Vintage radio speaker, can I get it working?

Looking at a vintage radio speaker and trying to get it working with some modern equipment.
I've acquired a speaker or radio horn from the early days of radio - or wireless as it was known then. This was designed to be used with a valve or tube receiver, however I'd like to be able to use it with something more modern.
Please note - this video is for entertainment, it is NOT a tutorial or a HOWTO.
#vintageaudio
#vintageradio
#vintageradios
#wireless
#tuberadios
#tuberadio
#radio

[@joaomarcelobadu]

Awesome video! Im curious to hear more testing to evaluate the ramge of this speaker. A 20-20khz swipe test and some modern music test. Also a more powerful amplifier to see until what volume it holds up without distorting. Fascinating content, please keep it up and thank you for this valious content, it made my day!

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 😀👍. Glad you liked it - and I really enjoy making these videos too. I have found a more powerful amplifier with a much better power supply, so I will try that also in a future video. Thanks for the suggestions on the swipe test and using some modern music. I need to be careful about copyright but I will see what I can do. Thanks

[@joaomarcelobadu]

@@mrrgstuff KZbin music will do the trick studio.kzbin.info/door/oj5bbngN3YP7p0zDZYh8Agmusic

[@mrrgstuff]

Yes indeed. I will find some from that. Thanks 😀👍

[@Timothycan]

I think these were not particularly loud originally. In the 1920s many people listened to radio using headphones, and so it was a considerable step forward to amplify the audio loud enough that several people could listen at once, but my guess is they still had to keep quiet and be attentive!

[@tiga4180]

The volume depended on how many audio valves were used after the detector stage. You could get good volume, but valves were expensive. Reflexive audio circuits made one valve deliver the power of two. I built such a circuit using 1920's valves many years back. Got decent volume, but there was a lot of distortion.

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks - that's interesting to know. I have a few valve based amplifiers - but to be honest I haven't had the time or skill to work on them so far. Too many other projects! 😅👍😀

[@mrrgstuff]

Yes, the cheap USB mic makes it sound much louder than it is. It is loud enough to listen to - but yes you do need to have a quiet room and be attentive. I will work a bit more on it and see if I can improve it. Thanks 😀👍

[@tiga4180]

@@mrrgstuff I know the feeling!

[@unfinishedthought]

Great Vid! Subscribed right away

[@mrrgstuff]

Great! Glad you enjoyed it! Have you seen this one? kzbin.info/www/bejne/rHXTpH2Bba9qjbM Thanks 😀 👍

[@dhelton40]

I think if you keep the vintage driver, it is important to match the impedance of the driver to the amplifier. A driver of 3000 ohms was probably intended to be connected to the output tube(s) with no output transformer. (Keep in mind the true impedance would need to be determined with an AC signal, not an ohm meter) This driver will make a very poor match to an 8 ohm output and will result in low volume. If you would like to hear it another way, use a horn driver for a PA speaker, be sure to use a crossover to keep the bass out of the driver.

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks for the info. Yes, the amp is a poor match, and from what little I have read, modern solid state amps don't really require impedance matching to modern drivers as they have such low output impedances anyway. It's not a useful capability, though, when the driver is 3000ohms, rather than 4ohm! 😅 I do have some other amps to try, and whilst the output transformer doesn't completely sort out the problem, it does show promise. That output transformer just happens to be one I have, but I probably have some other ones that may be better. I had also considered winding my own, though that does seem like a lot of effort. I did successfully wind some coils in this video, though: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z57LoWisfrKKjassi=XF2RWp-bscEa0Zlf Thanks 😀 👍

[@davidk6271]

Interesting. They certainly look better than they sound. Could you 3 d print a case to accomodate a modern speaker?? that could be attached to the horn? I wonder how that would sound? My Mother used to tell me her Dad put a pair of headphones in the mixing bowl when the family wanted to listen to a program together. This would have been late 20’s.

[@mrrgstuff]

Yes - I was thinking about making a 3D printed adapter. I have tried holding the bluetooth speaker up to the tube mount and the horn certainly amplifies it a bit. The dealer I bought the horn from had some horns set up with fiberglass copies of vintage drivers which had bluetooth speakers inside! They looked really good and fooled me initially 😅 I agree though that the horn certainly has the look - but currently leaves quite a lot to be desired in terms of the sound! Mixing bowl idea sounds great. I guess they needed to stay quiet - but the bowl probably made a very effective sound reflector. Thanks 😀👍

[@clockworkbadger2363]

This is so cool! Makes you wonder what time and setting that speaker was last used.

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 😀 👍. Glad you enjoyed it. Yes, it probably has been a while since any of this was working. There will be more on this, however I am moving stuff around at the moment to help film. This radio horn now has a hopefully permanent location: kzbin.infoDTLP5Xk73lc?feature=share 😀

[@NippersLounge]

That's pretty impressive, with the vintage driver!

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 😀 👍. It's not great sounding, but I am pleased I got it to work at all! 😉😅

[@tarstarkusz]

These early speakers are meant to be hooked directly up to a 1920s pre-superhetrodyne regenerative type radio. Glasslinger (youtube user) has done a few of them. They aren't very loud either. I'm pretty sure most need a power supply for the electric magnet. The frequency response is probably worse than AM radio. The paper-cone loudspeakers came on the market around the same time (just a bit before) as the first electric records. They pushed these mechanical jobs off the market. Other than switching out the electromagnet in the early loudspeakers for the permanent magnet of the modern one, they are mostly unchanged since. Also, either you have the amp turned up too high, or your matching transformer is way off. The distortion is terrible.

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks for the info. Yes, there is definitely quite a bit of distortion and whilst I didn't mention it in the video, I noticed that using the headphone socket added to it noticeable, although it did also increase the volume. The amplifier is maxed out, so undoubtedly is adding to (or creating) the distortion and the output transformer is not matched, just one I happened to have. I am pleased it works though, and have at least one other amplifier I think worth trying with it. Thanks 😀 👍

[@milesprower6641]

when you doing to second demo with the headphone socket, you can see the light on the amp dimming from the voltage dropping out from excessive current draw XD @@mrrgstuff

[@mrrgstuff]

@milesprower6641 Yes, you can. I noticed whilst filming also. I guess the a/c adapter unit I'm using with the speaker set can't actually cope with the amplifier turned to full volume. I will try some different amplifiers, but any other ideas welcome. Thanks 😀 👍

[@tarstarkusz]

@@mrrgstuff This pretty much always happens, particularly with lower end amps like you would find in a pair of powered computer speakers. It's probably not the power supply. There are very few amps that can handle going up to about 60% of max volume. As you turn the volume up too high, it will sound more and more like screaming (as the sound becomes more "compressed" and loses the up and down of sound) and then as you go higher, it will start clipping.

[@digidoridvideos3672]

I'll say, stick with the vintage one lol. It looks cool and I like the sounds of it.

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 😀 👍. It's certainly not hifi, but at least it produces something recognisable! 😉 😅

[@digidoridvideos3672]

@@mrrgstuff Yep.

[@Barnaulets17]

Thanks for the video! I'm a collector of a such stuff too. I have a similar radio speaker made in the USSR in the 30's. But my one also is a gramophone soundbox. I mean it can work like yours - as a speaker and it can be used like an ordinary gramophone diaphragm. More than that, it can work in ways at the same time - as an electromagnetic pickup - sound goes from your amplifier's loudspeaker (from radio) and also sound goes from gramophone's horn. Honestly speaking, it sounds poorly, there are almost no high frequencies in it's sound. Almost forgot! It can be used as a cheap microphone if you'll shout it it's diaphragm. It looks like it's a simple gramophone pickup but more heavier and it has two jacks for cord connection on the back side. All these functions of our such soviet device were listed in "Radiofront" magazine from the middle of the 1930's.

[@mrrgstuff]

That's very interesting to know. Thanks for the info. I have borrowed one of these drivers previously and that was clearly boxed and sold to be connected to a gramophone, though I didn't really realise that at the time! kzbin.info/www/bejne/j2bLk2eZgdOcnNk I found my vintage driver in an antiques shop and although I didn't really have a use for it - decided it was worth buying. Fortunately I did as I then found a suitable horn at RetroTechUK, which is a yearly show in the UK. I don't think the driver is the right one for the horn and there is actually a little 3D printed spacer inside the horn now to make it fit. It's close enough to being right I think. I have seen a complete one for sale, different model - but it was too much money for me. Thanks 😀👍

[@Barnaulets17]

@@mrrgstuff Thank you for making such interesting videos! Also I found your tutorial about repairing the soundbox for HMV useful , it helped me a lot (I don't remember the name of this model), I know that it's a very common soundbox in your country. Unfortunately, in the USSR such soundbox were made almost of crap - from low quality zamack. That material cracks and crumbles with time. That's why such soundboxes nowadays in Russia are very hard to find. Fortunately, my friend sold me a such one. And with your help I did the repair and maintenance. Thank you! 😀

[@amirsyazli1621]

Well in my opinion, if you like sound amplified the natural way which is by a giant horn then you could use that radio. Unlike other speakers, it amplifies sound with machinery like receivers.

[@mrrgstuff]

The horn certainly adds a a bit of tone or colour to the sound. It amplifies it a bit - but not as much as I would like. The horn really does need to be repaired and fitted properly into the metal tube part. There is a significant air leak between the wood horn and the metal which I need to fix. I think it does look pretty cool though! 😅 Thanks 😀👍

[@RealEpikCartfrenYT]

i looked closely at 6:40 and noticed that the power LED of the speaker amp was getting very dim. The transformer was pulling a lot of current. I'd say there is definitely stuff that needs to be left in the past. Not only does it draw so much current, but it also sounds dreadful

[@mrrgstuff]

Yes, the LED going dim does show that the PSU is not able to deliver the power the amp requires. It's possible that I am just using the wrong PSU for the speaker set and it can't cope with the amp being turned all the way up. I don't think the vintage driver itself is the problem, as the high impedance shouldn't be drawing much current. This will certainly be the first thing to address, and I think does answer the question as to whether those speakers are suitable to use, they aren't! I agree it doesn't sound great either, and probably due to the limitations of the technology, probably never will. Thanks for watching and commenting 🙂 👍

[@tiga4180]

Keep it original & go for the vintage driver, preferably using 1920's valves. I''ve done this, but the sound's a bit quaint, due to the imperfect frequency response. Here's an example of the sound I got from a later (balanced armature) high impedance speaker, on a rare early 1930's radio: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nqWcopuVoLGfkJosi=D0jwC2DiKXSYvVgu

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks. I'll do some more work on with the vintage driver - but not sure if I will get to using valves. Thanks for the link also! 👍😀

[@victrolalover7795]

I think it would be good to stick with the vintage driver, but fool around with it some more, as the distortion is a bit out of hand.

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 😀 👍. Yes, it's struggling a bit and doesn't sound great, but the volume is getting to usable levels. I will try some other amplifiers I have to see if I can improve it 😀

[@modellbahnagenda]

👍👍👍

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 👍😀

[@andreasu.3546]

1:44 looks an awful lot like a compression driver. I bet a modern driver (say Pyle PD122) could make that horn scream like hell.

[@mrrgstuff]

That's interesting to know. Maybe I'll look into that. Thanks 😀 👍

[@H2Oredfirefox]

I think most old vintage speakers are driven by a transformer not Direct but I could be wrong🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔

[@mrrgstuff]

From my limited understanding, early radios had high impedance outputs which were suitable for use with an earpiece or some early types of headphones. This I guess is why early speakers had high impedances - and it was only when low impedance speakers came in that output transformers were really necessary. I don't know for sure though. Thanks 👍😀

[@jjcaruso44]

If you want to keep it as close to original as possible, keep the vintage driver.

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 😀👍. I'm certainly going to do some more tests with the vintage driver. I have found a better amplifier which may improve things

[@oldtimegamer2.098]

I think you should stick to the old one and I wouldn't mind hearing it playing other music to

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 😀 👍. There will be another video. I have made some improvements and tried more modern music, and it works surprisingly well! 😅

[@medeiros639]

Hello my friend

[@mrrgstuff]

Hello. Hoped you enjoyed the video. Thanks 😀 👍

[@Mrpurple75]

Upgrade but continue working with the old driver

[@mrrgstuff]

Yes indeed - I will undoubtedly try both routes 😉😅! Thanks 😀👍

[@paulanderson7796]

DC resistance is not the same thing as impedance.

[@mrrgstuff]

Thanks 😀 👍. I know, and I never claim in the video that it is. I believe it is true though that the simplest way to measure the impedance of a driver is with a dc resistance check. Properly measuring the impedance is unnecessary and far too complicated for an entertainment video like this.

[@madmanmapper]

It's hard to tell how it sounds because I'm listening through your mic, your sound card, youtube compression, my sound card, then my headphones. It's a working piece of vintage tech. Leave well enough alone. Make a new driver that you can attach to the horn.

[@mrrgstuff]

Yes - I agree, there are so many components in the loop that its difficult to tell how it really sounds. In this video, the cheap USB mic makes it sound much louder than it really is, but then of course it is a cheap mic which has issues of its own. I have done quite a few comparison videos like the following which I think allow subjective comparisons of equipment in the way that listening to live would not be practical: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n4nTgXysj92Hq9Usi=OaApWKuijTS1LTSL Thanks 👍😀

[@medeiros639]

A lot of electronic capital

[@andrewmerritt9113]

Stick with the original

[@mrrgstuff]

Yes, I was able to get it to work better. Have you seen this video?: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aISQnqGejMSpeZo Thanks 😀 👍