VDOM vs lit-html - HTTP203

[@MaxArt2501]

If HyperHTML is so similar to lit-html, and predates lit-html, and had some traction already, and it's actively maintained, and it's currently more powerful, and has Node and NativeScript implementations... Why didn't you guys promote HyperHTML right away? What's the reason for lit-html?

[@adiorthotos]

Asking the right questions.

[@dassurma]

I am not sure what you are accusing us of. Neither of us wrote lit-html. I have been playing around with lit-html and Jake has been playing around with HyperHTML. I don’t think we made one appear better than the other. Feel free to take a look at both (or any other library that takes a similar approach) and form your own opinion.

[@MaxArt2501]

Surma Nah, I'm not accusing anyone of anything. It was a legit question, asking was the rationale behind lit-html. I know the author is Justin Fagnani, he's a great guy and of course he's free to do whatever he wants, but I was hoping some of you guys could know something more about it. The matter is that HyperHTML has been showing some degree of maturity for a while, where, of course, lit-html is still in its infancy. One of the most common saying in development is to not reinvent the wheel (something that I actually like to do from time to time), so if lit-html isn't "reinventing the wheel" what's its purpose that HyperHTML isn't targetting or just doing differently?

[@punio4]

I also kinda got this feeling that people are actively avoiding talking about hyperHTML for some time now. And it's not like Andrea hasn't been promoting the library to the best of his ability. But as soon as the guys on polymer summit have shown lit-html as a proof-of-concept lib, the whole dev world has been acting like it's the second coming of Christ. While HyperHTML, which has been actively developed and used in production for a year now, hasn't been covered by _anyone_. This is the first time I've actually seen anyone mention it. Just feels like there's a bit of politics and tension going around it.

[@MaxArt2501]

Ivan Čurić Eh, it's understandable to think that way and I really hope it's not a matter of politics indeed. Hopefully, this video relieved me a bit about that since Surma and Jake explicitely mentioned hyperHTML and acknowledged its value, so it's not like a taboo word among Googlers. So, in the end I'm just hoping there will be something about lit-html that we just can't see right now because it's still in an early development stage. Wondering what the future will reserve for us.

[@billwindsor4224]

@Surma and @Jake Archibald - great job on this; an excellent focused highlights on key concepts for lit-html, HyperHTML, and VDOM data binding. *Thank you* for doing this.

[@xseman]

Lit-element is a fantastic leap towards a web framework that follows web standards and represents the future.

[@MajorBreakfast]

I'm curious whether lit-html will be able to replace the current data binding system of Polymer. For that it must bring similar performance and features to the table. The library is super tiny, but that's of course only an advantage once you're able to drop the current solution. I really like that people like Justin are trying new things. The directives API seems to be powerful enough to be used as a target for Polymer's current data binding system.

[@justintaddei]

hyperHTML . . . Hyper Hyper Text Markup Language. Just seems funny to me.

[@Textras]

Good video guys. Rare to see such an advanced conversation on DOM principles. Was looking at lit yesterday. Would love more content specifically like this and deep diving into other DOM related material

[@jimfoley2690]

What does Surma say to watch in the beginning of the video?

[@justinoneill2837]

Am I right in assuming that Lit HTML and/or Hyper HTML is "kind of" a replacement for libraries like Redux? Sorry if that question is irrelevant, but from some of the points you made @Surma, it sounds like that might be the case?

[@anthonyarostegui409]

Actually, demos made with litHtml works with redux. LitHtml doesn't replace redux but the VDOM

[@justinoneill2837]

Gotcha. Can't wait to sink my teeth into P3.0!

[@anthonyarostegui409]

Polymer is already out, check it out

[@nibmz7]

I've used lit-element and react and I'm glad I've found this video. Always wondered how they both work differently under the hood. If lit-element has an official hooks way of writing components, it'd be really awesome 😎.

[@TheSlarkInn]

Dear Surma and Jake, This is exactly how Vue works (hoists out static templating content also)

[@andreagiammarchi6110]

the main difference is that no tooling, nor build time, is needed/added to use hyperHTML. A quick comparison of get-started examples Vue vs hyperHTML here: viperhtml.js.org/hyperhtml/examples/#!fw=Vue.js&example=Todos%20Component

[@gokatz]

Hey Surma , I'm not a polymer guy ;) I understand this as handlebars of javascript. Is it so??

[@dassurma]

It’s a bit more than that. So “JavaScript Template Strings Literals” are like Handlebars, but built into the language. Both HyperHTML and lit-html are using Template Strings, but are much smarter when you render the same template *a 2nd time*. Those libraries figure out which parts could have changed in between renders and only update those instead of the entire thing. Hope this helps

[@gokatz]

Thanks for the time Surma :)

[@DenisTRUFFAUT]

Is lit-html basically a cache solution for "JavaScript Template Strings Literals" ?

[@jackninja1]

Didnt know you guys had a podcast, im gonna check it out!

[@RakshakHegde]

What's the podcast called?

[@code4chaosmobile]

I have a quick question. Could we run the browser in frames per second? It would be interesting to see a website with each element refreshing to its own Accord. Just something about the idea of thinking of it in frames per second that could bring interesting style ideas unattainable in the way it is now

[@mszado15]

the browser works like this

[@fazalhussain1599]

And this link in my price payment for you but not this is the crime for my mind

[@RevvItBham]

I literally just "got" the name of the show HTTP203. #hilarious #clever

[@dassurma]

Some people call it HTTP204 :'(

[@RevvItBham]

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! You're too much!!! And that is totally not true! Maybe HTTP206 that takes HTTP402 to be HTTP202

[@JamesKelley1]

You should edit a version of the video containing only the giggles and put that on a 204 channel.

[@samwight]

GlimmerJS has been doing this for a looong time.

[@pwarelis]

Surma Interruptus

[@martixy2]

Wait... so HyperHTML is Hyper-Hyper-Text-Markup-Language... huh?

[@JaihindhReddy]

ECMAScript Tagged Template Literals.

[@ColinRichardson]

What? No Webworker or Serviceworker ?

[@jeffesoncosta14]

nice video

[@BeingCreatives]

How to Join Google? I'm Adwords Certified.

[@LarsRyeJeppesen]

2-way binding is evil.

[@aammssaamm]

They just do it in a wrong way.

[@Nonenone-rj9yp]

I use lit I don't enjoy it. You end up writing way more code, its untidy and doesn't give you massive performance improvements.

[@LarsRyeJeppesen]

React react react ... zzzzzzzzz

[@AkshayAradhya]

I think one of the guys here has a uninbrow and decided to shave it off right down the node ?

[@billwindsor4224]

@Akshay Aradhya - do you have a comment on the lit-html software engineering concepts? (which is actually the topic of this KZbin post - just so you know)

[@carloseliososasposito1276]

COMO VAMOS A ENTENDER SINO HABLAN EN ESPAÑOL

[@dassurma]

Dann müssten wir ja auch Deutsch sprechen. Das wäre doch unfair ;)

[@danielmejia7804]

Hahaha! :p

[@fronbasal]

Surma Recht hast du!

[@adiorthotos]

Donde estas la biblioteca?

[@miguelangelbastidasenrique6161]

KZbin tiene traducción automática a los subtítulos...... así si se entiende