Video Games and the Uncanny Valley

[@s0me1up]

option number 3: use the uncanny valley itself instead of avoiding it to create some of the most awesome horror games...

[@ViRiXDreamcore]

+s0me1up Now THAT is a good idea!

[@3lH4ck3rC0mf0r7]

+ViRiX Dreamcore Wow.

[@3lH4ck3rC0mf0r7]

+3l H4ck3r C0mf0r7 JUST WOW.

[@Ryanflees]

WOW

[@tricolourbearer2435]

Well there is a horror game about uncanny valley, but its not free.... :(

[@Thrna_1]

"We haven't quite reached that yet" What? Checks upload date Oh, 2008.

[@kevinpeter1079]

omg same XD

[@BeeBwakka]

Ahhh 2008, when videos longer than 5 minutes were considered TOO long, now anything shorter than this video is very rare, especially for this kind of video

[@matt1240]

Holy shit this video is almost a decade old. I hadn't realized how far video games and such have cone

[@ace-catel]

"Beating around the bush" I think it means to keep poking around whatever is in the bush without exposing the contents inside even though you have a good idea on what's in the bush already.

[@doglyfe4444]

i absolutely love the way this guy makes his videos. he reads everyones minds, and put it into a sense that everyone understands it.

[@MidgetguyII]

I really like it when developers push the boundaries of both sides of the uncanny valley! Most recently I would say that Heavy Rain was a really influential leap forward for creating realistic emotional performances and visuals with characters! (Though some movements and voice acting broke the believability... the emotional horsepower behind the characters made them dozens of more times believable than many other characters)

[@nedegame]

The similarity of this is to the episode "The Uncanny Valley - Why More Realistic Characters Look Less Human - Extra Credits" is just...uncanny

[@josef733]

It honestly doesnt apply anymore. With the graphics we have now, video game characters look amazing rather than uncanny.

[@marcosladarense]

@@josef733 , it is uncanny still and the previous game generations will alwYs be. Mass effect Andromeda, that is a nowadays game, is very uncanny

[@wanderingslacker]

You've done it again Kirithem, good job. I know what the uncanny valley is but this topic never really crossed my mind before. It's interesting to think about where graphical innovation will eventually take us in the video game world but artistic style and beauty will always have its place.

[@ExplodingHamster]

Your producing very interesting and educating videos. I like your art style and your short, but informative format. It's a shame your videos aren't more popular. Kudos to you!

[@originalname1337]

This whole series is great. It's really quite impressive the way you articulate ideas that can include the non-gamers in your audience without sounding patronizing. Also, your animation reels are pretty awesome. As far as the realistic vs. stylization argument, I'm for stylization for now. It seems much easier to make an endearing character when the effort can go into making a robust personality over a robust physics engine.

[@artbyaline]

I hope this will be the last of a long push to educate non animators about this phenomenon. Thanks for that brilliant video, narrative and visuals! :)

[@doomsday514]

Very educational, detailed and well put together, Daniel, this has actually inspired some of my College work.

[@SolidSonicTH]

Your understanding of the psychology and meaning behind all this is commendable.

[@WoodenPotatoes]

Wow, I really enjoyed that. Very good video!

[@MediaHell]

very interesting topic,i discovered this effect after watching several robert zemekis films made with motion capture( the polar express, Beowulf, and a Christmas carol )

[@stardust-reverie]

Gotta say, Daniel's a damn good writer. I know he still edits the scripts for EC, but he definitely held his own back when he had more control over them.

[@SeansShowStudios]

Outstanding. Yet again, you have created a video that is funny, entertaining and educational. Keep up the great work!

[@TheProfessorFunk]

Keep making these lectures man - they are informative and hilarious. I love your work!

[@Eliphas44]

These presentations are really clever and at the same time funny !!!

[@Leppa10]

Once again, nice work! Sadly, it is WAY to easy to fall into the uncanny valley when striving for perfection. Liked that bit with your wife at the end, Dan! :)

Silent hill games manipulated the uncanny valley to their favor

[@OhNoTheFace]

It's true. I still remember 2 bouncing between looking crazy real to completely off between scenes lol

[@highlandragdoll]

Hi there! Just a few comments to make! Firstly, I'm a 3D artist who uses one of the programs that showed on there - or its equivilent, but details - and for years, I did struggle with the Uncanny Valley. This is because I choose to design and render very doll like characters, because I simply ADORE dolls, but for years and years I got comments that people were freaked out by my renders, while some other people absolutely adored them and found them ever so cute! I wonder why these different reactions occured? At any rate, I recently got the most lovely, lovely comment on one of my works that "I had not only passed uncanny valley, but climbed its mountain and planted a flag", so that was INCREDIBLY touching - but I used BOTH stylised and photorealism from this. Realistic textures, but the character herself was very doll like; large eyes, small mouth and nose, you know how it goes. ^^ I'm just flaunting this because I'm insanely touched by the person's comment. The other comment... Wow, I LOVE your videos!! They're the -perfect- mix of entertaining, witty and outright educational!!

[@parman01]

Ashendoll Hi. Could you post a link to your work perhaps? I'd like to see renders that people consider creepy because personally I've never experienced the uncanny valley in videogames or 3D art.

[@highlandragdoll]

ashfire45.deviantart.com/ Be gentle, my ego's fragile! :p No, not really XD The character on the front page is the one that people used to consider very very very very creepy, but I've made a few tweaks to her now and there's been no such reactions - but we'll see. :p Anyway, if any of them do strike you as uncanny valley material, please speak up so I can work on improving these models or how I render them!

[@iinspectra]

I knew about uncanny valley was, but this video discussed it very well. Funny, informative, presented some original points in a concise and interesting way. Great job, man.

[@ltlfrari]

If you think about it, your presentation style validates the message in the video. Very interesting and well done.

[@MemoryOfGravy]

Very nicely done, I like your style and how you don't talk down to your viewers but still manage to keep it accessable to those who aren't in the know. Thanks for the infomation. =]

[@tata11369]

Yet another great production and great info. Keep up the excellent work.

[@PudgeHayward]

This was really awesome, thanks for explaining this :3 It took me a while to understand it on my own, but this really helped :D

[@Alexisonscope]

I still enjoy coming back and watching these.

[@mik912]

Great work, easy to follow, great format, entertaining and informative.

[@yourkie1921]

Nice. I loved this. Also, you pointing out problems and having those arrows pointed at you was hilarious. Although I would say your videos stay on the left of the uncanny valley.

[@MegCherry25]

Excellent. These videos just keep teaching me more & more.

[@lupermattroid]

I learned a lot. Thank you for explaining it so well. You should do more.

[@adamjanusz]

Great video. As concise and articulate review of the uncanny valley, and the paths of future graphic development as I've found.

[@DanielFloyd]

It's called "Penguin Cap", a remix by CarboHydroM. Run a search in google, I'm sure it will come up. And check out the rest of his game remixes too. He's quite good.

[@y0schi]

i didn't know one thing about the uncanny valley, thanks for enlightening me! nice presentation, hopefully it'll be longer next time!

[@SoupyGuy193]

INSPIRED BY ZERO PUNCTUATION?! THAT'S SO AWESOME :D

[@RedmayneDeadmayne]

@kirithem Haha so glad you go for the cartoony voice, fits the character so well. You are definatly the smartest guy I've ever heard when it comes to video games.

[@mechworrier]

Another fantastic video. Keep up the good and insightful work!

[@Tnu1138]

"Beating around the bush" comes from the quail hunting practice of disturbing the bushes in which the quail resided causing them to flee so they could stop beating around the bush and cut to the chase.

[@peterlord5]

This has just changed my life FOREVER!!!!!!

[@AbcNation]

That was superbly put together!

[@carbonelldx]

I love this vid and the way concepts are explained, great work whoever you are!! (sorry for my crappy english)

[@gamephreak5]

friggin' awesome! you used Toejam & Earl music for the ending song!! Keep up with the great videos!

[@SaiScribbles]

I've been watching you guys on Escapist for a while, I had no idea you had some stuff on youtube. Awesome.

[@ericlundquisthere]

i had heard of the uncanny valley before watching this, but had never really thought about it. great video. very informative.

[@thatonedude6695]

I'm new to your channel and this is video number 2 or is it 3 for me. But I think you have the right combination of facts and funny, keep it up :-)

[@jakestene]

You do realize this video is almost 6 years old right? He has newer videos just like this in a show called Extra Credits.

[@thatonedude6695]

Jake Stene yeah, I made this comment before I watched every video on this channel and was forced to move over through the suggestions. But even then I'm still standing by my comment here.

[@jakestene]

michael byrd Alright I meant nothing by it. I was just making sure you weren't misinformed. :)

[@Adamkrr]

That was a perfect explanation of it it was so clear and understandable!

[@themagnety]

I love this show SO MUCH

[@canadiankazz]

I love your videos. I didn't know what the Uncanny Valley was before, but now I do. Thanks! XD

[@smashbrolink]

XD @ 3:33 The three red arrows. You sir, are exceptionally good at dry humor.XD

[@SollowP]

I hav heard of the uncanny valley, butt! I newen knew what is was. Thank you James and Daniel

[@daviousfima]

wow awesome work, I been waiting for a video, I hope more gamers watch your lectures, your videos must be spread.

[@DarkFnh]

Great work, keep making those lectures man

[@pirataga]

perfect, congratulations for this great movie. everything makes sense, to me.

[@katjagareis]

Enjoyed this quite a bit. Good Show.

[@PonderJutsu]

LOL I've seen this episode when it came out back in 2008 and then came back searching for it after seeing the remake of it on their website gaaaaah I love extra credits

[@tripleha2]

this video was excellent! i knew what uncanny valley was before, but you just cleared it up so much more for me. i have this problem when it comes to robots, but i love final fantasy LOL

[@Alhorian]

That's cool. I get the magazine over here in England, the site is a great extension. Well done for yourself anyhow.

[@MGlBlaze]

I agree, Invisible walls can easily be replaced by something that makes more sense. A 'force-field' such as those used in Half-Life 2 to prevent the player from getting to combine spawn points, for example. Then there's physical obstacles such as collapsed tunnels, sheer cliff faces. Or there could be something that deals damage, such as (again looking at half-life 2) the leeches present in seawater to prevent the player from just swimming wherever.

[@NathDriver]

Superb video. Thank you. Been looking for a nice, simple definition fo the valley for a long time. 5/5

[@DanielFloyd]

I'm not employed by them, but the video should show up on Edge sometime in the coming weeks.

[@llice1681]

I've never heard of the Uncanny Valley. Thank you, it was very interesting and well explained ^^

[@D3stinySm4sher]

I love your work -- I have to admit, I'm using the same idea for my advanced media course in the spring, only mine will, like yours, have its own spin. I'll be using the "Yahtzee" style to present a multipart argument defending the notion that games are a modern form of art, exploring their different facets and the like. :) Your presentations were more an inspiration to do that then Yahtzee's, but we both owe the cyncic a tip of the hat, eh? Keep up the great work!

[@MasherDole]

Another great work from you. Keep it up. ^^

[@phillrochardt5840]

MY GOD! This guy said almost everything I ALREADY THOUGHT about this subject! I'm glad other people are thinking about this stuff too...

[@TimeBolt759]

I love how the remade episode is just the same as this one

[@BrightBlueInk]

It did, he showed some models from the game when talking about what sort of stylized looks you can do.

[@kinggimped]

Very nicely done.

[@Nevic5]

nice this was done well enough my little sister could understand what the whole uncanny valley ment and how it makes games awesome

[@Cool_A02]

I get the feeling that this is in extra credits

[@llirik360]

This almost four years old. I think some games (I can't name any off the top of my head) have already moved past the uncanny valley, but the majority are still trying their best.

[@textcavation]

@kirithem: the voice is perfect. The speed of this video along with the wise-cracks makes this really funny, not to mention a wonderful example of the uncanny valley. Agree with lulxors about "Keanu Reeves." ROFL

[@CkVega]

I have a feeling that the curve out of the valley might be as long or longer as the curve up to the drop into the valley.

[@FairZack234]

This really helped simple and to the point

[@TheWilsonator]

Thanks, if that few seconds was any indication he's pretty awesome

[@joshuaoha]

Once again you make some great points. But I am LOVING my photo-realistic skyrim right now. Even with all the kinks left to iron out. And brown is beautiful.

[@shadowrb3]

nah, it's what makes the lecture unique and interesting

[@VeronicaZammitto]

Great video, clear explanation and fun!!!

[@Maximara]

I should mention that there are actually TWO uncanny valleys: still and moving. This is why still pictures of photorealistic games look better than when you see the same thing in motion. David Hanson showed that via Neoteny you can flatten out the valley to where it is not a problem.

[@AdderSIG]

I hope you're able to explain this... ...damn, that's a very good explanation. And a Don Hertzfeldt reference. This rocks.

[@venerealmelon]

4:50 wow that game is out now!

[@baokhangluu]

Awesome explanation of the uncanny valley

[@siliconespectre]

the thing about stylization is that when you want to set a certain tone you need to have characters that can be taken seriously not only in actions but in appearance that can drive this home, using the examples in the video if Mario were to say "You're a dead man" you won't think its threatening or aggressive. If Master Chief said that then you would feel threatened even if you didn't know about the character. The reverse can also be true depending on dialog used in a situation.

[@karntom101]

Yay your back, was starting to worry

[@clawhammr666]

Another great video, keep up the good work!

[@ooHotcooleRoo]

Awesome man! Keep up the good work!

[@TanaSilvers]

Very informative. I think I should show my dad this next time I try to talk to him about graphics.

[@joevictor53]

@thangQanime Yes but Uncharted sticks on the left side of Uncanny Valley. LA Noire is creeping up the right side of it but isn't there yet

[@designerdougm]

@Keejus Simply because the characters more readily resemble humans than lets say Sack Boy or Mario, does not mean they are not on the stylized side of the uncanny valley. If anything, the fact that they ride that line so well to the left (on the chart provided in the video) is what allows those characters to remain appealing for a longer period of hardware aging than attempts at photo-realism. It's an excellent example of how stylization can be subtle, and perhaps less alienating.

[@TheReaverOfDarkness]

The valley is very flexible. There are certain mistakes in a humanlike design we see as worse than others. Things like basic facial symmetry and the way the character walks are more important to us than things like the colors of their body or the size of their eyes, for instance. Also, some mistakes can look like communicable diseases or other dangers, while other mistakes can look much more surreal and thus benign. Modern Final Fantasy characters are made to look mostly hyper-realistic (with some stylization) and they get away with it largely by ensuring that the trickiest features are unrealistic in a way nobody will mind. If they can't get the skin blemishes right, they don't give the character any at all. If they can't get the eye color right, they brighten it. If they can't make the folds in the clothing look right, they turn the clothing into magic spandex which conforms to every comic book stylized pose the character happens to be in, wind be damned. They probably show their characters to people who aren't graphics designers to get reviews, and to make sure they are likable. This is how you can get past the Uncanny Valley. The resemblance modern Final Fantasy characters have to real humans would place them deep in the valley, yet they are not frightening to us at all.

[@SageofTalos]

@SamanthaJFordie type in Extra Credits. That is this guy's show on the escapist (if you didn't know). there are tons of more eps uploaded there.

[@TheRaggetyDoctor]

this video was AWESOME!

[@existenceisrelative]

I didn't know this stuff. I've heard references to it, but they were only in passing and not enough to work out the concept from context.

[@ElectronicSiliviy]

We watched this video in my class about comics today. xD Very appropriate!

[@AnyBodyWannaPeanut]

You should make an update video to this one! 2008 was five years ago already!! :O

[@frozensage]

i think thats cause its like reverse of the graph, we go and take out some minor details

[@atimholt]

The Movie "The curious case of Benjamin Button" is firmly on the 'realistic' side of the uncanny valley. Very few (if any) people notice that for the first hour of the film, the main character's entire head is CG. There's a really cool TED video detailing the new tech they used to achieve this.

[@umcarainteressante]

This was very nicely explained and awesome :D

[@Fantome001]

The Uncanny Valley, huh? I've never heard of it before. I'm glad I saw this.