The War That Ended the Ancient World

[@rycolligan]

I will never get over the Roman capacity to have a civil war, get invaded, have their capital besieged by multiple enemy armies simultaneously, and still pull out a win. And even with the later losses to the Arab invasion, Constantinople would stand another 800 years. It boggles my mind.

[@cgavin1]

A lot of that had to do with the very chaos that perpetuated the cycle. Ironically it was their strength because it allowed the strong to dominate the weak and encouraged ruthless meritocracy.

[@fbswampfox]

It was administration and a grand network of diplomats and spies. This is well documented. Even with military defeat the government was still functional.

[@geordiejones5618]

It really lived up to its name Nova Roma. The sister city that stood a thousand years. Also it tickles me that as the Romans became more Greek, the more they fought themselves like true men of the Balkans.

[@DivergentStyles]

@@geordiejones5618 Romans where orignally Greek, Trojans.

[@RomaInvicta202]

Economy and logistics, mate - Romans were good at them already during Republic; personally their logistics amazes me most We didn't equal that until 19th century

[@notatranslationschannel8896]

The fact that school history classes go from the Roman Empire straight to the Middle Ages and skips over things like THIS is insane.

[@martinusv7433]

Deep-down, there are a few significant reasons for that historical omission in the West: The Great Schism (religious), and the subsequent greatest treachery in European history in the form of the 4th Crusade (1204). In other words, guilt has triggered a sense of denial, preventing the recognition of the Eastern Roman Empire for what it truly was: the direct continuation of the Roman Empire (as opposed to the HRE), and the greatest protector of Christianity in the history of the world.

[@OAlem]

@@martinusv7433 That is all wrong on multiple levels. The great schism and the 4th crusade were well within the middle ages, and they were taught in schools, so your theory doesn't make sense at all. It seems that you misunderstood the post or didn't care and were just looking for a chance to spout your propaganda. Even if it were true that the ERC was the continuation of the RE, that is nothing to be proud of anyway. And the greatest protector of Christianity? It sounds like the crusader is you.

[@martinusv7433]

@@OAlem It seems that there really was one person who misunderstood a post...but that definitely wasn't me. I thought that it was clear enough that I listed 2 REASONS for that omission, NOT 2 events that have been omitted. Those 2 reasons are the main CAUSES why the Western (Catholic) educational system attempts to water down the fact that Byzantium blatanty WAS the most prominent protector of Christianity for hundreds upon hundreds of years (because how exactly could anyone pretend to be a Christian while they're on record for brutally sacking and destroying that protective empire). And what on earth do you mean by "even if it were true"?? There was one Rome, which got divided into 2 parts: the East and the West. The fact that the Western part got annihilated DIDN'T stop the Eastern part from being Rome, for goodness sake! Just like when North Korea happens to get annihilated it obviously doesn't stop South Korea from still being Korea. It shouldn't be really that hard to understand. And make no mistake, if you happen to be anywhere from Europe, North / South America, or Australia, then you'd most likely be praying towards Mecca 5 times a day WITHOUT the Byzantine defensive efforts and grit. The Battle of Poitiers (732) was just a historical footnote compared to the significance of the failed Arab sieges of Constantinople (674-678 & 717-718). Btw, I'm NOT an Orthodox Christian myself and I've got even less ethnic connections with Greece or Greeks - so it's all about giving credit where credit is obviously due.

[@apotato6278]

@@martinusv7433 I'd imagine the real reason why this is rarely talked about is because of the waning influence of the Roman Empire and the rise of recorded history in Northern Europe. By the 600s the Byzantine empire is no longer powerful enough to directly influence France or Germany and as a result it is overshadowed by the rise of Charlemagne. In the North the Vendel Era is slowly evolving into the Viking Age and on the British Isles the Heptarchy is taking shape. In the West this period is already occupied with local history, there is little place for the Rise of Islam. For a Frenchman the 1st siege of Constantinople is a footnote in history whilst the Battle of Poitiers is a significant event. In the same way Athanasios Diakos is a national hero in Greece but completely unknown in the rest of Europe. It's hardly a religious conspiracy which aims to cover up the rule of Heraclius, it's simply so that the education system has a tendency to favor local events over ones which happened far away.

[@OAlem]

@@martinusv7433 Yep, crusader confirmed.

[@MaxwellAerialPhotography]

The final Sassanid-Roman War is one of the most incredible and understudied wars in history. What Heraclius achieved was truly miraculous.

[@VengefulLeprechauns]

Heraclius was the 1st Napoleon (A great man who had the misfortune to live long enough to see his life’s work undone)

[@darnellgrape-drinker4916]

Press F to pay respects to Heraclius.

[@starcapture3040]

the war wasn't missive as Imagined. Hercules Attacked upper Mesopotamia. the whole war took 5 bettles. Syria and egypt were returned peacefully with no war.

[@velstadtvonausterlitz2338]

@@starcapture3040 🙄

[@starcapture3040]

@@velstadtvonausterlitz2338 Oh so I must exaggerate it so you can imagine it in certain way?

[@Paulsinke]

I love the historical context and the account of the Sassanid/Roman war of course, but I really appreciate the poetic firsthand account of this ancient cathedral still standing after all these centuries. The little sensory details about the wind and the grass and the hand made bricks really fires my imagination. Thanks Garrett!

[@ctfamily40]

In a sea of awful pronunciations, direct copying from Wikipedia, and endless inaccuracies on the "history" side of KZbin, toldinstone is a beacon of good, accurate info. Thanks as always- you're the best!

[@anonymike8280]

All I care about is whether a video puts me to sleep. A droning male voice is always best for that purpose. This video is too short for my playlist thought. I prefer at least 40 minutes, or it would not work. Accuracy or not means nothing.

[@MiguelTyson]

@@anonymike8280 that’s sad

[@anonymike8280]

@@MiguelTyson If you had trouble sleeping, you would think different. What I actually do is make and save playlists. They go on all night, and when I wake up in the middle of the night, which I always do, there's something to listen to. It's replaced leaving the radio on all night. Back in the radio days, I often was awake for the 5 a.m. farm show. I learned a lot about cows. It's amazing sometime what people will say and admit to when they're in front of a friendly audience. There are cow secrets. Just that I've forgotten most of them.

[@histguy101]

So true. Pop-history KZbin channels often scare me.

[@wrnchhead76]

@@anonymike8280 haha same!!!

[@deusvult5247]

It’s crazy how Armenia and Armenians are still around. They’ve been through a lot , respect

[@zippyparakeet1074]

So are the Romans but they have been forced to forget their Romanness by Western powers and embrace their ancient Hellenic identity which they really had nothing to do with by the time of the Greek war of Independence. Modern Greeks are direct descendants and continuation of the Byzantine Romans- aka the Greco-Romans of the East. Not the old Achaeans and Classical Greeks. A very simple way to verify this fact is their longing to gain back their old capital- Constantinople aka Istanbul.

[@underarmbowlingincidentof1981]

@@zippyparakeet1074 tf are you talking about? Nobody forced anyone to forget their Romanness. When did western powers do that? Italians are proud of their roman history, and greeks are too. Greeks just like the whole cool greek stuff more than the stuff the romans brought. Most nations are more fond of the stuff "their" people did than what foreigners forced upon them through military invasion in the past.

[@goatwarrior3570]

@@zippyparakeet1074 Romans ripped off most of their culture from classical Greece. And do tell where all these Grecco-Romans came from. They didn't sail in from Italy and replace the native population, if that's what you're getting at.

[@metsglukh]

Idk what these other comments are talking about 😂😂😂😂 I'm Armenian and our history and culture is very important to us, every time I hear the name of my motherland in one of these videos about the times of the Great Roman Empire, makes me very proud. Though also very sad that the world keeps ignoring the things that are happening to us

[@thaneofwhiterun3562]

​@@goatwarrior3570Romans didn't rip anyone off, they had their own native traditions as do all peoples and cultural exchange due to trade did the rest. Chill out.

[@ethangonzalez8904]

Isn't it crazy how most people have NO IDEA about Rome's rivalry with Persia? If you asked, most people would say Rome's greatest rival was Carthage (who the Romans beat in only two wars) or the barbarian tribes of western and central Europe, or the Huns. But Persia remained an unconquerable rival RIGHT NEXT to Rome's eastern border. Two virtual equals with millennia of proud history, constantly exchanging blows and territory in the Levant and Fertile Crescent, but who could never fully beat one another. Finally, they fight a war so cataclysmic that it marks the end of a roughly 14000-year historical era, brings both proud empires to their knees, and paves the way for a new civilization to conquer them both as the dominant power of the age.

[@ejoji4245]

you expressed that very well, good comment

[@selfiekroos1777]

The last one was more of a greek persian rivalry. byzantines were greeks That rivalry was historically greco persian well back into antiquity

[@ejoji4245]

@@selfiekroos1777 i agree with you, but just because our ancestors had a rivalry with them that doesn't mean the romans didn't, i would honestly say that the roman identity was so compatible with the greek one, that some of our enemies became theirs also.

[@selfiekroos1777]

@Ejoji The Romans operated differently from the Greeks. Greeks were into trading and city state-hood. Greeks argued on points for days at a time in order to find the true meaning of something. The Romans operated more like Persians... Empire building, domination and debate to get to a point to make a decision not to think and theorize too much. Though the Greek culture influenced the Romans early on, the mindset of the empires east and west of the Hellenic world had more relatable function. Greece was a heavy culture and commerce based fragmented society, while Rome and Persia were empires who sht first and asked questions later. Minus Alexander's dynasty which really was only created as a defensive accident and the eventual Byzantines (who were not so much an empire , but an attempt at preserving what Christianity hadn't destroyed) the Greeks were a far more distinct and thoughtful society than either of their neighbors. Plus, the Romans hated facial hair while the Greeks loved it lol

[@ethangonzalez8904]

@@selfiekroos1777 except with mustaches, Spartans HATED mustaches

[@themengsk176]

Honestly, Heraclius is such an under studied figure in history. The war he devoted his life to fighting is simply legendary and almost defies belief in the impact it has on history.

[@samwallaceart288]

I can't believe how _well-written_ this is. Descriptive, relatable, and to-the-point. I love the use of the adjacent cathedral as a framing point for the story.

[@ruufusdeleon1264]

I feel such melancholy and sympathy for Heraclius and the Empire every time I hear of his heroic deeds.

[@generalcaesar3477]

The sources say the Persian War drained him physically, spiritually, and emotionally. For about the five years between his invasion of Mesopotamia and the battle of Nineveh he had to carry the knowledge that if he made a mistake and his army was destroyed, Roman civilisation would follow. Add to that he had to leave his wife and children in Constantinople during the siege. It’s no real wonder then that he had to leave the defence of Syria to subordinates when the Arabs invaded. It didn’t help that when he died in 641 his family squabbled over power. One son died of TB whilst Heraclius’ hated second wife and her son were overthrown by a power hungry general. That general crowned Heraclius’ grandson, an 11 year old boy, Emperor, at a time when they needed a fully grown martial emperor.

[@concept5631]

@@generalcaesar3477 Unfortunate.

[@jacob4920]

I would actually argue that the ancient world officially died somewhat before this war, with the sacking of Rome itself, and the ending of the Western Roman Empire, leaving only Byzantium. At that moment, virtually all of the remnants of human history "Before Christianity" (or BC) were officially gone. Persia and Constantinople remained. But Imperial Egypt, Greece, Rome, Carthage, the Hebrew Kingdoms of Israel, and many other civilizational earmarks of the ancient world, in and around Europe and the Middle East/Africa, were officially gone by that point.

[@martinusv7433]

@@jacob4920 The Ancient World ended with the birth and spread of Islam. That was the most destructive watershed moment in history (and its ripple effects have continued 'til this day and age).

[@concept5631]

@@jacob4920 What of China?

[@TetsuShima]

Eastern romans: "Could you please try to not invade our territory...FOR FIVE MINUTES!?" Persians, ottomans, mongols, huns, barbarians, etc: "What an awesome capital you have, guys!" 😎

[@jeffreywilliams3421]

Thats the problem with being the crossroads of the western world, you tend to get alot of traffic🙃

[@theuniverse5173]

Mongols invaded east rome? Dam never heard of that

[@Intranetusa]

​@@theuniverse5173 It was way later during the middle ages and long after the "ancient era". The Eastern Roman Empire had split into several different states by the 1200s. The Mongols defeated some of these Eastern Roman states in battle, which caused some states to surrender and other states to seek alliances/good relations with the Mongols. At the Battle of Kose Dag, the Mongols defeated troops from the Latin Empire and the Empire of Trebizond. This caused the Empire of Trebizond to surrender to the Mongols and the Latin Empire to seek a peace & alliance treaty.

[@Intranetusa]

​ @TheUniverse It was way later during the middle ages and long after the "ancient era". The Eastern Roman Empire had split into several different states by the 1200s. The Mongols defeated some of these Eastern Roman states in battle, which caused some states to surrender and other states to seek alliances/good relations with the Mongols. At the Battle of Kose Dag, the Mongols defeated troops from the Latin Empire and the Empire of Trebizond. This caused the Empire of Trebizond to surrender to the Mongols and the Latin Empire to seek a peace & alliance treaty.

[@JonatasAdoM]

@@theuniverse5173 That's why we usually say they've invaded the Byzantine Empire

[@MicrophoneMichael]

I like that you hardly exaggerate and any artistic license you take is simple, beautiful, and adds emotion without altering the history you’re teaching.

[@crakkbone]

Adds*

[@josephatthecoop]

I love this video. The Mren Cathedral provided a perfect lens for the story. I experienced it as a human-scaled access point to the clash of empires, long decayed but with enough detail left that I could imagine being there when it was new and the events it commemorates were living memory. I hadn’t known anything about this key moment in history before. Now I know and I’m sure I will remember. Well done, and thank you.

[@messianic_scam]

this is totally fake history like I'm watching afrocentric videos ,ghassanids and Christian Arabs in levant who carried ALL byzantine's wars and Romans's before them in the region against persians ,they were not the romans who faught sassanids it was their classical rival the ghassanids who ruled the fertile crescent for 450 continues years fake history no one byzantine chariot passed these desert between Syria and iraqi then between Iraq and Iran , romans were in europe fighting their last wars with the slavs ,goths and bulgarians who were attacking Rome borders from every where they will never call up all their power to fight in unknown arabian deserts when they were taking their last breath

[@symb2005]

I've become very interested in ancient Rome over the last year thanks to people like Mike Duncan and Lars Brownworth, as well as other YT channels like Historia Civilis. It's always a pleasure to be able to immerse myself in this world. Fantastic video--please devote your energies to making more like this.

[@doublem1975x]

Mike Duncan is the best. His history of Rome podcast was great.

[@ДжекИтальянец]

I would also recommend Robin Pierson and his "History of Byzantium"

[@skysurfer5cva]

@@doublem1975x I am almost done with my 13th time through The History of Rome. It's that good, and Mike's subtle humor is well appreciated.

[@doublem1975x]

@@ДжекИтальянец Very good podcast too but I found Robin gets a little too bogged down by minutiae and the pacing gets dragged out. Duncan is the best ever at conveying information in a concise and entertaining manner. He did another great series called “Revolutions”after he finished THOR.

[@jadedmastermind]

Mike Duncan stands out above the rest because of the dryly sarcastic humor he sprinkles into his episodes.

[@theinquisition7]

The tragedy of Heraclius was, if his story ended with the victory over the Sassanids and he had died shortly after, he would have been known as one of the greatest Emperors in Roman history( he arguably still is one)…..he lived in an unfortunate time and lived too long

[@The_Guit]

Man, he should have just drank bad wine

[@juniorjames7076]

Epilogue: Rising scholarship suggests that the "trauma" of those wars birthed Islam among the Christian/Pagan/Jewish Arab mercenary tribes. Heraclius created/used the concept of "Holy War" among soldiers and mercenaries, which planted a seed.

[@williamstevenson8454]

Love this unique form of historical analysis. Really helps you to understand the perspective of the people in the 6th century

[@weed...5692]

This is the sort of history that once used to be the norm: an entertaining and educational story of how things happened. It's very much old school (and it's cool).

[@tomlxyz]

@@weed...5692 The old school version didn't care as much about truth tho

[@GlazeBattleBorn]

Vivec

[@messianic_scam]

it's totally fake history like afrocentric history ,ghassanids and Christian Arabs in levant who carried ALL byzantine's wars and Romans's before them in the region against persians ,they were not the romans who faught sassanids it was their classical rival the ghassanids who ruled the fertile crescent for 450 continues years fake history no one byzantine chariot passed these desert between Syria and iraqi then between Iraq and Iran , romans were in europe fighting their last wars with the slavs ,goths and bulgarians who were attacking Rome borders from every where they will never call up all their power to fight in unknown arabian deserts when they were taking their last breath

[@greekvvedge]

Great video on possibly one of the greatest sequence of events in Western history. Imagine if Maurice had not been killed by Phokas. The maintenance of antiquity's status quo in the Balkans and Mideast for how much longer? No Slavic Balkans, no Islamic Conquest.

[@ziggytheassassin5835]

history is built on seemingly insignificant petty things that add up and end up having drastic consequences.

[@LordWyatt]

A possible strengthening of Italy and southern Hispania? Fuck Ph*cas

[@bl1tz533]

Like the big lebowski

[@messianic_scam]

fake history ,ghassanids and Christian Arabs in levant who carried ALL byzantine's wars and Romans before them in the region against persians ,they were not romans who faught sassanids it was their classical rival the ghassanids who ruled the fertile crescent for 450 continues years fake history no one byzantine chariot passed these desert between Syria and iraqi then between Iraq and Iran , romans were in europe fighting their last wars slavs ,goths and bulgarians who were attacking Rome borders from every where they will never call up all their power to fight in arabia and deserts when they were taking their last breath

[@messianic_scam]

hohoho Maurice was persia's bitch at that time byzantium was done deal witnessing their last breath by civil wars and the slavs and goths attacking everywhere actually the persian king parviz came to take over cause phocas was getting the borders back,it wasn't phocas

[@bodaciousbiker]

It's amazing how much hostility you encounter from some people when you try to explain to them that Rome actually fell in 1453 and not 476AD. The 'Byzantines' knew they were Roman(and never called themselves Byzantines!), but we in the modern era sometimes seem to forget this, or worse, choose not to accept it. Maybe it's because they spoke Greek rather than Latin, or because they adopted the customs of the Greek part of their once vast empire, or perhaps because they were Christian. But the reality is that the Rome of Cicero, Caesar and Augustus survived for over two thousand years and fell only about fifty years before da Vinci painted his Mona Lisa and some thirty years before the Tudors ruled England! Thank's for this video on the 'end of antiquity'!

[@gerardgarbutt607]

you got it!

[@Evagelopoulos862]

Rome fell in 476AD. Byzantium (renamed New Rome ,Constantinople) fell in 1453AD. Romans mean citizens of various ethnicities with Roman citizenship , free citizens. Rome a Greek word Ρώμη mean strength.

[@SovietBear91]

@@Evagelopoulos862 cope.seethe.dilate

[@Evagelopoulos862]

@@SovietBear91 Take it easy ,baby 🙂

[@blede8649]

Exactly. I would also argue that even Western Rome didn't really fall in 476, Odoacer's and later the Ostrogothic kingdom were more of a new managent rather than a new thing (all the institutions, culture and customs of old Rome remained). What finished it off, the Western equivalent of this war, was the Gothic War and its apocalyptic carnage, and the subsequent Lombard invasion. Ironically, Justinian did more to destroy Rome than the barbarians themselves.

[@jaxellis3008]

Wow. Just wow. I've enjoyed your channel for a year or so now and know you are a creator of the highest quality and integrity but this video hit me in a different kind of way. This period is so rarely covered or explained in any meaningful way and I learned things I needed to know while being quite entertained. Thank you so much for your work. What a bittersweet and strange (and dynamic) era!

[@John_Fugazzi]

This is a story few people, even those interested in ancient history, know. Thanks for telling it so clearly and emphasizing its importance..

[@tomsuiteriii9742]

The sixth century, from Justinian and Heraclius to the Persian Wars, is a fascinating one, although far overshadowed by the Arab conquest of the Mediterranean world in the seventh. If anything, this helps contextualize the events that were soon to come, which are relevant to this day!

[@starcapture3040]

Well if you look at it These early Muslims done something only can be seen in phantasy movies. a minority fighting on 4 fronts defeating everybody in their way later creating a very high culture in one century eventually their legacy would completely destroy Rome. it is not easy to avoid being stunned by it. Just look at Kings and Generals channel its highest Watched videos are about that conquest

[@tomsuiteriii9742]

@@starcapture3040 Impressive, indeed. However, not unheard of. The world happened-upon by the Arabs in the seventh century was once fractured by war and plague. Alexander took on a unified Persian empire with 30,000 men at most, and the Mongol Empire--although short-lived--was larger in scope and faster in conquest. The Arab conquest of the Mediterranean was still a fantastic feat, but one that had been done before, and since.

[@starcapture3040]

​@@tomsuiteriii9742 It is totally unheard of! a 40 year old dude out of sudden started preaching a religion claims to Finnish all of god messages sent to mankind through out of history in none other than mecca the center of Arabic Pagan worship in a barbaric region so desolate and harsh for living with few population living in scattered villages. for 25 years living in constant danger of extinction by Pagan Arabs known for their rigid mentality oppressing them then to ultimately win creating a republic after the prophet death defeating super powers while creating their own super power to this day still the fourth largest empire in world history. the mongols have never had any such story they just conquered and destroyed eventually being defeated by the Muslims too lol and their empire fell so fast with not leaving any new creative culture to flourish. we today use the algorithm thanks to that high culture these early Muslims have created. it is so sad how downhill they are now. Muslims lived in the seventh century not in the 12 century much farther in time when technology advanced especially in militarism not leaving the fact the mongols used barbaric methods to conquer. these early msuilms weren't big collection of tribes living beside rivers and plains like the mongols. their region is absolutely harsh except for yemen. Alexander conquered already established one empire that declined massively from within that its whole strength lies on big armies. The sassined and roman empires were long standing advanced military empires and once alexander died his empire died with him and once he reached india he was defeated although many don't like to claim that while Muslims defeated every force they encountered and left a ever lasting legacy.

[@tomsuiteriii9742]

@@starcapture3040 Why is your reply hidden? That's strange. Anyway, I'm aware of these typical talking points of Muslim apologists, so I will briefly answer your objections: Number one, yes, Islam _claims_ to finish all human religions. The only problem is that anyone can claim to do this. In a biblical sense, the life, death, resurrection, and ascension of Christ closed the book on God's message to humanity. Everything he does going forward is via his Son. This is what someone referred to as an absolute attempting to overrule an absolute. At any point in time another "Muhammad" can come along, proclaim the previous religion to be corrupt, and start fresh. Number two, I've heard the argument that Islam somehow "defeated" the Mongols, which, to me, is bizarre. In a sense, you're correct: the Mongol conquest of Eurasia laid waste to civilizations and killed millions in the process. However, the bulk of its wrath was unleashed on the Muslim world, including Baghdad. In fact, the end of the "Islamic Golden Age" coincides with the Mongol conquest of the Abbasid Caliphate. Therefore, if Islam defeated the Mongols, it was the most pyrrhic victory ever. Finally, Alexander did not rely on big armies. It was exactly the opposite. And if you want to measure truth by military conquest, you must account for the losses dealt to Muslim armies, as well as the victories. From Charles Martel to Constantinople to Lepanto to the Six-Day War in 1967, the Arab and Islamic world have faced serious military defeats. By the logic of God being solely on the side of truth, Muslims should have never lost a single battle in history.

[@alafujah]

@@tomsuiteriii9742 The main difference between those examples and the arab conquest, and by far their greatest achievement, was how lasting and thoroughly transformative they were. Alexander and the Mongols may have created larger empires, but the arabs succeeded in creating an entire civilisation, one that still stands today.

[@BrockSamson18]

Absolutely nailed it, bro. This is one of your best yet.

[@costasakellariou3530]

Mren is located in the militarized zone just on the Turkish side of its border with present day Armenia. It is in imminent threat of collapse, and Armenian monuments in what was once Armenia are not a high priority for the Turkish government... also, listening to the opening brings to mind the verse of the persian poet Saadiquoted by the Ottoman conqueror of Constantinople as he looked at the vast palace of Voukouleon, which had been empty for a few hundred years. It goes..." The spiders weave curtains in the palace of the Caesars, the owl keeps the watch in the tower of Afrasiyab"...

[@michaelmccoy2847]

I find ancient history, culture and knowledge to be endlessly fascinating. Furthermore, it is worthwhile to understand and enjoy the past while finding parallels in our contemporary world. I recently discovered your channels and I am steadily working through them. Already, this particular work about the cataclysmic conflict between Rome and Persia that set the stage for rapid spread of Islam is my favorite thus far. Thank you for your work, Garrett! Best wishes!

[@daniel-wood]

That last paragraph gave me chills. Your writing is beautiful

[@savabout6487]

This was all Justin II's fault for breaking the peace with Persia because he thought he was hot shit

[@vandare6913]

"It may be said, however, that despite its multi-national character, three forces tended to give it unity. One was Orthodoxy, the other a common language, and the third the imperial tradition. The first and the second were Greek and to the extent that they were Greek the Empire was Greek also. The third was Roman, and to that extent the Empire was also Roman." The Transfer of Population as a Policy in the Byzantine Empire Author(s): Peter Charanis Source: Comparative Studies in Society and History, Vol. 3, No. 2, (Jan., 1961), pp. 140-154 Published by: Cambridge University Press

[@patmorris9692]

@Twitter Is Cancer “infested”. If anything Greeks civilized the otherwise unsophisticated romans. Greek and Hebrew are still spoken today as mother tongues. Latin lmaoooo !!!!!

[@TheHylianBatman]

Wow, I love hearing about places like this. Little abandoned places that nobody would think anything about. Amazing that it has such history.

[@gkoogz9877]

The work you're doing is such important escapism from our own Roman collapse.

[@Peppersfirst]

This one will be worse.

[@simonestreeter1518]

@@Peppersfirst But the wind will certainly be blowing through the grass.

[@timjohnson1199]

Socialism eventually kills what it infects.

[@messianic_scam]

this is totally fake history ,ghassanids and Christian Arabs in levant who carried ALL byzantine's wars and Romans's before them in the region against persians ,they were not the romans who faught sassanids it was their classical rival the ghassanids who ruled the fertile crescent for 450 continues years fake history no one byzantine chariot passed these desert between Syria and iraqi then between Iraq and Iran , romans were in europe fighting their last wars with the slavs ,goths and bulgarians who were attacking Rome borders from every where they will never call up all their power to fight in unknown arabian deserts when they were taking their last breath

[@gkoogz9877]

@@messianic_scam Learn how to write in complete sentences, please.

[@patstokes7040]

I'm always amazed that you can encapsulate complex history into a 14 minute video. I will have to listen many times and take notes to get all the moving parts to stop moving. Thanks for giving your educational experience to those that love history but haven't had the time or opportunities, or even the brains, to peruse the more complex themes. The late Roman history is most difficult. .

[@unclegrim]

I'm glad the algorithm brought me to your channel. I love the format, writing, and subjects of your videos. I absolutely adore the fact that your videos also aren't choked down with generic stock action movie music in the background which is a regrettable feature of most historical youtube videos. Can't wait to see this channel explode.

[@dylanmcdowell3894]

Wow, the outro to this video is simply beautiful. Makes me want to go find it, out there in the steppe, and sit outside to hear the birds and the wind, and the echoes of history.

[@ariebrons7976]

In summary: King of Persia flees to Rome and gets restored to the throne. Roman king gets deposed, Persian king invades Rome to restore true heir. Deposer gets destroyed by his governors, and is replaced with Heracleas. Heracleas defeats Persia and restores the torn Roman empire. (by using H&R tactics in Hayastan)

[@zLamron]

your videos are easily some of greatest history related content online thank you

[@robinhodgkinson]

The simple passage of time puts into perspective how pointless the intrigue, wars and quest for power which all ultimately turns to dust. A passing amusement for we who live in the present.

[@cjclark2002]

It’s a curse of human nature.

[@robinhodgkinson]

@@cjclark2002 Ain’t that the truth!

[@animuslite8809]

Aren't we simply a continuation of that history though? Is the use of the plow in early agriculture just a quaint oddity of the past? Or are all things connected and these events, people and wars simply sewn into the ever weaving tapestry of human history? I feel for these people and I recognize their similarities to their descendants (us), so in my mind their story isn't an isolated event free of all consequence. Its a reverberation in my DNA, culture, history and people.

[@robinhodgkinson]

@@animuslite8809 you are absolutely correct. That’s why history is fascinating. We are both a consequence of it, and our present, history to future generations. My comment was perhaps more a reference to how we watch a KZbin video for simple amusement, yet this history was of life and death importance to those who lived it. How different our perspectives.

[@q45ij54q]

I met a traveller from an antique land Who said: Two vast and trunkless legs of stone Stand in the desert. Near them, on the sand, Half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown, And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command, Tell that its sculptor well those passions read Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things, The hand that mocked them and the heart that fed: And on the pedestal these words appear: "My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings: Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!" No thing beside remains. Round the decay Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare The lone and level sands stretch far away.

[@TheItalianPepe]

This is a time period I've wondered about for a long time and it's really fascinating. Thank you for doing this video!

[@snazzle9764]

Wow, what a video! Brilliant choice to use the cathedral as focus point. Feels like a documentary!

[@luciosergiocatilina1]

I'm so glad to see this channel growing. This is the kind of content KZbin should promote the most. You are doing an amazing divulgation work. Thank you!

[@SmogandBlack]

Beautifully made. Speaking of decisive battles... I think a video on Manzikert (1.071) would be very nice.

[@savioblanc]

I never knew the True Cross was taken from Jerusalem by Khosrow and sent to the private chapel of his Christian Persian wife. We need an entire topic about Christianity within the Persian Empire and how it influenced their relations with the now Christian Roman Empire. I remember reading an excerpt that when Persian soldiers invaded Jerusalem, they started burning down multiple churches but spared the Church of the Nativity from destruction, as there was an image of the Three Persian Magi following the Star to Bethlehem.

[@CG-yq2xy]

The history of Christianity in the Persian world is indeed a very ancient and goes all the way back to the early days of the Church. Considering how Armenia was the first kingdom to convert, it only makes sense that some of that "seeped into the empire". In tandem, as Christianity spread, one must not forget that both the regions of modern day Iraq and places such as Yemen (which had extensive contacts with the Persians) were either mostly Christian or a majority-minority religion. So it stands, why didn't the whole Persian world convert. The long story short is geopolitics. While the Persians originally did tolerate the religion, as Christianity became the de facto religion of the Romans, it came to be associated with the enemy of the west (the Romans). It also didn't help that the Eastern Roman Emperors (post Theodosius) increasingly saw themselves as the the protectors of the christian world (ecumene-οικουμένη) which gave them a great excuse to interfere in Persian affairs. In tandem, Zoroastrianism was the official religion of the state and the Shah, so Christianity could pose a direct challenge to the king of kings. Hence why when this war began, so many Churches were put to the torch. The great irony (or if you wish to dabble in the "what if"), is that even before the war, Christianity was on the rise in what we call modern-day Iran (albeit it Nestorianism and not the "correct" type of Christianity by Roman standards). By the end of the war, even a significant amount of the upper Sassanian had converted to the religion including members of the royal family. So it seemed that it was only a matter of time before Christianity established itself as the new religion. But as we all know, the Islamic conquests put an end to that trajectory.

[@adriennefloreen]

He thought he was getting his wife the best present every, and he fought a war to get it for her.

[@thedon9247]

Christianity was extremely widespread in Persia, Even from the beginning of Christianity. The treatment of christianity widely varied depending on the Shah's whims. Some had positive relations with the church of the east, others had negative relations. For the most part however, the specific church of the east enjoyed some degree of favour from the Sassanid empire. Unfortunately the rise of Islam virtually exterminated eastern christianity and various other religions of the time. Note how i said the church of the east. The Roman backed church was not the dominant form of christianity in Persia.

[@adriennefloreen]

@@thedon9247 Yeah, and many a man done a terrible thing just to get his baby a shiny diamond ring.

[@carlosnevarez4003]

The Kings and Generals channel has a documentary on the Rise of Islam. I loved how the people running this channel explained this particular point in History so well and filled in the empty details in my head and pointed out how it was really the last Ancient Battle.

[@aka99]

K a g Channel is awsome too, tough it only focus on k a g as it is the names channel, but the everday life of the people in ancient rome is often ignored. Luckily not by toldinstone

[@laughsatchungus1461]

I usually try to refrain from calling historical wars “epic” considering they usually are shadowed by the intense misery of 100’s of thousands, but this war, as terrible as it was is seriously the perfect fantasy novel. I don’t understand why anyone needs fiction.

[@lukasmakarios4998]

Just one point, or adventure, of fiction was really left to be desired in this story. I would love to hear about the hero who confronted and destroyed the Muslim army and personally executed Muhammad. Actually, it's too bad that story would be a fiction. It would have saved the world. Literally.

[@zeus0710]

It makes me sad how there's so much money invested into fantasy series like game of thrones or the witcher and many other movies instead of real historical ones like these or the wars of the successors of Alexander the great It would be 100 times better and real fact 😥

[@game_boyd1644]

@@lukasmakarios4998 wow, did you really just wish that the progenitor of a faith over One Billion strong never existed?

[@lukasmakarios4998]

@@game_boyd1644 - Yes. It's a false religion promoted by violent conquest.

[@null-xf9pd]

Moral relativism is the refuge of pseudo intellectuals

[@lll9107]

Awesome video man. I loved Naked Statues, Fat Gladiators, and War Elephants. Are you writing/planning to write another book?

[@toldinstone]

Glad to hear it! I have a sequel to "Naked Statues" coming out next September, and plans for more books after that.

[@barath4545]

@@toldinstone Just wanted to say I also bought the book and gotta read it this summer! My brother is an modern archeologist (Roman era) and did work on the Ostia temple and helped dig out the forum there while writing about the temple there. He will read the book after me, he really likes your videos too.

[@d0tdash]

@@toldinstone Clothed Statues, Slim Gladiatrices, and Incendiary Pigs

[@lukasmakarios4998]

@@d0tdash - "Clothed Statues, Virgin Martyrs and Incendiary Heretics" may be more like it. Don't you think?

[@Neb_Raska]

@@d0tdash lol

[@shibuigroup]

I really loved this one. I hadn’t studied much about this period of history, didn’t know how to approach it. This helps!

[@steventhompson399]

I've looked at a lot of ancient and medieval churches and ruins from Armenia such as at Ani but I don't remember the story of this one, very cool. The fighting between Persian and east Roman/byzantine armies is often not mentioned much in military history that I've looked at but it's fascinating, it really laid the path for early Arab expansion since both sides were exhausted and weakened by the 630s

[@supremercommonder]

Both empires still out numbered the Arabs out experienced in every battle. Better equipment and economy. I get what your saying if the Arabs fought just one but it though both at the same time. Battle of Yarmouth and qadessia where few months between in which both imperial armies where broken

[@Frichickenisha]

Amazing video! I never knew about this war, nor about the Cathedral. And the way you started the video setting up the story was very poetic. Love your work!

[@robertosans5250]

Very beautiful and thought provoking video. Many thanks.

[@seanzibonanzi64]

The transitional phases of civilization are always most interesting and least understood IMO. Also poignant, given the current state of play geopolitically. Thanks for the upload!

[@finnkdy]

All that before the DUP.

[@lohphat]

The shot of the abandoned cathedral is a testament to the failure of proper historical preservation. For those who rally against museums harboring “stolen” artifacts, this is your lesson. Museums in richer countries have the resources to conserve and curate valuable, irreplaceable items of our collective human history. Leaving these things to the elements and to chance that some band of fanatics can destroy them in a whim - as the Taliban did to the statues in the cliffs - is a lesson that historical artifacts are not “stolen” when the original country they came from can’t guarantee their preservation let alone the stability of their current government.

[@casparcoaster1936]

I listen to these little historicals while I do my morning asanas... and sip my coffee. Really enjoy them, many, many thanks!!!!!!

[@sumanamjs]

A poet’s perspective on a turning point in History, a fine blend of emotion and fact. Fascinating narration!

[@Otto910]

The video quality of this one was exceptional. Well done!

[@Tiberon098]

Imagine going back in time and getting to watch one of the battles during this time period; it would be amazing to see.

[@ZeelofTheMarty]

Watching people die is amazing?

[@ar-rafirahman7700]

@@ZeelofTheMarty any problem?

[@sotnoscopes]

i can not get enough of this channel. While other history-focused channels lose my attention because of the narration, this one does the exact opposite. I'm usually a stickler for editing and good videos, but I could not care less in this case. the narration and level of detail are just too good for me to mind.

[@Arcenus237J]

Beautiful video, the parallel between the beginning and the end was *chef's kiss*

[@markp44288]

I love stories about people represented in my coin collection. Khosrow II is a pretty easy guy to get on a budget, and the coins are pretty neat!

[@asharpmajor6740]

A great way to tell the story of this moment in history - through a building

[@kalenderquantentunnel9411]

To me the times of turmoil in ancient history are the most interesting as little information we often have about them. E.g. what happened after Alexander the Great's death (including the end of democracy in athens) contains stories that alone can keep you entertained for weeks and tells more about human nature than any look on the present ever will. And the comparison may be a humbling experience too. The story of this war is just along this line.

[@yaqubebased1961]

What happened was that the wars of his generals created a massive cultural blindspot in history of the entire region for that time period. How is it that ancient greeks wrote everything down back then, but the greek Seleucids have comparatively little to show for it in that regard?

[@mindhistorydocumentary]

The narrations in this ancient history documentary are so compelling! It really draws you into the story

[@1137moiz]

Fun fact. This war is mentioned in the Quran in the Chapter Romans, which begins at a Roman defeat but correctly predicts a Roman victory. At the time the Muslims in Arabia were supporting the Romans as People of the Book against the Sassanians. Heraclius is also treated with more respect by Islamic sources than most of their other foes.

[@joer8954]

Then why did the Arabs invade? And why is nobody able to give me a reason? Seriously. Makes no sense.

[@Nathan-jt8zt]

It’s nice to see the number of subscribers rising

[@db.sarvestani6554]

I can’t get enough on Iranian history especially around the Sassanian era …, more please

[@qboxer]

Excellent summary of the final war of Antiquity. You might consider adding more Late Antique content, it is quite good and there are only a few channels that deal with it in depth.

[@messianic_scam]

totally fake history ,ghassanids and Christian Arabs in levant who carried ALL byzantine's wars and Romans's before them in the region against persians ,they were not the romans who faught sassanids it was their classical rival the ghassanids who ruled the fertile crescent for 450 continues years fake history no one byzantine chariot passed these desert between Syria and iraqi then between Iraq and Iran , romans were in europe fighting their last wars with the slavs ,goths and bulgarians who were attacking Rome borders from every where they will never call up all their power to fight in unknown arabian deserts when they were taking their last breath

[@qboxer]

@@messianic_scam What source talks about that?

[@hofwar]

I am thrilled!!! So much useful information and so interestingly presented. I'm looking forward to more episodes! 🎬🌍

[@skeeterhoney]

Truly exceptional. You've got a fantastic delivery; made possible by your outstanding writing. Well done!

[@FiveLiver]

12:16 The war between the Byzantines and the Persians exhausted both empires, the Muslims capitalising on this. The people of the Middle-East and North Africa were used to the to and fro of conquest, but had no idea that their civilisation was to be destroyed by invaders from the south who would never integrate or leave. It was Islam that ended the Ancient World, destroying Mediterranean trade, rendering coastal areas of Europe uninhabitable and ushering in a Dark Age that Europe would only emerge from nearly a thousand years later..

[@YipperStanley]

I really appreciate the time stamps on the video.. Awesome watch

[@juangallego7197]

What an amazing job you did. Epic narration and superb research 👌🏻👏🏻

[@Olliemets]

Terrific presentation about a subject I knew little about. Telling this compelling story so eloquently through the lens of the Cathedral is brilliant. Salut !!!

[@spiritualanarchist8162]

It's fun to imagine how much longer the Roman empire could have lasted if it hadn't had so many civil wars. But maybe the empire was just to big to be ruled by one person without internal conflicts.

[@zippyparakeet1074]

It just needed another set of the "five good emperors" to help it survive through the Islamic onslaught and I can bet you that it'd have survived in some capacity to this very day.

[@AureliusLaurentius1099]

Its civil wars pretty much was the reason why it lasted so long. The hostile environment bred only the strongest and hardiest of men to lead Rome

[@Patrick3183]

@@AureliusLaurentius1099 which led to more civil wars. No sense of legitimacy or birthright was established.

[@spiritualanarchist8162]

@@zippyparakeet1074Maybe. I think they couldn't have stopped Atilla and everyone else the Huns drove into roman Empire. It was just too much.

[@spiritualanarchist8162]

@@AureliusLaurentius1099 LOL. It's not some football derby. These civil wars killed off tens of thousands soldiers, used up funds and other resources needed to protect the empire's borders. And the men who lead Rome did not fight in the front lines eather.

[@Nikola_T_Markov]

At 5:55 you show an illuminated manuscript as a byzantine chronicle of the revolt against Phocas. Actually only the last word "Hraklioy" is written in ancient Greek script. The remaining text is in Cyrillic script and in old Slavonic, so most likely from the Moravian or the Bulgarian kingdom. What is interesting about that is that you place the revolt sometime in the 600's AD but the Cyrillic script was invented in the late 800's AD. As far as I can read it the text does describe the events but it is interesting to know it is not contemporaneous.

[@andrenewcomb3708]

That was nice. Poetic and heroic. People are sometimes believers.

[@andrenewcomb3708]

Sorry about the heads. I've got a feeling, a feeling I can't hide. Oh, no. Just kind of get wrapped up in the moments and have to follow through.

[@0leandr1]

Great story of Mren. Armenia is probably the longest existing country in Europe since then.

[@TriviRocks]

Europe???

[@deadbeat5165]

armenia no where near europe

[@0leandr1]

@@deadbeat5165 You probably know term Caucasian. That's because Caucasus Mountains are regarded as European.

[@deadbeat5165]

@@0leandr1 false the caucases region is called caucases not europe .. and armenia is transcaucases not even in the proper caucases

[@deadbeat5165]

@AndRand the term caucasian doesnt apply to europeans only its a type of skull in phenotypes indians arabs iranians and north african and many others fall into that classification

[@isaiahaguilera7710]

Hey, I just wanted to let you know I found you through your appearance on the Forehead Fables Podcast. Funny stuff lol. I always have had a great interest in History so I am looking forward to diving into your videos 👍

[@thefleecer3673]

What a story well done! I can't believe that cathedral is still there, how poignant

[@jmanj3917]

Wow. That was interesting. Well done!

[@onetwothreefourfive12345]

Heraclius is my hero. He is treated so unfairly. I think he is perhaps the greatest Roman to ever live and I don't believe the empire would have survived whatsoever had he not come to power at that time. Most of the criticism against him is petty nonsense about his religious interventions which he was forced to make because of foolish priests arguing over abstract rubbish.

[@gouf_respecter4881]

@@xunqianbaidu6917 not to minimize a massacre, but literally everyone did that, it's like an ancient times tradition

[@starcapture3040]

Heraclius wanted to move the capital to Carthage as starting point to restorer old Rome but he wasn't lucky enough

[@gouf_respecter4881]

@@xunqianbaidu6917 oh no 😱

[@TheSuperRatt]

@@gouf_respecter4881 What a constructive argument.

[@onetwothreefourfive12345]

@@starcapture3040 Correct me if you know something I don't, but I was under the impression that his idea was Carthage could be used as the capital as a last resort if the Sassanids were to conquer Constantinople.

[@benavraham4397]

Great video! Thank you for bringing this story to the wider public!😀

[@cyclesaviorn2700]

the ending of this video was so heartwarming, i for the brief moment, was there seeing that cathedral just on his words alone...

[@andrewtaylor9799]

Beautifully poetic history. Thanks.

[@vandare6913]

"In his »Comparison of the Old and the New Rome«, addressed to emperor Manuel II Palaiologos (1391-1425), Manuel Chrysoloras presented Rome as the mother and Constantinople as the daughter which was founded by the two most powerful and wise peoples of the world, the Romans and the Hellenes, who had come together there in order to create a city that would be able to rule over the whole world. In a sermon to the same emperor, he stated that the Rhomaioi were the offspring of the Romans and the Hellenes, thus being ENTITLED TO USE BOTH NAMES. Yannis Stouraitis, pp. 86-87, "Reinventing Roman Ethnicity in High and Late Medieval Byzantium" medieval worlds • No. 5 • 2017 • 70-94

[@ΑθανάσιοςΚΥΡΙΑΚΟΠΟΥΛΟΣ-θ7γ]

This is one of the times Constantinople was besieged by two armies at once. I think it was when the Akathist hymn to the Virgin Mary was written, naming Holy Mother Mary as the undefeated general of Constantinople. With so many invaders it's not a tragedy it ended, it's a miracle it lasted so long. And I beg to differ that antiquity ended with Islamic invasion, Constantinople called itself Rome until 1453. Greeks were taught to call themselves Greek at school to venerate our ancestors, but at home we called ourselves Romans until the '70s

[@enricomanno8434]

Bravo from an Italian

[@georgiosdoumas2446]

Εγώ που είμαι γεννημένος το 1973 δεν άκουσα τον πατέρα μου και τον παππού μου να λένε "Ρωμιοί", αμτιθέτως απο το σχολείο καθώς μας έδειχναν τα λόγια κάποιων οπλαρχηγών του 1821, πρωτοάκουσα τον όρο Ρωμιοί, και έμαθα οτι στην Τουρκοκρατία ο όρος Ρουμ μιλιέτ χρησιμοποιούταν για να δηλώσει τους χριστιανούς. Μην λές λοιπόν ψέμματα δημοσίως. Τι προσπαθείς να κάνεις? Να χαιδέψεις τα αυτιά κάποιων Ιταλών, όπως αυτός που σου απάντησε, όταν οι Ιταλοί μέχρι και το 1947 σκότωναν ΈΛληνες στα Δωδεκάνησα?

[@anthonyforbes9657]

Great video . Great commentary . This cathedral is now on my bucket list.

[@Baka_Komuso]

Supremely astute. Completely articulate. Not a single wasted syllable. As usual. 😊

[@alibesharatian4277]

Imagine if Khosrow had accepted the territorial offerings from Heraclius, or even better, if this war hadn’t been started in the first place: Islam would have never spread out of the Arabian peninsula… and most likely Romans and Persians would have eventually learned to live along; and we would live in a much better world today, with a much more stable Middle East…

[@MaxPayne-fi1mz]

How?

[@AnyoneCanSee]

This was an excellent video. Thank you for the effort. Maybe a video of the greatest artefacts of the ancient world that are in private collections might be interesting. I'm interested to know what we are missing and may never see.

[@DavidR747]

Can't stop thinking about how if Rome didn't help Koshrow it would probably have armies capable of defending against the Arab forces and the implications "simple" event would have in history. Also if I recall correctly the Persian nobles offered more concessions to the Romans than Kushrow did and yet Rome chose Kushrow

[@PascalSWE]

This episode is so poetic. Thrid time I watch it and it gave me the chills each time

[@adamseward4713]

Thanks for giving us chapter titles and links. I jumped to 12:16 and got exactly what I came here for. Oh that all youtube lectures would do so!

[@fishingislife9554]

I swear the Easter Romans were fighting the entire world at one point, to the east Persians and Arabs, to the west Slavs, avars, Huns

[@asd8459]

Amazing once again

[@funkyboodah]

love the poetry in this

[@Shineon83]

….What a move by Heraculius-intercepting the messenger carrying a death decree for the top Persian general-and passing the decree on to that very general (thereby, ensuring that a canny enemy would withdraw from the fight)….

[@BKNeifert]

I did enjoy this video. Put a little piece of the puzzle that was missing in my knowledge. A very important piece, too. Very masterfully done.

[@Tmanaz480]

The Naked Apse...great title for a book.

[@vandare6913]

"In the 6th century, the Byzantine legislative made use of both languages, and as a consequence of the Empire's definite territorial reduction to the East, Greek became the only official language of the Byzantine Roman Empire. Parallel to this development, the pagan connotation of the term "hellenikos" lost its importance, and the Byzantines, in particular the educated strata of society, increasingly reverted to "hellenic" cultural (and linguistic) values of Antiquity. In the end, the mediaeval (Christian) Byzantine Empire was characterised by political and cultural identity, whose romanness was inseparably linked with Greek language. Religious (Christian) and cultural and linguistic (Hellenic) stereotypes offered a sense of superiority over all other ethne, combined with the correlating hetero-stereotypes, this sense of superiority was disseminated not only in the upper classes, but throughout the population of Byzantium. It worked also and especially in periods of political decline. THE GREEK LANGUAGE BECAME THE REAL BASIS OF THE ROMAIC NATIONAL AWARENESS." Johannes Koder (2018) [Hellene, Romios, Greek: Collective Identifications and Identities] Eurasia Publications, pp.85

[@automaticmattywhack1470]

Really great video! A subject that I know far too little about. Thanks again for all your hard work!

[@ledzep215]

Just wanted to say thank you for your videos. Keep up the awesome work :3

[@Dionysus_333]

Found your channel recently and it is such a SWEET SPOT. Very grateful for your content, cheers!

[@blehbleheh]

Great video. It's amazing when you consider how history binds the distant past with the world of today. The Byzantine Empire, the former eastern half of the once mighty Roman Empire, conquered by the Ottomans, who in turn disintegrated at the end of World War I, never ceases to amaze as to how close the ancient past is close the present. Likewise, Persian identity has, since the overthrow of the Alexander-spinoff Selucids, had an an inherent desire to reassert itself. The spirit which restored Persia in Parthian and Sassanid eras carried over to Safavid Persia reasserting Iranian identity by creating an independent realm of Islam it could control, making itself the bastion of Shia Islam. Even though Persia became Muslim, the ancient spirit of its identity flowed from its distant Achaemeneid past through its new post-Islamic revival; the biggest symbol of this is retaining its own language in defiance of the Arabs who tried and failed to erase their culture. Even the most Islamic of Iranians still take pride in their pre-Islamic identity, much like Italians of today do their Roman ones.

[@thedon9247]

Persians would be better off returning to their Zoroastrian faith, In my opinion. I have no problem with Muslims, But as a religion Islam is not historically the best suited to permitting ones pre-islamic identities. I have known many Iranians and the muslim ones all view themselves as more Arabic than Persian, Although this likely is because of their governments oppression. The Zoroastrian ones (and i have only known a few) are much more in tune with their ancestral heritage. They claim that among modern day persia, Many Persians only follow Islam as a religion because they don't have a choice in their country. Also, i would argue that the Eastern roman empire wasn't truly conquered by the Ottomans, But rather it was conquered by Crusaders during the fourth crusade. The empire the Ottomans "conquered" was little more than a couple impoverished war torn Provinces. A pale Imitation of what they once were, Unfortunately.

[@mohamedali2858]

"O Muslims, you are not Arabs, nor Turks, nor Balkans, nor Kurds, nor Caucasus, nor Circassians nor African nor Indian European… You are only members of one nation, the Islamic Ummah, which preserves your nationalities for you as long as you maintain your Islamic identity.” Islam Islam does not fight healthy human customs and traditions languages that are beneficial to the individual and society. This is evidence from the Qur'an for human diversity in Islam and the criterion of preference is the fear of God.(13 O mankind, We have created you from a male and a female and made you into races and tribes, that you may know one another; indeed, the most noble of you in the sight of Allah are the most mindful (of Him) among you; indeed, Allah is All-Knowing, All-Aware.[ Surah : Al-Ĥujurāt ]

[@mohamedali2858]

@@thedon9247 Do not return human beings to the worship of idols & fire , the Iranians suffer from the persecution of dictatorship, as in Saudi Arabia, there is no just democratic administration, no just sound true Islamic rule . A just and fair man looks at things wisely and does not misleigh or deceive in human history, Islam founded in the midst of the strongest civilizations 1 Roman civilization 2 Persian civilization 3 Indian civilization 4 Chinese civilization, and stormed everyone and established a strong civilization by all human standards and so far exists strongly and fights even in Mecca and this is the strange thing in Islam, I am African Muslim & I feel pain for the Iranian Muslims & for the Saudis Muslims who rule by Tyrant both nations are full rich but they are suffering from everything .

[@thedon9247]

Iranians have the right to honour their ancestral faith, Islam has done nothing for them but bring suffering and foreign rule. Also, Islam was founded when Rome and Persia were at their weakest. Iranians do not want to follow Islam and many have been forced to follow it.

[@mohamedali2858]

@@thedon9247 The wise man should know the space of his ignorance more than he knows the space of his knowledge, because whoever is preoccupied with the amount of his ignorance He rises, and whoever is busy with the amount of his knowledge becomes Arrogant. The natural man is with the system that elevates him spiritually, intellectually and morally and corrects concepts. If my fathers don't understand, it doesn't mean that I'm doomed by their dark destiny this regarding to ancestral faith of the old Iranian Regarding to Islam was founded when the roman & Persia was weakest just look at who disappeared who remained And Islam is not like Harry Potter Stick 🦯 to do magic for the Iranian just looking what Russia & Putin doing.