Victor Victrola VV-XI 363451-G 1917 works again

Cleaning process is still underway, but the motor is back together, repaired, and in the machine, reproducer rebuilt. Early 1917, still the same as 1916 before the improved motor was introduced. Red mahogany.

[@tonyperek7292]

I love seeing those victrolas restored instead of being turned into bookcases,bars,etc. it brakes my heart to see those turned into other things instead of being restored.

[@Rockisland1903]

I have yet to come across one in the wild that had been converted to a bar, or other non phonograph use. I have seen plenty of pictures online of such things. Mostly I find badly deteriorated cabinets good only for parts. Dry rot, bug eaten, heavily water damaged are all things I see regularly.

[@cobolsaurus]

Wow, when this phonograph appeared, my great-grandmother was 25 years old!

[@Rockisland1903]

The USA was entering the Great War in that year, Victor took the horn slats out of the Victrola 4 to save wood for the war effort. Probably other stuff going on also.

[@BDSandM]

What a gorgeous, precious baby. Excellent restoration!

[@pip5528]

I have thoroughly wet-cleaned and dried 20s, 30s, and 40s Columbia 78s with no issue but that is an interesting anecdote. It seems like it's really hard to find cabinet machines in general in the current marketplace.

[@Rockisland1903]

Large Victrola floor models are all over the place, I see them weekly turn up on Craigslist, eBay, and Facebook marketplace. Not just Victor machines, but many other makes as well. I have two in the big shop that I can provide you with for a small fee right now. Larger machines take longer to sell because of the lack of cheap shipping. Many dealers will let them sell out of a store, or flea market rather than bother listing them. I avoid them because I have no more room, I own six at the moment, looking to make that four. As for cleaning records, if I don't have to clean them then I don't. I know I am safe enough with the Victor records, past that I just don't know as I am not a record collector.

[@neilmansfield8329]

beautiful

[@zachtownsend1]

What you refer to as paint splatters, left by lazy painters, is in fact magic fairy dust that prevented people from seeing a Victrola as outdated and discarding them over time.

[@Rockisland1903]

I am sure some sort of dust played a role with the painters. I remember one of my HMV 101's had at least six different shades of paint splattered on it . It took the on and off work of a year to get them all out of the cloth working on one at a time.

[@cherylann225]

@@Rockisland1903I have a victory talking machine not a victor and it was made in Chicago Illinois and it's a council model and I have having problems trying to find any information on it. It is a windup one

[@Rockisland1903]

@@cherylann225 That's because there were hundreds of different company's putting their name on some form of phonograph between 1900 and 1930. These would be what collectors call the off brands as they are not Edison, Victor, or Columbia who held the most important patents and were the top three producers. For most of these brands no information survives. Most of these off brands used commonly available parts from outfits like Otto Heineman in New York city. Heineman would sell these outfits motors, reproducers and tone arms, anything needed to make a basic phonograph. Furniture makers, department stores, musical instrument makers would commission a phonograph to be made, or make the cabinets themselves so they could have one in their product like without having to get deep into the phonograph business as a major manufacturer. I would guess the Victory would have a SAAL, or Heineman motor in it. I don't have one here to look inside, you will have to open it up and figure out what motor was used, once you know that you can send out for parts. Either that or you can pull the motor and send it to George Vollema at Great Lakes Antique Phonograph, and let him figure it out and fix it.

[@lydiaahubbell8545]

I HATE “alligatoring”- the inside of my red mahogany has such a pretty, shiny finish. I guess it is so common and banged up, refinishing the outside for my own pleasure rather than considering diminishing what little value it has at be a good option for me.

[@Rockisland1903]

Up to you, there are various ways to recover a damaged finish since they used shellac on these machines.

[@lydiaahubbell8545]

@@Rockisland1903 project for another year. i did read everything on the victor-victrola website.

[@lydiaahubbell8545]

@@Rockisland1903 i think I will try cleaning it, the. brushing it with PGA

[@lydiaahubbell8545]

i just won one at auction-pick it up tomorrow. Not sure of condition. got it cheap enough. Edit-i actuslly way overpaid-although it seems to work, the cabinet is banged up and severely marred inside and out!

[@paramanandchandawarkar2046]

Yes Sir I have preserved this type of machine till now ! Sir , its my ill luck that I dont have the original sound box ! 😢

[@Rockisland1903]

The original soundbox would be the Victor Exhibition, or as an upgrade the Victrola No2. These are easily found on USA eBay for USD $45-$55 without being rebuilt, or around $110 fully rebuilt. You can also substitute the HMV Exhibition, or No2 soundbox as these were made in the UK, and India under license from the US Victor company.

[@paramanandchandawarkar2046]

@@Rockisland1903 Thanks a Lot Sir ,I will try it in e- bay !👍👍👌

[@TheFoolintherainn]

Hello! I had my victrola moved and when it arrived the turntable was off - any hints on how to reset the hardware and set the table? If I seat it - it's too low. Can't spin. New steel needles make much better sound, and they don't last long. We're supposed to put sewing oil to stop that noise... I can't put the link here - but there are articles and diagrams on where to put the sewing oil on the gear.

[@Rockisland1903]

OK, we have a lot going on here, but lets talk about steel needles first. Steel needles are designed to be used for one play only and then they are discarded, that's why they come in hundred packs. The early records have shale dust in the mix that forms the needle tip to that particular records grooves as it travels along. Use it on another record that it's not shaped for and now you are causing damage to the records. Use a needle ONE time and then remove it and put it in the round spent needle can. Needles can be bought on eBay or from any of the phonograph parts suppliers like Gettysburg Antique Phonograph, or the Phonograph shop for a couple of examples you can Google. If the turntable was working just fine before you moved the machine, and now it's off the machine and not working then we have serious problems. Turntables on Victor machines do not just fall off, they need to be lifted up at least an inch for them to clear the shaft before you can remove them. I am assuming we are talking about a post 1912 machine without a screw on center holding the table in place. That machine would have to be dropped hard, or turned totally upside down to get that turntable to tumble off on it's own. It worked before and cleared everything on the motorboard while spinning and now it's not working, not spinning, or hitting things if it is spinning. I am afraid you may have serious structural damage to the cabinet or damage to the motor. Something has happened to cause that turntable to sit lower on the shaft in such a way it's hitting the brake, or the motorboard itself. I hope the shipping company is insured, this is why I hate entrusting my machines to shipping company's and now I require anyone wanting one to come here and pick it up. I can not stand the idea that the machines will be ruined once they leave my care because some idiot tossed the box or dropped it. It's not the money, they can be insured, but what I charge for a machine once I am done with it only covers maybe 20% or the labor and time I put into them. I play with these machines for a hobby, for fun, not to get rich, I want to help preserve the history. Your going to have to get that machine to somebody nearby who is familiar with working on them. You can check facebook for nearby groups of phonograph collectors, or Google if anyone has a shop near you. By the sound of it lubrication is the least of your problems right now, but if you unscrew the motorboard and pivot it up, or remove it you will find a lubrication diagram under it. Sewing machine oil is fine. Open up that board and have a look at what's happened under there.

[@TheFoolintherainn]

@@Rockisland1903 I figured it out. Not ruined. It's ok... Please don't be upset. This is supposed to bring joy and share music, especially where we don't use much electricity. I have thousands of steel needles. I use them for 30 minutes then toss them. Yes, I've seen them on eBay also. We're not all idiots. Instead of just ripping something apart, I came here looking for advice before I touched anything.. I didn't mean to upset anyone - just looking at pictures on another video helped me figure it out I'm sorry the world is full of idiots that don't appreciate things - I'm here trying to take care of something.. I invested money in having it moved instead of carelessly doing it myself. Evidently the turntable must have jumped up. Alaska roads are rough. It's traveled over 5,000 mi cross country... I've taken good care of it for a long time over the miles. Alaska roads are rough. Everything else is okay. I've already been square dancing with my Husky Malamute to Sancho Baird's "Teasin'" That's the whole idea. To Enjoy. 🎶 They don't have many 100 plus year old victrolas where I live in Alaska - they don't have anything. But it's here because I've been taking good care of it. And the records. I promise I will never ask you any questions again. It seems to be very upsetting G'day

[@deweydodo6691]

I have noticed name tags taped to records also. Why? who knows.

[@jacobkpollard]

Does anyone know of a needle that can be used in these to play the newer vinyl records?

[@Rockisland1903]

Vinyl records are absolutely not designed to play on any sort of acoustic phonograph. The heavy reproducers and steel needles would destroy these records. You can buy new or used modern turntables fairly cheaply today, that is the best way to play vinyl records. There is no Victrola needle that would not destroy them.

[@bobbywaynee55]

I’d say my Victrola had that there was a little little paint drops on it and it’s white and it won’t come off and it’s so annoying

[@Rockisland1903]

Kotton Klenser wood cleaner can be found online. Follow the directions to use it and it will soften the paint splatters so you can gently scrape them off with a fingernail, or bit of plastic. Get the wood feeder and polish also to top it off. It's what I use on all these machines to deal with both the paint scrapes, and the dirt soaked into the wood.

[@danielarick2105]

Was it possible that the back panel was intended for access for the battery that was used in some models used at the time

[@Rockisland1903]

That was not a thing yet in early 1917. The back panel is the only way to install the cast iron horn and it's wood front assembly in the cabinet. The removable panel goes back to the earlier Victrola floor models, like that big 1913 XVI I have been playing with. That one is missing the rear panel, someone lost it along the way. My 1915 XI is oak, but is the same cabinet as the 1917. Later on they did take advantage of that panel to install parts for the electric pickups or aftermarket electric motors. Cords for electric lights could enter that way also.

[@lydiaahubbell8545]

@@Rockisland1903 my aching I picked up today has no back panel. Shoukd I make one?

[@Rockisland1903]

You can, but the machine will operate fine without one.@@lydiaahubbell8545

[@mikerubino9082]

We have this but the speed decreases when we pit the needle on...how can this be fixed

[@Rockisland1903]

Could be a worn record, wear down in the grooves can stop some motors dead. Could also be a weak mainspring, or springs, maybe the whole motor needs service. A very dirty motor that hasn't been lubricated will not function well. Broken or frozen tonearm or mount that is causing the reproducer to apply too much pressure to the record. Combination of any, or all of the above.

[@AndresRuiz2035]

Devuélveme el corazón porque me muero. In spanish. Second disc. Canta, canta pajarito, que tu cantar me alegra el corazón. Why were there much songs in Spanish in USA in decades 20's, 30's, 40's. This singers was not native Spanish speakers

[@Rockisland1903]

There were Spanish speaking people in the USA well before the 1920's. Many people from Mexico, Cuba, Porto Rico, and immigrants from other Spanish speaking countries including Spain. Victor pressed records in Italian, German, Russian, Chinese and Japanese along with other languages because there was a market for them among immigrant populations in this country. Parts of what is now the US where once part of Mexico and Spain, Florida and the southwestern states had sizable populations of Spanish speaking people back then, and still do today.

[@lydiaahubbell8545]

Help! I just bought a VV-XI i think 149401 with maybe a zero way to the right. What did I buy? What do I do now? About 50 plus records. Lots of needles, but I think they are spent.

[@Rockisland1903]

1915, You bought a Victrola the 11th, the most popular machine in the Victor company's history. Over 800,000 sold between 1911-1920, with 1910 being the year it was a tabletop machine. What you do now is service the motor yourself, or have it serviced, the reproducer needs to be rebuilt unless it looks like it was just done and has soft crack free rubber gaskets and straight needlebar. Clean the cabinet and repair any loose veneer. Get new needles, sort the records.

[@lydiaahubbell8545]

@@Rockisland1903 Actually, it might be 149407 G. Still, 1915 -thanks! i also just found it on the Victor-Victrola site! I am positive it is a “G”, but not sure about the last number being a “7”-the plate is in bad shape. i was thinking about doing a crayon rubbing to see if it would make a clear impression. I used the side of a pencil lead and a piece of copier paper, and the raised wording came out beautifully that was raised. The stamped serial number did not show at all. I guess the serial number is not that important.

[@lydiaahubbell8545]

@@Rockisland1903 65 or so records. Do the hood ones need to go in sleeves? I think there are all kinds in there, not just 78. i have not had a chance to sort through them. I deeply regret my purchase. This is not special enough to have gotten so excited over, and there is lots of damage-deep scratches and gouges to the wood. I am trying to find a bright side. I guess that this is a good one to “practice” on. I just wish I had done some research and actually inspected it before bidding online. I would like to try to play a record before servicing the motor. I need to find out where to get needles and which kind. the wonderful thing is that it cranked and the turntable spun nicely and quietly. Some of the records look totally worn out. I may not have time for several months to invest time into this machine. it was such a hassle-not only did I overpay, i had to rent a truck and hire a guy to help me move it.

[@Rockisland1903]

Only play 78's on your machine, 33's and 45's will be quickly destroyed by the steel needles and heavy reproducer. put them in paper sleeves that you can find on eBay, this will protect them from dust and scratches. Better storage is a record storage box of some sort, I find vintage ones on eBay that hold up to 50 records but sometimes these can get expensive. The machine has the record storage shelves, but these are intended for use with the binder type record holders. These tend to be deteriorating now due to being made from paper a hundred plus years old. @@lydiaahubbell8545

[@Rockisland1903]

You have it close enough to determine vintage, the G just means something was changed during production, the G shows up in late 1915 and stays up into 1917.@@lydiaahubbell8545

[@danielarick2105]

Actually the fastest gear is that worm gear, that is the fastest spinning gear

[@Rockisland1903]

78 rpm, at least according to the stroboscope disc and the 60 cycle light pulse from the 1960's light bulb I am using to set it.

[@oldradiosnphonographs]

I had one like that in 2019. I fixed it and sold it so I could afford my credenza

[@Rockisland1903]

The 11 is not a hard machine to find, or expensive unless it's walnut. Walnut is harder to find. You can get one that needed the work this one did for around 200, after full motor repair, reproducer rebuild, and full machine cabinet cleaning it's going to run double that. At this time I have two nice XI's, one waiting for full service, and one parts machine so they are around.

[@oldradiosnphonographs]

@@Rockisland1903 I’m at the point is if I want a XI it’s gonna be a 1910-1912 tabletop one.

[@Rockisland1903]

A friend of mine in Florida stumbled across a 1910 tabletop XI at an estate sale, I had him grab it for me and I will see it when he visits in a couple of months. Real nice machine in playing order. That, a nice L door XVI, and a partial front mount Victor, I forget the model.

[@oldradiosnphonographs]

@@Rockisland1903 I’m getting an Edison Triumph possibility a VV-IV in june

[@Rockisland1903]

Nice find, I don't come across many Edison machines. The VV-IV I see frequently except for the very first ones with the metal horn grill, or the 1917's without slats in the grill. So far I have come across four 1917's without the slats, but no early 1911's