Were the Cathars even real?

The Cathars are one of the most well-known heresies in medieval Europe. But how much do we know about them? In this episode of the Medieval Grad Podcast, Lucie Laumonier interviews Jean-Paul Rehr about the mythical Cathars and a peculiar inquisition record drafted near Toulouse in the thirteenth century.
You can get the show notes for this episode at www.medievalists.net/2021/11/...

[@strategicgamingwithaacorns2874]

Fun fact: In the video game Crusader Kings 2, the three main Gnostic sects of the Middle Ages- Manichaeans, Bogomilists, and Cathars- are each depicted as respectively Heresies of Zoroastrianism, Orthodox Christianity, and Catholicism, rather than denominations of a Gnostic religion in it's own right.

[@nunyabiz6925]

Thank you

[@inquisitivepitcher4599]

Jean, you've got big balls to switch at such age. Kudos. Also, I guess when a group is ostracized and given a tag or a name, consciously or unconsciously they would take that word and make it matter of pride. This is reference to the statement how criminals are made and stay so(or something similar). As to whether Cathars were even real. My fiction inspired mind would say that a conspiracy by the papacy to not mention Cathar in any records or that it was made a great taboo to do so. PS: I felt intelligent and philosophical after watching this video. Lol.

[@exploringspiritualityourselves]

The "good men / good women / good Christians" was a term used by both themselves and their social peers. One of the problems is that revisionist historians (including this video) fall into is the trap historically set by the Catholic Church which seeks to describe and understand them in doctrinal terms whereas what drew people to them was the example they set rather than whatever beliefs they may or may not have had. To quote 'Cathar' Bishop Guilabert of Castres, "Gold and silver I no longer carry in my purse. I am satisfied with each day’s food and am not anxious whether tomorrow I shall have enough to be clothed and fed. You see me in the teachings which Jesus Christ preached and in which His Gospel consists.” And this view of the "good Christians" was shared even by Inquisitors. The extent of their organisation or coherence of their theology may well have been exaggerated by the Church but that that is a far cry from asserting they did not exist. Indeed a very distinctive feature was the spiritual voice given to women in their 'priesthood' of the parfaits, more about which can be found on our video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n2bUn559pa-gbKM

[@exploringspiritualityourselves]

"Were the Cathars even real?" is a dramatic title and the claim that "the myth of the Cathars have been debunked" is presented as a fait accompli but the historical evidence does not support this sweeping assertion. The "good men / good women / good Christians" was a term used by both themselves and their social peers and represented a critique of Church practices that went beyond anti-clericalism. One of the problems is that revisionist historians (including this video) fall into is the trap historically set by the Catholic Church which seeks to describe and understand them in doctrinal terms whereas what drew people to them was the example they set rather than whatever beliefs they may or may not have had. To quote 'Cathar' Bishop Guilabert of Castres, "Gold and silver I no longer carry in my purse. I am satisfied with each day’s food and am not anxious whether tomorrow I shall have enough to be clothed and fed. You see me in the teachings which Jesus Christ preached and in which His Gospel consists.” And this view of the "good Christians" was shared even by Inquisitors. The extent of their organisation or coherence of their theology may well have been exaggerated by the Church but that that is a far cry from asserting they did not exist. Indeed a very distinctive feature was the spiritual voice given to women in their 'priesthood' of the parfaits, more about which can be found on our video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n2bUn559pa-gbKM

[@strategicgamingwithaacorns2874]

The Cathars were a Gnostic sect derived from the Bogomilist Gnostics of the Balkans.

[@mrpoop123]

It comes from zoroastrianism

[@lemfarba4827]

First.

[@wherethebirdsgo]

congrats