Tiid sshhhhhhhhshshhhh. . . You're not supposed to say anything.

[@giantslayer9335]

Hazardous Propulsion I feel is the first step in the right direction. A purely weapon focused exotic, no melees required. And it’s EFFECTIVE.

[@davidavina3941]

I want to to this into perspective. So, since witch queen Titans have gotten the next exotics: Loreley, Horfrost Z, Second Chance, Point Contact Cannonbrace, Cadmus Lance Ridgecap, Abeyant Leap, Arbor Warden, Pyrogale Gaunlets, Wishfull Ignorance and Hazardous propulsion. Notice any pattern? Well they are all melee and barricade focused. So, we went from having 10 exotics focused for melee before Witch Queen to 14 and in the case of barricade related items we went from 3 to 9. In other words Bungie gave titans like a full year of pure melee builds (taking into account we were given those exotics in 4 seasons which is equivalent to a year, not to mention season of the wish lasted 6 months) to play with, only for all those exotics to not be as relevant as synthos. Wonder why the exotic class item feels lackluster? Maybe because for balance reasons they allow us to stack two diferent melee exotics in the two perk columns. Think how spirit of the contact cant be combined with spirit of synthos. Titan has around 40 exotic armor pieces. If Bungie were to have every single exotic perk in those two columns, the would have had to put the 14 in one column to not break the balance. Leaving like 6 other options in the same column. The result, simply returning to more melee focused builds. In the case of barricade items, Loreley was very used until its nerf and the consecuent nerf to how fast you regain health with restauration. Abeyant Leap was very dominant because of how strong was suspend, which I remind you got nerf for all classes. And then of course we got Banner of War. In other words, titans had have easily 2 years of pure melee builds because bonk titan lasted since season of the Haunted up until season of the Deep I think. And then, we got Banner of War for 9 months. In those two years we got only two other prevalent different playstyles. Hoil storm granades and abeyant suspend. They got nerfed enough for Bonk Hammer and Banner to be the most relevant playstyles. I will not count Loreley because it genuinly does not requiere the player to change fundamentaly how bonk hammer worked. I simply think bungie should only make one last melee exotic for the time being. To be concrete a Stasis one. Just to simply have a melee expecific build in every subclass. We need something that refreshes the titan playstyle. Things like hazardous propulsion are a great step forward. I have not seen anyone complain about the exotic. I will make it easy, please make more exotic pieces that do something with granades. Currently, we only have Armamenterium, Ashen Wake, Hoil (which can either be used for melee or granades) and Ursa Furiosa (very debatable because it works with Unbreakable which uses the granades energy). I agree with making more exotic buff weapons. We already have Actium, Peacekeepers, Hazardous Propultion and No Back UP Plans. Only Hazardous has seen any playtime and mainly because its the newest toy. Actium has seen some uses like early Shadowkeep with Xenophage. Peacekeepers were made in vanilla D2 when the two primaries sandbox existed. No Back Up Plans really depends on Void Overshield to really become an endgame viable option. There is a lot of stuff they can do to put forth the futuristic soldier fantasy taking into account how many types of weapons we have. An exotic armor piece that plays into energy and heavy granade launchers would be pretty cool. As I said earlier, we can lean on the granades a lot. Bungie already gave the arc subclass an aspect that pushes granades builds. Lets make either more exotics like Ashen Wake, that give a special effect to a specific type of granade for each subclass. Maybe give a little buff to armamentarium, since it has fallen greatly in this sandbox. Other thing that may help is giving Strand and Stasis more types of granades. The light subclasses have a lot of variety. Meanwhile, the darkness subclasses only have 3 options. By giving more granade types bungie can create aspects or exotics that let the players buildcraft with the extra options. And please, create more one of supers that dont really on melee. Behemoth and Berserker basically have the reissued Fist of Havoc. We could have one of suppers for those classes. I have seen creators brainstorm ideas for stasis and strand.

[@vd9190]

Bro.. who tf is going to read a book in a comment section.

[@SP-me5si]

Me

[@lancebaggaley9433]

@@davidavina3941 hazardous propulsion is a titan version of gunpowder gamble.

[@Blanktester685]

@@vd9190 i did i dont have tiktok brain.

[@jurionov5358]

Bubble was already rarely used bcs you cant dps out of it so it was just a worse well…yet it got gutted. Only ranged dps super being the clunky void axes is also stupid, but thank god for those atleast… god bless the good times with hoil storm grenades, the only non melee titan we ever had. Im not saying consecration is weak or bad, but titana went from must have in a raid(melting point/weapons of light/old rally barricade) to literally griefing your group if you take one now

[@Fenyxclips]

As a diehard Titan, I'd love to see more supers like Twilight Arsenal. Minus that aggressive tracking. Saw it aim at something completely random recently that wasn't even an enemy. Even a super that allows you to place an ammo crate for allies. Each subclass should get a new super that is more heavy weapons focused or aiding the fight in some way. Void should be overshield focused but after bubble was pulled out of the grave it already was in and thrown off the cliff and overshields just being paper, it really needs something. Deployable cover is how I use bubble. Sometimes as a panic button when things are getting too heated. Unbreakable should draw enemy aggro to you and Stronghold should work with the Aspect. Spirit of Stronghold should be added to the Titan class item in the second slot to be paired with Spirit of the Bear. Potential for a good Prismatic combo if enemies prioritised you over everything once the Aspect is in use. Arc should get a super where instead of being the missile, you throw a missile. Even working with Hazardous Propulsion. A new grenade focused Aspect should be added as well as a unique melee option that just grants the ability to use a secondary grenade for a melee. Strand should get the concept art super shown when the Lightfall Vidoc was shown. Hard to think for Strand with anything new due to how focused it already is. For a melee subclass, it feels the most focused and intune with being a melee subclass. Even having the optional range with Flechette Storm. Stasis...It should get something to really zero in on dealing shatter damage with a melee that causes shatters on killing targets as well as a super that is a one and done. So why not throw a much stronger Diamond Lance that does high damage but can also lock down an area. Solar I'd say is in a decent spot but HoS needs help. Though a new super should be placing an ammo box for allies to pick up in a larger sunspot. Not something that invalidates well but can compliment the super instead. If wearing the helmet that places a sunspot when at critical health (forgot which one), then everyone can get that healing included as a sort of escape when the fight grows too intense and the Well vanishes. Just some ideas that aren't 100% thought about or will even work in the sandbox.

[@NecroAsphyxia]

I agree. honestly I think what Titans need is to be THE gunplay class. Let Hunters take on the melee abilities as they have the mobility to justify it and honestly its hard to be Hunter melee uptime when their dodge has such a low cooldown and instantly refreshes their melee. So let hunters take on the mantle of melee, let warlocks become the high power artillery with grenades and long range super bombs, and let titans become the best neutral gunplay experts and combat support. Allow titans to give themselves and nearby allies easier access to weapon buffs and allow titans to become the masters of crowd control. If you do this then titans have a place in the team. The way titans are right now, they only bring damage as they have NO team support. Their personal tankiness does nothing for the rest of the team as it ONLY helps the titan. And since titans can only bring damage that puts them in an impossible balancing act as hunters and warlocks ALSO bring damage... and bring more damage AND team utility. Giving titans CC and neutral game buffs you give fireteams a reason to bring a titan over another warlock or hunter. You make content easier for the rest of the team as the CC allows them to maximize their damage output with minimal risk and bringing easy on demand weapon buffs for everyone gives you a place with the team. Like imagine if Prismatic titan had abilities to easily spread all elemental keyword buffs to everyone? You could then make champions a nonissue for your fireteam regardless of weapon because you are allowing their Kinetic SMG to shoot unraveling destabiliting rounds with amplified or something. Imagine if Stasis titan gave all weapons a pseudo chill clip or headstone. They become the standard soldier who depends on thier gunplay over a reliance on super natural powers to buff them like hunters or Warlocks. The benefit of this is that it can easily be added into the existing titan kits by just adding 1 or 2 aspects to each titan subclass. Just give them an aspect that allows them to apply the keyword/weapon buff to everyone by doing something like eating their grenade or using a barricade or whatever trigger you want to mix things up.

[@Tigerbro6]

void overshield got neutered when they reduced the orb generation on the game.

[@ianmills6260]

People love to say the contest stats dont matter because witness is hard weighted against titan. I played titan the whole day 1 up to witness, and swapped to hunter and cleared. There was no point in the raid where i needed to be on titan. I was the only one on my team. Titan is legitimately completely useless in raids nowadays. We get 0 team utility and bad boss dps.

[@themaynetitan]

Actium war rig, armamentarium, and hazardous propulsion really make me think about how the most fun titan builds for me always the "soldier" themed builds that involved more gunfire and explosions than melee that chain reaction you see from volatile rounds or controlled demolition/middle tree sentinel was always more satisfying than mashing melee and seeing high numbers to me I think Titans should be the buffing+dps class Hunters really be the debuffing+dps class Warlocks provide support with turrets+heals

[@icarusrising2787]

Hit the nail on the head when you said that titans have either had one absolute best in slot build or none, and if they dont have one then they're not worth having in a fireteam

[@Slimerror]

The fix is easy, they want titans to be the melee class but refuse to let them have good melee build options. All they need to do is have titans have a few routes to take when it comes to a build. Brawler = Best of both worlds, with decent damage and the capacity to regen health or build oversheild while in close combat. Knockout = little to no oversheild/regen with impressive damage output and emphasis on ability regeneration for big damage dealing melees Immovable = Pitiful melee damage with improved emphasis on regeneration/oversheild making them nearly unkillable walls for the team Long-range = Above average damage with rewarding ability regeneration (like how on hunter you get your knife back for landing precision)

[@user-jl3ol9lz7s]

As a Titan main I can sympathize with the struggle. Being simply the punchy class can feel repetitive and doesn't and much value in any endgame content. It feels like there's just a like of identity variety. I would like to see Titans get a new super that buffs weapon play. Say an arc super, "soldier of fortune" that maxes out reload speed and increases fire rate for self and all allies in a radius.

[@tonebrown2961]

I feel there's a lack of hamrony with Titans and their exotics, mods, and abilities. I just thought of something, a Titans class ability needs to change. Maybe turn it into something the briefly buffs grenades and/melee/overall defense. Several of the Titan armors haven't aged well. Most of the viable stuff can't be used in Prismatic or nerfed with no balance. CAN WE PLEASE FIX THE STASIS MELEE?! If you want to make, really make Titan a melee class, then lean into it. Give Titan better sword usage, better glaive usage. Make the normal melee a punch with AOE at base.

[@novavstheworld7925]

Tbh I think the bigger problem is subclass identity. Each subclass has the verbs but every class has access to the same verbs. Limit and add exclusivity’s and I think you solve half the problem. A lot of times hunter/warlock does stuff Titan does but just better. And removing those from those classes or adding others to titans would resolve half of the “titans feel useless” talk. -a Titan main since 2016

[@zomgie6817]

The first few things that come to mind. Buff thunder crash damage, nerf ways to abuse the super. Keep Solar Titan as the most melee focused Titan. You literally are holding a giant hammer, keep it melee, it makes sense. Void over shields can be buffed with Titan passives or some shiz, idk, and buff bubble, it’s kinda crap now. Strand rework is just necessary. Making you reliant on regeneration is just too risky, too hard to balance. Rework it to dps, maybe think about that original Titan super with the minigun. Stasis, I got nuthin. Idk.

[@RUGER5264]

Still hoping Solar Titan gets a javalin super that functions like gathering storm. Only it constantly ignites the target.

[@AxisChurchDevotee]

A rocket launcher that shoots a big nuke would be better.

[@RUGER5264]

@@AxisChurchDevotee until that one teammate walks in front during DPS 🤣

[@marcosmenezesguedes4243]

How about a proton cannon style? Or Spartan laser??

[@ayejay2688]

we just need more ways for titan to do non-melee stuff, that's really it, melee is fun if it's supporting pillars and abilities work, but since bungie keeps nerfing every ability and avenue that melee builds have for power, they no longer feel fun as a result i still don't know why the secondary power fantasy bungie originally setup of titan also being heavy weapons support, was canned, it's tragic as that's what's desperately needed rn

[@ninety_ldn]

Another take on this, is that Hunter has the exact same problem except that their best build melee build happens to be one of the best PvE build in the game. There really isn’t any synergy in hunter prismatic if you aren’t playing combination blow. And the singular classes aren’t as strong as the prismatic combination blow. I hate playing hunter because why are they the melee class. And if warlocks didn’t have the turrets build, they would be calling for an entire rework to their prismatic. Prismatic was meant to open up options, and now we are stuck with more one dimensional builds than ever.

[@MantecadoMantecadito]

The only solution I see is make Titan very strong close combat and then make massive damage . Because the damage is already done .

[@okamisan3642]

Banner of War raises all Titans!!!

[@Tigerbro6]

I feel like the main problem isnt necessarily the melee builds, but how one note melee builds that are GOOD get. consecration spam is just a different shape of lil hammer spam. its a mindless playstyle. thunderclap is REALLY fun right now on prismatic with the refund arc melee exotic. I think they just need tot make INTERESTING melees be a thing. not tie all of titan's new melees behind aspects and let the class have a more varied place in the sandbox. maybe damage bonuses on the kit would give it a spot on pve more like you said. I've been playing titan since the game went free to play and i had the chance to see it evolve through all its phases. and I wouldnt feel bad to say its a pvp first class, but when the game is so tooled around pve it feels awful when you're just not as useful to your team with the current kit. Frankly a buff to void would be amazing right now. Solar can perform but has been neutered due to nerfs to general things from the subclass instead of the actual culprits involving aspects that buff resto or stuff like that. bungie is terrible with these changes in this new era of the game and it feels like they just need a more inspired person to take over titan development. I personally thing a damage resist while sliding would make people actually give cryoclasm a chance. There's a bunch of changes that bungie made to titan that just feel like "hey corporate wants you to make sure you're working so work on something on the kit and ship it" the cryoclasm cooldown change, the burning steps turning into a legendary pants exotic, all these unique things titan had slowly got neutered one by one. What titan needs is not only a subclass rework, but a big armor piece overhaul. In these past 3 expansions that i've played the game religiously the only exotic that was a mainstay on my kit was synthoceps. Heart of Inmost light was up there for a couple seasons and then they nerfed it to a state where it cant even perform boss dps anymore. Starfire had a similar fate but then it got turned into a super now, so I hope the team gets it together and notices that titan mains want more stuff around grenade builds too. It doesnt need to take anything away from warlocks, it just needs to make other aspects like roaring flames have any use outside melee, ashen wake rework pls

[@AndrewWilson-fb8ge]

ez fix, give Titans golden rocket launcher super, a medium to long range super with a focus on barriers and/or grenades so a very explosive class with some range.

[@MantecadoMantecadito]

Wi know pvp has some influence on Titan to

[@badacid7388]

The ward of Dawn should be indestructible, and the buffs should be buffed. Lol.

[@badacid7388]

The shield should be buffed for the team members that shoot through it to offset the loss of damage from the wielder not shooting.

[@Andres-bf5cq]

banners on every subclass

[@oceanrichardson4674]

Remove all the nerfs they did on every class and every exotic armor on titans put there back were they were originally then we wouldn’t be complaining plus add some aspects to prismatic class

[@sh4rkstooth340]

just keep the nerfs in pvp it shouldnt be that hard to discern pve from pvp

[@eldrielle6327]

actium war rig should also allow heavy ammo boxes be generated from you for yourself and allies whenever you cast your barricade (with rally barricade granting less due to shorter cooldown), that way not only are you the Machine Gunner but also the Ammo Supplier for the fireteam, might turn it from a meme to a viable endgame support option, and it really fits the theme of the exotic all about packing endless munitions and never stop shooting. and if we talking about being tanks, what truly defines a Tank is not their ability to block or soak up dmg but their ability to take away the aggro of the enemies so they're not shooting at your allies, currently the Threaded Specter decoy has this property but it exists on the Hunter class of all places.

[@BASEDROBBERSPONGE234]

I want like a hive BERSERK GUTS solar super.

[@Blackjesus327]

I’m not even mad with just being melee. But not even being the best melee???? Wtf

[@robertetchingham7337]

The problem is that all these points are really good. And thats why bungie wont do it

[@aranax418]

I want my strand minigun

[@gabrieldidan]

i mean titan should be the gunner, hunter the one that makes guns that are bad good like a specialist and how they have lucky pants and warlock the ability spammer.

[@MantecadoMantecadito]

I will like to have like a big spear of stasis

[@rd8081]

Dial down the melee fantasy

[@rakebangalang]

Bros got some valid points, but anyone who uses deterministic chaos is a fed

[@MsCOLDSLAYER]

The problem with titans is in front of the screen

[@snappa_tv]

im a titan main. ive been a titan main since year 1 destiny 1. melee is not fun. its never been fun, and its completely useless in endgame content. bungie has shoehorned this class into being "the melee class". titan players NEVER wanted this. it was only done because nobody at bungie mains titan. its gotten so bad that i have no more reason to play this awful game.

[@chriscunningham8703]

Titans still feel the best class to me!

[@ksa-5057]

My hole destiny journy i just played as titan over 6000+ hours titan being the best of the three light subclass to being the worst of them. volitile was only for titans. Solar was the most op thing 25% for being in sun worrior and melting point gave you that 30% damage. Finally arc were the melee power house is. All of them got nerf to the ground.What feelings you do actually have for titan. Titan is fun but not as fun as used to. I know some of these nerf was for balance but the solar subclass nerfs was not justified. If you really love titan you know those abilites ome of them got to warlock and others got to hunters and titan being forsaken. Feelings will not get anythung to no where

[@ksa-5057]

Im not hating on the other classes dont get me wrong but titan gave but it did not get anything in return

[@AdrianoiD2]

what are you on about ? titans haven't been it a awesome spot like now since the storm grenade builds

[@kayval274]

Like the Biden switch up, too little too late.

[@badacid7388]

The ward of Dawn should be indestructible, and the buffs should be buffed. Lol.