1 Brood War Pro vs. 4 Silver SC2 Players

[@uThermal]

Join the Discord to participate!! Thanks for watching everyone

[@Chefkok09]

What is your channel my master

[@stevenape377]

@@Chefkok09 It's in the video description 👆

[@mitang7508]

Try to use Protoss Sc1 it may do better results

[@47StormShadow]

All the BW terrans are sleeping on ghosts....remember they have a ranged stun on ALL mechanical units! Also I have three words for you to try out Uthermal: Stim Firebat Drops...you'll love the results :D

[@joshuakim5240]

Also from i've seen, a lot of BW terrans seem to be using mech just to see if it can work and they tend to just flop. BW bio with the extremely quick stim+medic combo is kind of nuts in comparison and might be the single strongest opening timing attack in the game.

[@Cawfeesomething]

Haven’t seen too many people use valkryies either. These things just melt air instantly

[@DaRealLegacy]

@@joshuakim5240 that marine med stim timing was pretty stupidly good

[@47StormShadow]

@@joshuakim5240 yup, and unlike the SC2 Terran they can always transition or add mech units into the comp fairly easily

[@rjmaxx1258]

BW Terran has so many good spells but they are being ignored.

[@SindarinElealar]

Btw, Goliath AA is really upgrade reliant. They have 2 attacks with +2 each for a total of +4 per upgrade; +3 Goliaths do 32 damage while +0 Goliaths do 20 damage. It's over 50% increase to their damage (and similarly, enemy armor is efficient against them). So if you need to kill Battlecruisers, Goliaths ARE actually a great option (though in BW Terran mostly went Battlecruiser themselves), but you'll have to start your vehicle weapon upgrades early and micro them at max range. And you need a LOT of them. They're only 2 supply each, you can get 50+ of them easily enough. Supply-for-supply they actually do quite reasonably against BC though as long as you use their range (Battlecruiser's DPS grows a ton if it gets to shoot freely).

[@TheWayManREAL]

Those are some amazing silver players.............. they were way better than I was when I was in plat.... :/

[@civil5737]

Theres probably a lot of good players stuck in the low leauges just from the amount of cheese and other bs down there.

[@TheWayManREAL]

@@civil5737 idk, in plat I struggled to even get back 100 pop, these people are maxing out on the right units, that counter a lot of comps. Also when I was plat I didn't even know how to counter units correctly, I just did the same build over and over again regardless of unit counters. Wasn't until I understood the game and learned different counters then I went to diamond/masters. Doesn't mean good players aren't in lower leagues I do agree just I see this on Hera's YT a lot, they are "1000" solo but can keep up and with macro score from hera. That just doesn't add up.

[@Pico141]

@@civil5737 if they die to very weak cheese (I've seen how silver players cheese) they are not good players

[@rkanava7245]

@@Pico141 Yeah but it's a lot harder to defend in general. If your build isn't optimized you can just die accidentally even if your general mechanics are good. Take terran pushes against toss for example: I still struggle against them as a masters player, and even a silver player knows how to reactor out marines and tanks, and even if it hits later, it will be hard to hold unless you know what to do

[@BuddyWudzyn]

Everyone has had so much more experience in sc2 now. People understand the game way better and not a lot of casual players play multiplayer ladder compared to when it came out. And new players have much better guides and builds to follow since the scene has matured over the last decade

[@BobertJoe]

19:00 That moment when they pin your wraiths up against the wall of turrets was super hype actually, my brain immediately shot with adrenaline when I saw them pop out of the fog

[@sebastianweigand]

I love your vids! I'd love to see more BW Terran abilities in a future video: EMP from Science Vessels, and Lockdown from Ghosts. Those used to annoy the crap out of me back in BW! 😉

[@jacobkarlin6147]

Second on lockdown. Also, bw nukes pack a biggggg punch of 500 damage

[@wernerviehhauser94]

Maybe don't clump the mines up like this. You don't need six mines to blast a dozen zerglings....

[@reighzhor1058]

I wonder...if you play as SC1 Protoss, got a Dark Archon, and mind controlled an SC2 builder, would you build SC2 tech with that builder? Would it do the SC1 thing where, if you do this in SC1, each race has its own supply tracker, but they share resources?

[@BHMTH19B]

in BW every race has its own supplys. so if you play protoss you can actually have 600 supply. but in SC 2 its shared. at least not in the campaign its not. already try it with zerg neural parasite and alSo darK archons in 3rd campaign ( protoss). so i have no ideea how they made the mod, but i do know that they did some balance to it bc BW its too OP. it was design with the clunky units in mind so they OP to make up for that( some of them). if i had to guess i think they dont allow you to have over 200 no matter what race.But it should ! i mean if you dumb enough to lose an worker , EVIL VOICE : you must pay !

[@ragnarokfps]

Brood war marines and medics with tank support is a good counter to thors. And actually Goliaths are great anti-air units, they deal good damage vs air and have a ton of range, but you have to research the extra range just like marines. Flash'a bread and butter is marine/medic, tanks and vultures. You got too much emphasis on vultures. Brood war Terran also have firebats vs the swarming sc2 lings. You should go back and look at some of Flash's games.

[@Uritzeal]

SC1 sounds are so good, love that OG scan.

[@goodlearnerbadstudent756]

not sure about evo mod, but 1 thing you might find interesting is that spidermines can target cloaked units even without detector. It's used by bw pros to counter dt rushes, without needing to alter their build order to get early detection, and hence being economically behind. in bw, goliaths are considered the terran's answer vs air. they are 50 gas(compared to wraiths 100), per upgrade gets +2(x2) compared to wraiths(+2 once) and with charon boosters have 9 range. but love these sc evo videos. thank you!

[@maximk9964]

This was nostalgic, I used to build a whole bunch of wraiths to try and deny expansions. And then I would use dropships to sneak the ghost onto the high ground near the mineral line for a fat nuke. Ah childhood

[@Panzerkuchen]

you needed a few ghosts to shut down the BC competely ;)

[@soldier22881]

love the custom colors instead of the generic red vs blue. +1 good to see broodwar getting some love

[@lIllIlllII]

Cool games, thhank you. Why do you never build ghosts? Lockdown ability seems op vs mech. Also if you put a medic or two in a dropship you can still heal your marines in the field.

[@Pico141]

you'll never get in range, a counter to mech is your own mech

[@Prodigytoast]

Great vid thermy! Would love to see more challenges like this

[@thomaschevrierlaliberte5884]

42:35 ggwp. Real fun to watch including when UT loses which makes it less predictable 👍

[@booshmcfadden7638]

I really do love seeing Brood War played against SC2. Lots of nostalgia. GJ, uTHermal.

[@gamergoltz]

Damn, I was so close to finally see Valkyries on the field in game one

[@LCInfantry]

The lockdown on ghosts I remember being pretty good because it’s cheap

[@HappyChillmore]

Dude how the hell do you play and talk so much at the same time son competently at both? It’s crazy. Also I’m digging your channel as someone who previously only watches broodwar

[@anuarox]

ghost lockdown + goliaths, try that againts toss or terran air

[@wilsonang4286]

I have an insane challenge for you Marc, beating gms in windowed mode😂

[@flamerollerx01]

That would be a challenge if you limit the resolution to something small for his monitor. You'd have to set three limitations; no more than 1024x768 windowed game resolution, no larger than 27" monitor and no lower than 4k desktop resolution. Perhaps even require 800x600 game resolution, but on a 4k monitor, 1024x768 is tiny (I got a 27" 4k monitor. Anything less than 2k resolution windowed mode and it's unplayable), so that may already be too punishing.

[@wilsonang4286]

@@flamerollerx01 Haha yeah, I was thinking also along the lines of having no hotkeys as well

[@EmperorSigismund]

@@flamerollerx01 It should be on a vastly underspecced PC so he has to choose between resolution and framerate.

[@thetabest]

Im kinda wanting a zerg bw vs zerg sc2! Which is more powerful?

[@thundron]

Double science vessel irradiate each other was pretty nice worker killing tactic, something like oracle harrash

[@boorockt]

Medics look insanely good in this challenge. But I also waited the shuttles to heal the marines, too. :)

[@mynameismud08]

I recommend you do this again, but play as BW Protoss. Build Dark Archons and Mind Control your opponents' workers. Now you can build all three races, make 600 supply and you might be able to take on better opponents. (You have mentioned it is not easy getting silver opponents.)

[@MrShavrgo]

love this mod love these vids

[@danielsommerlykke9475]

I think the strategy needs to be more ambitious to win 1vs4 and exploit the poor defense of silver players: Do a small and quick 2 rax bio attack, follow up with mass vulture mining most of the map and all potential enemy expansion spots, and raiding on all opponents (use rax'es to scout) while going into 5-6 base mech with mech upgrades and mass tanks aiming for a 180 supply killing push w. a few cloaked wraiths as anti air and to protect science vessels that irradiate clumps of enemy units and themselves to quickly take out their worker lines and use later use emp on protoss armies before the tank fights. If you can take out one opponent completely and keep them on less than half the map with a siege line+turrets, but the tank push is unlikely to win, a yamato battlecruiser transition could help.

[@okalsdi]

ich kriege immer so bock drauf das Spiel zu spielen wenn ich uThermal zusehe

[@PetkoGanev-yu8by]

Bro, back those days, the Science Vessels had EMP missle, which nulified protos shields. I didn't see you use it

[@FloridaManYT]

Valks do splash air damage i thought

[@t3nse7en]

Calling yourself a Broodwar pro.... Call your Grandmaster friends and petition Blizzard to make a Brood War ladder on this engine, climb the ladder up, then call yourself a pro! (I just really want to play Brood War on this engine for realzies)

[@thetabest]

Do spider mines block expansions? Or since they dont attack workers hidden in mineral lines to see when they expand?

[@flamerollerx01]

Yes. I watched a replay on another KZbinrs channel and the Terran player spiked so many expansions with spider mines. The workers don't trigger the mines, so they have to build detectors, or fly them all the way over, or trigger them with a real ground unit, rather than a hovering unit like workers, high Templar, or archons (dark and regular). I could be wrong though and only workers don't trigger spider mines. Those units I listed were also immune in sc1 though.

[@flamerollerx01]

Vulture/Valkyrie might actually be pretty good. Also Vulture/Tank/Battlecruiser maybe. Goliaths are okay, but they're slow and kinda squishy.

[@JoeMendez579]

Freaking epic man this BW videos are amazing

[@malicesutton8592]

In broodwar firebats do extra damage to buildings btw

[@flamerollerx01]

1v1 BW Terran vs any other race except BW Terran might actually be able to win with a worker rush.

[@yornieldominguez2288]

@uThermal men the ugrade of Vessel for EPM. here the EPM broken all shield 1000 point of shield 1 shoot

[@marcinluter1195]

biggest bw advantages are ui and engine improvements in sc2 engine, you could not select 2 buildings at the same time in broodwar. '98 sc is more clunky, and i love wraith's ;d anti carrier unit, just snipescan observers ;d

[@patrickhuffman9632]

Do you ever consider coop challenges?

[@slimpwarrior]

Would love these at some point too

[@frothyxd7784]

I think he has done a few with goblin in the past, but I may be misremembering.

[@reighzhor1058]

Can we get a BW Ghost-Only game?

[@pablobg6823]

Marine, medic battlecruiser is unstoppable.

[@booshmcfadden7638]

Valkyries for anti-air. They shred.

[@MeesterG]

Wasn't it a thing that you could pick up Sieged Tanks with the Dropship?

[@leoritchie9635]

You have the advantage of the silvers, likely having no clue exactly how your units work

[@edibleapeman]

Are there any mods that mix SC1, BW, and SC2 and allow you to literally build any unit?

[@dogfoot1874]

They straight up back stabbed. They were going to own you one way or the other

[@LichWe]

flashbacks from sc1

[@omegablue22]

How do you get access to this kind of map/gameplay with the SC1 units?

[@kaiser2261]

The one Terran was prob plat...no silver is 9k/4k max BC with 5 bases 100 turrets under 20 mins. Gold MAYBE if you're terrible at dealing with pressure. I think 4 true silvers uThermal can do it

[@xeruexe1624]

Well now. This feels like those BW Melee maps where you have to hold out against 7 AI opponents... Actually, can you use the mode to fight against 7 Extreme AI?

[@slimpwarrior]

So fun! Love these

[@thecommonsensican]

Marc, is SC1 op in this mod? Saw Lowko comment the same. Realize it’s still new and they’re still balancing, but curious for your opinion 👍🏽

[@uThermal]

I think if SC2 really wants to win they'll always win because sc2 has some ridiculous units that you can't really counter with brood war races, in macro games I'm not quite sure ^^

[@thecommonsensican]

@@uThermal lol, just finished the vid…I see what you mean. Thank you for the awesome content! 🙏🏽🙏🏽

[@dkizzle3135]

@@uThermal seems to me like the current seeming dominance of SC1 is that SC2 players don't know how to counter SC1 builds yet

[@wedgeantilles8575]

@@uThermal I played BW back in the days and my guess would be: In late-game games, SC1 could have the edge in this mod. Why? Because some mechanics like Spellcaster are way stronger in SC1 than in SC2. Same goes for stuff like Zerg Hatcheries. In SC1 it is balanced with "horrible" mechanics in mind. Using spellcasters in SC1 is way harder than in SC2 (and that's why way less efficient) Building from 10 hatcheries is way harder (and takes much longer) than it is in SC2. Because you couldn't hotkey all hatcheries, you had to select them manually. But in this mod, we get to play them with the superior mechanics of SC2. -> This should give the SC1 races an advantage (if they get to the late game of course.) But this is only my theory and I am unskilled. Your thoughts about this?

[@smexypapayas]

@@wedgeantilles8575 Just the opposite, I think. Brood war units are pound for pound stronger than SC2 units, but they are inflexible and really bad at map control. Worse still, they don't mass well and require enormous amounts of micro to make good use of each individual ability. What this usually results in is one of two results: 1) the brood war units brute force their way in and destroy everything before it becomes a problem. 2) the SC2 units get all their tech and abilities and just out last and out maneuver the brood war units.

[@mannygee005]

GG well played! 1 v 4 is not that easy.

[@SH-os1ck]

I love these 1 v #. But silver is too low... They can't compete. At least high gold. Or 6 silver. OK, nevermind! 😂

[@howardsmith6368]

Great games

[@crabking2206]

1 vs 4 sc2 silver... man u r pro

[@unnamedlegeon]

Uh why there's an indicator on the map on where is the opponent is located? 🤔

[@邵奕虹]

I hate starcraft 1 micro so much, but I really want to play the campang, now I see hope.

[@TheChesnutCafe]

The Mass Recall mod has been around for ages, and let's you play the sc1 and bw campaigns in the SC2 engine. There is even a mod to let you play the warcraft 3 campaign in the sc2 engine.

[@mut3d]

play mass recall then. You won't regret it.

[@邵奕虹]

@@TheChesnutCafe I see lol, I'll go check it out.

[@wedgeantilles8575]

@@TheChesnutCafe Wow, I didn't know that! I grew up with SC1 and BW and I'd definitly love to replay it - but I am just spoiled by SC2 and can't go back to the mechanics in SC1. Your recommendation is much appreciated, I'll definitly use this to replay SC1 :)

[@njdarda]

these are getting more and more cruel

[@maddocpax788]

05:45 I think you're clumping the spider mines up too much, getting overkill on the lings. Fewer would do just as effectively and if placed at intervals and in depth, some ought to remain. Earlier when you didn't know where'd they go, from the minimap it looked like one ling triggering three mines (overkill indeed).

[@Jabullz]

Wouldn't valks of been the end of all those BCs? They are a direct counter.

[@Tom_a_youtube_commentor]

No, wraiths are the counter to BCs, BCs are the counter to valks, and valks are the counter to wraiths.

[@AmoeBa-y6t]

Omg YAAAAASSSSSSSSSS!!! ❤

[@MrAndersonneo88]

Love this mod

[@mohamedhimeur2991]

Are BW Ghosts still a meme in this mod?

[@dshlango]

The Shure MV7 pop filter is really bad dude

[@朕是神]

You need nukes.

[@alexganz2582]

BW protoss -> rush to dark arc. -> mind control drone + SCV -> 600 supply 1 v 4

[@tayloriii6328]

Can someone please post a link to where the mod can be downloaded from?

[@maxolo1]

love u @uThermal , but also love when the silver/gold beats you hehe

[@nohuart9854]

LOL steam without medics kinda triggers me LOL poor marines

[@konstantinlehmann8307]

I'm in your discord (and silver). How can I play in these chalanges?

[@fishlobs]

ggs

[@CaiisGaming]

So i need to go ranked untill i hit silver again it seems :'D

[@nolalb824]

Shouldn’t it be called “S” rank ?

[@Anon_Fox]

why don't the silver league players communicate and do like a 8 minute all attack timing? Is that only a gold quality? LOL

[@scottwright1379]

Because an 8 minute timing attack at 16 minutes vs uthermal probably won't work 😂

[@baron2062]

Thing is that silvers dont know how to defend against a GM's harrass, so if the GM pushes back 2 attack timings eight minutes then they just have two seperate fights which they easily win. Technically the best rush would be idk 2-3 cannon rushes and one 12 pool rush at the exact same time, nothing a gm could do about that, but its also not fun.

[@KorewaKosmo]

How is this even a challenge

[@ghoohg551]

1 BW vs 7 cheater sc2 bots when?

[@franciscoaliano5626]

Hi Marc, I really enojoy your videos. I had an idea, maybe someone already suggest this to you or maybe you don't think this is funny, but do you remember the PiG 1vs10 IA speed run? I played it after watching your video with the PF and eventually I manage to beat all the IA. And today I just played with this mod, is so different, I went sc2 terran vs all BW IA. Dragoons just erase my defense. This is the video from a year or so ago: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aJTHi4SPfLKYe9k

[@TraumaQC]

Isn't IamSerral your gf? She learned well

[@jhl.654rr]

Can anyone tell me how to play this mode Please

[@frothyxd7784]

Go to the melee section, not arcade, pick any map and there should be a mod button somewhere on screen just search for evo.

[@jhl.654rr]

@@frothyxd7784 thanks

[@jhl.654rr]

@@frothyxd7784 thank you

[@StarcraftPlague]

Seems like a tough challenge, holy... ggwp

[@valeriogreco5963]

lol? after 4-5 minutes still no attack from any of the 4 enemy players? Are we sure they are silver? sbrofl.

[@randallfletcher497]

first

[@wangsunfuh8889]

Couldn't they all just base rush with workers to win?

[@pirds102010]

thats the only thing not allowed

[@AnYung-nr8qh]

Stop boasting and calling yourself a “pro” when u can’t beat 4 silver players

[@timolson9722]

DO U HAVE ANY REPS OF U PLAYING REMASTERED I LOVE WATCHING U PLAY SO CRAZY GOOD

[@timolson9722]

I WANTA SEE SC2 BCS VS SC1 BCS

[@DrunkSober-n2h]

Pro? I won u in 5 min