Tony and I discussed about these 6 higher-end DACs.

#hifi #DACs #audiophile #stereo #audioreviews #highfidelity
Patreon account: / thomasandstereo
Non-affiliated links:
Denafrips Venus and Pontus DAC: www.vinshineau...
Gear used or mentioned in this evaluation
Matrix X-Sabre 3 DAC apos.audio/pro...
SMSL VMV D3: hifi-express.c...
Gustard R26: shenzhenaudio....
Ladder Schumann: shenzhenaudio....
Gear used or mentioned in this evaluation
Exasound E28 DAC
Denafrips Venus and Pontus DAC
SMSL VMV D3
Gustard R26
Ladder Schumann
Matrix X-Sabre3
Galion TS120 tube integrated amp
Upgraded JBL L300
Thorens TD 125 LB custom ebony TT
ORACLE acrylic mat
Pro-Ject record clamp
Alphason HR-100MCS reference tonearm
Dynavector 20x2 Low output MC cartridge
Audio Technica AT-605 Isolation feet
Pro-Ject Tube Box DS Tungsram tubes
SWAGMAN Labs linear PSU upgraded
Cary Audio SLP-03 preamplifier
MARCHAND XM44 3way active crossover
McIntosh Mc2200 amp for subs
Mcintosh Mc2200 amp for mid horns
Mcintosh Mc2120 amp for tweeters

[@ThomasAndStereo]

See you this week Oct 21, 2022 at the Toronto audio show. I will be there everyday from 3pm to 4pm. Tony's reaction to listening to the Galion TS120, the first time listening to a full tube integrated amp: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n4m8aJWijKiHg6c Tony's JBL L300 system: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y57HfJqwo61nadU Non-affiliated links: Denafrips Venus and Pontus DAC: www.vinshineaudio.com/product-page/denafrips-venus-r2r-dac?currency=USD Matrix X-Sabre 3 DAC apos.audio/products/matrix-x-sabre-3-dac SMSL VMV D3: hifi-express.com/products/vmv-d3-r2r-pcm1704-mqa-dac Gustard R26: shenzhenaudio.com/products/gustard-r26-discrete-r2r-decoder-with-streamer-renderer-pcm768-dsd512-bluetooth-xmos-xu216-high-performance-audio-decoder Ladder Schumann: shenzhenaudio.com/products/ladder-schumann-dac-hifi-usb-dsp-coaxial-opt-aes-resolution-audio-decoder-1

[@cupido1506]

Hi Thomas, do you have any experience with any of dcs dac?

[@kiudont]

Thomas why didn't speak about Ladder Schumann??? how does it compare to them all?

[@mrpmj00]

Denafrips Ares II 12th now has 3 firmwares (the latest is July 2023 v1.8 and customers say it sounds the best). Today I've just requested my v1.8 firmware. My setup: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jX2aiXadltGSga8 After I upgraded my mixed use theater/music room's 2 front L/R speakers to GoldenEar BRX with the awesome AMT ribbon tweeter, these tweeters are soo revealing and realistic (gave me goosebumps) that it got me to upgrade the weaker links in my chain: - Added a 3rd GoldenEar BRX as my center channel speaker. - Added a DDC from Denafrips Iris 12th which improved the sound for my already great Denafrips Ares II 12th (a DAC with R2R technology for 3D live/realism) - Eversolo DMP-A6 streamer with native Apple Music for hi-res lossless and ripping my CDs to it. source=Apple Music (hires lossless, and spatial audio surround music) and Denafrips Ares II 12th dac (R2R technology for 3D live/realistic sound).

[@jazzlouise]

More DAC comparisons please. This is some of the best analysis of comparing DAC's that I have seen.

[@klepp19]

I wish you guys compared the SMSL D300 instead of the one you had in this comparison.

[@sp6450]

Are you kidding? - The guest he brought on who borrowed his DACS sounds like a complete novice and unsure of how to explain anything.

[@PauloMundo]

Please keep this guy with you for reviewing product it is very good to have this kind of review by another tester. He is very expressive and clear to have an idea of the product

[@andrewmorgan7919]

Hi Thomas. Great to see you outside your man cave. From an audiophile perspective, I might suggest your garden is lacking in ‘Mids’. You clearly have plenty of lawn (lows), and conifers (highs), but where are the mids? No shrubs or perennials. Give them a try…. They will blow you away. And all analogue.

[@thomasmleahy6218]

Daffodils Hosta Black Eyed Susans Roses Peonies...aaaachoo must be spring Suppose the only difference turned out to be.. the volume level, gain.

[@chasehatton3691]

Well, I could not have found this DAC comparison video any sooner. As I am in the market for an upgrade to my current Pontus ii. The Martix Sabre X and of course the Venus go to top of my list. Not to mention the VMV M3 will be in contention. On a sidenote, what makes Thomas so popular is his sheer honesty and candor when discussing audio products. A straightshooter compared to many other audio review channels. .....he does not play word and mind games like .....a certain Mr. Huff ......cough cough .

[@alitabbal9529]

Excellent video Thomas, and thank you Tony for taking the time to test these 6 DAC's! This channel is probably the best for real world audio reviews, with no "audiophile" BS, looking forward to the next video, thanks a million!!

[@marks.2909]

I happened to come across this video Tony’s evaluation of the Denafrips Venus 2 is right though I had the Venus 12 th anniversary model a friend brought over to listen in a speaker system. Magico S5 with subs , Boulder integrate and Innuos Statement server with Playback designs MPD 8 . Tony mentions how the Denafrips dac connected to his emotions I agree with him it did that with me also and that’s so important to some of us , you’ll know it when you hear it .

[@morespinach9832]

R26 would do the same. 😊

[@ronaldmcdonald2456]

Refreshingly different Thomas! And VERY useful for those of us with our noses stuck in this crazy DAC market...which is all the time these days as new product intros-updates are coming fast&furious. Thanks to you both.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@liamporter1137]

Nice. Candid comments from one music lover is great especially he was given so many to test and therefore we get to know the comparisons which is the most useful.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Well said! I wanted something raw so there was no editing. Just say whatever he wanted and keep it real.

[@deepvillage]

good work ...Thomas I had the Pontus 2 then purchased the Gustard R26 , after comparing I sold the Pontus kept the R26 , I just like it better , synergy w my gear

[@michaelmityok1001]

Very useful POV from Tony, the fact he picked up differences across these DACS and could define those differences in simple language should be the baseline for all of these comparo videos, not sure it's possible or something reproducible or just something Tony would/can do in a way other audiophiles would/could take the time and effort to try to do for a KZbin video.

[@bdmcn]

Valuable perspective, thanks. The Venus needs months and months of burn in, like 700-800 hours, to really hear its true self. Glad you gave him a burned in example, Thomas. The Venus is all I need - wonderful DAC for the money.

[@rctony710]

Don't you find it could have more air to it?

[@bdmcn]

@@rctony710 It’s a good question. I think, like most of this, it is system dependent and our rooms play a starring role. I have a pretty reflective room, and I have a Class A SET amp into 95 db speakers. In my set up, and I do enjoy OS more, I don’t want for much more air. But when I go “NOS”, then I guess I could say yes, I’d like more air. I guess that’s why I prefer OS! It does bring more air, more HF sparkle, if you will.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Yes, it was a review sample so it has been really used. Heck, I myself have put easily 700 hours on it. I can't imagine in which way the Terminator will be better.

[@xxgamerxxchrischris2325]

@@ThomasAndStereo what's the best DAC to buy

[@sc51153826]

Agree. My Pontus took at least 3 weeks😅. I sounded like a broken speaker. It didn't have any highs and was sluggish at first. I wonder if the Venus 2 could have been better if Tony had more time to run in. It was nice to see Tony's system again🤩🤩🤩. I'm sorry Thomas, I think it would help Tony's system more if he could upgrade his DAC before changing his amp for the highs to your tube amp IMHO😂

[@budgetaudiophilelife-long5461]

🤗👍😎 GREAT VIDEO WITH TONY, …ENJOYING HIS JOURNEY AND YOU GIVING HIM BLIND TESTING 🤗💚💚💚

[@CP-oe3kt]

Love this guy and his knowledge. He doesn't pretend to be an authority but if you listen closely, you will soon realize that Tony knows music and has a great ear. I think you need to add Tony to your testing group Thomas. Perhaps he could be Mr. Turntable? :)

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Haha, love it!

[@ThomasAndStereo]

@@r423fplip The difference between me and many people on the internet is my conclusion is not derive from what I think should be, but actual real life experience. Countless nights of AB test, thousand hours of listening, Meeting many many audiophiles and learning from actual people. It is so easy to draw a conclusion looking at a plate of lasagna and think how it taste but does it really taste how it looks?

[@ThomasAndStereo]

@@r423fplip The problem with my story is thousands, if not hundreds of thousand of people have experienced the same. That is why they can relate to my story. An industry cannot survive long term if it is not true. It can cheat people of short term, yes, but not long term. The fact that this is continuing means there is substance.

[@shanestephenson8423]

Hi Thomas I'm a big r2r ladder dac fan and I've had the holo May kte and loved it. I thought it was superior to the Terminator + which I had also demoed in my rig for a week before deciding on the May. I've since taken another big step up and recently purchased the Aqua Acoustics formula xhd rev 2. Now I'm in digital Heaven this dac is nothing short of stunning when it comes to converting digital into an analogue signal. End game for me, the next step is $50000+ and I'd have to win the lottery to even contemplate going there. Great video really enjoyed both of your perspectives.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Wow, the Aqua is no joke. Congrats.

[@klepp19]

Does the Aqua have tube output stage?

[@shanestephenson8423]

@@klepp19 Hi there no it doesn't It's different from the lower models.

[@klepp19]

@@shanestephenson8423 Ok thanks!😊

[@JoseFerreira-zb7wh]

Really enjoyed this video. It's nice to have these types of comparisons, more based on a subjective point of view (vs measurements) coming from someone that isn't used to the gear and can notice the differences vs what he's used to. From the video i gather maybe the pontus 2 or the ladder dac would be the best for me as i listen to lots of different types of music, so maybe an all rounder would be the best choice. Nice job!

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

Yep an all rounder is the way to go especially if you had you system for a while and it because balanced already! Another reason is that most music will play well with an all round kind of DAC! Who wants to change DAC for different types of music anyways?

[@JoseFerreira-zb7wh]

@@Montreal_Audio_Systems agree. You have to take in account the rest of your system. Speakers/ headphones and even your amp matters more. However you might want a specific type of sound (dac) if you only listen to specific types of music. Maybe you don't care for an all rounder dac if you don't have an all arounder taste in music. I do. 😀

[@Olaya_kawaii1922]

Ladder ones are natural with quite the right tempo (time domain) as analog. And that is a big difference confronted with Delta Sigma dacs.

[@20puskinas1992]

More distortions, more jitter, more crosstalk all that result in warmer less accurate, but at the same time pleasant sound.

[@Olaya_kawaii1922]

@@20puskinas1992 There is a run in order to absolutely avoid distortion. I am not sure at all that it is the right way. There is distortion everywhere in sound and even more in instruments. The same with detail, more and more detail but there are a lot of sound lingerers that are really disappointed because they are hearing things that they worked a lot in order to hidden. Greasy world !!!!

[@Mestre_tainha]

@@r423fplip If it sounds good I'm all for it. I care about having a good time listening to music. Dont give a rats ass if its colored, distorted, its not neutral or it's not as the artist intended.

[@rvgr12]

Got the R26 a few weeks ago, after some burn in, the connection to the singer really improves. Initially I found the DAC to be flawless but boring. After some recommended burn in, wow, the low end came alive! Anyway blah blah, it changed a few times but then it settled and it is smooth and detailed and clear. Love it

[@alexmacdonald2644]

A great video. More please from the two of you. From Brighton, England ( via Glasgow)

[@7in1]

I watched this video badly translated to my language, and finally I've found an original . I am so happy 😊

[@rodrigoarias390]

Hello, Thomas! Thanks so much for this kind of videos! It will be so great to know your opinion on the Ladder Schumman. I´m specially interested on how it compares to the Pontus II, since both the Ladder Schumman and the Denafrips Pontus II are what i´m considering as my best options (regarding price/performance) to upgrade from the Ares II (which was my very happy introduction to the R2R world). Thanks again and hope to some day have the pleasure of listening to a Galion TS120!

[@Coneman3]

Best r2r in world might be Audio Music DAC/1. Costs £13,000 but beats off £40k DACs apparently. Never gets reviewed, so best sleeper DAC ever. Industry secret. Start saving £££.

[@JTB--]

I've had the Gustard R26 about a month now and love it. Didn't realize how much I'd like the R2R DAC sound. Sold my Bifrost 2 DAC which I liked a lot after getting the R26. I immediately realized the R26 was a legit upgrade to the BF2 DAC

[@slidetek]

With companies like Gustard doing this, I think that we'll be seeing another industry paradigm shift in DACs, just like we've seen in the delta-sigmas over the past 5 years. A $10k DAC from 2012 can't touch some of the DACs available for $500 these days. One reason I'm hesitant to drop more. For $1650 the R26 at the moment is an incredible deal, and worth every cent. No doubt in 2-3 years its match will be selling for $500.

[@JTB--]

@@slidetek You're probably right. But I'll worry about that in 3 years. lol

[@V1ralB1ack]

I went from the gungnir mb to the gustard r26 and it's my new favorite dac too. And it has a power button in the front!

[@nc3419]

@@slidetek I don't think $500, but there will be more choices well under $2000...unless the world goes to @#$%.

[@nc3419]

Is it still worthwhile if you can't use XLR? I have the Topping D70s, I'm sure it would be better but I can only use RCA. Is the performance still close enough to XLR when you volume adjust?

[@bogroll1881]

As someone who likes to listen at louder levels this kind of comparison is really helpful the venus ii goes to the top of my wishlist!

[@williammilligan1451]

Thomas, any chance of reviewing the Audio Note 0.1X in the near future…Jay was impressed, very impressed, comparing to his Denafrips T. Love your thorough and honest reviews.

[@larsv6144]

The Holo Audio Spring 3 (KTE) is missing in this list.

[@HifiBoomer]

Great stuff👍now we should all go to Tony’s place for beer and music 😂🤣😂🤣 good job Tony👌

[@ryanschipp8513]

Here's the other thing to consider also. All six of these dacs were hooked up to his preamplifier and his amplifier. Who's to say that his equipment didn't have the synergy with some of those Dacs. Maybe one of the dacs that he didn't like or care for the least would sound great with somebody else's preamplifier and amplifiers and speakers. It's a huge rabbit hole! LOL

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

If one DAC has more bass it will still have more bass on your end I guarantee it's just the way it works! Soo let's say your missing bass well then you'll search for one with more bass and we'll it will definitely help you the review! A DAC should be reviewed and researched before you buy it's not like a pair of shoes that you can just bring back to the store!

[@Shozimus]

VMV D3 - the mythical dac, that I can't find anywhere to listen to :( Waiting for Your take on R26 and Ladder Schuman - a R2R round up\comparison would be nice also :) Possibly with and addition of Holo Spring 3

[@robk5745]

I saw you trying to get out of him what analog meant to him but that just didn’t come out Hahha. I’ve had an ares 2 for a few weeks and the biggest difference over delta sigma is mostly in how real and tonally accurate everything becomes, it’s smoother too. The notes just have more pop and life to them without harshness. Looking forward to the Schumann review Thomas!

[@riccitone]

Great vid! Nice to get that exchange of thoughts and perspectives. I'm kind of stuck n my dac journey at the moment, but this really helps. Worth also mentioning, many have changed out the opamps in the Aune x8 to really good effect. Even claiming that with Sparkos labs discrete amps, the Aune can compete with 1k+ dacs.

[@rolfnilsson8667]

Sorry Thomas, I don´t find this video being a serious review, as I have got to know you. I have been following you here on youtube for quite some time now for your most excellent reviews and not least the way you go about talking sound performance in a wider perspective. And I also find you being down to earth, when talking about the relation price/performance of what ever gear you are presenting a review for. As always, the best from me in Stockholm, Sweden.

[@beslemeto]

Gustard R26 is improving after 100+ hours of listening!It is the real deal!

[@steverino5054]

How's the bass?

[@beslemeto]

@@r423fplip I've read so many reviews and articles! Thats why!

[@andrewlim7751]

Debafrips 500hrs as standard. 😂😂

[@briancampbell7712]

@@beslemeto do you own it?

[@everettedl]

Man I wish I had a friend like that. Awesome video

[@jdm-uk-yank]

I myself just recently came to the realization that a DAC is more than just a tweak. It's as important as a phono preamp. Damnit, now I need more money.

[@toddhupp]

Tony said it all: the goal of a dac is to mimic /reconstruct analogue.

[@toddhupp]

looking forward the Thomas review of the ladder Schumann

[@creationsmarketing5033]

It's a very good DAC!

[@toddhupp]

@@creationsmarketing5033 Considering Shumann vw pontus

[@ReamannMacbiatiagh]

Looking at Tony's basement, and the surfaces I'm left feeling the room would be very live, a bit of damping would likely make a huge improvement and tidy up the acoustics no end. Perhaps if he were to play around a bit,,, throw a few rugs around hang a some big blankets or duvets till he sees how it changes things. It tends to be the last thing people will do but until they do they cannot understand how it can change things .

[@gerritfridericksohn4627]

@19:40 our hero really cuts to the heart of the matter. At least for me he does. The ability to create a holographic illusion in a semi dark room is the holy grail. Sitting around glowing vacuum tubes satisfies a primal need to worship fire. And if Dinah Washington is standing there singing to you, you will be a better person. I worship at the altar of the single ended triode. And burn sacrifices. Well, they're not really sacrificed, just burnt. Like about twenty minutes ago.

[@slidetek]

I think when you're at this level of nuance with these DACs, IMHO it becomes very system dependent, and of course subjective depending on what your listening for/to. I never had a problem with lack of "air" in my system (Focal Kanta 2's, BAT amp/tube pre) and have been using the top measuring Topper DACs (for whatever that's worth) with an Aurender for some time. Detail abounds, great soundstage etc. But I wanted some of that silky magic I can get with analog. Denafrips was the obvious choice (Holo a close second) - a friend has the Ares II which sounds great. In my rig, I really like the Venus II (store demo), the presentation was certainly smooth, but it still seemed a bit dark next to the Topper. Especially considering the price. Then I tried the Gustard. TBH, I couldn't tell if I preferred it, it really sounded like the Toppers. At first. Fast forward 100+ hours break-in and I'm in absolute heaven. It opened up, the soundstage and space around instruments is amazing. And bass? Plenty, thanks. Balanced connectors of course. The R26 has the articulation, speed and slam of the delta-sigmas, but that silkiness and 3D space of R2Rs. I've found my match. It absolutely competes with my Technics SL1200G/Goldnote PH-10/PS-10 combo and MC/MM cartridges. _On my system._ The icing is it's half the price of the Denafrips.

[@michaelmityok1001]

Just bought the R26 and will get it in about 2 weeks, really good advice you are offering here to be patient with it until it fully burns in, thanks!

[@slidetek]

@@michaelmityok1001 Congrats! I know you're going to be happy with it. Yes, if you possibly can, just let it run - the amp doesn't need to be on so it can go overnight. It's almost like somebody flicks a switch when it finally comes into its own. If you bought it direct from Aoshida, you might get it a _lot_ sooner. Mine arrived to California in 5 days, with a weekend in between! I had expected it to take 2-3 weeks.

[@davidschwegman7539]

Couldn't agree more...Sold the Holo May after having the R26 for a few hundred hours. It's not better but it brings me the same level of enjoyment at a fraction of the price

[@slidetek]

@@davidschwegman7539 That's great to hear!

[@redleather100]

So glad to read this ,as I’ve just purchased the r26 and watching this video and the chap said it has no bass I nearly started crying . All other reviews said it’s got great deep bass .

[@charleskatz2606]

Great stuff.I am with folks who don’t want to spend more than $1K as the performance varies so much and you can get very good specs from Schiit and almost lab grade from SMSL and Topping.I was thinking.Gustard but with lacking bass and mids head to head this was informative

[@jasonp1568]

I wonder if they used USB inputs for this DAC shootout, or if they used DDCs or Gustard’s LAN. USB implementation can really vary between good DACs. Chord USB inputs are horrible, while Holo KTEs’ USB are great. Also, I wonder how many of the R2R DACs have a good amount of burn-in already. For this DAC shootout, I dunno if they were experiencing each DAC at their ideal performance. Tony’s correct though; not sure how you go back to DS after listening to good R2R.

[@MarylandDevin]

I just got the Schiit Bifrost 2/64. Would be fun to test some pricier pieces though

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

It may be costly!

[@alvidrez7956]

Hard to beat the shiit bifrost without spending $$$

[@MarylandDevin]

@@alvidrez7956 yeah. I think I'm content for a long time. If I was made of money I would like to try some more headphones though

[@daveyurkovich9459]

Wonderful video and info

[@lesarnolfinis6775]

Finding "air": great topic. Apart from going outside more, are R2R dac the best way to find air since they tend to be rolled off in the high frequencies?

[@enushalu2548]

Nice discuss, very informative !

[@dennis3779]

Nice dacs Tan. The Ladder seems interesting to me. What about Cayin idac series 🤔

[@jungtarcph]

I wish you added in a 650 USD DAC..... or the Denafrips Aries II

[@blucheer8743]

‘He was shocked he’d never heard air like that!’ Isn’t that audiophiles in a nutshell… no pun intended lol 😆

[@astrofog4638]

This one's a gem Thomas.

[@lesarnolfinis6775]

I was wondering how much burn in the different dacs had. Obviously the Venus had plenty but what about the others. I have a R26 and enjoy it very much!

[@ThomasAndStereo]

They have all gone thru Mr Quad home and he does at least 100 to 200 hours of burn in.

[@OptLab]

Very interesting. Are there high end dacs that don't draw too much power on use+idle, only for desktop IEM use? Buying Daps make little sense for a desktop use because I don't need a screen and a battery, buying large dac make no sense when I only need 1 watt of power in the transducers. Are there no high end, compact and balanced solution stationary iems ?

[@TheKent2288]

Audio gear is like fine wine. Once you taste the good stuff it’s hard to go back. Very enjoyable review.

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

It is sooooo true ...

[@SuperMcgenius]

Love this review, shout out Montreal , so many accents, Laval ?

[@monster7363]

Oh how I love when I just buy a piece of gear and you guys come out with a review like this literally 2 weeks later. I owned Ares 2, Pontus and now Venus 2. I also have the Exasound like you Thomas. Ares and Pontus not really great. Venus, amazing midrange and vocals!! Nice pairing with Lumin U1 mini. Wondering about I2S connection and DDC from Denafrips

[@connorduke4619]

With a Mano Ultra Mk2 streamer you can run i2S direct into the Venus without any DDC.

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

Oh yeah Venus is crazy on the vocals! Be happy with it cause the others may be better at one thing but not everything! You can tweak around the Venus and you'll never lose that smooth round sound! The smoothness of that DAC really can give you a connection with singers and bet of all you can play it loud to retreave more details and it will never get fatigue. Detail is something fun at first but it gets old fast! Once you have detail it's like bahhh ok...sometimes not enough of something keeps you wanting more and coming back especially if you don't have fatigueing detail and highs!

[@monster7363]

@@connorduke4619 interesting, I’ll have to check out that streamer. Thanks

[@monster7363]

@@Montreal_Audio_Systems I’ve gone down the details path already. Totally not for me but I think it’s a path all audiophiles will take only to end up going for tone.

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

So true. I always taught high end was all about detail but it's clearly not the more expensive equipment is usually more analog smooth warm sounding

[@jmp622]

My Ladder Schumann DAC was defective upon arrival. Won’t use again. Went with Gustard A26, and VERY happy after auditioning various Dacs.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Congrats on the A26.

[@jmp622]

@@ThomasAndStereo FOMO on R26. But I’m exhausted on demos.

[@briansage9388]

Can you please do a review on Gustard r26 dac? Want to know what you think.

[@ryanschipp8513]

I like this video and Thomas I like you as a reviewer but this is just another classic case of different flavors of sound. Just like speakers, amplifiers, and pre-amplifiers offer different flavors of sound. That's one of the frustrating things in the HiFi industry. There really isn't a best of category it's just what do you like the sound of. With so many options it can become overwhelming. Kind of like going to a ice cream shop with 48 flavors. If 100 people coming to the ice cream shop they are all going to have different favorites.

[@ullodea]

I have the Ladder Schumann and can attest to the observations in this video. It heartily beat by Schitt Bifrost and offers incredible value for money ❤

[@WelkySchullin]

Hi Thomas thx for the video you should finally try the Audio-gd DACs you will thank me later. Tony s turntable would probably be at another level with better phono just my 2 cents. Cheers

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

The turnruable is another sound/level of course but...don't forget there's dust and bad pressings everywhere which create background noise ! These DACs are getting really good and you can have an incredible connection with singers especially without all the noise! Analog has a very realistic sound you can hear it with saxophone especially too but the DACs are very good now and can just about do it and without the pops clicks.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

I did try a Audio-gd Preamp, really good.

[@WelkySchullin]

@@ThomasAndStereo Nice! the DACs are maybe even better mean R2R ones. But you need to get them play well - Firmware and OS or NOS modes its a bit finicky but when you get them where you need it s a heaven on earth!

[@WelkySchullin]

@@Montreal_Audio_Systems I mean there are some much better phono preamps for this nice turntable! I didn t mean that some is better just the Project is not bad but for this turntable I can imagine something much better! Digital or analog both have their own.. Cheers

[@BobCoalWater]

@@WelkySchullin I had the same thought about the phono stage. He has most likely has not heard his turntables full potential.

[@Coneman3]

I got a tip for you. Best endgame DAC might be Audio Music DAC/1. At £13,000, it allegedly sees off DACs in the £40k price range. Not many know about it. I got one recently and it’s blowing me away. Doesn’t sound digital at all. It does it all. Giant killer.

[@Coneman3]

Lampizator, DCS, Terminator, Chord Dave? Forget them, THIS IS THE DAC.

[@petrpulpytel]

Thanks Thomas for great video👍 I made my own test of dacs CA 851N (1000USD dac section only) Earmen Tradutto(800USD) Hidizs s9Pro (110USD) Noname china crap(10USD) volume matched on my Master 19 on Moondrop Variations IEM. The differences on the first 3 was very very subtle (thumps up for Hidizs for 110 bucks) the last 10USD crap was the worse of course, but for 10USD it was not so horrible.. mabe im def😀. the difference between 10usd dac and 100usd was big (audible noise, anemic bass, bad detail) but the difference between 110 and 800usd was very subtle.. the diminishing returns beginn by relativelly low price..

[@lucianobadoe36]

Interesting analysis.

[@lucianobadoe36]

Interesting analysis.

[@petrpulpytel]

@@lucianobadoe36 haha, yes it was very funny, i tried it again, but excluded the cheapest one and included shanling ua5, the ua5 was practically on the same level as master 19 + tradutto.. maby because i used iem.. by hungry over ear hp the differences are probably bigger. ua5 is 10 times cheapper then master + tradutto... for iem you need only good dongle.. very cheap way for high quality sound

[@lucianobadoe36]

@@petrpulpytel Very cool Petr. After 2 years with a SMSL M500 a go to a Gustard X16 and have some improvements. Now, I will do my (I hope) last DAC movement to a Venus II.

[@petrpulpytel]

@@lucianobadoe36 yeah, venus2 is another animal👍😀 dont have experience with r2r.. maby sometime in future

[@goodsound4756]

But what if you do need no DAC at all? Please review the Peachtree gan1 poweramp which has only digital input.

[@freelancer1499]

Hi Thomas, since u have spend lots of time with the Venus, could u share how is it different to the meitner ma-1 dac? As I own the Meitner and love it(I actually bought it used and plan to re-sell it to try after watching your video on it, but I kept it! I am not quite sure what to expect. I listen nearfield.

[@MisterChibs]

This was a great vid Thomas. I saw you with that Venus some months back and was wondering if a review was in the works. Happy to know your thoughts as well as Tony's, and I'm totally happy with mine. Will you be at the Toronto Audio show this weekend?

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Yes , see you there. I will be displaying the Galion at room 354 between 3 to 4 everyday.

[@MisterChibs]

@@ThomasAndStereo looking forward to meeting you! 🍻

[@vagomaniac]

A very good idea this comparison. it would be nice to know type of connection Tony used. ladder dacs always play better with I2S, thats when you hear their real character

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

He used a PC with a usb disrupter cable using foobar2000

[@ajzepp8976]

Having a $300 topping dac or something entry level would be fun.

[@PauloFerreira-hh6zv]

Hi Thomas, thanks for the video. I would like to see a comparison made by you of these 6 dacs. When are you going to review the Ladder Schumann?

[@welshrarebit9238]

People like you are what feeds the industry…..review that you like …..buy it

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

The ladder is great a good all rounder! Especially for the price but the bass could have some more detail! It also won't have those super smooth mids like the denafrips or the vmv d3. But considering the price it's very good. It does it all fairly well after all it is a R2R

[@PauloFerreira-hh6zv]

@@Montreal_Audio_Systems Thank for your opinion. I would like to know how it compares with the Pontus II, since they are the 2 better than the Ares II.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

I will review the Ladder DAC but I don't think I will compare all 6 DACs, it takes some serious time for me to AB test 6 DACs because I will not just go based on memory.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

@@welshrarebit9238 Well buy with the option to return. I basically tell them what is worth their time, and ultimately, they decide what is best sounding to their ear.

[@matteo5128]

Well done!! I would like to update my cambridge cxn v2 what do you recommend Gustard R26 or Gustard A 26 ?. Thank you

[@thomasmleahy6218]

My question is when and where or if any results will be published. I really don't have any desire to flip through all these entries. When, where will results be published, rated, decided, etc. Got a plan?? Inquiring minds want to know.

[@DevBone42]

Thomas, please review the Holo Spring 3 (especially this one as it is more affordable for most audio enthusiasts ) and/or the Holo May. Many would like your opinion on this dac(s). I was set to buy a Denifrips, but now I am not so sure? Thx

[@ThomasAndStereo]

I heard the Dac at a friend's place, really good. Yeah, serious challenger to the Denafrip.

[@mikemajors2385]

Hey Thomas, I know i`m a little late on the comment, but I have the Ares2 and I found the SPDIF to sound more refined than the USB input. Then came the HOLY COW moment when I tried the Ifi SPDIF iPurifier 2. This little device blew me away, to the point it may be the best hi-fi purchase to date. Powered with a quality 5v linear pws I got a Larger soundstage, impact-dynamics and quality bass instantly. A must try in my book.

[@klepp19]

What is your transport?

[@Staybrown11]

Hey Tony, you have a great cartridge and table. Upgrade your tube phono stage. You will get the bass and air you are seeking …I got a 10 year old Audio Research ph8….that’s my end game phono pre…

[@dajikbatarang1]

Will you be reviewing the Gustard R26, that one looks quite interesting.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Yes eventually.

[@dajikbatarang1]

@@ThomasAndStereo I will be comparing it to the Pontus 2 this weekend, should be fun.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

@@dajikbatarang1 Let me know how it compares.

[@allenwilliams8962]

@@dajikbatarang1 who won???

[@dajikbatarang1]

@@allenwilliams8962 I preferred the R26 over the Pontus 2 in most areas. The pontus did have a bit better vocals than the R26.

[@leeandrewclarke]

Send this video to those know-everything types on ASR, so they can ignore it, then agree that R2R must be dismissed, without ever listening to one, and go back to wanking over the 'perfect' measurements of a Topping D90. Would have also been nice to hear more about the Schumann.

[@creationsmarketing5033]

The Schumann is great!

[@V1ralB1ack]

ASR can go to hell along with their measurements up their ass which is where their ears and head are anyway

[@Alextraz]

I really liked that video....got a new sub ! I am feeling the time to update my dac is near. I have kef r300, arcam a19 and arcam irdac. I am considering to update thr amp (yamaha as1200) or the dac with maybe denafrips ares 2. Any tips? I am into jazz, vocals, soul. But the system is used for everything...movies music games...

[@klc2578]

hi Thomas great review, will u gonna re-review the VMV D3 again in deep comparison?

[@WhiteBubblySoup]

Can't we get Tony a cool "audiophile buddy" name? Comment with Tony's name. I'll start Mr Analogue Mr Mcintosh Mr Biker Jacket Mr Hearing Aide (100db!)

[@legione1capone]

Will you be reviewing the gustard R26 and ladder Schumann? Would love to know your friends thoughts on these two against each other a bit more too. Even compared to the pontus II because they are all within the $1000-2000 market

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Yes, soon soon.

[@rosswarren436]

These "higher end" R2R DACs sure seem to offer a lot for the money. I've watched numerous reviews of them, especially the Ares II. But I hesitate on buying one because I want to know what the consumer experience is like when things don't go right and you need one of them serviced, either during the warranty period (if there is one) or if the device is out of warranty. I note that at one time you could buy an extended warranty though Amazon for the Ares II, but that is no longer the case. Until I hear some good stories from consumers regarding getting these serviced, I'll stick with my AKM delta-sigma based Geshelli J2. Customer service and warranty service is the "500 lb. gorilla" that most reviews never seem to acknowledge or address.

[@michaelmityok1001]

Hi Ross, I have purchased 3 Denafrips products from Alvin at Vinshine and a Kinki EX-B7 monoblock amp, the amp after I sold it developed a fault in the output stage circuit and Alvin honored the warranty transfer to the guy I sold the amp to, and it was quickly repaired. All warranties have been honored so far when I have sold the gear on to other guys, no one has informed me of any service or warranty issue problems to date. IMO you can buy with confidence through Alvin at Vinshine, don't have any experience dealing with any other Denafrips dealers based in NA.

[@rosswarren436]

@@michaelmityok1001 thanks. Good to know. Just curious on how long the process was, 3 months or more or less? Would be interested in out of warranty service too. My concern is with the Ares II using so many electrolytic capacitors, I wonder about how long it can work and stay in specification since electrolytic caps get hot, dry out, and change value over time - admittedly very slowly usually - but that is why people have to replace them in speaker crossovers after about 10 to 15 years or so... I know some would say, well, you will have bought an even better DAC after that long, but maybe, maybe not, if it meets my needs. Thanks again.

[@michaelmityok1001]

@@rosswarren436 Alvin responded in 24 hours when I copied him on my follow-up email to the guy I sold the amp to... basically Alvin knows his business relies on this level of service as he is a foreigner and has no real service dealer network in NA - coupled with the fact Denafrips is Chinese and increasingly people in NA don't want to support Chinese businesses. Personally I don't have a problem with Chinese people and particularly their high-value small audiophile manufacturers, it's the CCP I have a problem with. Unfortunately my prediction is some folk like Alvin are going to lose the Western market eventually because of their government, as always the little folk suffer when empires collide. Maybe the Chinese domestic economy picks up the slack as it's potentially huge, but that will depend on many factors which are again out of the little folks' control. FYI I just bought a Gustard R26 DAC for $1650 to see if I don't have to pay $7K for high-end R2R sound, by all accounts it's a winner but we shall see.

[@rosswarren436]

@@r423fplip money and sound quality do go together on DACs at least. There are many in the under $500 range, and some in the $500 to $1000 range, then there are those $1000 to $2000, and some double or more. Some are chip based "delta-sigma" DACs, others are resistor ladder (R2R) types, some have better op amps, some have better, quieter power supplies. All those decisions at various price points affect sound quality and price. The reason many of us watch the reviews on KZbin is to try determining what we are getting for our money, and once we choose a price point, we want to know the differences between the ones at that price point. I have a $129 Schiit Modi 3+ I bought 2 years ago and it does fine in my computer office, pushing some $300 ELACs driven by an old AVR. But in my den and living rooms with much better components, I'm trying to decide which DAC in the $1000 range gives me the most bang for my bucks. I've pretty much 80% decided that the Ares II gives me about 90% of all I will ever need. But like many, we look and hear reviews of ones costing just a bit more, in the $1100 range like the Musician Pegasus that offers more bass definition. So yes, it isn't "snake oil", there are real differences among them. But buying one should be price commensurate with the rest of your system. There's no reason to spend more than you need if your system isn't resolving enough to let you hear the differences, i.e. I'd be dumb to buy the Ares II and put it in my computer office system. In there, it probably wouldn't offer any better sound than the $129 Schiit Modi+. At the end of the day, it is all about synergy between all components in your stereo. For me, the Ares II looks to be where I'll tap out and just enjoy the music. But hey, if I find a good deal in a couple years on a used Pegasus or Schumann DAC, I might jump on it.

[@irisfinchmusic]

@@michaelmityok1001 How's your experience been with the R26?

[@howardmims8376]

Hi Thomas everything I've read on the Gustard R26 has never stated that they were bass thin what's your opinion on the bass on the R26

[@quinto34]

from what I understood, it's from the perspective of a basshead..

[@pedrowilson1526]

I consider myself a bit of a bass head. The R26 arrived today so nowhere near burned in. In my system it's already round fat satisfying and defined.

[@quinto34]

@@pedrowilson1526 My concern is the midrange sounding a bit thin..what do you think so far? thanks!

[@pedrowilson1526]

@@quinto34 Within the context of only two hours playing and in comparison to the SMSL VMV D2, I can say the R26 has superior tonality across the range. There is no deficit of detail nor sense of roll off. It is tonally denser than the D2. The R26 is connected directly via Xlr to my tube amp so I'm using the pre of the Gustard.

[@bharadghost]

@@quinto34 Nothing like that, please note everyone's ears are different and opinions are subjective and relative. I have tested the GR26 against a Holo Spring v2, and its mostly right up there with it.

[@lucianobadoe36]

Hi Thomas, that's a great experience. Very important to R2R DAC´s fans like me, but I confess that the first minutes were very tense for me because my Venus II is so close! When Tony say the Venus was the worst!!!! My God! For a while I was very concerned. Thanks' for excelente work and Tony, my man, what a fantastic experience did you have!

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

The venus is great! You should play the song A Case of You -Diana Krall live in Paris like he did! You'll be amazing the connection with singer

[@twntwrs]

@@Montreal_Audio_Systems Must be great if it can make Krall sound good.

[@giovannitirado6229]

Interesting comparisons. Thomas, are you going to review the Terminator II or T+?

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Haha...I think Denafrips will be afraid to send me anything anymore, I kept their DAC for like 7 months!

[@teknolojigundemi]

He made good explanations.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Glad you liked it

[@briancampbell7712]

My vote is for the Aqua audio Formula😉

[@Maxiinti]

Tomas Gallon 120 how long do tubes last before the need to replace and cost 💲

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Probably a few years? I don't know because it depends how many hours you listen every day. It would be around $300 to replace the tubes. If 2 years, that is less than 50cents a day.

[@Maxiinti]

@@ThomasAndStereo thank you 🙏

[@HD-Tech]

Tony, as soon as you start thinking those DACs are making you regret that analogue set up you have, let me suggest a Bobs devices SUT and watch that DV cartridge come alive then I suggest a better phono than that Pro-ject perhaps a Manley Chinook since you like a tube phono. I feel that is holding back your DV. Then revisit A/B DACs vs your TT.

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

The turntable is great it still has a more realistic sound but you really need to find an encredibile expensive record! DACs at 4000$ start to become really good I mean really good! Don't forget theres no pops or ticks or that rubbing sound! When you play a record loud no matter how much yours TT is worth you'll always hear the rubbing sound! On the DAC it's complete silence! True analog will always be something special no doubt if you ask me you need both!

[@HD-Tech]

Variety is the spice of my audio life, that's why I have both. Metrum Acoustics Ambre streamer into Metrum Acoustics Pavane L3. Pretty darn good as well

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

@@HD-Tech yep of course you need both!

[@mrpmj00]

Naw, as Thomas' friend said, the turntable's pops broke his attention during listening. I also hate replacing the needles back in the late 1980s, and eventually the needles scratched the record until I couldn't stand listening to all the pops.

[@dilshadmashoor7566]

I "upgraded" from a TEAC 503 to a Gustard R26 DAC, I have to say the TEAC 503 sounded more like an "R2R" to me compared to the R26.... I went back to the TEAC 503. Not trying to say one is better than the other I preferred the sound of the TEAC. Far as "sounding analog" technically all DACs output an analog signal, I believe the Sabre and AKM chips are more dependent on the quality of the source. I have tried the Gustard X series and L.K.S and did not prefer the Sabre chip at the time and recently I heard a Benchmark DAC3 my opinion on Sabre chip changed completely. My source and cables have changed drastically when I tried the benchmark from my previous experience with Gustard and LKS, based on these experiences I would not throw words too quickly. I have been a die hard R2R fan till I heard the TEAC and Benchmark in my current system. Why turntable or "analog sound" sounds "nicer" or better than digital is because of the absence of "Clock" in analog play back. If digital is done right it is far superior to analog... this could be a touchy subject to most I don't intend to throw a grenade on a sensitive subject. Again this all goes back to throwing opinions before you fully understand, even if you fully understand its still best to leave some room for error because eating your words could be a full meal. I have read in forums where they claim DACs and cables have no sound signature its all "placebo effect" I don't know what to say to that, this all goes back again to throwing opinions before you fully understand. This is my 2 cents take it for what its worth.

[@blejzerosamigos6115]

Thanks for the video guys, but I wonder what was the source for all these DACs thanks

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Check out the video on his system, it is in the first comment. I remember it was a laptop but he had some USB thing to clean up the signal.

[@blejzerosamigos6115]

@@ThomasAndStereo Thomas Thank you for the reply. One thing I have noticed is that a lot of people a lot of reviewers are using computers as their source, some use laptops other use their gaming super pc. None of which are good sources, people just don't believe that $500 bluesound is better than their computer but it is. That is very strange for me.

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

@@blejzerosamigos6115 i use the usb disrupter! Yes is 200$ but I took a chance because no one knows about it! It made a lot of sense to me! What is is actually is a usb cable that ends up having no connection to the PC! You are right PC and especially labtops have a tremendous amount of noise! Tons of it actually! Anyways this is why I want to try this cable! As soon as it came in the mail about almost 10years ago or so. . me and my none audiophile buddy tested it and man even he heard it! It was actually a big difference! Much darker background and seperation of instruments was so noticable! Now this was back then when I had a cheapo DAC a MicroMega MYdac!

[@MisterChibs]

@@blejzerosamigos6115 Amen brotha!

[@UDASAN1]

How do you run a turntable through a DAC I’m confused as that’s analog and a Dac is digital to an analog converter ?? Thanks for your help as I’m new to all this

[@ThomasAndStereo]

You cannot. A turntable goes to a phono stage and not a DAC.

[@UDASAN1]

@@ThomasAndStereo thanks for that as it sounded like he used his turntable and tape deck through these x 6 Dacs as he mainly used ANOLOG so I was well confused but I presume he used streaming and CDs maybe ( By the way was the Venus Dac his fave in the end ? Thanks for the reply Dan From the UK I have just sold my Topping D50s DAC and I’ve bought a AudioLab 90000A amp / BlueSound Node 3 / Warfdale Linton 85th Anniversary Speakers / P2 Turntable with Rega MM KK 5 Phono Amp / Rel Tx 5i Sub and I’m looking for a new Dac but I need a remote control so that rules out many brilliant Dacs ( Denafrips Aries 2~12 Aniversery £1100.00 ( Denafrips Pontus 11 £2000.00 ) or Denafrips ENYO £865.00 but the Holo 3 level 2 is very expensive to me £2400.00 New but a used one maybe for me or is it over the top ? Or what do you recommend ? Thank You Dan.

[@Audfile]

Love my Gustard!

[@aiCorner]

I heard Denafrip DACs are not quite suitable for snappy, quick presentation (rock, electronic music). Chord Qutest is good in that but it's not R2R. How true is that?

[@gumbygreeneye3655]

I’ve got a Pontus II 12th and an Iris and it’s just fine mate. I listen to plenty of rock electronica.

[@denniswade4998]

"You can play the Venus loud all day, and it sounds good!" . . . . Ha! . . . so, don't buy this one if you have neighbors???? :} I really never thought about it, but it does seem to be true that we do rate dacs by how analog sounding they are. Says a lot about analog sound! And it seems to be a quality that requires more cost to attain. I do wonder about trying to add more air to a system through a dac, as it seems like he really didn't find this even with the very expensive dacs. I tend to think that tubes add this very well, even at lower prices. And I have discovered that airiness is something I value a lot more than most other qualities.

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

Yes that airy sound can be hard to achieve but if you want it I would seriously consider his galleon amp it's fantastic for that and depth in the music

[@davidmills3846]

Thanks Thomas I'm a big fan, please review some DDC,S

[@truman4956]

If I was Thomas’s neighbor, I would be at his house everyday checking out new gear (definitely not mowing the lawn)

[@Xiaoguan8845]

I wonder when people talking about smooth sound is that means narrow frequency range(slow)with very strong power supply?

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Perhaps but the Matrix should have a good power supply but it is not as smooth as the R2R DACs.

[@Xiaoguan8845]

Then after serious burning period it might deserve a second chance to get reviewed Even with different power cable?

[@robinhook37]

So what exactly is “air”? It seems the two of you have completely different definitions of air. Tony defines it as the details in the high frequencies, but Thomas is talking about “the space between instruments”. So Tony is talking about frequency response and thomas is talking about imaging and sound stage?

[@ungarlinski7965]

Is the Venus 2 appropriate for Metallica?

[@Montreal_Audio_Systems]

I'd say it would be good it will smoothen them up a lot but it will slow them down. With the pontus it will be faster

[@robertm8518]

You should try the Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE 😊

[@user-od9iz9cv1w]

I started with a AD1860N based DAC. Once tweaked with a tube output it was very good. Then went to Phillips R2R. A very well done TDA1543. Much better. Then many Phillips TDA1541a DACs. Best. After a couple of iterations now with dual mono triode output with 5u4g rectifier tubes driven by TDA1541a S2 double crown. Streamer with SOTA low phase noise clock. Super caps and Blackgates in abundance. Sublime. Detail, air, smooth but tons of grunt. Natural. No going back after R2R.

[@backrack01]

Would love to see some Terminator II reviews. See a lot of T+ reviews.. very limited on T2.