Was Jesus a False Prophet?

[@T-41]

Dr. Ehrman has an impressive knowledge of the history of ancient civilizations, culture , religions, but fortunately for us laymen he is a gifted teacher. I feel very thankful I have had the opportunity to learn so much from him.

[@hegagi839]

Yea Bart said Jesus didn't say he is God and so he couldn't be God. In that case, if Tabor said he is God, Bart would immediately worship him.

[@RadicalCaveman]

@@hegagi839 Try logic.

[@sanaltdelete]

I haven’t watched the podcast in quite a while, but I am absolutely loving the microphone upgrade for Dr. Bart Ehrman. Keep at it people you were doing great work.

[@IsacBorgert]

Read my book about it, Jesus Failed and Finished in Disaster

[@JamesBinger-qs8hs]

Ttttt

[@adamclark1972uk]

It's a good colour

[@RadicalCaveman]

@@adamclark1972uk Excited by black?

[@johnferris9526]

Letting go of American Evangelical Christianity was one of my best life choices.

[@AcerbusFive]

Same here john

[@Phi1618033]

It's difficult to see the benefit of leaving a cult until you've actually left the cult.

[@elizabethallen1415]

Likewise! I'm truly amazed at the overwhelming relief and joy I feel again.

[@benxvotr8170]

Repent, you rejecting the spirit.

[@AcerbusFive]

@@Phi1618033 man I could not agree more. My life has had much more meaning and purpose once my chains were broken.

[@drumwaves1]

It'll be a sad day when I don't hear new content from Bart. I could listen to this stuff all day

[@jamesmziegler]

On my last visit to an evangelical church, I heard a political speech. It was like watching FOX news. I never went back.

[@shekina9473]

Don't go back to that church. They are doing their own thing

[@terryreynolds200]

“Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them.” - Barry Goldwater November 1994

[@jamesmziegler]

@@terryreynolds200 This quote surprised me because, in 1964, he was considered a conservative's conservative. What he feared largely happened, too. Today, MAGA would banish him as a RINO.

[@patrickhurley7029]

stay away from those evangelical churches in my opinion

[@HkFinn83]

Evangelicals and the republican right are joined at the hip

[@simonthompson2764]

Professor Ehrman has made Bible scholarship available for us plebs. Totally altered my view of the Bible. Very few Christians have either the interest or guts to go deeper than their surface devotional interest in the scriptures.

[@Willie_Wahzoo]

Can you blame them, really? They're told their whole life that they're essentially perfidious cowards who will be tortured in a fire for all of eternity if they don't "believe in Jesus" (whatever that means---seeing as it means many different things to many different people.). It's hard to turn away from something taught so strictly to you and to turn away from the belief of your family, friends and most of the people around you.

[@simonthompson2764]

@@Willie_Wahzoo 👍

[@FionaBranker]

Oh wow I thought "plebs" was solely a Trinidadian word 😅 thank you for using it in this comment

[@BrunoCardoso-dp3bd]

You find what you are searching to.. internet gives you the answer you want

[@simonthompson2764]

@@BrunoCardoso-dp3bd Internet? No. Academic scholarship? Yes.

[@skyer82]

Finally! 🎉 Bart got the propper microphone! ❤ so happy to be finally able to hear the podcast with good sound ❤

[@kobe51]

Thanks for asking the big questions that most Christians would never dare to bríng up.

[@DMD5609]

Jesus never said that the end of the world would come in his generation or even close to the next generation. Megan Lewis put up this false question and Bart did not correct her. When some people asked Jesus he replied that no one knows when the end will come. Matthew 24:36

[@DMD5609]

Bart Erhman should be debating with a Catholic theologian like Scott Hahn, or apologists like Jimmy Akin and Trent Horn. They know their stuff.

[@AndriyValdensius-wi8gw]

David cottage Dr Ehrman covers that. Didn't you listen ? The Gospels were written at different times and as the years passed the message shifted, adjusting to circumstances, as it became increasingly obvious that Jesus wasn't going to come back "in their lifetimes ". I seem to remember reading Christ saying, "before this generation is out" or similar, although I'm not enough of a scholar to quote chapter and verse. As the years passed Christianity spread and became more organised. They had local bishops, deacons and what have you. I'm sure there was a lot of money involved as well. Christianity had to be marketed effectively. Marketing is not a recent invention, by any means.

[@DMD5609]

@@AndriyValdensius-wi8gw Wrong, the apostles kept notes of what he said, nowhere in the bible does it say they did not take notes, they could not rely on just their memories. They passed what was preached on to others in the church hierarchy of those times. Jesus didn't leave a bible but he told the apostles that not one word (Jesus meant the true meaning) must be changed from what he said. He also said that the Holy Spirit will tell them what to say and do. Jesus could have got highly educated Jews to be his apostles, instead, the twelve he picked were fishermen and from other simple professions.

[@DMD5609]

@@AndriyValdensius-wi8gw "Before this generation will pass away" does not mean the time of those Jews who were living 2000 years ago. Read Matthew 24 entirely and you will see that Jesus meant the end times, as he also said there will be wars and earthquakes in various places (on Earth) meaning it will be a long time to come.

[@BanjaraHillbillies]

I am ex-clergy. Recovering Anglican Priest. Thank you, Bart and Megan!

[@SugoiEnglish1]

Let's not assume Erhman goes unrefuted here. Daniel Wallace give a fine balance to Erhman. Watch the debates.

[@adamclark1972uk]

If you change your mind, I'm sure the church will take you back.

[@timhodor9271]

One of the better episodes thus far, very informative, really enjoyed this one!

[@AConcernedCitizen420]

I love it! Bart stated that the authors of at least two of the gospels were actively putting words in Jesus’s mouth or keeping him mute as they saw fit! 😂 Bart has won a subscriber!

[@scambammer6102]

he shouldn't be assuming that jesus even had a mouth, much less what the guy said

[@AConcernedCitizen420]

@@scambammer6102 😂 amen!!

[@AndriyValdensius-wi8gw]

"Putting words into the mouths" of various historical figures was standards practice during the Greco-Roman period. Historians like Tacitus, Livy or Cassius Dio wrote about people who lived a hundred or more years before them. Yet they write what someone supposedly said. As Dr Bart explained, they just made it up. They wrote what X might have plausibly said on such and such an occasion given the circumstances.

[@SrikantSalvi]

BOTHER DR BART WHAT U ARE PROPAGATING IS OLD STUFFS ALREADY REJECTED BY CHROSTIAN SCHOLARSHIP. NOW HISTORICAL JESUS IS ACCEPTED BY SECULAR HISTORIANS. AS REGARDS HIS DIVINE NATIURE AND MIRACLES PERFORMED BY HIM U SHOULD READ THE WRITINGS OF JOSPHUS FILAWAS AND BABYLON AND JERUSALEM TALMUDS OF JEWISH FAITH OF 1ST AND 2ND CENTURY. TILL REFORMATION JEWISH SHOLATSHIP CONSIDETED JESUS AS THUG AND DECEIVER. BUT TODAY JESUS IS ACKNOWLEDGED HIM AS RABBI TEACHER. WHAT A TRANRFORMATION.

[@gillesmeura3416]

I've been listening to Bart Ehrman and viewing numerous videos on early christianism for several years now. I think this video gives an exceptional insight into early christianism in a most succinct way. Amazing job. Well... coming from Bart... not really surprising! 😉

[@gregmark1688]

That's a good word, 'christianism', I might have to adopt that.

[@garrybooker]

Annointism, Yahwehism, Abrahamism, Paulism, Scripticism. The possibilities are endless.

[@James-sk1kp]

​@@garrybooker churchianity, Paulianity lol

[@MichaelYoder1961]

Megan is such a great facilitator for this podcast. And Bart - well, what can you say? The humour between the two of them and the easy-to-understand explanations are fabulous. Thanks to you both!

[@joeboxter3635]

Why does Megan have a (she/her)?

[@BobSmith-vo9hv]

You know very well why she has "she/her" pronouns in her chyron, and you are being passive-aggressive. Hair dyed pink & cut short, bluestocking glasses, nose-piercing, pronouns; young, female, British academic. From this we can say with 90%+ certainty that she is: From a well-heeled family in the Home Counties; Went to Oxford or Cambridge; Is a 3rd or 4th wave feminist; Is pro-choice; Voted Remain in the Referendum; Votes either Labour or Liberal Democrat - and is, as chance would have it, quite similar in appearance to Lib Dem MP Layla Moran (and if she has dual American citizenship, she also votes Democrat); Reads the Guardian; Supports Just Stop Oil & co.; Is most emphatically the ideological opposite of a TERF; Believes that Nigel Farage, Boris Johnson, Douglas Murray etc are all literally Nazis; Has certainly read her Foucault & Derrida, etc; In short, she is a far-left ideologue. Which is obvious & doesn't need to be slyly inferred with feigned wide-eyed innocence as per your question.

[@unsiliquaria]

I just wished muslims who are very pleased with Ehrman's skepticism realized they're not any better than christians. For instance, the Quran has only one version just because all the others were eliminated very early on.

[@pamalickkujabi3461]

Hahaha nice joke

[@Endrin911]

@@pamalickkujabi3461 There's only one cult thats still practising bloody sacrifice, apostacy kills.. etc Wake up, abdul boy. Yours is the funniest among existing religious books.

[@pamalickkujabi3461]

@@Endrin911 It will be good if you talk on matters you have knowledge on or else you make a fool of yourself! My humble advice to you

[@pamalickkujabi3461]

@@notanemoprog Oh okay standup comedian I heard you

[@ernestschroeder9762]

@@pamalickkujabi3461 the koran is full of stories that people had heard and attributed it to mohammed, but, in honesty, since neither jesus or mohammed ever thought to write anything down (unfortunately god didn't think writing important as most people of that time were illiterate) we can not know what either one actually said.

[@betsywilliamsonms]

Yes, grading is the worst part of being a professor! However, I do love grading paper. I am not a professor anymore but I used to give my art appreciation students and assignment to discuss an artwork that they either identified with or did not identify with. They were amazing because the students would be honest and raw in their essays and I would learn so much about them as individuals. ❤

[@Moodboard39]

Boring

[@badvibes2568]

Here is C.S. Lewis’s explanation of the problem: “Say what you like,” we shall be told, “the apocalyptic beliefs of the first Christians have been proved to be false. It is clear from the New Testament that they all expected the Second Coming in their own lifetime. And, worse still, they had a reason, and one which you will find very embarrassing. Their Master had told them so. He shared, and indeed created, their delusion. He said in so many words, ‘this generation shall not pass till all these things be done.’ And he was wrong. He clearly knew no more about the end of the world than anyone else.” “It is certainly the most embarrassing verse in the Bible.” C.S. Lewis, The World’s Last Night: And Other Essays, p.97

[@edwinf4524]

Here in Germany we love the teachings and knowledge of Bart Ehrman. - But my evangelical friends kind of hate Bart. 😂😅

[@Nexus-jg7ev]

Ironically, it was German theologians who kicked the entire critical New Testament scholarship off, such as David Friedrich Strauss and Albert Schweizer. Gerd Ludeman was German too, and even Bart Ehrman has German roots.

[@edwinf4524]

@@Nexus-jg7ev you are right😊👍🌻

[@andrewmays3988]

The truth about our cherished beliefs can be very painful. Few love to hear the sins they love to act.😇

[@billball6503]

Would love to see episodes on what we can say about Jesus' family, as well as the supposed tension between Paul and James/Peter in the early church. I know other scholars have a lot to say about this, but the evidence they work with has always seemed flimsy to me. Would be interesting to hear a more measured view from Bart.

[@jeffmacdonald9863]

Definitely would love to see Bart's take on James.

[@jeffryphillipsburns]

I think an episode about Jesus’s and the early church’s relation to economics (the root of all evil, etc.)-and how church positions on that matter of wealth acquisition has changed or varied over the centuries-would be much more useful.

[@Larry30102]

James Tabor has some interesting things to say about Jesus family

[@IsacBorgert]

Read my book about it, Jesus Failed and Finished in Disaster

[@Moodboard39]

James is written about Israel and the law ....if u read it u would of understand that .... Paul was apostle to the gentiles ( non new ) yet many people get confused and can't able to discern between the two You have to see that dispensational

[@thomaslynas721]

Excellent as usual. I must admit I also enjoy the format. Megan refers to it as a 'show'. Indeed it is as it resembles an old English TV quiz show with an announcer declaring the next segment in a bright cheerful manner. Always learn something new.

[@ChessemillPerezChristopher]

Excellent discussion. Much appreciated.

[@johnbevan4684]

Megan is super sweet and has a big brain. She's an excellent host. Thanks, Megan!

[@chrisdriver7776]

Don't need the pronouns though.

[@Moodboard39]

@@chrisdriver7776 huh? he a man ot something?

[@nasonguy]

That gospel assignment sounds super fun... if you're only taking one course that semester, haha. I just imagine, slammed with 15 credits, several finals and papers coming up, and goddammit Bart wants to write the dang Bible?!? lol. Glad I'm not in college anymore man.

[@jeanne-marie8196]

Very informative! I’m looking forward to next week

[@brianb4877]

Great episode. Request for future one (forgive me if you’ve already covered this). You’ve mentioned before the historical value of the gospels: beyond the mythology, these are the written versions of verbally communicated accounts. Can you talk more about that history of verbal communication and the possible biases or lack thereof at the point when they were transcribed? TY!

[@lauriehermundson5593]

If you are speaking of oral tradition, story telling, Erhman does talk about this in some of the other podcasts and debates he has done. Very interesting indeed.

[@DwayneShaw1]

It's often commented that ancient writers of religious texts were more concerned with conveying a message than they were with actual historical facts --- kinda like nursery rhymes - The doomsday death cult known as Christianity was, for the most part, plagiarized from several more ancient 'resurrection cults' collectively known as 'The Mysteries' - which was acknowledged very early on by Christians. Justin Martyr, considered the earliest Christian Apologist, said in an open letter to the Roman Emperor, Antoninus (circa 150 CE), - "And when we say also that the Word, who is the first-birth of God, was produced without sexual union, and that He, Jesus Christ, our Teacher, was crucified and died, and rose again, and ascended into heaven, we propound nothing different from what you believe regarding those whom you esteem sons of Jupiter." This is one of the reasons the Church was so adamant about burning books - to destroy the evidence that there was nothing special or novel about the Jesus Myth

[@jonathanguernsey7051]

I thank you for all the hard work putting in to every episode, I think that Bart, like a lot of us have been bruised by orthodox and evangelical doctrine, but, I also think that very same doctrine has dulled his hearing in Jesus, one day I think he’ll read something that very much so will spark a new interest in the philosophy in Jesus words, not the worlds view of Christianity!! Mad respect to you and Bart.

[@montagdp]

I'm very interested in the book you are working on.

[@orlandoarkadie5144]

I wish to say, Thank you sir. You have given me information to address the many questions I have in Christianity and provided the frame to my life picture. Mysterious ways indeed!

[@AverageJillM]

Next week is one of Paulogia’s favorite subjects. Maybe contact him so he can promote the podcast?

[@davidsparks6146]

Who was writing down detailed historical information such as that other Jesus guy who got hit with a rock? Where can I get those documents? Great Podcast... You two are always a fun listen.

[@edwardmiessner6502]

Jesus ben Ananias in Josephus's _Jewish War_

[@pmaitrasm]

Josephus Flavius

[@zephyr-117sdropzone8]

I think Dale Allison's POV is better than Bart's, who is really following Bultmann and is underestimating Jesus' view of himself. Also, that Jesus wasn't merely an apocalyptic prophet, but one with a conditional eschatology similar in some facets to dispensationalism. Where his eschatology timing changed based on the response he got.

[@TheDanEdwards]

Or the _Jesus_ in the gospel is a character, given the gospel story is a constructed story. Whatever real person or persons inspired the character, the _Jesus_ character in the gospel is playing an apocalyptic role for a culture (Roman era Judaism) that was in turmoil over the Roman occupation.

[@zephyr-117sdropzone8]

@@TheDanEdwards Where is your evidence for this?

[@papie5151]

I’ve learned a lot from this channel about religion but also about public speaking.

[@nusbacher]

When I think of 1990s authors writing about the historical Jesus, I think of Hyam Maccoby. I'd love to know what Dr Ehrman thinks about Maccoby's books

[@rebella5769]

cant wait for next week

[@jessemacias4863]

Love the write a Gospel assignment! Wish I had such an assignment. I'd probably plan to do Stephen, then when the deadline approached switched to someone barely alluded to in the letters so I could just make some stuff up.

[@giuseppemannino5204]

Thank you for the time ,dott Bart ehrman ✌️

[@AzimuthAviation]

I find it amazing that modern humans haven't overcome the basic psychology of ancient people's flawed ideas. Jesus doesn't stack up...

[@tophers3756]

We are primates with primate brains.

[@littlebitofhope1489]

How can they when huge medical organizations like the APA come up with utter nonsense like having a delusion is a mental illness unless it is in a group.

[@abedonwona8576]

It's amazing!!

[@theobolt250]

It can't be said often enough, loud enough. Jesus swung... and missed! That there came a massive following after his death... purely because people who invested in his ideas, couldn't let it go! The inventors of the resurrection and whatnot.

[@littlebitofhope1489]

@@theobolt250 Actually the only way it took off was due to Roman Society at the time. Basically, if Paul, who was a Roman Citizen, had not taken up the gauntlet for Christianity, it never would have gotten off the ground. If you weren't a Citizen, you were ignored. So it was political, as many things are.

[@bowhunter3703]

About 50 years ago, I was told by fundamentalist Christian family that I am very lucky because Jesus will come back during my lifetime. I finished high school, then college, got married, had children who all got married and had their own children and I am still waiting. The last date that was given to me is sometime between 2025 and 2030.

[@codecixteen]

I'm sorry but sometimes when Bart is gazing directly at the camera in his most serene and sagacious state of mind he looks like he's stoned, and I don't mean biblically. :P

[@77goanywhere]

But as he is as sharp as a razor, it must simply be that he is highly experienced as an interviewee.

[@Moodboard39]

tired

[@JamesRichardWiley]

Jesus, if he ever existed outside the stories written by his followers, was a wandering end times preacher who was executed for public blasphemy, (a killing offence) stirring up the people and attacking the Temple money changers (a felony). The reason Jesus never returned is because he is dead.

[@Lfppfs]

Excellent, as always!

[@guyfeldman4404]

Covered a lot of ground in this one...very informative and thought-provoking.

[@reikowallach2465]

I think I can answer the question about the Bodmer Papyri and why Phokion J Tanos is of interest. He smuggled a lot of antique documents from the ME to Europe, including the Nag Hammadi library. His life make a fascinating story, reads like noir-fiction and Lovecraft stories at times James M. Robinson has written a lot about him.

[@Nshiime]

Wow just wow, always discovering something new with you guys ❤

[@adamnascent7231]

Every time I hear about another figure around the time of Jesus, like Jesus ben Ananias or Judas the Galilean, and the remarkable similarity to Jesus in the gospels (predicting the destruction of Jerusalem, clearing the temple), I have to wonder if some of the gospel stories (which are not attested to in Paul) are creative conflations with these other figures.

[@DwayneShaw1]

Much of the Christian mythology was plagiarized from several more ancient 'resurrection cults' collectively known as 'The Mysteries' - which was acknowledged very early on by Christians. Justin Martyr, considered the earliest Christian Apologist, said in an open letter to the Roman Emperor, Antoninus (circa 150 CE), - "And when we say also that the Word, who is the first-birth of God, was produced without sexual union, and that He, Jesus Christ, our Teacher, was crucified and died, and rose again, and ascended into heaven, we propound nothing different from what you believe regarding those whom you esteem sons of Jupiter." This is one of the reasons the Church was so adamant about burning books - to destroy the evidence that there was nothing special or novel about the Jesus Myth

[@chefchaudard3580]

The gospels were written AFTER the destruction of the Temple. No wonder they take that in account.

[@deplant5998]

TL-DR: all prophets are false prophets.

[@gregmark1688]

Too short-should'veread: that answer is not useful, because scholarship is not designed to answer the question of god's existence. Dr Ehrman answers the more useful questions "Did Jesus consider himself a prophet" and "Was he seen as a false prophet in his day".

[@apollion888]

I just wanted to say "No, Paul was."

[@kenhilker2507]

Asking before finishing the video, so perhaps this gets addressed. Do we have any records indicating how the early church founders reacted to the lack of an apocalypse during their lifetime? Ie: at what point did "the end is coming soon", become "the end is coming eventually"

[@gorillaguerillaDK]

Never, they still believe it’s coming soon and very possibly in our lifetime!

[@WilsonCBrou]

Yes, the apostle Peter said: "But beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day"" 2 Peter 3 : 8. KJB Now it's good for yourself to know that even in the Old Testament, God had already testified: "For a thousand years in Thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night" Psalms 90 : 4. KJB

[@WilsonCBrou]

Mock not Jesus-Christ, following Dr Bart Ehrman in such a way of loss. He (Bart) doesn't know what he is doing... or knows it but can't go back !

[@gorillaguerillaDK]

@@WilsonCBrou LMAO - okay Loony….

[@diansc7322]

in 2 Peter I've heard that the question of a delayed coming is addressed

[@dawnbern2917]

I duh-no... when I hear that the Kingdom of God is coming, I don't really see it as apocalyptic... especially when combined with "the kingdom of God is within you"

[@DwayneShaw1]

it's apocalyptic to anyone that doesn't believe in these archaic immoral fairy tales - IF true

[@epicofatrahasis3775]

Only in the later gospels does it become that the kingdom is within you. This is an apologetic to the fact that Jesus’s predictions didn't come true. For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; ***and then he shall reward every man according to his works.*** Truly I tell you, ***some who are standing here will not taste death*** before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom Matthew 16:27-28 *CHRISTIAN APOLOGETIC RATIONALIZATIONS* *Rationalization #1: Matthew 16:28 refers to Jesus’ transfiguration, not his second coming.* The transfiguration of Jesus is a story recorded in Matthew 17, Mark 9, and Luke 9. The first problem is that these Gospels place the transfiguration at different times. In Matthew, it occurs after Jesus made the prediction about his second coming. That might make it seem reasonable to think that it was a fulfillment of the earlier prediction. However, Mark and Luke place the transfiguration event before Jesus made spoke the prophecy. Laying aside the obvious discrepency in timing, we can say for certain that an event occurring before a prediction is made can’t be fulfilling the prediction. The “prediction” wouldn’t be a prediction at all. *The preceding verse (verse 27) starts off the description of Jesus’ coming by saying he would come “in glory” with angels to dole out judgment to “every man”. That is not what happened in the transfiguration stories. Therefore, the explanation doesn’t work.* Some try to make it work by separating verse 28 from the preceding verse so that the two verses talk about different “comings”. This is a baseless tinkering with the passage in order to make a doctrine fit the scripture. The same Christians who do this will accuse other of taking verses out of context when they disagree with an interpretation. Yet, this is exactly what they do here. *Rationalization #2: The word translated “generation” can mean “race”. So, Jesus meant the Jewish race would not die out before he returns.* This is a manufactured definition to suit doctrinal purposes. *When you see “generation” in the New Testament is means just that - people living in a particular era, not a race of people.* Elsewhere when he speaks of the Jews, he does so by saying “Jews”. It’s rather strange that he would speak cryptically in just this one instance. *Rationalization #3: When Jesus said “this generation shall not pass away” he meant the generation living at the time of the end times tribulation.* *Correct! Jesus told his followers that they would go through persecution. So, he apparently thought they would be the generation living at the time of the end.* It is evident in the writings of the New Testament that first century Christians saw the tribulations they were going through as a fulfillment of Jesus’ prediction about the end times and the tribulation. If they saw it as such, modern Christians have no real justification not to see it that way as well. Notice that Jesus didn’t say “that generation” - which would be the normal way of referring to a future generation. *He said “this generation”.* ***Besides through a plain common sense reading of the text, we know he meant the people alive while he was speaking because he said that some of his listeners (and the high priest at his trial) would still be alive to see his return to Earth.*** *Rationalization #4: When Jesus said that some of his listeners would be alive to see him return, he was talking about the Day of Pentecost when the Holy Spirit descended on the church.* This is another explanation that is so far from rational that is it hard to accept that anyone sincerely believes it. The Book of Acts tells the story of the Holy Spirit appearing over the heads of the saints as tongues of fire endowing them with the magical ability to speak in unlearned languages. *There is no mention of them seeing Jesus in the clouds with angels. The supposed event did not accompany the final judgment. None of the things Jesus said would occur at his return happened on the Day of Pentecost.* *Rationalization #5: When it was revealed to John in his visions that Jesus would come quickly, it is to happen on God’s time scale, not a human time scale. “The time is near” and “coming quickly” are not to be taken literally. To God a thousand years is a day.* This is actually the first Christian attempt (found in 2 Peter 3) to explain away the fact that Jesus had not come as expected. *Believers of the time had begun to waver in their faith because Jesus had not come back as promised.* The writer tells them not to listen to people who say, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.” (2 Peter 3:4) By “fathers”, he evidently means the founding fathers of the faith who had all died by that time. *This is evidence that almost from the start of Christianity, believers have been wrestling with the apparent failure of their savior’s end times prophecy.* In verse 8, the writer tries to reassure them by saying, “with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day” and continues in the next verse to say that the Lord is not slacking on his promise. He basically tries to make the argument that time is meaningless to God. *This passage is in obvious contradiction to what Jesus himself said about his return and everything else written in the New Testament about it.* This contradiction raises the question: Did the Simon Peter, one of Jesus’ personal disciples, actually write this book? The most truthful answer: Not likely. When reading 2 Peter, we must keep in mind when it was written. It is well-known that many of the writings floating around the early church were not written by the people claimed to have written them, but were forged by believers to push their particular doctrines. This is most likely the case with the book of 2 Peter. *The first clue is that the writer acknowledged that “the fathers” have died. Since Peter was one of those founding fathers of the church, he couldn’t have written this book.* It has proven difficult for scholars to pinpoint exactly when the book was written, but they all place its origin sometime between 60 and 160 A.D. This means that it was written at least 30 years after Jesus’ crucifixion is believed to have taken place when he was 33. Assuming his disciples were somewhere around his own age and taking into account average life expectancy of that time and that, according to church tradition, the apostles were all killed, none of them would have likely been alive in 60 A.D. (the earliest date scholars say the book would have been written). *So, what can we make of the fact that this is in the Bible? It was written by a believer who didn’t want Jesus’ failure to come to cause the faith to die out.* Knowing that Peter was a founding apostle and a personal disciple of Jesus who was deemed to be the first Pope of the Christian faction that came to be known as the Roman Catholic Church, the writer forged this book in Peter’s name. It seems likely that this was an attempt to keep believers in the nascent Catholic churches in the fold. This is not the only case of forgery to uphold Catholic doctrine. (There are other forgeries in the New Testament that have been recognized by scholars as such.) *Whether written by the apostle Peter or something else, it is an obvious rationalization to try to deal with the failure of a prediction that came to be central to the Christian religion.* We do not accept similar rationalizations from modern-day doomsdayers and we shouldn’t accept them from ancient religious people either. *Rationalization #6: In Matthew 16 when Jesus said some of his listeners would see him “coming in his kingdom”, he was talking about his coming into his kingdom in Heaven after his resurrection when he went back to Heaven. Many saw this event through visions.* *This fails to take into account what Jesus said his “coming in his kingdom” would be connected to the day of judgment when he would “reward each according to his works”.* As far as I know, no Christian apologists say the judgment occurred when Jesus supposedly went back to Heaven in the first century. Everything in the New Testament places judgment day at the end of the world. Even if we were to throw the Matthew 16 passage completely out of the Bible, there would still be the problem of other passages where Jesus said *“this generation will not pass”* before he comes and New Testament writers testifying to their belief that he would come in their lifetime. *It is no wonder that this rationalization has largely been dropped by Christian theologians.* *Rationalization #7: Maybe in our human understanding we don’t know what Jesus meant when he said “this generation would not pass away” and that “some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom”. He couldn’t have meant he was coming in the first century because he hasn’t come back yet and that would make him a false prophet.* This rationalization is nothing more than interpreting the Bible by a doctrine you want to be true. If you’re going to believe in the Jesus of the Bible, shouldn’t you base your doctrines on what the Bible actually says? It is self-deceit to look at Jesus’ “prophecy” detailing his return in the lifetime of his disciples and rationalize why it didn’t happen. Only a mind interested in maintaining the illusion of faith could twist and mangle the plain words of the Bible the way Christians have in an attempt to make the incredible credible. An honest mind looking at the facts would have no choice but to admit that Jesus’ prophecy of the end of days has failed to come true.

[@Moodboard39]

@@epicofatrahasis3775 peter not founding father... fathers in israel about israel abraham, issac, jacob... u see the igorance? book of peter is talk about Isael new covenant

[@michaelgarth7077]

Another interesting talk. Thanks.

[@stevenpike7857]

Prophets aren't real. It's like asking if the mall Santa's are false Santa's. Santa Clause doesn't exist so the question is a non sequitor.

[@Moodboard39]

they had prophecy, u have no idea what u talking. wake up too reality

[@stevenpike7857]

​@@Moodboard39 The irony of "wake up to reality," from a person that thinks magic and prophecy is real. the Bible is Harry Potter for dumb people - but at least Harry Potter novels are better written.

[@Moodboard39]

@@stevenpike7857 Bible ain't a harry potter book ...just proves how bible speaks to your conscious...lol. Why so much talk about it ? Why the bible even here ?? If just books of faire tales ....

[@stevenpike7857]

@@Moodboard39 Don't forget about leprechauns, the Easter Bunny and Santa Clause too!!! 🤣🤣

[@MikeMcAughey]

Fascinating! Thank you

[@abedonwona8576]

Yes he was... that's why the people of his day crucified him. Thank you Dr.Ehrman

[@NookCrannyTrips]

This kind of view is useful even for believers to deepen their faith, much more than what is usually preached in all kind of Churches!

[@WayneRossi]

I’d love an episode where Dr. Ehrman takes us through some of the classic Jesus movies. I love Jesus Christ Superstar and The Last Temptation of Christ particularly and would like to hear what a scholar says about them.

[@sankharaYT]

Yes, I'd love that too. Especially Last Temptation is such a fascinating Jesus depiction to discuss! He should also talk about Mel Gibson's take as well as newer movies that focus on specific aspects, like Risen, Mary Magdalene, or 40 Days in the Desert. And what about the adaptation of Bill O'Reilly's Killing Jesus? Nah, just kidding about the last one. ;)

[@Jd-808]

Ha this is a great idea

[@mariecreativity9065]

I would love to hear this!

[@briandaniel6354]

Wasn't Jesus referring to the transfiguration in those passages. The chapters only have value for reference but weren't originally intended. It seems that seeing the coming of the kingdom of heaven directly refers to seeing Jesus with Moses and Elijah with the voice of the Father and the Holy Spirit. This event in the synoptic gospels takes place in the next verses after the "apocalyptic" references. Food for thought.

[@Phi1618033]

Since there isn't really a God, then there's no such thing as a prophet of God, which means all so-called prophets of God are false prophets.

[@zephyr-117sdropzone8]

Where is your evidence there is no God?

[@zephyr-117sdropzone8]

@@notanemoprog Extraordinary evidence? For what extraordinary claim? The claim is not extraordinary. Only to the ones who presuppose naturalism, which has precisely zero evidence in support. NDEs, documented miracles in peer-reviewed journals, fine tuning, all sorts of evidence has been presented. You need to get with the times. Atheism is dying.

[@epicofatrahasis3775]

​​@Zephyr-117's Dropzone NDEs? Yeah, they're so credible. 🙄 Actually atheism is on the rise. "By contrast, the dominant religious imagery of India is Hindu, and predictably NDEs from India typically involve encounters with recognizably Hindu religious figures. Satwant Pasricha and Ian Stevenson provide us with the following case from one of the largest surveys of non-Western NDEs conducted so far: Four black messengers came and held me…. [T]he clerks had a heap of books in front of them…. *Yamraj was there sitting on a high chair with a white beard and wearing yellow clothes.* He asked me, “What do you want?” I told him that I wanted to stay there. He asked me to extend my hand. I don’t remember whether he gave me something or not. Then I was pushed down [and revived] (Pasricha and Stevenson 167). *Here an NDEr is seated near Yamaraj, the Hindu god of death, whose appearance also corresponds to the god’s portrayal in Hindu tradition.* While Western NDErs tend to encounter dead friends and relatives more often than religious figures, Hindu religious figures are prominent in NDEs from India. Additionally, we see that NDErs from different cultures also give different reasons for why they are sent back. Western NDErs are often ‘sent back’ in order to take care of immediate family or for some assumed purpose unknown to them; NDErs from India report meeting clerks in an impersonal afterlife bureaucracy who process the dead and send them back because they have been sent the wrong person due to paperwork mistakes (Pasricha and Stevenson 168-169). *While OBEs are rather common early on in Western NDEs, being visited by a Yamatoot is “the most common initial phase” of Thai NDEs (170).* Where OBEs do occur, “OBEs in Thai NDEs tend immediately to precede meetings with Yamatoots” (171). Tunnels are “largely absent in Thai NDEs” (with one exception unlike Western tunnel experiences), and feelings of peace or euphoria and experiences of light have not been reported at all (172). Thai NDErs are sometimes judged, but their deeds are recounted by reviewing written records of their lives or the testimony of others. The following case is typical: *I … found myself in the judgment hall of Yama’s palace.* I knew that they were ready to judge me for my sins. A giant rooster appeared who told Yama that I had killed him. He emphasized that I had tried to kill him again and again. The rooster also said that he remembered me exactly. An entire flock of roosters also [appeared] and testified that I had killed them, as well. I remembered my actions, and I had to admit that the roosters had told the truth. Yama said that I had committed many sins, and sentenced me to many rebirths both as a chicken, and many other types of birds as well…. But, quite suddenly, an enormous turtle appeared. It screamed at Yama, saying “Don’t take him; he is a good human, and should be allowed to live.” Yama answered the turtle “What did he do to help you?” [ellipses original] (Murphy, “Thailand” 167)." From: *"Hallucinatory Near-Death Experiences » Internet Infidels"*

[@gorillaguerillaDK]

@@zephyr-117sdropzone8 "Fine tuning" LMAO That we find life, living where there is conditions that allow life to to exist isn’t "fine tuning" and "miracles" doesn’t happen!

[@zephyr-117sdropzone8]

@@gorillaguerillaDK Ok, then name 1 other world with advanced species born with the belief in God and the afterlife, which have both been proven by scientists. Babies know about God and the afterlife, so where does this knowledge come from?

[@rcnfo1197]

Great discussion! Now we have not only the problem of misquoting Jesus, but a misguided Jesus! Where was the Holy Spirit's guide to all truth? This is yet another nail in the coffin of Christianity.

[@joshrogers7816]

I wouldn't be so sure of that I'm afraid. Doesn't do to be complacent.

[@ronaldmccomb8301]

If I wrote a gospel for your class, it would either be the Gospel of Longinus or the Gospel of Martha.

[@bonifaceawa]

Longinus was my first idea (since there is a Gospel of Judas). But I aiming now for the Gospel of the Fig Tree.

[@enijize1234]

I wrote a gospel this morning. The gospel of rectus.

[@edwardmiessner6502]

I would love to read such a gospel where Longinus starts out his recollection of the feat of his great grandfather, Cassius Longinus, who delivered the fatal stab wound in the assassination of Julius Caesar and witnessed Caesar's funeral, and ties it all in with his own witnessing of the passion and crucifixion of Jesus.

[@nickydaviesnsdpharms3084]

one of the things i like to do is if i download a copy of these videos for my myself i can clip out portions which are relevant and of special interest, like the verse about the virgin and young woman issue, but i find the verse online in the relevant version and screenshot it so i can edit in and flash it up on screen which really helps the viewer, in this case myself but if i showed anyone.

[@jamesboswellii2034]

Mistaken, but not wrong? As a teenager, I began admiring Jesus when I first read his teachings in the Sermon on the Mount. As I grew older and studied him more carefully, I started seeing that Jesus, like his predecessor John the Baptizer, thought -- and taught! -- that the end of the world was going to arrive within his own generation. Yet unlike John who stressed the coming of God’s wrathful fiery punishment, Jesus emphasized the good news of God’s imminently approaching Kingdom. Although ultimately I was compelled to acknowledge that Jesus was proclaiming something that did not happen, I continued admiring him, and still do, for this reason: I finally became convinced that he expected his death would almost immediately be followed by his being gloriously lifted up before the eyes of all the world so that people everywhere could suddenly see his death as a loving, forgiving gift of God intended for the benefit of all humanity. In other words, Jesus was expecting that his dying would soon wonderfully and totally fulfill Isaiah 52:13-53:12 for the sake of everyone on earth, and this understanding of God’s intended “will” was so unexpected that even Jesus had to struggle with it in Gethsemane (Mark 14:33-36). A short while later, as Jesus was standing before his accusers, he told them that they would see him exalted “at the right hand of Power and coming with the clouds of heaven” (14:62; see Psalm 110 and Daniel 7:13-14 ) In stating that, I think Jesus was saying that they -- even they! -- would soon see and possibly (or even surely?) appreciate what God had done for everyone, including them. (Note also Luke 12:10a.) “But wait a minute,” someone will object. “What Jesus was expecting did not happen. He was mistaken!” In attempting to answer that, I find myself in agreement with historian Dale C. Allison who replied to a similar objection by stating, “I think Jesus had it right: he so thirsted for justice on such a grand scale that he had to embrace his [Jewish] tradition’s belief in the transcendence of history and death. He may have been mistaken, but he wasn’t wrong.” (“The Apocalyptic Jesus: A Debate,” ed. Robert J. Miller, 2001, p. 105 .) Although subsequent events did not fulfill Jesus’ expectations, his unique view of his people’s visionary hopes still may be admired as wondrously forgiving and inclusive.

[@jamesboswellii2034]

Needless to say, what I say above is very different from the last part of Ehrman's interview. I am basically in agreement with everything Ehrman says right up until he says he does not think Jesus expected to be put to death in Jerusalem -- which is certainly not what the early gospel of Mark says from 9:31 on. For a very different (and in my opinion, better) view, see Dale C. Allison's "Constructing Jesus: Memory, Imagination, and History" (2010), paying special attention to Allison's fifth chapter wherein he argues that Jesus expected he would be put to death, and that this was God's will for him, and for that reason Jesus did not resist death. But what I said in the post above goes further than Allison does, for I am convinced that the historical Jesus' expectation that he must die was influenced by Isaiah 53, an understanding which was difficult even for him, as we can see in Mark 9:31-33 where he lashed out at Peter, and later in Mark's Gethsemane scene where Jesus himself struggled with the necessity of his death (14:32-36) as he apparently had found it revealed in Isaiah 53:10. I do not see how anyone can doubt the historicity of that Gethsemane scene wherein Jesus, who had earlier told his disciples that they must be prepared to die with him and warned them that if they sought to save their lives, they would lose their lives (9:35-36), seeks to save his own life even while stating that his will and the Father's will are not one and the same (14:36), though he subordinates his will to that of his Father -- as reveaed in Isaiah 53:10. How different from the Gospel of John in 10:30 where the Son and the Father are one and the same in perfect harmony. (See also John 12:27-28a.) Even so, what Jesus expected to happen did not happen. And so I refer again to my last sentence in the post above.

[@andrevanderschoot842]

@@jamesboswellii2034 i think it’s impossible to reflect on the past without ‘inserting’ certain knowledge of the dominant view in a person’s present. All NT writers lived in a present were Jesus was crucified and raised from the death as fulfillment of prophecy and a Divine plan….so they thought. Since all of them believed this outcome was ‘God’s secret will/plan’ they of course concluded that Jesus had fore knowledge of this plan. Therefor in the gospels Jesus foresees his own crucifixion and gives hints about it in certain places. The problem lies with Jesus early mission. Especially in Matthew Jesus urges the people to be perfect like their Father in heaven and seriously undertake actions to fulfill the law in a new way like Jesus taught. In true love for God and thy neighbor without scoffing at any detail. Jesus himself claims that a house divided in itself cannot exist. The same applies to a mission this important. You cannot proclaim a message like Jesus did in early Matthew , with so much conviction and fire, when you secretly are running a different agenda hoping people won’t listen in the end because otherwise they may refuse to crucify you and the prophecies remain unfulfilled. The bible is a collection of religious opinions that are very often in conflict with one another. You cannot preach a message like Jesus did with true honesty , fire and conviction and at the same time knowing they won’t listen and they really shouldn’t because otherwise a higher agenda would be blocked. That’s the philosophical tirannie of biblical scholars AND parts of scripture that has misguided ordinary people simply asking for a clear direction and instructions for centuries. We were promised a kingdom, but all we got was church… a true wise man once said.

[@jamesboswellii2034]

@@andrevanderschoot842 Thank you for this. I just want to point out to you that Jewish scholar Amy-Jill Levine is in disagreement with several present-day historical Jesus scholars in that she thinks it was NOT the later church, but probably Jesus himself who believed that he would suffer a God-willed death which would result in righteousness for many, a concept she says he "quite likely" derived from "Isaiah's Suffering Servant songs, particularly Isaiah 53." (The Historical Jesus in Context, p. 37). Dale Allison also thinks that Jesus himself 1) believed he would have to die, 2) thought this death was willed by God for a good purpose, and therefore 3) did not seek to escape from death but went toward it. Against those who do not think Jesus went to his death willingly, Allison says, "I think it much more likely that, in this particular, our sources are not bereft of memory. Jesus' decision to die, whenever made and whatever the motivation and whatever his precise interpretation, left a vivid impression [on his followers]. Indeed, next to the fact that Jesus was crucified by order of Pontius Pilate, his acquiescence to his fate is probably the best attested fact about his last days. At some point, he determined to assent to his miserable end, accepting it as the will of God": Constructing Jesus: Memory, Imagination, and History, p. 433.)

[@jamesboswellii2034]

Liberals and progressives (one of which I consider myself to be) tend to dismiss any sense that Jesus himself believed his death was necessary as God's will for him. I myself used to climb right up the wall at the merest suggestion that Jesus himself was in any way into some sort of self sacrificial or atonement (ugh!) thinking. As I grew older, I had to change. Many years ago Joachim Jeremias helped me get my head clearer on this matter, and today Amy-Jill Levine and Dale Allison offer added support for my conviction that Jesus himself was into something like that sort of thinking. I suppose I would change my mind if anyone could convince me that Mark 1:13 and 8:27-33 and 10:35-45 and 14:22-25 and especially 14:32-36 are in no way historical.

[@DwayneShaw1]

@@jamesboswellii2034 so you need someone to convince you that archaic immoral fairy tales that include talking snakes and donkeys,, and unicorns, and zombies crawling out of their graves and roaming the city, are in no way historical? --- grow up

[@BrettHayes-tw5gm]

Great info. I love Bart. So insightful. I'd like to make a correction though. I've heard him say in this, as well as another video, that nothing is said about the kingdom coming in their generation. Luke 9:27.

[@ferrantepallas]

listing pronouns, Megan, really?

[@ngliscsaxon6128]

She has short pink hair what else do you expect lol

[@ahmadymuslim]

hi bart, I watch your videos and find them very informative and thought provoking. I want to know your views on what happened to jesus after crucifixion. I am an Ahmadi Muslim and I believe he went to kashmir lived there and died there to avoid jew persecution. Do you have any kind of research on the matter. Thanks

[@jf5177]

Nice video Dr. Ehrman. I would disagree with that the “Forces of Good v Evil” was dominant in the Jewish view. Reason being in Judaism we don’t view “evil” as an independent entity. In the book of Isaiah G-d says “I created light and darkness, and I created peace and evil.” and even in Job, Satan is working on behalf of G-d. The concept of dualism where evil is independent of G-d or that Satan is an opposing power to good ie G-d steps outside of ethical and strict monotheism of the Torah. The concept of dualism came much later, even after Jesus.

[@kennethbrownsher1264]

I agree. Judaism rejected Duelism. Even in Job, Satan is the great Accuser of man . However, he is under the power of Hashem.

[@1DaTJo]

Exactly. God is ONE and God has created everything.

[@Kyeudo]

_[" Reason being in Judaism we don’t view “evil” as an independent entity."]_ Your modern Judaism. Not Second Temple Judaism. Your religion has metamorphized over the centuries. _["The concept of dualism where evil is independent of G-d or that Satan is an opposing power to good ie G-d steps outside of ethical and strict monotheism of the Torah."]_ The Torah reveals plenty of polytheistic roots. The oldest manuscripts we have show that Jehovah was once a god subordinate to another. Monotheism was a later development.

[@kennethbrownsher1264]

@@Kyeudo Corret, but the Ethical parts seem Original Yes Hammarabis Laws are old, but they lack various moral or ethical commands. I knew a out Judaisms earlier development from professors. Jesus is a retrograde money back to Polytheism, especially the Trinity

[@Peanut888..]

@@1DaTJo Are you Jewish?

[@andriesscheper2022]

Future is the obvious, a possibility, the unexpected. In that realm all prophets are false, even Jesus. He said Gods kingdom would arrive in his generation... It didn't.

[@Johnathan1800]

Exactly Christian’s don’t want to admit it and it makes them mad I’m glad it does 😂.

[@stephenchalmers71]

Is there any other kind of prophet?

[@jeffryphillipsburns]

Brian.

[@stephenchalmers71]

​@@jeffryphillipsburns That's true. Thanks for the reminder.

[@TheHookahSmokingCaterpillar]

Only naughty boys.

[@yo-Rowe]

I thought it was a strange choice of words as well. Adding the word “false” is quite unnecessary. We don’t say false wizards or false leprechauns.

[@Agonostic]

Thank you Bart for your work! I am a much better person since leaving Christianity and not being part of any religion for over 6 years now! ❤

[@TimBee100]

Jesus was a cult leader like Jim Jones.

[@grungeisdead8998]

He was a cult leader by definition but we can’t say exactly who he was like in terms of cult leaders because we don’t personally know the historical Jesus or any mental illnesses he may or may not have had

[@Moodboard39]

um no, jesus wasnt, muhammad was....

[@larrybikedummy]

Thanks a lot for your work, Bart, it's such an eyeopener. I'm from Ukraine, been born and raised in the evangelical environment. Later when I got married I started attending my wife's eastern Orthodox church but there's always been a battle going on inside me and something would push me find out more about what I believe in. Now in the era of KZbin when there's a chance to delve into the plethora of eye-opening works such as yours and those of other NT scholars, the seeds are planted. The slow and painful deconversion process is underway....🥴😮‍💨🫣🤕

[@Powerslave-gi7nx]

My friend, I too left evangelical church. It’s totally compromised nowadays and so often the last place you’ll find God. But we must not escape the ditch one side the road and fall into the ditch on the other side like these guys have on this video. In England we say ‘we must not throw the baby out with the bathwater’. The truth is out there but it’s so hard to find it nowadays. Check out a guy called Derek Prince. Keep seeking, God is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him. These guys on this video sadly misinterpret so much of the bible. So often they are educated to degree standard by a compromised system, the same system that’s compromised our churches.

[@gorillaguerillaDK]

I started losing my faith during deployments in the Balkan region in the mid and late 90's and early 00's. I know Bart Erhman lost his faith partially due to the question of evil - and in a way, although less intellectual and more real world experience based, this was what drove me to question the existence of a god! I was on patrol south east of Tuzla when the first refugees from Srebrenica started pouring in - being hunted by militia groups of Serbs and Russian volunteers roleplaying "crusaders"… You’ve probably heard the saying that there’s no atheists in foxholes - this is absolutely untrue - and I have to question how anyone who has witnessed war can continue to believe in a god like the Abrahamic god! Coming from a very religious family, with all men and most women on my maternal side were either priests or otherwise involved with the Church, or a Christian approach to their line of work as nurses, teachers, or social workers, it wasn’t easy "coming out", but luckily my family is also very liberal humanist oriented, and as losing my faith also moved me towards a more progressive humanist take, I was soon "forgiven" and invited to family events again…

[@bertrandrussell894]

To think hell is a real thing and to be at the whim of a callous deity has to be awful. I can only imagine. I wish you the best.

[@larrybikedummy]

@@bertrandrussell894 , thanks, buddy 👊

[@Powerslave-gi7nx]

@@larrybikedummy The truth is still the truth whether you believe it or not. If you remain related to Adam YOU will face the wrath of God. If you accept Gods invitation to his family by choosing to ditch your Adamic past and get related to Christ, then He took your punishment for you. Come on my friend, it’s a no brainer. You’ve just been taught about the wrong God, that’s what’s happened. I don’t like the god you talk about either. Please get to know the true God that the god of this world keeps hidden from so many.

[@thoughtsuponatime847]

oooh. spicy topic. Can't wait!

[@Dizzinator2114]

Imo yes, but I’m here because I like your teachings.

[@dominicestebanrice7460]

Insightful and informative as per usual. Bart's closing comment about elite Roman views on the good life that prevailed at the time of Jesus, made me recall the (good) shock I had upon reading Tolstoy's short work "Confession"; we've completely lost sight of just how radical & revolutionary the preacher from Nazareth really was! The Christian church's takeover of the imperial superpower, and its subsequent growth into a supranational superpower is the greatest irony in history. That Paul guy, eh?.....The ultimate fifth columnist! "Christianity in its true sense puts an end to the State. It was so understood from its very beginning, and for that Christ was crucified." - Leo Tolstoy "Even for a Christian anarchist, Leo Tolstoy’s reading of the Bible was unusual. When he ‘converted’ to Christianity near his 50th birthday, he did not embrace the orthodox Christianity of the traditional church. For him, Jesus was no ‘son of God’, nor did he perform any supernatural miracles. Tolstoy was convinced that these superstitious stories in the Bible had been added by the church in order to keep ‘Christians’ hypnotized enough to ensure that they did not question the unjustifiable compromise that the church had reached with the state. He was convinced that an honest and full application of Christianity could only lead to a stateless and churchless society, and that all those who argued the contrary were devious hypocrites."

[@thewb8329]

Usually the least religious or non religious people are the most knowledgeable about religion. Once you read the entire Bible, who wrote its various books, the times it was written in, read many other non canon religious writings of the era, see how Christianity is in a constant state of change and evolution and see that all world religions have experienced similar paths of development you come to realize the delusion of it once you spend the time and effort to question this almost universally accepted social construct. Only 20% of Christians have actually read the entire Bible (pew research poll) and most blindly go through the motions unquestioning their indoctrination and get their information from a 5 minute weekly sermon at a 1 hour weekly church service.

[@michaelvenezia9673]

if love exists then so does God

[@Hamann9631]

This is one of the reasons I love Bart. This is why I watch, despite Bart some times being wrong. Bart is correct about the Biblical definition of a prophet. Prophets, according to God, are what Bart said. Prophets in the Bible are revealing God's will, not definitely future events.

[@jeffryphillipsburns]

Starts at 4:18. You might want skip to this point.

[@JCResDoc94]

another gr8 title! _JC

[@meteor1237]

Meghan is a great host! Keeps things on track; and she's very cute, too!

[@stenblann9784]

Yes, but Bart is even cuter.❤

[@ashishmantri3684]

Letting of his or her own religion is one of the most relieving experience, in the beginning it wud be loss of meaning but after some time thw withdrawals go away u feel more emphatic towards ur fellow people

[@joeboxter3635]

For a bible scholar, you would think he would have read the bible. The matthew quote he is citing is taken out of context. The "this generation shall not pass before the end comes" shows that Jesus was NOT an apocalyptic preacher. They asked Jesus when. He answered no man or angel knows - not even the "Son of Man" .... And "Son of Man," Jesus was saying he did not know. So if he did not know, how can he answer when. And thus Jesus was not apocalyptic. So, he doesn't answer when. He actually then proceeds to tell them the signs. And he gives a list of signs. Now you can read into these signs much -- at your own peril. But it is *this* generation - the generation that will witness the signs Jesus gives that shall not pass. Again I have to ask, how can this guy be a Bible Scholar and not read the context. So then the next riddle. Many who stand here shall not taste death, but shall see the Son of Man return in His glory. So that's confusing. Are some who were living then still walking around us now and will continue until Jesus returns. I doubt it. The ones who will not taste death are the resurrected. To them there will be no "death." Like Lazarus they were "sleeping." Once appointed man to die and then the judgement. Lazarus did not "die". If he had, he would have faced the judgment. Thus Jesus said, "he is not dead, but sleeps." Those who are alive and will see Jesus are the ones, like Lazarus, sleep. They will rise as did Lazarus to witness Jesus return. There is another explanation others hold which is Jesus was speaking of his resurrection. I can see this point of view, but don't agree. But it makes no difference. I am clueless about science stuff and eg quantum mechanics etc. Even many scientist will say it is baffling, but it works and so until something better comes along, they "accept" it. And so are these things. They are not fundamental.

[@terryreynolds200]

Then you would not enjoy the Smithsonian Museum of Natural History.... The Earth is 4.3 billion years old, and Homo Sapiens have been here for at least 300,000 years and maybe longer. There was some pretty advanced Hominids making specific tools and using fire 2,000,000 years ago. THOSE ARE FACTS...

[@andrevanderschoot842]

The problem with most bible believers is they never ever can ‘see’ anything wrong while gazing into an abyss of contradictions. Best example is the proclaimed urgent return aka second coming of Christ Jesus. When ? Soon very soon. In our lifetime or generation according to most writers in the bible. Then people , christian and non christians alike , are wondering why it takes longer than proclaimed by the insiders and leadership of the early church. Then we ‘learn’ the golden trick ! A day, soon, generation, imminent are completely different matters in God’s realm. A day can mean a thousand years. Imminent can mean postponed and generation can mean something vaguely like a spiritual brand of people that form a singularity . In other words never trust simple straightforward language because in the end it can mean the exact opposite. Do you also promise your children a new specific gift and not coming through as a parent ? And after your child starts to cry because he/she is waiting for three years now , you claim a mummy’s and daddy’s ‘soon’ is not a children ‘s ‘soon’ ? Three years is still ‘soon’ for us older people you ignorant child. The more developed authority always communicates in a way it’s understood correctly by the receiver. Not setting a trap , knowing the lesser developed ones surely misjudge or misinterpret the promise. Evildoers use those tactics.

[@davidmulcahy6575]

do we need she/her? pandering to the current zeitgeist?

[@nohbuddy1]

Oh shut up

[@thamergazzaz3309]

Omg I’m so glad I crumbled upon this video. Thank you both for asking interesting questions, and Bret for clarifying them smoothly from an academic standpoint. I must also say that everything Bret was saying aligns perfectly with what the Quran says about Jesus. I’m pretty sure you read the Quran as part of your historical study of Jesus. Thank you so much for sharing the knowledge. Respectfully, Tham

[@calebmorgan6939]

Let's Go, Bret!

[@rocketdogticker]

The Quran confirms Jesus(as) son of Mary(as) was indeed a righteous servant of G-d. This is also stated in the book of Acts.

[@gregmark1688]

And of course, we believe everything we read, instead of trying to use the brains god gave us to think for ourselves. That's how research works -- just believe everything you read.

[@DwayneShaw1]

fairy tales also confirm that Goldilocks broke into a house owned by a family of bears

[@tomlaflamme2118]

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[@markgleason9546]

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[@jacklabloom635]

Another great video.

[@elzoog]

As far as grading, I give Bart Ehrman an 85%. I hope that teaches him how he can do a better job.

[@gorillaguerillaDK]

Eh, not without addressing what it would take to get rated higher…

[@elzoog]

@@gorillaguerillaDK Well, the semester is over so Bart has probably already forgotten the material covered. Not only that, but I have 300 other students. If I only had say, 30 students I could give him more attention. He can console himself on the fact that grading is SO important for his education.

[@jeffryphillipsburns]

@@elzoog Do you have an actual point?

[@elzoog]

@@jeffryphillipsburns If getting an 85% isn't clear enough for you as to what Bart is getting wrong, then you must not be well educated.

[@TheHookahSmokingCaterpillar]

@@elzoog Any teacher worth their salt doesn't just give a grade, they also explain what the student needs to do to improve. Formative feedback is immensely more important than quantitative feedback.

[@jeffreyhicks6585]

I learned the same thing from michael Grants book on Jesus (1972) that Jesus was mistaken about the end of the world

[@elzoog]

I wonder if Bart Ehrman could comment on Profmth's KZbin videos on if the apostles died for a lie

[@tedgrant2]

The birth of Jesus was prophesied in the Old Testament (Judges 13:5)

[@EvilXtianity]

_"The birth of Jesus was prophesied in the Old Testament"_ No one doubts that a messiah was prophesied; the point is, none came. Paul created the Jesus fiction in 48 AD after the Daniel 9:25 prophesy expired unfulfilled. The Gospels were written anonymously decades later to match Jewish expectations of the messiah.

[@tedgrant2]

@@EvilXtianity I can tell you've been doing your homework

[@jeffmacdonald9863]

Jews would disagree. Or at least disagree that Jesus was anything like what those prophecies foretold.

[@EvilXtianity]

@@jeffmacdonald9863 The only Bible author who claimed to have seen Jesus is Paul who asserted that he met him in a vision and described Jesus as being only a bright light. Paul actually stated that his sources were non-human, "...the gospel I preached is not of human origin." (Galatians 1:11-12). Paul further asserted that Jesus selected him alone to speak for him (Acts 9:15): "Paul is my chosen instrument to take my message to the Gentiles and to kings as well as to the people of Israel." In Romans 1:16 Paul reveals that no other gospels existed at the time, "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ." The Jesus story began in 48 AD with the first of the Pauline Epistles (which comprise nearly half of the New Testament books) when Paul realized the Daniel 9:25 prophesy of a messiah expired without fulfilling so he made one up decades later and set the story decades in the past matching Jewish expectations of the messiah to make the prophesy seem true. The fulfillment of the Daniel 9:25 prophecy written in 444 BC was the test of the true messiah. By 48 AD it was known that the prophecy of a messiah coming in "seven weeks and threescore and two weeks" had not occurred on the prophesied date. It was the 69th Week and the 70th Week was soon to come. The prophesied messiah was expected and the anticipation set off a messiah craze. "Seven weeks and threescore and two weeks" is, 7 plus 60 plus 2 equals 69 total weeks. One prophetic week equals seven biblical years of 360 days (the Julian calendar was created centuries later), so 7 times 69 equals 483 total biblical years beginning with Artaxerxes' decree in 444 BC. Those 483 biblical years equal 173,880 days, or 476 Julian years. Therefore the Messiah would come and be "cut off" in AD 33. One prophetic week equaling seven Biblical years is something “Daniel” invented in about 165 BC, effectively an admission that Jeremiah 25:11-12 failed. Paul made up the entire Jesus story and added historical figures, locations, and events to add authenticity. In the Galatians "road to Damascus" conversion vision tale written in 48 AD he claimed to have gone to the Arabian desert to study the Old Testament for 17 years to align with the Daniel 9:25 prophecy. Paul's goal was to garner support for the insurrection against the Romans which began in 46 AD led by two brothers, Jacob and Simon, in the Judea province. The revolt, mainly in the Galilee, began as sporadic insurgency until it climaxed in 48 AD when it was quickly put down by Roman authorities. Both Simon and Jacob were executed. He created the fiction of having witnessed the risen messiah. He wanted to show that the messiah had come as prophesied but was murdered by the Romans. This was to entice the Gentiles to aid in the Jews' rebellion against the Romans.

[@tedgrant2]

@@EvilXtianity According to Paul, we will meet the Lord in the air and live there forever. I'm a little bit sceptical because it's too cold in the sky and nowhere to sit. If Paul had known this fact, he would have invented a different idea.

[@Venaloid]

18:46 - Do you think Jesus went to Jerusalem because the prophecy in Zechariah 14? The one which states that the apocalypse will begin on the Mount of Olives, just outside Jerusalem?

[@Moodboard39]

Yea, but dispensational doctrine teach it's future event ...Israel coming back ...okay ...does that mean the apostle ??? They have be resurrected ...and go through the tribulation ...well that doesn't make sense

[@manfrummt]

Melchizedek - Pretty sure "Salem" meant "shalom". Peace. Not King of a town as this guy says.

[@rationalrant7407]

Is there any connection between Jesus and Hillel?

[@spiritualanarchist8162]

It's something inherently human to find al kind of ways to convince yourself you didn't spend decades believing the wrong thing . The brother of my grandmother was a Jehova Witnesses . He believed the world would end in his lifetime, and then died in the early 80thies. Decades later, young Jehova witnesses still try to convince people the world will end in our lifetime.

[@elarakamai]

And sadly their grandchildren's grandchildren will still try to convince people the world is about to end. I expect they will likely do this for another 2000 years. But it's a good hook to keep the parishioners in their pews in a state of eternal expectancy. They get to sit and wait and do nothing. Note that's very contrary to the succinct description Bart gives of the essence of Jesus's message to act kindly towards ones fellow.

[@spiritualanarchist8162]

@@elarakamai A lot of people seem to need someone who tells them what to believe and how to behave , and that will never change . I think a lot of these 'extremer 'American' cults , like JW, Scientology , etc are slowly dying out due to social media exposure. But sadly that same social media also gives us potential new crazier global cults, like Qanon.

[@Moodboard39]

Jw is a cult ....pluck out Bible verses and have no understanding....they get things wrong

[@sandystrait3878]

These talks are medicinal applications of reason injected into my previously poisoned mind. Thank you for your thoughtful dissertations. That old wounds might one day heal.

[@crede9427]

Bart is the GOAT.

[@MotherFarquhar]

Love each other as much as you love yourselves and you have fulfilled Gods love in it's entirety

[@adesojiadesina2129]

This is eye opener

[@GlorifiedTruth]

To discredit Joseph Smith and the like, Christian apologists are quick to point out that the biblical standard for prophesy is 100% accuracy, and that the penalty for failure is death. So, while I respect Dr. Ehrman's tact, I think it's fair to classify Jesus as a falsed prophet.

[@stefandavenport1588]

Genesis 1 claims that plants were created on day 3, before the Sun's warmth was in existence, yet Mark 10:6-7 has Jesus believing that Adam and Eve were actually real humans •• it doesn't sound like " divine inspiration "