We Were Wrong...Dyno Told the Truth...Question Answered

We knew that certain Air Cleaner Backplates Make More Power than others, and we had a theory of why. Theory was Proved Wrong, & the Importance of HOW THE AIR FLOWS AFTER Passing Thru The Filter Element was Confirmed.
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💥 Link to VIDEO of Myths & Facts about Air Cleaners. SPECIFICALLY addressed is HOW the air Flows AFTER passing thru the filter element- • The Myth of Performanc...
💥 Link to Free Flowing, Performance Air Cleaner Systems- www.dkcustompro...
💥 Link to External Breather Systems- www.dkcustompro...
💥 Link To Photos & Details about WHY an External Breather System is so Important- www.dkcustompro...
💥 Link to Differences Between HiFlow Air Cleaners, with Dyno Charts- www.dkcustompro...
➡️ Link to another video about how our High Flow Air Cleaners Cool Down Your Ride- • COOL DOWN Your Harley ...
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The DK Team

[@williamforbes5826]

Some of the smallest changes can such a huge difference! As you said, the Dyno doesn't lie! Good video, guys. Keep up the good work, I enjoy the channel. Thanks.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Man, thank you for the kind words. Very good to hear you are enjoying the channel. You hit the nail on the head, small changes can make a big difference!

[@vf12497439]

A sharp edge could create a vortices that helps mix air/fuel, in a slightly different place in the airspace and the vortices could swirl at the wrong place and cause a less accurate air fuel mix point. A flow bench with colored powder or smoke to make adjustments and really visualize the action would be beneficial. Of course a ported head or aftermarket intake runner would change that flow characteristic. Introducing an influencing structure like a wedge or golf ball bumps…. 🤔

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yeah, lots of variables. We ran into this quite by accident while testing different air cleaners on the dyno. Our first thought was the difference between steel and aluminum, but turns out it was more the shape and path of the air flow. Thanks for watching. 👍

[@bajarvcouple]

Great to see you guys so excited about the Dyno results!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yeah, like Christmas time for inventors!

[@Americanpatriot602]

Guys,, I appreciate all the studies you guys do! I watch your videos just because i know you guys don’t talk smack! You do your homework to help us all! Thanks “ ride on 🤙🏼”

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you, appreciate your good words. Glad you are finding the videos interesting/useful. 👍😎👍

[@--J--]

great video and information, goes to show how every little thing helps or hurts performance

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you, good to know you enjoyed. You are 100% correct, little things can help or hurt far more than one may realize.

[@Marty59143]

Turbulance causes better fuel air mixture. An un fettered exhaust makes a lot of difference. Smooth intakes and runners work better with turbo systems . Great video.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks man, glad you liked it. Appreciate the comment.

[@hammered0184]

Enjoying your channel. Thanks for logical testing and rational conclusions, instead of promoting yourselves as "KZbin Stars" and discombobulating the info with abrasive "music". Have a great, safe 4th!!!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the kinds words. Glad you are finding the videos useful/interesting. Wishing you the best this 4th. 👍

[@jastaylor2730]

Hey guys, I bought one of your catch cans painted shiny black. Yeah it’s performed wonderfully one suggestion avoid getting the paint on the inside of the cylinder of the can the fuel and oil break down the paint and it comes apart all inside the filter other than that, it’s a very good working system That’s all

[@DKCustomProducts]

They are powder coated, and we have been trying to get them powder hung for powder so none goes inside. Thank you for the feedback, and for your business, we appreciate it. 👍

[@TwinCamChristian]

Awesome, awesome video guys! Great work and thank you for sharing this info!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the comment, and good to know you liked the video. 👍

[@gnsmk357]

Guys great video. Needed another bike for a winter project. picked up a 2003 softail custom with a numbered paint job. Not sure how much I can put into this small motor but am sure your stuff will get me more enjoyment out of this motor. P.S your were never wrong. Its just (maybe mistakes were made)....

[@DKCustomProducts]

Sounds like a fun winter project. Yes, we have many parts that will help the TC 88 develop more power, last longer, and run strong and cool. Thanks! 👍

[@ronlynch7744]

Cool one, the dyno test doesn’t lie. 😎👍🇨🇦

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks man! 👍

[@ernieme101]

maybe thicker backplate means the air has to travel farther to get into the throttle body , but you'd have to ask an engineer if that would be significant enough to reduce the torque by almost 3 foot pounds . good video !

[@DKCustomProducts]

Could be. It is probably a combination of several things. Less space, surface is not smooth, lines, divots and other irregularities interrupting flow. The important thing is that we can cross off our list that aluminum (which vibrates at a different frequency than steel) is NOT a factor.

[@timbrown5896]

THANKS, I'm learning so much from y'all

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad to hear it! Thank you for the comments. 👍😎👍

[@robbyclark6915]

I know this, when I put the 587 air cleaner, the external vented catch can, xl-vied, and new slip ons on my iron 883 the difference in performance was not just noticeable, it was beyond my expectations for sure. It literally, LITERALLY, made it feel like I was riding a completely different motorcycle. I just recently put a permanent oil filter on when I did my 5k oil change and actually got rid of the noticeable lull in power when shifting to 2nd gear. Not a huge deal as I rarely ride around in 2nd gear at less than 3k rpms but still, that little drop off in power isn’t there anymore.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the comment and kind words. Great to hear you are enjoying the benefit of the parts. Enjoy your ride!

[@poncoolride]

Maybe I missed it in the Video... but did you test both backing plates without an air cleaner? That would help prove or disprove the air volume in the air cleaner theory you brought up.

[@DKCustomProducts]

We did not. That would have been a good one. We will do that next time on the dyno. Thanks! 👍

[@josevalencia5145]

Many variables to consider. Wonder how this plays out on an Arlen Ness inverted AC? I'd assume the inverted design of the filter element would be conducive to the radius design of it's backing plate? Additionally, wonder how this plays out on higher displacement applications (110"++), with larger throttle bodies, 58mm++. I have the Arlen Ness inverted AC with your stage 4 catch can EBS. On a S&S T124. Thanks for sharing.

[@DKCustomProducts]

We have not done an apple to apple test like this with the inverted. We have done many apple to apple tests with higher displacement bikes, some with larger throttle bodies, some without. They have always shown an improvement. Good deal on you having an EBS. Your bike likes that! The purpose of this video was not really about the AN BS, but to see if different material made a difference. We were surprised that it did not, but it just reinforced that the way the air flows after it passes the element is Very Important.

[@PAULY-P]

I hope I got a good air cleaner for $431! I got the Arlen Ness Inverted Beveled AC and the V&H Hi-Output 2 into 1 shorty exhaust for my 2017 BreakOut. Had it dynoed and seems to run good so far.

[@dougburrell]

I love your guys videos, I don't see any EVO items on your website? Am I looking in the wrong place? I love the transformer.

[@DKCustomProducts]

It is a great engine, maybe the last of the truly Harley sounding engines...but not a huge demand for parts. We do have External Breather Systems for Evo's, to pair up with whichever intake you have. You can see them at this link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/91-up-sportster-big-twin-evo-c75-116.htm Everything at the above link, except for the Transformer unfortunately, will fit your Evo. We do have a few other parts that fit EVO's as well, but not many. Please feel free to contact us with any questions you might have. Thank you for commenting! MB

[@dougburrell]

Thanks for the reply, now I see what I need!@@DKCustomProducts

[@DKCustomProducts]

You are most welcome! Thank you for commenting! Do not hesitate to reach out if you have any questions!!! MB

[@dougburrell]

I appreciate your response very much. If I could only do one thing. What do you think is best for cooling the oil. An external breather or oil cooler from Jagg?@@DKCustomProducts

[@DKCustomProducts]

An oil cooler will help with cooling the oil specifically! 👍

[@geoffmitchell2143]

Have you compared the S & S Stealth A/C with one of the DK A/C's? I have the Stealth on my 2019 RK with the DK EBS. I'm curious because the Stealth uses a polymer backplate. Their reasoning is that polymer doesn't heat up like metal so the intake air is cooler... Or so they say.

[@DKCustomProducts]

It has been years since we tested the Stealth. It was not plastic back then. Of course, the intake tract on the M8's is now plastic also. There are reports, here and there, of them developing cracks. But they are under more stress than the air cleaner backplate. Interesting, and quite possibly true (that with a plastic backplate the IAT is cooler). We will revisit that and test it out on the next dyno day. Thanks!

[@paulbronnenberg2075]

GREAT INFO .... So would I be correct in assuming that with my 2020 Fatboy 114 STOCK Screaming Eagle breather that my best bet is to add ya'alls external venting system. And NOT change out the breather back plate ? THANKS for sharing !!

[@DKCustomProducts]

If you are going to keep the stock air cleaner on your 2020 Fatboy 114, but want to make it work better/product more power, then an External Breather System will do that. It will need a little work. Here is a link to 4 EBS set ups that will work with that intake- www.dkcustomproducts.com/diy-external-breather-systems-407.htm And here is a video showing how to install it- kzbin.info/www/bejne/q3LQgXaVoMyfgM0

[@insurancehelper7254]

Bernoulli's Principle, explains friction loss in fluid and air moving though a constriction. It's also the basic principle behind flight. Any air or fluid moving through a constriction....the speed increases, but the pressure decreases. One of the plates is causing the pressure to drop more than the outside pressure.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you! 👍

[@ttjbiggunner2025]

I love the test you guys do I have a question are you guys a big company or a smaller independent type Company just wondering

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks man. Yeah, we are a pretty small company with only 12 employees.

[@fuzzymuzzle9752]

Thank you for the dk infomercial

[@jeffreyengle2762]

For me, it’s simply what I need it to do. If the bike does everything I need it to do there comes a time when you just start throwing money at it. If I twist the throttle with a loaded trailer, wife, all gear, camp gear, and everything else goes down the road the engine is not running too hot, everything is working like it should. Then I have achieved the sweet spot. There comes a time when you have to just put your foot down and say no this money is going for something else and not on another stinking part. Everybody makes that choice some of us don’t. we just choose to throw money after money after money at this stinking thing, I am seriously enjoying these days as I walk into my Harley Davidson dealer rarely look at the wall of parts and quite literally have purchased everything on their wall. Good bad or indifferent. It just feels damn good to be done. Onto the oil changes, And general maintenance. I guess it’s a good thing that everybody’s not like me otherwise, you guys go out of business😂😂😂 But yes, I get it coming from your particular perspective it’s about business and at the end of the day looking at numbers to see if it was profitable or not ….. you have to pay your bills like I have to pay mine. So it’s up to the consumer in the end and he’s a strange bird.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, it is a really good feeling to have ones ride dialed in. We try and dial it in the best possible, and help folks to do it Right The First Time. Too many folks do what you say....they keep throwing money at the bike trying to get it where they want...but they are buying items that will not get them what they want. Here's a video where we address exactly what you are talking about. kzbin.info/www/bejne/fmebYpeiZ72SnJY

[@jeffreyengle2762]

@@DKCustomProducts it’s taken us three years to “dial-in” this road king…. Literally thousands of dollars funny thing is I go down to the local dealer and the first thing they want me to do test ride a new bike. Which I find absolutely insane it’s like a blank canvas and my immediate answer is are you kidding?….. not only the bike but the trailer and all camping contents have been swapped numerous times to accommodate my aging body as the price of motel/hotel stays skyrocket out of sight. This year, we’re taking a 16 day trip and doing the outside circumference of Arizona in depth…at the right time of year as not to bake ourselves to death…. Ahhhh… the glorious month of May! Daytime temps around 80 with nighttime temps in the low to mid 60’s…… we’re staying at KOA’s primarily to save money as we’re on a budget of sorts….. we will see just how “dialed-in” we have it…… 😂 took some advice from you about cooling mods…. Did two things primarily.. one, Harley’s, fan-assisted oil cooler, as well as a good temp oil temp gauge along with ditching the fork fangs…. Maybe I’ll get that tank lift kit here before we leave…..

[@DKCustomProducts]

I hear ya. There is a satisfaction in working on the bike and getting it just how I want...but there is a Much Larger satisfaction in being out in the wind on the bike that has been dialed in. I am in a bit of a different situation...my personal bikes are also used for R&D. That means that I periodically have to see a bike that I have dialed in, and replace it with a newer model for R&D purposes. This means I have to go thru the whole process again. 😱

[@evetsegap]

Learned something new. Thanks.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad to hear it! Thank you for commenting! 😎 MB

[@rickanna8662]

Another great video, love your channel. I've bought your products for two bikes, I've also spoken with Duane on the phone. I appreciate that you guys know how important the nature of airflow is in the intake and exhaust of an engine. I also have a PhD in aerodynamics and spent many years working on defense projects at Boeing. The data you collected during this test is super interesting. As you figured out, the results have nothing to do with the materials used. The performance boost you saw is due to increased mixing of the intake air. You're welcome to give me a call if you'd like to discuss this further. You have my number and email on the order I made. Stay safe. :) Rick Black

[@DKCustomProducts]

Hi Rick, Will be calling. Thank you for the invitation. Yep, for the last couple of years we were really thinking that it must be the aluminum vs. the steel accounting for the power changes. Obviously HOW the air flows after passing thru the filter element makes a difference, but with the small differences between the AN BS and the 606 backplate, we did not think it would make THAT much of a difference. Between our tests a few years ago, and the 6 tests we ran last month, we now know that even small differences in shape and surface make an even larger difference than we thought.

[@frf239]

Rick can you elaborate some? I’m interested in your reply! I am no engineer or mechanic but I was wondering if the center flang/curve into the throttle body decreased the air flow some as the space is a little smaller. But what do I know I am a highly train unprofessional. Lol

[@rickanna8662]

Fluid dynamics, especially turbulence is inherently unpredictable. The rounded edge of most engine inlets, including jet engines is a great place to start for maximizing the air intake. But there are other important factors. After intake air has passed through a filter we're not talking about laminar flow, the issue is how to analyze and maximize the turbulent air. Sorry, it's a little much to discuss in detail via text. :)

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@rickanna8662 On my list to call. Thank you for your input! 👍

[@frf239]

@@rickanna8662 Thank you for replying. I understand.

[@davidhaworth1243]

I must say that turbulence is great for an intake manifold and combustion chamber but not across a carburetor inlet nevermind a CV style. My opinion is that a reduction in internal air cleaner volume due to a "proper" radiused inlet is a detriment to proper room for "fuel standoff" which is an intake reversion phenomenon due to an odd-fire engine and a plenum intake. I'm willing to bet if that filter is deeper, the radiused inlet will prevail. Regarding EFI; is that inlet turbulence causing minute fluctuations in manifold pressure the MAP sensor "sees"? Being the devil's advocate, radiused inlets and velocity stacks have been around for a long time! Great videos.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for the comment! Glad you're enjoying the videos, and yeah, the Velocity Stacks we redesigned last year really perform well. You can see our report on them, AND dyno charts, at around the 8 minute mark in this video- kzbin.info/www/bejne/gYWQhaZtjqunjJI The difference between a V-stack and other type air cleaners (whether radiused or not) is that the air has to turn a corner, and before it does that is is flowing across a flat, smooth (or not so smooth) surface. Making the filter deeper on the 606 is not really practical. It is already one of the deepest filter elements used on a Harley, and going deeper would interfere with most folks right leg/knee.

[@ronchamblee2663]

What breather&filter combo will be best for my 2000 harley Davidson sporster 883

[@DKCustomProducts]

All External Breather Systems work equally well as far as the engine is concerned...so which one to use comes down to which look you like best. The 425, 587, 606, 636v and 828 All breathe more air than an 883 can use, so again, it comes down to which look you like best. The 587 does have the most cover options, AND it is the lowest profile, giving the most amount of room for the right leg. The 636v will produce a bit more power than the others...for that reason, that is why I run the 636v on my Sportster. I also like the Transformer and the Premium Discrete Breather Systems the best. (for looks, functionality is the same on all of them). Feel free to call or email with any questions- 662-252-8828 [e-mail]

[@davidwilley6199]

Do you sell an air cleaner kit that allows me to use the stock football cover?

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, here is a link to my own bike with the football cover with a 587 air cleaner below it. www.dkcustomproducts.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/b/r/breathersoftail4d.jpg Here is a link to the air cleaner...it has a cover, but you can put the football cover right on top of it. We have many Customers that do that.

[@NativeSD53]

I've always been amazed that filter manufacturers don't test and rate their filters (complete unit, not just the filter element) by the CFM. Dynos are fine.... but I don't know anyone that rides a dyno. It's like oil filters.... unless you know all the facts, their filtration claims mean nothing.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Great points! 👍😎👍

[@300shields]

Can I use the air cleaner with a stage 2 setup? Thanks.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, you can! 👍

[@rykerolaoghaire8781]

I love these video's!

[@DKCustomProducts]

Glad you like them! More to come! Thanks for the comment. 👍

[@2kanchoo]

The biggest factor not accounted for is airflow from the bike moving to it being static on the dyno. I’d be willing to bet if you put a strong enough fan infront of the filters to simulate actual riding conditions the power loss wouldn’t be there. Edit: Didn't seen in the video they had fans setup. My mistake.

[@DKCustomProducts]

That is definitely a good thought...but it is taken care of. With any dyno set up there are fans that do a good job of replicating riding down the road. They are also used to control the heat. All our testing, including this one, has the fans on and running to equal going down the road at about 60 mph. So it is simulating riding conditions and gives an apple to apple comparison.

[@2kanchoo]

@@DKCustomProducts my bad. I didn't see any in the video. I stand corrected and surprised it still lost that much power.

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@2kanchoo Yeah, we mentioned fans a few times (in passing) in various vids...but we did not focus the video on them, nor talk about how they are an integral part of a dyno. Thanks for pointing that out, and we will do a future video on that.

[@garylee8132]

Ok guys this be the deal, everyone believes you need your intake polished smooth to aid in air flow. In reality you want it semi smooth or with a swirl pattern so the fuel will stay atomized, with system that is smooth the fuel does not stay atomized it drops out of solution. Ifins you want something smooth its the exhaust so the expended gases exits the chamber as fast as it can. Its been proven in drag cars. What your back plate does is remove the smoothed venturi and replace it with a sharp edge which atomizes the fuel. N unless youve worked with really high horsepower engines you wouldn't realize it.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you. Yes, I believe you are correct. After our testing a few fluid dynamic guys have told us the same thing. Thanks for explaining it so clearly. 👍

[@maxheadflow]

You need to go back and forth a couple times between the AC to verify the difference.. Could simply be that the dyno and motor were warming up..

[@DKCustomProducts]

We did Warm up the bike and the dyno. We also did do a few different runs per AC.

[@maxheadflow]

@@DKCustomProducts Did you swap back and forth? The measurement needs to be repeatable.

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@maxheadflow Yes, we have done the test multiple times, swapping back and forth, this was the one time we videoed it.

[@Big88Country]

When air does not have to bend to go into the carb or throttle body, you get bigger gains of HP and torque. So, if you have a filter that lets air come straight into the carb, you will get noticeable gains. So, if someone would produce a filter that let air go straight into the neck, not have to make a 90 bend prior to entering the chamber, there would be good gains.

[@DKCustomProducts]

You are describing a velocity stack. See link below. www.dkcustomproducts.com/outlaw-velocity-stack-air-intake-complete-systems.htm Our recently redesigned Velocity Stacks produce even more power than our previous design. You can see a video and Dyno Charts at this link- kzbin.info/www/bejne/gYWQhaZtjqunjJI (starting around the 8 minute mark is when we talk about the Velocity Stacks) We also have a written report with dyno charts at this link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/differences-between-outlaw-hiflow-air-cleaner-systems-dk-faq-acs.htm

[@Big88Country]

@@DKCustomProducts Yessir, I have seen them, and thank you for these links. I was thinking of a more low profile, open face filter design that would not interfere with your right leg. Take your 828 filter, instead of the filter media being around the outside edge, the filter would be where the face plate is currently. Just my idea of the perfect filter. You guys have great products!

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@Big88Country Yes, we've done some prototypes of that design style, where the face and the sides of the filter element were actual filter material. We did not see any increase in power from those types of straight in elements. It may be because the air coming from the sides was interfering with the air coming straight in. The absolute be performing is the 636v that has a patented tube the speeds up the intake velocity. (link below). It is also out of the way from the right leg, BUT, cannot run with a full size filter on bikes with lower fairings. www.dkcustomproducts.com/outlaw-hiflow-636v-air-cleaner-complete-systems-c125.htm

[@brucelund5788]

I blocked the pasages that let the engine air/oil into the big sucker and tapped fitings to the outside to get rid of the hot air/oil. Then I ground the ridges of the face of the big sicker plate and polished it a bit. The ruoughness and ridges of the plate certainly don't look right to me. Would sure like to see you run my plate and see what the results were. Thanks for the info :{)

[@DKCustomProducts]

We always like running tests, comparisons, and learning more! Maybe at the next open house we can do an apples to apples comparison on the dyno. Tentative planned for May 2024. Hit us up by email a couple of month ahead of then, if you'd like. [e-mail]

[@billflixtone6684]

Thanks for the video

[@DKCustomProducts]

👍 Thank you for the feedback.

[@dormantmenace]

Ide like to see dyno for airfilters with a center style opening. Drawing directly into the throttle body or carb throat without having to make a 90° turn. Like the s&s stealth air or s&e round extreme flow, the s&e ventilator extreme air. Vs these more traditional capped air filters like you are running. As far as the difference between the radiused backing plate and square cut throat. It seems as simple as air velocity. Same principle as head porting. The radiused area is a larger volume. Wich decreases air velocity. Also similar to running a velocity stack

[@DKCustomProducts]

Good thoughts! Thank you. We do have quite a few more dyno videos coming...including at least one of a straight in.

[@FLHCSfan68]

Excellent 👍🤙✌️

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks ✌️

[@derfskittlers6125]

I would think an aluminum or plastic back plate wouldnt get get so warm, allowing cooler air in.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Regarding the plastic backplates...it is the fact that they are totally enclosed that makes them a "Hot Box", as seen in this video-kzbin.info/www/bejne/qnu7eHitgaiBetk Regarding aluminum backplates, like on the Big Sucker. We were very puzzled also, this is why we did so many tests (this video just shows one of them). As talked about in the video, it is all about what happens regarding How the Air Flows after passing thru the filter element. Even though steel holds heat longer than aluminum...as shown in the video, it does not make a discernible differece. Probably because aluminum will get hot faster, and will cool down faster, but still reach the same temp as the steel. Thanks for watching our videos and glad you are finding them interesting.

[@john59254]

What would be the best for an 02 dyna

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thanks for looking at our parts. For the absolute best power gain the 636v will give that. Not far behind that is the 828, and the 606 and 567 are very close to the same as the 828. You can see all of them at this link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/air-cleaner-intake-c10-313.htm

[@soranrix]

On the road the aluminium would be colder then the steel but if it could messured in hp is another story, the smothed edge i good when air is pushed direct straigt, but the air comes in at a 90 degre angel thrue filter, so that could be why. Plus there are 3-4 holes in the edge. Ps i liked my 606 on the sportster, never did get to fit the catch can still in the box 😉 a good reminder off my trip seing you all, i still thing about the really want to come back and Explorer the back roads with kevin like we talked about😋😎 maybe the covid shit gets a break so i can come over this year🤘

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, the irregularity of the surface and the divots for the bolt holes, and the lines for oil seepage...all small things, but they make a difference. Looking forward to when you can make it back over this way!

[@bigal9052]

years ago backyard mechanics would polish the intake

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, and most performance engine builders still do. It may be that simple...I think it is also the other protrusions interrupting the flow in the AN BS backplate. Thanks for the comment. 👍

[@bradanderson1024]

More air in, make a change to the exhaust so that the extra air can come out.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you for watching, and thank you for the comment. Agree 100%! Here is a video that explain a little bit of Why what you said is important, and how it works- kzbin.info/www/bejne/pqOZq2NmnLFoj8k

[@mbsnyderc]

That's not a big difference that's well within margin of error you need to reverse the process were you put the big sucker on first because heat soak in the engine could cause this difference air temp isn't all you need to consider.

[@DKCustomProducts]

I understand what you are saying, and because of that we've done this test well over a dozen times, in all different orders, and on different bikes. We also heat soak the engines before the pulls, and then get the temps at 210 via use of fans and throttle. All pulls were the same temp. It does not matter what order, the results are the same. Also, we do 3 pulls minimum, for each configuration. We look to make sure we are getting virtually the same results on each of those 3 pulls. If there are variations, we pull again. The difference is outside the margin of error when you do your dyno runs this way. Here is a link to what I am referring to...this is an acceptable margin of error....less than two tenths of 1 ft. lbs. difference in Torque on all 3 pulls. www.dkcustomproducts.com/image/2021_Dyno_Pulls/3%20Corroborating%20Pulls.png

[@tex9280]

💪💪DKC💪💪🇦🇺💪💪 Safe travels 🙏❣️

[@DKCustomProducts]

Thank you! 👍

[@gregduncan1001]

in the market for one thanks.

[@DKCustomProducts]

I believe you will be well pleased with any of our Outlaw Air Cleaners. 👍 www.dkcustomproducts.com/air-cleaner-intake-c10.htm

[@frf239]

Can you please check out this channel and comment about vacuum in heads and how he stated an ext breather.is not good. The channel is Ricky HD. Also there is a another guy on KZbin Ron’s Workshop who is trying to figure everything out and decipher between BS and facts. If you could comment I think it would clarify some things please.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, in the last 12 months this theory has been floating around. It presumes that the rings need more vacuum than exists in the crankcase with an EBS. That is a large assumption, however, not a single person or company has provided any test results, or data at all that there is any validity to their theory. What is known, and what there is a plethora of testing and data on, DO NOT put hot, oily, oxygen depleted air into your intake. It will reduce power, cause accelerated wear, and result in tune instability. These things are all well documented. Dyno Chart Link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/media/wysiwyg/breathertest_1.jpg Photo of a piston out of a M8 114 at only 5,000 miles. It was taken apart to do a 131 upgrade. Imagine the owners surprise! He now has an EBS on his 131 Kit Upgrade www.dkcustomproducts.com/media/wysiwyg/AirCleaners/M8_114_5000_miles.jpg Every External Breather System we have is a crankcase vent. The Systems we have prevent 100% of the hot, oily, oxygen depleted air from going into the throttle body and combustion chambers. This extends the life of the engine, gives more power, runs cooler, and prevents tune instability. You are probably asking about the vents that have become the fad in the last year that vent at the actual oil tank. With these there is still some hot, oily, oxygen depleted air being fed into the intake & they cost more. It is spending more and getting less benefit.

[@frf239]

@@DKCustomProducts Thank you so much I understand.

[@jackklarich7045]

Very interesting video

[@DKCustomProducts]

Hey Jack! I could be wrong, but I think we first saw this when we were running the dyno when you were here. 👍

[@jackklarich7045]

@@DKCustomProducts Yeah, I think the dyno sheets showed that

[@DKCustomProducts]

@@jackklarich7045 Crazy. Really enjoyed that time when you were up our way.

[@jackklarich7045]

@@DKCustomProducts Me too

[@gordonwrichert8240]

less air speed from a longer intake

[@DKCustomProducts]

Not necessarily! Here is a video where we go over this more in depth that you may find interesting - kzbin.info/www/bejne/qWnIoIWeeMeofpo MB

[@mikeandersen9605]

Their completely wrong. The bell is to smooth the air into the inlet. Better let F1 see this scientific video.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Methinks you're confused. They, There, Their, They're sure they mentioned that the reason for the testing was to see if the aluminum vs. the steel made a change. Fact: it did not make any significant change. They also tested the 606 vs. the AN BS with the bell inlet. Fact: The backplate with the bell inlet did not perform as well as the 606 that does not have the bell inlet. Why? That was not determined. But as They said, it should have...but the THEORY, not the fact, or science, is that the irregularities in the backplate reduced the power generated, even overwhelming any benefit of the bell inlet. Nothing in the video is right or wrong. It was simply a test of how the steel vs. the aluminum backplate worked, and how the AN BS backplate worked. It was tested, results were shown, and theories were discussed.

[@arthurcutaiar9994]

Dude. Cut the rubber bands n let your freak flag flow.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Like in this video? kzbin.info/www/bejne/hnOplGRubsuGbpo 👍

[@NofaceCat]

It’s like the winglets that they add on the tips of the airplane wing they never used to have those they realize there was turbulence going out at the tip so they installed the winglet get less drag at the turbulence

[@DKCustomProducts]

So true! Fluid Dynamics can be surprising sometimes. What happens with the air AFTER it pass thru the filter element can be very important! 👍

[@motorbitch69]

The round radius entry on the super sucker plus how thick it is working as an inlet spacer may be substantially better requiring a jet increase? Same deal on go karts and big blocks.... a giant air cleaner flowing more air wasn't always faster at the track because now your jetting is wrong. Don't most bikes require at least 2 to 3 jets when upgrading air cleaner and exhaust? If its working as a small velocity stack than the jetting has to be accommodated to make power... just a thought.

[@DKCustomProducts]

Yes, that could be the case with carbed bikes. Our testing was done on an EFI bike and the AFR was the same with both A/C configurations, so that was a non-factor. Since making this video I've spoken with a fluid dynamics engineer who explained why the rounded radius actually slows down the flow of air going into the throttle body.

[@motorbitch69]

@@DKCustomProducts 10 4. On 1 hand I totally agree. In theory that should be enough.... unfortunately, here in Florida (could have to do with sea level or temp) we haven't had much luck with the factory set up compensating on its own (cars and bikes alike but bikes especially). The new 'Milwaukee Eight" for example just about HAS to have a corrected fuel map for pipes and filters. There is a LOT left on the table after mods if a dyno tune and fuel/timing table correction isn't done. Love the black billet plate and the super sucker... In my experience and opinion, you guys could do a shootout with both setups (with a laptop and tuner to mod the fuel map) and see nasty gains! Great video and info as the average dude just want to stab a hot filter and go ride.... The factory map is no good for that. (Or jetting if your old school/ LOL).

[@nuckingfuts9658]

I bet the loss in power is from the big sucker you ran being run with the external crank case breathers.you gain hp with the crank case under vacuum thats why they run vacuum pumps on race car engines.

[@DKCustomProducts]

The 606 also was running external crank case breathers. We have seen NO evidence that running internal crankcase breathers increases crankcase vacuum. We've seen a lot of folks talk about it...but have not seen any test results.