Webra T4-40 First Run Attempt

This did not go as expected.
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[@dmrcflyr2]

Just so everyone watching this is clear on some facts. This is a NIB engine. The timing is or should be perfect from a German made engine out of the box. Besides I have also made the video link here of a Webra T4-60 with different timing settings and the engine still fired and ran. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aZu7q6Keosipe9U

[@keithgoode9726]

Wow. I have never seen this engine. Looks pretty cool. Watching the teardown video next. Thanks David!

[@victormontalbano4993]

I had one a very long time ago. When it ran, it didn’t run that good so it’s in a box with the other 400 engines I have. As a collector. Now

[@dmrcflyr2]

Interesting. What are those 400 engines going to do for you? Can you buy groceries with them? I can understand collecting precious metals, or jewels, but rc glow engines have no intrinsic value.

[@donaldhoppe1470]

Dave, bummer, I did not see anything obviously wrong with the start up procedure you used. BTW, when I can’t get to the carb to prime, sometimes covering the exhaust opening while spinning the prop works to get fuel into the carb

[@dmrcflyr2]

I have seldom if ever had that method of prime work. Besides it was taking a prime and I put fuel directly into the chamber.

[@Irvine7214x6apc]

@@dmrcflyr2 David that's how I've been priming most of my engines since '04 when I started R/C flying. Especially the FA-220A where I haven't got access to the carb inside my YT International Hawker Typhoon. May I suggest you also try this priming method yourself (fully open the carb, then block the exhaust and turn the prop over 5 times) when you do the 220 run - you'll see how much and how easily she will prime :) EDIT: watch the startup method here, it's just 50-seconds long -> kzbin.infoEgDllb9Pmgw?feature=share

[@threefiftyone4726]

Nice to see its not just me who has weird issues with motors that make no sense :) Interesting to see what the issue is as a grinding feeling in a glow motor is usually pretty bad

[@SomeGuyInSandy]

Teardown video coming in hot? Love to see inside. I hope the issue isn't anything serious.

[@dmrcflyr2]

I did the look inside just a bit ago. No visible damage, only questions...

[@SomeGuyInSandy]

@@dmrcflyr2 Timing maybe?

[@dmrcflyr2]

How could the timing be wrong on a NIB engine? When I took the head off today I could feel the original factory torque on the screws. How could a timing issus suddenly cause a smooth engine to become grindy to turn over?

[@SomeGuyInSandy]

@@dmrcflyr2 I was thinking more along the lines of why it wouldn't run man. Why it feels "grindy" who knows. Could be a degraded seal that let loose, who knows.

[@budsimpson973]

I too have a webra 40 that is in need of the drive belt to the overhead cam/valves. Any ideas where they are available?

[@dmrcflyr2]

They aren’t.

[@johnswilley6764]

That's a neat looking engine. I'm sorry that you had so much trouble with it. I have a few 4-strokes; Saito, YS, Enya, RCV (really neat!) and there's also a host of 2 strokes which I own. I was a bit surprised when I saw you pull the pressure line off the muffler and blow into it for priming. I suggest that you try what I find to be a MUCH simpler approach, plug the exhaust port, your finger will do nicely, open the throttle (wide) then flip the prop a few times in its normal direction of operation. Here's the trick...the engine's a pump I know pumps (29 yrs. in fire service - major dept/ also state cert. instructor). If all of your "plumbing" is properly connected, when you open the throttle, plug the exhaust, flip the prop, the piston will quickly pressurize the fuel cell, and push the fuel to the carb, and engine. Make sure that the low and high mixture screws are properly set, better too rich than too lean. It should fire up. I noticed your checking the glow plug, and it appears that you had a McDaniel's ignitor, good thing as mine has an indicator which would tell you if there is continuity in your plug; as an aside, the plug could show continuity, but still be bad. Once the nichrome has lost its catalytic materials, the plug will work BUT there will be a drastic drop in RPM's when you remove the glow driver. I hope that this helps. I look fwd to seeing/hearing that engine running. Best wishes Sir, from Orlando!

[@dmrcflyr2]

Thank you for the response, but I have a few years of experience owning and running literally hundreds of engines since 1988. I am pretty familiar with how to operate them.

[@johnswilley6764]

@@dmrcflyr2 No problem. Your actions have already demonstrated a void indicating the lack of your perceived omniscience. As with most, you're not worth the time.

[@dmrcflyr2]

Ditto

[@weofnjieofing]

Try putting fuel down the glow hole and see if she pops. It seeme to be a fuel issue or the glow plug has failed. I think the carb needs to be adjusted especially the low speed to richening it up. The grinding could be the rings wearing against the cylinder wall with all the dry running attempts. Will be interesting to see how it is inside

[@dmrcflyr2]

Sometimes it is good to watch the entire video. As I said that I DID put fuel directly into the plug hole in the video. The glow plug was not bad it was verified again when I put fuel in the chamber. I mentioned that also at 6:45.

[@acajutla]

Aint no gas in it

[@dmrcflyr2]

Sorry, you are WRONG.

[@KathrynLiz1]

I think you have pushed the crank back with the starter and that is causing the bind...

[@dmrcflyr2]

No, that is not possible with a double ball bearing crankshaft. Besides the rear cover will not allow the crankshaft to be moved back. This was a result of heat build up. I also have the engine running properly now too. See the latest videos of it.

[@tempest411]

Seems to run as well as my HP 49VT, but without the grinding issue. I've taken it apart and can find nothing wrong.

[@dmrcflyr2]

Chris and I have found a strange listing on the parts list for this engine that seems to indicate there might have been different heads made for reverse rotation. Perhaps for a twin engine airplane application to have counterrotating props. I might attemtp to run this in the reverse direction. Maybe you can try the same thing.

[@SomeGuyInSandy]

@@dmrcflyr2 Now that would be weird. You would think the box would be marked reversed or something. But, those Germans probably assume you know what you are buying, lol.

[@dmrcflyr2]

I just confirmed that it is NOT a reverse rotation engine. Had it in the garage just now. I primed and hit it with the electric starter MANY times. I could hear it wanting to run as it was firing, but it would not sustain running. Tried 4 different plugs of various heat ranges, length and with/without idle bar, adjusted both needles several times. It was getting warm and firing WHILE the starter was on it. It would continue to fire for about 2 seconds after the starter was removed. I saw no leakage of fuel, no air bubbles in the lines. About the only other thing I can think to do is put a heavier prop on it for more flywheel action. The wood Top Flite 10x5 is pretty light, but it called for a 10x4 for break in. Maybe I’ll just put an APC 11x6 on it to see if that changes anything. It also only seemed to want to fire and do best with the throttle fully open. Hell I even raised the tank to a stupid level above the carb. That made things worse.

[@tempest411]

@@dmrcflyr2 What if the compression isn't quite where it should be? I know it's new, but perhaps the assembly lube has gummed up in such a way that the ring isn't sealing as it should. Do you have some means of measuring it?

[@dmrcflyr2]

I have been running engines for many years and I can tell when the compression is correct and this is. Besides the engine is running now.

[@luisgarza2036]

Not a single pop that's not normal, like no compression or out of timing rotary valve, if something feels grinding need further inspection; hope to see disassembly video.

[@dmrcflyr2]

I felt a pop at the end when I turned it over by hand. But how could the timing be off on a NIB engine? When I took the head off today I felt the factory torque on the screws. So unless German made engines have serious quality control issues in assembly I doubt the timing is off. I thought I did a video on a belt timed engine of some sort showing it being off a tooth oe way or the other and it still fired up and just did not run well. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aZu7q6Keosipe9U

[@luisgarza2036]

@@dmrcflyr2 you're right it's almost impossible from a NIB engine, and specially coming from german manufacture their QC are way better than others.

[@hungcuongvo7541]

This machine is hard to explode. really

[@richardwallinger1683]

put your finger over the exhaust while turning the motor over . to prime it .not possible to flood a four stroke so get some juice in there .. via the plug if needed .chill out man .

[@dmrcflyr2]

Yes it is possible to flood a four stroke. It’s called hydrolock and it can destroy an engine. Been doing this for over thirty years.