Zero Countersteer Drift: is it ACTUALLY Faster?

[@ThatSlowBRZZ]

"Its a preference of most to have controlled oversteer, than it be a surprise" finally someone understands and puts it into words!!

[@AdamKueflef]

I agree. Especially in winter with snow and ice i find its easier to control slides then to avoid them all together. Controlled Chaos is Easier then uncontrolled normality

[@stutterpunk9573]

This is me whoever ANYONE fans on porches handling. Yeah it's great until you say hi to the local oak tree

[@ThatSlowBRZZ]

@@stutterpunk9573 hahahaha I agree, but some Porsches can get sideways and pull out if you got the skill for it

[@Blackwing2345635]

But most importantly - zero-counterstering drift feels sooo right, when you have a clean corner exist on straight wheels xD Also it "felt right" to me only on dirt with powerful cars, on tarmac it feels slow (and usually after pulling this you see new rears in front of you), while someting that is not overpowered, well, lacks power to pull out fast enough.

[@aninnocent1544]

slow tarmac corners are fine (as we also see on the vid) because you do have the power to pull out on lower gears, but yeah, anything fast is better taken normally. also that's what we see in WRC, they drift slow corners and take fast ones normally. They're also on tight roads where slow corners are abundant, so that's why it happens a lot

[@mc_redspace]

I have seen a lot of "Grip vs Drift" videos and... I am still waiting to see a video where they add "vs Both" A technique where you mainly grip but also drift in some corners because it could give you an advantage This is the first video I've seen that came close to it and it taught me stuff, thank you very much

[@jorisramanauskas780]

His channel should have something like that, I believe.

[@WizNick1532]

Drip?

[@BlasterJunos]

Unless you're planning on time attack, Grip would almost always be the way to go. Not only does it use more of the tire for carrying you through the corner and accelerating, you also don't kill the tires after the first lap. Tire management is crucial in racing, which is why you don't see intentional drifts in tarmac racing

[@somedudenameddes0121]

Watch the slip angle video

[@Delimon007]

That's called using slip angle. . . It's already a thing that all top drivers use. . .

[@logiarplayz9029]

The problem with this entire concept is the terminology itself. A drift by definition is causing oversteer at the entrance of a corner. What the drift car was shown doing is drifting into the corner, but powersliding out of the exit of the corner. If you watch the test with the two consecutive hairpins, you can see that the drift car won because it was actually gripping up well before the exits of the corner, allowing the advantage of higher entry speeds, and being pointed towards the apex sooner. Once you have the car pointed towards the apex, its up to your car control to decide if you're going to slowly powerslide out of the corner, or regain grip as soon as possible for maximum acceleration out of the corner.

[@Kodunkion]

This is how I always imagined it, drifting carries consistent momentum which makes it the best in low speed corners, whereas grip driving needs braking initially but because of that it slowly builds up momentum past the apex and zooms out

[@languaj]

He’s back! Btw… a video on managing tire temps/durability for the duration of a race would be interesting

[@TheAndrewlolz]

Your commentary during 5:53 The Race is immersive af. A lot more thrilling than real life F1 commentators 😂 but great video! Really informative 👍🏻

[@crimsonkoyori8054]

fire video. subscribed, liked, commented, clicked the bell, shared it to my family, played it at my grandma's funeral (she was resurrected), this video cured my stage four terminal cancer, my depression, and fixed my unrelenting habit to call shitting while constipated a souls-like experience. cant wait to see more

[@DudeMcPunchy]

Can we PLEASE see that lap again but with both grip and drift where ever it's faster?

[@iamhugry]

During a drift you go slower and go sideways which actually gives you more space to see plus you enter the corner earlier view wise and thus can see more ahead of you AND during a drift you can easier come to a standstill because all 4 tires will grip sideways the moment they stop spinning AND the car is 90% of the time in the correct angle in the corner

[@eagle_2351]

The art of rally is knowing when to drift, when to grip, and when to go flat out. Overall, grip will in most cases be better overall, but there are some situations that taking the drift will be better.

[@myr_wlk698]

What is flat out?

[@twapsgelacio]

Flooring the gas. Just zoom.​@@myr_wlk698

[@MahadShahzad08]

Bunta was such a god at driving that he for the first time test drove an AWD car and mastered Countersteer drift and maybe that was the reason Takumi got smoked... BTW great video I tried this with the Lan Evo but I still need practice 😅

[@MedievalRally]

Great video with amazing visuals to show the differences! Speaking solely from a Rally perspective. Drifting is bit like jumps. Sure they look cool and it's fun but it's not always the fastest solution depending on the stage section you're in. I found I greatly improved my times by reducing the amount of times I would drift. If I can stay in grip even in a hairpin, except really acute ones, I'll avoid drifting. As the video did a great good job at showing. There are certain situations where a drift can out perform a car that maintains grip. The real key to getting killer times is knowing when you'll benefit from a drift (a short and controlled one ideally) versus slowing down enough to maintain grip throughout the corner. I don't think there's a one size fits all advice for this. You need to be familiar with the car you're driving and how it handles on the surface you're on.

[@MigotRen]

So in essence, its a case by case decider. while in theory static grip is always higher on a solid surface than sliding, practically, the offloading of the front tires and the additional rotational momentum can help the car with tight corners.

[@thomasisready]

How ZERO COUNTERSTEER DRIFTING makes you FASTER simracing...

[@SeanQuinn4]

I think this taps into the beginnings of neutral steer and extreme trail braking. Pros do most of their cornering with the pedals, not the wheel 👍

[@LeitoAE]

This technique is usefull for some corners and powerful cars. Cars that in rwd configuration have problems with maintaining rear wheels from burnouts at corners exits. Low power cars will not benefit from 4wd systems. Also need to take into consideration grip level. Also in some corners you were overspeeding in entries causing "drift braking", so exit speed was poor. I was expecting some nice, 0 counter steer, low angle drifts, but here there was typical Subaru overspeeding to impress chicks that is mostly causing their boxer engines to die because of oil not reaching sump 😂.

[@mahuba2553]

the tighter the corner the more efficient it will be to have the car point towards the inside of the corner

[@samiraperi467]

The truth is that the absolute fastest style is grip with *just a bit* of drift due to how rubber works on tarmac. Even WRC cars drive basically grip when the tarmac is clean and dry.

[@eggdog1227]

Would love a transcript of the music used, all bangers :)

[@TheAngeryMan]

Awesome video, like always,, and congrats for 100k!

[@1SM4h]

"Zero-countersteering drift", it's mean on literature as slip angle technique. Drift use tractive effort AND lean angle, to turn the vehicle. MotoGP yesterdays, use this technique for all turns. On the past, riders like Casey Stoner, use drift to be faster. On all cases, the answer his: where had more power? On Stoner era, the Ducati had a lot of power. The V4 had a great performance on a straight line. But the higher torque, make it unstable and harder to ride, in turns. So drift around the corner, was the way who makes Stoner faster. A higher speed on the turn exit, make a higher average speed on the straight line, and a higher top speed to the next turn. On same way, old times F1, with a lot of torque, make it easier to lost control. So drift was faster. Whe we can predict what's before the next turn, like a public road, the pivot of the questions are the car, and the speed. In a low power car, in low or mid speeds, drift was faster. At high speeds, stock tires hasn't a good performance. In other words, hasn't good grip. Than, slip angle was the fastest way, because had less power loses. A high power car, had most times too, tires with high grip. In this situation, at low speed we don't need a special turn technique. The high power compensates itself on a straight line. At mid speeds, slip angle was faster. Not much loses, and a lot of reserve power. At high speeds, drift was faster, because we have power, so drift losses are insignificantly. A low power car vs a high power car, the maximum possible speed, defined the winner. On dirt, ice, snow, gravel, and other low grip situations, high or low power, slow or fast, don't change so much the needed techniques. The poor road prediction, and low grip, make the drift faster on average situations. But how less power, grip was faster. Less losses, more power to accelerate the vehicle. So low power cars, drift on rally, but not ever.

[@KayoMichiels]

0:31 Was that the Windows 95 boot up tune i heard in the background?

[@bigdbandit64]

Try this again with a higher horse power car and the drift might benefit more from the power increase

[@Tishan01]

How do I slide In a corner? Whenever I go in a corner my car comes out of it and in the gaurdrail

[@TSRB]

Could be a number of things. Depends on what exactly is happening. You mean the car suddenly snaps, and turns into the guard rail? Probably turning the wheel too much

[@Tishan01]

@@TSRB imagine the car going into the apex but instead of going around the corner it goes to the opposite side of the lane and into the gaurdrail

[@TSRB]

Maybe a lower entry speed and less throttle. Sounds like you're going in too fast and just slamming on the throttle, meaning you have almost no grip

[@Tishan01]

@@TSRB it worked. Lower the speed worked, I held down the brake for like 4 seconds, release and they I went flying through the corner. Thanks. I am a subscriber too thanks

[@casperSQ]

Cheers for the 100k!

[@okamesnt]

this video just got there when the issued pop'd out, I am in a difficult decision of full grip or using both zero countersteer drift and grip, it's an r34 at touge, I used to main zero countersteer drift but, just noticed that grip seems faster, I was never really sure tho, now I am trying to go full grip, but grip is really a challenge after years of only zero countersteer drift, I am still not sure what should I go with

[@KitsuneYTZ]

So, you need to alternate them Drift at hairpins but in normal corners,Grip

[@jammyhorizon1771]

I like to think i do something similar to this in karting. Kind of a mesh between this and slip angle, even thougn the karts aint 4wd.

[@michaelgoldberg4000]

Uh, add more power to accelerate better out of faster corners?

[@nic1586]

what about drifting the hairpins and grip the rest

[@MakhnoDripGod]

good video but why only AWD and only on a track instead of a touge or something? not saying you're wrong, but I probably would have included more variables like rear wheel drive, driving on a touge, the skill of the gripper vs the skill of the drifter etc

[@kltsoi5860]

Is there any help by the AYC system on a Lancer Evo when doing the zero-countersteer? Saw it being done on Best Motoring a few times on Dunlop corner/ last corner and the exit speed seems not much different to others

[@martixak]

Congrats for 100k 🎉🎉🎉 :linushappy:

[@TSRB]

Thanks bro

[@skinderbeg]

Please tell me on which track the tests were carried out?

[@Fujjinn1977]

How do i stop spinning out after trying todo this in assetto corsa

[@slippery_penguin86]

hey great video! What track is this it looks really fun

[@themetabaron8722]

What about with more hp, like Group B? Also, isn't the grip car in the race an STI and the drift car not an STI?

[@TSRB]

Same car, just exterior mods that don't affect performance

[@realsimpilot8221]

Less steering is ALWAYS faster!!!!

[@mgtowphilippines8164]

Sondoing this on a touge and not a endurance race will be faster?

[@KiWii69]

Wait thats why I suck at WRC 4🤯. I ALWAYS Countersteer😅

[@acethemain7776]

hey wheres the video of you going to a car meet in ur bmw z4?

[@ElShotte]

Drifting != Power Slide.

[@thefirstoffence9048]

my issues with this is that the debate will only be settled by a real-life Takumi. his driving was not as good on drift. the main reason Takumi was faster was because he was on the perfect grip line with zero counter steer drifting.

[@АртемВинокуров-ж9й]

how to find this drift subaru?????? Basic 22b cant even drift properly. Where is the link?? Impreza GC8 Subetin & Me9u doesnt give anything from discord server

[@onetonpun]

4wd cars tend to be front heavy and under steer horribly. Drifting is kinda necessary, and easier to control than rwd.

[@B0XMATTER]

nice controller

[@RandomGuy37]

It really depends on the corner which style is actually faster. I usually only drift through hairpins and any other corners where gripping is way slower. So most of the times grip is faster with certain exceptions.

[@camrongoodall]

What if the corner is at a 45° decline?

[@TSRB]

Still not good for the tyres

[@Finnjaymakes]

I make Race Cars 🗿🍷

[@ElGanchoMino]

basically, you need to know the track, and know the right technique depending on the corner, not just sticking to one technique that isn't beneficial on some part of track

[@maxc300es]

Try a race on sharp corners not an actual track

[@Ladyoftheroundtable]

What do you mean all wheel drive is slower than two wheel? Historically its always been the opposite

[@kondi585]

i know bro

[@prartmusic]

THIS IS REAL.

[@hf117j]

Tbh it looked like there was a lot less skill from the drift car in the head to head than the demonstrations. I feel like it could've won if it wasn't constantly leaving the track and failing to follow good lines

[@TSRB]

Tyres were overheating

[@xXPumpkinPvPTutsXx]

anyone know the map name for the one with the cones that are shaped like hairpins?

[@AxtrodoSulfur]

100k what a journey!!,🎉

[@rastaboy_gamesnstuff7778]

Zero countersteer drift is even faster in rwd

[@FabianHumaJava1]

Make Roblox video again in midnight racing tokyo use evo 6

[@krisztianpap4421]

2:41 why the fuck is Initial D available in the UK but not here

[@TSRB]

Sounds like you need Surfshark VPN

[@krisztianpap4421]

Yeah sounds like it

[@terrythegoblin8745]

this is close but its still way off, try again tsrb. to be exact the only time you use any sort of drift is in a low grip environment period. as a rally driver with a lot of seat time ive raced tarmac rally a fair few times and you dont drift. if its a tight hairpin we do "drift" but its really just a 90 degree skid to point at the exit quicker if you do this you will lose time overall. you might be faster in a single corner but it wont matter in the end to any new drivers that are looking to get better, leave. your lost, if you have questions find someone who has been racing for a while most people will help you and answer your questions.

[@ArchOfficial]

It's not the low grip that makes it viable, but the material properties of the surface which makes the ideal slipcurve to peak fairly high and be more or less flat after the peak. Some stone surfaces, gravel, snow etc. all have curves like this, especially the loose surfaces which have additional factors to them. You're basically not losing very much if at all tire performance, but the car can be rotated and accelerated earlier, at the cost of tire heat and wear. If the track is slow enough, the tire heat might be a positive if the tires are on-average closer to their optimal temperatures, instead of being cold in the corner entry and mid-corner. If you tried it on "tarmac, but half the grip" it wouldn't work terribly well and you'd need to balance around the slipratio peak. You can try it in a sim by reducing the tarmac grip.

[@BluestOyunda]

bro thats nfs drift lmao

[@Arlojmikk]

they dont even drift all the time in initial d!

[@raptorjeezus2607]

theres better impreza mods out there

[@ArmanKhaider]

You are a poor driver

[@XiseTK]

lol awd is inherently faster than any other drivetrain around a track, all the advantages and none of the weakness except for a bit of added weight.

[@TSRB]

False

[@basdewildt7973]

You're coping

[@Riddick_TTC]

EVO III fanboy here, it always faster.

[@BM-13_KATYUSHA]

You can use it as a last second failsafe. When you fail to brake on time just scandi-flick and pray to the spirit of Collin McRae to keep you safe from the wall 🙏

[@powerpaul1423]

The description of emergency-brake

[@Sosa3mg]

Congratulations for 100k subs! 🎉🎉🥳🥳

[@TSRB]

Thank you!

[@DrR1pper]

The drift method produces more total cornering force from the car but a much larger percentage of that larger cornering force vector is pointing rearwards versus grip method (i.e. less drift method which is less yaw-angle), adding significant drag to the car and the engine does not have the power to overcome this additional drag in anything faster than slow speed hairpin corners and so it is slower on average.

[@oppoaction]

Your engine doesn’t need as much power if you set the rear to slide off power.

[@Appletank8]

@@oppoaction If your rears are sliding, then you are going to have less power available to power out of the corner.

[@nade5557]

Hate to be that guy but tyres actually provide less grip/force once you reach a certain angle. If you are drifting, the tyres are already past that limit, so this produces less total force compared to standard cornering. The reason why it's faster in hairpin corners is because the limiting factor for those isn't grip (like regular corners) but yaw rate, aka how fast you can rotate the car to face the exit, so drifting will get the nose pointed towards the exit a lot sooner at the expense of maximum grip, which becomes better as a tradeoff the sharper the corner.

[@las10plagas]

you just didn't do it right, duh! and if you gave the drift car blue paint and bronce wheels, drift would have won!

[@finnbauch2909]

the best is the mix of both

[@hexhiaa]

lots of cope in the comments here lmao

[@OgamiItto70]

This all depends on what is meant by "drifting." Since about the early-to-mid 2000's, "drifting" has come to mean what was previously known as "powersliding." In the parlance of racing drivers _before_ the advent of _The Fast and the Furious_ and "drifting" events, it meant driving a car through corners with all four tires at the slip angle of maximum cornering/accelerating/braking grip. This was called a "four-wheel drift." And for most of that time, the racing tires available were bias-ply, which necessitates a larger slip angle for maximum grip than radials. So drift was often noticeable to spectators and movie/TV cameras, if you were looking for it. In practice, if you four-wheel-drift your car through a corner _right on_ the maximum-grip slip angle, yes, you should be getting through that corner the fastest your car can, assuming you used the correct racing line and entry speed. If, however, you just pitch the thing in sideways, sliding _way_ past the proper slip angle, you're just going to slow yourself down and burn up your tires in the process. Remember to consider that generating maximum cornering grip entails getting all the _tires_ at the maximum-grip slip angle, not necessarily holding the steering wheel straight ahead. The question was, "Zero Countersteer Drift: is it ACTUALLY Faster?" The answer to that is, "It might be, but not necessarily." The real answer you're looking for as a racer or sim racer is, _"Four-wheel_ drifting, done correctly, _is_ actually faster." (Rare exceptions not usually found on roadracing tracks might include special situations like turns so tight that "bootlegger J's" or "handbrake turns" are required to negotiate them.)

[@intensedabberoniJG]

Thank you for your comment.

[@pistonfury]

It's not about the weight as much as it is about that it is front engined, a Gallardo would be slow 4 wheel drifting. It's all about rotating around the engine.

[@impreza0109]

to add to the "rally drivers slide because it's safer and easier to control", this was also prevalent in the 86 vs 86 final battle in initial D. Shinji was so used to the course that he can practically "see" the other end of the corner being blocked in view by the grass and trees and can actually grip out of the corners, whilst Takumi had a hard time keeping up with him at the start.

[@dawidnabozny1437]

These videos must take so much work to get done

[@TSRB]

Too much 😅

[@SSZaris]

Awesome video :) The trick is to live in between the two techniques. Never full drift, never full grip. Ride that edge for as long as you can until your nerves give out.

[@excite.winters]

In between drift and grip is such a meme now 😂 it screams I have no idea what I'm talking about, next you're gonna call it slip angle

[@SSZaris]

@@excite.winters As long as you feel good bro, you do you.

[@pistonfury]

You jinxed drift on the race

[@Raysboostin]

I don't think this race was a relevant test. As you say, the zero counter steer method is common with rally. So why did you run the test with an underpowered stock wrx? In your own analysis you repeatedly said the car didn't have enough power to hold the drift. Rerun your test with an actual rally car and I believe your outcome will be different.

[@uncleweirdbeard86]

Ive been playing racing games for most of my life. Started with Need for Speed High Stakes, but eventually found my way to sim racing in Grand Turismo 2. Along with that I have played many other racing sims such as MX unleashed, a few rally sims, Extreme Tokyo Racing, ect. The zero countersteer drift goes by many names. 4 wheel drifting, speed drifting, and the 1 I heard the most was "cheating" in the Forza community back in the day. It can be super effective, and not just with AWD cars. I have used it to drift FWD cars as part of a bet, RWD cars such as my speed drifter builds, and even on motorcycles. Using the technique comes almost second nature to me. Its great for when you come in too hot or if the opponent is running a blocking line that makes their car seem 3 cars wide. Like with any technique, its only as good as the person executing it. This is why the Forza bois of old use to complain that it was cheating. Because it is required for AWD cars a lot more and since they were rocketing ahead coming out of the turn, they saw it as unfair to use AWD. But the problem was never that AWD was unfair, but rather the technique of the opponent wasnt very good. It took time, but eventually I showed a few players how to be not only a better drifter, but a better racer. And it all started by winning a bet

[@Luka-gf1uv]

Sim racing in gran turismo? What are you talking about?

[@uncleweirdbeard86]

@@Luka-gf1uv Yes, because it was classified as a sim racer back when it came out and at the time, it was THE sim racer. The popularity of the engine that ran the grew to the point other companies started using similar engines and even straight up copied the game. Despite the unrealistic crash physics, it was the most realistic simulator on the market. Nowadays that title goes to BeamNG Drive, which not only gas realistic handling physics for the cars, but also has soft body mechanics and simulates each component of the vehicle for the most realistic crashes in video games. No need to write all this down, there won't be a test on it

[@Netosilvagames]

This means I've been doing this unconsciously in games with awd cars, and never noticed it was an actual technique?!

[@bradleycole2655]

Subscribe, or else you'll be slow!

[@hhaste]

Irrelevant to the video but what car do you own in real life? I just like cars in general

[@TSRB]

BMW Z4!

[@RogueBeatsARG]

Dont think Initial D lied to anyone, you have to remember that in Touge Racing, even if the Anime exagerates the spaces and time, we are talking of mostly low speed and harpins, gotta be lucky to even reach 120kph at a touge

[@DrR1pper]

Drift is actually grip here because you're not counter steering. However, drift here (which is actually grip) is only faster in the slow speed corners. If you look at the amount of steering lock used by grip in the fast corners, the steering angle is nearly zero too making it the same as drift (which is actually grip). The problem with drift (which is actually grip) vs grip in the fast corners is that you're using way too much yaw angle for the fast corners. The slower the corner, the larger the yaw angle needed which is why drift (which is actually grip) in the slow speed corners is faster.

[@mintypot]

finally i can make a comment on your video that isnt a bump

[@isocuda]

Didn't do a mixed technique super lap. Ultra downvote :P

[@lusciouslunk]

These techniques can be loosely applied to FWD cars too, especially if you clutch in for the first third of the corner

[@sharx7781]

AUUUUUUUUU mobile gaming is so shite.. and yehh prolly a vid on the supra too :)

[@donkey2340]

Hey I know the guy who made windows breakcore, cool guy :)

[@TuttuTheDog]

Damn that 100K under your name looks majestic

[@Colts_specials]

Track and rally are extremely diffrent, rally has the power to pull through, track dose not. This is a point he actually missed when explaining rally preference. Yes it is a prefrence. No, your not gonna be faster trying to grip, you want that oversteer becouse the car has the power to make oversteer outrun grip. This is becouse, as he said, in perfect conditions you want more traction than power. Itll be faster in corners and yada yada. In rally your traction is limmited to the surface, unless you plan to rally on combine tires, your faster making enough power to just make every turn oversteer and hope to baby jesus all you have enough grip.

[@MuscleCarLover]

I'd wager that the same is true for a FWD car...IF you set it up for a very slight drift, nowhere near as much angle as in this AWD example. It ends up being similar to if you literally drag the rear brakes on a FWD car by doing a couple clicks of handbrake, that one however is only able to be replicated in games if you have analogue handbrake input though

[@kcwyattcraig]

I feel on a flat track is the least practical way to test this, but a more realistic way to test this is on the downhill of a Touge run. BUNTAAAAA! But hear me out, you now have the gravity of the downhill and it appears that momentum is key when it comes to the no counter steer drift. When we all know that the grip car would have to brake a lot more in order to maintain its grip and speed through the corners.

[@CyarSkirata]

I know in games with a decent handling model and tire heat, outside of doing it just for style points I mostly drift on tarmac if I'm attacking a corner super hard in order to make use of a gap I think won't exist long enough to grip it. Doesn't come up often but it's good to stay in practice for the few moments it does.

[@imprelude]

I know what is the diff now Drift need a lot of precision and speed to be faster than grip in some corners So if you dont have speed its better to grip That means on slow corners and corners from long straight you can and should use drift to be faster While if you drift out of the slow corner and you dont have speed for long one you need to grip Also if there is a straight from the corner other than hairpin its better to slow in fast out

[@ZebraKing13]

Do a race on a mountain see if grip can win neeeoooowwww😎😎

[@Delimon007]

Wuuuttttt you don't want to drift you use more slip angle and you use the fact that the car has more stability under acceleration to get on the throttle earlier. You solve 2 birds with one stone essentially. Drifting makes you slower overall. You should be using slip angle. . .