Top 10 Science Fiction Games

[@EddieInzauto]

Sam is clearly the only one who knows the breadth of what science fiction is.

[@salmonblox]

I think the real question here (and this goes ditto for the Fantasy Games video, which had the same problem) isn't "Can this game be classified as science fiction?", but should have been "How well does this game evoke the feelings and themes of science fiction?" The Resistance takes place in a future dystopia, so yes, it has a scifi setting. But nothing about the gameplay makes you FEEL or THINK, "oh yeah, science fiction". It's solely about deception and group dynamics. Not really the best example of a scifi game. Cosmic Encounter or TI3, however, are about strange alien powers affecting your decisions, or choosing the path to take as you conquer entire planets and systems. THOSE are scifi themes. Those games are great examples of science fiction games.

[@DruLeeParsec]

Tom! The definition of Sci-Fi is not "It's set in the future." Steam punk, for example, would be sci-fi set in the past. Ray Bradbury has written stories which most people consider sci-fi even though Bradbury himself called it "Midwest Surrealism."

[@slinks90]

I'm not sure Tom and Zee know what "science fiction" means.

[@KabukiKid]

100% agreement.

[@chanm01]

Sam's got the right idea when it comes to which themes should be considered science fiction, but I've gotta hand it to Zee. He was killing it during this entire segment. "No, that's Fire Fiction." Come on, I died.

[@martinrasmussen114]

"Pandemic can happen today" -Tom Vasel, 2014.

[@winteravarice]

So I heard a lot of saying "It's not sci-fi, it's horror." So I would just like to ask... Is Alien sci-fi or is it horror? Can it not be both?

[@jward1465]

Sam is spot on by saying that H.P. Lovecraft wrote science fiction. Most of his "monsters' were aliens most notably Cthulhu himself. He was not actually a "god" he was an alien entity. Lovecraft referred to his works as "weird fiction" because when he was writing the terms "horror" and "Sci-Fi" had yet to be coined.

[@LORDJAVI131]

I'm with you on that dude.

[@ikesteroma]

I'm with Sam on all accounts. He'll get no hatin' from me.

[@VinegarAndSaltedFries]

Sam is completely correct. Science Fiction is a very broad term in reality. Perhaps if you guys wanted just space you shoulda just made that list.

[@Mandrake42]

Uhhh, I kind of agree with Tom and Zee that Eldritch Horror is....well, horror rather than sci fi. It's all about ancient gods, not science. King of Tokyo on the other hand is definitely sci fi. Cyberbunny? Mechadragon? They are both robots. The King has cybernetic implants....the others not so much but half the monsters being created by mad science firmly puts in in sci-fi.

[@ToBeVerified]

I agree on Eldritch Horror not being a sci fi game, but what I find the weirdest is their seeming insistence on defining all games with a single genre. Eldritch Horror is a fantasy horror game. King of Tokyo a science fiction fantasy game. As for Pandemic, it can be seen as a sci fi game, but it's not really. There's no real alternative or super advanced technological or scientific advancements in the game, as far as I know, and there's no explanation behind the sicknesses that could tie them to the genre. It is true that it is about science and it is fiction, but it isn't really "science fiction" unless the science and technological advancements itself is fictional. Pandemic doesn't really have any fictional science or technology.

[@fifimsp]

I agree. Pandemic is totally science fiction. In fact, I'm gonna argue that Star Wars is not. I know I'm going to get shit for this but Star Wars is fantasy that takes place in space. It's about good vs. evil and involves magic. To me science fiction presents scenarios using science. "What if four plagues took over the earth?" Could we save it in time? Who would we need? Ect. I'm with Sam on this one.

[@Tibbroar]

Have to agree with this. The easiest way to think of it is as a hierarchy with Fiction at the top and just below that would be sci-fi. That leaves a whooooooooole lotta room underneath it for subgenres.

[@angewomon143]

Sam was on point, as for eldritch horror the books the game is based off of are in the science fiction genre which explains why he chose it. Also don't mind it being on there because everybody else basically chose space, Sam at least spiced it up a bit making the video entertaining

[@dabearz27]

I'd let most of Sam's choices slide. They are scifi, if not always the scifi we think of. Except for Pandemic. Two reasons why I don't think it's scifi: 1) it's way too abstract and nothing feels futuristic about it. 2) the black death happened centuries ago, and you could consider that to be similar to what happens in Pandemic. Also, if no one noticed, Tom put star trek attack wing instead of fleet captains on the screen after that round of games.

[@VorpalGreatSword]

I got to play Star Realms recently. It's a nice, easy deck builder with a space theme. You collect ships, build space stations, and you can attack you opponents which is kind of rare with deck builders.

[@wetwillyccma]

I just ordered Star Realms on Amazon today. They only had a few of them. I can hardly wait to play it. Great art work. Looks like it will be late Feb until it's at stores.

[@AndrewKimbrell]

31:05 Tom said Fleet Captains, not Attack Wing!

[@non-alphagamer3618]

I really thought Tom's #1 would have been Agricola 3000

[@HarryBuddhaPalm]

Fantasy: Impossible Science Fiction: Possible

[@lecitadin69]

Also : Fantasy : wood and rocks, supernatural powers. Scifi : bolts and metal, technological powers.

[@ejrasmussen]

That's not true, there is hard science fiction and soft science fiction. Hard science fiction expands on current technology showing future technology like in 2001: A space Odyssey. Soft Science fiction is where technology exists but there is no reason as to why or how it was made like in Star Wars.

[@kustomkure]

I like a lot of games and I have played almost all of the games on their lists but it is still a mistery to me why oh why they don't like Eclipse. It is a very very solid game with a lot of very nice ideas, it's immersive and captivating, it has everything you need from a space exploration/economics game.

[@mrbrdo]

Turns out Pandemic wasn't Sci-Fi after all.... #2020

[@jamesmaxwell4447]

Eldritch is based on arkham which has plenty of sci fi stuff like creating machines to close gates and so on and aliens.

[@yogeshchugh1915]

22:30 - Tom: "Pandemic can happen today". Truer words have not been spoken

[@greglott4977]

Sci-fi as define by Webster: fiction based on imagined future scientific or technological advances and major social or environmental changes, frequently portraying space or time travel and life on other planets. Pandemic is not futuristic. All the movies you mentioned in IMDB have a futuristic element (accept Contagion, even IMDB can make mistakes). Godzilla, not sic-fi. It's something that is set in the present. Same with Cthulu, that ones right out. Cthulu isn't about future, it isn't about technology, it's about hopelessness in the face of insurmountable helplessness. I don't care what HPL said, the dude was deranged in more ways than one.

[@purplexenno]

***** not only that but the way dictionaries are literally changing world (see what i did there) i wouldn't necessarily trust websters. Sci-fi covers more than just rockets and tech. Godzilla as with all kaiju is a result of nuclear testing. Which is sci-fi. well at least to me.

[@DastardlyMatt]

Star Wars was set in the past. Not necessary to the science fiction story, the future is.

[@shoeshineboy]

Defending Sam, his picks were sci fi. You guys are confusing futuristic sci fi, a subgenre, to be science fiction proper.

[@FoxgazeGrimoire]

You guys really hate on Eclipse. I like it so much more than TI3 and Exodus was forgettable to me. To each their own, I guess.

[@ianotoolevideo]

For the most part, Lovecraft's Old Ones come from space, they "filtered down from the stars". The mi-go are space bugs that disembody people's brains and send them throughout space in canisters. Lovecraft DEFINITELY falls under sci-fi, as much as it does under horror.

[@brandonkempf298]

Going to have to put a "freaky stuff happening" sign up in our Sci Fi section at the library.

[@Amplecan]

Just a thought. If you reference an old review or video it would be really nice if you had a quick link in the description. I know its a bit more work for you but it would be really helpful for the viewer. Great series! Really enjoying them

[@kl1n9yklingy51]

Good idea actually.

[@davidbartlett3348]

Tom got it spot on with FFG showing off Imperial Assault!

[@jasonupton2765]

Saying pandemic is sci-fi is like saying: west Nile virus, H1N1, swine flu, polio are events that never happened. If the virus precursor theme lead to the movies Sam mentioned, that is when pandemic would move into the Sci-fi classification.

[@nathannemeth4094]

You got it right on Tom! They made Imperial Assault!

[@berryjordaan7665]

King of Tokyo is so Sci-fi. Isn't Godzilla on most Sci-fi channels?

[@HeadCannonPrime]

Pandemic, no way its sci-fi. There is not even a single sci-fi element in the game unless you consider bird flu science fiction?

[@zachhookom3813]

Tom predicted Imperial Assault!

[@jonasakerblom2675]

Now you have your good time travel game in T.I.M.E Stories :)

[@EyalItsik]

+Jonas Åkerblom (Bracca) Yes! Actually came back to this video to say that too :P

[@adam19742007]

Sam drops the mike. THAT WAS EPIC!

[@JazzMan5000]

Well we all know what Tom's number 1 will be. And what Sam's number 1 will be, to begin with.

[@ericweaver2691]

I agree, I love the length and banter of these lists

[@Michael69blue]

eldritch HORROR-science fiction-not horror game..you pay these people?{kickstarter}

[@PaulDarcy]

OMG! - you used an image from my playthrough of Level 7 [Omega Protocol] - I'm actually quite excited about that - and I love the top tens you guys do. Always good to see you three getting along . . . ;) Keep up the good work with these top tens - so what's next? - top ten cheese games? :)

[@Venters]

I was surprised that there was no Space Cadets or Firefly....

[@marcbowling6451]

Tom predicts Imperial Assault @ 28 minutes

[@Skarmyy]

Wow Sam, I was feeling for you this entire episode. These guys pretty much only accept either 'robots' or 'space' as scifi. I can't imagine how aggravating it must have been to listen while they to mocked all of your correctly classified games the entire time. It's literally Fiction based on Science. Is pandemic based on a true story? No? Fiction. Is it based on science? There you go. Also funny how apparently Eldritch Horror was classified as ONLY horror, as if things can't have two genres, but then Omega Protocol was scifi automatically when it is "just Aliens the board game" which, I'm pretty sure was also a horror movie, unless i missed some obvious romcom subplot

[@geektome4781]

As the whole Cthulhu mythos is really about ancient aliens who come to Earth, I agree that Lovecraft was writing both horror and sci-fi.

[@koalabrownie]

Is House of Cards or West Wing science fiction? Political science is a social science, therefore stories which deal with politics, anthropology, societal shifts etcetera are also under your logic "Science Fiction" Definitions exist for a reason. They exist to classify the material and help inform the reader as to its subject. The broader you stretch the definition, the less useful and thus less relevant it becomes. By this understanding many of Sam's choices are simply wrong. This isn't a knock against Sam, as many of these lists are full of choices which stretch the definition of the list. A list about euro-games includes games which the other don't classify as euro for example. Or Sam picked one game as "best multiplayer game played with 2 people" which was 2-player in the base game to begin with, he just didn't like an expansion which added a third player. Point is that he can include this on his list, but a lot of people will not find it a useful addition.

[@eystberg]

@@koalabrownie Science fiction can arguably fit under the umbrella term 'speculative fiction' (which most often is pessimistic), where I believe Pandemic would fall under. Take '1984', for instance; that is not based on any science, but socio-politics. Today we say that '1984' is sci-fi at its best, but back when it was written it was speculative fiction (although the term has gone out of fashion).

[@GameToppers]

Sam's top 30 is awesome! He's right. Only two problems. Why doesn't merchant of Venus chime in? 2 nd with all this science fiction talk some kind of mutated virus permeated SAMs frontal lobe while compiling the list and even though he recovered it left a trace residual that made him even argue that pandemic fit this group. Just saying...My dream is to come and play Twighlight Imperium 3 with Sam and my son.

[@SamHealey6]

www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/1105878/sorry-guys-but-science-fiction-cant-be-defined-as Click the link and scroll down a bit for a more in-depth explanation of why I chose some of my games for this list.

[@oddeVideos]

I think you're 100% right on Pandemic. I think Tom's idea of SF having to deal necessarily with future and/or spaceships is restrictive. I guess a distinction should be made on what is 'setting' and what is 'genre'. The movie 'Hot tub time machine' deals with time travel, but is it SF? Definitely not, it's comedy. Pandemic might not have what we consider a SF setting (no spaceships, set in the present), but as you demonstrated it's certainly SF in theme.

[@billytong3822]

Thumbs up to you big man!

[@platinump90]

I completely agree with you Sam. Pandemic is science-fiction. Fiction based on science. It's as simple as that. There isn't even a doubt about it imo.

[@javierper3z]

I disagree on Pandemic, I think it lacks the commentary on science that a sci fi work should have (virus and bacteria are natural events)... that said, I love the argument!. I WOULD ABSOLUTLY READ A WEEKLY BLOG ABOUT THESE KIND OF DISCUSSION

[@cyseren524]

I think when Tom said "prepare for the heat..." should give you the hint to skip Pandemic. Pandemic is simply a simulation game of maybe exaggeration real life medical situation. Overall you did great, I love your choices of the lists and other lists. You guys are funny. I love watching you guys as hosts.

[@ToBeVerified]

"We are experiencing philosophical difficulties. Please stand by." LOL! Amazing. You won me. What do you command?

[@AgentKuo]

Science Fiction: Freaky stuff happening.

[@imjacobyournot]

will you be updating this list?

[@Exegence]

Time Travel? Legacy: Gears of Time. Fantastic time travel game.

[@scootergsp]

I like Eclipse...

[@bradymccann]

King of Tokyo, definitely. Pandemic, not a chance haha it's at most a medical game, no way sci-fi. but no doubt a good game :p

[@Wlerin2]

Medical fiction is still science fiction.

[@sjholden]

You don't consider medicine a part of science?

[@georkarpkd]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalyptic_fiction

[@philheaton1619]

The question to ask when considering Pandemic or other modern day stories is how would you categorize Michael Crichton's books.

[@gronith]

Cthulhu and the elder gods are from space no? Mi-Go's? Also Giant Monsters are a staple of the Sci-fi genre aren't they? Post apocalyptic themes are scifi as well. With a little imagination pandemic could be but it is suspect. Entertaining as always though.

[@bradcarey3078]

Sam seems to have a better idea about what qualifies as sci-fi

[@apanapane]

Thanks for yet another interesting video. I'd be interested to hear if any one of you considered Dune when making your list.

[@trevorseim6950]

Id bet my water they have

[@silentdante]

I also found it hilarious that Tom says multiple times which star trek game he likes(fleet captains), but then puts the wrong name in the number recap of all the games at that number (attack wing), hahaha

[@robj765]

Avid sci-fi and fantasy reader since 30 y. Also a scientist, working in the field of microbiology. Pandemic? That is current and historical. Science yes, fiction no. Eldritch and KoT are horror in my mind. Sorry Sam. Provocative maybe, but also lax. While SF and Fantasy tend to be clumped together in literature (very distinct genres I think, although there are always cross-over examples), horror usually constitutes a clearly separate niche. Though, Area 51 zombies, I guess. Disclaimer, these are my personal opinions and in no way represent any organization I may be associated with.

[@gheilers]

I think "Pandemic" qualifies, because its setting, being that of *many* severe world-wide outbreaks, simultaneously...is at this point, still (fortunately) a work of fiction. It *could* happen, as you correctly state, which properly earns it the "science" label.

[@MrJenssen]

Sam has a ton of really strange choices that I personally wouldn't consider sci-fi. King of Tokyo has some sci-fi characters, but so does Smash Up. But Smash Up isn't a sci-fi game. Not exclusively. No, both these games can better be described as "monster mash" games. Because that's what the Japanese "Godzilla vs" movies are usually described as. And Pandemic? Give me a break. That IMDB argument is hollow. Most of the movies there have ten different genres written on them, based on minor elements within them. Pandemic is a modern "what if-scenario" type game, where you're in our universe, with NO sci-fi technology or anything, and you're combatting viral infections. There is no space, there is no out-there science or technology, no fancy gadgets, nothing like that. It's just a fictional universe based directly on our own.

[@MarekBorecki]

Hard to consider Lovecraft and Pandemic as stricte sci-fi. Is zombie theme (Zombicide style, no Resident Evil) sci-fi also? In my "top 10 sci-fi games I played" would be Starcraft:BoardGame.

[@kilometre42]

I would say the literary, film, and television genre of 'Science Fiction' is fairly broad, but generally revolves around future technology, robots/ai/androids, extraterrestrial or extradimensional travel, aliens, etc. It's not just 'fiction' with a 'science element'. I'd say Pandemic falls into the 'techno/thriller' genre. Think Michael Crichton, Tom Clancy, etc. Lots of plague/pandemic/virus novels out there set in modern times, and these wouldn't be put in the 'sci-fi/fantasy' section, rather almost always in the 'general fiction' section.

[@jacqland]

You can have two definition of sci-fi. I think Sam's is the broadest definition (in which even alternate-history stuff like would be considered Sci-fi), while Tom's is the narrowest (however, in the narrowest definition I wouldn't consider Cyperpunk sci-fi, because it's its own genre - look at something like the Cryptonomicon by Stephonson, which is totally cyperpunk but not very sci-fi at all.)

[@winterplum]

SPOILER ALERT!! SPOILER ALERT!! Correction: Tom's #4 is listed as the wrong game. It is NOT Star Trek Attack Wing.

[@amadcow2]

Okay, this theme is rife with debate, and I agree with Sam. Call of Cthulhu IS both sci-fi and horror. Ancient Old Ones are inter-dimensional aliens. King of Tokyo IS sci-fi in that if you've seen the movie Pacific Rim, I don't think that you can argue that being anything other than sci-fi.

[@ZatoichiBattousai]

HP Lovercraft wrote about the 1920's & later in from 1922 to 1937 and wrote stories about Venus in his future along with many other tales set in HIS future. Ergo a Sci-Fi Writer.

[@Diogmetes]

Sam is dead on regarding Lovecraft being a writer of science fiction. He often involved current scientific findings in his writings. Especially in what is often considered his most accomplished work, At the Mountains of Madness. Also, Whisperer in the Darkness and Shadow Out of Time very much involve science fiction themes like aliens and space travel. Lovecraft is considered horror today but in his time his work was considered weird fiction and he felt that ghosts and goblins were very much being explained away by science, and so wanted to use science to create fiction that could not be unproven by it. Granted ghouls and zombies are in the game, but in Lovecraft's works were very rare, and often not used in what we consider a traditional vein. Particularly in his fantasy work, The Dream Quest of Unknown Kadath. Whether or not the game is sci- fi or horror in it's theming could be up for debate, but as being a theme of Lovecraftian fiction, it could encompass all weird fiction: fantasy, horror and sci - fi.

[@paradigmNick]

Just for your appreciated advice, I watch the entire advertisement each time. Thanks for helping me with my next purchase. P.S. King of toyko is sci-fi. super powers and technology make it so.

[@kayakasch]

Awesome episode. By far your best list not necessary because of the picks you made but because of the emotions involved. :D And Sam's extended list (only available to these who stayed to the end of credits) is a nice cherry on top. Great job guys.

[@Mandrake42]

I would argue that Mad Max is sci-fi. In the end, the collapse that leads the whole apocalypse is results from the exhaustion of natural resources due to our societies use of technologies that over exploited it. Sci-fi has always centred around mankind's relationship to technology, and I think describing the world as it exists after over reliance on technology destroyed itmakes it valid sci-fi. While they are a little vague on the exact nature of the apocalypse that happened between Mad Max 1 and 2, flashes of footage show nuclear explosions, which once again ties into the theme of mankind and technology.

[@soerenheriksen]

Top 10 Living Card Games please :)

[@RhinoBarbarian]

Only 6 of those exist. One of which has finished production. Warhammer: Invasion(Finished) Star Wars: The Card Game Lord of the Ring: The Card Game Android: Netrunner Call of Cathulhu Game of Thrones

[@soerenheriksen]

pardon my ignorance on this subject but I thought Summoner wars, Sentinels of the multiverse, thunderstone and such are also LCGs. Guess I was wrong :)

[@TheChrysalis83]

Søren Eriksen Technically LCG is an FFG trademarked term, so if we're being nit-picky, yes, there are only the 6 above. The concept is certainly ripe for broadening, however. There are any number of franchises with semi-constant expansion releases that add depth to the card pool. Maaayybe not quite enough for a Top 10, but sooner or later...

[@soerenheriksen]

William Heitman Thanks for the info...much appreciated.

[@RhinoBarbarian]

Søren Eriksen Oh, I see what you mean. Since LCG is a copyright you could say non-collectable card games.

[@adamleibrich4730]

Pandemic is definitely Sci-Fi. The definition of Science fiction is: fiction based on imagined future, scientific or technological advances and major social or environmental changes, frequently portraying space or time travel and life on other planets.

[@LastRaven215]

I'm sorry Sam, but Pandemic is not Sci - Fi. It can and does happen on smaller scales today. The flu, drug resistant MRSA and many other diseases happen with the same feel as the game.

[@TyphoidBryan]

A viral outbreak is something the CDC fights. It is science reality. Just because the game is essentially a simulation doesn't mean it becomes science fiction. There are no classic sci-fi mainstays present in the game. Probably one of the best science non-fiction games, though...

[@HarfangX]

I like the music for the top tens :) simple but fun

[@Rad1oAct1veman]

Sam is starting to ruin these lists for me. Everyone one of these lists turns into an argument about what falls in X category and Sam picks his lists like he's trying to be as clever as possible about what the definition of the current list is. It's happening in video after video.

[@torshap4157]

Godzilla is most definitly scif! What would you call Mecha Godzilla?....He is a robot for petes sakes!

[@williammcguinness795]

The debate centers around the subtle difference between "sci-fi" which conjurs thoughts of bug-eyed monsters, and "science fiction" which can be any fiction in which sciencve is the dominate factor. The novels of Neal Stephenson would be good examples.

[@Gatewaycreed]

Tom Vasel - Looking back you totally predicted Imperial Assault! Genius buddy.

[@torshap4157]

What?!?!?! Throw Star Fleet Battles in the garbage!!!!! Star Fleet Battles ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@SHONNER]

TI3 is my number 1 game. And it's my number 2 game. And my number 3 game...

[@hansgougar1874]

I'm with Sam that King of Tokyo is SciFi

[@Reaper3734]

all right guys time for an update it has been 2 years. although I wouldn't blame you if you wait for first martians to come out first

[@CandyCinema]

1) Horror is not separate from Sci-Fi or Fantasy. They are not mutually exclusive genres. Lovecraft is science-fiction horror. 2) I have to stand by Sam with Pandemic. Some of the best Sci-Fi is about something that could happen today. It's frightening, it feels real. Pandemic is certainly Sci-Fi.

[@kaitie210]

Hearing Sam call Pandemic sci-fi in 2023 is certainly something…

[@antonausallerwelt]

Earth Reborn? Anyone???

[@silentdante]

sucks you can't pick up alien frontiers right now until they get the new print out... I really want that game.

[@berryjordaan7665]

Tannhäuser is one of those games that I'm really interested about but it's impossible to find.

[@fabianabonini1112]

Pandemic is science fiction? Well, if you are in 2022, unfortanely not...

[@aarongreenwell158]

Contagion is not scifi

[@Jeff321]

I think Pandemic is a valid choice. One of the roles is a Scientist, after all.

[@lonelongboarder27]

Godzilla movies are for SURE Sci-Fi

[@darinherrick2503]

List needs to be updated. So many more sci-fi games have come out since this video.

[@guidomoyanoloyola7282]

And the prediction of Tom about Star Wars ground miniatures turn to be right!

[@DemonmachinE]

My girlfriend and I have been loving Race for the Galaxy. We find it significantly more balanced than San Juan, but with similar mechanics. It's definitely a lot better than San Juan because in that game there's one really OP strat, which can easily be achieved, whereas in RFTG you really have to work for a good tableau.

[@i_Lupercalia_i]

The way I see it, all games with science-based things that aren't real are scifi (therefore Pandemic is a scifi as it involves science but the events around it are fictional), as well as anything set in the future (therefore Post-Apoc is automatically scifi). A game doesn't need aliens or robots or space to be scifi, I think. They're just the staples. And in terms of games being horror, scifi/horror is HUGE and always have been since the first Alien film.

[@حمادةاوسكار]

bbb

[@kongnasty7289]

Pandemic and King of Tokyo aren't sci-fi. The comparison to both is made in the context of cinema, which neither would qualify. Clear cut examples lie in Godzilla or Cloverfield for King of Tokyo and Outbreak for Pandemic. Both of those are best classified as disaster movies like The Poseidon Adventure or The Towering Inferno. The elements may seem very different -- a monster or a virus vs. a burning building or a ship wreck, but the plot progression in all four of those movies follows exactly the same structure. Final thought -- how is the plot structure of Godzilla or Outbreak in *any* way similar to Star Wars, Planet of the Apes or District 9? Answer: it isn't. It's The Towering Inferno with a monster or a virus instead of a fire.

[@gheilers]

Is "Star Wars" itself, even science fiction? I consider it to be "space opera." Just because something is set in space, does not necessarily mean it earns the classification of "science fiction." Face it, one finds more hard and true science in "Gilligan's Island" than they do in "Star Wars."

[@Draygarth]

Twilight Imperium is good for a group of 4 or 5 but I actually like Eclipse for 2 or 3 people. TI is a lot of trading and diplomacy and trying to convince people to vote your way. Which is great but Eclipse is focused on mechanics which is better for small groups. I have them both and love them.

[@doomed2063]

One day I'll pick up Twilight Imperium but what holds me back is the fact that I'm pretty sure getting a group together to play it will be easier said than done due to just how complex it it.

[@thegrizzly9740]

the difference between science fiction and fantasy is that fantasy is pure imagination, no science involved. Science fiction on the other hand, is based on modern (steam punk, cyberpunk, or 1940's 1950's fiction)

[@thegrizzly9740]

*Science on the other hand, is based on modern, or sciences of a specific era

[@JoeGrimer]

Fantasy: Supernatural Reality Sci-Fi: Natural Reality that is Superficially Supernatural

[@finnekusu2505]

You said Godzilla(Gojira) movie style is the theme for king of Tokyo. Those movies aren't sci fi they are kaiju films. Kaiju loosely meaning strange monster. So I wouldnt class that as sci fi

[@NewUnit13]

Thank you, as soon as he said that I wanted to see if anyone else knew term kaiju... It is what the genre the movies were introduced to me as :)

[@watersilver]

H.P. Lovecraft is most definitely science fiction.

[@AHeadC]

Lovecraft is usually classed as Weird Fiction or Cosmic Horror, I can see the SciFi for some of it though. However, his work and Eldrich Horror isn't a fair comparison. The game is horror. King of Tokyo isn't SciFi, your reasoning could fit nearly every game ("One if the characters has a robot arm... SciFi" "One of the race options is Cyborg... SciFi" "That guy looks like an alien... SciFi"). Pandemic is a hard one to call, I'd go on the SciFi side though. I don't know where your movie choices came from but none of them (apart from having some kind of viruses) are comparable to the plain old virus outbreak of Pandemic, unless they made a zombie or rage infected psychopath expansion I don't know about.

[@anthonypaolilli253]

Eldritch Horror is science fiction themed horror. The horror is outer and inter dimensional alien beings 100x older than humankind use foreign technology to enslave or destroy earth. The science fiction is aliens and dimensional rifts and shifts. Pandemic is medical science fiction.

[@kevinsullivan3448]

Have you even read any Lovecraft? Read all his works and his commentary about his works. Most of his 'monsters' are aliens. The reason it is considered Horror is because they are so different from us that trying to comprehend them makes you go insane. But it's all based on Weird Science, and actual science from his time period.

[@AHeadC]

***** If you were replying to me, yes I have. Lovecraft is one of my favourite authors and I've read a great deal of his work, and other Lovecraftian authors.

[@skyblazeeterno]

***** its a stretch to say that Lovecraft included any REAL science in his writings

[@kevinsullivan3448]

You should do a bit of research into real science in the 1920s, well what was still being considered real science at the time. Lots of crazy stuff there.

[@gheilers]

Is "Star Wars" itself, even science fiction? I consider it to be "space opera." Just because something is set in space, does not necessarily mean it earns the classification of "science fiction." Face it, one finds more hard and true science in "Gilligan's Island" than they do in "Star Wars."

[@camjam91]

Greg Heilers It's actually fantasy.

[@McBehrer]

Aww, shame this game came out NOW. This list would have benefited from Galactic Strike Force and Chaosmos.

[@kustomkure]

I backed up Chaosmos, amazing game.

[@SamTheWai]

Contagion is not sci-fi, Helix is sci-fi. Sam...