WC3 | Round Robin | [UD] Happy vs Lyn [ORC] | Don't Force Me Cup

[@HiddenWen]

Game is great when Happy, Lyn and Forti win a lot. Sadly, we have no NE representative that competes at their level. Maybe NE needs a buff.

[@alexch3618]

Revert the bear, dryad, talon, wisp, glaivethrower, demon hunter, kotg, warden, and moon well nerfs. It's pretty ridiculous how nerfed into the ground NE is.

[@emirerdinckala4514]

Such an incredible rush. I ve never seen before, look at 56:42 Happy already delete 4 creatures while lyn realize combat has started.

[@PeteCrawfordCrawford]

Pro WC3 at the tipitty top is a rock/paper/scissor afair between Lyn, Happy and Fortitude. Lyn usually beats Fortitude, who usually beats Happy, who usually beats Lyn. And yes, I know that Lyn recently won 2 series Vs Happy, but that is idiosyncratic. Game 1 is sobering. Happy loses *both* his DK and Lich in the span of 1 minute, and still goes on to win anyway. That should have been *irrecoverable* , but we see that quite often in the Orc V%s Undead matchup of the UD losing 2 heroes or entire army while still being down 1 base Vs 2 bases and still winning anyway. Also, Orb of Corruption + Acid Bomb is such a ridiculous overkill Vs wyverns. Like, a 70 food army of wyverns pretty much dies instantly. Literally instantly. Man, it's so anti-climactic to wath Shadow Hunter dying to Coil and/or Nova over and over and over again from the other side of the map. "Meh".

[@LAdS897]

He had an invul potion and still died for not using it, eventho he saw the coil coming from max range

[@PeteCrawfordCrawford]

@@LAdS897 Funny that Undead is the only race in WC3 that people play against that somehow they are never fast enough to press the invul potion. Maybe because the range, DPS and speed of coil/nova is absolutely insane? By *far* the best hero-nuking in WC3. I mean, sure, Pala HL is fast too, but the difference is that it only works Vs Undead and does a fraction of the damage that Nova does. But of course, Happy fanboys will never admit that the race that he plays gives him unfair advantage. It's always the "mistake" of other player. What is your excuse for Happy losing BOTH Dk and Lich in game 1 and still winning anyway? In a balanced match, that would be instant gg. UD's recovery ability is insane.

[@nightyonetwothree]

@@PeteCrawfordCrawford dont fool yourself. He deliberately dont press invul just to lose. It;s a show by lyn. He must be paralised to not press it.

[@PeteCrawfordCrawford]

@@nightyonetwothree That's not the point, genius. The point is that, because of it's DPS and range, Coil/Nova is the hardest hero-nuking to defend against from in WC3. Literally *all* the top pros lose more heroes playing Vs Undead than in any other matchups.

[@nightyonetwothree]

@@PeteCrawfordCrawford dps of coilnova is pretty low. They're 2 mediocre nukes, but used together and their dps is very low comparing to any summons or just extra damage from crits

[@uioup7453]

Wait, why did they nerf Wyvern HP in the first place? Lmfao, second nerf coming real soon

[@nightyonetwothree]

21 years ago...

[@uioup7453]

@nightyonetwothree pretty sure it's one of the reforged patches that got them to 570 HP...

[@nightyonetwothree]

@@uioup7453 2003 year, 1.12 patch. Literally 21 years ago

[@uioup7453]

@nightyonetwothree Yeah I can't keep up with thousands of PTR's and patches, but my point still stands, thank god Destroyer has 3 base Armor, Magic Immunity (except Coil for some reason) and 850 HP, right?

[@nightyonetwothree]

@@uioup7453 and zero dps while taking up 5 food

[@jordanjohnson5063]

Is there a way I could get the UI addons you have? I want to have the heroes with the skills/items in the top left and the Upgrades and stuff showing on the left. How is something like this not already in the game as an optional UI Option?

[@sugan2303]

34:27 - 34:38 I love Acolytes so much

[@chuckwalla123]

The ice king is back!

[@LAdS897]

Happy wins = UD broken Happy loses = UD is finally nerfed It's hilarious to read these comments of professional analysts.

[@uioup7453]

@@LAdS897 name (1) nerf lmao

[@sandcastledx]

That first game was the biggest throw ive ever seen. So many mistakes and bad decisions by lyn

[@PeteCrawfordCrawford]

I think that it's more accurate to say that, when you lose *both* your heroes in the space of less than 1 minute, it should be completely irrecoverable and the guy that lost his heroes should lose. The fact that he went on to win is complete BS. You talk about mistakes...how about the fact that Happy lost *both* his heroes in 1 minute. Does that count as as a mistake to you? What mistakes did Lyn make that was bigger than losing both your heroes in quick succession?

[@sandcastledx]

@@PeteCrawfordCrawford he lost 2 head hunters and a wyvern in happys base while killing only 2 ghouls. He proceeded to not creep himself and follow happy around when he had an advantage. He continuously lost wyvern in ways that he shouldn't have after that. I play orc so I get the frustration but this was really badly played.

[@PeteCrawfordCrawford]

@@sandcastledx So losing 2 HH is a bigger mistake than losing 2 heroes like Happy? Great logic.

[@NhanTran-ks1cd]

They aren't humans.

[@benjaminyen1087]

Spoiler shield 🤺

[@zhiro12]

Happy the amount of gold you consume on lost statues against orcs is NUTS, Shift to wyverns mass gargs or destroyers (right away) instead of statues and just mass heal with rod, You’ll win 99.99%

[@4bafiafzil999]

Mass wyverns is ez win for Lyn but why would he changed it midway baffles me. I understand the need raiders for late game tho but not zerkers, kodo etc

[@Lucas-uo9ml]

Ud so broken

[@ramtintashakkor7311]

without a doubt! its so funny how happy stans always think its happy skills not the UD

[@henrik7891]

Poor guy you have no clue

[@zhiro12]

UD SO BROKENLY BAD! Is a joke at this point, Just look at the strat lmao… mass kiting nova coil to survive, While microing ghouls at ground, Only top players can do it like this, Not to mention he lost hes last 3 matches against Lyn… this is an improvement

[@ramtintashakkor7311]

@@zhiro12 learn how to type!

[@LAdS897]

@@ramtintashakkor7311Dude what's your problem

[@nightyonetwothree]

Lyn was demoralized in game 3: skilled endurance aura on a map w/o spots to creep. He knew what's he's doing

[@PeteCrawfordCrawford]

I think that Lyn and other Orc players were demoralized a long time ago, by having like an 80% loss rate Vs Undead(not just Vs Happy).

[@nightyonetwothree]

@@PeteCrawfordCrawford i had gathered t1 tourneys stats (AllStarLeague, ProironTP league, BeingEsports series) (not only finals, but qualifiers+groupstages+playoffs) for 2022-2023 and it shows orcs had 49% wr vs ud in those. Far from 80%. And when i exclude Happy - wr became 60% orc vs 40% ud. So basically your stats are very off.

[@PeteCrawfordCrawford]

@@nightyonetwothree 120 has more tier-1 wins than any Orc player for the past several years. How many TP League/TeD Cup 120 won back in the day? But, of course, you're well-known for being the #1 Undead/Happy cheerleader here, so I don't expect any objectivity from you.

[@nightyonetwothree]

@@PeteCrawfordCrawford how many t1 cups Ted and Happy won back in the days? How many wcg? That's it. You talk about times when no orcs training and 120 just otskill them in all possible ways. Because at the same time 120 was farming t1s - Foggy was able to climb top8-top4 of t1 tourneys - and it tells a lot about level of play before Happy comes back from sc2

[@PeteCrawfordCrawford]

@@nightyonetwothree So basically, we need to go back in time 10+ years to find a time when Undead isn't absolutely dominating. Yeah, let's just ignore the last 5-6 years when Happy and 120 have been oppressing everybody else. It makes you wonder, right? I mean, Happy is a veteran and a contemporary of both Grubby and Moon. Then if he's so "skilled", then why was his win rate pathetic back then? I mean, I can kinda understand it Vs Orc, because back in those days, Orc was definitely OP Vs Undead(unlike you, I'm fair and I call a spade a spade). But the UD Vs Elf matchup always slightly favored the Undead, so why wasn't Happy smashing Moon back in 2009? It's so funny that Happy played this game for 10 years with mediocre results, but then suddenly when Undead received the most massive nerfs that any race ever did in WC3 at the beggining of the Reforged Era, he suddenly emerged as invincible. Yeah, you'r egoing to reply "he g5ot better. Funny how that works that he had 10 years to get better but never did, but then when Undead got buffed(including the ability to tier 1 expand, which was never possible for Undead before), he "suddenly" got "better". Pure hypocrisy.

[@ramtintashakkor7311]

UD is unbalanced AF. its way too OP

[@Mikall322]

It's good that there are no UD players on w3c. all 2 play on the Asian server

[@talkchatSleepyLion]

but there r obviously some weak points of UD. can't deal with it , you lose