WGS Retro 30 vs Vintage 30 & Veteran 30 / Celestion vs. Warehouse Guitar Speakers

[@booganaga123]

Your speaker comparison videos are some of the best on KZbin. I know they're a lot of work so thanks! Also that V30 sounds incredible. Every time you switched to it it felt like a breath of fresh air.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Thanks, man! I appreciate your feedback

[@BR-kj3fp]

I love seeing the frequency comparisons, that tells the whole story and hardly anyone else does it like this. Thanks for sharing.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Glad you find it useful!

[@ColtonJacoby-dv4td]

I’d love to hear a DV77 // V30 comparison. I appreciate all your hard work. I hope it pans out for you. You’re in a niche market and answering questions we’ve all wanted answered for some time. Thank you!

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

I appreciate your kind words, man! I'll be doing a DV-77/V30 video for sure and I am thinking of throwing a Creamback H in that mix too. I'm enjoying this niche a lot do far. The audience these videos seem to attract seems genuinely awesome, appreciative and intelligent. We'll see where it ends up going. It is and it has been very rewarding to me so far

[@Lesca6]

Just found your channel today. Got the Hesu demon IR's from a new vid from you. Looked up this vid and more IR's that sound good (I'm more of a beginner, not really but new to cabsims). Thanks a loooot for the free IR's. A sub well earned. Thanks again 🥰

[@jeffhampton6972]

As always, your videos are super helpful. Thanks for making them!

[@carlosalfaro1777]

Probably the best speaker combination that I hear in my life!! Vintage 30 + retro 30!

[@Dr.Dark1331]

Hey john i really appreciate all of these comparisons you tale your time to make for us, i was wondering if you think the Retro 30 would cut thru a mix as well as a Vintage 30 as that is what is so great about Vintage 30s as they cut thru a band mix like nobody's business and as great as a amp or speaker sounds playing solo it is almost useless if it can't cut thru a mix, which other than V30s sounding great is why they are so popular as they are probably the best speaker for standing out in a full mix or live gig

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

So, what do we think of the Retro 30? How would you rank the speakers in this video to each other and am I the most tired looking dude since Senator Palpatine? Want to help decide which speaker to test next? Head over to the poll on my channels community page!

[@huntergalloway3944]

The V30 is still #1, however I still like K85s a lot and of course classic Greenbacks. Nothing beats the cut and sizzle of a V30 for high gain sounds IMO. They just work in a mix

[@JimijaymesProductions]

It sounds so different and I really didnt like the peaky frequency in the Retro, definitely V30 by a mile, it has the right frequencies pushed where the Retro sounds like it is in some weird resonant room.

[@jketterman6054]

I liked the V30 in some applications and then I started liking the Retro 30 in other applications. When combined together, I thought they sounded awesome.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

@@jketterman6054 Yeah! Same! The Retro has been growing on me. I think it sounds particularly cool on the low to mid gain stuff and after hearing the tracks over and over again in editing, I don't find the Retro bad at all.

[@jketterman6054]

I've had mine since 2012. They work very well with Orange amps. I'm using it now with my 5150 iconic, but I plan on trying it with V30s.

[@RsSquier51]

You should try the WGS ET65 too. I have mine paired with a WGS Veteran 30 in a 2 x 12 cab.

[@terran236]

the ET90s are amazing as well

[@saarangnarayan123]

Dude, excellent video but that Vintage 30 IR is absolutely FANTASTIC. One of the best IRs ever. Just has that "magic" that V30s are supposed to have. Goes to show that the correct V30 WILL sound great when mic'd up well. Definitely going into my folder of favourites.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

I am stoked you like it!

[@saarangnarayan123]

@@TheOtherJohnBrowne the only thing “missing” is a bit of low end thump but a) that’s down to the cab, and b) might be just what’s needed in a mix

[@RICO_SUAVE21]

Incredible demo! Just what I’ve been trying to find 👍🏾 Thank you!

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Thanks, man!

[@zanthraxus]

Damn I hope this is the last one I've missed. To me (again) the mix is the preferred sound - but in this one the V30 pulls 90% of the weight, it sounded amazing here. Also this detailed exposure to the V30 showed when Zilla Cabs posted their blind test (Greenback vs. V30) - so thanks again! Cheers!

[@roberthastings708]

This is great. Thank you! The v30 sounded very good. Better than I expected. Tonally the combos are the way to go. I'd be waiting for some Eminence tests.

[@DrGand]

I had an entire comment typed out but figured I should hear your thoughts before pressing the comment button. I deleted the comment when it was just literally the exact same thing you were saying in your final thoughts, lmao. You hit the nail on the head. Cheers man!

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Cheers, mate!

[@DavidsMusicChannel]

Nice comparison! The Veterans sounded better to my ear, They also sound way better on my 5150, amazing how much different speakers make. Cheers!

[@TheNocturnalEvil]

Hmm, to me the Retro 30 doesn't sound like a Vintage 30 inspired speaker. To my ears it sounds like with the Retro 30 what WGS has done is that they have tried to replicate the tone you get by mixing a Pre-Rola Greenback with a JBL speaker. That combination has its own charm but for modern metal tones it does sound poor. WGS is well known for doing this. Their Invader similarly replicates the Greenback and Vintage 30 mix. Even their Veteran 30 is somewhat like a mix between Vintage 30 and modern non-vented magnet G12T75 speakers.

[@oozede9035]

Great Video, as always! I really like the frequency diagram that you showed.

[@focusonjunta]

In that set up (single 57), I thought the Retro 30 wiped the floor with the Vintage 30 and the Veteran 30, and this is from a big Vintage 30 fan!

[@WholeLottaBulldog]

The mad German scientist returns. Thank you once again, my man

[@ruhrpottflo2249]

This is so awesome mate 🎉 love it 🙌🏻

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Appreciate it, bro!

[@youztuber5000]

I've got some Reaper HPs and want to try more WGS, Veteran 30 are next for me. Really appreciate this vid!

[@Greg25815]

How come I did not see this movie ? Good job man.

[@bllyfen8]

I really like the Retro, but it does seem quieter, so I'm assuming that it's attenuating some frequencies that give that sense or it's just not as efficient as the V30.

[@noahslavinmusic]

Bro… your riffs, so heavy and nostalgic and beautiful. Everything I love about riffs lol. Is that all original? Or what songs are you playing?

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

@@noahslavinmusic you just made my day. Yes, all original written by me, except maybe one or two that were written by band mates at the time

[@ludwigseipelt5541]

Geil, endlich mal ein guter WGS Vergleich:) Ich denke ich werde für meine 2x12er ET 90 und Veteran 30 nehmen!

[@jamesaddiss8438]

You do some of the best speaker vids I have seen! In this one I thought the Retro sounded harsh in the highs. I guess it's the 5-6k peak I hear? Someone said it sounded 'scratchy' and that is a good description. I liked the V30 and the Vet30 much better. They are different but both good.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Thank you very much! Yes, I think it's the 5 to 6 kHz in this speaker that makes it stick out a bit. Fwiw I did not think it sounded bad

[@shino8820]

I felt WGS Veteran 30 is more open sound. It's for me!

[@MetalheadOv666]

Great demo! I have a Veteran 30 and Reaper HP in a custom 212 cab I built and sounds killer! One of the best combos I’ve ever had. I also have a v30s 212 cab which I don’t care for much, and another custom 212 with a Redback and Creamback 75 and my favorite combo of speakers now! I’m a HUGE fan of WGS speakers and going to try out a Retro 30 and ET90 (which is the ET65 with more watts and bigger magnet) which is their take on a Celestion creamback 65.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

I also really like the Redback

[@MetalheadOv666]

@@TheOtherJohnBrowne my favorite speaker right now!

[@BBF3]

Thanks again, great video. In my ears, the WGS Retro sounds a little bit like a Vintage 30 with a thin blanket between speaker and microphone. The Vintage 30 just sounds a little (not much) brighter and more open and airy, what I prefer. The winner in my ears is the V30. Did you ever test the Celestion V-Type? In other comparisons on KZbin the V-Type sounds quite good, even a tiny bit better than a good V30.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Not yet. I have one and I believe I have shot IRs for it, just haven't filmed a playthrough yet

[@bigkidband911]

John, The Mojotone Greyhound wound be a good one to test.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Duely noted!

[@huntergalloway3944]

I like to mix WGS ET65s with my V30s in an X pattern. I really like their stuff, and I think they mix very well with Celestion speakers.

[@terran236]

I have two of each. ET90 and vet30. Thinking of changing my veterans for v30s. Sadly vets don't have the clarity and complex overtones v30s do.

[@Dr.Dark1331]

Hey John I really like the thicker sound of both the Retro 30 & the Veteran 30 and I value your opinion as you owned and listened to all 3 in the room and was wondering which you would pick for a 112 combo amp between the Retro 30 and Veteran 30, nothing against the Vintage 30 but being only a 112 combo I think I need the thicker sound of one of the WGS's to fill a room better with only having a 112 as opposed to a cabinet with multiple speakers which I am sure that is where the Vintage 30 shines

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Between those two, I'd go for the Veteran 30. The Retro 30 is great but it has that high end spike that might be overpowering in a smaller enclosure by itself.

[@Dr.Dark1331]

​@@TheOtherJohnBrowneok thank you John, I really appreciate your knowledge and feedback on these matters

[@dominikpohli2381]

maybe you shood try the wgs reaper and reaper hp they sound also great for modern high gain metal sounds

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

I'd love to! At the same time I have at least 8 more speakers here I haven't even tried yet 😂

[@dominikpohli2381]

@@TheOtherJohnBrowne the weber gray wolve and the tonespeak liverpool are also great v 30 style speakers

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

I assume the review for the Liverpool on Tube-Town was written by you? Do you have any good source on Weber Speakers in Europe apart from Banzai?

[@dominikpohli2381]

only banzai @@TheOtherJohnBrowne

[@dominikpohli2381]

@@TheOtherJohnBrowne yes the liverpool has more top and more mid bark than vetaran 30 but it isn,t that agressive like a retro 30 ilike the retro 30 the most it has this great power metal mids that no other speaker had

[@inzanestrings]

this is interesting, usually ive preferred the retro 30 to the veteran 30 in other comparisons but in this one i definitely preferred the veteran 30, but also preferred the good old v30 over either of them

[@Van020280]

I've had all these. I got rid off the Retros. No character and lacked mids in a loud mix. V30 and Vet30 are what I kept in a 412. Vet30 has the best mids and the deepest palm mute crunch.

[@gitarius]

The Retro 30 got a high spike that really annoys me. Had to check the frequencies in Cubase and it got a big spike at 5.5khz, and is scooped from 2.5-4.5khz. The V30 is much more even in the high mids. The Veteran 30 is pretty similar to the V30, but has a little scoop around 3khz that might be a good thing, espcally when mixing I alway have to make a dip around 3k. Consider to buy the Veteran 30, got to much V30 in my studio, haha!

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Yes. The Retro here has a massive high end spike

[@Outloaf]

I'm not sure how many cabinets you have but doing a test to see how the enclosure, slant vs straight and position in the cabinet affect the voice. I've done these tests and it's wild but I don't have the means to do KZbin content. :)

[@zAvAvAz]

Excellent riffage and sound! The retro 30 is a great speaker.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Thank you

[@amirtak9886]

That veteran 30 sounds amazing. The retro 30 sounds a bit tin canny. And the v30 sounds like what its supposed to, a v30. Great playing as always.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Thank you!

[@amirtak9886]

@@TheOtherJohnBrowne no problemo

[@eygerywazzup]

Thanks for the great comparison! I liked the Veteran 30 most. I'm a bit bored by the V30 sound alone so I'm looking forward to get some veterans for my engl 412 pro and pair them with eminence swamp thangs. Do you have these as well? I like the V30s 16 Ohm in my orange ppc412 though. Played through a super kraken this cab rips. For my herbert mk3 the Engl is a far better match than the orange so I'm excited to swap the speakers. Got a Diezel 412 coming my way as well and my expectations are high 😂 I see the hesu demon as an interesting speaker as well. Would be cool to see more of this one 👍🏼

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

First of all, great taste in amps, man! I do not have a Swamp Thang yet but it's on the list. I'll be making a video like this on the Hesu Demon next year!

[@eygerywazzup]

@@TheOtherJohnBrowne Thank you! I'm looking forward to that one! 😁 👌🏼

[@-LSTR-]

Thanx, great video:) I liked the V30, but hated the retro tbh. But I love V30's the most when combined. Today I paired one with a Redback in two ppc112's and it sounds awesome with my Dark Terror

[@daviddegagatem]

Thanks for your great comparison vid. I own a WGS Veteran and a V30myself. It’s al about the amp and guitartype in combination with the speakerchoice. The Veteran 30 gives me more prescence in my cab , matched with a head which is on the bright side. My more mid heavy amp head likes the V30 better. Based on your comparison I wouldn’t choose the Retro. In both cases.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Thank you for commeting! I absolutely agree with your assessment on when the Veteran and when the Vintage is more suitable

[@emoboi311]

I own both the Retro 30, and Veteran 30. Both incredible speakers, the veteran 30 is a superior vintage 30 in my experience. The Retro 30 is a unique sounding speaker with its own signature sound. Heavy sounding, both are great for high gain. WGS speakers are my favorite by far.

[@Darth.Shredder]

Great shootout! I don't know much about Warehouse speakers but I wonder how they rate sensitivity compared to Celestion. The Retro 30 seems like it's pushing out less dbs kind of like an M65 Creamback @97db vs a V30 @100db. The Veteran 30 sounds more equal like it's closer to 100db. I'm just going by my computer speakers, so I could be wrong. The Retro 30 reminds me of a Mojotone Greyhound. BTW, the Engl sounds wonderful as always! I really hope they bring the Retrotube back one day.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

I'd love for them to make a Retro Tube mk II with presence and depth controls! The Retro did seem to generate the same over all SPL as the Veteran and Vintahe 30s and the preamps were set near identically. I believe it appears more quiet to our ears as it has the least mids content.

[@lordgraga]

Modding almost any amp with a presence and depth control is pretty simple if it already has negative feedback (which I think all ENGL amps have for sure)

[@Sven.Jeschke]

I don‘t care about the speakers, I want that gorgeous PRS!

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

It's a lovely piece of wood

[@stefanoenricosalvadorebesu1445]

Veteran 30 for me. Fuller and rounder. And of course, there is a reason why the Vintage 30 is an indistry standard. It enphasizes all the right frequencies. But the Veteran 30 is also is terrific.

[@reverendg5937]

I luv WGS Speaks, but I really luv good tone. If it sounds good don't mess with the formula. Not saying not to change speaker. (I do it all the time) Sometimes things just sound amazing as they are. 🎸🎸🎸🎸

[@danielbelensky5513]

just opened KZbin, and saw your new video. Retro 30? nah... here, I liked both Veteran and V30 better. seems like retro would benefit from slightly different mic placement.. I would love to experience them all in person to know for sure. anyway this video made me think, that problem with many KZbin speaker comparisons is that IDENTICAL mic placement sometimes(or quite often) might be misleading, "neutral" or "the same" mic placement might favour one speaker over another. Long time ago, friend of mine made speaker comparison, in which mic placement wasn't the same, but he tried to get best possible sound out of each speaker. obviously results were all over the place, but it was very helpful to get more of what each speaker capable of. maybe some wider pattern, neural microphone, could help to eliminate the placement advantages, but I'm afraid it's just to much hustle, and expenses.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

You bring up a good point that I havd been scratching my head about for a while. With these particular speakers, I think it's appropriate as they are Vintage 30 copies as WGS pretty much admits. I'd say that identical mic placement is therefore fair game. For speakers further removed from the classic V30, this is an issue though. They may have a different sweet spot. The issue I have with choosing different positions for each speaker is, then my taste becomes the benchmark. Anything you hear would be filtered through my preference. Of course you could argue that that is already the case as I also dial the amps but they are dialed according to what I hear in the room and not to what comes through either of the mics. There is no way to be neutral about it and I try to be as neutral about the speakers as I can be. The only way I can think of improving this is to add another SM57 to the speaker in question in order to A/B test the speaker against the V30 in the same position an A/B test it against the V30 in its respective sweetspot. I guess I could do that. I'd just have to use the regular Audient preamps in my interface, which are great... but I really like my Rupert Neve 511 modules for the 500 series and I can't afford a third one 😂 Thanks for another great and detailed comment

[@ScrewDJ_McDuck]

Good sir, can we have t75's comparison from all eras?

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

I'm afraid not any time soon. I don't own a single one of those so that would likely take me five years again 😅

[@Sven.Jeschke]

@@TheOtherJohnBrowneThe time to start a new speaker collection is now!

[@KaddysJamKave]

I rank Veteran 30, Vintage 30 and Retro 30 last. But they all sound pretty darn good.

[@asnark7115]

Same.

[@adamwatson6916]

I would love to hear the Marshall G12 vintage wihich is a Marshall spec V30 compared to these 3 speakers .. The G12 vintage is a fuller and smoother V30 .. i have them in a Silver Jubilee 2 by 12 and its a killer cab and the speakers are some of the best i have tried. I only like the Standard V30 in a mix.

[@Patrick-rf7vx]

hi, what poweramp did you use for the IRs?

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Message me via email or Instagram, mate

[@jesperbc]

In order of preference: Vintage 30 > Veteran 30 > Retro 30, but that Retro Tube sounds amazing, so that one wins.

[@CraigFlowersMusic]

Retro was so dark I can only compare it to a ruby or something. Veteran 30 reminds me of something but I can't think what. Maybe the V-type, or like an old JBL, but not a V30 anyway. Decent combo though, usually speakers with a spike somewhere pair well with something. I think your V30 is wicked awesome by itself though.

[@m3ssym3ss]

they are both cool but they are a world apart, not quite sure if the '30' reference makes any sense on this case.

[@admgloval]

I guess I have different ears than most do. To me the Retro 30 sounded better and more 'hi-fi' for lack of a better term. The Vintage 30 sounded very boxy and almost 'AM radio' sounding to me.

[@vmathias2023]

Man,I am pinging back and forth between the retro,vintage 30 and mojotone bv30h and I can't make a decision.🤬

[@TheLamboman640]

Veteran 30 for the win!!

[@dominikpohli2381]

i like the wgs retro 30 the most it has more agressive uppeer mids than the vetaran 30 but sound also sound better and has more dynamic and smoother ovrdrive ana to end than the celestion v30. the celestion v30 sound sterrile and total bright the both wgs speaker sound warmer and more open

[@jaychen2000metal]

I absolutely love the Retro 30 and also the Reaper. Got both in my cab. The recording of the Retro kinda sounded dark here. Definitely not a dark sounding speaker. The V30 Definitely was brightest and since i think the Retro is fairly bright, i'll stay away from the V30.

[@Findyournextguitar]

very interesting - I thought the veteran 30's were a lot more "articulate" the retro 30's sounded a lot more scooped to me, and the veteran's sounded like a much more well rounder vintage 30 - my pick would be the veterans by far, but they could be mixed with the retro's no problem in a 4x12 - I wouldn't mix them in a 2x12 though granted I want to hear the bright sparkly high's and crispy mids so hard to say. I'm curious what they'd sound like with PRS mccarty's or a PAF style les paul pickup the 85/15's are a bit "dead" sounding in the mids compared to the mccartys - at least the ones I've got which are 2002's in a bolt on swamp ash special I'd be curious how much different they sound with a more harsh 6L6 setup - I'd guess the retros sound a bit better with a more aggressive tube head - they probably round out the harshness a bit so you can really take advantage of the low end boost THX for the review !

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Thank you for the insightful comment. In retrospect, I think the Retro 30 could have done with a slightly adjusted mic position a little further outside. I have adjusted me approach a bit since but compared to the Veteran and Vintage 30, it's surely brighter. The Retro 30 is a good blend with either of the others - at least to my ears. I think the 85/15 are the lowest output pickups I currently own and I haven't tried any of the other PRS pickups offerings. I love the 85/15 in the CE24 though. What other PRS pickups would you recommend? From your message I assume you are a fan of the McCarty pups?

[@AlanW]

Wow, I am not sure those speakers could have been more different. I'm a bit of a midrange junkie, so I found myself liking the V30s better. Great comparison, also nice guitar! I like your choice of riffs, I think it really showcases the tones well.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

Thank you! I appreciate your feedback!

[@Cpt_Adama]

Weird, to me on a laptop mind you, the Retro seemed a little muffled to me. I think I like the Veteran better.

[@adamwatson6916]

The veteran sounds much closer to the V30 but still has its own spin on the V30 sound .

[@scottpeters4401]

I much prefer the V30…the WGS is a completely different sounding speaker..I was surprised,I figured with the “improved “V30 marketing that it would be closer..I didn’t hear the similarity between either of the WGS’s to the V30…But I did like the Veteran more than the Retro…

[@goodmanwiseman303]

The Retro 30s sounded like they were meant to copy the Vintage 30s, which they probably were. Great speaker, I think the Vintage 30 would sound better with a bass guitar because it covers more of the higher frequencies, the Retro 30 sat more in the lower treble and bass. You can’t beat those Veteran 30s though, I’d like to hear them vs the stock Orange amp speakers, say in the Rockerverb.

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

I think the stock speakers in the Rockerverb combos are in fact Vintage 30s. Do you mean the Voice of the World speakers that Orange put in their more affordable cabs and combos?

[@eBagJones]

My ears hear the Retro as buzzy, bright and scooped compared to the Vintage 30.

[@anthonydavella8350]

Great job, thanks for the info. The Vintage 30 sounds so much better to me. Open, nice mids and still not harsh. Im really disappointed with the warehouse speaker. Super scooped and sounds like a blanket was put over the cab

[@SuperReverbious]

Veteran 30 for the win.

[@Outloaf]

I used to have the retro 30s and whatever the g12-t75 inspired drivers were. While the "75" sounded better than their celestion counterparts to my ears, the real vintage 30s (early 2000's) were leaps and bounds better than the WGS vet 30s.

[@gusmc01]

I came to the exact same conclusion. I sold my Celestion T75’s because the WGS HM75 are so much better. Not the case with V30 clones. I’ve tried a bunch and none of them measure up to the real thing!

[@sparella]

Rhythm parts on V30s sound like its all the same note to me (like a reflex subwoofer bass enclosure). I'd use Retro on rhythm, V30 on lead, and pass on the Veteran.

[@HugoWelti]

I liked the Veteran better here.

[@WholeLottaBulldog]

Retro sounded the best to me

[@frankstetka7206]

Some V-30’s just can’t be beat it seems while others need help perhaps 🤔 like when Chinese factory kept dishing them out with the wrong parts 🤣

[@traviscrown9189]

What would bob rock do…. That’s all you need to know…

[@TheOtherJohnBrowne]

What would he do?

[@traviscrown9189]

@@TheOtherJohnBrowne vintage 30’s

[@alexanders5121]

Retro 30 to much fizzy.. v30 much better) thank’s for work) a can’t wait speaker burn-in video)

[@lordgraga]

Retro 30 sounds like a small dog trying to be a big dog. V30 is the big dog. Cleans were nice though!

[@theRodofwar]

DV-77 vs VETERAN-30 vs Celestion CREAM 90 watt !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THX !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@asymmetrymedia9838]

bit muddy in th elower mids, loses all mids that are nice on the V30, ugly scratchy top end... in this video at least: retro 30 is an absolute loser