About twenty years ago, i bought a pair of Totem Arro speakers. Still enjoying them almost daily. I saw this model is even still in production.
@ginom4073 жыл бұрын
I have a pair of the Totem Sttaf from the 90's that still sound amazing. They're never leaving house.
@Kbaum7523 жыл бұрын
I'm still loving my totem mites after twenty years. Adding a REL T5i subwoofer put them over the top
@alfredtolentino86143 жыл бұрын
Nice. I’m running a Totem Kin with a Rel T7. 👍
@-x21-3 жыл бұрын
I traded my skylights for mites.
@jonaskromwell44643 жыл бұрын
Totems really surprised me when I auditioned them. They put out a shocking amount of bass for such a small package and sound incredible.
@rmccormack9203 жыл бұрын
I purchased a pair of these in 2020 from a local brick and mortar (sound unheard). I finally received these (pandemic related supply chain issues) and hooked them up to my near(ish) field setup. By the time they arrived, I had gotten a pair of the Klipsch RM-600’s and coupled with a Rel subwoofer, I was very happy. I hooked them up briefly, and they ended up in a the bedroom for evening relaxation. In the past few months, I was ready to try something other than the Klipsch. I was ready to jump into “something else”....and then I saw your review (again). I moved the Klipsch’ and put the Skylights in. OMFG....was this a bottle of fine red wine that I had let breathe? Were these past months a burn in? Whatever.....these speakers have bloomed. They sound so amazing and I am so glad I didn’t jump on to the next best thing. Thanks Steve.
@plaubelmakina89163 жыл бұрын
The owner would be a great interview guest.
@michaelmityok10013 жыл бұрын
Ya wud luv 2 c that interview!
@brandonburr49003 жыл бұрын
I agree. Not sure I have ever seen the ownerf/designer of totem speakers. Is it the original guy that started totem? I know their is a following for this brand over the years but the other bigger names seem to overshadow it.
@kozmiczian7953 жыл бұрын
good work, Steve. Detailed and expressive.
@norton750commando2 жыл бұрын
One thing about Totems, is the soundstage they give, you really don't have to find the "sweet spot" for getting the most out of your music listening pleasure, you can get it sitting off axis. I have a pair of Dreamcatchers and they are really special. My son was in his room about 25 feet or so down the hall from the stereo, and I had put on the 2017 repress of Massive Attack's Mezzanine on the TT. He came running down the hall to listen to the album.
@rrtind3 жыл бұрын
I absolutely love this review. Really informative but also passionate. I heard a pair of totem speakers over 20 years ago and they were very special back then. Great review Steve 👌
@MrCraptakular3 жыл бұрын
I am from the UK and picked up my Totem Sky with official Totem stands last week. Running with my Sugden SE21 amp and the combo of totally amazing! Highly recommend Totem and Sugden for that matter!
@DigitalPhilosophers3 жыл бұрын
The Totem Tribe Tower is THE ONLY speaker I‘ve ever heard that sound exactly like the instruments it plays back.
@DigitalPhilosophers3 жыл бұрын
@@keplermission4947 Did you like your own comment? Are you a clinical psychologist or a psychiatrist? I am a clinical psychologist and I recommend never call someone a narcissist or psychopaths or any other (personality) disorder without testing them comprehensively.
@DigitalPhilosophers3 жыл бұрын
@@keplermission4947 There is no „if“. I am a clinical psychologist. I studied in Munich for two Bachelors one in Business Psychology and the other in Clinical Psy and did my master at the University of Ulm. As long as you are a human being you are welcome and not a stranger to me.
@preparetomeetthypnoom92013 жыл бұрын
My favorite version of Dark Side of the Moon is the one with Syd Barrett singing and playing guitar on it.
@malaudisa3 жыл бұрын
I have had a pair of Totem Acoustic Dreamcatchers for the last 10 years., driven by a Naim Uniti Atom. Two years ago, I set out to upgrade the speakers, with a hefty budget ceiling of around $5k. Everything I tried didn’t seem to be worth changing the Dreamcatchers for. The sound they make is son natural, so live, esp. female vocals that make you believe Ella is in your living room. I’m still thrilled with them, and I wonder if I’ll ever have the energy and motivation to go on the hunt for a better sounding speaker, since it’s so laborious and difficult to actually setup and hear other products side by side.
@keithwalker80903 жыл бұрын
I've heard that Totem and Naim owners are like cult members. So I think the only way you can upgrade is to listen to another totem or Naim. It sounds like your in a good place.
@bjornlagerwall3 жыл бұрын
I too have the Dreamcatchers, got a good price for a demo pair. Upgraded everything now except the speakers. Using a a Primaluna tube amp and a Hegel DAC. Very nice combo.
@StealthParrot3 жыл бұрын
I have 5 Totem Kin in-wall speakers in my home theater room and they sound fabulous. I fell in love with Totem speakers when I first heard the Mani-2 decades ago.
@johnkelley44042 жыл бұрын
Just bought a mahogany pair a week ago. Fabulous! Paired to my primaluna prologue premium amp Rotel 1572 CD player and transparent plus Gen 5 interconnects and speaker cables. It sounds similar to the Totem sttaf I owned,but a little more open and less bass but not by much. Great review
@billappleton39869 ай бұрын
Love the new albums and music + audiophile reviews
@mikecoffee1003 жыл бұрын
Canada is not just for Curling but also Great sounding speakers like Totems
@mipepim8 ай бұрын
I have the same speakers!!!! I love them.!!!
@jaywatterworth Жыл бұрын
I was at that Doors concert. You are right on in your assessment except not mentioning that the whole band was top rate.
@JoelOman19803 жыл бұрын
I used to own a pair of Totem Mite standmount speakers some 10 years ago. Miss them a lot. They were soooo good!
@ZeroFidelity3 жыл бұрын
Nice job, Steve! It's great to know that Vince has retained his passion for the craft!
@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac3 жыл бұрын
Thanks Sean!
@bobb.99173 жыл бұрын
Thanks for your enthusiasm, knowledge and passion with the gear and more importantly "the music"! It is always a pleasure!
@TO-vw3sy2 жыл бұрын
If you've never listened to the Totem Model One, the original...I'm not sure how you can call yourself an audiophile. Simply incredible speaker
@damianzaninovich49003 жыл бұрын
Great review, I enjoyed the music reviews as well. You mentioned bootlegs. I’ve been listening to a homemade cd my brother made from Ray Davies’s “Storyteller” era which is legitimate but most of the songs on this disc are bootlegs from this tour. The dynamics are eye opening, never hear commercial recordings made like this. It sounds like Ray Davies is in my room. I’ve never heard a bootleg that sounds this good. 80 minutes of some of the best music I know of. We love the “Village Green” era before and after. We are Kinks fanatics.
@MarkBanks772 жыл бұрын
Totems are incredible 👍
@richardsauer74943 жыл бұрын
What irks me about bookshelf speakers is the cost of the stands... what are these thing made of ? Gold. Might as well buy a floorstanding speaker.
@chuckgillespie13 жыл бұрын
Amen - I just bought $600 stand mounts and $1000 for subs and $150 for the stands....
@elijahmohamed18863 жыл бұрын
I realize it is kinda off topic but does anyone know of a good site to watch new series online ?
@kadenmarco5763 жыл бұрын
@Elijah Mohamed i use Flixzone. Just search on google for it :)
@edencarlos22193 жыл бұрын
@Kaden Marco yup, been using Flixzone for since april myself :D
@elijahmohamed18863 жыл бұрын
@Kaden Marco thanks, signed up and it seems like they got a lot of movies there :D I appreciate it!
@geoffreyvanhouwaert86773 жыл бұрын
Signature one on the other hand💕
@rd2643 жыл бұрын
heard the AR 3a speakers with the AR integrated amp and turntable. really good. dont scoff !!
@henriksrensen32203 жыл бұрын
I love standmount speakers. Love your reviews Steve 👍
@mike-js1jj3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the review. My Totem Forests really came to life when I hooked them up to the Prima Luna Evo 400 what a difference . I do wonder at times if there a bit bright though.
@benjaminqilafku57143 жыл бұрын
These Totem speakers look ordinary but sonically punch above the weight. They have only one flaw are very expensive here in Italy, cost about 1400-1500 US dollars. I was seriously considering buying them but their price tag turned me off and took a completely different route bought a set of large floor standers for 500 less and I'm happy as a free bird. By the way the speakers I bought are called Magnat Transpuls 1500 and are very similar to a Klipsch FORTE III in size. Give an audition if you can or buy them straight away because I swear will not regret it. Big bold, natural, live venue sound is going to be the reward for less then 1G
@seanmangan27693 жыл бұрын
I've always liked Totem, I have the Dreamcatchers, and the original Model 1s. Magic.
@SaZooCaballero3 жыл бұрын
Yep, same here. I've had many speakers, and pound per pound Dreamcatchers are unbeatable.
@davidmiller15343 жыл бұрын
If we're going to do bookshelves, I hope to see something from Revel, KEF (R3), or Monitor Audio.
@newgunguy41763 жыл бұрын
I love that your intro is only 4 secs long!!!
@madisongraham93073 жыл бұрын
Saw The Beach Boys 127 years ago also in Dallas in mid-1969s... never had their LOs only 45s...I will now have to get the CD (and check Steve’s math)!
@edwardbalboa55283 жыл бұрын
Totem make thier own drive units ... Some of which are the best in world
@techmetal22923 жыл бұрын
What are the acoustic panels you have on your wall? They look very interesting
@tonykazz27793 жыл бұрын
Geeze, your lens is making a nice soft look
@dayfornight883 жыл бұрын
I scored a nice pair of totem dreamcatchers my favorite speaker ever . when playing them if I close my eyes I think I'm herring imassive towers high end..
@barfdog172 жыл бұрын
if i end up with a pair of skylights it will be this review that led me to them
@ionobelisk3 жыл бұрын
What you say about the Fillmore makes it sound like The Astoria in London, now sadly demolished for a new underground station. Just the best venue
@nevigo55193 жыл бұрын
Is the plates on the wall with different small holes (like Kefs meta) to absorb certain freq? Thanks for the video Steve. Love from Copenhagen.
@bradleydurbin67846 ай бұрын
How do these speakers compare to Paradigm and PSB since they are also Canadian Speakers?
@-x21-3 жыл бұрын
Try playing Either or Both by Phoebe Snow. Her voice triggers the port problem. It should sound like her singing though a plastic pipe... Steve, I cannot believe you didn't hear the port bleeding into the mids. This was a major fuckup for Totem. I guess I had mine for longer...
@mikecoffee1003 жыл бұрын
ok I have the original Rainmaker and a pair of Mites and a Pair of Skys and am happy with each one of them.
@Raskolnikov186310 ай бұрын
You must review Arro! Blows away your affordable speakers
@jeffkalina77273 жыл бұрын
Heard this speaker in a shootout last November. It had a very engaging sound everyone enjoyed. Would be top contender as a secondary, small room speaker at $1.0k.
@arthurwatts16803 жыл бұрын
Steve has been a fan of Totem speakers since the 1880s ;) (OK, OK - he's only a few years older than me, but I struggle to remember ANY of the audio gear from the 80s. I know my turntable was crap but few of us cared as long as we could hear the music on the records. I'm fairly sure everything I had was Made In Japan - sadly, that was before they made the leap to high quality manufacture).
@kjbunnyboiler3 жыл бұрын
Interesting, for some reason I can remember kit my school had in the early 70’s , I can also remember the reg plates of my fathers cars from the 60’s.The thing is I think my memory is actually pretty crap especially with peoples names! I guess the brain retains some things better than others and it very much depends on the individual! I also remember the vat number of a company I worked for briefly in the late 70’s. It was 9 digit number and there’s no reason why I should remember it. I can’t remember my own vat number My business had in the 80’s! With Hifi though I can usually tie a pic with a model number
@arthurwatts16803 жыл бұрын
@@kjbunnyboiler Nope - back then it was whatever consumer-grade gear I could get my hands on and that was it. I know there WERE hi-fi shops in Sydney but I knew I couldn't afford any of it so I didn't bother - my priorities were the music and partying. Saw a lot of live bands and enjoyed the vinyl I owned, but there was absolutely nothing memorable about the brand names where I shopped - if was probably JVC or one of the other brands that slapped their name on anything to turn a profit. FWIW, I've never forgotten my tax file number or my Army regimental ID. A young Steve Guttenberg trying to sell me Totem speakers would have given up very quickly ;)
@Lightworker4443 жыл бұрын
Could you review the Kin Monitors? I see nobody doing it and I don't understand why. They have a smaller woofer than the powered Kin Plays, and I'd like to know how the Monitors sound, stage, etc
@mbvx73 жыл бұрын
when are you doing a KLH Model 5 review?
@rd2643 жыл бұрын
heard the AR 3a speakers with the AR integrated amp and turntable. really good. dont scoff !!
@mbvx73 жыл бұрын
@@rd264 what does that have to do with me or my question?
@dynacoman73633 жыл бұрын
Wonder how sound of Skylight compares to Sky. Skylight has slightly larger woofer, smaller cbnt, 1/2 price.
@alfredtolentino86143 жыл бұрын
Love the video👍🎶 How would these fair inside a Salamander cabinet?
@ionobelisk3 жыл бұрын
Don't know if it's still the case, but Mission always advised parallel over toed in.
@1leesuperka3 жыл бұрын
Soo happy to see Totem getting reviewed! I think they get less attention than they deserve. I own a pair of Dreamcatchers and Rainmakers. They are truly amazing. As a Canadian, I thank you for praising one of our best companies in Hi-Fi! Now, how about some Bryston?
@hastingsbnsfnscalemodeler85943 жыл бұрын
Thanks Steve. I’m going to check out the Dark Side the next time I’m listening to my system.
@aag11403 жыл бұрын
Totem One
@danielshia15752 жыл бұрын
hey steve! curious how you compare the Skylights with the LSX - between those two for a desktop set up!
@davidstein91292 жыл бұрын
Steve, Thanks for another informative & fun review. I own Totem Tower speakers. I have a quick question for you. Which company makes the charcoal colored diffuser panels behind the speakers in your listening room? Thanks So Much.
@jlmain57773 жыл бұрын
Speaking of Carol Kaye, she would make a terrific interview and I’m sure she would do it.
@MG-iv8ooАй бұрын
care to comment on the skylight compared to the totem arro (which i have just ordered). thx
@garysmith84553 жыл бұрын
Thanks Steve, great review as always. Your Martin Logan man here.. Just wanted you and the audio community to know, that JUST THIS WEEK, I sat down and listened to that VERY SAME Beach Boys recording edition. Wonderful sound indeed. I believe Carol Kaye is the bassist throughout those arrangements with that 'wrecking crew'... I remember very well hearing those tunes when they were on the air in rotation before I even owned an FM radio ((O: My dad bought my mom an FM table radio in 1967 and that was really a break through sound back in those days.....NO static from lightening during the summer storms.......sorry, I didn't mean to get carried away, but, I am sure you've been there (O:
@mcpoulet132 жыл бұрын
Hi, would these pair well with a NAIM Uniti Star? I believe that these might be the best in the price range but I'd appreciate any other suggestions.
@Jeton63 жыл бұрын
Neil Young is an artist acutely aware of how badly CD's could amputate psychedelic rock compared to LP, so I expect engineers on his classic recordings will hold similar values when mastering to high-res media.
@mikrophonie56333 жыл бұрын
Neil Young made psychedelic rock? That's probably news to him.
@davidstein91292 жыл бұрын
Does anybody know who makes those square, diffusion panels behind the pair of Totum speakers?
@richardpauli45152 жыл бұрын
Thanks for this review. I bought a pair of Dreamcatcher’s in Cherry finish (my first and only Totems) about 6 years ago and really enjoy them. However, I think that bass is a little bit lacking, so I was wondering if you might have an opinion on matching the Dreamcatchers with a small sub? Unfortunately, Totem isn’t making a Dreamcatcher sub. I think they said that the Kin mini would work well. Thoughts?
@davidstein91292 жыл бұрын
One person said he paired them with 2 REL subs & likes the sound very much. I don't remember which model REL
@EirkenElite3 жыл бұрын
It's all about those linkwitz crossovers
@ForsakenSparrow2 жыл бұрын
How do these compare with the Kef LS50 Meta?
@jimmatheos90693 жыл бұрын
Did you test the totem with the stock jumpers or your own? The photo that you posted shows stock jumpers.
@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac3 жыл бұрын
Stock
@rhwinner3 жыл бұрын
Totem speakers have a reputation for being amazing at moderate sound levels but sometimes lose their composure with loud, rock tracks.
@marcgabor96903 жыл бұрын
Steve are you listening to Pet Sounds in stereo or mono? Your review inspired me to put on my lava lamp and dive into to pet sounds. For a change I listened to the mono mixes (Tidal has them in MQA) and WOW. Amazing how deep the mixes are. I never feel like I'm missing any ambiance or separation even though the same thing is coming out of both channels. Brilliant.
@johngutmanis35803 жыл бұрын
Steve any idea what kind of amps and speakers were uses at the Fillmore in it’s hay day? Thanks
@mikrophonie56333 жыл бұрын
They used to serve hay at the Fillmore? Didn't know that.
@pingkichan72853 жыл бұрын
Can you tell me what is that black panel behind the speaker, where can I get it and how much is it? Thanks
@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac3 жыл бұрын
It’s a GIK difuuser it’s about $50
@pingkichan72853 жыл бұрын
Thank you.
@jogmas123 жыл бұрын
Crunchier?
@alexp-de3 жыл бұрын
just curious, is the video with more viewer home setups still coming?
@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac3 жыл бұрын
Yes on Wednesday and Friday, it’s a two-parter
@atoz65523 жыл бұрын
I want a pair of Arrows for my small room
@brandonburr49003 жыл бұрын
Steve, With that sorta consistent 7 to 8 ohms rating that just screams try me with lower powered tube amps and some first watt class a magic or some sit amplifiers 😀
@PanAmStyle3 жыл бұрын
Very nice review. I remember hearing the original Manis when they were just released, at a high end show in Toronto. Indeed it was amazing to hear all the bass coming from those little guys. Steve, if you still have the Skylights in house, try playing St. James Infirmary on The Bright Mississippi disc by Allen Toussaint. Wow, what a great version and recording! I’d be interested to hear your impression of how the Totems rendered that piece - it’s so much fun!
@TheTrueVoiceOfReason3 жыл бұрын
Great for "HiFi" recordings, but how does it recreate what the artist intended on something like Art Brut's Slap Dash For No Cash?
@fletchermunson622511 ай бұрын
I massively screwed up. Instead of going up to the strip and seeing the Doors at the Whiskey, I went to the Troubadour. Sigh.
@carlitomelon46103 жыл бұрын
Seems like a good name for an in- ceiling speaker? 😅
@mesonto3 жыл бұрын
Generally the Totem speaker line have vastly superior tonality compared the majority of other speaker manufacturers. This is where I think they are well worth their money. Also, you mentioned the speaker grills... funny enough Wilson Audio could take some lessons from Totem in this area. (Grumble, grumble, had to repair my over priced Wilson speaker grills several times, grumble grumble.)
@tonykazz27793 жыл бұрын
Your Crib is catching-up with J.Darko
@Finn-McCool3 жыл бұрын
The second coming of the Polk Audio RT15 😆 Looks aren't everything though I suppose.
@danielwilliams19213 жыл бұрын
Where’d all the crazy-cool shirts go?
@joeragu70563 жыл бұрын
Hi I like your videos can you please tell me how I can send you a question about a product ? Thanks Joseph ragusa.
@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac3 жыл бұрын
Thanks Joseph, you can email Audiophiliac@mail.com Say what the product is in the subject line. Please understand I get offers all the time that I rarely accept, so don’t take it personal
@joeragu70563 жыл бұрын
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac thanks I will not take it personal you are very good at what you do I can understand why you get so many ! Actually just wondering what you think of gallo speakers and did you ever do a review of them thanks again Joseph.
@danielnicholls68683 жыл бұрын
wait to you get to the tribes or V2s
@ICU20023 жыл бұрын
Hello Steve, when are you going to review the JBL 100 anniversary speakers? Any chance?
@JohnJohn-lk4lq3 жыл бұрын
Hope not it’s a shit speaker
@ICU20023 жыл бұрын
@@JohnJohn-lk4lq Have you heard it???
@JohnJohn-lk4lq3 жыл бұрын
@@ICU2002 clearly I have, I wouldn’t comment if I haven’t. Jbl is a joke
@themastroiannis3 жыл бұрын
@@JohnJohn-lk4lq of course you didn't listen to them! you're lying yet again. i went to your house and you still have your pair of Dayton Kremola Speakers!
@bizyz3 жыл бұрын
we really don't get to see much of this speaker.should have shown close ups of it as well as what the back looks like.
@jfasselin43013 жыл бұрын
Made in Québec
@aceberganabolic3 жыл бұрын
is it just hobby ? or u paid by companies ?
@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac3 жыл бұрын
I get paid by Google, the company that owns KZbin. You know all those commercials of people hate? That’s where the money comes from
@asphalthedgehog65803 жыл бұрын
My former speakers were the Arro's now replaced by the Kin Mini + Sub just because the imaging of the Kin is better. Probably due to the 6dB filtering. Thinking about replacing these by either the LS50 or these Totems with the Sub. Never liked KEF but the LS50 should be different. Never heard them though.
@wiebl52663 жыл бұрын
with so much experience, you can really enrich the audience--your fans. BUT you spend 40% of the time rambling on about music that you reminisce... it's meaningful and special to you, but not to me and many others--I'm sure. Of course those who adores you will come to your defense here. Perhaps you have a rich experience to talk about old music that others do not have the privilege to experience like you did, but how does it benefit the audience--who tune in to find out more about TOTEM Skylight?
@JEG69193 жыл бұрын
Never heard a memorable totem speaker. Just another two way speaker. They’re not alone, however.
@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac3 жыл бұрын
No problem, they’re doing fine without you👍You know we don’t have to all agree what could good sound is, have you not been paying attention?
@JEG69193 жыл бұрын
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac There are two way bookshelf speakers as far as the eye can see today. An opinion can be a individual who has heard their offerings more than once, never feeling there was anything above average about them. Differing opinions should be encouraged.
@LiuMav3 жыл бұрын
I heard the totem bookshelves before. When set up properly, it can bring out emotions and dazzle the senses.
@JEG69193 жыл бұрын
Bruce Liu l've heard totems on a multitude of occasions. If you don't compare them to anything, you may think they are OK. The unvarnished truth is they are forgettable.
@kenhiett5266 Жыл бұрын
@@JEG6919 And yet Jason from 2 channel listening rates the Totem Element Fire as one of the best speakers he's ever owned. Not just the best bookshelf speakers, but one of the best speakers in general. This is from a guy that's owned many highly accomplished speakers. I put the Element Fire V2 on my shortlist to audition, so we'll see if your opinion has any merit. I'm highly doubtful considering the raving reviews regarding the in-house Torrent driver. My money is on your comment being put to bed.
@tonykazz27793 жыл бұрын
You are too bleached-out, adjust colour balance
@ryanschipp85133 жыл бұрын
10lb speaker for 1k? Nope. I'll take the NEW pair of Canton reference 9.2's I got for $1100 shipped. They should feel ashamed to sell a 10lb speaker for 1k. Holy cats! Thats a lightweight.
@HareDeLune3 жыл бұрын
Lol! Speakers by the pound.
@ryanschipp85133 жыл бұрын
@@HareDeLune Yep. Makes a difference in cabinet resonance and shows if they are cutting some corners.
@HareDeLune3 жыл бұрын
@@ryanschipp8513 I prefer cutting corners. All the corners. Less diffraction that way. ~_^
@ryanschipp85133 жыл бұрын
@@HareDeLune lol
@geoffreyvanhouwaert86773 жыл бұрын
I didn't like these...
@Yessssz3 жыл бұрын
... why?
@geoffreyvanhouwaert86773 жыл бұрын
@@Yessssz they were bland, no sparkle, no music, but that's just me, maybe my room or amps didn't work with them
@Yessssz3 жыл бұрын
Geoffrey, thanks for the comment. I feel like I had similar experience listening to a pair of Totems with Audio Research years ago, though I can’t remember the model.
@geoffreyvanhouwaert86773 жыл бұрын
@@Yessssz the signature one is actually one of the best bookshelfs for smaller rooms i've ever heard...
@phillipmaxwell68822 жыл бұрын
I like the tonal balance and and signature of totem speakers. To date I have never owned them. I find them a little to expensive for what they are........
@phillipmaxwell68822 жыл бұрын
But by no means are they flat. They always have that Bruce buzzy sound.( sorry about spelling of bruzzy)