Top 10 Civilization Games

[@Salixalba1000]

Love the list, we got nations on your recommendation and we love it. In my top 10 as well.

[@Bartolomeus002]

I don't like 7 wonders because all you have to do is remember all the cards and builds by heart and just draw whatever is best for you.

[@TheMr02drop]

I just played 7 Wonders Duel tonight for the first time. I won 65-64 in what seems like an incredibly balanced game. I personally enjoyed it more than the original 7 wonders. I was wondering if you played it, how you think it holds up to the original, and if it would jump into your top 10 civ games.

[@JJ_TheGreat]

Richard has done a video runthrough regarding 7 Wonders Duel. The game has too much direct player vs. player conflict - in which each player is trying to destroy what the other has built. It was heartbreaking for Richard.

[@Arjay82]

@@JJ_TheGreat I don't like direct conflict games, but love 7 Wonders Duel. It feels more like you're thwarting your opponent by taking a resource they'd possibly want rather than actively attacking/destroying them. There are a few cards that let you force your opponent to lose a resource or money, but nothing too cut throat.

[@dg7815]

Couldn't help but notice Agora in the background. How is it? I'm tempted to grab a copy but it hasn't gotten a lot of attention and I haven't see any positive reviews out there.

[@rahdo]

+Cody Gaines haven't tried it yet. i bought it because it was 10 euros, but i worry there's a reason for that

[@imthewhiterabbit]

I have a serious question... what is that Imperial Settlers doing on your shelf? I thought you said AD NAUSEUM that it was TOO MUCH CONFLICT for you guys... I would not mind at all if you changed your take on it and if you'd give it a spin... but I found it a little weird :P. Also, this could have maybe made it to your criv game? :P

[@rahdo]

+imthewhiterabbit won it in a contest, haven't tried it yet :)

[@ngfom]

Hi, great list of games. I love civ-games myself. Thats why I'm a little disappointed, that "Through the Ages" didn't make it to your list. Why not?

[@rahdo]

+Volker Scheipers nations killed it for us. i talk about that at lenght in the nations final thoughts vid i filmed :)

[@TheMacius99]

I like watching your lists, Radho, because your taste is so much different than mine i'm discovering games I've never heard before all the time. My favourite is "Forbidden Stars", and there is not even a close second, but I understand why it's not for you, since conflict is pretty much 90% of the game ;-) Have you tried "Clash of Cultures"? It's the most euro - style civ game I currently own, and it works well for 2 players at that. ps. I think "Myrmes" is a completely valid choice here.

[@YoannLevet]

Oh! Thanks for Myrmes! ;)

[@hkunikat]

Love your inclusion of Myrmes- very lateral, very clever!

[@jyoung10]

Thought it would be fun to follow your own rankings on BGG as the video progresses, trying to anticipate what you'd pick. But your #9 is ranked higher than #8, #7, and #6 on BGG. Maybe it's been a while since you've updated your list? Btw, any thoughts on the supposedly more streamlined edition of TtA? Not sure how Military has been altered, but heard it had been changed a bit.

[@rahdo]

+J Young i haven't really looked at the new TtA at all...

[@jyoung10]

+rahdo yeah, suppose if the original was a miss, the new edition wouldn't necessarily be that interesting; and I know you don't have a lot of time these days to look at things you know might not appeal...was just wondering. Even if it's something you guys don't like, your insight is valuable. :)

[@kossowankenobi]

Clash of Cultures? Has the Xterminate but I imagine particularly 2p you can find enough fun with 3Xs, no? (see: Scythe for a 3.5x)

[@irekwinnicki2985]

Hey, do you have plans for a new runtrough for Civilization Through the Ages 3 edition?

[@rahdo]

+Irek Winnicki nope, not really. not enough changed from the previous version to my mind

[@Watanga10]

Nations! It took me forever to understand it but I love it

[@Lordjunon]

I like nations dice and roll through the ages, but I think they are totally different styles of civ games. Both are fun though!

[@chadjacobson2679]

I love Nations myself. Also the inclusion of Myrmes was great and outside the box. I don't think you will enjoy Imperial Settlers at all, but I'd enjoy your thoughts. The drafting and card combos are so addictive. Must say (and I have watched both run throughs) that it floors me that you like two player Seven Wonders and not two player Five Tribes - though if Jen tends towards APthat limits the fun of that game.

[@EclecticCamel]

I think he'd like Imperial Settlers just fine. The raze tokens can be used on your own cards, and I find using them confrontationally usually comes at the cost of something better. There are a few faction cards that are definitely not in his taste (Engineers comes to mind), but those can be swapped out for something else from the expansion. I think them adding the deck building aspect saved this one as a Rahdo potential.

[@errolwilde1656]

am. I the only person wondering just how much you sold antiquity for?

[@rahdo]

+Errol Wilde IIRC it was around 200 euros :)

[@josephsapiano6170]

I would like to introduce my kids to a civ game, again not too harsh on wars. Right now I´m completely undecided and I would love your opinion. 7 wonders vs 7 wonders duel?? 7 wonders (any kind) vs Nations?? I played Nations and I loved it, but maybe it´s too hard on the kids...could 7 wonders be a kind of introduction? Or any other game similar i´m missing out?

[@rahdo]

nations the dice game, or roll through the ages are probably better introductions. maybe check www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgamecategory/1015/civilization for a list of ideas :)

[@landmarkforum3652]

I'm surprised Roll for the Galaxy didn't make it, given how much you love it - did you not want to put both Race and Roll on the same list?

[@rahdo]

+Tony Faber didn't feel enough like we're building a civilization, unlike race

[@EclecticCamel]

For some reason, I thought you didn't like Nations, but thinking about it, seems like a perfect fit given how downplayed combat is in that game. I think it gets a really bad rap in general; it replaced TTA for me due to the scaled back scale (read: time required to play) and the milder combat makes it more accessible.

[@GatsbyCioffi]

Its weird that no mainstream board game reviewer(dice tower included) ever mentions Sid Meier's Civilization the Board Game, despite being in the top 100 on Boardgamegeek. Is there a reason for that?

[@rahdo]

+Andrew .Fralinger i dunno... never played it, because we're combat averse :)

[@mattigus]

Interesting that both Race for the Galaxy and the Nations dice game made it, but Roll for the Galaxy didn't. I thought Rahdo was crazy about that game.

[@rahdo]

+mattigus i am, but roll does't feel as much like building an empire. it's a bit more abstracted

[@prufrock1977]

Yeah! 7 Wonders is my absolute favorite game!

[@A.L.E.X.42]

I spy Imperial Settlers back on the menu in the background

[@rahdo]

+Alex M won it in a contest :)

[@nanorider426]

You're crazy! ......nah. ;) Rahdo, have you ever tried the old Adv.Civilization from Avalon Hill?

[@rosco834]

Why did you keep The Golden Ages out of the list? I think it's a good stream line civ game!

[@rahdo]

+Mirko Bonelli (Rosco83) great game, but didn't like the combat

[@pokerdealerohio]

You have Race for the Galaxy, Nations the dice game and Roll Through the Ages... I think Roll for the Galaxy is better than both of the other roll games and possibly even better than Race for most people. Very surprised that RollFTG didn't make the list over at least one of the other Roll games (Which I think Race is better than probably both of them).

[@rahdo]

+pokerdealerohio i'll talk about this in my next podcast when i revisit the topic :)

[@marcvenot5141]

Maybe you can add a spreadsheet to resume it?

[@frenzykitty]

Great list

[@goyasolidar]

An ant colony constitutes a society, not a civilization. That said, you've made me curious about Myrmes.

[@robbar77]

Nations is the best. Number one on my list.

[@avalexandrescu]

IMHO, Sid Meier's Civilization: The Board Game (with the two expansions) is the best civ game

[@whostolecookiesfromthejar]

7W as a 2player is very disappointing experience tbh, 7W:Duel is a whole different story tho

[@przemysawwuka6641]

Try to make a card piramid as in duels in core 7W, worked for me for 2 players, and to be honest it is more fun than card selection from the original mechanic

[@JJ_TheGreat]

7 Wonders Duel also had a lot more direct player interactivity / conflict - destroying things your opponent has built. Therefore, it is not a game for Richard.

[@TheFlymar]

This is my main complain for the computer civ games also. I like creating end expanding but unfortunately when wars start It's downhill experience for me.

[@RafNen]

Imperial Settlers on the shelf? :] Didn't you say somewhere that you wont gonna try it and even Ignacy said that it's not for you and Jen?

[@Barabba210]

+RafNen noticed that too :) I would like to hear what he thinks about that game!

[@rahdo]

+Barabba210 won it in a contest, haven't played it yet

[@ConsummateGamer]

+rahdo You should really give it a try... I think you would be surprised at how much you both like it (PLUS it has a nice Solo Variant right in the box).

[@EclecticCamel]

+rahdo I actually think you'd really enjoy Imperial Settlers. There are a very, very few cards you guys might find problematic (which could easily be replaced with expansion content), but direct combat is not really necessary (and in most cases prohibitive).

[@MatthewMSanchez]

So there were 4 surprises for me in your list. 1. Nations was not #1 2. TTA:New didn't make the list at all. 3. RftG beat out RollftG 4. 7 Wonders Duel didn't make the list I figure TTA:New and 7 Wonders: Duel didn't make it cause they are too new. I'll have to check out Myrmes

[@rahdo]

+Matthew Sanchez yup, 7w duel & peloponnes card game i haven't played yet, but i imagine they're contenders.

[@EclecticCamel]

+Matthew Sanchez Yeah, I expected Roll FTG not Race.

[@FinnCanDo85]

I have a sneaky suspicion rahdo might not like 7W duel, despite 7 wonders being #1 here. Duel is very confrontational and mean, but we'll see what his final thoughts are :) I'm waiting to see if I am wrong.

[@JJ_TheGreat]

@@FinnCanDo85 And yes, turns out Richard does not like 7 Wonders Duel due to the player vs player conflict.

[@5ergion]

Hi! What about Archipelago?

[@rahdo]

+5ergion neat game, but too much aggressive negoation and too much randomness for us

[@marcoschaub8978]

Too bad you haven't played Imperial Settlers yet. I think it might have made your top 10. There is some conflict, but it's really minor and more of a nuisance than a tragedy. Have you played the new Roll Through the Ages: Iron Age?

[@rahdo]

+Marco Schaub nope, havne't played it yet.

[@marcoschaub8978]

***** The new one doesn't replace the old one, but it's a bit more complex. I think you'd like it. Give it a shot. :-)

[@viggoelcarpato4827]

Through the Ages ???

[@rahdo]

+Viggo El Cárpato too long, too war-ey :)

[@msolec2000]

+rahdo I agree with the too long complaint, but I don't think it's too war-ey. You get some culture (points) or maybe a few resources from your opponent. But it's just another way to get those. Also, you have to give them a turn in advance to prepare, and by declaring a war you lose the chance of doing some other useful things like playing an event that benefits you later on. :)

[@GeraldSunkin]

It's an amazing 2 player game. And not that war-ey, just stay close to the other person in military.

[@LOTRFootball]

+Viggo El Cárpato I agree with rahdo on this one. I played the game extensively on BGA but got frustrated by the imbalance of some leaders and armies.

[@yolatengo7779]

+LOTRFootball they just redid the game for balance. Plus it's a drafting game. Judging the value of plays is part of the strategy anyway.

[@IpsilonVr]

Better Race for the Galaxy or Roll for the Galaxy?

[@rahdo]

+Yves St-Denis race prob the better game, but we like roll more

[@IpsilonVr]

+rahdo I have Roll, and really like it. I thought Race would be nice, but I am more into dice than I am into cards... I guess I'll stick to Roll.

[@tonkicapalonkica1106]

I'm aware of your opinion on TtA from the review you did some time ago and I'm aware that this is purely subjective list... but still, not including TtA in top 10 civ builders just seems odd. Apart from being a reviewer with very specific taste, you are also one of the most influential reviewers in the hobby, probably second only to Dice Tower (e. g. when I got into the hobby you were the second reviewer I started following regularly). From that perspective, I think that this list could be unfortunately misleading for someone relatively new in gaming looking for games in this niche. Even if you are not playing TtA anymore... It gets me thinking about the problem of today's reviewing - it's all just fun and personal motivation of course, but since prominent reviewers can now directly or indirectly influence the market maybe there should be some responsibility included, like say in movie critics.

[@rahdo]

+Tonkica Palonkica yup, i do agree that i have way too much influence, which is why i always tell people to ignore my subjective opinions and focus on my runthroughs themselves. and i have done a runthrough for TtA. But there's no way it would make sense for it to be on this list because we dont' like heavy conflict, so as i said in the video, that disqualified like 90% of all civ builders on the market :)

[@EclecticCamel]

I don't think he has any kind of moral obligation to include games he doesn't want to on his top ten lists.

[@tonkicapalonkica1106]

+rahdo Yeah ok, I know. Nobody could accuse you of not being transparent in how you do your lists and runthroughs. And I know that you know (cause you mentioned that in the runthrough) that conflict can be completely and elegantly removed from TtA (old edition as well as new), so I assumed you are going to blame it on longevity, not on conflict... I'm disappointed, that's all. Especially since the new edition is not getting enough buzz in my opinion. And of course Nations wouldn't exist without TtA, 7 Wonders is a wonderful game, which has very little to do with civ building (as the genre is formed by the computer game) and so forth... As you say for your final thoughts (don't listen to them), yet you still make them, so I guess it's the same with this comments (on yours reviews or others, all the same) - they are always welcome, yet never really mean anything. Keep up the good work, even if sometimes it isn't my cup of tea. Cheers.

[@tonkicapalonkica1106]

+TheGreatHamEl Maybe it's not exactly moral obligation, although it is also not a professional one (since he doesn't do this for living if I understand correctly) but I was thinking more in that direction. And although Rahdo is certainly not the first one to blame for a lack of this sort of responsibility, this sort of ignorance you are demonstrating and (perhaps) opinion that reviewers can do whatever they want (if you don't like them, don't watch them and so forth) could and maybe will soon lead to "casualization" of the market on one hand, and on the other blockbusterization. As in cinemas today, there will be only boardgame equivalents of superheroes and romantic comedies. And we are going to have so much fun!!! :-DDD Everything is awesome. I'm dramatizing of course, but in the core that's the mainstream process sticking out his ugly head every time someone as influential as Tom Vasel trashes some bit more complex game and praises f...ing Duel of Ages or some 5 minute card game dice rolling miniature s..t with Captain America who smashes trolls...F that. I give credit to Rahdo for not running away from complex euros for example, for always looking ahead on what indie market has to offer - I found out about some lovely complex games (and I'm not judging the games by their complexiti, but by their historical flavor, by which I mean ways it abstracts historical processes) thanks to him. And he is always very straight when he says "this is a great game, it's just not for me". I'm only regretting that he gave up TtA.

[@EclecticCamel]

Tonkica Palonkica This is precisely why there aren't more people doing reviews; they'd have to deal with self important people who think it is okay to tell them what they should or should not include or like on something that *sane* people recognize as purely subjective. I like a lot of games that Mister Hamm would never put on a list at any point, but it would be extremely arrogant for me to say that he should forget his frame of reference and substitute it for my own. And ridiculous in general really to let it bother me in the first place. Just take a breath and relax, go make a list of your own if it really bothers you that much.

[@BloodRider1914]

You look like Jon Stewart

[@rahdo]

meshuganah! punum, you give me the shpilkes!

[@biaxialtester1985]

Obviously, Rahdo doesn't like long game.

[@TorIverWilhelmsen]

Historia at #11? :)

[@rahdo]

+Tor Iver Wilhelmsen could be... i had a hard time making 10 though, so i didn't think beyond that :)

[@GeraldSunkin]

No Through the Ages?

[@rahdo]

+Gerald Sunkin nope, too long, to conflict-ey

[@deanrogers8845]

You're definitely crazy, but it's my kind of crazy.

[@donovanholopainen3554]

Heads up everyone, none of these are computer games, based on what he said at the beginning you'd think there would be actual like, video games lime he described but nope

[@mtgrocks04]

You know warfare is part of history and civilization right?

[@rahdo]

+mtgrocks04 sure, doesn't mean i enjoy destroying things that other people build. why should i like that?

[@GamingKnights]

+rahdo I'm pretty sure he never mentioned that you had to like it and im pretty sure you said why do designers add warfare to civ games !? because it's a part of the history genre that we know !! imo

[@rahdo]

+Gaming Knights i don't think i said that in the vid... it doesn't bother me at all that civ games normally include warfare, i only mentioned that this is why most don't work for us :)

[@kosterix123]

7 wonders, winning it feels just meh

[@PierreCarette]

Roll for the galaxy?

[@rahdo]

+Pierre Carette didn't feel enough like we're building a civilization, unlike race

[@barry1902]

I own about 60+ games. Civ games are my favourite. 7 wonders is my least favourite game by far. I haven't played it in years. It's too simple, too luck dependant, has no 2 player mode and drafting games are the most basic and dull type of game going. I'd rather play Sushi go if I'm going to be playing a quick draft game. Was this list made after Civilization Through the ages: A new story came out? Because Rahdo said on his Nations video he loved the old version even though he sold it. And the new one is rated number 9 of all games of all time. Despite having watched and enjoyed a lot of Rahdo's videos, I am a bit dissappointed in this list to say the least. When compared to the general concensus on BGG many of these games are a long way down the list. I was hoping on some input on Civilization, Sid meiers Civ, Civ new dawn, AoE, and any of the others higher up on the list of best civ games. But I guess everyone has thier own idea of what's fun, and everyone is different.

[@rahdo]

well, i talked about why through the ages and others you mentioned didn't make this list in the first couple minutes of the video, and yes, this video was made before the latest TTA from a few years ago :) also, 7 wonders is by far at its best when played with the official 2p variant, and it gets rid of a LOT of the luck factor and makes the game much more strategic.

[@pedro_navarro]

top 10 civ board games for someone who doesn't like civ games? ... ... ... ...good bye sir

[@ignitedxblaze]

No golden ages :(

[@rahdo]

+ignitedxblaze great game, but didn't like the combat

[@drygordspellweaver8761]

These are board games.

[@rahdo]

yes, it's a board game channel

[@simonmaynard9680]

What?!? Seven wonders sucks as a two player game!

[@rahdo]

i think you forgot to add "in my opinion" at the end there