Was there Irish arrogance before Twickenham?

"The other thing I would address is arrogance. I genuinely don't believe there's any arrogance in the Irish squad, not with Andy Farrell. I don't think there's arrogance in me in a sense that I dismissed England."
- Alan Quinlan on the defeat in Twickenham.
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[@andrewthomson7634]

One of the few involved in the Irish media with no need to explain themselves has to because everyone else has vanished??? Quinlan's media work is some of the most accomplished and down to earth relatable whilst being accurate. You never hear him belittling other teams because he knows that will bite u on the ass....

[@ardakolimsky7107]

Quinlan never, ever says anything incisive. He's a cut and paste merchant

[@jonathaneddy]

English fan here. No way were the Irish squad arrogant. There were 'arrogant' comments from the punditry but we have to be honest, the Irish squad has earned the right to expect to win that game. So difficult to play their game plan for so long and any rugby fan has to admit that Ireland is the only NH team to play at that elite level over the last 4 or 5 years. We have the same problem here (as do the Scots after their England win). So many times I've had Irish/Welsh/Scottish fans moan to me about English arrogance, when it's not the fans nor the squad...it's the pundits. Why? Often ex players stuck in their mind games trying to support their team and often back firing. FWIW this 6N is the most closely contested for over a decade I reckon. Italy could end up 3rd or with the wooden spoon. England could win or end up 4th Ireland is likely to win...or could (not will) end up 3rd (statistically possible but extremely unlikely). France...possible win or 5th!!!! (i think) etc. etc. When has that ever happened? I think it's amazing and as a fan of rugby it's better for the 6N and for the NH game. None of that would be possible without an incredible Ireland (best Irish team in history in my opinion). An outstanding England performance against Ireland and Italy playing out of their skins. PS - as an England fan I've particularly enjoyed being the party pooper, it's been pretty sickening over the decades have teams (Scotland and Wales mostly) play out of their skins for one game against us and then roll over to have their tummies tickled by others.

[@bernieob9577]

Thank you

[@user-hz4tz2qf7o]

The English team have never been arrogant, always the media, yet that's what the rest of the world sees, and you end up with the arrogant label

[@user-fb7iu7dv7s]

The Irish are not arrogant, we are just delighted and proud as a small nation to be able to play with the big boys

[@WetSands]

We're one of the big boys being no.1 in world for so long. It's one loss. Let's not bloody sell ourselves short. This small-country syndrome annoys me.

[@admaga]

I don’t think that the nation or the team is arrogant, but a lot of the Irish pundits were indeed arrogant and condescending before the game. There’s a difference between predicting an Irish win, which was logical, and being arrogant. I would highlight Joe Molloy (among others) as an example. However poor England’s form is you should never write them off, particularly at Twickenham. I’d say the same for any Six Nations side playing at home. Also, the number of registered players is Ireland does not qualify it as a small country in rugby terms. Finally the current Irish side are a fantastic side who you should rightly be proud of.

[@mitch2924]

Let’s go back a few years where Wales were the grand slam champion, didn’t see anyone throw out arrogant comments. These clowns have been found out for a second time within a few months. Where’s Matt crying about the Irish 6-2 split like he did with SA.

[@charlespirate1]

The Irish team don’t seem arrogant. The Irish media and some of the fans are. The fans have a history of arrogance. Mostly about themselves not their team!

[@ashishd380]

Ireland was arrogant

[@saren6538]

in farness quinny always anticipates the danger ahead

[@Vlerkies]

Yup, always level headed 100%, even when it's a turn of events and he gets it wrong. Respect. Not many pundits are when it comes to their home nation. Mils Muliaina for the NZ is also always on point and insightful. As for Ger Gilroy and Matt Williams, jaded nothingburgers

[@petercoles373]

Trimble, Heaslip, Zebo, Stringer……. GET IT RIGHT UP YER!!! 😂😂😂🤡🤡🤡

[@LeMerch]

Have to agree… god I hate Heaslip.. such a muppet. Zebo was having the craic but he was way off haha..

[@porcupineinapettingzoo]

Woodward, Tindall, Goode etc exactly who was predicting an English win?

[@rupey4582]

Squidge Rugby made a pretty good point, which is that Ireland are the most consistent team, ie always playing at an 8/10. The problem is that other teams are better at pulling out those 9/10 and 10/10 performances when it's needed. Naturally this will tend to be in high stake matches.

[@iamnemo1943]

Agree. Read an article yesterday about how Rassie would rather have a 60-70% winning percentage and win world cups than having a 80-90% winning percentage and lose it. In between WC's it's all about experimenting and building. Getting both right would be nice but is damn near impossible. But Ireland isn't far off.

[@porcupineinapettingzoo]

That was a great video

[@robw7676]

It is easier to be a consistent 8/10 team when the domestic game is structured around delivering the national side to tests in good shape. The same always applied to New Zealand - and they always had the same problem. Long unbeaten runs between RWCs, get turned over in the RWC. England, South Africa & France have the biggest player bases, but their squads are getting hammered by their clubs right up to their release into the national squad most of the time. All change at the World Cup - long lead up to prepare, which is why at least 2 of them tend to come out all guns blazing and put in some big performances.

[@michaelmccarthy9411]

The Irish players and management were not arrogant. The Irish media and pundits have! It's naive and embarrassing! As for the questions at press conferences. Don't make me start!

[@andrewthomson7634]

Couldnt agree with you more. As a Scot it has been painful to watch the Irish media especially in relation to Scotland. We know our deficiences without them being guffawed at by a bunch of private school Dublin boys. Ireland are a great team without doubt but at the end of the day there is still a small nation mentality that is difficult to overcome. Don't I know it as a Scot!!! 😂😂

[@LeMerch]

3 or 4 pundits you mean.

[@michaelmccarthy9411]

@@LeMerch No, embarrassed to say, a lot more. Try listening to some of the press conferences. It's excruciating!

[@vincenthickey9760]

​@@andrewthomson7634 as an ireland fan I have to agree with you. We were underdogs for long enough and took some wallowing from England in the amateur era all of a sudden were world beaters yes we've had some good years at international and club level but it won't last forever all teams experience this but as an irishman we don't do arrogance well it's not in our Dna. world beaters

[@stevemurray8257]

We had the audacity to stick our heads above the parapet and speak in slightly more confident terms (with good reason) about this teams capabilities.

[@laggers54]

It was clearly obvious they weren’t going to drop the ball 28 times again like they did against Scotland.

[@Sineadmcd]

Any arrogance came from media pundits or ex players

[@s.j.a486]

Quinlan has always been one of my fave rugby pundits.

[@charlespirate1]

The Irish team don’t seem arrogant. Same can’t be said for Irish media or some of the fans.

[@justincharles2332]

Ireland really should have won that game (on paper, bookies' odds, present form etc.) and I cannot help but feel they choked - they were on the verge of 2 x grand slams etc. and writing history and blew it - and it is not like Ireland don't have a history of failing... I am not sure that is a result of arrogance, maybe just not being in the right frame of mind etc...

[@rossgeography]

they well might have one it - I think the 6,2 split back-fired - I don't know if Farrell was thinking his backs were being targetted, also it seemed to take the ref ages to work out England were coming in from the side

[@kev63inuk]

No problem from this Englishman about the so called arrogance nonsense . These two in particular are good pundits , though Williams can be very chippy and Aussie about England . But haven’t seen the other presenter on here with glasses who’s the main guy I think . Now he can be fun to watch.

[@dulls8475]

Lets face it only us English are arrogant.

[@LeMerch]

@@dulls8475nah we Irish are rivaling your arrogance and even topping it. You’d wanna get your act together England!!!!

[@garyambrosini1427]

​@@dulls8475you are not English

[@dulls8475]

@@garyambrosini1427 How dare you....

[@dulls8475]

@@LeMerch We will be back....

[@johnpoile1451]

Last week France supporting England, this week Ireland supporting England.

[@karlosdeevs]

Yes😁

[@Ess_Bee56]

Confidence is often deemed as arrogance. Ireland were not arrogant. It was a great game and it’s a shame that there had to be loser. Ireland are still the best team in the NH. I am English and was surprised by the performance England put in.

[@bertiebanner2100]

Heaslip was arrogant

[@Ess_Bee56]

@@bertiebanner2100 Okay, true, but he doesn’t reflect the majority of Irish Rugby fans.

[@LeMerch]

@@bertiebanner2100he’s a muppet

[@DC.409]

Ireland statistically have the strongest defence in the six nations, I understand conceding a try a match on average so the pundits analysis, Ireland easy victory was understandable to a point. However, England’s attack effectively operated to the New Zealand All Blacks game plan from the World Cup producing 3 tries basically by not playing to the England World Cup strategy, which every pundit had expected. Effectively by forcing poor kicking from defence , Ireland rely on James Lowe an awful lot. The first try was straight out of the New Zealand All Blacks play book. Undoubtedly, this has not been lost by Andy Farrell and his coaching staff, two losses against world ranking teams three and five, effectively approaching the match with the same strategy. To lose once against the New Zealand All Blacks strategy may be regarded as a misfortune, to lose twice does look like carelessness, I don’t expect them to lose against this same strategy for a third time.

[@s.p246]

Let me put it to you this way, how many of you shared or posted the Ellis Genge clear out on Furlong? And how long after the game did you post it? Maybe that would give perspective on how we see the average irish fan. I know every fan from every nation had their take on an aspect of the game but sorry you guys whinge the most when the game doesn’t go your way.

[@kerrylass2]

What I have noticed is that ex-players generally from all sides perhaps becasue they are accustomed in their playing lives to blunt, honest and heavy self review are the toughest when they see any team, including their own, play badly. They also set out to wind each other up. I think perhaps ordinary folk and even non-playing pundits may tend to see that as being brutal and/or insulting or arrogant. Now course IF its opposition ex players saying that about you or your team well thats just beyond the pale and triggers you 😁

[@user-fz7de4cz4w]

To be Fair I’m English and I Thought Ireland would destroy us. Agree with the guys England Had been terrible for a While. Best I’ve seen England play since 2019.

[@kerrylass2]

As an Irish fan obviously sad at the loss. But honestly another part of me was glad to see England back in the saddle..rugby needs both England and now France to get back to full form. The 6 nations lit up last weekend. FINALLY!

[@vincentdegennaro3375]

Dang right there was….

[@shaunmcmahon2261]

Hypocrites on virgin media talking about Irish confidence and arrogance before Twickenham game as far as I remember the Irish squad were nothing but graceful and respectful towards England. It was virgin, BBC, RTE and ITV slating England every chance they got and the pundits making out Ireland were going to destroy England well backfired didn't it.

[@davos4268]

Any team that wins regularly is put on the arrogant pedestal by the media. Unfortunately some fans believe everything they read and hear…

[@frankkelleher8301]

No arrogance with the team or.coaching staff. Maybe some complacency due to the lack of serious opposition in previous games. These sort of attitudes can be there unconsciously. With fans and pundits, yes there was a bit but not with people who had their feet on the ground.

[@Kaiserbill99]

One thing being arrogant when you can back it up but Ireland have not even made it past a World Cup QF! The Irish media have been incredibly arrogant in recent times but Ireland do not belong in the club of "big Boy" nations which is an exclusive club of the Southern hemisphere nations plus England i.e. nations who have regularly made the latter stages of the World Cup, regularly beaten the big nations in the World Cup when it matters, and might have actually won the thing.

[@LeMerch]

Such waffle. Will you lot ever shut up being total weirdos with your big boy talk. Absolute melt. Ireland never contested world cups up until very recently. The sport was a minnow sport here you haven’t a clue!! Big boys… get your head off Grindr!!!

[@johnkent2114]

Let me guess, you're south african?

[@LeMerch]

@@johnkent2114of course he is. They really have the worst fans by far.

[@johnkent2114]

@LeMerch the worst fans of any sport I've ever encountered. And I've lived all over. Can you imagine if they let them into the 6 nations and we had to listen to their rubbish every year?! 🤯 playing them once every 4 years is even too much

[@user-ve4vb4vp1h]

​@LeMerch Why are we the worst fans because we state facts and win world cups. You can't deny the facts that Southern hemisphere rugby is definitely the best . So do everyone a favor win a world cup and then we will cheer for you

[@SAnd-pd1ou]

Ireland need to have 2 red cards, Ireland are streets ahead of everyone in competition, Ireland are going to win the WC.. Hon the backs! Just shut up with the dreadful arrogance

[@user-sd3hb6ru1w]

The team aren’t arrogant, the fans certainly aren’t, but the media are extremely arrogant. Just look at the comments of Stringer, O Gara, Zeno and especially Heaslip, (who also compared this Irish team to McCaws double world champions ffs)! Add that to the arrogant posturing of OTB and VMS and you have a pretty unpleasant scenario. There’s a reason NZ and SA were so happy to see you lose another WC quarter final. It’s called mouthing off before you have the right to.

[@porcupineinapettingzoo]

If it was arrogant to think Ireland were favourites to beat England why were the English players, coaching staff, punditry class and fans so delighted by such an excellent performance, it's almost like they were surprised.

[@robw7676]

Ireland were fairly regarded and named favourites with good reason. The Irish pundits behaving as if there was no chance Ireland could lose was the arrogance. Italy have been well off for years until now, but it has always been the case that any one of the other 5 can rip up the form book against the favourite. That's why Grand Slams are so hard - unlike a RWC, it isn't inevitable that somebody gets to the prize.

[@porcupineinapettingzoo]

@robw7676 Give me an English pundit who was saying anything different Woodward, Tindall, Goode...were they being arrogant too?

[@kerrylass2]

@@robw7676 I know it must have been horrible to hear (as a fan i know it really does hurt) and I am not defending Heaslip etc. but I didn't hear anything different from the English pundits...or even many of the English fans. Holy God you want to have heard some of the Kiwi pundits broadcasting after the English Scottish match..they eviscerated England!

[@robw7676]

@porcupineinapettingzoo Naming Ireland favourites and saying England would need to make far fewer mistakes and go up a gear to win - perfectly true & fair. You cannot name an English pundit that... a) laughed at the idea Ireland could lose (Trimble) b) claimed that England needed red cards to have a hope (Heaslip) c) wrote that no England player could make the Ireland first 15 (Stringer) Saying it after you win by 3 scores would be a bit unnecessary, but would at least be credible. Saying before kick-off is so foolish that it can only come from arrogance. @kerrylass2 it doesn't hurt, it is great! If I was Borthwick, I'd be writing it on the wall in the gym. England nearly always produce their best when expected to lose and disrespected by the opposition. I would encourage the Irish pundits to keep up the good work next season please 😄

[@porcupineinapettingzoo]

@robw7676 Clive Woodward “The fact Ireland are expected to win says a lot about how good they are but also just as much about England’s fall from grace. “The worrying thing is that if England don’t turn up, it could get ugly.” Why are you cherry picking Irish pundits, there were a lot more making similar predictions, congrats to England, they deserved it on the day but these predictions came from a place where England needed to pull out their best performance in 4 years to get a one point win, now let's see some consistency so next year nobody will be making similar ones.

[@trimad6128]

You were outplayed in every department stop making excuses and move on ffs!

[@hunterluxton5976]

Why do these idiots think the Irish can win every game? As for facts, those are limited to past events, not the future. Passion and unpredictability are the " known unknowns". Pride comes before a fall.

[@user-hz4tz2qf7o]

Arrogantly went into the World Cup, believing it was a given youd get to the final arr believed back to back grans slams ,Arrogantly believed no one could touch you .

[@frankharris9601]

you are only as good as your last game too many excuses always give england there credit

[@ardakolimsky7107]

Quinlan is the worst pundit in European rugby. Waffle, waffle, cliché