Victor VTR-9D: Battlytics | Classic BattleTech Mech Review | Clan Invasion | DFA Wargaming

The Clan Invasion would have gone very differently if the Inner Sphere hadn't found the Helm memory core... The Victor VTR-9D is a beneficiary of a few of the latest tech advances in that era, including the mighty gauss rifle. How will this thing stack up against other 'mechs? Is it worth that hefty 1700ish BV price tag? Tune in to find out...
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[@matthewneuendorf5763]

Easy tweaks for this Victor: switch to 10 dhs, use the weight for maxing armor and maybe adding more srms. If you don't want the pulse lasers for close range jump attacks then you can swap to standard lasers and put even more weight into srms. In both cases, you can probably toss another ton of gauss ammo without any trouble.

[@matthewbirdsall9518]

this guy knows what's up! forget them pulse! moar armor.

[@klinktastic]

Yeah, regular mediums and 2 more tons of armor.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

100% and an LRM 😁

[@brianhenry152]

I think there's a lot to the Victor in terms of intangibles. The design is a heat-neutral, jump-capable 80-tonner, so physical attacks at point blank can really ruin someone's day. The Gauss Rifle is definitely something to be feared, but staying at range is only utilizing part of it's full capabilities (at least this one has a long range weapon system!). I think the Victor is best as a city fighter and skirmisher. The jump jets add a ton of flexibility, and it can easily take down lighter mechs with similar movement capabilities. It's expensive in terms of BV, so in order to get the most out of the investment, it needs to pick on smaller targets. If it gets tied down and outnumbered, it's gonna be in trouble! Great video analysis as always Aaron! Here's to a great 2022 for the channel!

[@malusignatius]

It also does well flanking slow assaults, and with the gauss rifle it can plink away at most 3025 assaults (and even a few 3045 ones) and stay out of reach of most of their firepower (though I agree, that's only utilising a fraction of it's capabilities). Something else it brings to the table for cityfights is some potentially fearsome anti-infantry capability. 2 MPLs will murder regular infantry and BA alike, and if you really want to put the hurt on, load the SRM-4s with infernos.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Thanks Brian! Happy 2022!

[@davidnelson6168]

Decent mech but I think it was originally meant for urban settings in the succession wars. Putting the Gauss on it gave it range, but then makes it more of a sniper. I would drop the pulse lasers for standard IS mediums, and pack on more armor to the arms/legs.

[@malusignatius]

It's a funny one for sure, but then again I've always seen the Victor as the mobile element in an Assault Lance instead of as a solo 'mech or the lead in a lighter lance. In my mind you need another 'mech to play tag-team with the Victor, pinning down the opfor so the Victor can manoeuvre for a back-strike, or to exploit the holes that Gauss rifle's going to be opening up in someone's armour. The gauss rifle certainly makes it a better bully against lighter 'mechs than the AC-20, it's a lot harder to run away when the guy shooting at you can touch you from the other side of the map. As for modding, another thing you could do if you remove the two MPLs is fit in a large or ER large laser.

[@DIEGhostfish]

Where would you get the 1 extra ton for the IS large/ERLL?

[@malusignatius]

*slaps head* From someone who can remember his IS weapon weights. More seriously though, you could downgrade the SRM-4 to an SRM 2.

[@malusignatius]

Alternatively, switch to DHS, and drop a heat sink.

[@DIEGhostfish]

@@malusignatius If you go to DHS you can drop a bit to fit them but may not be worth it BV wise.

[@weaselwolf]

Speaking of gauss rifles... You should do an episode on the Hollander ;-)

[@mr.gunzaku437]

10 DHS, 4X ML, SRM-6 w/1t ammo, artemis-iv, CASE, Guardian ECM. Full Armor. You can jump and alpha for 47 possible damage at up to 9 hexes/inches for up to 3 turns before having to turn off one of the medium lasers to bleed off the excess heat. That's what I came up with when I was 15 and got my first Clan related books. No Clantech is present on the aforementioned variant.

[@jessepunch8945]

Im actually a bit surprised the efficiency score was as high as it was with that armament and BV cost! Ive never used this variant, but putting it alongside a Highlander 732 would be my play. The bell curve you have for efficiency score, I would love to see that split up into light medium heavy and assault separately. Like show the overall graph, and an assault mech specific. I would bet that efficiency score is on the lower end of the bell curve for assault Max

[@steveguziec8050]

Love the Guass Victor for 1:1 and the AC 20 for lance : lance. I agree with Fritz on Big Guns never tire.

[@subtlewhatssubtle]

Ah yes, one of my early favorites. I'd enjoyed the 9B as an infighter, but the 9D/9K update was great for the Victor because the Gauss swap-in mixed jump capability with a very generous engagement range and the continual threat of getting headcapped. People respect that Gauss even if they don't respect the Victor. I often ran out of Gauss ammo because I was able to keep Victor 9Ds alive so long in mixed engagements. Sure, people will want to Gauss/PPC it back, but it can take a few of those if need be. One tactic that my opponents rarely expected was for a Gauss carrier to go bug stomping via DFA (I'm sure you guys of all people could appreciate the tactic). After expending all but my last few slugs, my Victor would usually have ragged torso armor but almost intact leg armor. Which is a recipe for jumping on somebody one turn and lighting up another target with an Alpha Strike the next if my Victor wasn't dead yet by that stage. I usually lost the Victor one or two turns after that, but I'd usually also crippled or killed at least one other target by that point. In the late game, I often found it worth trading an exhausted assault for a relatively fresh heavy, or even two mediums in the rare cases where I could put two down in two turns.

[@malusignatius]

As a mad fan of the Highlander, I approve of your bug-stomping. *bagpipes intensifies*

[@subtlewhatssubtle]

@@malusignatius If Scotland the Brave isn't playing when you jump on someone, your background music guy is doing it wrong. :)

[@malusignatius]

@@subtlewhatssubtle Amazing Grace on bagpipes works as well, particularly when you have the Northwind Highlanders cresting the ridge to save the day.

[@Funkin_Disher]

'People respect the gauss even if they dont respect the Victor' Sums up my experience with it.

[@DevianID]

So funny that I'm on the opposite side on the IS med pulse. It's one of the best weapons around for me. Due to its low range you have a low BV weapon. Due to its -2 to hit and short range you have a low gunnery sensitivity, which means you get to spend less on pilot upgrades to make the mech work. The combination of a low BV mpulse with a cheaper than average pilot, while still being able to hit those short range shots, means you have a short range bully for the BV. Thus for 6.8k BV you can get 4 4/5 pilot Victors, for a lot of beef, but you only get 3 2/3 pilot crusaders and are over 8k BV. The victors won't dish out as much damage, but you save 1200 BV, have a tougher mech to begin with, and have a whole extra mech to hold an objective.

[@julienseitz1350]

Good point

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Sounds like a match to play.

[@zachklopfleisch8501]

How many times have you jumped into the rear arc and then whiffed because of the movement penalty? Medium pulses turn a jump into a walk. The range is shorter, but you really only lose out on the long range bracket. Which, at -4, is going to be a really low percentage shot anyway. All the other range brackets are either equal or better than the normal ML. It's not an auto upgrade due to the weight, but in a maneuverable mech with few weapons like the Victor, I think it's the better choice.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

I mean jumping behind someone with a jump of 4 is like a megafail on their part… they’d need to walk 2 hexes away. Idk, the whole “jump behind” thing doesn’t practically work unless you have at least 6-7 jump mp imo.

[@sebastiang.5032]

Yes, the Victor, such a cool looking Mech. I've just painted one for my Federated Suns forces.

[@zot8218]

Every day is a good day when you start with a gauss rifle

[@shaneflickinger]

This is a mech that I personally haven't seen fielded that much. Thanks for breaking down the pros and cons on this one.

[@kalixascsi66]

IMO, the better version of the Victor in this time frame is the Capellan's 10L. It has roughly the same load out, but the addition of Stealth Armor adds so much to the mech.

[@rmcdudmk212]

Victor is a solid mech that can bring the pain if allowed to go unchecked. I like the 10D but swapping the Streak SRM for an LRM 5 or 10.

[@gavincross2902]

First Gen lost tech upgraded mechs, especially Davion, blow. Thx for the vid.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Thanks for watching 😄

[@DIEGhostfish]

I mean, Davion had 2 ER mechs with no DHS (Blackjack and Enforcer) but one (blackjack) was retconned to DH Kurita meanwhile has the Panther 10k and Atlas 7k still using singles.

[@roshee5573]

Got to ten double heat sinks and none need to be allocated. Frees up 5 tons for armour and more weapons

[@theyellowjesters]

i'm trying to install MechWarrior 3 and 4 onto my windows 10 and it's giving me trouble. but a new battleytics makes me determined to get it working! so excited for more! happy new year 'mech warriors!

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Oh man mech 4. So good.

[@theyellowjesters]

@@DeathfromAboveWargaming so good!

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

I played borderline-obsessively in college in all the big online leagues like UTS, NBT, etc. Years of my life sunk into that haha I HAVE NO REGRETS

[@theyellowjesters]

@@DeathfromAboveWargaming I was 8 when the game came out and got it for christmas. i've played the campaigns ever since, though unfortunately never pvp. :( NO REGRETS

[@Ichaerus]

Oh boy! New video! Enjoyed watching it, and looking forward to seeing you guys implement more of these Battlytic 'Mechs in future battle reports.

[@KageRyuu6]

I'd suggest Swapping out the SRM 4 for an LRM 5, and the MPLs for an ERLL, you only need 10 DHS, and you can then max out the armor and it'd be so much more effective at range.

[@DIEGhostfish]

ERLL onnsingle heatsinks on a jumpy mech seems a bad idea.

[@matthewberryman6609]

The gauss rifle being volatile, on an under armored arm, i would have thought would have really impacted it's survivability. Am surprised it did so well.

[@Dmorris556]

What is most likely is you Don't get shots or miss with the GR turn 1-4, cutting into that performance. Victor always felt like a second tier grasshopper.

[@Joric78]

Can't say I field the Victor often. The choice of weapons on this one seems to produce a mech that's OK at long or short range, but not really great at either. I'd prefer the UAC20 variant (10D) for urban or similar short range, or the RAC5 and ER L. Laser (11D, light engines are survivable) build for an all rounder. Quite a price hike though, so it'd be interesting to see if they were more efficient.

[@MrDmitriRavenoff]

3025 Victor is a heavier Hunchback. The gauss is a great upgrade, but the MPL let it down. I think swapping the 2xMPL for 4xML would make it a much better machine.

[@vaughncollar8014]

Table top game fix. The 320 engine can hide 12 HS...so drop 3 and switch to doubles. Rebuild frame with Endo. Now you have 8 tons. SRM 4 becomes 6 (1 ton) with Artemis (1 more ton). Upgrade armor to max (4 tons). Keep the 2 MPLs, add two more ER ML in right torso. You have to pay attention to heat if you Alpha Strike in consecutive turns, but that's an easy fix, just be intelligent about firing everything. Alpha strike damage increases from 35 to 49; the two ER ML fill in 10 damage at intermediate range, helping out a lot. You want to scare the hell out of everyone? Remove the Gauss and put in an Ultra 20. Keep the SRM 4, remove 1 ton armor and add 2 tons of ammo. Having a jump capable assault mech land behind you in a city campaign, with an Ultra 20, is pretty much cause to put your dice down and turn the mech page over...because you just lost that mech.

[@judaspreest0]

I feel the Thunderbolt 9SE would be better served here if were going for clan invasion era. Like the 5SE it doesn't have the Achilles heel of 1 ton of MG ammo, it has jump capabilities, more armor and more reliable standard medium lasers. All this and it costs less so if you wanted to up the gunnery you could.

[@MiriOhki]

I personally don't mind IS Pulses, but a thought would be to upgrade to X-Pulse, since you have the cooling to deal with it.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Yah true, and the MXP at least has usable range…

[@yourearidiculouslunatic8435]

This is the Victor model that was the last mech that Lori Carlyle would ever pilot before her ejection and eventual death at the hands of the Sky Rangers in the defense of Hersperus II’s Defiance Industries sprawling subterranean mech plant. Leading to the end of the Grey Death Legion.

[@nemamiah7832]

Efficiency aside, VTR-9D seems like IS playing around with new technology to see what's what. Gauss rifle, IS MPLs. We know that IS MPLs are kind of bad. But that doesn't mean it wasn't part of the technology progression in 3040s. In many cases, some mechs are just not efficient. And sometimes it's the flavour of things. Best example is Assassin that goes through eras with terrible variants and untapped potential for blinging. Also, damn. "Not my best pilot - 3/4". And here's me, where 3/4 are usually my Lance leaders :P I guess I'm pretty basic with running 4/5s D:

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Haha everyone has their style! I tend to find the hit probabilities for a 4 Gunnery pilot make for very long games 😁

[@DIEGhostfish]

IS MPLs instead of having a shortened range should have just lost the ability to shoot out past medium. So it woulf have the same "max range" but reduced penalties for range.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Yes - essentially this is what is happening mechanically anyway except at point blank

[@DIEGhostfish]

@@DeathfromAboveWargaming Yeah but this way you shoot out to 6 with a flat 0 which seems better to me. And your point blank is I think a hex bigger.

[@jordansimpkins8784]

Great video

[@adamcondon5120]

Make one on the Thug!!!!

[@madcat3525]

Great Battlytics! Looking to see one about the Supernova, Zeus ,or Black Knight. Anytime someone in the facebook groups whats to know more about Battletech. I tell them to check out Death From Above Wargaming on KZbin. DFA Wargaming covers alot of battletech topics. Looking forward to the next video.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Thanks for spreading our name around!!

[@Magermh]

I am wondering about those stats. The Victor should have high marks as a skirmisher. To better place a skirmishers key points. Its mobility and survival as they are to push or pull the fighting line for the bigger force.

[@lukedudley5030]

What I don't understand is why have case on right torso when the gauss is on the right arm...gauss ammo doesn't explode but the gun does....never tough enough for much but as a support sniper mech with decent pilot can be dangerous....I pick this if money is an object.

[@subtlewhatssubtle]

Inner Sphere CASE can *only* be torso mounted, so putting CASE in the right torso is the best they can do to to keep an arm mounted Gauss rifle explosion from doing any more damage to the 'Mech than it already would.

[@lukedudley5030]

@@subtlewhatssubtle cheers I didn't know it was stuck in just torso....however dump both for extra 2 tons of armour or ammo

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

More armor seems useful in this particular case, though it does jack up the BV. I agree its weird placement on the case.

[@stormcrow28]

Didn't you already do this with the Victor 9K vs the Thug comparison? The 9D and the 9K are the same mech, just built in different plants

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

You have memory like steel trap. The patrons asketh…

[@stormcrow28]

@@DeathfromAboveWargaming Heh more like a steel trap full of wet mice, ala Foghorn Leghorn, but I remember this comparison.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Hahahah

[@rollingthunder55]

I really don't like the post 3050 Victor. Never liked the fact that its so hard to bring all its weapons to bear. Would have been better off taking ER mediums. I look at once you get to 3060 and the fact that the Templar it completely outclasses it. Prime kind of steals its new niche and the C steals the 10D's role as well in its classic role. Age was not kind till the Capellians came up with the Liu Wei Bing.

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Yah Victor was always a weird mismash imo for an assault… the 3025 at least had all the same range profile but usually was dead or badly damaged before it could do anything. I dont hate the D, but I do hate IS med pulse 😆

[@rollingthunder55]

@@DeathfromAboveWargaming I am a huge fan of the old 8D Great striker for assault lances and extremely deadly in a 3D environment heck my last game used one and beheaded a thunderbolt, Its just right at 3050 the tech isn't there to make it good. No light ppc's no MMLs, I realize there aren't too many gauss carriers till 3055 and the victor is still a survivable one, but I find my self going with the lighter Caesar.

[@DIEGhostfish]

When it was first made there wasn't an IS ER Medium, that didn't come till TRO 3055 or 3058

[@rollingthunder55]

@@DIEGhostfish True, which leads to the idea tech had to catch up to make the victor good again. Point still stands 3050 wasn't kind to the design.

[@DIEGhostfish]

@@rollingthunder55 True, the version with standard mediums and 2 tons of armor seems nice. Or messing around to get a large or some DHS for an ERLL, or in MW5 I went I think XL to mount an LRM15 and ERLL. Worked nice.

[@tciaravino]

In that era can't you use er medium's?

[@DeathfromAboveWargaming]

Yah I think this is strictly helm memory core stuff. Er mediums for the IS came out around the civil war I thought? Maybe late 3050s.

[@subtlewhatssubtle]

Inner Sphere ER Medium Lasers were only available starting 3058, and even then only to the FWL at the time (the rest of the IS got them by 3060 or so). The Victor 9D/9K was a 3048ish release and thus predates IS ERMLs by a solid 20 years.

[@DIEGhostfish]

@@subtlewhatssubtle But that's 10 years.

[@NemFX]

I'd trade away the ac20 for an ac10 in both arms. Typical Davion mindset, one big ac, zero tactics.

[@dmjamesplaysosr]

Post 3025 is trash tier BTech imo.

[@DakDarklighter]

Yes, no one has ever heard that before.