Pilots vs Legends - who wins?

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

so what do you think, who wins between these 2 and what other topic should I talk about next?

[@DLdg21]

Idk

[@icemanspy007]

Man your videos are legendary tbh

[@aarkemis]

Delicioso

[@Tybek1]

You are first heh

[@cbas551]

Nice video aaahh me cuesta mucho escribir en ingles

[@chikihando2483]

a pilot vs a legend is like a marine soldier vs an influencer with a gun

[@mako9324]

Na marines is an understatement

[@NoctisPhantasm]

Lmao

[@davidproductions1974]

No, it depends on the legend

[@Jack_1956]

agree, exept maybe for revenant... but i agree

[@NahIdSword]

@@Jack_1956 also ash, she was a pilot

[@mrazbyte3150]

Bangalore has 2 choices. 1. Survive 2. "THEY'RE TRYING TO CORNER US!!!"

[@beanother1an690]

At least she only says "They're trying to corner us!" when her team's actually in danger of being cornered, unlike her fellow IMC grunts.

[@radioblade5610]

Soo true. but dont forget if she sees a pilot. Look a Pilot no the ods are in our favor.

[@Vogelgangg]

Are there any pilots in the area?!

[@mr.bravehart8183]

"Look Pilots! Now the odds are in our favor!"

[@sgtmoose1942]

"WE NEED TO MOVE!"

[@erikjohansson5553]

the case of bangalore winning against that pilot is literally: The Strongest Grunt vs. The Weakest Pilot

[@aprilbaird-p5c]

has to be

[@soulsurvivor8293]

Great summary. Essentially sounds like Pilot near peer Rifleman VS Overconfident terrible Pilot. Cooper from Titanfall 2 was a near peer Rifleman that received basic training in Pilot jump harness gear and Titan operation. Bangalore sounds like they are basically Cooper minus the jump harness and Titan training. Admittedly, it was just bad timing for this particular situation. Felt like salt in the wound of all Titanfall Players after all the vinegar Respawn had already been pouring into it with Apex. When given proper context, this makes sense. Doesn't make it sting much less though.

[@obamnaprismus]

​@@soulsurvivor8293 The thing about Cooper is that yes, he starts off as a grunt, but all he learns as a pilot is literally acquired from battle alone. Sure, BT was extremely helpful, but many times Jack had to go off alone and take down about an entire regiment's worth per level. On his own. Socomparing Bangalore, who had normal training, to cooper who was straight up battle-hardened, seems a bit unfair. Really I'd say that Bangalore is closer to a normal pilot - which for a soldier of her rank is an impressive feat - and not a literal miracle war-winning ace like Jack Cooper, who brought down all the of the Apex Predators on his own. He's on another level entirely, he's like the Goku of first person shooters

[@cyberghostx1826]

Imagine a pilot loosing a fight against 2 grunts :’o

[@cyberghostx1826]

Imagine a pilot loosing a fight against 2 grunts :’o

[@critical_crunch]

Let’s be real, pilots would win. They are trained in wall running, use battle-tested gear and abilities, and have experienced actual combat. Even without the help of their titans, I believe the pilots would still win.

[@franciscoc296]

Andkids still tink there is a dicussion here

[@magnunator]

And they have T I T A N S

[@peabrain6872]

octane has the gauntlet record

[@magnunator]

@@peabrain6872T I T A N S make short work of Legends

[@peabrain6872]

@@magnunator they also make short work of pilots

[@lionljb]

Scryer made the key mistake Blisk told us about in Northstars trailer: "arrogance, that's the problem with most pilots eh? Makes you blind.... (and get's the ones closest to you dead)" . Pilots are the peak performers of killing, but he got cocky and didn't handle the situation how he should have, in a calm collected manner, but he was blinded by his will to show Bangalore he is better.

[@nathanbristol4506]

@@sprayender2002 For me this hits home with the Viper boss fight. I can still hear that damned Northstar Core.

[@revemb4653]

He lost because he didnt have 5G from verizon fios.

[@colinni7065]

@@nathanbristol4506 yea I agree on my opinion he’s the hardest out of every apex predator

[@StandardBuster]

He also used a smart pistol on IMC traitors that are still listed as allies.

[@tonympal]

there is no excuse her mf missed with a smart pistol that aint a pilot bangalore got away with the easy way put a g 100 player with a kraber and she would probably not even be a legend after it

[@zesty_jack7801]

If it's Jack Cooper no one beats him

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

👊🏼

[@derp-7274]

Maybe he'll definitely win against some but idk about some others

[@mata_potato5438]

@@derp-7274 ash has already been killed by him in tf2 Bangalore goona get killed 100 percent revenant would be close but I think cooper wins and that's it

[@derp-7274]

@@mata_potato5438 the problem is that we don't know enough about Cooper's skill since we never see him outside of his titan lore wise so though he won against ash that was when he had his titan and in this fight he wouldn't

[@songokucarot1668]

@@derp-7274 ever watched the Titanfall 2 trailers buddy?

[@bigmansir3745]

Pilots definetly

[@Bcnbiwka]

Honestly no competition

[@corrosion1yt466]

Yeah

[@rafaelleiguesouza2027]

Yes man 👌

[@baviett.]

what about rev 🤔

[@ilovemen671]

@@baviett. rev and ash are probably the only ones who can take down pilots

[@shenanigans01]

i like how one titan battery is the center of a whole apex legends character but pilots literally run around with them half the time in battle

[@Flob13]

To be fair it was one after what was essentially a nuke eject.

[@fractality9676]

The idea of a pilot getting cocky is very realistic and does happen with actual gameplay in titanfall 2. I think that if you showed bangalore struggle more and not just effortlessly stop a pilot execution it would be cool. The way the takedown is performed made my scream at the monitor. There is no way the pilot was held in place for several seconds, doing nothing, and then casually just tripped over.

[@tobiasnguyen2502]

Same thought, dude must be drunk as hell to not counter her

[@kivori3438]

This, it isnt bad to see a cocky pilot get killed but not this easily when it should be a hard fight, like those anime scenes where the villain gets all cocky cuz he has the upperhand but fails in the end. Bangalore cant be a one man army against a pilot come on

[@WwZa7]

It's not even that he was cocky, he was behind her, than pulled out a knife, to attack her from the front where she could see him (cloak does not work with humans as well as with titans). He could just use kick.

[@Johnny_Galaxy]

Kane is a good example. He was the 1st boss battle in Titanfall 2 and you could tell he was cocky as all hell in his intro.

[@WwZa7]

@@Johnny_Galaxy Yeah, but you were a trained pilot and had a titan that is by default stronger than any other titans manufactured by IMC.

[@Bingus1507]

Pilots without a doubt, better trained, better equipment, better skills, TITANS, jet packs, better awareness, legends just lack the equipment and training that pilots have.

[@muftu6075]

wdym "titans"? then mention revenant being unable to die too we are talking about pilots not titans

[@ajh3461]

Better equipment doesn't mean they know how to use it. Considering that you can beat the average pilot gauntlet time by walking, the majority of pilots probably can't even wall-run anyways.

[@itsyaboi.1645]

I don't titans are very fair to include in this. Thats almost an instant win.

[@ajh3461]

@@muftu6075 If pilots can have titans, then Ash should get her's too.

[@lucky9293]

And Ash has a fucking Ronin Fast, sure, but a strong breeze would kill her

[@snowstalker36]

Pilots have just about all the advantages, even before bringing in the Titan. But that doesn't mean that a good Legend can't defeat one, or a pilot can't screw it up. It's not likely that the Legend would win, but it is possible.

[@raisgamesnz325]

I 100% agree.

[@Yomotomen]

Yeah, but bangalore trips him, he doesn’t move from being tripped, doesn’t even struggle and the he gets shot, idk man, you can fuck up, but this just feels wrong, ngl, bangalore and her brother getting a pilot i can believe, but a smart pistol that isn’t smart, and then she effortlessly kills the dude in the intro, bit much, rev, ash, and vantage are the only ones that imo can really stand up to a pilot an potentially consistently win, otherwise, it’s a bit much.

[@AWACS_Snowblind]

As someone who has, shamefully, more than once, accidentally got cornered and got my ass kicked by a Grunt, I didn't at all blink at the Bangalore short. His buddies were probably talking shit about him after seeing the kill feed 😔

[@JadedMarigold]

Question have you ever been 180 by a grunt while grappling?

[@CodeVIPER555]

@@JadedMarigold can't say I have XD

[@JadedMarigold]

@@CodeVIPER555 I got 180 by a grunt once, while I was grappling to safety and had half health

[@CodeVIPER555]

@@JadedMarigold ouch how does that happend XD

[@thatoneguy7331]

Yeah. But it only happens when there are to many grunts, distracted, or enemy pilot puts me at low health

[@GeeseAreDeadly]

I agree, I thought at first it was bs that Bangalore won but thinking about it a bit more, Pilots we’re supposed to be the best of the best but now realized how he toyed with them he was asking for it, thanks for making this video! Great work man

[@lucky9293]

yeah bangalore lost to the militia pilot because he didn't waste any time, just beat the shit outta her before she could even fight back. Clean and quick The imc pilot could have beaten Jackson and bangalore if he went straight to the point but he fooled around and got stabbed

[@rage_tv4493]

Yea the reason she won is bcz she wasn’t alone and the opponent was being dumb. But she did get her ass kicked while doing it.

[@GreenSoldierProductions]

He done a one vs 2 against 2 highly experienced grunts , bare in mind he lost by a slither , it was a really close fight

[@lonewolfx7552]

not only did the imc toyed around too long remember militia went for quality > quantity while imc went for quantity > quality

[@virgilhoffman9144]

One thing to add that the trailer didn’t show was that a Militia cloak pilot was the one who stabbed her and the only thing he did wrong was not confirming her death. Other than that, the militia pilot did everything a pilot should’ve done. He was calm collected and struck when the opportunity rose

[@garretdyel]

People base alot of their opinion on how the legend plays in game not realising the real apex games wouldnt have nerfs and buffs putting it simply some legends like Ash are simply capable of beating a pilot despite being at the same level as Wattson in the actual apex game

[@aqn01]

This!

[@Nexxplane]

Garret has spoken

[@itsyaboi.1645]

Ash is still considered a pilot no? Or was a part of the apex predators. So I dont think thats a fair comparison considering ash has probably beaten a lot of pilots while a lot of other people in the apex games havent

[@catsharkthe85th]

Ash was a pilot so it depends what pilot she is fighting, against an average pilot she would win but against a pilot like Lastimosa or Blisk she would most likely lose

[@itsyaboi.1645]

Also these "abilities" that the legends have isn't anything pilots haven't seen before. Or some at least. Like Wraith with her phase or octane with his stim

[@Sarcastican_]

Well, this is interesting. I'd say that the pilot can outmatch just about every legend. Wraith, ash, and bangalore seem like the only ones who can put up a fight. - Wraith having the phase ability. - Ash... being ash. - Bangalore being an above-average grunt (she would survive, but maybe not win). Though Valkrie has a similar pilot kit, when have you ever died to a hover pilot in titanfall?

[@zesty_jack7801]

ash is on both teams

[@scarecrow2272]

Ash would probably win since she is a pilot herself

[@Tot_samei_Kiri11]

Where is Rev?

[@arandomguy6551]

And revenant and pathfinder?

[@love999cats]

Wraith was a pilot before the experiments, so she has proper training as well.

[@Alive19_]

I would love to see a battle between blisk and cooper. With and without titans

[@catsharkthe85th]

I think Blisk would probably win at the time of Titanfall 2 campaign but at the time apex takes place Blisk is much older now, he still could win but cooper was young and has had years to improve since the campaign when he already was above average for a pilot

[@filipw8050]

What if Cooper gets send on a mission to hunt down Blisk and Ash and in that way becomes a legend. It could get us a cinematic of them fighting.

[@eli3998]

​@@filipw8050 he already has an invitation to the apex predators, which circumvents the need to go to the legends in the first place. And either way, he's a fucking pilot, the legends game is beneath him. It's like a professional football player playing seriously with a bunch of tweens

[@Foxtrot-22971]

bro Blisk would get flicked by a firestar in the first twelve seconds of the fight probably in pilot-v-pilot. Titan combat i'm not sure, depends on BT's loadout.

[@eli3998]

@@Foxtrot-22971 blisk was the leader of the apex legends, he was the top of top of pilots, one of the most sought after mercenaries out there, he is not a pushover

[@atlas9852]

I'm not a huge fan of Apex. The Titanfall games however are my favourite games of all time. I think the whole bangalore being able to take down a pilot argument is stupid and a waste of time. However I couldn't help but get upset at the finisher animation as well when it was first revealed. It just seemed like an insult to the titanfall fanbase at the time (I'm well aware it was never meant to be.) Seeing my personal favourite pilot getting their ass kicked in an animation right after Respawn announces Titanfall 1 being taken down from stores wasn't something that sat well with me. But I can definitely acknowledge that the argument between both fanbases is literally pointless. I think that the gridiron cinematic was incredible though and it had amazing animation and choreography and the way the pilot in that short was defeated was realistic and made sense to me. I don't really know where I'm going with this comment but I guess the main point I'm trying to get across is it's ok to like both games or one and not the other XD.

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

thanks for the comment. It's a bit terrifying sometimes to release something that can potentially get eyes on both communities, I try to do it as respectfully as I can and sometimes brace for impact 😅

[@atlas9852]

@@ToonCraftAnimation I'm currently studying animation at Uni right now so I'm well aware of the struggles that happen in the industry such as resource shortages. Never the less I have always and will always be a fan of your work, no matter the game it's in. Still remember the first titantoons episode :D

[@peabrain6872]

dont be a whiny baby

[@atlas9852]

@@peabrain6872 Hush please, the adults are talking :)

[@thatoneguy7331]

In my opinion, the first Titanfall game kinda sucked (especially the campaign since it was multiplayer) plus, people couldn’t pick out their own load outs respawn pretty much telling you “Oh here you go Titanfall players, have a pre-made load out.” And don’t get me started that you didn’t even have to earn the smart pistol.

[@comic-_-fanboy5414]

I don't know if Moy would be into this but you should teach some basic animating tips and tricks on this channel or a separate one? :)

[@quive5705]

THIS

[@kcajproductions5150]

Please moy

[@diarykeeper]

He has a job and a family... Just watch his animation breakdowns

[@tosstt9936]

some things that people dont realise is that, like stan lee said, the one who wins, is the one that the writer wants to, they arent going to make the main character die cuz canonically hes weaker, it doesnt matter who would win or lose cuz its up to the writer all the time, the progression and meaning of the story is way more important than being "100% accurate", its a game, theres no need to yell and cause havoc just to prove "the characters in my game are stronger", titanfall and apex is basically a family, theyre brothers, theres no need to fight if both would benefit more in the union of their communities

[@yellowflashgamer5460]

did you happen to have learned this from Stan Lee

[@tosstt9936]

@@yellowflashgamer5460 o crap i forgot to say its from stan lee in my comment, sorry for that and thank you for reminding me!

[@yellowflashgamer5460]

@@tosstt9936 no problem at all! I always keep that train of thought in my head. It's fun to think about two characters or forces fighting and thinking about who wins but it's important to remember that the writer can always create a circumstance to make the fight go one way or another. So I usually won't be found online fighting over who wins when the writer can go "he's stronger now lol" and still make a great story.

[@tosstt9936]

@@yellowflashgamer5460 yeah, a fight can go so many different ways, any result could happen, either for a plot twist, character development, unforseen event, that in some times the fact that x character is stronger or smarter than the other, wouldnt even matter

[@thatoneguy7331]

@@tosstt9936 brothers usually fight in the real world every now and then

[@xypod]

Loved hearing some insight from a Respawn dev on this! I'm very satisfied with how you explained it and i hope both communities can be at peace with this discussion.

[@AxisCorpsRep]

my only issue with the animation is the flying bit, yes it is a common thing that skilled pilots are referred to as "flying" trough the battlefield, but i think the studio that developed the animation misunderstood that and took it literally. i do however extremely agree with the portrayal of a cocky and undisciplined pilot being defeated by soldiers that (traditionally) are "below" him i do like this aspect and choose to think that his scar was not trough some rough n tough badassery of being a pilot, but him being loose with the rules and choosing to skip things and got hurt because of it. maybe he forgot to engage safety on a gun he was working on and blew up in his face, or he took his helmet off to make an "easy" fight more "interesting"

[@ege8240]

well, there is apperantly pilots can fly

[@sharkmastergaming1524]

@@ege8240 There are pilots that can hover. Even then they're still falling just slower. They can't actually zip around like they're wearing a jetpack.

[@Chernokam]

To be honest, my stupid ass has died to grunts all the time in frontier because I forgot they can shoot at you

[@silverwolfe3636]

Anyone can kill anyone. A highly trained career warfighter can still be killed by a child with an AK, and it happens.

[@gigginoxplayer]

I think the thing that really hurt the situation was how the animation for the Bangalore skin was leaked BEFORE the short came out, so not only did the original pilot show up in the animation, but then all people got to see at first was a legend taking down a pilot pretty easily (again since that was covered in the actual Gridiron animation) so it was just a series of unfortunate events which led to people getting mad

[@antares3518]

If a pilot dropped in the apex games, even the announcer would perish

[@Smurfson]

Great video Moy. IMO I don't think its out of the possibility that a legend could take down a pilot, and Bangalore is a great example of that. I love the work you did on her animation for her skin, and that + the cinematic makes me love her heirloom so much more! You're great Moy, keep it up!

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

❤️🙏

[@rage_tv4493]

Ayyyy

[@RazielJR]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA dios... Muchas emociones en este video, el amor que le pones a tu trabajo se ve reflejado en cada aspecto Moy!!! Tengo muchos comentarios, espero no sea mucho texto jaja Coincido completamente contigo respecto a pilotos y leyendas, "Gridiron SFTO" fue un gran homenaje a todos los amantes de titanfall, lástima que muchos no supieron apreciar el mensaje de esa hermosa cinematica (de mis favoritas) Sin duda, Bangalore y Jackson si podrían hacerle contra a un piloto, conociendo su historia se entiende su pantalla de seleccion de personaje, excelente trabajo demostrando lo depredadora que puede ser Anita! Muchas gracias por entregar siempre tu pasión al Apex y titanfall, como siempre te lo he dicho: Cada animación transmite algo, todas y cada una de ellas se sienten tan emocionantes... Saludos Moy! Te queremos mucho! C:

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

Que bueno que te gustó. Yo tambien vi tu vídeo cuando salió y fue muy interesante ver todas las ideas y especulaciones acerca de esta animación en particular. Siempre hay una historia detrás de cada desición aún en los detalles más pequeños y me alegra poder compartirlos cuando tengo oportunidad. Gracias por el apoyo siempre 👍🏼 muchos saludos 🖐🏽

[@ElPrincipito99386]

Como es que aun no hay 50 comentarios diciendo: "raziel que haces aqui :0"

[@cviche04]

RazielGod

[@ComicalRealm]

Apex Legends in a nutshell: “Just one more game” ... 6 hours later “Now is the last one!”

[@franciscoc296]

Everyday

[@michaelplaczek9385]

The fact that a Legend even took down a Pilot is ridiculous

[@ultrachoccymilk]

Yeah, not to mention his SMART PISTOL missing

[@r3eech]

Solid work as always Moy! I love the little insight videos you do!

[@ChimerFox]

As someone who's had military training, like CQC training I can say that I think that Scryer did make the biggest mistake of not only toying with them but waiting way too long for the perfect chance because he thought he was better. Once he was in that room with the two of them, it was a battle of attrition for who made the most mistakes. He also didn't need to carpet bomb the place just to show off. Now i'm not saying the animation wasn't cool, cause it totally was! But just looking at it from a personal perspective! :) In that instance if it was ASH who was a pilot, both bangalore and jackson would be dead because she doesn't hesitate lore-wise from my understanding.

[@mattbad3114]

Very intersting video thanks ! I feel like it could depend on the legend. Like pilot vs Ash or Revenant could be different

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

agree :)

[@Omar12831]

Ash don’t win, cooper vs ash

[@bitbreaker_creator]

@@Omar12831 cooper is very skilled and lucky tho are you seriously gonna compare a random pilot to cooper

[@lionpridedivisionyt1388]

Ash is a pilot…

[@madrichm2763]

pilot vs legend is pretty much just "hydrogen bomb vs coughing baby"

[@kevtheking99-YT]

Nice video Moy well done 👏

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

🙏

[@shulferlol6086]

I think that the pilot win because he's more trained for fight than the legends

[@Redactedusernameofall]

Imagine this: 1. A pilot with a stim and mastiff VS 2. An octane The pilot wins

[@dma968]

I think pilots were stronger and still for the most part are,i just think the devs have retconned some of the things that wouldve made them overwhelmingly stronger,im 95% sure pilots had super strength and heightened reflexes,in the games we literally punch enemies across rooms sometimes enemies burst from a single punch.Also in the cinematic trailer we used our jump to break a grunt through a wall had to be strong for the shock to not also hurt us

[@NoorAG]

Pilots without a doubt 😎

[@revivrevalchn3503]

Imagine being a last 8 legend on the lobby and heard "Stand by for Titanfall"

[@dannyn5997]

Legends said he missed with a smart pistol.

[@supplice-03-aaliyah]

underrated comment, needs more likes

[@rennox_warzone]

Pilots are basically Titanfall's spartans from Halo.

[@mozambique_enjoyer]

"Missed deadline" is the best part of the video. Glad to hear informed opinion. We still want TF3 tho.

[@justsomejerseydevilwithint4606]

I don't see a legend with A FYCKING GIANT ROBOT SUIT COMPANION

[@tosstt9936]

ah yes, the three classes, cientists, space moms and robots

[@connorjosephson2931]

Considering most pilots DIE in training, (lore says 98% of pilots in training die during live fire exercises) they have insane reaction time, extremely strong gear, armor, and of course titans. Pilots, obviously are very powerful, due to the fact that they have crazy abilities, and like man’s said, they are at their peak of military career. Even though Bangalore, being a sergeant in the IMC, would not even compare to any pilot. Whether new pilot or seasoned pilot, the outcome with Bangalore getting her ass kicked, along with most other legends. Revenant may be a challenge considering he is basically immortal.

[@verifiedpotato7502]

I appreciate you sharing some reasoning here. The animation looks great and context does matter!

[@mrmandudeplays]

I agreed with everything here. The beginning shows Bangalore almost being killed by a pilot but then remembering what to do in the same situation. This gives her the edge in that fight. After all, most don't live to tell the tales of a pilot encounter. Also I would like to learn more about octane. An animation about his origins into becoming the S tier Legend that he is (in my opinion) would be pretty cool.

[@m.ubaidaadam]

great vid toon, always puts a smile on my face! I'm much more of a Titanfall fan then an apex one but still couldn't agree more with your verdict and why bangalore won. though as a holo pilot boi the animation hurts a little lol

[@Realcoolbeanz]

lets not forget they are super soldiers. literally knees through a wall and kills a grunt in the first 50 seconds of the titanfall 2 trailer

[@xdrumix6132]

Pilot wins for me because like u said they're prepared for war but bungalore and revenant (as an assassin) or ash (that is an ex pilot) are prepared too. The difference is that at start of tf 2 we know that in order to become a pilot they need already war experience (protagonist apart) and another training specifically to improve and use at best titans and abilities (wich a lot of them are the same but a little bit reworked that legends are using) P.s. for the same reason they win both 1v1 and in group and if ash is at the same level of the legends it's because she can't use pilot stuff or war strategies because apex games are a sport not a war. I love valk but she's not a pilot for me

[@9robbby78]

Ive been following this channel since peak Titanfall 2 and while I respect the grind and the decision making behind this particular case, If I really try to remove the bias I have from TF2 I still believe fundamentally that most experienced Pilots including Cooper at this point in the timeline, would absolutely demolish the entire roster. Coin flip on Revenant to be sure but not one Legend would come out on top. That being said, I still find it believable that Pilots arent perfect, and the one that died to the siblings truly deserved to be a cocky downfall scenario and I didnt mind that trailer at all. It still highlighted how absolutely grimm reaper most pilots would be and I appreciate that.

[@TheRiceIsReal]

let's see how many people are gonna disagree with a developer of both of these games XD

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

I'm actually really looking forward to hearing opinions, even if they're totally different. As long as things remain civil in the comments 😅

[@crim1188]

Being a developer doesnt make you automatically right

[@SP00KYM4NH3R3]

Pilots are literally super soldiers, Legends are just lore-fuelled people

[@GL1TC3]

It depends on the legend and the pilot. And if the pilots would have access to a titan. Or if it would be just a fist fight.

[@Vennnaya]

Here is the way i see it Let's assume canon, and use a comparison to Halo Pilots are basically Spartans. The best of the best legends, canonically, are basically ODSTs (even though Ash and brimstone are former pilots....but note how they are FORMER pilots. They're probably past their prime or otherwise not as effective as they once were) The worst of the legends, canonically, are basically grunts. Think about it this way - Take away both the pilots suit abilities (cloak, grapple, holo etc), and also take away the legends abilities (active, passive, and ultimate) Who wins in that scenario? Easy, the pilot.

[@itsnotfun3]

I think that nessy wins, come on! He's hot, cool, chill, + more cool and he got plot armor. He definitely can crack any legend and pilot.

[@prussiansoup]

Jack has got 1 major upside : plot armour

[@Lonewolf360gaming]

Personally love the titanfall universe but at the end of the day pilots are just people(with the exception of the robo guys and gals) so whoever wins rather if it's a pilot or not is based off of circumstances and pure skill

[@SuperTone]

Well pilots should have more skill

[@maddasher8471]

exactly and pilot have better skills they are the top of the military chain.

[@Riimaachan]

When a pilot punches a legend they will turn into red mist

[@dingo5797]

it really depends on the legend. some would get folded instantly, like lifeline, some would destroy almost any pilot, like revenant

[@fractality9676]

Im not quite sure there is literally any legend that would destroy any pilot

[@Друг-р4з]

Ash is literally a pilot

[@crim1188]

​@@fractality9676Thats why people dont count her

[@LuisB114]

I purchased and played Titanfall 2 a week ago and have been playing every single day ever since (Titanfall 1 and Apex Legends being the only games I've played before that). I can confidently say, after playing the Campaign, that an experienced Pilot can definitely win a fight against a majority or even all the Legends. Titanfall 2 perfectly captures how nimble yet powerful a Pilot truly is. I liked the explanation for the animation reel you did. Bangalore deserved that win vs the cocky Pilot, but I don't think she's capable of taking down Jack Cooper (Titanfall 2 Protagonist). Not even close.

[@halofall8136]

so informational of both pilots and legends, I like it, keep up the good work.

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

❤️👊🏼

[@thomasbruinsma]

I have 1000 hours in apex, and 25 in Titanfall. I can say hands down a pilot would win every time. That is assuming the ttk is averaged out, otherwise the pilots don't stand a chance.

[@ciandooley]

before i watch this ill put down my opinion. in the situation either side could win. as stated multiple times through the lore, pilots are not super soldier, they have not been given any chemicals to make their body stronger then the average human (like a spartan from halo would). all they are are "the best of the best", given armour and attachments that suit their fighting style, as well as a jump kit to give them better agility. if it came to a sneak attack or the pilot wasnt aware a legend could take out a pilot, heck even a kraber from long range where the pilot wasnt seeing it coming could take them out. 1 on 1 combat a pilot may have an advantage as they are more agile and quick to scope out their environment to give them the upper hand. even if it was 2on 1 or even 10 on 1 if the pilot had a level head and knew the opponents weakness then they could beat the overwhelming odd. BUT the same can be said for the legends. if a pilot wasnt at the top of their game, or in the Gridirons cinematics case, underestimated their opponent believing that they were the best so they would win hands down in the fight then the legend could make that an advantage and win. It all really depends on the rules of engagement (im not taking into account if the pilot has a titan to help them). I hope people do read through this and have the same feelings towards this as i do. Now on with the video

[@ToonCraftAnimation]

Thanks for your comment!

[@ciandooley]

@@ToonCraftAnimation NP. thanks for taking the time to read it. its funny how some of my points match up with the video :}

[@dma968]

dont pilots literally have super strength tho?

[@ciandooley]

@@dma968 no their more higher agility through training rather than super

[@lucky9293]

Some Pilots have implants (Aural Implant burn card) and may even choose to become robots (Simulacrum, Spectre Camo burn card) Also the ability for Pilot to survive virtually any injury, up to and likely including losing limbs, and then patch themselves up and continue fighting. Cooper, a basic-bitch *Rifleman*, was *majorly* fucked up before Lastimosa hits him with the Magic Nanobot Stims; He likely had broken bones and bruised internal organs just from his lifeboat's botched landing alone, said lifeboat then overdosing him on several combat stimulants just to get him *ambulatory*. He then proceeded to immediately charge into a firefight, likely taking a few gunshot wounds, in addition to however much internal stress and damage he'd've inflicted on himself due to the stimulants and adrenaline. After finally collapsing, either from his wounds or the stimulants giving him a heart attack, Lastimosa hit him with a Stim (which is really *really* not good for you long-term, of which Octane is living proof), which immediately knocked Cooper out. Note that I do not consider him one-punching Grunts and Specters before getting the Stim as evidence of him just being super strong, as he was 100% coked-up on lethal amounts of Medical Space Crack^TM at the time. Even after that, once he wakes up he's *totally fine*, and now has enhanced reflexes and physical capabilities beyond what a normal Rifleman should be capable of. Additionally, he suffers no lasting injuries from his leg getting shaken around by a Prowler all "Canine Kill-Instinct" style, nor any other injuries that were not immediately fatal. This *includes* the ones that previously disabled him. That level of field-applicable medical, viewed as seemingly just as normal as an IFAK... Even considering that Stims and other similar equipment are likely only issued to Special Forces units like SRS Pilots, that implies a *ludicrously* advanced level of medical technology. There's no way augmentations *aren't* available to any Pilot willing to get them

[@slate8409]

Pilots, without question. A lot of people do not realize how insane the lore behind Pilots are - it's not just the training. Out of 100 people who GET that training maybe one of them passes Pilot certification last I checked, and the ones that do are frequently mistaken for super soldiers by people not familiar with the fandom. Normal, unaugmented humans just using good tech and trained skills. Titanfall 2's opening is pretty clear on this - short of VERY bad luck or an individual making poor decisions like Scryer did in Bangalore's story? The only way to take a Pilot down is either through overwhelming force or an equal on the battlefield. And it should be noted that Bangalore killed Scryer due to HIS mistakes. Just prior to that she got absolutely bodied by another Pilot that was taking it relatively easy in the fight and not gunning for her specifically. Wrong place, wrong time - as soon as she wasn't a threat they moved on which is how she survived. Just take a moment to consider how nuts trying to fight a Pilot in Apex would be. A single character with the ability to wallrun faster than Reaper can climb, zip across the battlefield at close to 40 miles per hour on average while nailing shots with pintpoint accuracy as they do so... and Grapple/Cloak/Phase/Stim longer and more frequently than any of the Legends can. Cover and position would be meaningless, and no position safe from a rapid flank from angles most players simply are not equipped to handle or predict. Such a character would get IMMEDIATELY frozen and locked in the nightmare scenario where Respawn chooses to make one like this, and rightfully called out as gamebreaking. Yeah, you're going to have instances were a more skilled player comes out on top... but what happens when such a character is only allowed in the hands of the top 1% of Apex players? That is an accurate comparison to what a Legend trying to fight a decent Pilot would be like.

[@bmx9757]

Realy depends on the legend. Some could easily compete,while some would get washed immediately. Its not black and white

[@PulseStar5k]

First, animation wise, there's nothing to say, it's great :) Then, lore wise, the pilot they took down was a pure cocky noob. He should not have loose this encounter : he failed as a pilot. My point is that a serious "normal" pilot would have squished Bangalor and her bro in a instant

[@greyferret26]

Hmmm, I would say that that's fair. I was against Bangalore after this cinematic, because I'm huge Pilots fan (lore-wise). Even with training and all other blah-blah - as you said, Pilots should come out on top. But this one Pilot was arrogant and I *did* have emotional response to this cinematic, so I can't overlook the importance of that. So in the end: I agree with your message :)

[@son-izanagi4736]

As someone who loves titanfall 2 and could never really get into apex I really hated this scene. But with the context behind the story and making of the animation it made me appreciate it a lot more

[@OW.FEntertainment]

Legends train for entertainment and pilots are like super soldiers

[@connorbaird8596]

Pretty much are supersoldiers, the human ones pull off physically impossible stuff, plus there's the simulacra ones who have their minds put into robot bodies straight up physically are superior to a human.

[@krisdphillips]

Yeah Bangalore won because A) There was 2v1, B) Both of the 2 were highly trained on a level close to a pilot, and C) The pilot got cocky. Agree 100% with Moy here. If he had listened to his training and been smart about his engagement, he'd have won.

[@BTandJackCooper]

Pilot superiority

[@witherwolf3316]

I think something more fair that would actually be an interesting scenario would be the Apex Legends vs Spectres. They might actually stand a chance that way.

[@lastword9047]

Legends lose because they can't even hold a gun properly

[@elvhadarei4521]

Pilots are like the mini-doomguy of the Titanfall, especially jack cooper

[@itsyaboi.1645]

The thing is pilots have wayyy more experience. Most abilities the legends have is something they have seen before. Wraith, octane, mirage. All those abilities they have experience with. They won't be going in blind at all for most legends. Now obviously ash is a different story though.

[@itsyaboi.1645]

I'm not saying pilots would absolutely steamroll the legends. Although its a higher chance that it would happen

[@fractality9676]

ash is a pilot and they have in fact seen them before

[@CheeseSoup]

@@itsyaboi.1645considering they canonically break bone with punches, they would

[@arcticghost1393]

How is this even a question. The chad pilot vs the virgin legend.

[@SCUBA_Draconis]

Dude there is no way a pilot worth their salt should lose to a legend. Their reflexes and augments alone would sway the fight.

[@CaptainDiqhedd]

Moy out here using the best Apex Music Pack in the game for the video, he knows what's up.

[@chris2656]

I think technically not all pilots could use all kits right? Because the human pilots couldn't use phase shift or something? Hence the wraith project. That said you can phase when you're inside a Ronin so idk maybe I'm misremembring

[@BigSlimDunham]

Bruhhh the pilot had 2 chances to rock bangalores word with a nasty right hook

I think it depends on who is fighting who. EDIT: After watching this, it clears some stuff up a bit. I don’t know a lot about Apex Legends lore, but I do recall hearing that Bangalore and her brother were basically pilots already. Don’t know if that is true though. So it makes sense IMO that together they would be able to take down a pilot. Now, I do think that Revenant and MAYBE Wraith would also be able to take down a pilot one on one. Revenant cause Revenant, and Wraith has phase shift, which none of the pilots have. She could gib them in the right situation. Though, I think it is more likely that a pilot would adapt and take her down.

[@declicitous1763]

Isn’t wraiths phase shift literally a pilot ability? And you can’t say that revenant wins because revenant

[@Tot_samei_Kiri11]

@@declicitous1763 Rev is LITERALLY killing machine that lives 300 years .

[@declicitous1763]

@@Tot_samei_Kiri11 yes, he was fighting security guards and other people, for 300 years Not extremely well trained soldiers who fight giant robots that can one shot them let alone every other threat in the titanfall universe

[@catsharkthe85th]

Dude, phase shift is used tons in Titanfall 2. Phase shift pilot ability, getting on the drop ship at the end of a game phase shifts you into it, phase rewind is a variation of phase shift, you can phase shift into your titan with a certain perk equipped and finally the titan Ronin can phase dash which is another version of phase shifting. Edit: also the pilot execution 'inner pieces' has you phase shift into the enemies body then come out of phase shift exploding them, if I've missed any more uses of phase shift in the Titanfall games please tell me to add to my point.

[@lucaheatough9857]

As a hardcore Apex fan, Pilots solo easily. I’d even go as far as a pilot can 1v3

[@_coffeyclan_5898]

Lets be real who cares who wins its just amazing that they still remember what this universe was born from and i think that shows respect from Apex and Honor to Titanfall

[@robert6243]

At first I thought legends would win, but you gave a bunch of valid points and changed my mind. Nice video!! Keep up the good work

[@connorloomis7326]

Pilots.

[@thc_freebaser]

The pilots are augmented humans with supernatural levels of strength and agility ON TOP of having a lot of the abilities the legends have AND more with boosts, and that's barring titans being involved. Every legend besides Ash and Revenant is a REGULAR human being that happens to be far better at combat than the average joe, who have presumably FAR less combat experience than the average pilot for the most part, competing in the intergalactic equivalent of a game show. It's not meant to even be comparable. One group is fighting a literal war while the other is providing entertainment.

[@arandomguy6551]

I'm going to be honest, suppose a pilot faces a legend, this would be the result: Pilot > Lifeline Pilot > Mad Maggie Pilot > Octane Pilot > Loba Pilot > Horizon Pilot > Caustic Pilot > Wattson Pilot > Gibraltar Pilot > Bloodhound Pilot > Rampart Pilot > Crypto Pilot > Fuse Pilot > Valkyrie Pilot > Seer Pilot > Mirage Pilot > Bangalore Pilot < Revenant Pilot < Ash Pilot < pathfinder Pilot < wraith ( not sure about this one) cases such as pathfinder or revenant are explained because they are robots and especially pathfinder has an infinite learning capacity as it is a 100% robot mind unlike revenant, however, the latter having an infinite number of bodies and a knowledge of 300 years could shoot down a pilot even after losing the first matchup

[@junaidhossain4203]

I get the reasoning behind pathfinder but I still think he'll lose cz even if he has infinite learning capacity it needs time to be integrated. (he lost in his cinematic). Also Wraith's probably gonna lose cz she isn't a fighter and more of a scientist but yeah her voice is really a big unknown factor here

[@arandomguy6551]

@@junaidhossain4203 you are right in everything

[@Lacertidae_is_top]

Valkyrie half pilot. Ash completely. I'm waiting for Cooper to be added to Apex. The fact that the reverant lived for more than 300 does not matter. Pilots are also being restored, for example, the tactic is a stimulator.

[@junaidhossain4203]

@@Lacertidae_is_top Valkyries isn't a pilot. she self taught herself how to fly a titan and is a mercenary.

[@Lacertidae_is_top]

Yes

[@theraidingwolf6657]

The only legends who could genuinely beat a pilot are Revenant because he can keep retrying, Pathfinder because he may have some form of hidden fighting code embedded in him that could allow him to win, and Ash because she is a pilot herself

[@onyourleft9273]

Finally the answer to the question we’ve all been asking also it’s been like 1 minutes as this video has been posted so i’m putting my bets on Pilots

[@IsfetSolaris]

It's pilots without question, primarily because the Legends would have no clue how the fuck to fight pilots. The Apex Legends are sportsmen. They're there to make a spectacle. Pilots are trained to kill efficiently. They're also equipped with insane abilities (in lore, pilots don't choose 1 of 8, they have all of the abilities available at once). And of course, involving Titans would make the fight into a joke. The Legends don't even possess weapons that can meaningfully damage a titan.

[@bdtwothree]

That's the best explanation I've heard. And I'm not surprised that commander scryer lost to bangalore because of his cockiness. Welp most of the IMC pilots are cocky and weak, that's why they hire apex predators to help them.

[@empiricalsmut9419]

Legends don't need to have real combat training of any kind as a pre-requisite, they just need to get past orientation matches to become a regular competitor. We also need to put aside game logic for a second -- gameplay mechanics don't necessarily reflect the in-universe canon rules. With that being said, I would also say that pilots would win a majority of the time if they were to go up against most Legends. Now, obviously, there are unique examples like Ash, who is both a pilot and a Legend. Ash is probably one of the most capable Legends out there, along with Revenant, a top assassin whose lived for countless years by now. In a realistic combat scenario, in a one-on-one fight, pilots just have more flexible training that is capable of applying to multiple scenarios, vs situational Legends like, say, Wattson, who, without catching someone off guard, or with prep, would get steamrolled -- the poor girl doesn't even carry her firearm correctly.

[@hadesofbadaim2982]

Pilots have more training and better gear so they would win most of the time but give the legends the battlefield advantage and they have a much better chance at winning. Bloodhound in a dense jungle would be very hard to beat since a pilot probably would be as used to fighting there as bloodhound is.

[@myfriendscallmejojo]

Pilots fight on all sorts of terrain that and pulse pilots exist

[@drakeyork241]

Pilots can snap necks bare handed with minimal resistance, and straight up punch stalkers and specters to death their own kicks are enough to instantly shatter spines of other pilots, so Bangalore holding back that knife was absolutely nonsense unless she has the same augments as a pilot. That is superhuman strength right there. Pilots can be riddled with bullets and even take rounds to the head and come out fine with a passive recovery in mere minutes. (Most legends can replicate this via shields and medkits which are pretty much excessively potent combat drugs and octain has the same passive regen but significantly worse which he only got due exclusively to how many drugs he has done which have most likely done a pretty big number to his brain functions.) Pilots can take the same drugs as octain and still keep a perfectly tactical mind and a steady hand without having those constant jitters and unrest that octain seems to have meaning they are most likely going to have an amped up resistance to toxins and various poisons. Pilots go through regular soldiers by the hundreds on their own and and the one that wins when it’s pilot vs pilot is the one with better tactics while legends struggle to kill each other which includes Bangalore who is on all levels except mental and tactical and equipment based, physically equivalent to a regular grunt. Cooper was just a pilot in training and ended up killing at least 1000 imc grunts while using unfamiliar guns he picked up off of the grunts he just killed all while being in an objectively unfamiliar circumstance. Pilots have the strength, endurance, and resilience to carry anti tank weapons on them as well as an LMG and a heavy revolver to top it all off while also carrying all of the other equipment they any other soldier would need. They are stronger than any legend bar none They are faster than any legend bar 1- octain. And even then, if both had the same stuff, pilot wins a randomized obstacle course due to sheer adaptability They have a far greater tactical mind than any of the legends bar MAYBE Bangalore. They are just smarter than any of the legends bar 4- wattson, caustic, Horizon, and crypto. (When the super soldier is smarter than all of the legends bar the scientists and the super hacker, that should say something) Pilots have uncontested general mobility over all of the legends bar none (pathfinder gets close, but he lacks the wall run and double jump.) Pilots have greater adaptability to just about any situation and weapon. Again note the existence of Cooper. And finally pilots have the trump card known as *T I T A N S* A giant war machine with enough thermal resilience to survive atmospheric re-entry from an orbital drop and survive their own terminal velocity crashing into cold hard earth as well as an on-board tactical A.I. that could make up for the lesser flat out intelligence than the scientists. Practically unhackable due to not being connected to any thing resembling an outside network that could be reached though radio or electrical signals. The only chance the legends have would be crypto’s emp followed by several thermite grenades which also might not even work because from what we have seen, missive bursts of electricity barely slow titans down from more than a few seconds and BT was still operational after losing an arm while carrying the ARC which might as well be crypto’s emp constantly going off in the his cockpit which probably has worse electrical shielding that the exterior hull by a long shot.

[@punkdoggo211]

Okay I completely agree, BUT… some legends might be able to beat a pilot in certain situations/environments in a 1v1… Yes, if you’re randomly selecting a legend to take on even a newbie pilot more often than not, said legend probably won’t make it out alive. However, if you’re pitting a, for example, holo pilot like the one Bangalore beat against, for example, Bloodhound, an expert hunter and tracker with literal wall-hacks in a forest or heavily-wooded environment against a pilot, I’m sure Bloodhound would come out on top. Or, at the very least, Bloodhound could deal a serious amount of damage to the pilot.

[@ratlosmappy]

But pilot can traverse the trees, most people forget pilots jumpkits allow them more than just a fall dampner, it is an essential part of the pilots kit that makes them a hyper deadly threat. have you ever tried shooting something thats moving, its not a easy task. now try shooting at that something bouncing across trees of buildings and can adjust their height to their liking changing their movement to whatever they need, that would take a incredible marksmans to hit, and to make matters worse, those pilots can shoot you with alarming accuracy during those movements. Now some legends may be able to beat a pilot, BUT the chances are slim.

[@Satoru_Gojo3985]

Titanfall pilots quite literally speed blitz, have you seen pro-level movment clips from TF2? Oh my dear God.

[@WolfeTitanfall]

It's pilots,bangalore is a literal grunt and the training has a 98% death chance,no competition at all,her taking out a pilot shows how much respawn knows and cares about titanfall

[@karlilves9303]

She is not a grunt, she was training with her brother to become a pilot in the lore

[@ajh3461]

*dropout chance. Although, I wouldn't be surprised if fatality was high too considering the average pilot has the coordination of an IGN reviewer.

[@WolfeTitanfall]

@@karlilves9303 training doesn't mean she's a pilot

[@karlilves9303]

@@WolfeTitanfall I'm just saying she was on pilot training so she has a good idea of what a pilot can do, and when she and her brother were fighting the pilot, ther was two of them and her brother was a pilot at the time

[@TheRainWorldCreature]

The only legend would be the MRVN because no good pilot would kill a MRVN

[@D4RTHR04CH]

lore wise in a way of gun fights with any abilities or something like that bangalore or new castle are probably gonna be the legend who dominate since they have more knowledge about weapons and ways of combat

[@Coolguywithshades]

Only reason Bangalore and that other dude won is because that pilot was cocky and arrogant but against any other well level-headed pilot the pilot would wipe the floor with them