WAS 90s CART ON PAR WITH F1? 1999 Indycar vs 1999 F1 Car in Assetto Corsa

[@AidanMillward]

Bugger. It was Montoya that won, wasn’t it? Not having a good week. Also fucking incredible how many people have commented “it was Montoya who won” despite this comment being here isn’t it? 🤣”

[@Scotracer1987]

Yes, my little Bathgate heart (same home town as Dario) broke.

[@AidanMillward]

@@Scotracer1987 they were both winners.

[@ajeade08]

I was so confused for a second.

[@danielhenderson8316]

Montoya win the tie breaker by winning one more race.

[@mgers75]

If you need any help with Monrtoya related history, let me know. Im probably in the top .01% in the world when it come to useless Juan Pablo Montoya information.

[@y_fam_goeglyd]

I miss CART. It was a fantastic formula. They looked good, sounded good and there were some brilliant drivers. Not saying whether F1 or CART was "better", because they were different, but they both got my adrenaline pumping!

[@dickfitzwelliner2807]

Same. Indy/cart cars have always looked good in my opinion. F1 cars have always been an engineer's car and cart was a drivers car, if that makes sense to you

[@davidca96]

I totally agree

[@tokyosmash]

CART was so entertaining

[@gigadonis8684]

CART car is about the same speed as the Minardi's of the time (about 3 seconds down). And is also about 10 seconds faster than MasterCard Lola if my calculations are correct.

[@addi1105]

Im pretty sure i can run faster than the MasterCard Lola tbf

[@gigadonis8684]

@@addi1105 Well if you can run faster than MasterCard Lola you can definetely walk faster than Life F1 Team.

[@GTChucker86]

Well MasterCard Lola was originally designed as CART car but hastily modified to meet FIA regs

[@jeremeymcdude]

@@GTChucker86 Who needs FIA regs when the Reynard ChampCar/Indycar actually was faster.

[@GTChucker86]

@@jeremeymcdude thats not the point, the car was built around CART regs cause twas a testbed for the engine, however mastercard wanted to race a year earlier so Lola had to scramble and hastily modified the CART chassis to FIA safety and performance spec. The regs arent there for performance but for fairness. The result was an underpowered car cause a last minute placeholder engine from Ford and a chassis that was draggy on the straights and no downforce on the corners. Who knows what’ll happen if Lola finished their V10 project and chassis and started racing in 1998 instead

[@StreetLugeNetwork]

F1 and CART did actually race on the same track in Montreal from 2002 to 2006. Here are the 2002 stats. F1 POLE - 1:12.836 CART POLE - 1:18.959 F1 FASTEST LAP - 1:15.960 CART FASTEST LAP - 1:20.238

[@AidanMillward]

Not in 1999 they didn’t though 😉

[@GurusWorld1]

@@AidanMillward You could have used the Indy GP course it changed very little since the first F1GP race even though they never ran at the same time plus from one who watched both series back then F1 were always more tech biased and don't forget ground effects on CART cars were partial tunnels only at the rear though the radiator ducts unlike F! that had full tunnels from the front to the rear

[@angry_ike7628]

@@GurusWorld1 CART never raced on the IndyGP circuit because IMS was owned by a rival race series/sanctioning body. No way to compare there either. If one wants to compare by closest course length, Road America is the longest course of the '99/2000 CART seasons, at 6.515km. In 2000 Dario Franchitti qualified at 1:39.866 seconds. Longest course in the 1999/2000 F1 seasons without going over 6.5km is Silverstone, at 5.140km. 1999, qualifying at Silverstone was Mika Hakkinen at 1:24.804. 11.062 seconds to cover an additional 1.375km. Is that a lot? Would a period F1 car do the same at Road America? Could a '99/00 CART Reynard run 1:25 at Silverstone? Who knows?

[@GurusWorld1]

@@angry_ike7628 actually the Indycars of today use the same equation of performance to the CART cars of the 99/00 - I lived though the split seen it happen first hand the Indy GP was and is the same track so it would be a better mark for performance to both cars since both have run on the track - actually you can use Watkins Glen cause before they came up with the US GP at Indy they tested F1 there to see if it was viable track being it held F1 in the 70/80s - but they didnt want to do so much construction to make it F1 complaint

[@Olivyay]

@@GurusWorld1 While it's true the current IndyCar cars have pretty much the same performance as the CART cars from the late 90s/early 00s (but they're still slower, especially when comparing to 1998/1999, e.g. more than 2 seconds slower at Road America and Laguna Seca), the Indianapolis road course currently used by IndyCar is * completely different * from the one used by F1 between 2000-2007, your memory must be failing you: - the current one doesn't take the banking like the F1 did, instead using two slow 90 degree corners and then a faster one to rejoin the oval - they've changed the two very slow hairpins towards the end of the F1 lap to a quick right/left esse for the current course - IndyCar completely bypasses the old turns 5 to 7 used by F1, using instead a very fast left/right chicane to rejoin the back straight It's no use comparing the times as the layouts are so different.

[@WoahThatsCozy]

I’m so glad this question is being answered I’ve always wondered exactly HOW fast the road course CART cars were cuz they seem decently quick

[@jeremythurman5261]

I wonder how close on an American style track. I.e. Road America.

[@superduperbooper3987]

I feel that if they raced on the Daytona road course it would be an extremely close race. The f1 car would dart off in the first sector but the CART car would reel it back in on the sweeping banked sections.

[@The52car]

@@jeremythurman5261 or any oval

[@trappenweisseguy27]

They were 6 seconds a lap slower on the same track in Montreal in the same year. And Montreal is closer to a street circuit than a conventional road course.

[@thatonenigeriansformula]

There was 1 or 2 years were they were faster it was in the late 90s im sure of that

[@robdavies82]

The late 90s, early 00s CART seasons would have really been huge in today’s world of Netflix fans, especially in the larger speedways and street circuits. Indycar these days isn’t a fraction on what it once was.

[@simoneburini4036]

@Gentleman Driver SimRacing if the internal combustion engine will be similar to what Indycar has now, then the sound won't change much

[@danielhenderson8316]

@@simoneburini4036 The engine is increasing to a 2.4L TT V6 and a KERS pack. Unlike F1, IndyCar’s ICE is getting bigger.

[@eamonahern7495]

I used to watch the champ cars on eurosport in 2001. I loved the look of them and I liked how they still used a lever to change gear.

[@seancassidy795]

Do a CART car at old Hockenheim! That might suit the package more, allow it to really flex that low downforce high horsepower.

[@Fixer29]

Or the old Monza layout with the banking, that could be effective in an indycar

[@AidanMillward]

Could try and max it out at AVUS

[@seancassidy795]

Spicy!

[@amjan]

Yes!!!

[@mickcompagnoni1114]

If you're going to get weird & go somewhere where only I has been, try this curve ball. Surfers Paradise. Can you imagine the F1 through the beachside chicane!!!

[@pranc236]

Cool video. Had wondered about the cart cars. Indy cars and F1 both put laps in at COTA. F1 2019 and indy 2020. The gap was much bigger 11secs per lap and indy car was not as harsh on track limits at a specific corner. Lmp1 also did some laps and were 1sec slower than the indy car. My understanding is that japanese super formula is the closest to F1 being 3.5 secs slower.

[@danielhenderson8316]

I'd be interested seeing this Champ Car around COTA vs the 99 F1 car. It should be faster then the current IndyCar.

[@danielhenderson8316]

Engines also last more than a race now as well. Next year, they’re upgrading to 2.4L TT V6 with KERS to get around 900hp on road courses. The fact that IndyCar finally has stable leadership and is growing is more than anyone could have expected for the last 20 years.

[@pranc236]

@@danielhenderson8316 indy car has been pulling allot of driver talent from all over the past few years too. Thats a solid engine platform too. Sounds like they keep heading in the right direction. I catch a few races but mostly get highlights.

[@rancidmarmot1994]

It’s certainly impressive to see f1 cars take corners as fast as they do. It doesn’t make better racing though. INDYCAR ditched speed when people started to die at Indy in the early to mid 90’s. Fats laps don’t matter so much here. It makes ovals suicide runs. It’s more about end product ie the ability to pass and a little parody. The big teams still win championships but it’s possible that a midfield car can win every week. F1 does look a little better this year but I’m sick of three teams with a chance to win.

[@WynnofThule]

I love this! You should try this on more tracks! Monza or old Hockenheimring, a CART oval, and Road America or Burke Lakefront would all be really cool options.

[@danielhenderson8316]

Something interesting is before F1 went back to a tire war, Schumacher took pole at Montreal at 1.19.298 in 1999 while for 2002, CART dropped the boost levels for cost reasons and still ran a 1.18.959. If you threw a race at Montreal in 1999 or 2000, you could probably get CART drivers qualifying within 1.5 secs of an 1999 or 2000 F1 car, but CART would lose race pace as seen in this video because they're a handful. The F1 tire war alone would kill this comparison even if F1 didn't make any car upgrades as 2001's pole was 1.15.789 and 2002 was 1.12.836.

[@FORZAPOTENZA]

Also tbh the AI make a big difference. If you had a driver of similar ability to test with it'd be different

[@upsidedowndog1256]

CART cars were built to do road, street, AND ovals, something no modern F1 car has ever done. The power was limited by boost to maintain safety, if not limited 900+hp was possible. In the 2000s CART attempted a race at Texas Motor Speedway and they were so fast on that oval that the drivers were on the verge of passing out in practice so the race got canceled, dooming CART. Indy Cars after that did about 10-15mph slower laptimes than CART had done. Ask Kenny Brack what he thought of TMS! For fun race all 3 series at TMS for an apples to apples comparison.

[@LimitPro1]

From what I am hearing Indy car for next gen is going back to 900+bhp next year

[@upsidedowndog1256]

@@LimitPro1 That would be cool. The recent Indy Cars sound good, I hope by boost and rpms, not hybridization!

[@danielhenderson8316]

@@upsidedowndog1256 It's both. KERS + a new 2.4L TT V6.

[@upsidedowndog1256]

@@danielhenderson8316 Bummer. I like racing machines that burn fuel only. More time to ride motorcycles, I guess!

[@amjan]

I remember that very well. I wish they limited the turbo boost for that event to happen.

[@f1jones544]

Not bad from the CART car given today's Indycar is 10 seconds slower around COTA than F1 per lap now. This reflects about what I thought at the time, that the CART car was good enough to qualify at the back of an F1 race at the right track. Good job

[@1250ships]

Best season of racing I personally watched was the 1999 CART season. In particular I remember the Portland race where the field was putting around saving fuel and Gil De Ferran cranked it up, ran an extra pit stop and won the race by actually racing. But it seemed like just about every leg of the championship that year had close races that we exciting all the way to the checkered flag.

[@BiggieTrismegistus]

The best race I've ever seen was the 1998 US 500 at Michigan International Speedway (it probably helps that I was there but still...) There were 63 official lead changes at the start/finish line, but sometimes the lead would change 2 or sometimes even 3 times during the lap. Indycar in the 90s was so great and I'll never forgive Tony George for ruining it because he wanted American racers. At the time there were just 3 foreign drivers to have ever won the CART title: Emerson Fittapaldi, Nigel Mansell, and Jacques Villeneuve. So you've got a two time Formula champion, the *reigning* F1 champion, and a guy who would go on to win the F1 championship. There's hardly any shame in them winning the CART title over American drivers. That Americans could and did beat those guys for championships shows how strong the series was overall. It was hugely popular too; the annual race at Michigan used to attract 120,000 fans. Then Tony George fucked it all up.

[@1250ships]

@@BiggieTrismegistus The big oval races were fantastic during that time period. The setup that CART required made the constant passing happen. Must have taken an incredible amount of concentration and effort by the drivers to do that for 500 miles.

[@danesorensen1775]

Now do Monza-spec F1 car versus CART IndyCar at Indianapolis. That's what they were really built for, after all.

[@crusherbmx]

Sounds about right from what I've heard in interviews with Montoya and Villeuve. Indy cars are a bit more sluggish, F1 cars can be tossed aroind easier and are more on edge, so the drivers have said....both cars look great, the F1 car sounds great, F1 was more interesting and glamorous ....but if we go back to 1999...CART was more fun to watch!

[@donnypopovski7251]

We need a Super BOSS series! I like the video because it actually enhanced my appreciation of champcar performance.

[@amjan]

ChampCar was a dilluted form after CART went bankrupt.

[@DonWan47]

Interesting and fun video. Almost whimsical by your usual standards, love it.

[@AidanMillward]

I like to break from the norm to have some fun and hopefully be interesting at the same time 🤣

[@marknielsen9762]

In the last F1 race at Detroit in 1988, Senna's pole was 1:40.606. In the first CART race at Detroit in 1989, Michael Andretti's pole was 1:41.681 on the same layout but with the final chicane removed.

[@that.guy11]

It’s so weird seeing a McLaren West-liveried car without the appropriate V10 sound, the Ilmor V10 had an almost supercharger whine to it compared to the Ferrari’s more conventional sounding engine

[@111catron]

Ill just add that the CART cars were a lot more difficult to drive, in 99' they truly had more likely around 900-950 HP...and steel brakes unlike F1 cars. Paul Tracy when asked the difference between the two (yes he tested in F1 back in the day) the F1 car was more nimble thru turns & accelerated quicker, but on a straight away the CART car would gobble up an F1 car. Both cars IMO are great machines.

[@connori2391]

You said only the BTCC use old pull/push sequential shifters nowadays, but the nextgen nascar for this year are running that style of shifter

[@LouisTheSEGANerd]

the new hybrid wrc cars have also gone back to using the sequential shifters as well

[@nickhauck8939]

Absolutely enjoy your channel. Watch every video. Really loving that you’re covering some of the American racing events. Obviously living in Texas I’m going to enjoy that more. If you want to compare the major series as far as top speed, you have to bring NASCAR into this. I don’t play AC so I’m not sure if they have a NASCAR in it. But if they do and you can take a restrictor plate off of the car, take them all to a track such as Daytona or Talladega. Flat out gas no brakes needed. Of course the NASCAR will not be able to handle nearly as well as the Indycar/cart car or F1. But I think that would make for a interesting little video myself. Keep up the tremendous videos

[@TedSchoenling]

The CART car was a handful to drive.. it did have less grip and more power. These cars were fun to watch the drivers had to wrestle them...

[@Slikx666]

I was wondering if the Indianapolis F1 circuit would be a good track to do the F1 / Indycar race on? It would be a fun race.

[@AidanMillward]

I probably could have use it, but wanted to use a layout/track that was used in 1999, and since the circuits have changed so much over the years it was either Barcelona, Imola or Montreal I could have really used. And since Barca has a mix of high, low and medium speed corners it made it the best choice.

[@Slikx666]

@@AidanMillward Gotcha. 😃👍

[@ITProjectManagerMan]

You are the best, always bringing the content your viewers are interested in and doing it with facts and passion. Thank You 🙏

[@jacekatalakis8316]

Few things The Honda (at least) had a boost button, in the 99 CART coverage they metion it and Chip can be heard telling JPM, use the button, meaning hold the button, max revs, max power, and go for it. It'd be interesting to see if the 99 CART car had it modeled since you picked a Reynard/Honda. Though I'd be curious if any of the other chassis are quicker or slower, same for the engine combos. After all, Toyota were improving leaps and bounds in 98-99, the Eagle chassis was Dan Gurney imitating the Lola F1 project, Lola themselves were gearing up for a 2000 season in which they'd join up with CGR, and Penske were ditching their chassis around that time and going with a Reynard There was, at least in 2001, a variety of gearboxes, IIRC Forsythe were the sole users of seven speed boxes. In 1999 IIRC this was also the case with 6 and 7 speed boxes. I don't believe anyone was crazy enough to run a five speed...but, could be wrong however CART was, to quoth Paul Page, 161 cubic inches, 1550 pounds. I don't remmeber if that's dry or wet, or just the car on its own however There was traction control, kinda, sorta. PT confessed years ago to using it from 1994/5 to 2003, so at least one Honda engined car had some form o TC, this was actually a point of contention in 2000 between the Penske/Reynard team and Ganassi/Lola, specifically mentioned at the Houston round. TC was only legal in 2002 for CART and even then it still put Carpentier in the wall before the start at Long Beach when the system disconnected and fired him into said wall however, the FOX (yeah FOx covered CART briefly) mentioned it. And...no, the 99 CART cars had the better look and better liveries. Change my mind!

[@AidanMillward]

Don’t think it has any extra gizmos on board. I just got in and had a run. I think it’s just a generic model.

[@stanislavkostarnov2157]

the feeling when you are watching a history video (or alternate-history video) and realize it all happened AFTER you stopped watching F1...

[@csonkaperdido]

Commentary level 1000 Murray Walker, Martin Brundle eat your heart out

[@Durbanite2010]

Cool video concept, Aidan. I wonder how the F1 car would fare against the CART car around one of the Superspeedways in the U.S., e.g Talladega.

[@laborliberal]

I loved the late 90s indycars. It really was a great rival series to f1.

[@Tommo_]

about the sequential shifter, the new 2022 rally1 cars now all use a push pull type sequential shifter too. They are also pretty quick, and use an ERS type plug in hybrid system. Would be cool to see you cover this :)

[@LtNduati]

I enjoyed this, well done Aidan, well done.

[@chipwhitley9407]

I'm laughing at the altered sponsor logos on the Reynard. Can't wait to shop at Tango to buy some Powerizer batteries!

[@AidanMillward]

Fake liveries are best liveries.

[@RJ-cq8dd]

All i can say is i LOVE the VRC NA 1999 car. The sound, the physics and the sequential stick shift is all i need.

[@caincha]

I gotta say to me the biggest appeal of the CART championship in late 90s was how much it felt and looked like 'real' racing whereas F1 was more 'artificial' with so much tech and driver aids. Also we could see CART go off road and tangle with each other a bit and still keep going but F1 was more like it'll break if you look too hard.

[@AidanMillward]

Between 94 and 01 f1 cars had no driver aids.

[@caincha]

@@AidanMillward I might have phrased it wrong but ok: CART was a bit more 'pure' with sequential gear rather than paddle, no power steering, slicks, refuel and so on. Personal preference - ain't it always? - but I thought it was much better to see than F1 back then.

[@denyer457]

To be honest. For fairness, he should have both driven by the ai and him follow in a camera car of sorts.

[@Blaghhhhhhhhhhhh]

That layout is so much better than that stupid last chicane. So wish they would bin it.

[@ayrtonsenna1989luke]

CART also had ground effects giving a different type of grip and ton of power with boost wound up from the bi turbo v8s, I'll let you off that you corrected in the comments that this car did infact win the title at the hands of Montoya and not Dario in the Kool Green team.

[@Nightwolf5151]

Amazing video, why not have these two cars to race at Monza or Michigan raceway?

[@DrBIeed]

Well of course they’re more ‘chunk’ than F1. They have pneumatic jacks integrated into the chassis so the car lifts itself when it pulls into the pits.

[@sadwingsraging3044]

Kool Blue car was a gorgeous little girl!

[@elijames3041]

Cool video

[@F1ll1nTh3Blanks]

Man the CART's really looked stupid cool with the classic sonic jet nose and the curvy spade like front wing.

[@philllawrence1580]

Could you do a What if... for Greg Moore if he had just crashed like Richie Hearn at Fontana... the Potential for him at Penske in 2000 was unreal...

[@ih8temoney]

That was a dark day in my home in the UK. Watching live, he hit that wall and my god....Montoya was in tears at the end of the race. I became a Montoya fan for life from that point on.

[@philllawrence1580]

@@ih8temoney I remember watching the Channel 5 coverage because they replayed indycar races in full and they warned before the footage there was brief footage of the crash... one minute it's racing the next Greg was flying cockpit first towards the wall 😞 oof

[@minibus9]

cool video. Could you do Pikes Peak for the Could modern F1 handle series as that would be fun

[@Scotracer1987]

It shows that all the complaints that current F1 cars are too big is nonsense. CARTs/Champ Cars were just as big and look AWESOME. And the racing was great.

[@Frostfly]

Current F1 cars are too big. CART used very different tracks where big wasn't as much of a problem. Looking awesome is not the primary job of a racecar. nor the primary goal of a race series.

[@nickb2049]

@@Frostfly it may not be the primary goal, but it is one of the goals for series in the states. and CART absolutely nailed it on all accounts

[@nickjacobs1770]

I think to get a good comparison you need to race an F1 & Indy car on an oval.

[@JPKelly-xr7tr]

This.

[@danielhenderson8316]

The F1 car is just going to blow it's engine because it's not designed to run laps at redline for 95% of a lap (which is very different from 95% on throttle).

[@SmittyHalibut]

Just came here to post this. Take these same cars to the IMS Oval. :-)

[@AidanMillward]

Saying that, McLaren took their 1991 (or 1990) car to an oval and ran fast enough to be mid pack or something ridiculous like that. I’ll try to dig more up.

[@jeremythurman5261]

@@AidanMillward In 2014/15, Indycar tested at Cota with that awful looking Chevy aero and ran times that compared to F1 mid-field. But for the most part, the gap between the two series only grows or shrinks when F1 changes regs (since 2000). Unfortunately, I don’t think that gap is going to get any closer than it could have in 2015 because in the car seems to be preoccupied with racing product than about the speeds. Even with Indycar going to 900 hp in 2023, that fat chassis will hinder it closing the gap.

[@Will_M600]

@Aidan Millward you're really good at commentary. like really good. So refreshing to hear a clear easy to understand commentary that doesn't sound like crofty

[@AidanMillward]

I commentate for the official rf2 competitions and do comms for FSR. I’m usually the driver “expert” but doing the main stuff Is fun too.

[@Will_M600]

@@AidanMillward oh awesome! I don't really follow r factor but I'll check it out

[@AidanMillward]

@@Will_M600 Traxion’s KZbin channel should have a few of them.

[@gerglmuff]

f1 cars are faster, but 1999 indy car racing was better than 1999 f1 racing, for sure

[@nickb2049]

it proves that fast lap times does not mean better racing

[@rickydeathtower]

I’m having way too much fun with 90s cart mods for assetto corsa.

[@nickypoundtown9568]

If it were real life the McLaren would have had a hydraulic failure and the CARTs firestones would have made it go into the wall

[@AidanMillward]

Still get PTSD from the 2001 race 😔

[@bloqk16]

Ah! One aspect not covered with the specs was with the fuels. CART/IndyCar ran on methanol back then; and of course, the F1 cars with petrol/gasoline. Given the sophistication with the fuel injection systems on both cars, it would be curious to see how well the respective engines would run with reversing the fuels. One aspect that made the F1 Cosworth DFV engine work well for CART/IndyCar in the 1970s was its adaptability to running on methanol.

[@michaelniemeyer2706]

Can you put them both at somewhere the Indy cars drive or it that not available in the sim? Curious how the F1 cars do under their track setups.

[@AidanMillward]

Some of the tracks are availabe, I just went with Barcelona as it had the variety in corners and has the same layout as used in the 1999 season.

[@Angelbonilla1982]

The cart slides, and the F1 passes in that right moment so not fair

[@AidanMillward]

Yeah. cos it would have been so close without it... It;s a motor race, they went racing.

[@stevegillies1687]

I look at these onboards as some one who enjoys sim racing (and rubbish at it) and I just see how much the CART car moves around and fights for grip, and think man they look a ton of fun. Obviously F1 cars are a huge spectacle but the fact you can see the struggle to get the power down and the car turned in just makes it for me. Its like doing a dance, they seem way more dramatic even though they're going slower.

[@racingfan88mwg23]

you should do Australian v8 supercars versus a nascar. i have always been curious the difference in the two main stock cars in the world!

[@josephernest91]

Someone already said it but thanks for answering a question ive had since I was a kid watching both series with my dad.

[@DanoFSmith-yc9tg]

The Indy car’s AI looked like he purposely crashed on lap one! Lol. But yeah those 90’s cart/ Indy cars definitely has the best look of any open wheel car.

[@AidanMillward]

Yeah, AI can over defend sometimes.

[@Mrmayhembsc]

God those cart car were beasts. What amazing engine

[@LoganHunter82]

Aidan, what are your thoughts about if F1 added one oval race on it's calendar? How would that change the cars? Since ground effect is back, could teams build a F1 car that is specific just for that race. How would those cars look like and drive?

[@AidanMillward]

Yes, They’d have to design an oval specific car, or just build a car that can handle all three types of circuit (road, oval, street), the former now more than ever cant be done because of the budget caps. And the teams aren’t going to design and build a car for one race- Jack of all trades or not. Since 2017 the mercs haven’t been that hot round Monaco and been brilliant everywhere else… to an extent. They’ll sacrifice Monaco for all the other tracks on the calendar because Monaco is such an anomaly of a track.

[@LoganHunter82]

@@AidanMillward But would you like to see F1 race in oval?

[@xX_Gravity_Xx]

You'd honestly be better off going late 80's or early 90's, as at those periods the gap was much closer.

[@stephenbritton9297]

those 90's CART gearboxes were horribly unreliable to.

[@ajsteffen41]

I think the 90s cart cares look cool because they are similar to late 80s early 90s F1 cars. Low wide and sleek looking. Looking fast while standing still. Also less complicated aero (kinda) that makes it look like what 10 year old me thought an open wheeler would look like or at least something I could draw

[@layoutman69]

The Indy car may have did a little better at Monza or the old Hockenhiem.

[@T_Mo271]

Interesting comparison.

[@Scoobydcs]

the sounds are great!

[@MrBarniculusBaboonicalshire]

Im curious, which one has faster straight line speed, IndyCar/Cart cars are built for top speed after all especially on ovals, knowing F1 is fast AF, I’d like to know the answer

[@JohnDoe-td7mu]

Correction: Juan Pablo Montoya won the 1999 season

[@AidanMillward]

Read the pinned comment.

[@F-Man]

Actually, Mika Häkkinen won the 1999 season.

[@Holanduzo]

I think 95 cars wouldve been a much more fair comparison

[@AidanMillward]

No 95 cars available.

[@Holanduzo]

@@AidanMillward Hum, maybe a fw17 with te Cart from 1999, carts werent developing with the same pace as f1, so I guess carts during the 90s had more less the same pace, but maybe Im terribly wrong

[@GeeShocker]

Nice comparison 👍, but who cares. '90s Indycar/CART (NOT IRL) racing was a gazillion times better than any F1 racing.

[@nehylen5738]

Wouldn't go that far. It was good, but as an F1 fan having watched 93-96 CART seasons on and off, having the 5th safety car intervention after 30mn of racing could get old, and it did. Ovals weren't fascinating either, at least not over 500 miles. Some tracks and drivers were fantastic however. I got in for Mansell, stayed for some superb tracks (Surfer's paradise, Laguna Seca came to mind), racing, and on-track fights, as opposed to the refuelling overtakes from 94 onwards in F1. The points system made it quite hard to read properly, by the way.

[@danielhenderson8316]

How anyone could find the Michigan 500 boring is beyond me. Every race there was at the limit of machine and man.

[@15DEAN1995]

I wonder if the cart car would've been closer on old hockenheim? Cart cars were built for more speed so not sure if it would've been closer.

[@Furnerfamilyadventures]

i always wondered how much weight the champ cars would of had to lose to be 1-2 seconds off the f1 pace and why they didn't just go for it.

[@coeng.5714]

Part of the weight comes from a bigger car, the IndyCar is absolutely massive next to that F1 car. Not sure how much weight you could remove. Although with modern building techniques who knows, it might be possible.

[@s.j.l.8736]

The F1 car winning against the Indy/Cart car was never in doubt. The Indy/cart car didn't stand a chance against the F1 car on a road track which is much lighter and as more downforce

[@AidanMillward]

The point wasn't to see which was faster, it was to see how MUCH faster.

[@theabsolutedrive]

Ah! Those were the glory years!

[@adammiller011]

What about modern IndyCar vs CART? RSS has an IndyCar mod for AC. I'd personally love to see it

[@Maverick_31]

A CART champ car would probably be around 1 to 2 seconds quicker than a current Indycar (I would think) considering champ cars had 200 more hp than today’s Indycars an there about the same speed mid corner if I’m not mistaken.

[@mickcompagnoni1114]

If you re-do this video at the Brickyard, the Champ car should be quicker because the F1 aero causes too much drag.

[@skaldlouiscyphre2453]

Am I the only one who wishes a CART chassis got dressed up in prototype bodywork and used in an attempt to resurrect Can-Am? I'd also really like to see a Champ car running contemporary F1 brakes and tires, or vice-versa, the F1 car running iron brakes like a Champ car.

[@The52car]

Interesting thoughts on a Reynard chassis Can-Am car. Maybe someone with some old die-casts or model builders could give it a try.

[@skaldlouiscyphre2453]

@@The52car I've got a handful of older open wheel cars to try and modify like that, but I don't feel I'm quite at that point skills-wise. I've got a slantnose 260Z race car on the bench right now and it's turning out well though, so maybe by spring I'll feel like the Can-Am car is doable.

[@lacosanostra20]

Also take in to consideration indy is built for ovals and f1 for road corses so its not an equal comparison

[@AidanMillward]

Indy is built for road, street AND ovals. It's not just turning left.

[@lacosanostra20]

@@AidanMillward i never said it was just turning left there is still strategy involved if your trying to trash me in the comments look at my comment and what i said

[@leenux1707]

it's a good idea for a collab' with an other 'youtuber' ... one race with one car and you change for the second race

[@zeeshanhaque]

The Answer Yes

[@mark4lev]

Just to put to bed the ‘did indycars used to have manual gearbox’s etc’ … ‘From 1996 to 2007, all IndyCar Series cars used a hand-shifted 6-speed sequential manual transmission with a shift stick lever, supplied also by Xtrac since 2000 season until 2007’

[@devinmackey83]

Now do the same video but on the IMS oval and let’s see who wins

[@martijnkosters9024]

Deserves a rematch around Long Beach or something

[@maliklowry1236]

I would like to do a comparison of how far back you have to go in Formula One for a 1999 indycar to match, so for example could a 1985 McLaren be equal to a 1999 Indy car?

[@calvinstraveldreams]

I would actually say the 1999 CART car should be comparable to the 1999-2000 F1 cars, the problem is however that the default setup provided by VRC for the Formula NA 1999 SUCKS and needs major adjustments for competitive lap times. There is WAY too much front wing angle, and the suspension is wrong, and thus there is too much oversteer, when in fact CART cars should be biased towards understeer. At Mid Ohio (a medium downforce circuit) for instance, based on what I have seen from the race broadcast, the teams were running low front wing angle and a bit under maximum on rear wing angle, based on actual photos of the race that I have seen. I would recommend you use that as a reference point for medium downforce tracks like Silverstone, Imola, COTA, and Catalunya (as well as Watkins Glen Boot-Watkins Glen Short is an ultra low downforce track), and once you have the correct downforce (according to the 1999 CART race broadcast at Mid Ohio, the cars were hitting 195 mph (314 km/h) at race boost (925 bhp @ ~14500 rpm), meaning they should logically be hitting 200 mph (322 km/h) at qualifying boost (960 bhp @ 14800 rpm)) (Although I do think the actual top trap speed will be closer to 205-210 mph (330-338 km/h) given that while downforce requirements are similar to those of Mid Ohio at F1’s medium downforce circuits, the straightaways are longer than the one at Mid Ohio). I almost guarantee the lap times will improve significantly once you do that, and so will the drivability (contrary to popular belief, the 1999 Reynard CART car should feel quite benign-if heavy and understeery-compared to the grooved tire F1 cars).

[@blekenbleu]

Enabling closed captions could remove considerable guessing about dialog specifics.

[@HeavyMetalGamingHD]

This CART car is quite the chungus. Almost on current f1 levels. They are as wide as modern f1 cars, but almost a meter shorter.

[@jamesbrennan5457]

1995 would probably be a good year to compare. Maybe that's why VIlleneuve transitioned decently to F1.

[@RantingBrummie]

They really need to put the sweepers back in for the Spanish GP

[@RomanShopa]

Why would you think Barcelona is a fair track for comparison? I'd say the best option would be something like Hungaroring or Mid-Ohio - similar by character and the surface (much bumpier and more dirt back then). People rightfully mentioned Monrtreal below in the comments: in 2000, the F1 pole was similar to the CART lap record, set in a SLOWER 2002 car. I also wonder about top speed these days on road courses. Apparently, CART would not be able to hit 360 kph at Hockenhein or Monza due to weight and more drag (wider track), but 320-330 at Road America were typical numbers. And that's 25 mph (40 kph) more than today's "IndyCar" is capable of.

[@romeovidalrodriguez7754]

hola bueno video saludo #Excelente!: 🤜🤛👍👏👊

[@mattpotter8725]

I was expecting you to compare the actual racing in the series and not how fast each car could do a lap because it is obvious that the F1 car was going to win by some margin, but this is missing the point, each series has regulations so that each series is competitive. I love F1, but at the time with the lines of Franchitti, Paul Tracy, Al Unser Jr, Gil de Ferran, Tony Kanaan, Scot Dixon, Juan Pablo Montoya, and the Andretti's at its peak, which I'd say was more to late 90s I looked more towards to watching CART then I did F1, more on the street and road circuits and not so much the ovals, but it was much more competitive. Even at the time I knew that F1 was the pinnacle of designing and running the fastest cars on the planet, and that in CART they basically had the same chassis and the teams couldn't do that much in the way of differentiating the cars apart from maybe different amounts of downforce settings on the car, I think they had a boost button that could be used a limited amount for overtaking, different fueling strategies so it was all about the racing and less about the car design to a certain extent. I think this is what made it much more exciting than F1 at the time when it was coming into an era where Schumi was starting to dominate. I'd love to see you do a follow up video on that aspect of this comparison. I get why you did this and it's fine, but it didn't really tell me anything I didn't already know if I'm being honest.

[@mattpotter8725]

I also wish you not chosen Barcelona, I hate this track.

[@AidanMillward]

The point of the video was to answer the “Indycars were pretty close to F1 cars on terms of performance in the 90s” claim that’s thrown around on the internet. The claim is “on par with f1”, not “faster than” Plus I used Barcelona because of the amount of different corners (high, low, medium speed), rather than taking into account peoples’ feelings.

[@mattpotter8725]

@@AidanMillward I wasn't having a go, I just saw the headline and didn't think it was what it was. I just remember living watching CART at the time because the racing seemed so much better, a lot more overtaking than F1, which almost seemed a forgone conclusion. I have the video a like and if was entertaining, but it didn't tell me anything I didn't already know if I'm being honest. That said for all those who didn't live through the era or didn't watch CART then I think this was a great companion piece to your recent videos on IndyCar and puts that series into context. Keep up the good work. Would still love to see a video on the pros and cons of CART of that time. I was really annoyed when it all came crashing down because of the split and the two rival series over there.

[@kevinhuber8723]

You can't compare. It's called "Formula" for a reason. On the budgets versus the competition, CART was the more viable formula.

[@AidanMillward]

The claim in the 90s was CART cars could keep up. I’m just seeing if that’s the case. Wasn’t a comparison

[@Holanduzo]

Hum, the mercs from 2000 were told to have around 840 hp, so I asume the ferraris were around those numbers or a bit less

[@DeshiBlacksheep]

Montoya won the 1999 CART Championship, not Franchitti.

[@AidanMillward]

People really don’t read the pinned comment, do they? 😒

[@DeshiBlacksheep]

@@AidanMillward I came here to see race cars, not read.

[@mattpotter8725]

God, that F1 car looks so narrow compared to how cars are now.

[@csonkaperdido]

BTCC = Blokes Trashing Cars by Crashing

[@IanMcCloghrie]

They both ran Montreal, didn't they? Was that the same configuration?

[@AidanMillward]

Not in 1999. They had street races in Toronto and Vancouver

[@IanMcCloghrie]

@@AidanMillward Ah, right, it was 2002 they went there. Still, the 2002 CART cars weren't all that different from the 1999 ones. Looking at lap times, it seems the 2002 CART cars were pretty close to 1999 F1 cars (1:19 for 1999 F1, 1:20 for 2002 CART). Of course, by 2002 the F1 cars were 6 seconds faster than they had been in 1999. (that's assuming the configurations were the same, which I *think* is true, but I'm not positive)

[@nickb2049]

@@IanMcCloghrie 2002 saw cost cutting compared to 99, one of which was lowering the boost to lower engine wear.

[@AidanMillward]

For fairness I can only really do a like for like comparison. I know it’s a 2000 spec F1 car but that’s only 12mths as opposed to three years.

[@IanMcCloghrie]

@@AidanMillward Did a little more digging and they actually shortened the course in 2002, so the comparison is moot anyway.

[@isuckatthisgame]

It's fucking Montoya! 🤣✌️