War Within Gearing: MORE GRIND?

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War Within gearing apparently just got worse, in the sense that myth track gear has 2 more steps to get to its full item level and there was absolutely no change to the crest and flightstone system whatsoever. Now this was a great step ahead when it was introduced but we were hoping that with war within gear, we’d get some streamlining on the current gear system.
It looks like we are in for a new war within gearing guide once again as new players and returning ones from past expansions will have no clue on what is happening :)
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[@rolandlaflamme2128]

I like the way MOP is doing it. One currency upgrades the gear, the higher in content drops more of that currency so you progress faster. Casual players will get there eventually but at their own pace. Its the multiple currencies that drives the confusion and hate imo

[@hameed]

This is how DF season 1 was with Valor and it was AWFUL. All it did was incentivize highly geared characters to run +2's for the quickest farm. Tiered currency is fine, but it's also not explained well to new players

[@Kerbz012]

@@hameedthats simply an issue of low Dungeons rewarding too much and higher keys rewarding too little.

[@CosmicCleric]

Wrath was like that as well, you earned a currency and you were able to purchase upgrades. For casuals like me, it took longer, but that was fine, I was running heroic dungeons (and they were harder back then; had to CC, etc.) with friends/guildmates for the currency.

[@dragonriderabens9761]

maybe also make it so that ALL gear can get upgraded between seasons instead of forcing us to grind out an entirely new set of gear every season it's especially a pain when it comes to set items

[@maldlions5313]

Honestly, I think multiple currencies is just better.

[@CJP706]

simplified loot system: Only one track (like Awakened in S4). Only one currency. Any item can be upgraded from 1>14 with the same currency. So how is it balanced? Lower content drops a little bit of currency, and higher content drops a lot. Upgrades cost more the higher they go. There is a weekly cap on currency (like right now), so you can only get so many upgrades per week. People that do higher content get higher base gear, and overall higher ilvl after their loot and upgrades. people that do lower content get lower base gear, and overall lower ilvl after their loot and upgrades. The biggest criticism of this idea I have heard is that a casual world quest enjoyer can get a 14/14 bis item. but I say who cares if someone spams WQs and gets a single bis item late in the patch cycle. it takes them exponentially longer, and people who do mythic will have near full bis by then and a much higher ilvl overall.

[@taylordubose1117]

The amount of currencies is ridiculous. I’m a casual, I don’t have the energy to keep up with all the different things. I just want to play the game.

[@CosmicCleric]

Said well! I'm in the same boat. Metaphorically speaking, f'ing don't want to study for a Ham Radio Operator's license to just change the channel on my TV/radio. Edit: Typo.

[@user-hz2ub4qb6v]

and a game that you have to PAY , kek.

[@Raddo94]

You can play game.

[@CosmicCleric]

@@Raddo94 In Soviet Union game plays YOU!

[@dirkgoodman4282]

I feel like I do my mythic plus weekly, and I have to wait a week for loot with a possibility of it being useless, which is madness

[@TheDumplingOrc]

I think making bosses and dungeons provide 15 crests (or 1 upgrade's worth) would simplify things a lot... I don't understand why we need to grind so much especially on higher level keys. Feels pretty bad to finish a dungeon and not be able to do a single upgrade every time. This way they could also reduce the crests to 1 per dungeon and just need 1 per upgrade - which would at least make the numbers less complex...

[@FBarbacovi]

As a semi-casual player (I do HC raid content and M+ from +8 to +12/13) I confess that I didn't like the increase of myth itens track (because of my personal moment ... work and baby issues, I'm struggling to do Myth content, ir order to reach an end-game gear level) However, for another point of view, I must agree that this way of upgrade is fair with players which can raid on Mythic difficult. At the end of the day, both systems rewards the players according to its efforts. This is also a true If u consider revamp on professional gear (which I really loved, as a semi casual player). But I also really agree with your comments about "useless gears". Maybe Blizzard could implement a system similar to the Awakened track (1/14 upgrades, for example) since the easier Raid/M+ levels or the possibility to recycle itens aiming to get Professional itens (or even Crests?) Or even replace a gear drop system for a material drop system, where u need to craft your item (similar to a professional item but maybe with a different item lvl track?) It is a great topic to discuss. Thanks for the vídeo. I love u guys. Wish u all the best!

[@bradulery]

The upgrade system is such a turn off for me. I miss when items were just items and didnt have six different tracks and multiple currencies to upgrade them. It feels like a bad mobile game. If we're going to upgrade gear can we just have Valor Points again? Simplicity is the name of the game, don't make me have a spreadsheet to play a game. Please.

[@SupremoMancoSama]

i say they should still add some kind of vendor for the m+ and for them to let you upgrade it to hero or myth without the need to depend on a vault every week (which 99.99% will give you repeated items), this whole RNG is just awful, most of the times at the end of a dungeon you don't get anything NOT EVEN ENOUGH GOLD FOR A SINGLE WIPE REPAIR, they should add some kind of currency or item that would allow you to buy the specific items you want, let's suppose that per m+ with no loot gives you a tome or something and you need 3 or 4 to buy the item on like the bronze buzilion or whatever those bars are called and just increase the level with more tomes or something, and i know this is a pretty hot take and a lot of people are not going to agree, defending the RNG and how you doing the same dungeons 200 times "makes sense", but i have never seen ANYBODY happy doing the same dungeon over and over and over again and never see that trinket / item at the end of the dungeon, just frustrates everybody, and they should remove the flightstone caps... it's stupid af

[@eldiablo303]

I agree, i dont like the amount of currencies. I had to go look up guides and when i ran into the first time i needed new crests i just stopped playing. In addition the upgrades themselves were so boring. Wow my x slot has 6 more intellect now. Amazing. Wow. Fantastic. 😅

[@pilke5683]

I don't mind needing more crest on main but cut it in half for alts and stuff, if it takes 3 months to fully gear a main, make it a month to gear an alt

[@UltimateGamerCC]

it shouldnt even take THAT long to gear a toon.. damn man..

[@brandonneifert3199]

Yea alts should just have reduced flight stones or whatever they should also need reduced crests

[@UltimateGamerCC]

@@brandonneifert3199 actually they already have a workaround going on where you get Warbound drops one rank below you, so if you're at Myth rank, you'll get Hero drops that is catchup in of itself.

[@Deadneck]

Just here to send positive vibes

[@Arja021]

❤

[@JacboUphill]

I think the design goals for multiple currencies and upgrade tracks solved some of the problems that past single currency systems have had. Namely that in a single currency system you only really have two options: 1) uncap it, and then players gear up in a week, make all content trivial, and leave; 2) cap it weekly, and then since all levels use the same currency if you want to maximize gearing any given week you're incentivized to never upgrade any piece below max obtainable base item level, since then you're "wasting" that currency, and it feels bad to have those competing incentives of wanting to feel a little stronger but not sacrificing being perpetually behind those banking their currencies. The latter problem still exists to some extent, but in a much smaller range. Obviously it also introduced new problems, as the video lays out, though I think the way forward is some creative solution and simplification that iterates on what they have now, rather than reverting to one of the many older systems that all had their share of major design flaws. For example, rather than having multiple different currencies they could just passively tie upgrade cap each week to the level of the gear, then you can upgrade say 10 levels each of Adventurer/Explorer/Veteran/Champion/Hero/Myth gear, but all using the same currency, and removing flightstones as unnecessary. They could also just glow your gear in character panel when it can be upgraded rather than needing a vendor as an intermediary. And then in terms of explaining the system to newer players, I think the trap a lot of content creators fall into is explaining it to a casual like you would to someone min-maxing. If you're a casual the system is really simple, you go run the highest content you possibly can, and you occasionally check if you can upgrade. If not, you go back to running the highest content you possibly can. That's generally all it boils down to, you don't *need* to understand all the tracks and the break points if you just keep pushing that highest level up a little at a time until you hit your wall. And if your wall is below +10, which I'd expect it is for anyone who's actually a casual, then you'll also be getting better base items as you go up.

[@EvilPolish84]

They need to simplify it. IMO m+2 gear should be 1/20 (combine the 3 tiers champ, hero, myth). Remove all flight stones, gear upgrades use crests. Lock the ilvl upgrades behind m+ scores. 1500 rating let's you upgrade to 10/20, 2000 rating is 15/20, 2500 score upgrade to 20/20.

[@avirian6589]

Maybe I'm weird, but I don't find it complicated at all lol. I only PVE in M+ to get the achievement (I find PVE giga boring) for the mount, and that's it. Maybe it's worse at higher keys or mythic raiding, idk. My only complaint with gearing is PVP gear is now shit in PVE.

[@billyp4352]

Well if PvP gear was good in PvE it'd kinda make less sense to play PvE. The 2 types of armor need to have their respective pros and cons. It was long wanted to even get PvP gear back and then they finally did and people still complained it wasn't good enough for PvP, well now it is but there's gotta be a line xD it can't be the 1 and only form of gearing.

[@dan240393]

The issue with infinite progression, is that it feels more like no progression than finite progression does. The instances of progression are so granular that they're nearly imperceptible. With finite progression you get fewer instances of progression (and eventually run out), but the individual instances tend to be much larger (i.e getting Smite's Mighty Hammer or Verigan's Fist in Classic) so you are significantly more aware of them. Infinite progression is a slow, constant dopamine drip, but it doesn't generate the same moments and memories as finite progression generally does.

[@RDFrosty7645]

Season 3 gearing felt perfect, only change they shouldve made was to make +12 keys drop myth track m+ loot.

[@MarcelianOnline]

was better and the fastest for sure

[@JQ86]

Thank gawd I'm a pvper and all I have to do is attack nerds.

[@72APTU72E]

Right? I hope the conq system is largely left alone, I don't like how you must get embellish crafted items, pvpers dont get the kind of gold people want for compensation.

[@TheTama8]

@@72APTU72E Is it still possible to upgrade PVP gear by doing PVE content, or something like that? I didn't play the latest patches, so I'm a bit out of the loop.

[@edwardhatfield5360]

Getting best in game, or even pretty good gear, is near impossible for a brand new player, but yeah it is a bit needlessly complicated to grasp at first. I like the pvp gearing, Honor, Trophy of Strife, and Conquest gear is pretty straight forward to me, and require no crests for pvp. What does effect pvp performance is knowledge of and using crafted gear, best stats, and embellishments. The most up to date info on what I need I can typically find fast on KZbin.

[@ianisgiannis2363]

The bs comes from that many people don't have a mythic raiding guild, and i am generally mad when trying to push keys, i have all hc raid and m+ gear, but most of the bis trinkets weapons etx drop from mythic raid, and so all the "top dogs" (nerds) got all the bis gear and are able to push much higher keys.... just cuz they are able to get better gear... we are all using the same meta tactics in dungeons so it comes down to the gear if we are able to pull it off.... blizzard needs to make it like many people in the comments are suggesting, be able to get to that best gear in some acceptable way not like crafting a leggo just to get your bis bracers.... its so demotivating even better i think they should make something like MDI realm but just have a vendor when you join with your group like "pushing" you get to the dungeon you want and u have the vendor with all the available gear in the game take what you want and try to beat the timer..... if more people had access to bis gear we would have so much more high score people.... we always watch the same people... echo whatever and when im watching them they dont do nothing special even fail hard sometimes... but just because they have the best gear they are pumping hard and are able to pull big groups etc and be flexing on other people who just don't have the gear.....

[@Llockd]

Gear is not what separates you from the best players...

[@ianisgiannis2363]

@@Llockd ok level the field first and let's see. if not me from thousands or even millions of players, you think there won't be many people who would outperform the current "best" M+ players? :D U crazy even in PVP gear is all that matters.... you can watch every "best" team :D doing R1 per season, and then in the tournaments only 1 team beats all, so AAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLL the other teams gets beaten, I like Pikaboo, but he only dominates casual players with no gear, as soon as he is up against equally geared team he struggles like crazy, doing the least amount of dmg in every game... Why do you think they make all players in MDI wear the SAME ilvl gear? If gear is not deciding? Well yeah when you remove the gear as a factor if everyone is equal then strategy becomes more important.... and you could say the smartest and the fastest team wins... but unless you have the same gear from the start, there is no point in arguing whos best in what....

[@mothman84]

Baby steps, I'd be happy if they just removed the _holding cap_ on Flightstones, and made them warband-wide. But mostly just get rid of that _holding cap,_ it's stupid, it's annoying, and it's the reason why I just ignored upgrades on all characters except my main.

[@Strezleki]

A necessary conversation and one that more content creators and influential raiders should be having. Thanks lads for another great video.

[@bereth5006]

For me its again a way to spread casual and working people away from the rest. When you need to run more Dungeons in the same available time after work, you fall more behind and reach the point where you didnt get an invite for any group because of missing Item Level. Next Marcelian Video is not only F*ck Meta is F*ck Working people 😁😁

[@nunyabusiness1317]

Funny enough it's not confusing to gear up. If you need a currency just hover over the currency and it tells you what dungeons you need to complete for that particular currency.... What's difficult about that? If they go back to the old system everyone is going to spam +2 dungeons all day. There's no incentive to complete high level dungeons.

[@Bronzemanna19]

For me gw2 has the best gearing system. No number bloat, no characters becoming obsolete after 2-3 months of not playing the game.

[@shianova]

GW2 doesn't have a sub so once you reach the cap and have done most things, people go play something else. WoW has a sub and Blizzard knows that if there is no grind there will be a lot less subs

[@senthilmn1938]

I'm a wow.player for very long time, I agree that gearing system needs simplification. Whenever I come back after a break I feel this very strongly patch after patch

[@billyp4352]

I've been saying the currencies have gotten out of hand since Legion if not before. They've been a problem for most of WoW and it's not only gearing that has so many as well. We need 1 for 1 currencies kinda like Marcelian was saying with how they used to do it in Cata or something.

[@dwseagle17]

I STILL after playing an entire expansion have to go to the upgrade vendor and single click every piece of gear I have to see if I can upgrade that piece with the crests I have or if I need to farm more bc of the midlevel 4/8 break downs. Do I need wyrms or aspects? Do I have enough drakes to buy more? How many drakes does it take again? Sooooooo fucking convuluted..

[@uhohitsross12]

Bullions need to be Warbound at some point.

[@MarcelianOnline]

yes and crests!

[@uhohitsross12]

@@MarcelianOnline might as well put flightstones in that mix too 😆

[@sebs6736]

You guys are ALWAYS spot on, it's what we all think.... No joke, less grind, less currencies, less complications! More fun!

[@datemike1184]

You mean u want everything handed to u and to be fully geared in first week lolol

[@sebs6736]

@@datemike1184 No, not really. I do value my time outside of wow though... Perhaps not everyone does. It''s not about getting fully geared in a week, perhaps you did not watch or understood the video..

[@asto-1255]

A new player getting into mythic raiding? Yesh sure 😂😂😂 80% of the playerbase dont care sbout min maxing. And when I did mythic progression this is the kind of systems I loved.

[@shianova]

Blizzard will not improve this gearing system because it was made to make the grind longer and keep you subbed for longer. Since Legion the gearing system got worse and worse instead of better, I won't be surprised if soon they will make it that only 1 person get's gear from doing a mythic run

[@TheCorrosiveMan]

Blizzard somehow thinks all players immediately cancel their wow sub the second they loot their bis item. So we have to deal with all these bullshit systems and currencies...

[@Ceegore]

Totally agree. What they have done in MOP Remix with Bronze is the perfect solution for this. Plus it's crazy fun!

[@ryss1]

If you're casual should it matter so much that you don't have the top gear? For a new player you don't need top gear to play the game and complete the content. I think that the present system is too complicated BUT I do prefer that to get top gear you should really work for it.

[@madsboandersen5316]

Tempering in Diablo 4 is a trashfire. Being able to brick items is a horrible game design and kills the game for casuals. Just imagine a fresh player getting a good 2-3 greater affix item, only to see it roll wrong 7 times in a row and being UNABLE to reset it, like masterworking. Mechanics like that is demotivating and just bad per design.

[@chasexchaos9392]

I left in season 2. Just came back and I AM FUCKING CONFUSED. I have played for damn near 20 years now also with occasional hiatuses.

[@mgaming7]

blizzard is good at making systems no one ever asked for or wanted. And if they see you having fun, they will F*** everyone over to make sure that sh*t stop immediately. I am going to go thru expansion, get max level and log out until the next expansion. so sick of blizzards sh*t.

[@vengaron]

The Professor Layton backround music got me laughing ;)

[@syxqid3818]

Lets do 2 crest system accountwide. You get one from raidbosses and can upgrade raiditems, for higher ilvl you need some bosskills - clear nhc and you can upgrade to hc. And the second one from M+ to upgrade M+ Items and need some raiting to upgrade so you come to myth raidgear when you have 2.5k rio or so. It would be so much easier 😅

[@Morotak123]

I miss reforging and pre wod gearing

[@Wafflenobs]

The amount of currencies to upgrade gear is mental, they really need to streamline things. It feels so convoluted the way it's currently implemented.

[@bernatgarrido8233]

Flame's facial expressions say it all...

[@tushoo4938]

DF loot system I detested and to see it get worse just makes me not want to play War Within, I've still not bought it and I'm really struggling because man I don't have it in me to deal with it again. I've been playing FFXIV trial and it's such a relaxing game in comparison the hours just melt away.

[@paso7943]

Blizz wants the game to be grind fuck. And what wow player value most? Their gear. So the best way to make people grind is for their gear. And more grind = more play time = longer time to be subscribed = more money to Blizzard.

[@UltimateGamerCC]

i hate the increase in gear grind, this is not helping M+ become more popular in any way. originally i planned to have full Myth on my Main, but now with the changes making it to where i gotta time double the keys needed in Dragonflight, i'll only ever upgrade my Tier Set and Trinkets to Myth and the rest of the pieces will be Crafted instead. because 90 Timed Keys to max a single piece of gear?? forget about it! that means only the hardcore M+ andies are gonna have that max gear, it's just not encouraging for anybody else that does not love repetitious gameplay. and sure, you can argue that "such is WoW on a daily basis" but i can vary the repetition on a daily basis, this is an unnecessary grindfest.

[@TooMuchTuna7]

I was a new player again over a year ago and yes it’s daunting but that’s part of it. Reading guides and watching videos and learning. Thats part of the process a new player needs to understand if you want to do well in the game. If a new player doesn’t want that then maybe this game isn’t for you or you can just not participate in end game content. You can just mount farm or quest if you don’t want to learn the complexity

[@CsStoker]

Or leave, which is what will happen if TWW releases like that

[@CosmicCleric]

"... then maybe this game isn’t for you ..." Stop gatekeeping. *Any* good game is intuitive to get into, and sells better. If you metaphorically need to study for a Ham Radio Operator's license just to do well in the game then you've failed in your game design. Its stupid that I have to constantly keep wowhead open on my second monitor so I can just understand WTF this thing or that thing is.

[@Drakaziel]

The endgame feels very condensed. Dungeon, raid, now delves and gear in order to be able to do those 3

[@crhoch16]

We need a way to get myth track items outside the vault also. I’ve been running at least 4 +8 dungeons on my mage every week and I’m still missing 5 myth track items. The last 4 weeks in a row I’ve taken tokens from the vault because it was all duplicates. I’m not a mythic raider so that means I can’t get myth track gear I guess. Doesn’t seem right to me. Why don’t mythic + 10’s reward myth track from the end of dungeon chest? A mythic raid boss takes less than 10 minutes and gives between 2-4 items depending on group size. That isn’t equal in my opinion seeing as one dungeon takes 30-40 minutes

[@Lunarae-y7j]

I'm a veteran wow player and I still become confused about the difference between Champion and Hero track gear when I step away from the game for a few days (Mythic is - well top end). I can't remember which is which in terms of keystone level.

[@Uncle19]

I want to loot more things, not collect currency like I do irl.

[@MrTrhemp]

Over thinking it. Just play game and upgrading gear comes organically

[@deesul4134]

Thank you for your content, but i think the mic/audio sounds like you are in a hallway or the bass is too loud. lol no idea, not my knowledge but its very distracting but love your content, no hate

[@Lunchbox739]

Take the concept of the DF S4 awakened gear that goes 1/12 or 1/14 and apply it to everything. Doing higher end content alleviates the need for the crests below it and allows for valorstone onlu upgrading to the highest ilvl item youve looted for a slot. S4 of Dragonflight may have been a throw away season but man did gearing feel smoother/ more alt freindly and if you werent someone clearing mythic raids for that pile of aspect crests you could still grind it out in M+ dungeons. The crest grind is still a grind however so adding more levels to an items track adds to that so im open to alternatives on that front. I am not a fan of the current spreadsheet for item progression at all.

[@L0rks]

Yay, more grind! :) Thank you.

[@Thorkou]

I swear blizzard Thinks Everyone Raids and that it's the only important content that matters. blizzard also has this fear of if they don't time gate gear they'll loose money. they like to over complicate things by adding 30 different currencies. from what I've heard so far my bourn out on grinding is going to happen sooner than later in the xpac sadly.

[@thatepicwizardguy]

M+ is the easiest and fastest way to gear unless you mythic raid. Myth track gear isnt necessary unless you mythic raid or do m+ at +12 or higher... so the gearing is perfectly fine as-is. If anything they should add myth track drops to +12s and higher...

[@Thorkou]

@@thatepicwizardguy As someone who does both Raiding and M+ I got geared faster doing Raid each week than running 10-15 keys a day at+8-10. not only do you get more loot when Raiding, you have a higher chance of getting the loot you need, were when running a Azure vault you see the same cloak drop for the 20th time instead of the trinket you've been grinding for lol.

[@Phaseish]

can you target mythic + /raid items in a vendor , or is that just someting for the prepatch, I felt like the gearing is interesting during the prepatch with the bulions, was that not impltemened? I agree this system is way too complicated for someone who leaves the game and comes back, but once you get the gear it makes more sense, It's almost like Pearls in Nazjatar in BFA on fucking steiroids.

[@karlkroenen8355]

Who are the top healers at the moment?

[@phnxx5301]

more grind is nice, less ilvl gap so fast so people stop ditching players if they are 5 ilvls lower. but it should be always grinding to a goal , not the shitty RNG what is now.

[@UltimateGamerCC]

this is not gonna help with the ditching, brah..

[@3r123]

The gearing system is so complicated

[@RavenskyAsh]

Bring back Salvaging!

[@jonathanalvar1234]

Just get Valor System back.

[@mallusdarkblade]

The current system is fine, it lets people on lower tier content improve so they can maybe move up to the next tier of content. The reason it probably feels bad for you guys is you push the top tier content early on and you start to feel fatigued. As someone who's been playing MMO's since EQ1, and could perform at a competitive level in heroic/mythic raids I just don't do it because the game starts to feel like a job, games are meant to be fun...

[@UltimateGamerCC]

why are people going to want to progress higher when it demands so much repetition? 95% of players are gonna either skip it or quit part of the way through.

[@CosmicCleric]

@@UltimateGamerCC "why are people going to want to progress higher when it demands so much repetition?" Addiction?

[@UltimateGamerCC]

@@CosmicCleric that's my point, i may be addicted to WoW, as i have been for 19 years almost, but such repetition is definitely unappealing. they need to lower the number of timed keys needed to max a gear slot.

[@mallusdarkblade]

@@UltimateGamerCC Because thats the gameplay loop of most mmos? If players have nothing to chase that's when they usually stop playing...

[@UltimateGamerCC]

@@mallusdarkblade not me, when i finish up on one character, i work on another and a LOT of players these days are like that. they dont need to hamster wheel us into playing longer these days, if we have time we'll play. simple.

[@Vondarkstar]

One day we will have a horizontal gear progression like gw2. The gear they got in 2012 is still viable in 2024. You just unlock more appearances or acquire a new piece of gear at similar strength. No more gear hamster wheel.

[@shianova]

They won't cause they know that when players will have reached the cap, players will unsub. GW2 doesn't have a sub

[@mothman84]

I wouldn't expect that, the hamster wheel 🛞 pretty much _is_ WoW! They need to motivate players to pay for the next 3-6-12 months, there must always be a carrot for us all to chase after. And we're player power junkies, we're driven by item level, we need our quarterly _fix._

[@hr1meg]

Thanks Flame for saying what I was thinking with the whole stones and shit. LMAO.

[@the-stonevault]

what does that even mean? "the gearing should be much more fantisized" Also I dont think its that hard at all, people have gotten used to it in DF and now its still the same system. ok they added two more layers on the Mythic track, so what, people complain about everything but dont have a better solution. Tbh I like it, it can make our gear go higher ilvls and then I can also do higher keys, imo good changes from blizzard!!

[@MrLP3xp3rt]

why capping flightstones, why is it 15 not 1 or 2

[@jesalbov]

Agreed 100%

[@cainrip89]

Ive played wow since 2007 breaks here and there been on classic came back to prep for tww and have no clue how to upgrade my gear and I'm an experienced wow and mmo player it's just too convoluted to artificial extend attention spans

[@omok2]

Why it's not just a token to upgrade the ilvl of a piece of gear is baffling. Instead hey get all these different currencies to do the same thing

[@ninedigitlife4983]

Its on difficulty , not rocket science

[@lurklimit8378]

Maybe I'm crazy but once you know how the gearing system works it has been by far my favorite gearing system WoW has had

[@hiddenflowerto]

Destiny 2 has a much better gearing system and I'm now finding my out people don't even consider that a MMO 😂

[@TheUmbrex]

its like titanforging u can work for

[@MrJeremydb91]

Awful changes…make myth 4/4 or hero 8/8

[@dw22509]

Less grind turns retail into SoD or CLASSIC... Once you have your bis or close to bis there's little reason to log back in.

[@rhysroberts7572]

thank god, it was a bit to easy in DF, need that middle ground a little bit more

[@-.-Monster]

I like being able to gear out every class with relative ease but i could see that getting boring quickly for someone that only plays one or two characters

[@ninjaturtlesoup2769]

why all the grind? Grind = more 💵 for blizzard

[@briancamp4302]

Blizzard hs gone full minimum on new content and full maximum on the grind. Its gotten bad enough even the grind has its own grind.

[@Electric_]

I don’t like it. Blizzard has to allow a dedicated player to complete the game for a given season on a class. Let us get to max ilvl within 3 months, and move onto another character. We want to play alts. We want to take an alt and max them out too. It’s way more fun to play an alt than to do an excruciating grind to top off a character. Furthermore, there’s going to be a time where us raiders are expected to bring geared out mains to a raid in order to help everyone else get geared out. So let us all just get to max without RNG or stupid grinds so we can collectively move onto an alt. If the grind is too long we will just quit after AOTC/CE or 2500 IO. We won’t max out or get close to it, and we will play less WoW because alts will feel futile unless we don’t intend to take them beyond Raid Finder.

[@straedeizoizoffle9137]

I hope its not just another grind but.. name of the game right :)

[@joek2978]

FF14

[@gooseg3822]

I think a bit of a longer power curve and not being bis after 3 weeks is a good thing for the game

[@SpiddeRify]

To be honest.. overall this is the best version of gearing we ever had.. And both of you know, that i play from Vannila and on high-ish level.. And this is the best gearing we have. Yeah it is a little too complicated and could be better on that front, but you get more from your items than you had ever before. And you can gear up in any way you want (M+ and raids) and the gear is on similar or same level

[@xXGeko1Xx]

If it wasn’t a grind… it wouldnt be gaming to be honest

[@Robsos2010]

This is not true man, especially for PVP. When the grind is gone for gear, you enjoy PVP the most, knowing it's never a gear issue.

[@immodsr9348]

There is a difference between grind and GRIND.

[@CosmicCleric]

I feel for the newer generations that think this is the gaming way of things, and have not been able to play older games, which were nothing about grind, but about fun gameplay.

[@jakelehmann7087]

Why isn’t your channel named marcelian and flame? Or something with his name in it at least?

[@DuckdaringZ]

This current gearing system is awesome. The item you're trying to get never drops, so you at least get something.

[@fos8789]

.

[@randomjimbitz512]

I had to skip a chunk of your vid due to the trash cinematic you showed there... complete trash... not you guys... I like you two lol

[@sharkstaint1373]

blizzard have the urge to ruin this expac , they like " shit we had a good systeme in df , lets rename currencys and add more , also we need more monthly sub money , lets add more grind too"

[@buddybarlow9604]

Honestly i agree with Marc that gearing is way too systematic and not enough MMORPG... 100% agreed. Also account wide currency is a awful idea, you literally remove all progression from a alt and they get to their max gear lvl and then what? There's nothing to chase but i love the idea of scrapping epics you dont need

[@themetal6216]

bring back valor system.

[@UltimateGamerCC]

spoiler alert, they wont.