Toyota Supra and Mazda MX-5

[@NippyMoto]

The MX5/FIAT situation wasn't really a collaboration. Mazda needed a bit of cash and FIAT needed a chassis that's about it. The MX5 is all Mazda, there's nothing Fiat about it. On the other hand the Fiat is pretty much a MX5 so having that would have made more sense here.

[@XtremeArtists]

Correct. The MX5 has no Fiat technology in it. It would have been produced without Fiat's involvement. The Fiat is a rebadged MX5 and the Supra is a rebadged BMW.

[@davidzhang1704]

Correct. The MX 5 exists with or without fiat. Supra would not exist without bmw.

[@ltkwok]

Yup. He should have done the MX5 & the Z4 (OEMs). Or the Supra with the 124, the modifiers.

[@vxsiliu]

That's exactly what I wanted to say

[@caldera878]

Amazed at Mazda, a small car manufacturer, for keeping the MX-5 alive for so long while still retaining the same formula while other sports cars from Japan died a sad slow death. The Supra on the other hand is a disgrace of corporate penny pinching from Toyota.

[@chrismccombe6961]

He's wrong when he said the mx5 4th gen was made in a joint partnership with Fiat. Mazda designed the mx5 on there own from the ground up that's why it feels so good and true to is roots fiat had nothing to do with the design of the mx5 they just bought the best platform off mazda and tried to have a quick cash grab

[@MogsterKupo]

Correct, and I'm surprised this comments section hasn't hounded him more on this point.

[@paulcfyeung]

@@MogsterKupo I dont know cos maybe we're not all assholes?

[@MogsterKupo]

@@paulcfyeung I'm not saying I personally would (because I don't condone bullying), but let's be honest, this is the internet we're talking about. Or maybe my being surprised is just more to do with the cynic in me.

[@MyGoogi]

exactly. he is completely wrong

[@maheshmurali2697]

Anything fiat Chrysler makes is garbage

[@Themazcorner]

Mazda actually developed the ND inhouse and Fiat more or less put a fiat body on it and a different motor as far as I know. The collab part maybe was more that Fiat put in some money in the development. In any case both the Supra and MX-5 are awesome cars. My 30th anniversary is sitting in the garage waiting for the summer to break through :).

[@sutats]

Easy choice here. The MX-5

[@1PITIFULDUDE]

Yes, Miata is always the answer.

[@traderloves6556]

Why? Toyota got more horse power

[@CLU7CH3R]

@@traderloves6556 Not as reliable and fun to drive.

[@traderloves6556]

@@CLU7CH3R I thought Toyota is always the most reliable

[@XZX0110]

@@traderloves6556 but thats a bmw bro

[@swanblake]

MX5 is my choice all day. I'll pass on the heavier RF version but give me the soft top with a manual gearbox, and I will be in heaven. It's also light weight and affordable. A perfect recipe. Supra puts down great numbers for alot more money but the Miata you can enjoy everyday. Also BMW reliability is horrid so the Mazda will be cheaper to fix and much less frequent

[@NippyMoto]

The RF is absolutely wonderful. The ability to drop the top whenever you want while having the luxuries of a hardtop us awesome. It's chassis is actually more stiff than the softtop model.

[@Saboda53]

The vast majority of auto journalists and KZbin reviewers feel the added weight of the RF is insignificant and should not be a factor in which MX-5 one chooses.

[@caldera878]

The Mazda MX-5 formula works while other automakers completely abandoned roadsters.

[@danielthomas2621]

The spirit of the mx5 is as a softop , the rf is cool but not for me....

[@michaelfont7239]

@@Saboda53 its 100 pounds,I'll take the st.;)

[@christophernicol4762]

Your reviews are amongst the very best. You are informed, balanced,enthusiastic and not overawed by certain German manufacturers, something of a rarity in the trade these days. Thank you!

[@XtremeArtists]

You should have compared the Fiat 124 and the Supra. "Without BMW there would be no Supra," but without Fiat, the MX5 would be the same. Mazda did not collaborate with Fiat just as BMW did not collaborate with Toyota.

[@alexgrazie93]

Then let Supra name rest pacefull, than shaming it's name with that bmw

[@jabiqq]

As an MX5 30AE owner, I can say that Dan's points are entirely valid. However car's slightly floaty suspension is easily fixed with shorter springs and precision alignment. As for small cabin, I'm 6'2" - I replaced seat runners with aftermarket ones and now have over 4" of headroom. Seating position feels very sporty now. It's fun to be able to use all available performance in daily driving.

[@smilepermile888]

Great video Dan. If anyone wants a 'modern day Honda S2000', get this 2020 Mazda MX-5, send it to BBR to get the 'Super 220' tuning package, as well as wilwood brakes, Ohlins coilovers (w/ proper alignment + geo done) and stiffer antirollbars to maintain all that balance, and you're done! OK, it doesn't rev to 9000rpm like the S2000 did, but it'll rev to 7800rpm and you'll have torque and power across a more broader rev range, and you'll have similar power to weight ratio as the S2000.

[@jamescarson6681]

Could make for a great trackday toy - hopefully UK racetracks aren't so strict about convertibles without rollbars

[@deasystems]

"… you'll have similar power to weight ratio as the S2000." Actually, the MX-5 already has a similar power to weight ratio without any modifications at all (12.9 lb/hp vs. 12.1 lb/hp).

[@smilepermile888]

@@deasystems Ok lets get very detailed then. Fastestlaps.com quotes that the S2000 weighed 1260kg and has 236hp, which makes it 189hp per ton. It also mentions that the 30th Anniversary Mazda MX-5 ND2 weighs 1060kg and has 181hp, which makes it 170hp per ton. When the suspension travel of the Mazda is much longer than the S2000, it'll have more body roll around the corners, so I reckon the Mazda could at least make do with upgraded suspension/swaybars, and a midpipe + axle back exhaust from Flyin' Miata (+16hp without a tune). Perhaps the BBR Super 220 package may make the ND2 comparison with the S2000 a bit too unfair, but hey, who says no to a higher redline right

[@caldera878]

Rather just get a used s2000 for half the cost of a new mx-5 + parts.

[@twitchyzero]

I have both ap1 and nd2 I will pick nd2 9 out of 10 times but the s2000 is very special esp the motor and that transmission lauded as one of the best in production vehicles

[@cpandsooz]

Superb video. MX5 30th AE here. Please world keep making cars like the MX5. 👍🏻

[@Kemigon]

The Supra looks nice but being codeveloped by BMW means it's unreliable and expensive to repair. Miata remains the correct answer.

[@xxptamaxx]

Will the supra be the least reliable Toyota ever, or the z4 the most reliable BMW ever?

[@barturronesoficial23]

They accepted the deal cz the supra will run until the 100k miles or the 10 years of guarantee of toyota. At the 101k miles even you claim will be again a z4 and a poor reliable car like every bmw after 2000 year

[@thezanzibarbarian5729]

Caterham are doing it with their new PlusFour which has a BMW engine and gearbox. It still looks like a Caterham with it's handbuilt internals and 1930's style, but with very modern internals. So for me, car makers who collaborate to make sports cars is a win, win for me. Who wouldn't love to have something that looked like a Jaguar E-Type, XK150, Austin healey 3000, Mg TF or a Porsche 356A but had the reliability and running gear of any modern car? As for Toyota joining with BMW to make the new Supra. It's great. Even better, it's faster with Toyota's engineers tweaking the engine than it is with the stock BMW engine that goes into BMW's Z4.

[@richardwright1948]

Morgan not caterham but i agree completely with all you say and i love the new supra.

[@Mr--S.]

I'm a Toyota/Lexus guy, but the ND2 MX5 is the better car... Gonne be mine in few months

[@dk6024]

The Miata was developed by Mazda. The 124 just replaces the engine, transmission, and body with Fiat gear. So, Fiat reduces the cost but the Miata is all Mazda.

[@BryanDawsonUSA]

I’m 6’1” and have no issues at all with headroom in my 2019 Miata RF GTS. Ironically, in the Supra, your head is almost scraping the roof and the steering wheel is almost in your chest. While the Supra is beautiful, the fact that it lacks a manual gearbox and an over-engineered “collaboration” with BMW = pass.

[@redsquare5325]

The original supra was cheaper to run and maintain than rivals and also cheaper to fix when things go wrong. This supra BMW combo will be costly to fix like BMW costly

[@carboydorifutoparty3976]

Cheaper? All I hear from owners is that parts like windows,seats,radios,mirrors,doors,trunks,etc are hard to find and are stupid expensive since 90% of the parts are discontinued.

[@smilepermile888]

+Billy Padiwa You sound like a Scotty Kilmer fangirl

[@jf_paes1589]

@@carboydorifutoparty3976 It's almost like the Mk.4 is a 20+ year old, out of production car. He's saying it WAS, as in, back when it was still in production the car was cheaper and easier to maintain than the new Mk.5 will be now, because it was all Toyota.

[@carboydorifutoparty3976]

@@jf_paes1589 the mk5 isn't even a year old and B58s arent hard to maintain. They're are already plenty of B58 bimmers with 70-100k miles that haven't had any issues to speak of. These are completely brand new so there bound to have problems that evwn normal toyotas are being called out for problems and recalls.

[@loyp4328]

The only thing FIAT provided for their 124/Abarth was the badges and the engines. That said, they will be a future collector as zoomstimers thanks to the fact they will probably age rather gracefully.

[@OutVanAbout]

If you're considering the idea of collaborations, why wouldn't you do a side by side review of the cars their sharing their platforms with?

[@hrmfa]

You should have tested the Fiat along the Supra for video to make sense. You would have the same situation with the inteor in the Fiat as with the Supra. They both have just taken the lot from the "donor" car. That said Fiat uses another engine than the Mazda.

[@rob.fisher]

Great vid by Dan, background music really irritating. Sounds like I'm in some sort of 'experience' at an aquarium.

[@jameswillard1]

If Fiat had an involvement in the MX5 it would’ve been hard to start when it rained out and had the headlights short out on a dark back road late at night

[@ryantaylor6530]

What do you consider collaboration? The only part of the Supra that is Toyota is the body panels, similarly with the Fiat it is just a MX-5 with different body panels.

[@grisa12345]

Great video, thanks! Hard to go with anything other than the Miata for usable power and fun everyday.

[@chrisogrady28]

Lack of manual in the supra is unforgivable, I also wish it was still a 2+2 T top

[@dumyjobby]

I would take the mx5, a true sports car. Manual, rwd, light and fun and not very fast which is a good thing

[@clarksonoceallachain8536]

Not light Especially in japan

[@ras6488]

Wow the reviewer couldn’t hav gotten their facts more wrong. Did he not do any research? The Miata was NOT co-developed! It is pure Mazda. The Fiat 124 is what was co-developed between Mazda and Fiat. Fiat put their body and drivetrain onto the MX5 chassis/platform.

[@mycbeats1276]

The Supra doesnt feel like a collaboration, feels more like toyota contracted it out to BMW. I'm still struggling to understand what Toyota's role was other than just signing the checks to BMW.

[@xu10j4rs1]

Design and chassis set up for a start, both better than the z4.

[@netmatrix75]

@@xu10j4rs1 I would give that a hard disagree. Z4 is convertible Zupr4 is coupe. As history proven that coupe will always have better rigidity and handling than open top. So the argument of set up/ tuning/ handling are all bullshit.

[@Fioravanti.80]

Hearing between the lines of Dan's narrative in this footage, the message to take is that the company that leads the engineering and development is to be respected more than the company that simply borrows it; hence the Mazda remains a Mazda and thus well liked and respected while the Toyota is a disquised Z4 and therefore adversely compromised.

[@brandoncomer6492]

That Mazda is 100% Mazda. The Spider is the one that lifts pretty much everything from the Mazda but the engine, which is a turbocharged 1.4L Fiat.

[@WoozieGuy]

Unfortunately I cannot buy a Alpine A110 because It’s not available mostly on U.S. markets.

[@smiler921]

I would definitely one day buy the Supra

[@seidshot]

Great video! Just bought an RF GT with club pack. I have raced A Radical SR3 , and a Spec Boxster, but I love the feel of the miata. Had an NA Miata, and have missed it ever since I sold it.

[@brian_mwaura]

Still wondering when Mazda ever collaborated on making the MX-5. Thought other guys came to ride on their success.... I imagine if Fiat brought its business in the development, it wouldn't be as reliable as it is... 🤷‍♂️

[@Mexxx65]

Ok I'll take the Ford connection with the NC1&2 Duratec engine, though even then Mazda said the engine model number was unique to their MX5 only.

[@MrSunnyBhoy]

Dan why did you leave Evo? Always a great review

[@drdoolittle5724]

Dan, as a very good motor journalist, it surprises everyone you describe the Fiat as 'sharing' the underpinnings of a 30 year old ikon!!!!!!!! The Fiat IS a Miata with ornamental changes.

[@businessmanph]

How does the supra handle compared to the miata. Imo all heavy cars feel fat compared to lighter car. If I won a supra I would sell it and get a miata and mod it up.

[@Torresmeza9]

but the mx5 is purely mazda lol they just let fiat borrow the chassis

[@nathanlambert1502]

Which car has a the best handling ? I’m looking for the better handling car ?

[@ChengHooSew]

Anyone who can afford a Supra should also has a MX-5 in their garage

[@joetaka7620]

I agree, both are great drivers cars that improve one's driving techniques. They like to 'rotate' around corners, meaning less steering lock required.

[@schellingrs]

I would choose the MX5 all day.

[@bonzobanana1]

No idea why Toyota went to BMW their new Supra would have been far better as a cosmetic variation of the Mazda MX-5 with a few design differences. Now the Supra is a low quality, high maintenance car that can only damage Toyota's engineering reputation. Is the Mazda MX-5 a joint development with Fiat? I would of thought the new MX-5 would have existed without Fiat's involvement and Fiat just based their car on the MX-5 where as the Toyota is a re-skinned BMW not much else. The only good thing about the Supra is Toyota have naively continued with their full 5 years warranty on it which will cost them dear as there appears to be lots of problems with the new Supra already. So you get an extra 2 years warranty over the BMW which may save owners a huge amount in repair costs. The MX-5 is a brilliant car and fantastic value, for me a sports car needs a manual stick and its more about throwing the car around corners which I think the MX-5 is ideal for. I'm hoping for a MX-5 with the skyactiv X engine.

[@carboydorifutoparty3976]

Low quality? Ok then how many rcfs,LC's,and GSFs have been selling compared to their competition. Better yet Toyota would've probably made it another overpriced nsx added to the market or another crossover with a iconic name. The car itself is a decent plat form (not sandbagging the mx5)it can be used for nearly anything just like the gt86.

[@bonzobanana1]

@@carboydorifutoparty3976 I'm just making the point Toyota on average produce very reliable, long lasting cars with low ownership costs and are at the top of the reliability ratings. BMW are 31 out of 40 for brands according to the reliability index which is based on repair frequency not opinion or surveys and BMW do a lot of much simpler cars which will be much more reliable than this Supra so those will shore up their reliability rating, its the expensive complicated cars that have horrific reliability and unbelievable repair costs. www.reliabilityindex.com/manufacturer

[@jerryjin3427]

Looking at the comments. I really don’t know why people hate Supra but love Miata so much? Just because BMW was involved in the Supra development? But I guess isn’t a Supra faster than a Miata? *I am not trying to argue or fight, I just simply want to know the reason why almost everyone of you is saying that?

[@Lee-70ish]

Mx5 is the mx5 the Fiat was just a climb on that's why its stopped selling in Europe and will be dropping it's US sales soon. It was never going to be popular because it uses the Fiat power plant which couldn't undermine Mazdas better reliability reputation and MX5 cars historic popularity. Even though having owned three Fiat cars I can vouch they produce good engines The rest was just styling choice the yanks love the Miata the Europeans love the MX5 and us Brits buy more rag top cars than anywhere else and it's the MX5 that always tops the list.

[@joekao192]

I love Supra but I don’t like BMW, how much BMW are in the Supra?? MX5 is very cool but not as cool as Supra, but I sure it’s much more reliable BMW, so then first question is very important, how much BMW in the Supra??

[@UncleWally3]

Why doesn’t the Mazda employ its G+ technology in the Miata?

[@clarksonoceallachain8536]

Can he try a 2nd gen Daihatsu copen

[@paultaylor9652]

Lovely Jubbly, such great cars.

[@Nino5i]

Mx 5 Is better if you don't want a faster car

[@thehauke7981]

Love the supra for its such a complete package. Would make a great daily if I had the money

[@Oofus21]

Such as worthy battle

[@richieonyt5815]

Surprising that the new Supra’s aren’t manual

[@Sustainable_IN]

Lovely two cars to me.

[@brianrocks7277]

Collaboration in car industry nothing new at all. Mazda is actually all Mazda, Italian just stuck a nose on.

[@businessmanph]

Engine should have been built by toyota. If the miata engine came from fiat I bet my miata that sales would plummet. Even the brz n frs n 86 didnt even get a real power bump or boost. They didnt listen to the customers. Tesla is coming for toyota.

[@moneyparhar]

Mazda for win. Poopra is just BMW

[@Daniel-ih6rc]

We need a Supra MK5 targa

[@bored2323]

Supra ? What Supra ?

[@Mexxx65]

Its actually Toyotas new Celica, they just named it wrong Lol

[@caldera878]

Zupr4

[@randomthoughts1001]

MX-5 6MT Club please 🤗

[@teroxc]

So, they use a new engine, and the excuses is because developing a new engine is hard and costs money. okay. what about the 2jz? just...put them back into production. nobody will complain about new 2jzs. nobody.

[@potatochobit]

well, I own a fiat 124 and I enjoy it but I wanted a more tuner friendly turbo engine. this multi air BS out of a cheap fiat panda designed to save gas in a sports car is a problem but I can live with 220hp I guess.

[@seikocitizenwatches]

Give me, I take the Supra To buy, I buy the Miata

[@marwanedits]

Supra and MX-5 is not in the same Class 😕

[@1PITIFULDUDE]

No, the Fiat benefits from utilizing what Mazda developed. Fiat had absolutely nothing to do with the cars development. The Supra? Meh...

[@K03sport]

...next up, Toyota collabs with Mazda with the Mazda2/Yaris duo...

[@MattyDienhoff]

Ha! They already did exactly that with the Scion iA in the USA.

[@Mexxx65]

"Joint enterprises with other car companies" ;Mazda MX5 ND .... What type of crack has Dab been smoking lately?? You could'nt get a more in-house pure design as the Mazda MX5, Its always been Mazda's shining achievment!

[@NicWir]

*Dude Is That a MX-5*

[@VELCT-Edits]

They look kinda same

[@joelhenderson4450]

Banish annoying background music. Be more like Matt Watson.

[@therealpinkyskull]

No stick shift on the Supra😐 PATHETIC! ❤️Mazda❤️

[@danielthomas2621]

Well below parr review, the lack of knowledge on the fiat/ Mazda collaboration was just unresearched and lazy IMO, mx5 is an icon the supra is a fake and like all supras overrated junk , no competition not even in the same class as a sports car... Disappointing review

[@JMB1891]

For an expert car journalist and car reviewer this guy appears to not know what he’s talking about lol.

[@mikuelable]

Mx5 all day ...very never a Toyota fan ...decent products .....but zoom zoom bye

[@descarroll2039]

Nice BMW copy by toyota....

[@md7999]

The MX5 is totally MAZDA, thankfully with no input, other than financial, from FIAT! Unfortunately the Supra is a BMW, it is just wearing Toyota clothes! So I’m not sure the word “collaboration” covers this video..........

[@rossrreyes]

My God that Supra is one ugly car.