Value Gap: CBCS vs CGC

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💎 ABOUT REGIE COLLECTS:
Regie here, your friendly neighborhood bodybuilder and comic book collector, and I want to welcome you to my KZbin channel.
If you are new to comics, newly returning to comics or are a long-term collector, there is something here for you. My channel is a mixture of comic book hauls, CGC unboxings, and practical advice that is designed to make us ALL smarter about comic book collecting. I don’t tell you what to think but I do give you a few things to think about.
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[@murrayc9615]

I've gravitated towards CBCS because (and I've mentioned this before): • Their slabs are way better • The head grader of CBCS is the former grader of CGC [**UPDATE** It has been reported today {2022/05/17} that head CBCS grader, Steve Borok, is leaving CBCS to take on a position with "MyComicShop" as head consignment manager] • Grading notes are free • Turn around times are slightly better than CGC at the moment • The number of unboxing videos showing unhappy collectors angry over CGCs quality control is hilarious. • Even though I've had my books graded by CBCS, I STILL get top dollar for them • Overall, even if a CBCS book sells for less than a CGC, I'm happy to save a few bucks when purchasing a pricey book

[@aaronwing78]

Also CBCS will authenticate signatures. I can’t believe instead of improving the service that pays the bills, CGC starts new divisions to grade other collectibles. Perfect one service, then expand to other items. I’m a CGC guy myself, but I have quite a few examples of mistakes they’ve made over the years. Some are kinda funny.

[@oldmankaens]

CGC grader notes are free now as well, and the turn around times are WAY slower on CBCS right now. It's a year to get graded and if you wanted a press it's another year. Literally 2 year turn around per the CBCS estimates on their site not my personal experience. My personal experience is they took my money 9 months ago and my books have never left "processing" I use both btw.

[@Igaveyoumyfakename]

Donald Trump voice: "Wrong!"

[@USMC0331]

Yep it's so much better to go through CBCS. There's too many people that think that CGC raises value . I would never devalue a CBCS I would more than likely take a 2nd look at a CGC book as there so flooded

[@RegieCollects]

Help me to understand the flood comment? The point of that isn’t clear to me.

[@MattWoodsComics]

This was a fun project to help you with. Thanks for the shoutout. 😊

[@RegieCollects]

Appreciate you bro. You made magic happen.

[@zeleve174]

I prefer CBCS for my personal collection. I guess since cgc cornered the market earlier their auctions gauge more interest and higher the value. Would like to see if there are price fluctuations between auctions and non auction purchases.

[@oldmankaens]

As a guy that shops both every single night, I know CGC sells for more. I appreciate all the work Matt did here, but I don't agree with the methodology. Primarily you are looking at single sales (versus an aggregate) which allows for so many variables, the most obvious of which is not selling to the same bidders. I prefer to look at bigger key books that sell robustly (some samples in there, like the 90s books) but you know my buying area, I look at 70s & 80s books. Anyhow, good to see people thinking about it this way, not trying to poo poo anyone's research.

[@adamchace]

Agree, single sales can be so unreliable. I still feel that CBCS gap is closing (hunch, not data) which means buy CBCS now and enjoy the ride as the gap goes to zero!

[@marcpatten4318]

One other thing that might interest folks: Of the various LCS that I frequent in CT most use both companies. And Overall, they price their slabbed books the same regardless of what company graded a book. I’ve asked the managers and owners many times if they notice a difference in pricing or sellability with the two major grading companies, and the answer each time is pretty much “No,” if their customers trust the grade, they don’t care. My own retail business has only recently started selling slabbed books at conventions. I price all our graded books according to market and my competition. Overall, for our live in person sales, THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE. Occasionally a customer may ask for a discount for a CBCS book because “online, CBCS books sell for less.” I always point out that if they agree with the grade in the slab, whatever company graded the book does not matter. I can’t recall one time where I have not closed a sale because of the grading company. The grade is the grade (at least between CBCS and CGC). I will admit, I’ve gotten more partial to CBCS this year as I like their cases better, and their turnaround time is better. Plus I think their grading is far more ‘Spot on’ that what I’ve seen come back from CGC in the last two years, but that’s just my opinion.

[@leftyB82]

I'm going to start buying cbcs and save some 💰

[@stephens4175]

I buy either, I'm buying the book not the case , the only thing I care about on the label is the grade and graders notes and book info, thats it, the way I look at it is the grading company is doing its job and I am buying the book in its assigned grade, and thats it, its for my pc and not for resail, either way they sell for way more than if it was raw if you do sell.

[@Just_Pele]

I was talking earlier about this. At one time the value gap was large, 25-35%, and then it shrunk quite a bit and many thought that CBCS would eventually catch up with CGC. However, lately that gap has spread again, nearly to where it was before, and I have no real explanation for that. At the shop we sell them for the same, or at least try to, but oftentimes if we want to sell a book we need to offer a discount on the CBCS comic. Part of it may be the look of the slabs, most PEOPLE like the look of CGC slabs more, and uniformity could play a role, as collectors already have CGC books and want to stick with the same look for all their slabs.

[@RegieCollects]

As you outlined bro I think there are several reasons for this for sure. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out.

[@collinf33]

You should do an experiment and put a same title with one from CBCS and one from CGC out to bid at the same time on the same platform. I think that would be a very interesting experiment.

[@RegieCollects]

Nah.

[@brewfront]

Another thing that happens is cbcs are less likely to be sold or take longer to sell.

[@88discostu]

As a reseller I will only pay about half as much for a cbcs book than a cgc. They always sell for about 25% less and take twice as long to sell.

[@Sjsjdbhh]

The gap is real but I value both companies services & products equally. Well done BIGSPOON!

[@RegieCollects]

Boom 🥄

[@joshuaclark1930]

The Casye Kasem of comic commentary... this next song... I mean comic...

[@RegieCollects]

Lol. Have a good weekend bro.

[@Comicbookrobb]

NEITHER!! EGS is the by far better than both. EGS grades just as hard as CGC, their return time is 1/3 of either of those 2. Their custom labels are on another level. EGS for me. :)

[@mr.ghidorah4202]

Both grading are at par with each other but presentation wise CGC just looks better. If CBCS could improve the label I think they'll get more summations.

[@Igaveyoumyfakename]

This. But I'll never give my money to CBCS. They are liars run by a liar that does honor what their people agree to.

[@RegieCollects]

You think it’s the label that’s holding them back? Interesting.

[@Igaveyoumyfakename]

@@RegieCollects : Marketing matters. Look at what CGC does with those vibrant custom character labels that people WILLINGLY PAY EXTRA for, compared to those boring-ass, hard to read, tiny type, looks like they were created by the owners' secretary's 16 year-old son labels at CBCS. It's not the only issue they have, but yeah, those hideous labels are definitely holding them back. And the sad part is, changing the label is an EASY, QUICK, INEXPENSIVE fix, and for YEARS now, for some reason, those idiots at CBCS just REFUSE to change them. SMDH.

[@bigwillcomics9968]

I think the biggest thing is seller's keep lowering CBCS books more than CGC. If sellers just sold them at the same price the gap would disappear.

[@RegieCollects]

You think it all comes down to that? I made similar comments myself in the past which is why I partial created this video. 🤣 All me to play devil’s advocate against myself. Here’s the question….why are sellers lower the price? Additional if the graded volume is so small so as to create a downward trend in the overall value of their books versus the competition is that also not telling?

[@bigwillcomics9968]

@@RegieCollects if sellers put them at the same price and don't give a CBCS discount then your only option is pay that price or don't get the book. A book's worth is in what it is and it's grade not the company so as long as the company is reputable it shouldn't and doesn't matter.

[@RegieCollects]

Agreed. But my question is the same, why do they lower the price. Answer, they lower the price because people are not buying them at that price. Which means that the market has decided that CBCS books are not worth as much. This assertion also makes the assumption that most books are sold as BIN but it may actually be auction data that is the bigger driver. I’d have to go back and look at the data but a lot of the GoCollect data comes from eBay auctions. If true, this would also be a sign that the market is unwilling to pay more for CBCS books even during a competitive auction. As mentioned in the video, the samples size is pretty thin which is why I didn’t go down these narrow paths but these are some of my own internal debates. 🤣😂

[@bigwillcomics9968]

@@RegieCollects well I think you also run into an issue when using data to try and compare you miss a lot of info. Why did one sell for more could be it's a newsstand or it was more centered in the slab or the colors are brighter or the cut is better or they may be a spine roll. If you really want to look at data and find the answer you need some books you can compare 50+ sales for with each company. Oh and the auction would need to be the same length as well with good photos and correct title because all that matters including seller feedback rating

[@brandonkief3278]

Love that Amazing Wall! I think CBCS is a good option but does sell for less most of the time IMO. I actually have some CBCS slabs but the majority of my slabs is CGC. I equate this like I do with Sports cards. PSA is number 1 in the hobby and BGS and SGC are number 2 and 3 but that has been changing lately. To me CGC is the PSA of Comics.

[@JohnnyHarmonic]

This Dude the Casey Kasem of comic books ! Lol 😂

[@pcantu3]

Like the game Burger Time in the background. It works!

[@leftyB82]

Good video

[@mikestukes801]

Great investigative work bruh 🤓👊🏿😎

[@markandrews6142]

Good analysis of the sales difference. I see the disparity quite often between the 2 companies on several different auction house platforms. I think CBCS continues to have buyer perception issues. I've tracked similar books and grades up for auction one CBCS one CGC I have yet to see a CBCS book sell for the same amount even when the grades are the same. If there is a perception out there that one company is better than another there will be these discrepancies. If the people Grading the books have exactly the same skill set in both companies a 9.8 should be a 9.8 period and the sales should be pretty much the same. I think if more well known collectors make it known that they have CBCS books in their PC, the negativity or apprehension by buyers may balance the prices.

[@RegieCollects]

Do you think that’s it? Interesting.

[@markandrews6142]

@@RegieCollects I really do think it it is a big part of the issue. CBCS is considered a sedan while CGC is considered a sports car. CBCS need to somehow reassure people that their experts are just as talented and reliable as CGC experts are.

[@MrCanibum2]

💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾🙌🏾🙌🏾🙌🏾

[@oliverortiz8507]

I like CBCS personally. I understand why CGC has the advantage in many comparisons when it comes to the selling prices we have seen in the last two years. I believe it just comes to the fact that CGC was here first but I believe that with videos like yours and others the price difference will matter less in the years to come. CBCS will continue to prove itself as a reliable choice and CGC will continue to have a prominence in the hobby as long as they do more to satisfy their customers. I would just continue to buy both but with the belief that the price savings from CBCS due to the perceived value that many have on CGC graded books will benefit the collector in the future. Great job REGIE and MATT WOODS. CONAN LIVES!

[@RegieCollects]

Great ending to a solid comment.

[@mjmurray8512]

I do not see any gap in my sales of both. CBCS signature option authenticator is really awesome.

[@RegieCollects]

Not exactly sure how to respond this comment. At the end of the day, we personally may not see it but it’s pretty clear in the data. That’s the benefit of price aggregators.

[@mjmurray8512]

@@RegieCollects No response needed. Love the videos. Just saying in the couple I have sold of both types the gap was not too glaring.

[@USMC0331]

I'll more than likely choose a CBCS the same as CGC in fact I prefer to use CBCS over CGC as there not as flooded with books plus lately they've been negligent on grading vs CBCS

[@sergioreyes1970]

Thanks for the video Reggie. The reality is that many people will believe what they want to believe, despite the evidence. I’ve had a good number of sellers on FB & IG who try to convince me that there’s price parity across the board, when the facts say otherwise. I will make sure to share your video, when it’s appropriate, though I’m sure some viewers will discredit your sample size, methodologies, etc. I truly wish there were better alternatives to CGC, but until one appears, I’m going to continue to buy & sell CGC slabs.

[@RegieCollects]

I think that their are differences between person preference and facts. The data are what the data are. I put several of the weaknesses of the analysis out there for the sake of transparency. I’m a after all just a KZbinr…and not a statistician. 🤣👊🏾

[@pbales8951]

It sure would have been helpful to have the price data overlaid on the pictures of the books. I guess I'm more of a visual person than a auditory person.

[@stevewhite4533]

Thanks for doing the research Matt, great video. I have a feeling the delta may be from the length of time CBCS has been in buisness compared to CGC.

[@RegieCollects]

Maybe. Following that logic PGX slabs would have a higher value than CBCS, right? 😏 I say that because PGX has been around longer than CBCS. I think it’s a little more complicated than time in market.

[@MattWoodsComics]

Thanks Steve! I always enjoy helping out.

[@stevewhite4533]

@@RegieCollects agreed, maybe curb appeal has something to do with it because PGX labels are horrible and an affront to my eyes 😆

[@RegieCollects]

Not everyday that I get to see a comment with a great word like affront. Thanks for that. 🤣🤣👊🏾

[@richardzaric2524]

Thanks for the video. Very informative. What I got from this was that if I'm buying for the PC, try to find a CBCS book. If I'm looking to sell, sent it to CGC.

[@marcloev2072]

One way to segment without requiring an enormous increase in sample size would be to stratify by Auction verse BIN sales. I had seen a video by Mighty Comics, 1-2 years ago, comparing the two companies And his conclusion was that by Auction there was a pricing delta exactly as you and Matt identified. However, he found if sellers set the price through BIN they sold at comparable prices. Could you ask Matt what percentage of the books he used in this analysis were Auction verse BIN? Maybe the higher CBCS books were Explained by BIN? If BIN is indeed similar (although it may take longer to sell CBCS), then this changes the dynamic significantly. Thanks as always Regie.

[@RegieCollects]

I’m not certain that reducing a small sample size even more will tell us…more. I think the answer might be increasing the sample size. This should yield more insight especially if we are able to include both auctions and buy it now. This would allow us to look at the overall while potentially looking for significance between the two buying options. All of this is a challenge due to what I cited in the video which is an overall smaller number of graded CBCS books and sales.

[@marcloev2072]

@@RegieCollects yes any statistical study has more Power by increasing the sample size or likewise diminishing it reduces Power and Confidence levels. I may not have been clear, I am suggesting that if you stratified your present data by Auction and BIN, and for example, saw no difference in price by BIN for example - the insights would be a useful update to what you already prepared. Thanks Regie

[@RegieCollects]

Ah, that helps. Appreciate it.

[@alamocitycollectibles6105]

Still haven't seen a CBCS 9.8 with spine ticks! [drop the mic]

[@RegieCollects]

Glad you enjoyed the video.

[@chickenfkeryay]

Thats real

[@eggplantcomics8336]

Boom!

[@ericcampbell9553]

Got to believe timing has to play a factor in some of theses sales . We all know how quick a book can jump or crash. Over all both have a good product and I have lots of both .

[@tazblazing]

This is like Coke vs Pepsi...!!! Two top brand.. The both shouldn't be that different in price value.. Am a big fan to CGC but lately am toward more to CBCS now...!! I bought two graded CBCS a week ago and quality of CBCS case to me is just better.. The case is thinner but yet solid like a rock.. Am digging that nice holo CBCS logo...

[@RegieCollects]

🫡

[@Michigan_Wolverine]

Another great post Regie

[@paulblade6064]

I just got cbcs books back, very quickly, I was shocked under 3 weeks! However grading was very strict, that surprised me also. Still worth it cgc takes too long and is too expensive.

[@RegieCollects]

Not sure that this is true. The prices are pretty similar between the two considering cbcs’ pricing increase. Turn around times are also similar as stated on the website and in reality.

[@paulblade6064]

@@RegieCollects just giving you my personal experience, I haven't sold them yet, so its possible I won't get as much. But it was faster and cheaper.

[@stevenberklund1281]

I made a video exactly like this a few months ago. Good stuff bro. #berkfam

[@kingpiccolo437]

Weird I would think the value of a collectable would be the actual collectable. Is this just a comic book thing? I don't collect and not sure how you got on my feed but here am subscribing to hear more. Enjoyed the video

[@RegieCollects]

Welcome to the channel King. No, it's not a comic book thing. I think you can see it happen in other collectibles and every day life. PSA is an industry leader in sports cards and their cards go for more money than another competitor. CGC is the dominate player in comics. Why do people pay a premium for Apple products versus those that run Android? A certified BMW from BMW goes for more money than a certified BMW from Car Max. A Rolex and a Timex both tell time and end in X yet....I want that Rolex. :-) Hope you'll check out more content. We'll make you a comic collector yet. :-)

[@fishnspaghetti1830]

Hey new subscriber love your channel I'm actually trying to decide which tier 2 sign up for for CGC which tier would you suggest?

[@RegieCollects]

Premium is always my recommendation. Mostly because you get the $150 credit which makes the membership free. The credit is now applicable to more than just grading now as well which is great. Use the link in the descriptions of my various videos to signup. Oh yea, you also get the $150 credit when you renew even if the renew fee is discounted.

[@altman4006]

Hey Regie, I have always been a CGC guy, but I am thinking of moving over to CBCS for some of my books because of the turn around time at CGC. They have had my FF67 since August. Turtle grading.

[@Igaveyoumyfakename]

You want it done fast or done right? Pick one.

[@altman4006]

@@Igaveyoumyfakename I have never had a book graded by CBCS, do they not do it right?

[@RegieCollects]

The grass is not always greener: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nYLVYYyLnLZlm8k

[@squirrelmadnesscomics6939]

Great information and thanks to Matt Woods. Makes me think about whether there is benefit in changing my CBCS FF 5 and FF52 to CGC🤔 BUT if they come back lower grade it clearly wouldn’t be worth it.

[@RegieCollects]

Boom! That is definitely the risk. It all seems like a great idea on the surface until you make it real with a book like that.

[@cwwheelz]

Time for some dirty grading!

[@jthomascruz4890]

Regie, thank you so much to both you and Matt for doing this video so much as this is one I have been waiting on for a while now. From my humble observations after coming back to comic collecting only a couple of years ago and still being a relative novice in the graded comics space I have noticed that there is indeed a value gap. In my opinion the gap is widest the older a comic is and the gap is narrower the more modern the book is. For me its been evident almost from the start that the market favors CGC as the gold standard. Now I know some people will get up in arms about this but this is where I feel we all have to separate our personal preferences or feelings from where you see the market tends to prefer.

[@RegieCollects]

Solid comment bro. There is absolutely a difference between personal opinion and facts. And, it’s okay to have personal preferences but they should be characterized as such. 🫡 Salute

[@USMC0331]

I honestly think it's timing and pricing at the time nobody is going to price there CBCS book several hundred dollars lower or 500 lower because it's not a CGC. If that's the case I'll only stay buying CBCS fur now as they grade just as harsh if not harder than CGC

[@RegieCollects]

I don’t follow this comment. Help me out.

[@jamesvillegas3553]

How does turn around compare CBCS, CGC?

[@RegieCollects]

According to the websites, the turn around times are about the same. Or, at least they were when I made a video about it recently. Here’s a worst case scenario: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nYLVYYyLnLZlm8k

[@philtasticcomicsandart]

Appreciate this video. I’m wondering do you feel the difference is due to people largely preferring one co over another ? Matt great job buddy !

[@RegieCollects]

I think it’s multi factorial: CGC created the category but they also have a rich history with other graded collectibles. They have decades of relationships with industry players. Millions upon millions of collectibles graded and sold. CGC is over 20 years old whereas CBCS is 8. Many of the multi-million dollar comics are graded by CGC. CGC markets itself. It’s also an innovator. I could go on but I think you get the point that they have a lot going for them.

[@philtasticcomicsandart]

@@RegieCollects ty

[@HeyPanduro]

Matt Woods & Regie doing the lord's work figuring out CGC v CGC values 😂✊

[@philayling4398]

TY FOR THE INFO ILL STICK WITH CGC

[@roboway2121]

Is see that graded NES Burgertime in the background. Do you collect retro video games also?

[@RegieCollects]

I only have one vice at a time. That was an AOK from someone.

[@sigep815]

Well put together video using nothing but data and not being biased. I personally think both are equivalent in quality, one just has the longetivity over the other.

[@RegieCollects]

Just straight data. Do what you will with it. I will however push back on the time factor only because I see that a lot in the comments. CBCS has been around 8 years or so. PGX has been around 20 according to its website. If we use the time factor, PGX would be more valuable than CBCS but I do not think it’s true.

[@evanwilliams3895]

I think as you said, time will tell. We are also at a point where the economy and market are inflated, many comic films and tv shows are being released which causes some books to inflate, and some to sky rocket. It's a guessing game as to what the future holds, and one that we may never find the answer for potentially.

[@dougbratton7309]

Very interesting data. Great job, Regie and Matt Woods! Be sure to sub up Matt's KZbin channel! 👍🏻👍🏻👊🏻

[@MattWoodsComics]

😁😊

[@tomlennox3359]

I would love to see the follow up data on these books in a year on one graded book company versus the other. I bought a SIKTC #12 9.8 Peach momoko Virgin CBCS 9.8 on spec because I think at 58 dollars with shipping it was a no brainer last week. I can't wait to revisit this Conversation in a Year with the data. Music to my ears on the X men #1 I have multiple copies to submit and I'm on the fence about which company to use on that book so I wait till Next year.

[@cwwheelz]

Great work, Regie and Matt! I think that the comparisons were occasionally too far apart for accurate analysis. IMO I think the sales need to be within a week or so to give a fair comps.

[@RegieCollects]

Thanks bro. Totally agree but as mentioned, CBCS doesn’t have enough volume to make that remotely work which may or may not say a lot.

[@bachtuwork]

How many times does Key Collector get it wrong? And grades are subjective, turn around times are another level

[@RegieCollects]

Not sure that I follow this comment. What am I missing?

[@bachtuwork]

@@RegieCollects key collector errors

[@bachtuwork]

@@RegieCollects recently the leap frog 🐸 and then the turn around frog man. Then Bastet which is just Bast so they claiming first appearance for the wrong book. X-factor 221. But it could would should be Black Panther 4 of 4. What I’m saying is the Key Collector inflates prices. They get it wrong. But if you grading then they can also get it wrong cause grading is subjective and idk how they research and define the data for a character, like it’s always gonna be debatable.

[@chrisbigger7935]

Wait what about PGX…….. oh yeah never mind 🤦‍♂️

[@RegieCollects]

It would be tough to do PGX as no one tracks those values to my knowledge. 👊🏾 Don’t want any trouble from the PGX crowd.

[@rushdiehard8784]

CBCS VS CGC VS PGX.....oh wait....nevermind

[@RegieCollects]

To my knowledge no one tracks PGX sales or we would have included it. P.S. Don’t get the PGX crowd angry. 🤣🫡

[@RonSM2112]

I think there's a problem with only looking at one data point per book per grade. I've seen values for some of these books vary by hundreds of dollars over a single week. You guys should really be averaging all sales per book per grade over a multiple-month period, so as to normalize the values somewhat.

[@RegieCollects]

Several have made this comment and we looked at it. The issue is that averaging makes the lack of CBCS data worse as they have fewer sales that are spread further apart. The issue isn’t creatively around methodology, it’s a lack of CBCS books and sales data.

[@RonSM2112]

@@RegieCollects The data wouldn't be "worse" in that case -- it would simply have a larger standard deviation. Still makes for a better comparison.

[@aaronwing78]

I agree on your conclusion. Another wild card outlier, how many books were available to buy at the time of these snapshot sales.

[@RegieCollects]

That’s another great variable that would have to be considered for sure. Right along with buy it now vs auction, etc.

[@jmpw005]

I buy more CBCS, but submit my books to CGC. 2 test books I sent to CBCS (for pressing, sv, and grading) has been there for 10 months. Want to give them more business, but turn around time is too long. CGC labels do pop, but CBCS labels usually has information where CGC may not have any at all.

[@sean1hanna]

Reggie, would be interesting, but expensive, to actually take a sample of grades of CBCS and submit them to CGC for grading. Let’s see the actual grades. I understand that grading is subjective, but you would expect a greater than 50-75% to come back the same, right? To me if you buy a sample of 9.8 CBCS crack, submit to CGC and more come back less than CGC that would lead me to believe the price difference isn’t as much as a CGC name but due to the more strict grading at CGC and a more lax grading at CBCS.

[@RegieCollects]

This exercise was conducted by lots of KZbinrs back in 2019-ish. If you search KZbin you should be able to find these videos. I personally felt like the exercise was a massive waste of money. Yes, grading is subjective but the grading companies are not all using the exact same standards to grade comics. I feel like both CGC and CBCS have taken departures from Overstreet-maybe for good reason. If there was a single universal, standard for grading maybe something could be learned from an exercise like this but each company has it’s own standards that are rooted in Overstreet which isn’t exactly the same thing. Look at the definition for Fine (5.5 - 7.0) between Overstreet, CBCS and CGC. 🤯

[@sean1hanna]

@@RegieCollects for me I personally like the more strict way of grading. I’ve seen quite a few books from CBCS that are 9.8 but compared to my 9.6-9.8 they wouldn’t even touch that, more like a 9.0-9.2. But to my point I’m wondering if that’s why collectors flock to CGC due to a 9.8 being close to mint from them but a CBCS being not as so… again just my thoughts.

[@RegieCollects]

I think the reason that CGC is ahead of CBCS is multifactorial. CGC started the category, built upon a long history of other graded collectibles from the parent company. Twenty years is a long time to build relationships versus CBCS’ 8 years. When you think of record breaking mega keys going for big dollars which company comes to mind? When you consider innovative, market awareness, marketing presence do you picture CBCS or CGC? This isn’t a criticism of CBCS versus an examination of what I see. A lot of folks point to Steve Borock as the reason they use CBCS, as if he was still grading all of the comics. Either way, he’s gone now. Literally the only person you ever see publicly from CBCS has left. Interesting times ahead.

[@TheLafester]

I think CBCS is every bit as good a product as CGC. I haven’t had any experience to share in selling either one but I definitely find the prices of CBCS books of similar grade sell for less and keys are a little easier to acquire. Since many collectors are obsessed with resale value, this fact becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy

[@eggplantcomics8336]

Sounds to me like there is value in buying cbcs books and waiting for collectors to realize the gap is meaninglessness

[@RegieCollects]

🤣🤣 I tend to agree.

[@zachtaylor5312]

I’ll never understand why CGC gets special treatment. Some auction places won’t even sell a book unless it’s CGC. Why do so many people assume they are the only company that can grade a book “correctly”.

[@RegieCollects]

I have my thoughts, what are yours?

[@zachtaylor5312]

@@RegieCollects Hasn’t CGC been around the longest? If so it still doesn’t make complete sense. To me it’s like saying only one company can properly make vehicles or only one company can properly make furniture.

[@ManbatDetective]

Wow I'm happy I found your channel. Thanks for this 👏 👏 👏 👌 💜 Was thinking about jumping into other Grading outsources as I have tons of books for grading but was unsure of some of these other Comic grading companies. I have quite a collection of Cgc & Cgc S.S. books and have been thinking about either staying with one grading company or going to other companies. -What are your thoughts? Recommendations? Lastly ... If I may also ask what are your thoughts on Signed books and them being submitted after the fact, ?? - I have some signed books by artists and writers who are no longer with us sadly, I am curious as to what the outcome may be in my submission(s) ? Any input advice, thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks again for an awesome Epsd. And your time. Happy collecting & geek responsibly ✌

[@RegieCollects]

I have a video coming next week that may help with a lot of this. In the mean while kzbin.info/www/bejne/aIHXfWyrfLSId8k

[@Bigpop82]

I dont own a single slab, from any company. So 0 biased either way. That being said, it's clear to me that CBCS's slabs are far superior. I see people complain about busted corners and Newton rings on CGC slabs frequently. CBCS literally cannot even have Newton Rings. I think any advantage CGC had is gone and it's just a market correction that takes time and hasn't shown tangible change, yet. I also am not a huge proponent of this research method but I understand it's at least an attempt at finding and figuring this stuff out, so I appreciate the content.

[@toasty-toast]

I pay the equivalent of a 0.2 lower grade for CBCS. I.e. value a CBCS 9.6 as a CGC 9.4.

[@alexzariphes753]

I've been struggling with this for a long time and I am happy to stumble into this channel. Thank you for the hard work you put into it. I recently fell on hard times, long before I lost my job I submitted a comic (ultimate Fallout 4) for grading to CGC. This was at the time in the market where the value was really high. As you can imagine, after losing my job, I was chewing at the bit to get it back because I became cash strapped and the possibility of a nice sale would be a relief. Unfortunately, with the delays and such in the turnaround time. The market has changed and the prices have dropped significantly. (Such is the way of markets). It has led me to this question. With such a volatile and unpredictable market, do you think that we will see people lean more towards CBCS because (in my experience) they have faster turnaround times combined with lower submission costs? I mean, wouldn't a seller want to get his book back while its still hot? Tied into that, do you think that we will see more CBCS books on sale/available effecting the delta gap between the two companies? I'm sorry this is long, but I'd love to hear your thoughts.

[@RegieCollects]

The wait time for the two companies is virtually the same if you take a look at the published data. With that said, CGC has started to churn books out that have been in the system for a while which is a good sign for them. The long and short is that the gap does not appear to be narrowing and the wait times are the same. I see no change.

[@kevinhowe8725]

Do you think it would be to risky to buy a cbcs graded for cheaper? Then resubmit it hoping CGC grades the same lol. Seems like it could work. If the gap in money is wide enough.

[@zachtaylor5312]

I’ve done it twice and neither time worked for me. It’s a gamble. You either get lucky and it comes back a higher grade or worst case it could come back lower

[@Just_Pele]

In my experience, CBCS books frequently grade a little higher with CGC, because CBCS is oftentimes a bit more strict.

[@murrayc9615]

CBCS grading is on par - or even better - with CGC. You will need to factor in the grading and shipping costs costs to see what profit margin there is. I've chatted with other people about doing this with PGX slabs, but the risk is too high (i.e. a PGX 7.5 may only be a CGC/CBCS 5.0)

[@RegieCollects]

What all these people below said. 🤣😏 Seriously, these are solid responses that I literally would have said myself.

[@masonshih7858]

That's what I do. Purchase CBCS. If you want to sell, get it regraded by CGC.

[@kevinhowe8725]

When I first started looking into comics I immediately seen that cgc was the most popular and sold for more. I go where the market goes for buying to resale down the road. CGC

[@Just_Pele]

For more expensive books you might want to do the opposite, then. Buy CBCS comics, crack them out, and then submit them to CGC to make more $$.

[@kevinhowe8725]

@@Just_Pele Yeah. That was the question I also asked. Wondering if it was to risky. But I think if they were both graded the same and the cbcs was a lot cheaper for a bigger key that it could work.

[@clickmyvid]

CBCS owners shouldn't sell low, let the CGC prices come down

[@Igaveyoumyfakename]

And how many years have you been wanting for THAT to happen?

[@tinakaranson6964]

Interesting topic, great assist from Woodsie. Regie, do you think Cgc has done a better job of promoting themselves over the years compared to Cbcs?

[@RegieCollects]

Well done. This is actually something that I’ve spoken about with several people including CBCS. In my opinion, CBCS seems very comfortable being in second position. They do not market themselves. They do not sell the sizzle of what they offer. They do not get people excited about what they offer and what they are doing. They just send out emails.

[@tinakaranson6964]

@@RegieCollects " sell the sizzle" love it.

[@RegieCollects]

I’m in marketing. Sizzle sells. 🤣😏

[@richardvieth2094]

I'm sure it's been done, and probably mentioned in these comments (I scrolled but didn't see it). Has anybody ever submitted the same book to both companies? I'd be curious to see how a book would be graded at one, cracked and then graded at the other. Obviously one book wouldn't be evident enough of the grading quality, but if someone could afford to send in multiple books I would love to see the grading difference between the two Edit - on another note, was that a subliminal hip comic reference at the end of the video?🤣

[@RegieCollects]

Oh boy. Please don’t open that can of worms. This was pretty rampant in 2018-2019. Just search KZbin for all of the videos where people CPR (crack, press resubmitted) the same book to CGC, CBCS, PGX to compare. At one point it’s all that a lot of KZbinrs were doing.

[@richardvieth2094]

@@RegieCollects I knew it had to have been done before!

[@RegieCollects]

Yeah man. It was crazy how many people were burning that cash. Lol.

[@Voxclamantis]

I really do think we need segmented data, and like you say - a larger sample. I would guess that for prized silver age Marvel books there wouldn't be much of a gap at all. I really do think that a key differentiator in market value is from CBCS's signature authentication service. For example. those folks with Jack Kirby signed books - he was long gone by the time CGC came on the scene would only send their book to CBCS - because an FF1 (or any book he worked on) signed by Kirby at the same grade is a lot more interesting to most than one not signed. And for all the books many had signed years before CGC showed up - all those great autographs from and anyone fans met at cons years ago. - I only send those to CBCS and expect to them to hold more value- at least for those who are interested in signed books. Anyway, CGC doesn't even rank when it comes to those books.

[@RegieCollects]

A larger sample would definitely be necessary. With that said, I would say that the signature service from CBCS is a differentiator but how meaningful is it from a revenue standpoint? That’s an unknown. I would also suggest that it’s also their biggest liability/risk.

[@Voxclamantis]

@@RegieCollects I think they should add provenance options like auction houses. For example, you could have a photo of you with the person signing your book, COA, newspaper clipping about the appearance all encased in a fold out with the book. Evidence of provenance is regularly used with antiques and rare art. I don’t see why it would be unavailable service from a grading company.

[@Voxclamantis]

@@RegieCollects re: revenue, yes we would need some data on it. We could compare the price of a signed CBCS book unwitnessed to a CBCS book unsigned to see the premium and interpolate that added value as compared to an unsigned CGC book.

[@butterscotchsix9064]

Personally I think it's a more of a cash grab than anything. I'll give you an example...I'm currently in possession of a spawn issue 1 black and white variant that was signed by Todd Mcfarlane, BUT because no CGC attendant was present it doesn't have the signature series yellow tab on the slab because the signing wasn't " witnessed" I got my comic graded through CBCS and it came back a 9.8 with a verified signature. OF COURSE it was verified because I was there. IF I ever DO sell it I struggle to understand why the buyer would turn his nose up on a comic that was verified vs one that's witnessed. Isn't that the whole point of getting it verified? To assure the seller it was actually signed? Just because no attendant from CGC was present I don't think the comics value should go down relative to CGC.

[@RegieCollects]

I get your frustration bud but you may need to look up the definition of cash grab. CGC is attempting avoiding the forgery that has hit PGX, CBCS and other collectibles markets. There is at least one well documented case where a guy forged a signature and had it verified. I say documented because he created a video showing the entire process. The witness clause may be a headache but it’s being done for a few reasons. And, yes a lot of that has to do with CGC protecting itself. The value gap that we see between cbcs and CGC is also multi factorial. Hope this helps.

[@butterscotchsix9064]

I understand there are many factors in why the prices change vs the two. All I'm saying is CGC likes to toot that they're the " industry standard" which alone would contribute to the price difference which CBCS is slowly catching up to. No company is perfect and googling how CGC handles comics to be graded also brings up horror stories. I've also seen that CBCS is also a tad more consistent with their grading vs CGC. All up to the buyer but I'm happy CBCS is making headway catching up to CGC. Have a good one.....bud

[@Zeggskoll]

So I can buy a CBCS graded book, unpack it, send it to CGS and make a little bit of profit. Noice!

[@zachtaylor5312]

That’s assuming it comes back the same grade though. Not guaranteed

[@RegieCollects]

Gosh, I hope that’s not your takeaway from this video.

[@zachtaylor5312]

Unless your buying super high dollar books and get a higher grade with CGC, which is not guaranteed, then don’t expect or assume this will work even half the time. Smaller books after you factor in shipping and resubmission to CGC, how much profit is really gonna be there?

[@loki2stunt]

Most of these guys have too much money invested in CGC to admit there's no difference............ More money than brains.

[@RegieCollects]

No difference in what way? And, who are “these guys?”

[@eggplantcomics8336]

No REAL difference unless you consider cbcs has a superior product with dramatically less mechanical and technical errors. It’s almost inconceivable how the public ignores cgc’s horrible quality control. Books slabbed upside down, debris trapped inside, broken slabs and unsealed slabs.

[@eggplantcomics8336]

Would you keep going to McDonald’s vs Burger King if occasionally your McDonald burger had plastic shards inside?

[@RegieCollects]

It’s an interesting comparison that you make. Some might say that Burger King is better than McDonalds in several ways. Yet McDonalds has $37billion in US sales to Burger Kings’ $10 billion.

[@Igaveyoumyfakename]

It doesn't make sense to compare books that were not sold within a few days of each other. Comparing books sold weeks or months apart is not a fair comparison. The market changes constantly. How do we know that some comic news or rise or fall in value didn't happen in the weeks and months between sales that happen weeks or months apart? News makes a difference. It has an immediate impact on the value. If I buy a book today. And big news impacting that book gets announced the next day, meaningful price moves happen immediately. So what it sold for yesterday or a week ago is now moot. If no news (or meaningful value movement) has happened then the comparisons can be somewhat fair. But how do we know none of this happened with sales that happen so far apart? Nevertheless, CBSC and their lying employees and leadership suck! Their labels are butt ugly, PLUS their books regularly sell for less anyway. (But that doesn't matter to me because I COLLECT books. I DON'T sell books.) I will buy their slabs if it's a book I want, but I will never hand them my money again and do business with them directly. I don't see that ever happening again.

[@RegieCollects]

Thanks for watching the video.

[@marcpatten4318]

My big issue with this video, is that when doing real statistical analysis to compare values, your timeframes on a lot of the books you chose is too far off. To do an accurate comparison and use real statistics (yes Math!) to get the least margin of error, the sales for each book need to be at the very least within the same week. Otherwise, the comparisons are irrelevant sadly for the reasons you stated -the market changes too quickly. I’d also highly suggest you get sales data from NON-eBay outlets. Ask Vinnie from Metropolis/Comic Connect, Ted Vanliew from Superworld, Comic Link, Dave and Adam’s Card World, Harley Yee, etc. plus of course, Heritage Auctions, Shortboxed and My Slabs, as well. If you were able to do some kind of report every other month with different books, that would be an awesome addition to your already fun and informative content! Keep on Rockin’ Reggie!

[@RegieCollects]

That’s my biggest issue with the video as well. At the end of the day, CBCS doesn’t have enough volume to do a true comparison which might be the most telling aspect of the entire video. Solid takeaway. Thanks for watching and commenting.