Versus Series Darth Sidious/Palpatine VS Vitiate/Sith Emperor

Well guys here it is the one you all have been asking for, Versus Series Palpatine vs Vitiate
Greyjedi91 / yarealpoof
Also I don't own the movie footage in this, Star Wars is owned by Lucasfilm, Fox, and Disney.

[@rm0986]

Sidious killed his own parents as a young man. Vitiate killed his own parents at the age of six and took over his home planet at the age of ten. *Duh.*

[@banethesithari]

sidious took over the entire galaxy vitate didnt duh.

[@roba3113]

banethesithari vitiate didnt care of taking over the galaxy, he cared about killing everyone in the galaxy duh

[@banethesithari]

Priviledged Scholar I know that i was using Hans Wurst own stupid arguement against him duh

[@roba3113]

banethesithari your own name gives you bias towards Darth Sidious. duh

[@banethesithari]

Priviledged Scholar Bane has nothing to do with this discussion so my "bias" toward bane isnt a factor duh (duh really doesn't sum up how dumb your replies have been but im not sure if is used a word much more than 4 letter long you'd understand.

[@luizfcavalcanti]

This video needs a rematch, since Vitiate was found to be Valkorion and now is not only more powerful but also can consume the life of entire planets from a distance.

[@HolyknightVader999]

+Luiz Fernando Cavalcanti dos Santos And Valkorion is powerful as fuck. He doesn't even need a lightsaber to parry one. I remember when Arcann tried to knock him off with his lightsaber, and Valkorion was blocking it with nothing but Force powers. Arcann looked like a damn tool.....

[@jigolocana7492]

He even gave lord scourge enternal life

[@unlimitedpower8960]

This is what I kept screaming while watching the video!! Valkorion needs his own match, even if some results would be the same.

[@bluehero-96]

Naw. That damn MMO has poor writing. The more you know about Vitiate the less he can be taken seriously. There is no way he can win against Papa Palpatine when he's a lazy joke of a villain.

[@awakenow7147]

@Ursus_VF Ursus_VF Thank you. I don't hate the EU. But all this extra story and Force powers is incredibly unnecessary.

[@cptndunsel8088]

Vitiate did not need some fancy death star to destroy a world. Just saying.

[@ilovehistory5210]

Kyle messenger of pain/Darth Umbra Remember he drained ziost dry with no help..

[@ilovehistory5210]

Visitormassacre Where they on Ziost when it happened? no xD

[@ilovehistory5210]

Visitormassacre People who where never on the planet so your statement is wrong :p

[@ilovehistory5210]

Visitormassacre IM talking about when he Killed everyone who was on the planet after the main characters left -_-

[@ilovehistory5210]

Visitormassacre You do understand that that never officially happened? :p

[@Spectacular_Insanity]

Yeah, you know... except Vitiate CAN'T BE KILLED. Trust me, I play SWTOR. I tried. I killed him. A lot. But he keeps... coming... back....

[@armageddon3315]

+crzymn246 And Sidious came back once in DE. And he would have come back again if not for the effort of a ton of jedi. Vitiate dies eventually unless he is just siiting in the corner watching the galaxy burn.

[@brandonl7759]

+Russian Guy honestly he doesn't die. He's achieved some form of imortality if you've played KOTFE. His power is really odd, and he seems to be in a seperate tier then other force users. Also he killed an entire planet on more then one occasion, actually doing it single handedly the second time. I think this battle should be refought with all the new vitiate lore since.

[@armageddon3315]

Brandon Linthicum No matter what, Bioware will kill of vitiate or imprison him eventually. Otherwise, how come he isn't around in someone like darth bane's time?

[@Spectacular_Insanity]

Russian Guy Same reason Exar Kun wasn't around in ROtJ. He'll probably be slaved to some forgotten temple on some forgotten world.

[@knightheaven8992]

+Brandon Linthicum This video is cleary not valid anymore. It is obsolete. With The launch of KOTFE, and Valkorion story. But despite that, the video is still wrong about Vitiate. What he describes, and puts on the video, it isnt vitiate, but his voice. . The real body of Vitiate never apears in SWTOR. Contrary to what the video says Vitiate did evolve. i dare say evolved behond what Palpatine never could. Vitiate/valkorion evolved behond the dark side, and the light side. "No matter what, Bioware will kill of vitiate or imprison him eventually. Otherwise, how come he isn't around in someone like darth bane's time?" I dont know they are making Valkorion quite sympatethic , and Ambiguous in relation to the dark or light side, i mean he is still evil, or rather amoral more like.. Not sure if they will imprison him or do anything at all to him. So im not sure about that. Also does it matter if he is or isnt arround at the time of Darth bane? He grew behond the sith and jedi, he is no sith anymore. The eternal empire cleary is no Sith empire. Acording to Valkorion is a better empire and vison then the sith empire or the republic could be. But regardless none of it is canon, bioware doesnt need to acomodate to darth bane books anyway.

[@GreyJedi91]

Very honored to have had something to do with this video. Arguably your best one yet in my opinion. Looking forward to working with you again! -Matt

[@EvanNova95]

Thanks man.

[@mgvillanmp478]

Nice work guys!!!!

[@DarkUnicorn89024]

I agree Jensarris vs series are too long

[@lovefrompraha]

EvanNova95, GreyJedi91, and Jensaari are all my favorites and all bring something amazing to the table. Evan gives his unique perspective and does it all without dragging it out. Then Jensaari describes it in more detail and breaks it down more. Then GreyJedi adds even more to the table and fully explains it when I just need more. Great job guys. Keep the nerdgasms alive.

[@SohnvonChristus]

There's one key testament of Darth Vitiate's power that isn't mentioned here. There was one occasion where the entire Dark Council plotted against Vitiate, and when they attempted to walk up the steps outside the Citadel to challenge the Emperor, Vitiate killed them all instantly with a flash of lightning even though he was deep inside the citadel in his throne room and nowhere near them. He allowed them to reach the top step, then he struck them all dead where they stood. No fight, no warning, no survivors. The Dark Council weren't average Sith Lords, they were the twelve most powerful Sith Lords in the galaxy, and he killed them all in an instant without being able to see or hear them. Not even the Dark Council combined could challenge him and live to tell about it. I haven't seen or heard anything that hints at Sidious being able to do anything like that, in canon lore or in the movies. Sure, he could slowly drain countless people on a planet over time (Byss), but Vitiate could strike anyone dead on the planet at any time he wished. He could reach out across light-years of space and control countless Jedi and Sith, crushing their minds and if necessary, killing them from just as far away. Sidious could summon lightning to strike people dead from his hands sure, but that required a direct line of sight between him and them. Vitiate could summon it out of thin air and strike entire groups of powerful Sith and Jedi dead instantly without being anywhere near them. I'm curious, how do you refute that fact about Vitiate's power? I watched the movies, read the Dark Empire comics, the New Republic novels, etc. And I haven't seen anything from Sidious approaching that level of power.

[@user-if6sg8cd7m]

Yeah, and Vitiate was killed by a fat Asian lisbian who didn't even wield force. What a disgrace!

[@nevermean6126]

yeah, and Vitiate was killed by a fat Asian lisbian who doesn’t even own power. what a disgrace

[@justsomeguywhokeepsgetting4885]

All the people he was able to touch and control were people who were known as the emperor’s children he can’t just do it to anyone

[@colonelradec5956]

yea I feel like vitiate would win. easily maybe even. I think in a head on dual sidious could win but I don't think it would ever get that far lol.

[@michaelterrell5061]

They were powerful but essentially canon fodder compared to Sidious. This feat is impressive but Sidious’s using force storms makes this seem like a joke.

[@dulio3240]

Siduous is a true sith lord of the rule of two. Vitiate is the sith lord of the ancient sith. Both have great accomplishments and feats of power but siduous have more martial skill while vitiate have more arcane skill. it like a warlock battling a demon hunter. warlock for vitiate and demon hunter for siduous.

[@charliedell4994]

actually sidious ended the rule of two, messed up and is now dead :)

[@sekouhicks3974]

They both at there prime could warp reality so I say they warp reality to much that they destroy each other

[@moe5020]

how did he end the rule of two?

[@ravenfal1496]

+MrAV8gaming He allowed other force users to be trained in the dark side (like his hands, which included Mara Jade and Lumiya, for example).

[@dulio3240]

Siduous did not end it but increase powerbase of darksiders/dark jedi. He trained replacements in case of Darth Vader died or fail . Darth Vader end the Rule of Two as the Rule of Two did not have the safeguards when the apprentice turn to the light.

[@TJNC100]

George Lucas, despite himself being way far from the guy that knows the most about Star Wars, is still the highest authority when it comes to SW lore, and more than once he has mentioned Palpatine as having been the most powerful Sith Lord in Galactic History... I think that pretty much sums it up.

[@XionToday]

Vitiate killes the entire Dark Council the moment they stepped up to confront him. They all dropped dead. Vitiate was also only defeated due to him being in a weakened state because he relatively recently transferred his essence from a Voss Mystic to his Hand. Vitiate might be 1000 years old, but then again he is Not as he is changing bodies. He subdued an entire Jedi strike force with ease, that including Jedi Masters and even the Hero of Tython and converted them all to the dark side. A lot is lacking when you compare these two. Natural power or artificial power, it matters not as long as they both match each others powers. He drained an entire planet of life and Force. That gave him immense power. NO natural power should be able to challenge that. Palpatine was able to create force storm, now I ask you, would he be able to create force storms in a duel? "Hey Vitiate could you give me an hour or two? I'm just gonna sit down here and devour you with my force storm" As you said he has trouble controlling it himself, and he even managed to destroy the Eclipse, his own Super Star Destroyer. It had a godamn super laser on it! I think you're making conclusions too fast, and I see that in many of your Versus videos. I feel you're down rating Vitiate, he is far more powerful than you show here. Natural power. Ok. Artificial Power. Ok. As long as you have the Power, it doesn't matter if it's either. Vitiate would not be using a lightsaber in combat as he was clearly a force user. And so he would use his force powers on Palpatine, not engage him in a lightsaber duel, if you got a sword for yoyr birthday but you weren't able to use it, but you had a gun that you could hit anything with ease, would you use the sword or the gun? Same concept.

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

Ahem, but Sidious did indeed conjure a Force Storm *right* after he was defeated by Luke. His hand was cut off, and distracted Luke with a few lines of speech on he could never hope to defeat him. Only moments later (as it only takes like 10-15 seconds to say those lines) a Force Storm appeared out of nowhere and ripped the Rebel Fleet apart. Also, the reason why he lost control over his storm is because Luke, Leia and Anakin cut him off from the Force. If they cut Vitiate off from the Force, he isn't so powerful either, is he? While I agree that Evan is highly biased towards Saga people, he is still correct in his conclusion. Sidious is simply more powerful than any other Sith. Vitiate comes close with his Force Powers, but his Lightsaber skills are just too lacking to be of any use. Vitiate should not be seen as a weak Sith, I myself rate him among the 5 most powerful Sith ever (along with Plagueis, Vader, Caedus, and Sidious.). But Sidious is just with facts only the most powerful ever.

[@codyloveless713]

Darth Vitiate nearly killed Revan with ease. Now i don't know about you guys, but thats something that Even Palpatine couldn't do if he had the chance. And may I remind you he did it with Meetra on his back as well? And T3-M4? And Lord Scourge? Palpatine may have killed 4 Jedi masters, but if it wasn't for Anakin, he would've been killed.

[@XionToday]

STR33TSofJUST1C3 He could and would utilize his lightsaber in combat. When needed that is, he is a force user he knows rituals and powers NOONE in the known galaxy. He had no fear, he wasn't afraid when the hero of Tython disarmed him, he died around 67 BBY for godsake! Now that is Power.

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

XTEntertainment Correction, he was dead prior to 67BBY. Just because it is said *died somewhere between 3,650B and 67B* is does not mean he died in 67B. The Plagueis Novel was the first Novel that came out after Vitiate's creation and took place in a timeperiod AFTER Swtor.

[@banethesithari]

cody loveless what exactly has revan done that means sidious wouldnt easily beat him ?

[@crysixhq7179]

I hope he did know that Darth Viciate(the emperor) did subdue 8 jedi at once in ca.2 seconds and palpatine had problems with Mace Windu for some minutes.

[@EvanNova95]

Quality over Quantity by friend, Quality over Quantity

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

Problems with Windu? The Visual Encyclopedia and Novel state that Windu was being pushed back by Sidious. Tiin and Fisto, who are on par with Windu's skills were dropped within a heartbeat. The Visual Encyclopedia even stated that Fisto, Tiin, and Kolar were all dead "before Mace even realized what happened". This strongly hints that Sidious left Mace alive on purpose, as he could have killed him when he was busy jumping around the Office. Do take into account that Sidious ignited his blade, cut off Tiin's head, impaled Kolar's forehead, jumped over Mace, locked the door outside, jumped back to his desk, stabbed the recording device; and Mace and Fisto only had time to raise their blades. Mace's Vaapad hadn't kicked in yet. Sidious was waiting for Mace to get his boost so the fight would look much more authentic. Only when Mace started to fully feed of his Vaapad, he was giving Sidious a challenge, but only because Sidious allowed it.

[@crysixhq7179]

Of course not he is my all time favorite jedi, but he was the only one who didn't get killed in 10 sec so i used him as an example.

[@TheRabbitpaws]

CrySixHQ Reality was Palpatine was acutally "testing" Anakin's loyalty and using the fight with Mace Windu to push Anakin into making the decision to join him.

[@crysixhq7179]

i know :)

[@bilal0072003]

Vitiate turned 2 jedi knights to the dark side without even getting out of his chair. Sidious couldn't turn luke to the dark side when luke was effectively less trained than a padawan and had no way of creating any type of force shield to protect himself from telepathic attacks. I understand that sidious was the better swordsman but force powers are ALWAYS more fearsome than blade work.

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

Sidious was able to turn Luke, but did not believe in a forced corruption as the Emperor did. Sidious believed that corrupting someone through lies, deceit and greed for power, instead of torture, pain and suffering was more pure. Sure, you can corrupt a Jedi more easily through the latter, but you limiting that person's potential by creating a ravaging beast that will eventually break down. Corrupting someone to the Dark Side through lies and deceit is much more effective, as the person is far too embedded in the Dark Side when (s)he realizes what (s)he has done. Vader hated himself after his cyborg surgery, but realized he could not go back as he was too much Sith already.

[@arkhaan7066]

STR33TSofJUST1C3 i understand what you are saying but Vitiate didnt force them in to slavering beasts he made them all but worship him and he was telepathically connected to them and they retained there intelligence and will they simply thought they were doing what they wanted instead of what he wanted. Like with Revan and Malak he twisted what they thought was right not who they were

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

George McCoy If someone manipulates you to join the Dark Side, are your actions as a Dark Sider still yours, or of the one that changed you?

[@niqlast200]

STR33TSofJUST1C3 well said, let's also note that Revan went AWOL on the emperor and declared him self Darth Revan, which was a direct challenge to the emperor. So ya Revan was brainwashed but not very well lol.

[@niqlast200]

George McCoy not true, Revan and Malak turned their backs on the emperor, before the rule of two Revan was one of the last sith to ever use the title of Darth which is an open challenge to all as the supreme sith lord. I don't think Revan was even aware of vitiates existence when he did this, but that's up for debate. The point is that to Vitiates own admission, Revans brainwashing did not go as planned.

[@DamienGranz]

One thing I have to disagree with you here is the whole "Natural Power Vs. Modified Power". Really, especially for the Sith, Power is Power. If you became the most powerful being in the universe because you were born that way, or because you trained really hard, or because you sacrificed a whole galaxy doesn't matter, really. If Darth Vitiate could crush you in an instant because he ate infants or because he just could, either way you're weaker than him and that's all that matters. Things like "It's not fair, you should had been.." or whatever, are excuses that losers make as the stronger Sith steps over you. Now I'm not debating maybe that Palpatine was the better Sith, or the better force user or whatever. Maybe he was. But if he was, it wasn't because he was naturally gifted or not. That's meaningless. Caring about whether or not somebody 'earned' or 'respected' their power properly sounds like something a Jedi might concern themselves with, but for a Sith, actions speak louder than boasts, and if one of you is a smoldering crater cracking with lightning and the other is laughing over your remains then they're the loudest. I don't think if Vitiate got into a battle with Palpatine and Palpatine was reduced to a twitching body that he'd care if Palpatine whined "I did more work for my power than you and I deserved to win!". And the reverse is equally true.

[@banethesithari]

but vitate wouldnt be able to use rituals in a fight so his artificial power is useless.

[@DamienGranz]

Yeah, but if you're discounting strategy or planning and basically saying "If I threw these two naked into a steel cage" of course you're going to get skewed results. I'm not saying Vitiate would or would not win though. I'm just saying that giving points for whether somebody's power is or isn't 'real' enough is pointless.

[@banethesithari]

***** if your giving vitate time to prepare then sidious can as well and bare in mind even with the help of 1000s of sith vitate still couldnt use abilitys to the same level sidious could by himself

[@banethesithari]

***** It's confirmed in the Darth Plageuis novel that Vitate dies but it doesn'tsay how or when for obvious reasons

[@arkhaan7066]

banethesithari referencing Sidious vs. Vitiate, having read and studied as much about the old republic as i could i will admit a little ignorance in the new republic storyline. however Vitiate killed a highly respected and feared sith master in one on one combat at the age of 13 and was apprenticed to Marka Ragnos less than a year later and although this video says that he was a failure of a duelist he managed to hold off Lord Scourge, Revan, and Meetra Surik, all of whom were feared swordsmen for a good while before Scourge betrayed the other two. and I know this has been quoted at you numerous times but his mastery of Sith sorcery has never been matched since his death, when he consumed Nathema his force power and life span were increased to the point of Nigh-unstoppable and him simply living on dromund kaas made it a vortex of darkside force power even into Palpatines time, as commented on by Bevel Lemelisk the guy who built the Deathstar, he said that Dromund Kaas was a dark world consumed by lighting storms and twisted monstrous creatures. and that was simply from his presence. Also his force attacks could rend buildings in a blink of his eye he even supposedly crushed a Dreadnought under the command of a traitorus sith in orbit of a different planet with his mind from his throne room

[@GEM.1123]

I've seen this video lots of times, there's still something that bothers me & it's not mentioned: the fact that both sith were political figures (Emperors). Vitiate forged an empire while Sidious took and tansformed an existing power structure. This had an impact on the way they developed as Sith before and after their empires were revealed, it'd be nice to analyze & include that here.

[@scolar_visari]

Vitiate forged 2 empires actually.

[@AnimePhantom1]

"Sidious is an absolute master of force lighting" EvanNova95 my good man even that is a understatement.

[@Sarethon]

As a fan of Star Wars, I love these versus videos, thanks for making them. I find them very entertaining! :)

[@LSTCG]

I'm loving the art work of the ones of Mortis, I'm guessing queen smiley on the very right is abeloth

[@mikeor-]

Yes.

[@mikeor-]

I never really liked Abeloth, which is why I'm glad SHE is the only one of the Ones that is no longer Canon.

[@akkalat85]

I vote Sidious hands down. The guy is badass to the bone. He can destroy you with the force, destroy you with a lightsaber, and MOST importantly, he has an Imperial Armada. He can destroy without lifting a finger.

[@TrAdErInSpAiN]

And he fucked the Republic up from within by politics. Vitiate could not even defeat the Republic. Manipulated The Mandalorians but backfired and could not even manipulate/control Revan.

[@akkalat85]

Arthur Wellesley F yeah, not only does Sidious have unlimited power, he has an entire galaxy at his back! His armada is downright frightening.

[@justinlacek1481]

If you want to talk about armadas, I guarantee that Valkorion and the Eternal Empire would obliterate Sidious and the Galactic Empire.

[@jamesdowson1396]

Vitaite destroys Palpatine and his entire army without doing anything except blinking.

[@PandorasBox7777]

How is Darth Sidious the culmination of the "Rule of 2" Sith when he had to kill his master in his sleep instead of a duel?

[@ThePalaeontologist]

Because Sidious didn't want to have an all out power battle with Plagueis on Coruscant. Remember the time frame here when this was happening. Its literally running parallel and crossing over events within The Phantom Menace. The Jedi Order obviously crawled all over Coruscant. There'd be no reason to risk alerting the whole Jedi Order. People confuse Sidious more carefully taking down Plagueis, as a sign a weakness, for logical self-preservation. If you want to try and make that unconvincing argument, ask it about Plagueis himself... Yeah, about that; how did Tenebrous die? How did Plagueis overthrow him? Wasn't some honourable showdown. These are late phase Banite Rule of Two Sith Lords. If they fight head on, not holding back, that kind of immense power would send shockwaves in the force around the galaxy, with thousands of Jedi there to detect those force signatures. It'd be like a lightning rod of dark side energy revealing itself to the galaxy. Sidious barraging and torturing a drunk, inebriated and aging old Plagueis, frying his respirator and killing him slowly, with his mastery of force lightning, is not the same as having a devastating power battle with his master. The whole point of the Rule of Two was quality over quantity, covert survival, striking from the shadows, being wiser, waiting for the most brutal time to strike. Sidious could have taken Plagueis in a duel. The only thing Sidious may have slightly needed to worry about in terms of Plagueis's powers, was the more elusive aspects of Sith magic and alchemy which Plagueis preferred to dueling with lightsabers or overwhelming force power attacks. Yes, Sidious had to take Plagueis seriously; but the hype over Plagueis is getting ridiculous. There is a reason Sidious was the new generation of the Sith to replace Plagueis. Plagueis was hugely paranoid of being destroyed, and so for Sidious to have actually managed to do what he did, is a remarkable feat in itself. Plagueis knew Sidious could be the end of him. He was like a paranoid miser of power trying to create life from the force and cheat death itself. For the most likely guy in the galaxy to be a risk to Plagueis's survival, his own apprentice, to actually lull Plagueis into a temporary moment of trust and relaxation, is in itself a testament to the intense levels of cunning Sidious was capable. Read more about it yourself. Plagueis had it coming. He'd manipulated Sidious since his youth, but the boy Palpatine once was, still had an innate resistance to grown Muun adult Plagueis from reading his mind; his innate force block and insidious darkness within, was so awful, so disturbing, that even when a young guy, and even when not even trained or initiated to become a Sith yet, even when Plagueis was pretending to be his alter ego and Palpatine didn't know Plagueis was trying to read his mind, something stopped him. Sidious is just so evil it even scared Plagueis - and that was Palpatine *before* a single day of training. Think about it.

[@Venusbluekites]

ThePalaeontologist he wasnt drunk he was drugged or poisoned. sith lords cant get drunk.

[@calumdique6205]

Where did you get that?? If you read the novel plagieus did get drunk. He just never drank after his assassination attempt

[@Venusbluekites]

Calum Dique i read the book and he was poisoned

[@calumdique6205]

The rule of two stopped the dueling due to Darth Tennebrous who like many previous sith lords wanted immortality and ultimate power.

[@tomfeldman100]

The Sith Order, in hiding for a millennium, had awaited the birth of one who was powerful enough to return the Order to prominence. Darth Sidious was the fulfillment of that prophecy, capable of exacting the Sith's revenge on the Jedi for having nearly eradicated the practitioners of the dark side of the Force." -- the Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia.

[@HboykicksA]

Vitiate wins hands down. EvanNova95+ I'm sorry you did a good video, but it felt like the only reason Palpatine won was because you wanted him too. You left out a lot of details of Vitiate and made him sound lame. You also exaggerated and used charged words to make Palp sound better. Vitiate killed Sith Lords and destroyed worlds at 13. He achieved immortality greater than Palp. He created the Sith lords Revan and Malak. He created an Empire out of a few thousand people (As opposed to Palp, who basically took a powerful empire weakened it and took over through a political vote). Vitiate could control whole planets and feeds off of deaths. He has the "Will of the stars and the patience of a stone." He could outlast Palp if nothing else. Vitiate could rule without the pathetic rule of two. Finally, he could destroy galaxies (including the Rishi Maze). When the Hero of Tython defeated Vitiate, you left out many details. 1. Vitiate had just transferred bodies to a new voice severely weakening him from his usual power. 2. Through sheer luck and the exact moment, the HoT managed to defeat his voice. Vitiate still lived; he just needed time to regenerate. Vitiate > Palpatine (I apologize to the many movie loyalists, who can't accept this, and will probably hate. I would just like to add I love the movies and the EU).

[@azronger7214]

That has nothing saying about their skills and it doesn't counter any of my points. They are facts and I can provide a source for each one of them. It also has false info about Vitiate. It was 8000, not 900.

[@itzkgt2919]

lol I agree I play the old republic and vitate was a beast he couldn't be destroyed

[@MatWol41]

Technically, Luke didn't defeat Palpatine, Darth Vader threw him off the platform

[@Raptorman0205]

I immediately raised an eye brow when he said luke defeated palpatine. palpatine never even drew his damn lightsaber in that fight and didn't even fight luke, he just started shocking him with low-level force lightning. palpatine would've destroyed luke in an actual duel in the 6th movie.

[@DarkLordofTheRizz]

+Raptormann0205 Legends Canon moron.

[@Raptorman0205]

Super SwegWill What? Dude, that was all pulled from the movie.

[@DarkLordofTheRizz]

Raptormann0205 No you idiot, the duel with Luke and the emperor happened in legends, you two are referring to the breif confrentation they had in Jedi.

[@Raptorman0205]

Super SwegWill I love how charged you're getting over fictional canons.

[@Batman22]

_Is it just me, or did Evan skip over the fact that Viciate completely destroyed a planet at the age of 13, and was basically un-killable? He was able of taking down opponents with a simple lightning shock and invading their minds with a simple thought. If the Hero of Typhon hadn't stopped Viciate, he would've, and definitely could've, completely destroyed the galaxy, which was his intention._

[@ItsJustFox]

Batman Not to mention the Emporer has recently been revealed to be making a comeback in the latest update

[@judaihyuga]

Batman Yeah, the idea of Palpatine winning this one comes off more as the bias of an old school fan than actually taking into account actual ability.

[@midautumn2012]

Batman I was thinking the same thing. That and the whole Zoist thing. Ye, maybe Palpatine was a better duelist and could use clones to save himself, but Viciate could possess hundred of people at once, divide his soul into multiple sources, extend his life indefinitely, and really the only reason he is killed in the end is because of the damn movie era binding the writers to a happy ending.

[@MrInfortunio]

Yeah that's the big shit about it lol, the Hero of Tython only killed The Voice of The Emperor, like an Avatar, a representative. Dayum :

[@azronger7214]

He died sometime BEFORE 67BBY, and TPM is in 32BBY, not 57BBY.

[@user-it2zg9sr7e]

Vitiate killed a powerful Sith Lord at the age of ten without any training and imprisoned his soul for an eternity of torment

[@EatFuckingTimothy]

Revan was still a fodder

[@calebfrost2822]

Just wanted to weigh in on the Vitiate vs. Sidious debate here. I think that Vitiate's abilities are largely over-estimated. One observation I would like to point out in support of this was the fact during the Golden Age of the Sith, Vitiate waited for fellow Sith Lords Marko Ragnos, Naga Sadow and Ludo Kressh to die/be defeated before beginning his power struggle to control the Sith. Why wait 4th in line if he was so powerful? This observation points to the fact that while Vitiate's power is formidable, he is not the strongest Sith in his era. Vitiate's Sith Empire is impressive, but he does not conquer the entire galaxy. Half of the galaxy was still under the control of the Republic and the Jedi during the game SWTOR. Palpatine's brilliance (and power) is that he doesn't need to display his power in feats. Sidious conquered the Republic and the Jedi using cunning and treachery, rather than pure military conquest. He has a better understanding of the Jedi and knows how to mask his presence from them. The fact that he planned and executed his Grand Plan with little to no Jedi opposition is proof enough that he is able to influence and cloud the minds of the entire Jedi Order. Palpatine was also trained and prepared to duel and fight other Sith, in preparation for the fact that he would one day fight and replace his Master. Vitiate was not; but rather "self-studied" his abilities. Hence, I could conclude that Vitiate not sufficiently exposed to opponents of his own caliber, compared to Palpatine. Palpatine wins simply because he is more cunning, intelligent, has a better application of his powers and is better trained.

[@sirpepeofhousekek6741]

Not to mention Vitiate needed Zildrog to drain Nathema for him. Sidious need no such thing to drain Byss.

[@Bzt117]

A new version of this is definitely needed as we now have the complete story of Tenebrae/Vitiate/Valkorian and now know his full capabilities.

[@K.J.R.Richard]

Agree

[@emzonik8851]

The anwser would be less obvious, indeed Valkorion is the peak of Tenebrae but in the end Palpatine is the most powerfull Sith of all time. He should have the edge anyway. And mind you, the additional story on Tenebrae we got came soley from SWOTOR whoch is a less accurate depiction to the books (lower canon).

[@K.J.R.Richard]

@@emzonik8851 Darth Sidious is not immortal, he need to transfer his essence to cheat death, Vitiate can also do that but he don't need to, he is already immortal. He can drain life force energy from planets in 3 seconds while Sidious took decades to drain Byss, Sidious can create force storms but only in presence of someone like Luke Skywalker. In the end i don't see why some people still think Palpatine is the most powerful Sith lord of all time, they literally have the same powers and here is their most powerful. Force lightning (Both can use it) Sith alchemy (Both can use it) Living force drain (Both can use it) Force maelstrom (Both can use it) Spirit control (Both can use it) Essence transfer (Both can use it) Force storm (Only Palpatine) Immortality "Not aging" (Only Vitiate) And here is their midichlorians count: Vitiate: 25 000 VS Sidious: 20 000. (Yoda is 19 000, Luke is 23 000, while Anakin had 27 000 before his lost on Mustafar)

[@emzonik8851]

@@K.J.R.Richard Palpatine could use force storm way before Luke came to Byss, he even summoned one on Coruscant, ravaged an entire city sector from lightyears away and teleported Luke to his facility. No rituals, just through his own abilities. There's no reason to think even ROTJ Palpatine couldn't already use force storms (which would make Rotj Palpatine way stronger than DE given he had his body). He drained Byss for decades but draining it over night wasn't his goal at all, life energy on Byss was useful to him as through draining it slowly, he kept his great power stable and enhanced his durability. Also, he dominated the minds of all people on the planet (Byss had 20 billion people on it) and made them his blind servants. Again, all on his own, no arefacts, talismans or rituals. Vitiate's "immortality" is the result of rituals and is a great advantage but doesn't make him more powerfull. It isn't of course by any means an actual immortality, it's just a fully independant spirit that can command the force without a vessel. He can exist without a body but he isn't as strong then. Midichlorian count doesn't really matter in terms of actual power if that was the case Anakin should be more powerfull than Tebebrae which is a stupid statement. Midichlorian count only represents potential. (+ pls provide mi with the source for this number in case of valks). Palpatine in Legends is outright confirmed by G and C canon to be the mkst powerfull Sith of all time at the time of ROTS. Episode 3 already! Even if Vitiate was somehow proven more powerfull than Palpatine, it would basically make that one info non-canon. Palps is locked at number 1 in Legends by the nost valid sources possible. That info was always unchangable for the EU. And again, the game is S-canon, it's exagerrated, it took place but not exactly the way it's shown, so only fully accurate feats of Vitiate come from the novels (but to be fair, DE is also kinda inacurate comparing it to the rest of the lore so it should be treated with a grain of salt just as much). Valkorion's skill in rituals and essence transfer is unparalleled even by Sidious but his feats didn't result from his power. Without those additions Tenebrae isn't really that strong at all, while Palpatine's feats result soley from his own strenght in the force. Valkorion has the biggest chance against Dark Empire Palpatine, as his glory days are over and despite his force storm he is vulnearable due to instable power, decaying clones and dmaged mind. But his victory is still not likely. Fully capable Sidious would have a tough time but would win in most cases.

[@K.J.R.Richard]

@@emzonik8851 At this point i would bet on a draw, because if you kill Vitiate even with a force storm, he will comeback with another body, if you kill Palpatine he would comeback in another clone, they would need to destroy their spirits to manage to kill each other and this fight would last 300 years lol, they would just give up at this point. And i'm agree that Sidious from ROTJ is the most powerful version of himself, but the ROTS version is not that powerful, Palpatine became chancellor and stop increase in powers between TPM and the rise of the empire, because he just didn't have time, even his fight between him and Maul on Mandalore was the only fight he had in decades... So it is really when he became emperor that he start to reach his peak by learning more dark side knowledge, most of it came from Sith holocrons storaged in the Jedi temple. And yes, midichlorians count do have a big impact, if a Sith lord that have a count of 22 000 is using force lightning, his force lightning will be more powerful than the sith that only have a 18 000 count, if Anakin would have been born in the old republic (way more easy to find dark side knowledge in this era), Vitiate probably would have made him his aprentice to use him as a tool, most like Marka Ragnos did when he found young Tenebrae.

[@SuperTJdude]

Yeah you need to update this lmao. Vitiate now can literally flick Palpatine now.

[@gamingexpert2191]

Why? What has happened?

[@Nemox94]

+GamingEXpert21 Vitiate was far from dead

[@melfos1]

+TheJulkkis by the whole time he was building his Sith Empire, on the other side of the galaxy he created another epmire on Zakuul, which was his main focus. He also took control of almost all people on Zist before wiping out all life there. Check the First chapter The Hunt of KOTFE, its really well made

[@butterbean8881]

+Aleksander Ramstad No, he did die like 60 years before Paplatines rise, but they are just telling his story after his first apparent death in SWTOR.

[@SuperTJdude]

***** lmao

[@papaofthejohns5882]

While Sidious' skill with Sith Alchemy is not fully explored, he did write a book called "Creation of Monsters" and he wrote books on the other things he was an expert in which leads us to believe he was an expert. As well as the fact that he created many powerful monsters and a Sith Prophet.

[@Lothi66]

Thats why i hate cinematic saga. Luke most powerfull jedi ever, Palpatine most powerfull sith ever, Mace Windu most powerfull swordmaster ever, bla bla bla. This is soo boring.

[@qawsedf234]

Yoda was the best swordsman. Mace was always number 2 in that department.

[@krzysztofaleksandrowicz9200]

qawsedf234 Luke Skywalker is the most powerful force user and swordsman in the universe.

[@analothor]

Mana Amalefnei your face is boring

[@elimoody9626]

Hey! There are a lot more useless facts that there that you might find interesting. I take offense to this because like Evan, I am a Star Wars geek.

[@6jackace]

qawsedf234 no mace was the swordsman

[@tomfeldman100]

Palpatine has spent decades studying the most arcane and esoteric Jedi disciplines. It is believed that he has mastered nearly all the known powers, previously unknown powers, and devises new ones at his pleasure"-- The Dark Empire Sourcebook.

[@desercitus]

Vitiate can completely dominate entire cities, battalions of trained Jedi, all at once, subduing them to his will completely. He takes out an entire Jedi strike team, made up by the most powerful there is, within seconds using only Sith lightning. He can unleash Sith lightning so powerful it kills one of the strongest Sith in existence instantly, capable of taking out fleets, killing hundreds of people. Without preparation, on the go! He has repeatedly proven he is powerful enough to drain entire planets of life. The whole idea of Vitiate is that he's basically all-powerful. Sidious was the most powerful being of his time, but hands down, he couldn't hold a candle to Vitiate.

[@desercitus]

+desercitus Taken both are at the height of their power.

[@JXZX1]

+desercitus Byss. Look it up.

[@JXZX1]

+desercitus Also. Nihilus called. Draining entire planets has been done before--WITHOUT the aid of countless rituals.

[@thebaronlouis8619]

+desercitus "Without preparation, on the go!" not true. When he isn't prepared, he gets his ass handed to him. To the point where all it takes to kill him is one person distracting him and another to sneak around and bust a cap in his ass. Sidious wins.

[@butterbean8881]

+desercitus Vitiate used rituals/ artifacts to augment his power to gain power and drain millions of lifeforms. Sidious drained the life form byss which contained BILLIONS of lifeforms. Vitiate like Sidious, transferred bodies to stay alive but Sidious was so powerful that the bodies he transferred became too corrupted by the darkside. He was known as a nexus of the Dark side and the most powerful sith of all time, I don't think Vitiate stands a chance.

[@rantaro9440]

Vitiate would win hands down. You'd know why if you played SWToR Not only was he much weaker during the duel with The Hero of Tython, whom he turned to the dark side along with two other knights and a council master for a considerable time without even touching or speaking, but even in his weakened state, his force push one hit kills you.

[@ravenfal1496]

Doesn't mean he's stronger than Palpatine. You're making assumptions based on how he fairs vs. the Hero of Tython (whom Evan Nova has said is unusable in a vs. episode due to all of his/her feats relying of the player's choices), and therefore assuming that the Hero of Tython is on the level of people like Sidious or Windu, both of whom are likely stronger than the Hero of Tython.

[@mranderson4580]

RavenFal That's not even Vitiate's real body, that's just his other humanoid host, power compared to his sith body. Not to mention, his human body is drastically weakened because he had been orchestrating his galactic consumption ritual for weeks which used up a large amount of his energy

[@ravenfal1496]

Given KOTET's ending, it would seem that his original sith body has long since perished. The guy wanted to take the outlander's body and stay in that body for the rest of eternity, ruling the galaxy, implying that it doesn't matter which body he has. Though you are right about how he was most likely weakened because of the ritual.

[@doomblade2902]

vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Matthew_Schroeder/Star_Wars:_The_Not-Quite_Tragedy_of_Darth_Sidious Sidious literally shook Stars out of alignment with his newfound power immediately after murdering Plagieus, and that was long before Dark Empire when he reached his peak with Force Storm, which has been calced to reach Solar System levels of destruction. Not saying that Vitiate isnt on that level, but a lot of people seem to underestimate Palpatine just because Vitiate has lived longer. Reminder also that it also took the souls of *every single Jedi* from the past 25000 years (which includes the likes of Yoda, Satele Shan, Revan, The Hero of Thython, etc) to ensure that Sidious's soul was destroyed permanently, which shows that at the end he was ridiculously far above Vitiate since even he didnt require so much to finish him off permanently.

[@justsomeguywhokeepsgetting4885]

Agree

[@deathstick8]

I hate to be the guy who beats the dead horse but this definitely needs a rematch. Vitiate being Valkorion changes the dynamics drastically. Just as a small example, Valkorion was able to outright kill Darth Marr with a casual blast of Force Lightning - keep in mind that Marr was a rather powerful Sith in his own right and on top of that he was completely on guard. But even with that Valkorion was able to rip through his defenses and destroy him instantly with a blast of power that took absolutely no time to concentrate and did not fatigue Valkorion in the least. But for its time this was a very well researched topic. Kudos, my guy.

[@emzonik8851]

Well, as Valkorion he was no longer a sith so he could be more powerfull (sidious is stated to be the most powerfull sith), however even with what you said, I don't think Palpatine looses. In Rots he killed Windu via force lightning in 5 to 10s and I know that it wasn't a "casual" force lightning and that Marr died in 1s, however 2 things need to be considered: Windu is much stronger than Marr; Palpatine became vastly more powerfull than in ROTS over the years by the time Of ROTJ he propably would be able to destroy Windu (if by surprise) in 1 or 2 seconds. Also, did Valkorion know how to use force storm? Nope, and this thing is powerfull as fuck, it can turn planets into dust. Also, the storm was used by DE Palpatine but I belive ROTJ palpatine was stronger. I'd conclude it like this: Episode 6 Palpatine>Dark Empire Palpatine>Tenebrae as Valk>>Tenebrae as Vitiate>/=Episode 3 Palpatine.

[@deathstick8]

@@emzonik8851 good points but I don't really think we have enough information to confirm or deny whether Mace is more powerful than Marr. Mace was second in command of the Jedi Council, but Marr was THE leader of the Dark Council and played the role of interim Emperor (in practice, not title) after Vitiate fled into dark space to retake control of his Eternal Empire - and Marr did this unopposed. He had to have been at least a moderate powerhouse to not have any other Dark Council members challenge him on taking the role of de facto leader of the Empire. On the other hand, while Mace was strong his true power lay in his Shatter Point abilities, not raw Force power. If he and Marr fought I don't know who would win but I feel confident in saying that even if Marr lost he would certainly give Mace a run for his money. Now let's look at another of Valkorian's displays. While he was still under the guise of Vitiate, he was able to wipe an entire planet of all life and consume that Force essence almost instantly. What's more is that he did this pretty much right after he came out of a comatose state that he was in for quite some time. I don't have proof that he can conjure a Force Storm. But for a guy that can consume the Force essence of every living creature on an entire planet within mere moments, I don't think a Force Storm, even one the size of those used by Palpating in the old EU, would be much of a challenge. My last bit of evidence is Vader. At the end of RotJ, Vader picks up Palpatine and carries him what looked to be several meters to toss him down that shaft. As we saw, Palpatine's lightning curved around and struck Vader the entire time. Now, I don't presume to know what was going through the Emperor's mind at that moment but I'm willing to bet solid credits that he was pouring every bit of hate, rage and power into those bolts that hit Vader. He was striking him for a solid 8 seconds with, presumably, everything he had and still couldn't bring an injured Vader to his knees who was already mortally weak to lightning and we know that at the time Vader was only about 70% as powerful as Palpatine. So to sum it up, Marr was far above average in terms of power (though we can't confirm difference between him and Mace), Valkorian/Vitiate has displayed an ability to wipe out and consume all organic life on an entire planet which means he was probably capable of other unfathomable feats of power, and Palpatine couldn't kill a man who was 1) less powerful than he was, 2) already wounded from a fight only minutes before and 3) who was inherently gravely weak to lightning with a full eight seconds of dedicated lighting blasts. Bear in mind I haven't read much of the old EU comics or novels that included Palpatine, I started with the Thrawn books then went right into the Legacy of the Force series. So if I'm missing anything major from Palpatine that anyone else knows I'd appreciate the company in this debate. We are, after all, using a non-canonical character in Vitiate, might as well use whatever version of Palpatine is the most powerful.

[@davidk2023]

@@deathstick8 Consider yourself lucky. Dark empire is the worst piece of garbage ever written, it even makes the disney movies look good. And the art makes your eyes bleed. Palpatine is not as powerful in those comics as everyone says. He could make force storms that were large enough to swallow some ships and give a janitor a bad day, that's it. He was never able to do more than that, anyone who says so is BSing. Palpatine lost a light saber match to jedi knight luke skywalker (that's right, not master, not grandmaster, but knight). And later luke got his butt kicked by lady lumiya before he figured out to use a shoto. Palpatine was cut off from the force by jedi knight luke skywalker and apprentice leah who barely knew anything about the force at the time. Palpatine was an idiot who was more akin to a saturday morning cartoon villain, than the brilliant puppet master we are used to seeing during the clone wars and afterwards. He also constantly couldn't control his anger, which caused his last body to deprecate faster. Palpatine's spirit was not able to even break the willpower of a guy who lived in a barrel. His spirit was taken to the force along with barrel guys. And no it did not take literally ALL the jedi to contain him. He was contained by one guy and his spirit was ripped apart afterwards. It was just a VERY charitable interpretation of a throwaway line that barrel guy said before he took him to the force. He wasn't really that powerful, Im not even sure if he scaled up to caidus or kyp duram if we use JK luke, JM luke and GM luke as the template for comparison.

[@jackwilliamsmith8734]

Interesting verdict and I agree with it. For years I thought Sidious was more powerful than Vitiate but I started to wonder otherwise. However this video reassures me that Palpatine is stronger.

[@atsukosan_artwork]

This video is fantastic!! I haven't finished it, I'm watching it now, but is awesome, you know so much about Star Wars!! keep it up bro!! I hope you make more great videos! :D Merry Christmas!! :D

[@josiahjenksisawesome]

It's funny to watch this directly after watching the New Council Forcecast episode. In that one, everyone's talking about how Weak Sidious is. Here, Evan is Praising him like some kind of god.

[@lazerspace9337]

True

[@smexehcougah3]

Wow, lot of hate for this video in the comments. So, after learning of Vitiates abilities, I think that Sidious would pledge himself to be Vitiate's apprentice only to murder the old fool when he's weak. Having learned the secrets of Vitiate's immortality, he would be able to prevent his 'master' from taking advantage of it. Vitiate concentrated on discovering new things for himself, but that's not the sith way. Why work hard to achieve for yourself when you can take from others? That's the way of the sith and that was the way of Sidious.

[@jakobrenner2230]

This is a possible scenario and actually makes me see that Vitiate and Plagueis are similar in many ways. However if this was Palpatine from Dark Empire, I think that the two Dark Lords would have nothing to say to each other; there can only be one Dark Lord of the Sith and both are in the peak of their power si they would likely fight to the death.

[@ZoneXGamer]

and vitiate has also defeated several jedis in seconds

[@mikeor-]

So did Palpatine, killing Saesee Tiin, Agen Kolar, and Kit Fisto in less than a minute.

[@SoulKiller7Eternal]

@@mikeor- Sidious killed them. Vitiate fucking mind controlled them.

[@mikeor-]

@@SoulKiller7Eternal Defeating them is NOT the same thing as controlling them, and killing them is a far more easier way to dispose of them rather than imprisoning someone for 300 years, not knowing that he would still haunt you after your die. Read the room: Palpatine is superior in every way.

[@justsomeguywhokeepsgetting4885]

​@@mikeor- Exactly. Also Palpatine mind controlled byss and mind dominated 20 billion people. Not only that, the thrawn trilogy revealed that Sidious was able to manage a galaxy wide empire and control them with the dark side.

[@starwarslegendsfan5712]

@@mikeor- The reason Kit Fisto died is because he sensed Anakin coming through the force which gave Palpatine enough time to kill him.

[@sheevpalpatine2128]

Im da winner, and the senate.

[@DarthMarr2009]

Valkorion definitely wins via multiple scaling chains

[@gamingrican5833]

love that you do palpatine videos there are not enough of them more please. keep up the great work

[@kerrycollier5297]

Lucas said Palpatine was the most power Sith ever, and Luke was the more powerful than he was. End of story.

[@MarkaNgamer]

Lucas said many things he changed later. I don´t see him as stable Lore-master, not even close. Star Wars has become like no-man´s franchise, where no one has a pure definition or word on it.

[@kerrycollier5297]

There are tiers of lore. It's all out there. You can be as masturbatory as you want over your favorite and think it's the bestest, but anyone that actually knows anything about the lore knows how it works

[@Emilherulf]

MarkaNLNL True, but theres no doubt Sidious was the most powerful sith.

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

MarkaNLNL Possibly. But the statement that Sidious and Luke are the two most powerful of the Jedi and Sith has never been contradicted after that point. Also, C-Canon Lore is maintained by Leland Chee. He even helped JJ in the New Trilogy's script.

[@HolyknightVader999]

Um, no, Lucas says that STARKILLER was the strongest force-wielder of the era of the movies. Had STARKILLER lived long enough, he'd be stronger than the Emperor at his peak.

[@emzonik8851]

YES THIS NEEDS A REMACH JUST TO PROVE TO THOSE PEOPLE THAT NEW INFO AND VALKORION BODY STILL DON'T CHANGE THE VERDICT.

[@darth_chaos4616]

Honestly after considering both emperors, Im pretty sure Vitiate would win. His early efforts leading an empire as a little boy and destroying a planet at 13 made everybody think of him as a god. He was able to switch bodies, several times, something Palpatine failed to do. Not just that he fed on the hatred of others, and was nearly unstoppable. Oh yeah and also look how many wars he started, he started the Mandalorian Wars AND the Jedi Civil War, he also started the reoccurring Empire and Republic wars, the Cold War, and would have started countless more had he not been stopped. Palpatine was impressive with his powers and his ability to be both Chancellor and Emperor simultaneously, but I do believe Vitiate is much stronger, smarter, and more dangerous. He even destroyed planets without a death star.

[@analothor]

Darth_Chaos sidious was still better i guarantee sid could do anything vitiate did if he used sith sorcery to empower his body as well and even IF vitiate stared off with more raw power in the force sidious ended up with more skill manipulating it as a whole plus it only took one lifetime to become thing powerful for sidious

[@DarthCuddlefluff]

This needs a redo now that KOtFE is out.

[@ravenfal1496]

Not really. Valkorion still gets stabbed in the back, so he's only immune to lightsabers when he's prepared, and Palpatine is more that fast enough to get behind him. If you want to bring up one-shotting Marr, remember that Revan turned a Dark Council member to dust in one shot, and was easily overwhelmed by Vitiate.

[@DarthCuddlefluff]

Wrathemon28 Uhh. He smiled before and as he was being stabbed. It only made him more powerful. He is not even close to dead. He is just an extremely powerful force entity now.

[@ravenfal1496]

Conor McIntyre Depends on how you determine a battle to the death. If it ends when the body dies, Palpatine would win. If Valkorion gets to become a force entity after his body dies (assuming he doesn't still need a host body, like the outlander's) then he wins because Palpatine probably can't do anything to harm him.

[@DarthCuddlefluff]

Wrathemon28 Yeah, I suppose that's right. Although Palpatine did master essence transfer. So depending on when they are fighting in the timeline Palpatine could theoretically run away. It would be a hard fight for sure. Also I would image it would be hard to determine Vitiate's lightsaber abilities.

[@sharpshot545]

He never needed them, as he was virtually immortal. Death meant very little to him.

[@CrimsonBlasphemy]

Just a small point. In the Revenge of the Sith scene with Windu and the way Palpatine dispatches Windu, I'd say that at no point was Palpatine subdued. By that point in the fight Anakin was back in the area (which Palpatine would have sensed). The situation Anakin walked in on was setup by Palpatine as final test, forcing Anakin to take the final step in betrayal. I would point to the surge Palpatine released at Windu once Anakin sided with him. He could have done so at any point. As demonstrated elsewhere in Palapintes power sets, combining force waves with Sith lighting. While I'm sure Lucas didn't go down this through process when writing the scene it plays out logically. Palaptine gets kinda unreasonably bumbly just before Anakin showed up.

[@MrMoimo]

a few seconds late and Windu would have killed Palpatine.

[@undead4500]

Gilles Grenier no he wouldn't. sidious held back and mace would die same way regardless if anakin interfered or not.

[@undead4500]

***** anakin always hated mace windu.

[@HopScopCo]

undead4500 It was stated (I think in the novelization of episode 3) that Mace Windu actually got the better of Palpatine in the lightsaber duel, meaning when Windu disarmed Palpatine, that was not in Palpatine's plan.

[@undead4500]

Owera Darksky nope in novelization sidious turned the tides back to his favor and mace windu had no strength left to fight his own lightsaber he even begged anakin to help him.

[@inflationrisk]

Wait, the power thing I don't get. A gun is still a gun, whether you earned money to buy it, or if its given by someone. Sorry, but your view of power makes absolutely no sense.

[@banethesithari]

His point is what vitate did in rituals is useless in a fight as it takes several minutes to several days to perform a ritual so if vitate tried to use one in a fight sidious wouldnt just stand there and wait for him to perform it.

[@inflationrisk]

-.- that wasnt what i meant i meant the "artificial power vs natural power" argument. In a no holds barred fight, especially regarding Sith, Power is power. Period.

[@banethesithari]

Inflation Risk Yes but most of Vitates best feats are parts of rituals which means there void in a fight ,even with rituals vitate still isnt as impressive in the force as sidious

[@inflationrisk]

... this still doesn't change the fact that his view on "artificial power vs natural power" makes no sense.

[@inflationrisk]

***** Based on your logic, easier time gaining doesn't add any advantages when what you're comparing is how much they can lift. Try thinking this way. someone who got big enough to lift 120 pounds from pure training VS someone who got big enough to lift 120 pounds from steroids = They both lift 120 pounds. Sure, steroid guy may have side effects after, or natural guy may have accomplished easier (based on what you said) but it doesn't change the fact that, as of the single moment where their peak strength is being contested, THEY BOTH LIFT THE SAME WEIGHT.

[@jeezed2950]

Dude that was awesome!

[@gorefreak2]

I think Vitiate's powers are far more impressive. Especially considering his knowledge of Sith Sorcery.

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

Considering that Sidious was also skilled in Sith Magic is no small feat. Sith Magic is usually only reserved for those that are directly bound to the Dark Side, such as the Sith Species. As Sidious was able to conjure spells using Sith Magic, he himself must've been descended from a Sith bloodline long before. Sith Magic was more or less lost after the Resurgent Empire. Zannah, Plagueis and Sidious are the only ones I know that know Sith Magic that far in the Timeline.

[@gorefreak2]

STR33TSofJUST1C3 True enough but Vitiate's feats with Sith Sorcery certainly seem to show a greater degree of skill.

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

Pierce Miller Possibly. Both of them knew a Ritual that would drain Essence on a large scale that would render them both near-immortal. The Emperor used this Ritual to drain the Essence of an entire planet, yet requiring participants called Channels to do so. Sidious, while not conjuring the Ritual on a large and desperate scale such as the Emperor, did not require the Essence to be channeled through various participants. The Emperor drained everything in one go, yet Sidious drained systematically over time. Both have advantages and disadvantages. Draining everything immediately allows for a massive increase in power and lifespan and does not require the user to connect to his Ritual over longer periods of time. Draining slowly over time will allow for a more efficient increase in power. The more victims, the slower the Drain while still retaining the same amount of Essence income. All the while the victims are slowly drained, they do regenerate slowly over time, allowing for much more Essence to be absorbed than if they were absorbed immediately. This way, the Ritual user would appear immortal in his domain (place where Ritual was first cast). Both also were familiar with Rituals that would enhance the abilities of others. Both the Emperor and Sidious were able to increase the power of their followers through a similar ritual. Sidious enhanced his Dark Acolytes, The Emperor enhanced his Wrath and his Hand. Both knew the ability to transfer (part of) their Essence into another being. While the Emperor was able to transfer a part of his mind into multiple victims, he could never fully transfer his complete essence into a new vessel. He copied his mind into his Voice through a powerful Mind Control ability, and transferred a small part of his Essence into his Children upon their birth. While his Children never required any focus, the Emperor did need to focus on his Voice, as the two were never different individuals. There was always one acting, and one focusing on the other. Sidious wasn't able to transfer a part of his Essence, yet only able to transfer his complete essence. Again, both variants have advantages and disadvantages, yet each of them seemed superior to the other at the time when they lived. Sidious had no use transferring only a part of his essence in his Empire; and the Emperor would have been unable to control his Empire if he was only able to transfer his complete essence. There is only one thing between Sidious and the Emperor that cannot be twisted by any words, and that is that Sidious is the more proficient blademaster. On all other terms, their own variants seemed more applicable at the time.

[@Didact13]

STR33TSofJUST1C3 I'm not arguing here, I'm just going off of what was said in the... Knight storyline, I believe, but isn't it said that Vitiate wouldn't need the channels if he drained a world again due to his massive power increase? I'm not 100% certain, and I am aware that Sidious is the greater Lord, but I was curious on that point

[@gorgivasilev1040]

Vitiate is lazy AF he is just sitting in the Dromund Kaas temple all by himself for 1400 years!!!

[@jasonmartel4603]

Well Sidious died at the hands of Darth Vader & Rey. Now Reys total training amounts to approxitely 3 years if that. Looking at it, how is Sidious considered a match for anyone need only Viatete who ruled for 1000 years as the original emporer?

[@TheBrunarr]

I'm glad you mentioned Vitiate kept up with the times by using a light saber, at first I thought you'd forgotten that the era he grew up in had no lightsabers but only Sith swords, which also adds to the fact of why he's a terrible lightsaber duelist.

[@binichschlau]

I just discovered this very nice format👐 subscribed👍

[@gopbartibogue1651]

awesome videos man !

[@IamJacksColon4]

Darth Sidious was toying with mace windu and used him to manipulate anakin. he could have killed windu whenever he wanted.

[@jasonmaxwell9762]

BS

[@awesomeguy2271]

Anyone who thinks Sidious would win obviously didn't take the time to learn anything about Vitiate, or is so biased towards the movies that they didn't even give this match a second thought.

[@banethesithari]

anyone who thinks vitate would stand a chance let alone win knows nothing about star wars ,sidious completly surpasses vitate with the force and a lightsaber

[@awesomeguy2271]

Palpatine would've been dead if not for Anakin. Also, in Episode 6 he didn't even put up a fight against Vader. Vitiate, on the other hand, was only ever defeated in his possessed bodies, never his own.

[@banethesithari]

awesomeguy2271 yes becasue sidious was fighting one of the most powerful edi ever who was the master of vaapad which perfecty counters sidious, sidious didnt lose becasue he's less powerful or skilled but becasue he was perfectly countered by windus style and there was nothign he could do about it. sidious in the 5 seconds he had from being pciked up to thrown over the ledge broke through vader force sheild completely destroyed vaders suit (which is incredibly resistant to lightening and then hurt vader enough to kill him in 5seconds he did that to one of the most powerful sith ever vitate has never defeated anyone of any note becasue he spent most his life hiding (even during a war) sidious completly outclasses vitate with a lightsaber and the force siidous know more and can use them on a great scale theres nothing vitate could do to beat sidious

[@awesomeguy2271]

***** If you had actually read the EU you'd know that Vitiate is more powerful lol. banethesithari Sidious is more powerful with a lightsaber for sure, but just because the guy says he was better with the firce as well doesn't mean he is. Vitiate defeated Revan and Malak without even a proper fight. He devoted all of his power to his force powers. He was able to break the minds of thousands of sith in one moment. He spent thousands of years studying everything there was to know about the dark side of the force, and even completed the most intricate and difficult ritual any sith had ever done.

[@banethesithari]

awesomeguy2271 "but just because the guy says he was better with the firce as well doesn't mean he is." true sidious isnt more powerful in the force becasue he said so but becasue he has more impressive feats " Vitiate defeated Revan and Malak without even a proper fight" revan and malak arnt powerful malak is featles neither mastered a lightsaber form and neither have done anything impressive with the force, revan fired back powerful shot of lightening but thats it and sidious lightening would be far more powerful than nyriss "He devoted all of his power to his force powers." doesnt mean he's more powerful "He spent thousands of years studying everything there was to know about the dark side of the force, and even completed the most intricate and difficult ritual any sith had ever done." you know damn well he didnt learn everything about the darkside the most impressive ritual vitate performed was draining all life from a planet with millions on sidious drained the life form a planet with BILLIONS by himself with his own natural power sidious tore entire fleets apart with the force,he created black holes in the force ,he destroyed entire battalions with a single blast of lightening, all of vitate impressive feats are in rituals which wouldnt be useful in a fight

[@ultratankie]

Also, I would really love to see this fight. Somehow, maybe through Palpatine meditating on the dark side and confronting a mental "echo" of Vitiate that survived through the eons, having the two fight within a battlefield of their own psyches. It would be great to hear them mock each other, to see Palpatine nearly humbled as the Emperor calls him an "unfocused boy", only to have Sidious stand up and annihilate what remains of Vitiate's mind with an unrelenting blast of lighting, proclaiming himself the greatest Dark Lord who has ever lived.

[@klaudiagrob]

The thing with Palpatine is that he was already born with this great evil. Every event in Clone Wars was his masterplan, Destroying Republic, destroying Jedi Order and turning Anakin Skywalker. He saw great potential of force in Anakin so he wanted to claim him as his apprentice.

[@tomfeldman100]

Yoda went after Palpatine in the empty Senate chamber, but could not defeat the most powerful Sith Lord in history.”(The New Essential Chronology, page 84 )

[@mikeor-]

He COULD match him, however.

[@neplsip8184]

@@mikeor- sidious lacked ligthsabers skills to quickly dispatch yoda, in a longer force showdown yoda would have lost. Also sidious didin't reach his full potential as of ep. III. 20 years later he had much more knowledge of the dark side.

[@mikeor-]

@@neplsip8184 Matching Yoda in lightsaber skills does not mean having the ability to dispatch him. That is why their duel ended in a stalemate.

[@mikeor-]

@@williamdai8796 I take the movies, not the novelizations, as fact.

[@killer13324]

You forgot to mention that the planet that he wiped out also became an absolute void in the Force. It had absolutely no presence whatsoever and any force-sensitive that got within orbit would begin feeling physically ill

[@EternalXSamurai]

He also forgot to mention that Sidious himself has a very similar description in not one, not two but three sources.

[@toddkurzbard]

This...THIS is the one I've been waiting for... ..The war of the SUPER, SUPER Heavyweights.

[@Sidragrosm]

First off, nice vid - thorough, clear and precise. (& yes - Vitiate, for all his "arcane" knowledge, was BADLY outclassed by Sidious.) One point that you might take into account for future Versus vids would be tactical know-how. ( i.e. manipulation via deception, strategy, etc. along with their battlefield counter-parts. Said skills being one of both Palpatines' and Revan's stronger aspects). Lastly, for your "Rule of Two" vs. Ancient Sith challenge..? Makra Ragnos vs. Darth Bane.

[@ernestoarroyo4278]

clearly darth vader killed darth sidious not luke

[@Spitz541]

i know

[@KingGaming001]

Luke defeated him but didn't kill him

[@KingGaming001]

Luke defeated Sidious with distraction while Vader pushed him into the core

[@markmayfield2228]

That is true in the first battle, but, in Luke's foray into the dark side, he did kill him after destroying the clone vats.

[@thearianmandalorian]

Mark Mayfield but that was a clone. not the real palpatine

[@multisturge]

Vitiate wins hands down I say, centuries hold, immortal, has an Empire, has different special agents like the Voice and Wrath and the Hand group. Vitiate uses a ritual to remove the Force itself from a planet, Palpatine just uses the Death Star to blow planets up. Vitiate used the Force to create copies of themselves during the fight with Hero of Typhon to make up for the lack in lightsaber skills and from the latest expansion of SWTOR Vitiate is just an entity in space and as theories go the body form of Vitiate pictured and killed by Hero was a Voice not the real Vitiate as the Vitiate with all the powers and his age he has become an entity because bodies age and die but an entity of pure darkness and power is immortal.

[@qawsedf234]

Vitiate required help from 8,000 Sith Lords and a ten day long ritual to drain a nearby planet with a few million people. Palpatine drained/siphoned a planet with 19.6 billion people by himself from across the galaxy. Sidious can also at will summon a Force Storm (wormhole) that can destroy star fleets and tear apart the surface of worlds. Palpatine has mastered all seven forms of lightsaber combat and can also create doppelgangers. Finally Sidious possess the same, if not better, skill in essence transfer and was only stopped when every dead Jedi in existence imprisoned his soul in chaos/hell. Vitiate has no advantage or chance to beat Sidious in a 1 vs 1 duel.

[@Nephalem2002]

qawsedf234 That was the first time he was freaking doing it. He drained Ziost like it wasn’t shit later on.

[@farbodbadihi5332]

Palpatine at the height of his power was matched by Luke and Leia, former had maybe reached half of his full potential while the latter was still an apprentice. Luke at his full power could barely stand his ground against a disembodied spirit of Marka Ragnos who couldn't really unleash his full power on Luke and only lost because the ritual bringing him back to life was interrupted. Now taking that line of comparisons into account, oldboy Marka thought that a Vitiate while still a teenager was a force to be reckoned with and in time would far outgrow him in terms of power, and this is the ancient Sith we're talking about, the people who pushed back the infinite empire at the height of their power and Vitiate drained an entire planet of those Sith. Him being defeated by a destined Jedi who had already beaten the greatest of the Sith combatants, while having previously beaten Revan and the Jedi exile doesn't really knock him down. Palpatine hasn't got shit in comparison to vitiate in terms of force power.

[@davidk2023]

I think the sith you are talking about is exar kun. Marko ragnos spirit did come back once but was "defeated" by jaden korr. The ancient sith didn't exist in the time of the infinite empire. The infinite empire died because they started losing connection to the force and were not able to use their technology which required a connection to the force in order to use. The sith came into existence wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy after that when the dark jedi were expelled from the order conquered and interbred with the species on korriban. And the jedi knight beat a SEVERELY weakened version of vitiate. Not only was his power cut in more than half due to his split with valkorion on zakuul, he was severely weakened during the sel-makor thing on voss. The devs confirmed this already. A full powered valkorion spirit humiliated the outlander/hero of tython before defeating him and then trying to possess his body. On nathema, vitiate did dominate the minds of 8000 sith and used them to help prepare a ritual, but he didn't wipe out/drain all life. He used a machine god named zildrog to wipe out all life on nathema and using the ritual devoured all the spirits/souls/force energy/whatever caused by the deaths. A weakened valkorion already beat revan, meetra/exile, marr, vaylin, archann, the outlander/hero of tython, satele shan and a lot of other powerful force users.

[@jacobmathena6241]

Great video!

[@refurbishedtechpriest9076]

Very nice video. While I've always been a Palpatine fan, in recent years I've come to like Vitiate quite a bit as well. And while your video does bring some very good points as to the qualities of these two Sith Lords, I think you don't quite give Vitiate enough credit in terms of his Force abilities. When all is said and done, I can't deny that this would be a very close fight.

[@alatea3685]

Not really. Palpatine was able to use force storms (wormholes) that could destroy entire fleets. How could Vitiate defend himself against this ability?

[@refurbishedtechpriest9076]

That kind of stuff took considerable concentration on Palpatine's part if I remember right. Odds are that wouldn't be very practical in a duel between these two.

[@jonjo2598]

***** We know for a fact that many sith possess the ability to incinerate others with lightning, as seen in the Revan novel, if they can turn opponents to dust I don't know how much more powerful any could be.

[@refurbishedtechpriest9076]

***** Let's not forget that sometimes games don't do a character justice. When you fight Vitiate, the game developers had to tone him down so that you can actually one-man him. Otherwise, you'd get your butt kicked in seconds.

[@youngbuck189]

The One True Sith Emperor was the greatest threat the galaxy ever faced. Palpatine was a sad excuse for a Sith Lord in comparison. Palpatine edge as force user? The silliest thing I've ever heard.

[@personahearts358]

Damn right

[@ht9ar41]

Exactly. Vitiate also killed all of the Dark Council in one second without being able to see or hear them.

[@matthewwithum8372]

youngbuck189 Completely agree.

[@ivybellino2238]

Man I love this video

[@shiningarmour6805]

Sidious is stronger not because of who he is, but the method he came to be. Darth Bane's rule of two kept refining Sith for a thousand years and Sidious was the final product of this. As an individual and had Palpatine been raised in any other Sith method, he would have come off as average. Just goes to show how the Rule of Two was extremely efficient that only the Chosen One could undo.

[@djbray7]

Um, no. Sidious had immense power. If trained in any other era, he would still be the most powerful Sith ever.

[@narayanamurthy4121]

If Sidious was so powerful why didn't he challenge Darth Pleagaus instead of killing him in sleep ?

[@djbray7]

Narayana Murthy, because that's not how the Sith work. Or, at least, not how Sidious worked. If he had had this massive battle, they probably would have been discovered, and he did not want that. Also, Sidious was not in his prime. Not until a few years later. Do I believe Sidious, pre-prime, could have beaten Plagueis? Yes. Easily? No. Like I said, he didn't want a massive battle. And also, logically, wouldn't you pick the easiest way to dispatch your foe? Why have a massive battle where possible discovery or injury could happen, when you can kill him in his sleep? It's just logical to do what he did.

[@shiningarmour6805]

Daniel Bray It contradicts the Rule of Two though. Yes it was smart, and personally? I think Sidious in his prime could defeat Plagueis at his best too. I think how Sidious takes down Plagueis is foreshadow at how the whole Rule of Two was starting to get undone since Darth Tenebrous. The ironic poetry is that the moment it was fully abandoned by Sidious, it marked the end of the Sith. One could argue that if Vader was taught fully with the intent of making him a successor, he'd have never turned to the light.

[@narayanamurthy4121]

Sith master/apprentice battles have been going on for some thousand years from Darth Bane. They did not detected by Jedi these battles. They cloud these battles with dark side of force.

[@jillum89]

I'm not sure I agree on the point about the natural versus the artificial. If we have two millionaires, one has worked his entire life, working hard, having jobs, taking an education, investigated how to save movey and invest them, etc etc etc, thus building a handsome sum of millions of dollars from nothing, and the other was simply born into a rich family, and he just inherited all the money without lifting as much as a finger for it, I'm not gonna be impressed by the last one. It's not an achievement to just have; it's an achievement to find, to get, to form, to build, to create.

[@oneannoyingwhiteguy]

Have you thought of doing Darth Caedus vs. Darth Vader? you know, Grandson vs Grandfather?

[@mikeor-]

Or Kylo Ren vs. Darth Vader... oh wait, that's not interesting because Kylo would be defeated by Caedus (through absolute superiority of the latter), so he could NOT stand against Vader.

[@vadimananenko2452]

Caedus

[@nielssmed2388]

Well you need to review now, with the new SWTOR expansion :) otherwise great VS duel as always! :D

[@Lin117]

Guy who absorbed an entire plant using his will, vs guy who got thrown down a hole by a one handed dude. Tough call.

[@sirpepeofhousekek6741]

Let's compare and contrast: Sidious most powerful abilities (draining the entirety of Byss while also wiping their minds of any memory of him. Byss had a higher population than either Nathema or Ziost) and the Force Storms, which could wipe the surfaces of entire planets, just needed extended concentration. kzbin.info/www/bejne/sGeuqpqkhdCBZsU Vitiate's most powerful feats are not things he can do on a whim. Vitiate needed Zildrog to wipe out Nathema. Ziost happened because A. it was already strong in the Dark Side to begin with and B. of tons of bloodshed. Vitiate did *not* control everyone on Ziost either. He only controlled around the capital. Sidious ashified three dark side adepts at once and, as stated in the video, it also disintegrated people. Sidious' lightning was also incredibly accurate, as seen in the assassination attempt by the Imperials. Sidious could transfer the essence of others without rituals (See Bevel Lemelisk) Vitiate, by contrast, either needed something pre-determined like the Children of the Emperor or to hollow people out over time, like when he took over Valkorion. And who cares how long Vitiate was around? He doesn't have the feats, he was too focused on either prolonging his own life, or ruling over Zakuul. He didn't even really rule the Sith Empire so much as he let the Dark Council rule it for him. So no, Vitiate/Valkorion is not more powerful than Sidious, nor would be win in a fight. If you want a more comprehensive and detailed explanation of feats and abilities, have this link: www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=790858

[@anondescriptbullet]

tenebraes strength lied in his permanence. sheev's was in pure might.(i am gonna ignore the sequels. if vititate is legends then i will use legends palpatine) while vitiate was powerful, we never see him destroy entire star fleets by himself. sidious however did. but you can never be sure when you have killed valkorion because he could still be alive. they went down too separate paths of power, so they will have different strengths and weaknesses.

[@Alarcj7]

Agree.

[@justsomeguywhokeepsgetting4885]

yep, but Sidious will be able to beat vitiate

[@yourfriendlyneighborhoodsaiyan]

@@Alarcj7 vitiate killed a whole planet with the force when he was dead...

[@Alarcj7]

@@yourfriendlyneighborhoodsaiyan Not all stuff from the gameplay is canonical in EU.

[@yourfriendlyneighborhoodsaiyan]

@@Alarcj7 still vitiate is stronger in the force then Palpatine. he lasted way longer then Palpatine did and vitiate got more attention. I'm not even fanboying it just seems vitiate is more powerful.

[@rossbaker4051]

would you ever come back with the new showings of Vitiate as Valkorian and how about a Darth Sidious vs Darth Nilus?

[@LiamGers-cx1kn]

Best. Verdict. In. Any. Of. Your. Videos. Ever!

[@Revansstuntdouble]

Caught you on your Lore EvanNova95, Star Killer challenged Sidious as well.

[@EvanNova95]

I know that, but I said "Jedi that challenged him" and Galen Marek isn't a Jedi.

[@DarthVaderReturns1]

EvanNova95 I love your videos I have a vs request caedus vs revan

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

The Novel is official C-Canon material, the Game is not. In the Novel, Starkiller never fights Sidious.

[@abominationmaullkiller6619]

This does not happen in the Novel, which should be held in higher regard than a video game in terms of factual evidence. However, addressing STR33TSofJUST1C3, the Force Unleashed Game actually "is" C-Canon Material.

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

Abomination Maullkiller Not only should it be held in highe regard, it also "is" held in higher regard. Chee has disproved the Game as the Official C-Canon source for the events and said the Novel overrules any contradiction between the Game, the Comic, and the Novel.

[@darthparallax5207]

Darth Vitiate was invented after Palpatine. The Dark Horse Comics Expanded the Star Wars Universe immensely, the Novels moreso.... But nothing remotely compares to the sheer amount of content that the MMO has- (I'm not talking about quality here, just quantity). Darth Vitiate held an entire Council of Dark Lords under his command, frequently, a feat very few Sith Lords ever attempted, some because of religious devotion to the Rule of Two, some because they just weren't Stupid. Palpatine was how old when he became a Senator? Vitiate was frigging 13 when he conquered Nathema by force instead of cunning using as far as I can see nothing but French Revolution tactics and the Dark Side. Vitiate makes everyone in the Star Wars Universe look like his bitch except for Revan who can throw the whole Light Side and Dark Side at your face. Palpatine is an allegory for the Caesars, Darth Vader is an allegory for Hitler......Vitiate is an allegory for Galactus or Sauron. Looking at the Source Material, things just weren't as Cosmic or Broken as All Get-Out as they are now. Tons and Tons of Retconning, or if not Retconning, Assumptions that are by no means Reasonable, to explain away the Movie Magic that allows Luke Skywalker to last 10 seconds against the Empire. But to counter that, Palpatine had to have more and more impressive stories stories written about him to make sure Luke Skywalker didn't look gay and the Galaxy overall pathetic. Palpatine in the original Star Wars novel was manipulated by the Empire's bureaucrats. In Return of the Jedi, he suddenly becomes a big Bad Dude. The powers he displays though, on Death Star II, are pathetic compared to anything in the EU. There is Flat-out Inconsistency in the Canon, because the Movies were never meant to be analyzed the hell out of by nerds like us. It becomes obvious the more you pay attention to how these things get written and created, that basically, whoever is the most recently published Bad Guy or Good Guy, They are the ones who are Ridiculously Overpowered As All Hell in comparison to the previous sources. Watch Episode VII suddenly show us that Luke Skywalker is 10 times as powerful as all the Avatars in bending history. Palpatine doesn't have as recent materials written about him as Vitiate. Vitiate is also the longest lasting Sith ever by a long shot-- he lived at least as long as Yoda, Yoda was not as powerful at 13 as Vitiate was at 13, and therefor the only people Vitiate can be compared to really are people like Galactus who do such redonkulus bullshit that the only thing that can defeat them is a poor farm boy like Aladdin or Luke Skywalker armed with nothing except being related to a bad guy and having the fate of the Galaxy rest on the balance of them not sucking too badly even though they don't have nearly the time or the resources to do anything remotely effective. Vitiate came pretty darn close to eating the whole frigging Galaxy. Nobody else tried anything remotely like that, not Sidious, not Krayt, not anyone. And this guy doesn't know much about how much focus was put on personal combat in the old days-- look at King Adas, who ruled like a Mandalorian would, going right on the front lines himself. Marka Ragnos and Tulak Hord and Naga Sadow were all Ancient Sith, not quite exact contemporaries with Vitiate-- and the Book of Sith makes it clear that Combat and Sorcery coexisted, and it was far more likely to find a Dark Lord Master of Combat than Master of Sorcery, because Brute Force and Power was what commanded Fear and Respect. Vitiate was someone who had to have mastered Visceral Physical Power to gain the authority over his planet that he did when Marka Ragnos granted him the title of Dark Lord, and on top of that he added to his power sorceries like what Darth Zannah studied on the orders of Bane. A Warrior that wasn't a Sorceror got farther in the Sith than a Sorceror that wasn't a Warrior, and the True Dark Lords of the times of the Old Sith Empires, starting with Darth Vitiate and Naga Sadow, were BOTH. The Rule of Two Sith Lords were powerful, but Darth Bane's Sith were not as powerful as Darth Vitiate himself. The Rule of Two Sith trumped the Jedi because they were simply more willing to be more powerful, and the Jedi were quite close to honoring "Blessed are the Meek"--- the Old Republic Knights and Sith Empire Sith were BOTH more animalistic, more primal, more powerful and more murderous. Read the Epic of Nomi Sunrider-- the Tales of the Jedi and Ullic Qel-Droma, Master Thon, all those good ol' stories-- the Dialogue is Much More Violent and Warlike compared to the Complacent Republic of the Last Days before the Dark Times even among the Good Guys, and I could never see Movie-Luke being comfortable with those kinds of Harsh Realism ideas. Partially this is even because the Order wasn't as Organized as people were totally allowed to be Knights and Even Masters who, under Yoda's type of Council, would never have been granted the rank of even Padawan because they had too much anger in them. The warning signs of Exar Kun's fall to darkness were so outrageously obvious, but the Jedi Council back then was big on letting him ''work it out on his own'' and ''discover the error of his ways by feeling the consequences of them''---- even if, you know, those consequences include Galactic Freaking Warfare for billions of innocent civilians of the Republic. The Rule of Two Sith did not achieve what they hoped to--- to Perfect and Embody the Dark Side-- they only acheived Failing Less than the Jedi did. Yoda's era Jedi were actually Wiser by far than the Old Republic Jedi in the art of "Not Falling to the Dark Side"--- they were better at being "Good People" and "People that didn't start Intergalactic Wars every generation". But the same things that made them like that made them much weaker at not being destroyed and deceived. the Sith were fighting a War with people who believed the War was over and spent most of their time doing Peace stuff. Lord Vitate's Sith, and most of the Old Sith, fought True Wars of Light and Darkness against Constantly Vigilant, Warlike, if a bit Philosophically Naive and Untrained, Jedi Knights, the last of which was Lord Hoth. Both the Jedi and the Sith were much Stronger back when they were less philosophically Wise in the Force.

[@jordanorenberg187]

this is the best one yet! and I agree with the verdict

[@andrewstout7452]

good vid dude

[@jakealter5504]

Cooperation? The sith that participated in the ritual that made him near immortal did help willingly, he dominated their minds (he did this to 8,000 other sith)

[@Mandalorian92]

+Jake Alter This video is inaccurate on many points in regards to Vitiate.

[@yasserzammen182]

+Mandalorian92 And Bane

[@hereticsign]

They came willingly knowing what that ritual does but during the ritual vitiate took over their minds. Those sith lords never thought vitiate would drain their life force too.

[@DeweyMcStewey]

@@hereticsign They came under the assumption the ritual would wipe out the Republic. They had no idea that the ritual would actually wipe them all out.

[@Hot_Grill43]

Can it be Vitiate vs Anakin Skywalker (at his full potential)

[@thebaronlouis8619]

For everyone who say this needs a rematch, Vitiate hasn't done anything in the time since this video was made that would necessitate a remake. Ziost was using the same ritual already mentioned and he himself didn't get that much stronger from it. And Valkorian got taken out by an even more obvious distraction than Palpatine's and has no feats to his name that Palpatine doesn't blow out of the water. Face it, Sidious is still the most powerful Sith of all time... as he should be.

[@telvanniis]

I just disagree. Vitiate's entire character is literally simply what Palpatine would have become if he had more time. Palpatine was nearing Vitiate's level, and he certainly matched him in raw power, but Palpatine simply had nowhere near the same time to hone that raw power. Vitiate literally turned himself into an incorporeal force-entity who doesn't even need a body anymore, while Palpatine's still in the "looking for another body" phase. They're almost exactly the same in terms of potential and power, but Vitiate is simply just far more along on his journey and training than Palpatine was when he died. But, Do I think Sidious would be able to kill Vitiate's vessels? Probably. Would he be able to do anything against Vitiate himself / his spirit? Nope. Vitiate would eventually win, either by waiting for Palpatine to wither away or by waiting enough to gather his energies into a ritual to destroy Palpatine.

[@abstraction6212]

Plus Vitiate has more sustainability in the bodies he posesses since he mastered both the light and darkside, and Sidious being only darkside crippled the bodies he contained.

[@abstraction6212]

Not only that but vitiate had the longest lasting war and rule in galactic history that lasted 1500+ years with long experience. Sidiouses empire with no sith warriors lasted only 25 years.

[@Rexbludmundi]

Sidious only gave the impression that he was defeated by Mace so that Anakin give the final blow that will mark his fall to the dark side, remember UNLIMITED POWER!!!!!!

[@87apizzi]

wrong. Windu DID defeat Palpatine.

[@maurice21781]

Hey Anthony read a book. I can give you the whole script from the books if you like

[@sevio8]

Palpatine & Mace were evenly matched. Mace can draw on both the dark and light side of the force and actually feeds on his opponents power. Hypothetically, their duel could have lasted forever but Sidious made a misstep while on the window ledge (can't remember if this was on purpose or was indeed accidental) which caused him to momentarily divert is focus and force on maintaining his balance which is when Mace seized the opportunity and won the duel. If Anakin had not stepped in Palpatine would have died.

[@maurice21781]

I think you should change the last part while mace was deflecting sidious lighting maces saber was bending towards his face and he was losing oxygen and he was pleading for Anakin to help him. And his special ability lets him draw on his opponents fear except the fear that mace was sensing wasn't his but it was Anakin's but by the time he realized it. It was to late and mace realized that sidious wasn't trying to win. That is basically the whole novel not exact wording but part of

[@dangerdan09inc]

Sevio Stanton That pussy Mace didnt have the guts to kill Sidious. He just stood there above Palpatine for like 2 minutes not killing him but just giving him stupid meaningless threats. Mace may be powerful, but he is my least fave character.

[@leagueplays2100]

mmm so what do you think now with him being Valkorion

[@Lwnorrie]

Well permanent death is no longer

[@Nephalem2002]

Well yeah Vitiate is still leagues stronger than palpatine. With or without lightsaber speciality.

[@SFArasTMToomuchslays]

EU Sidious > Valkorion > ROTS Sidious > Vitiate

[@SFArasTMToomuchslays]

+susumu07 Sidious had a mastery or knowledge for every known Sith ability of the time, including sorcery. (As seen in TCW) Sidious wasn't just the best of the rule of two, he was the most powerful Sith of all time. The only version of Sidious vitiate has a chance of beating is TPM Sidious, and even then, TPM Sidious literally changed the balance of the force from light to dark and every being in the galaxy felt it, along with Plagueis. ROTS Sidious above TPM because he puts his powers to use and he rekt Maul, Mace and Yoda. Vitiate's obscure abilities won't do shit against Sidious, and his lightning and TK aren't as strong as Sidious' by canon. EU sidious... Literally one shots Vitiate. The poor bastard

[@ralfigs]

+susumu07 lol is that even canon? lol come on geek it's not even legend this bs..lol

[@KingNazaru]

Are you going to update this or any other video featuring Darth Vitiate after Knights of the Fallen Empire?

[@raphaelhanna8345]

hey man where did you get the music you use in your intro its awesome

[@MrShishaw]

Vitiate is able to control a entire city while having no body of his own. Even if sidious was able to kill vitiates body he'd just mind control everybody around sidious turning them all on him at once. No matter what anyone says not even sidious can withstand a order 66 style attack. And also as a added bonus to vitiate the more puppets sidious kills the stronger vitiate becomes and the stronger vitiate becomes the more people he can mind control. In the end sidious would be screwed period. :)

[@banethesithari]

rusty shackleford sidious easily killed a battalion of stormtroopers in seconds with his lightening sidious would be fine. in this scenario it's just vitate and sidious nobody else

[@MrShishaw]

banethesithari if sidious was really so stupid as to kill everyone that would only empower vitate more...as of now there is no known way to kill vitate and several ways to kill sidious

[@banethesithari]

rusty shackleford Hero of thython killed him pretty easily . vitates spirit loived on but its the same thing happens with sidious. except sidious is powerful enough to immediately come back as long as there is a body near by that he can dominate

[@MrShishaw]

***** there is no main body at the current swtor timeline. He's more of a powerful spirit searching for a new form

[@MrShishaw]

banethesithari I'll concede that point to you. Sidious has taken over body's but weren't they just clones? Had he ever taken over a normal being? Because if I remember he tried to take over Anakin solo but failed.

[@achaudhari101]

EvanNova95 What's the name of the music at 3:30?

[@GamerX13X]

I agree about your analysis of Vitiate up to the point of him not being as strong as Sidious. But I wonder if the new expansion will reveal more about his abilities.

[@boazbeene3313]

Nice video. Can you do lucien dray vs ulic qel-droma

[@sirpepeofhousekek6741]

I agree with this verdict.

[@RomeTWguy]

Any knowledgeable Star Wars fan knows that Palpatine>every other Sith

[@Lobsterwithinternet]

Via George Lucus' decree.

[@analothor]

***** lucas is the created everything he says is canon

[@Lobsterwithinternet]

+analothor He also made Jar Jar Binks, midichlorines, ewok space magic ( not the force, actual magic ), Greedo shooting first and the entire prequel trilogy. Personally, I think he stopped giving a shit about Star Wars years ago.

[@analothor]

***** then you're another idiot that can't accept star wars for what it is, jar jar was there for the kids, midichlorians were a perfect explanation why everyone isn't a jedi/sith, most of the original retarded fandom still thin the force is magic, and whats wrong with magic in star wars anyway ??, and sure the ewok suck but their still canon

[@MK0437]

+RomeTWguy Precisely. That's undisputed canon. There really is no debate

[@Random2692]

love the videos though bro

[@kricard67]

Thank you Greyjedi91

[@ulluubloo]

Luke skywalker didnt defeat palpatine. Anakin did...

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

[cough]Dark Empire[cough]

[@RobbyDaGod]

STR33TSofJUST1C3 Cough Darth Sidious bandwagon rider Cough lol

[@scream_aim_fire2902]

in one way luke actually defeated the emperor, by not give himself over to the dark side. but its true that darth vader killed him

[@STR33TSofJUST1C3]

patrik Friman-Ask Uhm, Luke defeated Sidious in the Dark Empire Comic Series. They both engaged in a vicious lightsaber duel, which Luke won by cutting off Sidious' hand.

[@RobbyDaGod]

Well, since Dark Empire comics are EU and Disney, taking ownership of Lucasfilms, decided to make anything outside clone wars and the movies non-canon, then by landslide, Luke didn't defeat the emperor in their eyes and doesn't exist any longer than just as Legends

[@loghanditheimperialdiehard8876]

At least vitiate was able to hold an empire together without rebellion and most of his people (not including the ones he conquered) liked him. This was due to the fact that he dragged out the trip to dromund kaas much longer then it needed to be to increase their reliance and loyalty to him. Once they finally got there they where completely subdued by his will

[@bobmedcigg]

Loga Nator not entirely true, "At least vitiate was able to hold an empire together", I would say it was the dark council who was holding it together (the emperor was hiding and use the Voice of the Emperor to give command), and even with them (the council) trying to control the empire, sith was so power hungry that they killed each other and lost many battles cus of it, most people feared the emperor, but like no one ever saw him, and people started to think he was dead. and Malgus even tried to make his own empire. soooo......yeah, I guess Sidious did a better job making and controlling a empire. and its so funny that Vitiate use the force to control people in his own empire, Sidious + Vader didn't need that, Just their presence made ​​people in the empire shitting themselves so hardly anyone dared betray them xD

[@loghanditheimperialdiehard8876]

bobmedcigg Ok so how do you explain that little thing you call a REBELLION

[@bobmedcigg]

Loga Nator what is it to explain? people around the galaxy did not like the empire and they stared to rebel against them. same go for the old republic empire, people started rebel against them and joined the republic in the fight against the empire.

[@joshgonzalez5402]

bobmedcigg well your wrong. sure there was in fighting but the with empire lasted for centuries. The galactic empire just a little under 30 years. And people betrayed Vader and sidious and vitiate constantly. The only difference was the fact vitiate handled the betrayal himself. sidious almost died to poison and was only saved due to Vader. Also there was no with empire rebellion the people of his empire legitimately admired and wanted to serve him. While a full scale rebellion happened in less than 19 years of his rule. A rebellion that managed to topple the galactic empire. Vitiate knew how to run an empire and keep power, sidious did not.

[@bobmedcigg]

josh gonzalez "And people betrayed Vader and sidious and vitiate constantly. The only difference was the fact vitiate handled the betrayal himself."....when did vitiate do that? never seen that, but I have seen Sidious taken care of people who betrayed him. "sidious almost died to poison and was only saved due to Vader." I guess you talking about "Darth Vader and the Ghost Prison"...that comic made Sidious look weak as hell :( but proves that he dares show himself to the people and empire so they know that he is alive , unlike vitiate who was hiding and lets his voice do the job. "Also there was no with empire rebellion the people of his empire legitimately admired and wanted to serve him." well when I was playing the game a lot of people hated him and the empire and joined the republic to fight them + Malgus tried to start a new empire. so yeah, guess "legitimately admired and wanted to serve him" is a bit wrong. "Vitiate knew how to run an empire and keep power, sidious did not." HAHAHAHAHA omg that was good 1, the dark council was doing all the work, and even a fake voice of the emperor could take control over them, all thanks to Vitiate who was hiding and did not do his work so well xD or well his true goal was to get more power and to destroy everything...don't know what happen to that story, i don't play swtor anymore :/

[@ColonialFungus]

Suggestion (Probably spelled wrong but oh well): Darth Cyon vs. Darth Vader

[@SohnvonChristus]

Also what comic is that scene where Sidious combines Force Wave and lightning to destroy "entire battalions" as you put it? The comic where all the stormtroopers are lying on the floor, and he and his Royal Guards are still standing? It's at 10:45.