I Bought a RUINED Piece of Gibson History | 1978 Gibson "The SG" Original Prototype

[@Trog]

What is the coolest vintage prototype that you've seen? ❓Private Help Sessions: troglysguitarshow.com/help-appraisals/ 🟢My Website: www.troglysguitarshow.com 🔴Reverb: reverb.com/shop/troglys?_aid=growsumo&gs_partner=Trogly

[@jeromestevenfaigin6059]

Luthier are like happy kids and they want to showoff their skills, I like the Canadian Luthier he could blend the block to close to it's color.

[@clarkbabin9799]

Was thinking that you could fill that area in by the bridge and do your own ebony block. And then you said it. Just looked up the Songbird museum and its definitely a destination I'd like to make. But don't know why they are in Chattanooga instead of Nashville or Kalamazoo.

[@clarkbabin9799]

Most of them after market Kahlers and other trem systems I've seen were always set up to deep. Compared with a guitar that it was installed at the factory you can see the difference in height.

[@mattyburrows9059]

Slashes..must be good coz Gibson sell copies of his copy

[@mattyburrows9059]

​@@jeromestevenfaigin6059 so why hasn't the luthier fixed the same problems they've had for decades..angle on the headstock.make it less.the weak neck.multi laminate it and have it straight through like a bass

[@mykehutchings]

Who would’ve thought that somebody would take a guitar that sounds and plays amazingly well and actually play it - making it into the tool that they needed to express themselves…

[@larrydj549]

Hes a collector. He just wants to take them all and lock them away forever😂😂😂

[@emdeel5709]

@@larrydj549 or sell them on with a massive profit and drive up the price with hype

[@seanwoodburn2616]

A lot of us were looking at those guitars as kids trying to get that first Les Paul. Keep in mind that the $200.00 difference now is nearly $1000.00, so it was a fairly significant difference for the target market. The Les Paul Standard listed at $749.00 The Paul listed at 529.00 so for a kid it was definitely more approachable. A very cool slice of history.

[@frankwebster9110]

Back when you could get a pack of smokes and a gallon of gas for just under 2 bucks...

[@timscarrow9151]

Got my LP in '82 used for 675.00. Got rid of a KILLER SG custom to get it though. Thank you Dad, I miss you.

[@peejay6930]

It wasn't a "crazy modifier" it was a "guitar player" 🙂

[@vmann-jd5yw]

Agreed, not "some bonehead". It was a cheap Gibson at the time and not a "piece of history" The real boneheads are the idiots who spend half a million dollars for a guitar when anyone can spend one percent of that for superior playing instrument with finish that doesn't fade or crack and a headstock that won't break if we look at it incorrectly.

[@russellmorgan5611]

Is it just me or did anyone else notice, the trem didn't actually affect the performance of the guitar despite the criticisms ?

[@stewartross13]

@@vmann-jd5ywTrogly continuing to boot lick Gibson into oblivion and calling players and people who make player-friendly modifications “ruining” and “crazy modifiers”

[@jsnowdendavies]

@@russellmorgan5611there were always stories of 80's trems sucking tone - this one sounded just fine and it seemed to do all the whammy dives and soars just like it should. I'd love an SG with a stud-mount Kahler!

[@ChrisEck13]

​@vmann0207 The real boneheads are the ones that care about how much others spend on guitars or what guitars others have.

[@WackyT08]

Not ruined. It's a working person's guitar, not a "garage queen". If only it could tell it's stories.

[@acoffeewithsatan]

Yeah, this wouldn’t have been a particularly valuable nor sought after model for quite some time, more of an affordable guitar of the time. Its player enjoyed it but thought it lacked some extra features and so it was more reasonable to have it modded than sold to fund another purchase.

[@derangedhermit2879]

It has a misaligned Khaler bridge improperly installed, to where it’s fully bottomed out with jacked up high action, it’s basically ruined as a workhorse main guitar, at best it could be relegated to a slide guitar with its high action…8)

[@jonathanhudak2059]

WackyT08 but whoever installed it did a hack job of it so in a sense they did kind of ruin it

[@brunswicksquaremusic5905]

People who work don’t want trash guitars either.

[@matthewajello1299]

I’m so sick of collectors like you shaming guys who modify bottom of the barrel guitars to suit their needs, guitars are meant to be played especially inexpensive ones like a the Paul or the sg, guitars are like people, they have stories and history and scars, they reflect their player. it’s not destroyed cuz someone put a kahler on it, just love it and play it as is and don’t hold a grudge against the guy who had it modified

[@jonathanhudak2059]

Its only because its rarity as a PROTOTYPE

[@WilliamHaisch]

You could fill the hole and route the top with a center channel, inlay a strip of figured maple so it looks like an *inverse spotlight special* 😂

[@brandonjackson5865]

I actually think the Kahler looks pretty cool on it, I’d leave it alone and play it. It’s already a player anyway. I don’t think anything unless you wanted to paint it , filling it wouldn’t look as cool as the Kahler in my opinion. I normally don’t like SGs but that one is pretty awesome looking to me.

[@timscarrow9151]

They just don't play or intonate well, Mine is filled a has a Bigsby now.

[@brandonjackson5865]

@@timscarrow9151 I’ve never fooled with a Kahler much but I’d imagine a bigsby would be a whole different kind of nightmare for me. I have really heavy hands and probably couldn’t keep one in tune even if I didn’t touch the bar.

[@timscarrow9151]

@@brandonjackson5865 I had to replace a falling bridge, and raised the bigsby off the body to decrease the angle, it works better than I thought, I also am ham-fisted.

[@brandonjackson5865]

@@timscarrow9151 cool yeah I guess with the right angle across the bridge and good bridge slots and a nice nut a bigsby could probably be about as stable as any other non locking tremolo and they look really cool on some guitars too . Surprisingly I really love the way that flying Vs look with bigsbys on them. About the only trem I’ve ever had luck with is my old RG550 with an edge lo pro on it and as long as it’s set up correctly it’s rock solid reliable, I’ve been messing with a Wilkinson fender style trem I put on my Baretta special I got because I always wanted a single PU super Strat and even though I’ve got locking gotoh tuners and a graph tech nut my high e string won’t return to pitch and I see all these guys on you tube able to get theirs with supposedly stock hardware to return to pitch every time, but I think they all have to dump the bar or pull up to reset their standard trems to return to pitch. I’m stubborn and if they can do it why can’t I lol ? Even though I rarely use a bar except for just messing around anyway. I’m mechanical minded and can look at the parts and think ok this should all work but it doesn’t always and it can drive me mad if I let it. The older I get the more picky I am about intonation and fret buzzes and rattles , stuff that used to not bother me a lot, really annoys me being just a little off. You know ? Get off my lawn so I can yell at the clouds and shit ? I’ve always thought Kahlers looked cool on certain guitars too like the bigsby in a steam punk kinda way, I want to try something with an ever tune but I haven’t had the chance yet it sounds like it would solve most of my annoyances but I think evertunes are ugly so who knows, guitarists we’re a fickle picky bunch

[@watchtheskies]

The surface mounted Kerry King signature Kahler solved all of the issues that I had with earlier Kahlers, Kerry must have requested a lot of changes for his signature model, it is so much better engineered than other Kahlers

[@dougwilson8489]

Personally I love kahlers, I think that they are better and easier to install than a floyd rose. I don't get why everyone hates them.

[@crilf5830]

Lack of intelligence doesn’t help. Kahler made/makes great products. I would prefer a proper install or the guitar to be made with a Kahler flat mount in mind. Les Pauls should never have a Floyd but I’ll accept a Kahler.

[@leokrissandy5579]

definitely not ruined, just a guitar player mod it to suits his needs

[@justin3947]

I’ve modified my guitars doesn’t mean they’re ruined it means they’re mine.

[@ICantStopMakingNoise]

Before I knew anything about guitars - before I even really knew how to play - my first guitar was a 1979 "The SG". One of my uncles had left it in his childhood bedroom at my grandparents' house for decades, and my grandfather just let me have it one day. I owned it for about a year before I had to give it back to avoid family drama, and I've been telling myself I should get another, for years. Anyway, I was stoked to see you cover this one.

[@wesleyalan9179]

Dang, would've been cool if you could've kept it😑

[@greendaykerplunk]

@@wesleyalan9179 probably was cooler not fighting with his family lol

[@wesleyalan9179]

@@greendaykerplunk I'm sure that's a fact,lol😄

[@jonathanhudak2059]

Cool story too bad they just didn't let you keep it

[@tristanm-v7b]

@@greendaykerplunk guitar wont leave you family will

[@frankwebster9110]

The ebony block with some cool inlay wood be a perfect way to restore some dignity to that old rocker. I love the sounds of it!

[@Buffrt66]

You have to remember these were the budget guitar when they were new. Some people bought them to build their own model. That is fun you know?

[@alfsmith4936]

No.. Fun is buying guitars from desperate Reverb sellers, making the same video as last week and selling them to KZbin fans.

[@theabguitarshow1747]

I had the chance to buy this exact guitar down near Philly and the seller never messaged me back on marketplace. We came to a price, figured out a meeting time and then when I messaged him that I was on my way, NOTHING! This stings to watch this one. Could’ve had it for $500!!

[@jameshughes6049]

Evening all!! I just ordered a Gibson SG Standard in Heritage Cherry today. My first SG!! It'll be here tomorrow.

[@raytorvalds3699]

Congrats! That is very exciting!

[@jameshughes6049]

@@raytorvalds3699 Thank you.

[@jonathanhudak2059]

Howdy James congratulations!! 👏 my 94' SG Standard in heritage cherry was my first "good" electric guitar and my first Gibson, love it and still have it 29 years later. Enjoy your new axe!

[@alexandriashannon7438]

Take it to a luthier, they can do wonders with filling the hole putting it back.

[@gregj.gotham4402]

A dear friend now gone purchased a Firebrand Les Paul burned in Gibson headstock plus the chainsaw case. Man I loved that guitar of his, he paid a total of 480.00 used plus tax in 1983-84 the guitar was made in 1982.

[@jcwoodstl]

$480 in 1983 adjusted for inflation is $1,515.86 in 2024 money. That was a lot for a used entry-level Gibson at the time.

[@strat0871]

I like it, even with a Kahler, which is a good system, except for the garbage locking nut. Sounds good too.

[@chip9177]

You have to leave it as it is. It is telling a story. Trying to hide the mods would almost seem like a lie.

[@borasmussen4794]

I absolutely love my 79’ The SG! Now I know what the holes in the headstock were from lol! Someone had a locking mechanism above the nut. Mine still has factory pickups and electronics and tuners. I had to replace the bridge and tailpiece with a klusson harmonica bridge and tailpiece. Awesome guitars!!!

[@justanish6966]

I actually ENJOY the floating trem on this... keeps it in tune also.

[@hardac7943]

I would leave it be as someone who mods an change things it was someone's pride and joy. As it will end up in a display case it shows the history of players too. Even if it wasn't done the best it tells the best story as is.

[@jaydenstramel562]

Throw an evertune on it and just use it as a player

[@jonlennon3348]

The neck is walnut but it is quarter sawn to expose different grain.

[@therabbitcanada]

I've filled in routes like that no problem. Flush off the edges straight, route out the small area bigger to make it totally square, bring the guitar with me to wood dealer, match it then cut, glue etc

[@Shiznitt_]

Walnut has some of the nicest wood grain. The kahler should stay/upgraded as part of its history.

[@stevengrimes8737]

One of my big gear regrets was trading off my 1983 "The SG" in Electric Blue. I saw it again about 12 years later, and the next owner abused it terribly. The headstock had been broken and poorly repaired, and the body was severely cracking on both side of the neck joint. i plugged it in , and it still sounded amazing, but it was so sad to see the condition it was in.

[@harrisonandrew]

Just after I left school in the late 1970’s, I worked in a music store selling guitars. I always thought that the Gibson guitars like The SG, The Paul and those bolt-on’s you showed were complete planks. I hated them. I was fine with the Gibson Les Pauls and Semi-Acoustics - they were playable. However I felt the Japanese guitars always came in set up way better and were the ones I’d pick up to play when the store was quiet. Obviously I was young and inexperienced but I knew what I liked. Having said that, I bought a Fender Stratocaster and a 25/50 Les Paul (Ebony) from the wages I earned at that store.

[@alraymond1618]

I was alive in 1978 when the Paul was issued, and it was the bottom of the barrel. And it still is. Let's not over romanticize it.

[@Steve.Cutler]

Agreed, same with all the student level instruments from all the brands back in the day.

[@Crinkle65]

I’ve had mine since it was new in 1978. My first guitar. Loved it then. Love it now.

[@j.b.l.tones33]

Boo.

[@danieljaymeshansel5086]

It’s a modern romanticizing because it’s the closest younger folks can get to a vintage Gibson. Hell, I remember back in 2014 these were still pretty dirt cheap because no one really cared about guitars until after the pandemic

[@chadwcmichael]

I’ve painted wood grain before. If it were my guitar and it was time and money, I’d be ok tackling that…but it isn’t so I won’t. There are all kinds of tips and tricks though, it wouldn’t be that hard to fake it to “factory”.

[@zoinkiezz]

The kahler may be helping to counteract some neck-dive

[@mangaaxis]

I can see why you could think it's mahogany, but if the camera is showing right, that's totally a walnut neck.

[@metalextras]

Perhaps that Kahler block make it sounds even more heavy!

[@chuckburns9900]

What would it look like under black light?

[@rindred]

If you decide to get that ebony block inserted to fill that gap, get them to model the SG block you showed in the video, and have a MOP inlay that says "The SG" like the severed truss rod cover. Then you could a shim for the nut rout in the headstock and just put a period-correct SG cover on it, since you'll have the name on the body.

[@chrisghiardi117]

Sounds great especially considering the mod. You could pull the behind the nut lock for locking Grovers. The key with Kahlers was keeping the roller saddles clean and moving and enough down pressure on those saddles. Also the many adjustments could be a mystery.

[@shfla7293]

$500 in 1978 is equivalent to about $2,307.06 today… so much for a “budget” guitar

[@SteveOuimette]

My first "real" guitar was a Gibson "The SG". Fantastic guitar for a first guitar but I'm not too sure I'd feel the same about it today. Would love to try one again to see.

[@jonlennon3348]

I think if you refinished it a good luthier could mat a piece of walnut to fill the hole and he could make the screw holes on the head stock.The older fella at stew mac could do it.

[@timscarrow9151]

From firsthand experience, Kahler craze was 1983, the output jack is a replacement, and the neck wear looks right, I have worn mine that much twice now.Mine also has nice fretboard gouges from wear .

[@stewsim]

Adjust the little screws beneath the levers for proper locking…

[@robertwittjr1198]

yes it would be hard to match the wood, but it could be done. stewmac channel - Patching a Big Hole in a ’53 Telecaster; an apprentice went after it with a dull beaver to install a bigsby vibrato...dan did an awsome job making it "normal" again. great find.

[@Wargasm54]

I don’t get the kahler hate? Kahlers are cool. And they lock to hardtails if you don’t want to use the whammy.

[@ringsystemmusic]

It’s more the “modification of a guitar nerds on the internet deem important” with this episode.

[@kollabrock]

I own a -79 "The SG" that the previous owner bought new (1979). I got it maybe 1995, the pickups had been replaced at some point and the frets were totally worn out, so I had it refretted the following year+a new nut. When Gibson released the Burstbucker-pups I put a #3 in the bridge and a #2 in the neck, and I still play it just like that in 2023. It sounds great and actually stays in tune as well, a real no-nonsense workhorse of an instrument

[@johnnyennis9864]

It was clearly a player's guitar and they never intended it to be a "collector piece". The modifications show this was likely completed in the hotrod era, and fit what was common at the time. I think it's an excellent representation of guitar culture at the time, and it shows how guitars are tools for a lot of musicians, and not meant to be in museums.

[@meining-mech4378]

Always enjoy SG type guitars. The ebony block idea sounds like it would work out nicely for hiding that awful pit for the Khaler.

[@thebuck1152]

Twoodfrd could probably do the kahler delete. He does some amazing repairs on his channel! The best headstock repairs I've seen

[@brucejoaniewilliams3213]

Agreed, Ted does THE BEST guitar repair I have ever seen. His approach is thoughtful, his skills are amazing. And his history lessons and commentary make it all come together quite nicely. Check it out all of you!

[@thebuck1152]

@@brucejoaniewilliams3213 right! His old world skills and knowledge are mesmerizing to see in action

[@robempire]

You should look up an acquaintance of mine named Dave petillo in new jersey. One of the best Luthiers in the game. Dude is a wizard when it comes to guitar repairs. Check him out for sure if needing any major guitar repairs. He may be able to actually hide that cut out on the bridge.

[@roopher2]

I have one of these that I bought new in '79. It's completely stock but mine has the wide harmonica style bridge.

[@joermnyc]

The Output jacks on the production run are “deep panel” jacks. It’s a smaller hole than any other jack, so that might have been a cost saving choice.

[@petercappiello8192]

The Firebrands were junk guitars.I sold them when they were new.Parents bought them for their kids for Christmas.We even got asked if we could paint them.

[@brian770]

wish they would have kept the jack on the side like this one, its the only reason i never bought a SG, hate the front jack look.

[@jimilee459]

I love that series. I have a 79 The Paul that’s still one of my go to guitars.

[@HelterSkelter199]

I would have the hole filled, repairing a kahler route in an SG is well inside most good luthiers wheel houses. If it were me I'd just do an honest repair, neither mix/matching woods or "faking" a invisible repair.

[@viperBSG]

send it to StewMac! They'd fill in the Gouge and look almost original.

[@jonm1544]

Everyone says that the zebra The SG bridge pickup is a T-Top but I believe it’s a Velvet Brick. If you A/B it against a T-Top, it’s not the same. The Velvet brick is still a great pickup but it sounds more compressed to my ear. Open to other opinions.

[@jasonwaltrowski2315]

Just think if someone put a Floyd on it, the guitar would have a nice big route in the back as well

[@loudguitars69]

What is so wrong with Khaler trees? I had one on a Aria Pro II RS Knight Warior and loved it!!!

[@jaklcide]

Kahler FTW

[@reno145]

That is far from ruined. Lose the locking nut, throw on some locking tuners, set it up and rock on. Just lose the trem arm.

[@Xaltar_]

Easy enough to restore, a nice well matched chunk of walnut and a competent luthier could bring it back to stock with minimal evidence of it's alterations. I only say this because it's a prototype, otherwise I would leave it be as part of it's history. I miss the days when something like this (non prototype) could be had for next to nothing and actually be enjoyed by players rather than be over priced collector fodder. Guitars I used to see sell for $400 - $600 now sell for anywhere up to 10x that.

[@houseomiller]

A really good luthier like Dan Erlewine over at StewMac, which is pretty near you, can make those patches in such a way that it's nearly invisible, especially under the bridge and tailpiece, and under the truss rod cover. As the honest seller that you are, I don't think it would bring back any lost value, but it would look a helluva lot better.

[@JohnnyZnuff1]

Restore it!

[@Gordanovich02]

I think I'd be tempted to try and wedge the Kahler and just use it as a fine tuning fixed bridge. Ditch the Rube Goldberg locknut and source a new trussrod cover.

[@TM-ev2tc]

You need to check out Neil Young's guitar Old Black. A 53 Les Paul Gold Top that has been painted black.

[@jeromestevenfaigin6059]

All that is not hard to fix pretty close depending on the Luthier you can trust.

[@RoboSteave]

I love the walnut look and it sounds great. If I were you, I'd leave it alone and enjoy it for what it is.

[@jeromestevenfaigin6059]

Again - this can be restored to a point maybe a line will show the lose pin is a dowl incert and recorded to set the pin tied.

[@steveparish9210]

Can't the Kahler trem be removed and brought back to stock speck?

[@user-ql1pc7pi9x]

Really good pickups. They had a nice bite to them.

[@Eric_S]

I died a little bit inside when I saw the truss rod cover cut off. I would set the Kahler lower into the body if possible. This video sounds great and the Kahler might be contributing positively. Try it with a set up with a proper new nut and set up. If you want to do a 70s freaky thing, do a brass nut and a Leo Quan bridge. I like the idea of an ebony rout-fill.

[@leahcaudill6559]

I bought,a LPJ for 600. No binding, just basic wood, it's a 2013. The good thing about it,is it's got the 490&498 pup's

[@doomgoon2755]

id laminate walnut and ebony ,hit it with the router all the way up too the neck tendon and place the laminated strip in , route for pickups also filling the hole and run the og bridge setup. neck through ish..

[@Maxreverse]

Sounds awesome. Great find.

[@leviathan_is_me]

When I watch The Trogly's Guitar Show, I drink COFFFFFFFEEEEEEE!!!!!!!🤘

[@wadeguidry6675]

I like the grungy parts guitar aesthetic. Leave it be.

[@christophercarty675]

Send the guitar to StewMac. They’ll fix it up.

[@christophercarty675]

@stewmac

[@jw_au]

Great idea with the ebony block

[@bigsbyfreak]

I used to have an even stranger, 77 standard, ebony bound fingerboard, walnut body...

[@brycebryson9657]

Would be dope to rout like a small bit out of the top to form a line from bridge pickup to the rear. Then put wood veneer/piece in to make it look like a racing stripe or something

[@jimmyjames2022]

Nice find, the walnut SG prototype looks very sweet! Despite the questionable trem installation. Where is the neck tenon, I couldn't see it? Back of that neck looks sanded to me.

[@tonyy.8852]

What's wrong with kahler tho? Yes it does have a bad reputation, but still quite a lot of artists use it

[@Trog]

The vintage ones just aren't that good... I've had a modern kahler that was pretty nice though

[@Kahuna54]

There’s a fantastic luthier I can recommend, it’s Rosa String Works, you can see his KZbin podcasts also.

[@tobydavis6770]

So to put the price into perspective, my parents bought an acre of land here in southern middle Tennessee in 1972 for $500.00. Same property today sales for $4500.00 an acre. So could you imagine paying $4500.00 today for a MID TEAR Gibson???

[@lunchb0x1986]

Lol good to know gibson has always over priced.

[@che2335]

❤ the Kahler

[@Dokkensound]

I had a late '70's SG standard in the brown finish. I did some extreme string bending and added a cam lock nut like that with a tp6 tail piece. I just put the truss cover in the case. Didn't consider it ruined and never planned to sell it. Ended up being stolen or I'd still be playing it.

[@cuda426hemi]

Note the horns are hardly beveled at all - almost as flat as the no bevel '72-3 "Deluxe" SG w/2 scratch plates and embossed 'Gibson' chrome 'buckers and Bigsby. 🎸

[@danielbreaux1842]

Hey, Joe!! They have your old guitar on Troglys!!

[@alienb8]

I think you should restore it like Dan Erlewine's video on the 53 telecaster where he plugged the hole. The original bridge and tail pice will help hide the repair.

[@CJMacNeil]

Wow! This thing rips! Very cool guitar 🤘🏻

[@DeadSpectre22]

hand it over to JW restoration! I like the idea of putting an ebony block in the body. it would match the fretboard!

[@zeusapollo8688]

I think you could fill that hole and even if it was not perfect it would be very hard to see under the strings

[@jonnyhafer7376]

my band mate the one who traded you the original silverburst for the r9 has a super clean the sg he swapped the pickups but still has the t tops. when we played in a differnet band 20 years ago he had he SG and I had The Paul

[@barrygoins5429]

Matthew Scott's Luther put the goodwill les paul back trog you should get in touch with him . I bet he would shock you with repair he's capable of

[@bengalster7127]

I have a 1981 or 82 "Deluxe". It was the first "good" guitar I ever had and I still LOVE it! Even though mine does unfortunately not have the original pickups any more. But that was something I just didn't know or care anything about, when I bought it as a teenager.

[@patrickkem689]

That actually is not a bad idea. Covering the gaping hole with a piece of walnut and return it to a Stop tail piece. Beautiful piece,thanks .

[@jsnowdendavies]

I can't say it is not a shame it was shabbily done, especially the TRC. Yeah it is a prototype...but is it any more ruined than Tony Iommi's Monkey SG, or Frank Marino's 3 single coils SG? Or Old Black? Prototypes are for testing and the tar says it's been out in the field and not a case-queen! Maybe the player wasn't a worldwide legend but they made it "their guitar" just like the others I mentioned :)

[@supedersen]

Drop the intro, please !!!