What happened with Soul Hackers 2 reviews?

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Seriously what happened? Share your thots! Please consider subscribing as it helps the channel out a ton.

[@megami215]

I don't share my thots!

[@ElusiveShadow77]

This is just coming from my personal experience, but imagine being able to enjoy both Persona 5 Royal AND Soul Hackers 2. Crazy...

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Apparently we are the exception to the rule

[@Spencerwalker21]

​@@HallowedBeThyGame I'm torn on this game what's the good faith criticisms of the game. I've also heard mix things about performance on steam deck.

[@Wabasi]

Hey, I'm currently in the middle of my playthrough (around 15 hours in) but figured I'd give my 2 cents on this as well. I believe people have been skirting around the idea that they had expectations in a post Persona 5 world especially from a title that came from Atlus. With SMT V they marketed that title consistently in my opinion to be catering towards the hardcore SMT fans of old. Setting up expectations for their new fans on what to expect in comparison. Soul hackers 2 while marketed way more than I expected, never made that distinction that it might not hold up to the budget or standards that Persona 5 had and created as far as I know. I think anyone who knew how little soul hackers 1 sold saw it coming that Soul Hackers 2 would not be this grandiose title that has unique and crazy wild dungeons. It might be related to that gut feeling you described having but I just knew what the game would be like and it has met my expectations so far. I'm really enjoying myself and the world they created. Persona 5 created a LOT of new fans to the SMT series as a whole, fans that had one of Atlus's most polished games as their entry point. The bar has been set and especially with Persona 5 getting up there in age I think the hunger for something like it is setting in. Do I wish soul hackers 2 could've gotten the same budget and love that Persona 5 received? Of course but did I expect Atlus to ever greenlight such a high budget to a sequel of a game that didn't sell well and is fairly old? Not really. Soul Hackers 2 is not the Cyberpunk Persona some people might've been hoping for but what we got is a solid if not great addition to the SMT library. Again, I don't think the dungeons were the problem but the comparisons to persona was. I haven't heard people complaining about Tale of Arise's generic rock canyon/fire mountain dungeon or its final dungeon which is just hallways with small puzzles. Same thing with Yakuza Like a Dragon that featured copy and pasted sewers. (I love both of these games too btw. So no hate towards either series.) But once a game by Atlus following Persona 5 released, then it was highlighted as a major flaw. Anyway TLDR: I think we'll be seeing "Soul Hackers 2 is a hidden gem" or a game people slept on videos years down the road from now. I just hope more people will give it a try now to possibly convince Atlus to give their side titles a bigger budget next time. The game is worth your time but it's definitely not a masterpiece either. My only complaint so far is I wish I could turn down the navigators voice. Thank you to anyone who bothered to read this far into the ramblings of a random gamer.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Really appreciated your response and thank you for taking the time to laugh out respectful and insightful opinions. I agree and while this game isn’t the absolute pinnacle of jrpg perfection, it’s a great game and totally worth it. I expect if a lot of these KZbinrs are still going at it in 5 years this game will be gracing their hidden gems lists as well. Thanks for sharing and have fun with the rest of the game!

[@KyngD469]

Hard to call it a hidden gem with bland dungeons and mid combat. We've seen this done better before.

[@AnakhaSilver]

@@sebastiandelacruz1134 I mean, you just described the SMT experience. That's literally just SMT as a whole. Most people GET IT because that's what they want. You are literally saying, "People aren't mad because P5 spoiled people, but also it's not like Persona and that's bad." Literally, you just described SMT fucking NOCTURNE.

[@AnakhaSilver]

@@sebastiandelacruz1134 Really? Because a lot of the dungeons felt boring as shit to annoying at best (the main dungeon teleport maze that is LITERALLY trial and error andwill send you back multiple rooms if you get it wrong once) and I LOVE it. The demon negotiation was so random that it became annoying because you could be robbed blind and they'd just leave you with nothing and forcing you to pad out the game with more grinding to even make that up, the combat being "punishing" was really it just being unfair because the enemy would magically know whatever weakness you have and don't forget the infamous Mot not even letting you have a turn if you didn't come in having looked up a fucking guide (there's a video of someone going THIRTY MINUTES in a loop LITERALLY UNABLE TO DO ANYTHING before Mot finally kills him--but apparently that's great game design to you). I find this combat a lot more fun because I don't have to worry about killing the demon I want to recruit because I have to find it in the dungeon. Also like, Nocturne not having characters is like... Are you new to SMT? The characters are just shorthand for the philosophy being touched on. Just like in SMTV.

[@hosenpfefferjones4524]

@@sebastiandelacruz1134 It's very hard not to talk about Nocturne or any other game in the series for that matter when literally everyone criticizing the game uses them as a comparison for many of the games faults. Truthfully, I think criticism towards this game has been blown a bit out of proportion. I think some of the copy paste dungeon aesthetics and some of the later dungeon designs are a bit glaring, but outside of that I find this game to be pretty fun. It's not as deep or well polished as something like SMT V or Persona 5, but I don't know if that's what they were really going for given the lower budget of this game. It really just feels like a hybrid of older forst person dungeon crawlers mixed in with the modern 3rd person design of Atlus's newer games to me. I think if they had maybe sold this game at a lower price without egregious DLC, and maybe even called it something other than Soul Hackers 2, then I think this game might have been received a bit better all around. Personally, I'd like to see more spin off games like this rather than the typical Persona dancing/ fighting games because while I don't consider this game to be as good as the heavy hitters, I still enjoyed myself with it as a stop gap between bigger games.

[@Cybershroom]

I'm confused as to how split the community/reviews have been. The game was not spectacular by any means, but it was a very good game and how is that not okay? It doesn't deserve getting so much flack.

[@zackawesomeness2506]

Because people make Persona their expectations nowadays. At least from what I’ve seen. I think people expected this game to have the budget of P5 or something

[@Particle_Ghost]

Simple. Most people playing this only played Persona, and it's not Persona, so people bitch because its different from Persona. Yes, the bland dungeons are the worse part about it, but Persona 3 and 4 both have horrible dungeons as well. Most jrpgs have bland dungeons. Persona 3 is even the same dungeon for 264 floors lol!

[@Cybershroom]

@@Particle_Ghost While that's true, I was more invested in the characters,music and theme they got going, If I have one major complaint, that would be that the aesthatics pale in comparison to the original SH.

[@Tyler16bit]

I watched your review, and I agreed with it. I also believe with your experience in this genre of games that I can trust your opinion. I’ll be buying Soul Hackers 2 tomorrow, and I look forward to experiencing the game for myself, and at the end of the day more people should decide for themselves what they want to play rather than judging it solely based on what score a certain review site gives it.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Thanks so much! I agree that really at the end of the day what we enjoy about a game is a solely personal experience. It's ok to like games that the majority doesn't. Hope you enjoy and thanks for sharing!

[@wooichingsam5023]

there the nice game is only for those who love it，dont need to be distract by other

[@davehoffman515]

The comparison to Persona 3 is weird. That was originally a PS2 title with far less power so the dungeon variety is more limited. Soul Hackers 2 is a PS4 title that could have more variety like in Tales of Arise, Xenoblade Chronicles 3, or Persona 5 but doesn't. Watching the video in this chat, it looks like a pretty indie game made with limited resources and not a lot of bells and whistles. A 7 or 8/10 sounds right from what I've seen. I might pick it up at a discount down the road especially with these gross dlc tactics but it didn't look like a must have day 1.

[@AnakhaSilver]

You just listed three big budget games, you realize???

[@metroidcypher]

@@AnakhaSilver xenoblade is not a big budget game the developers have even gone and said people would be surprised by what it is.

[@RaymondTywaif]

You've made several points that I've thought about too and agreed with. Haven't played SH2 as I'm still not done with what I'm playing currently, but I'd like to share a few thoughts from my personal perspectives in relation to general gaming experiences and observations. Western/Eastern audience and design philosophies: From what I've noticed, in general, western audience values more in-game freedom like open-world settings, thrill elements, meme-potential, sense of community, technicality/performance; eastern prioritizes familiarity, stylish/pretty character aesthetics that aren't necessarily practical, evoking factors like musics and voice-acting, and sense of melancholy/existentialism. Final Fantasy 13 was bombarded with criticism about its linearity in the west, but wasn't as controversial or polarizing in the east and was more well-received instead. On the other hand, FF7R Aerith's facial design was a controversial topic in Japan for a while. In that sense, I think eastern audience doesn't mind repetitiveness as much due to familiarity, but it feels more of a boring chore and less freedom for western audience. I imagine the metaphorical analogy would be western players prefer the freedom of flying predator hunting for their preys in their ways with roller coaster rides of gameplay, and you want to passionately talk about the roller coaster ride experience with other theme park goers especially the ones who experienced the same roller coaster; eastern players prefer the sight-seeing at a small magical forest with restricted areas and beautiful creatures that make you question if you would rather exist with those beautiful creatures in a dreamlike world or you're just like them stuck and restricted, with gameplay of preparing ingredients and cooking - the repetitive preparation and chopping of many ingredients and time-consuming cooking but the end results the food gives you a warm filled-up feeling as you eat with satisfaction, soothing your existential emptiness. Like, you might notice that many JRPGs really have a lot of cryptic poetic in-game quotes and wordings, as well as existential themes. In general, the way I try to make sense of situations like SH2 is that, I think sometimes some western gamers expect more western rpg elements from hyped up jrpgs that are designed to appeal to bigger market, but the games failed to satisfy western's preferences, and some of them were disappointed and felt that "devs don't care enough and exploit/milk their supportive fans and communities", because as you might have seen it before, some particularly entitled karen-like western people really feel like the world revolves around them that things should have designed to suit them, and so it caused such a weird polarizing situation. Not to say SH2 has no flaws, as some criticisms are entirely valid, it's just some people don't really have any valid constructive criticism or had personally experienced the game, only biased/blind following that formed the bandwagon piling on like they are part of a community "trying to let the devs hear their voices". Anyway, I could go on and on about how there's a weird phenomenon of popular games getting circlejerk cult-like vibe worshipped to the point where suddenly people are not allowed to criticize/dislike the games otherwise it'd be no taste or wrong, and vice versa for unpopular games being piled on that you'd be criticized as disingenuous or sellout for enjoying/praising it, but I'll stop here.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I genuinely appreciate this extremely well thought out and insightful response. I didn't know about the Aeirth controversy out of Japan with her facial animations but your points about the design philosophies from East and West definitely ring true for me as well. I think the West has a much bigger problem with circle jerking than many people care to admit when it comes to the games that are worshiped and idolized. Really appreciate your response, and it gives everyone a lot of food for thought.

[@RaymondTywaif]

@@HallowedBeThyGame Well thanks for your appreciation, I'm glad that you resonated with my response positively ☺ I usually try to not expect any response back when I comment even if it's a long comment as it's not obligatory and creators have MANY comments to go through, so yeah I'm extra glad you found something you genuinely appreciate. I actually could have gone and written more but it'd digress into personal rant about society and humanity that we have no control over so this is the edited-down version of my original longer comment. I personally think this video/topic is interesting, and not enough people talk about it. A recent video by Deebeegeek about his Saints Row video situation also made me think about this too. People are too much sometimes that they lost objectivity and reasoning, wherein the situation easily gets hijacked by bandwagon and derailed to something else, because of "memes and based". IDK how to describe it other than it's like trolling or online version of karen-ism or adult form of temper tantrum. It doesn't happen only in gaming world but music world movies etc too, the "hate" bandwagon on Nickelback in the past was a thing too, Twilight, etc because memes and "everyone says so" so it's cool to pile on and if you don't agree you have bad taste/lame and that's embarrassing.

[@MissBubbles]

Excellent discussion! I am new to all of this so I had no idea there was even DLC. I think y'all were fair with giving your own opinion while also giving facts which is the way to go

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Happy it came out that way, and so glad you enjoyed as I really respect your reviews!

[@drowningin]

Atlus has gone crazy with Day 1 DLC. They are one of the biggest offenders of developers I play

[@franciscobutte]

The first Souls Hackers and SMT Strange Journey were also review bombed and they are one of the best SMT games of all time. Persona fans must chill out. Not everything is social links and school life.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

That's a really good point about the original and SJ. Thanks for pointing that out

[@KyngD469]

SMT IV:A was peak combat imo.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Yes.

[@nr2676]

Yes, definitely best combat in Megaten series.

[@drowningin]

Never played SMT4:Apoc despite owning it. What's the battle change from SMT4?

[@nr2676]

@@drowningin The best balance in series (every build is viable), nerf ,,Smirk'' mechanic, demons have Elemental Affinity (for example ice demons, like Jack Frost have bonus with ice skills, but penalty with fire skills), Status Ailments Affinity, hama and mudo deals dmg and have a chance for instakill ONLY if you are weak or neutral to LIGHT/DARK (so they are usefull not only in random encounters, but also with boss fights), physical skills buffs, best demon fusion, better map navigation, camera is better (a bit further than in SMT IV), some bosses have unique mechanics and are challenging (unlike SMT IV), last battle have unique mechanic - Dual Team fight, so awesome, but sadly SMT V dropped that for no reason.

[@DieselJT]

I'm absolutely loving this game! But I always love Atlus JRPGs. My only problem with the dlc is the practice of locking certain dlc behind the digital purchases of the game. I still like to own my games physically and I absolutely hate the digital deluxe editions of these games that come with dlc that is not made purchasable to people that buy the physical release. 😒 This practice always just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. And this practice is being used by most developers today. I dont want to feel forced into buying a digital version of a game.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Very good points! I know what ya mean, I'll always go physical with games when I can. Thanks for sharing!

[@icarusfluffybottom899]

Also: The dungeons in Persona 3 are ass. Even Persona 4, same thing. In P4 they had some thematic elements that were good, but the dungeon designs themselves are the most basic, boring, and all around uninteresting aspects of those games. If the dungeons in this game are even HALF as basic as the ones in P3 and P4, then it deserves the criticisms. They are convoluted hallways with some random enemies strewn about, there is never anything mechanically interesting going on. It is incredibly dated design, and no modern RPGs should be made in that style ever again.

[@ystevenxu]

Famitsu gave Time and Eternity, one of the worst jrpg ever, a 32/40. Let that sink in.

[@davelee1935]

Awesome game ! I missed because of reviews the first time around . Shame it got so bagged out

[@alsaiduq4363]

The game just seems mediocre. Not bad but it doesn't seems like something thats great and memorable. Idk but 6/7 out of 10 seems like the perfect rating for this game from what i saw and read about it.

[@lemonpop6251]

I like Soul Hackers 2. I like the story and the game play. I would of like to see some difference between Arrow, Milady, and Saizo dungeons, but make something different next time. The dungeons are just like any other dungeon crawl game. They look the same and it a lot of grinding, until you get next section. With waiting about 7 years or more for a mainline SMT or Persona. I'm willing to play a game that is more minimalistic as long the story and game play is solid. If they come out between the mainline games all the better.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Very well said, thanks for sharing

[@DarthIllustrious]

I think we need to realize that the online Atlus fandom like the Star Wars fandom is an absolute toxic cesspool and is not real life. It is probably even more divided then the Tales and Xenoblade fandoms at this point as there is an ongoing war between SMT and Persona that will never end online and I feel Atlus as a company needs to understand they will never please the toxic online fandom that is the online Atlus fanbase. Cause at this point theyre probably very confused. Their Persona spinoff endeavors flopped hard with the dancing games and Strikers with the only spinoffs doing okay were old fighting games, and now it seems like their SMT spinoff endevors might not work for them. However I dont think the online famdom is real life and while I don't think Soul Hackers 2 will be as big as SMTV or P5 but I think itll be moderate for the budget as many of my irl and online friends have bought and are really enjoying the game and im seeing lots of art and fan support not from youtube channels. If I were Atlus I would honestly ignore western reception and the online fandom and continue down the SMT spinoff path because atleast from what im seeing the game will probably be a moderate success and I actually think if they keep improving we can see more of these games. There are some series tho that listening to the online fans only lead to chaos. Its clear SMT/Persona has become that and is easily one of the most toxic online fandoms out there

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I'm still holding onto hope we can get DDS1&2 and Devil Survivor 3. But yeah interested to see what Atlus does next..

[@drowningin]

I wish Atlus would take a break from SMT games. I've had enough of the demons for a while. I wish they would work on other IPs, or new games more like they used to. Lately they've just become the Megaten Studio. Give us stuff like Radiant Historia, Trauma Center, just something. You can only capture & fuse demons in so many games before it gets tired

[@DanofWar101]

That was a good discussion about grading and DLC practices even if it started as a Eastern / Western grades comparison! I really don't like DLC to begin with unless it's more story like Ghost of Tsushima (I've played the PS5 version with the story DLC included at the beginning of the year and it's my favorite game I've played this year so far)! If people want to pay for costumes or skins that's one thing but when company decides to put elements in the game behind a pay wall, that's something that really irritates me! I'm getting old so for me grinding is part of a jrpg experience so I'm totally fine with that! I've played Suikoden 3 where I maxed out all my characters to level 99 back in the day! People who've played that game knows how many characters there are and how repetitive the Dungeons were, but it never bothered me! As for review scores, this is something that I haven't based my opinions on in a very long time... I mean the big outlets like IGN and the likes! They are limited in time and have obligations to fulfill so it always seems biased! That's where YT is so great! It takes a while to get to know which channel are like minded but once you've find some, they are the best kind of reviews that I can trust... and your channel is part of them! As for games that are not in my wheelhouse but that I'm curious about, I watch trailers and I decide if I'm interested enough to buy it or to just pass on them! Great video and keep up the good work!

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Thanks so much for sharing this and I’m happy to hear I’m not the only one who doesn’t mind the grind in jrpgs! Ghost of Tsushima is an excellent game and definitely a sweet pick for your goty! I need to play Suikoden 3, looks right up my alley and I know I’m missing out on greatness. I’m really thankful for YT, where we can find channels that we trust their opinions on. And yours is one I value as well! Thanks a ton for watching and sharing your experiences!

[@Rajin90]

So far, I'm enjoying it very much. I'm used to the dungeon layouts from Persona 4 Golden (which I played before SH2), the gameplay and progression is fun, the characters and themes are interesting, music is chill, ... don't know why someone wouldn't like it. If you dislike the day 1 DLC (which I totally understand), don't buy that. Money speaks louder than any words.

[@worldsbestpantz3445]

Wow, you guys talk about every game BUT Soul Hackers 2. Yeesh.

[@alezarde211]

Persona 5 has truly been an unfortunate curse upon every SMT game.

[@connorharnage6697]

Not wrong. I love P5 but now everyone's gonna complain when an Atlus game ISN'T like Persona 5. Heck I heard people complain about Soul Levels because it's too much like Persona 5 even though it's nothing like it besides the broad concept of strengthening bonds

[@Ingeniousleo85]

I bought the DLC in Takes of Arise because of Shionne’s Costume 😅 the rest of the goodies that came with it was just added bonus, but it did make the game more enjoyable since it was a pretty great dlc for in game rewards as well. (Bad practice I know but Shionne’s costume was worth it lmao). I haven’t bought Soulhackers 2 yet. I hate day one dlc. I only bought tales of arise dlc after I was already in love with the game. I wouldn’t mind buying soulhackers 2 dlc once I had already played the game and enjoyed it and also if it wasn’t $40 bucks lol. I mean yeah we are suckers but cmon now kiss me first before you… hehe. When soulhackers 2 goes on a deep sale I’ll be picking it up.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I look forward to hearing your thots on SH2 when ya play it! And I ain’t judgin, Shionne dlc costume was goat haha. And I LOVE Tales of Arise too.

[@brianlmosley]

Love the convos you two share, subbed

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Awesome, glad you enjoyed! Thanks!

[@CrimRui]

The DLC is a practice I do not support, but still I score the game of its own. I've seen people saying how dungeons are boring. It all depends what you want from the game. The things I want, this game delivers.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I 100% agree. Like the game has everything I want and look for in a quality jrpg.

[@sonictelephone1526]

Tbh I like the simplistic dungeons. I find gimmicks in dungeons to just be chores. I'd rather just engage with the core mechanics.

[@mickeymickey9914]

Free to play games, are garbage. I'm not gonna root for something because it's more profitable for the company. I want fun games, I'm not a cheerleader for some company. If profits are all that matters, stop making video games entirely and just make Pachinko games and slot machines like Konami. Maxamillion is a shill.

[@adult11252]

I think this is major problem in game industry nowadays. Free to play games just wait only one whale to milk money as much as you can while in the past you need a lot of people to buy fun game. In the present, Good game is not profit game. 😑

[@ladyjaye27]

And that’s why I completely skipped Diablo Immortal. I already don’t like the philosophy behind free-to-pay games, but I draw the line at pay-to-win mechanics. It’s too bad because it would have scratched that Diablo itch while waiting for D4’s release.

[@Satiator123]

Just make the game complete to begin with, and we will buy full price games on release. There's no way I'm paying $70 for a game, knowing that in a few years, a complete edition will be available for $30.

[@adult11252]

I understand because I kind of dislike in this game. Their dungeon design is not good for me (You will like it if you like Persona 3 and 4 more than SMT 5.) and Demon Recon is such a lame feature than just directly talk Demon in the battle. Sabbath also slow-paced than SMT 5 (but that not much point). Character Design is great and story is promised and should better than SMT 5 of course. But Gameplay cannot keep me play forward (I only play until Soul Matrix 1F) *If you like story or you like Persona 3/4, You may preferred this more than SMT 3 and SMT5 (Especially, SMT 5 because their story pacing are kinda weird)* but for me I preferred SMT 5 more than this game. Alternatively, You may buy Digimon Cyber Sleuth. It's $40.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Excellent insight, thanks for sharing your thots on it! SMT V combat is goat.

[@adult11252]

@@HallowedBeThyGame Thank you! This game not that bad. I give around 7. However, This series kinda cursed. Everything they do will be compared to Persona 5 no matter what. Not surprised if they stop do Persona for long time since this game is too wayyyy hype.

[@AnakhaSilver]

Demon negotiation was so hit and miss, and 90% of it was RNG which I did not appreciate.

[@Blutroth]

I'm really into jrpgs since my childhood (also played World of Warcraft for example and other wrpgs) and when i first played a Persona game it was really hard for me to get into it because i couldn't believe the repetitiveness of the dungeons and that anyone would enjoy that. Time went by and i got more used to it, played through several games with dungeons like that and when i played through P5 Royal i thought that the dungeons are REALLY creative and well made for an Atlus game. No comparison to P3 for example. It was still repetitive but it didn't felt that way, and for some reason the corridors had the perfect lenght. I was impressed with that. I think this is the direction the japanese dungeon design should evolve into (or further), if they don't wanna do western dungeon designs.

[@ophidianmind333]

I'm now playing Soul Hackers 2 after having just finished the Live-A-Live remake and I'm in gaming bliss. At the time I have put about 50 hours into Soul Hackers 2 and I am going for every side quest including the DLC side quests. Even though I haven't yet finished it, this will likely be my favorite game of the year unless it takes a nose dive at the end.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Psyched someone else is enjoying it too! I need to pickup Live-A-Live. Looks awesome, but yeah you'll have to let me know what you think of the end of SH2!

[@gottaextra]

that's very cute but have you played xenoblade 3

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

@@gottaextra playing through it now, game is fantastic

[@ophidianmind333]

@@gottaextra I'll get around to playing that one soon, but there's no reason to be condescending about it. Wouldn't it be more fun to tell me about why Xenoblade Chronicles III is a great game than to put me down for not having played it? I want to play every great RPG that is available and I would appreciate suggestions of games that you think are of high quality.

[@ophidianmind333]

@@HallowedBeThyGame Having now played through Soul Hackers 2 on both the normal and hard difficulty settings, beating the superbosses in the main game and the DLC, and having gotten the true ending, my opinion of it is even higher than before. It's a great game and is still the release from this year that I have enjoyed playing the most. While it might not be as close to my heart as SMT V, it was also setting out to do something different and I think it is a fine spin-off and I genuinely love this game. Hopefully the reception and sales will eventually be better for the game later on, because I'd really like to see what Atlus would do with Soul Hackers as its own series and I think it has a lot of potential.

[@goldenjoeblow]

Cool, maybe people in the west will stop taking Famtisu super seriously? Apparently there is a pretty strong correlation between review scores and ad space bought by publishers with it.

[@ShinigamiOni]

The only deal see that remotely mattered was the mission based DLC. Obviously she was going to be an additional character but they decided to cut out her story or something.

[@oztheimmortal]

My biggest issue with the arguement for the dlc is that, for example, persona 5 released and had dlc. They then expected you to pay for the game again, and for the dlc for Royale. So keeping that in mind, I didn't mind Soul Hacker 2's dlc crisis. It's disgusting but still

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I know what ya mean. Loved SH2

[@oztheimmortal]

@@HallowedBeThyGame honestly. it's a really good game and I think people are too fixated on the flaws outside the game to see and enjoy the game for what it is

[@Miyakolover]

@@oztheimmortal I totally agree...also the comparisons to Persona and mainline SMT are annoying because peopel aren't letting this game be it's own thing.

[@ponytafail354]

That was amazing! Loved your guys take and I agree! Had to wait 2 weeks to get paid to buy the game and I’m really excited for it! To soul hackers 2 boys! You earned a sub!

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

So happy you enjoyed and hope you have as much fun with it as we did!

[@thepaper888]

Don't forget to link your 3ds and Switch accounts, so you can add funds to switch and spend them on 3ds. Until March 2023. Lot of Smt/Persona.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Always a clutch reminder, thanks for spreading the word!

[@ZSleepingDragonZ]

Already played all of the Atlus games on the 3DS, yes including the Etrian Odyssey series.

[@AnosVoldigoad31]

I never listen to reviews. Just ruins the game for other people who wanted to try it.

[@supaipai420]

My issue with a lot of reviews are they are just trashing the games. Im playing Soul Hackers 2 right now and Im enjoying this game and the characters so far!

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Yeah it's been a great game and experience. Hey at least we're having fun

[@supaipai420]

@@HallowedBeThyGame I totally agree with that!

[@drowningin]

Haven't bought it, waiting for a sale as I am swamped with RPGs right now, and despite being an SMT fan this doesn't appeal to me that much. I loved the first Soul Hackers, but this appears to be nothing like it. I wish they could of remade Soul Hackers 1 for modern consoles. I've also heard a lot of negatives about the battle system and dungeons

[@mauricioaguilera3194]

I never had a problem with Tales of Arise ... I played on the hardest difficilty, and fought most enemies on the road ... I don't remember grinding much or ever being short on cash. I despise exp. And money DLC too, but I never felt like I needed them

[@faidou9954]

Looks like this is the end of SMT Spinoff games. What a shame.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I hate to admit it, but I'd assume I'm not as close to a DeSu 3 as I want to be.

[@SEGAblocks]

My issue with the whole debacle is that a lot of people, And I mean ALOT of people have been giving it a bad score and speaking poorly of it even though they haven’t played it yet. If you haven’t even experienced it yet, how can you pass a judgement? That’s like saying I don’t like strawberries, without actually trying them. Very bad take and that whole mentality is old and dated. I myself haven’t had the opportunity to play just yet, but I’m not gonna say this game is a 4/10. Why? Because I literally don’t know yet. People need to stop watching big name review sites and agree with them because they take their word as gospel. Bad take man, bad take lol That being said I am optimistic for this game when I go in. For me dlc and extra paid content doesn’t effect me as I usually just play the base game because I have way too many games to play, but can totally see people’s gripe with the way it’s handled. Pay to play is never a fan favorite lol All that aside, I’m still stoked to play this. Great discussion fellas! Stay awesome my friends! 🤘🙏❤️

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Thanks a ton for weighing in on this man. It really is nuts and then you get a lot of comments saying "I haven't played this but if you do such bad design then it is trash." Herd mentality and group think is alive and well today. And no matter how much we want to pretend we are a race of individuals, mankind is more desperate than ever to be told how to think.

[@SEGAblocks]

@@HallowedBeThyGame Moth to a flame. 🤦🏻‍♂️ haha

[@sonictelephone1526]

Only reason to watch big review sites like IGN or Gamespot is for a laugh and the memes. They only score games based oh how many diversity boxes it ticks or how big a bribe they were paid. You only get genuine reviews from independent reviewers.

[@chrono_s9699]

"Elden Ring didn't release with 3 major questline" This is absolutely false. It didn't release with 3 minor questline that are easily missable anyway. Have played through the game several times since day 1, and can confirm all the major character questlines were present day 1 without any issues.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Lol seeing the resolution to 3 of the biggest and most beloved characters from the game (one being a series staple) ain’t a big deal. 👌

[@chrono_s9699]

@@HallowedBeThyGame again those aren't major questlines. Major questlines refers to the likes of Ranni, Millicent, Hayetta, Fia, Rogair, Dung Eater and Goldmask. Resolution of the ones you are referring to are anything but major and doesn't dictate how the story flows and hardly brings anything substantial to the overarching story. I could see Patches' quest being somewhat important but still not enough to refer it as a "major" questline. Even if you completely ignore all 3 of those, you are not going to miss out on substantial lore pieces, areas to explore, bosses and such.

[@smartmouthriveria]

This is one of my top SMT games .

[@sonictelephone1526]

No gimmicky dungeons, great sounding soundtrack, nice art style, adult characters, more gameplay than dialog? Not played the game yet, but sounds like a great game to me. Minus the day one story DLC... bad, Atlus

[@Miyakolover]

I mean look...I can agree with disliking DLC practices and the game being "Overcharged" (Which honestly I am not sure why 45+ hours isn't good enough for some people)...but to shit on the game entirely just because of these aspects outside of the game is luducrious and I think people should differenciate between the actual game and what's surrounding it. As for the dungions being "repeatitive"...I mean that's pretty much every SMT game and Persona game before P5 and that didn't seem to be much of an issue with these games...and honestly, anyone whining about JRPG's being "grindy" shouldn't be even playing JRPG's in the first place...it just comes with the territory. As for the game "Not being anything new"...I mean, a game doesn't have to re-invent the wheel to be good, so I don't get this argument...it seems like the internet is just being "moody" on that one.

[@dev8582]

These companies have to make $ if the shoe was on the other foot I’m sure your outlook would be different spending 50-100 million to develop a game then selling it for 60-70 hoping to profit so they find a way by adding dlc which is totally optimal

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Everyone understands there has to be opportunities to monetize their games further. My argument is they should explore options that aren't toying with systems that could impact gameplay.

[@Edsaurus01]

I found Soul Hackers.. okay. Not a bad game, not a great game. The characters were interesting, especially Ringo, were interesting, but I found the story flat and kind of predictable. Other than this, I was expecting a cyberpunk SMT but the cyberpunk element was barely present, it was basically a normal SMT story but a little bit in the future? So yeah, for me it was a 6.5/7 or something like that.

[@robdiquattro5590]

Great game even if a little flawed. I’ll never forget Ringo! I’ve learned to never listen to the megaten fan base

[@Kozmo-Kamuy]

We're special were not part of the cult that enjoy hard games sounds like a skill issue

[@SeveredWorldLore]

It's hard not to compare Soul Hackers 2 to Persona 5. They look so similar, only Soul Hackers looks like a downgrade. I'm sure many in the US just see it as a knock off Persona 5. Basically, the bar was set too high with Persona 5 which became the standard for Atlus. This is a different case than being a straight up bad game. I haven't played Soul Hackers 2, but it seems decent. Not my type of game though. Maybe you rate it so high because you didn't have to pay for it.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

I had it preordered and kept my preorder after getting review code.

[@haveagoodday7021]

It's been controversial since it's announcement, at least in the West. From the DLC (which is understandable) to accusations of it "copying" gameplay (its from the same series as SMT and Persona so idk what people are on with this lmao) I personally like the game. Wish the dungeons were better, although that's not as much of an issue to me as it is to a lot of reviewers, I've played worse dungeons lmao, and the DLC wasn't so expensive/locked demons behind it, but the designs are great, the world is vibrant, the game play is great, (Yeah it may be tHe SaMe, but its a good formula so why change it?) I like that the cast is all adults instead of teenagers in a high school, and with that, I like the club idea. Its not 10/10 sure, but below a 7 or a 4?! I don't see that. Maybe its cause I've liked JRPGs more than Western RPGs (both are good, I'm not trying to sound like an obnoxious weeb, but I like the gameplay structure of them more than "open-world do whatever you want, sandboxes.)

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Game for sure isn’t 10/10 but I agree the game was great and there seems to be a double standard in play. Webster rpg formulas have really stagnated for me and reviewers seem to have embraced that open world fad as of late. Thanks for sharing your perspective.

[@haveagoodday7021]

@@HallowedBeThyGame Thanks for the reply 👍

[@VidiverseExplorer]

I think the Legend of Heroes Trails of Cold Steel series was way better than P5, but It's not as popular in the states, and 4 games isn't exactly cheap.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Cold Steel is excellent.

[@sonictelephone1526]

Enjoyed 1 to 3. By 4 it was getting to be a bit of a drag and Rean's long, predictable, motivational speeches were starting to get on my nerves lol

[@VidiverseExplorer]

@@sonictelephone1526 Isn't that what good leaders do? I'll take a motivational speech over a silent protagonist 10/10 times.

[@sonictelephone1526]

@@VidiverseExplorer Well, yeah, but it was just all a bit cheesy towards the end. The "power of friendship defeats everything" trope wears a bit thin after a while if you're older than about 12. Characters never staying dead got a bit tiresome too. Oh look... xxx isn't really dead after all, what a surprise! Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the series as a whole, but I played them all in quick succession during lockdown. And by the fourth game, I really wanted to move on. I played through it mainly to see how it ended. I wasn't going to play through 3 games and then not bother with the conclusion.

[@VidiverseExplorer]

@@sonictelephone1526 Everyone has their own flavors, I've played hundreds of rpgs, and none have gotten me so invested like that series, you can point out certain quirks like Characters never die, power of friendship, ect, but the quirks I find in all the other jrpgs are much more annoying, for a jrpg I consider it among the very best.

[@icarusfluffybottom899]

lol, your first mistake was putting stock in the Famitsu score. The comparison to IGN is apt. They're the big name everyone knows, but that sure as shit doesn't mean their reviews are any more meaningful than other outlets. I don't have a problem with Famitsu or anything, but they're not some shining beacon among Japanese gaming press that always knows what everyone will love. They USED to be well respected because they used to be known as fairly hard critics, but they haven't been like that for years and years and years now.

[@GarnitrexGaming]

Only just starting the vid and hearing about the dlc. And like, is it unusual to play a game on easy, or just toggle the difficulty for a section? No need to buy grinding dlc when easy modes legit simplify just about everything

[@Banehallowed]

Sounds like your all making excuses for a game. Also the story in p3 was the reason why people going back to play it is the reason not the awful dungeon

[@connorharnage6697]

Ok? And why won people give SH2 the same courtesy? The story is pretty good on its own and further elevated by the characters, just like Persona 3

[@itsanditimevarietyshow]

I'm only considering buying the demon dlc

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

It's pretty cool to see Masakado's model from Nocturne in the game. Have fun!

[@nr2676]

Because Soul Hackers 2 is only Devil Summoner by name (detective JRPG series with occult elements from mainline SMT). You don't even summon demons in SH2 like Devil Summoner. SH2 is not bad game, it's bad Devil Summoner game.

[@marcusneal2656]

It's a good game in my opinion it's shin megami tensei and scarlet nexus had a baby.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

That’s a great explanation

[@3nderoX]

The lukewarm reception can be boiled down to people have shit tastes and they're bombing it because of day one DLC. I preordered the game a month before release I've played up to just a little after beating Kaburagi and I'd say it's a fucking great SMT game. My opinion is a lot closer to Famitsu's rating than any of the western ratings or even youtubers I watch I was actually disappointed with several of them and even un-subbed one because I thought their opinion on this game being "mid" was bullshit.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Yeah it’s been a pretty wild experience all together. A get a trove of comments saying it’s mid but are brave enough to include “I haven’t played it yet but”

[@gosukuma9369]

I bought the game and play it for what? 6 hour? THEN I looking at the review from the people on internet and yt and all I see is criticism about how bad the game is. Which I understand and see why. Now here the thing, I have played and completed P5R as my first Persona game and I'm currently playing Nocturne, so I am more or less can see how these 2 are better than sh2. I am a "farmer" myself so I definitely do not mind the grind in any game at all. Tbh the only real problem that I have with sh2 is the fact that they literally just copy paste the soul matrix of your companion. Like come on man at least make each of them unique will ya? Like there only 3 of them tho. Although I am quite disappointed that the press turn is not a thing in this game (which is........idk have already been a thing throughout the megami tensei game). But I don't hate it, I really don't, sure that it is definitely repeatative and there is no thrilling of get to the save point because you can just save at any time that u want. Honestly I wouldn't recommend this game to like any like hardcore gamer tho no, not at all. But a chill game? Yeah probably. The game itself is decent tho, not all that bad but not really all that good. It's just "decent" that all. Usually when I play I don't really think much, I just keep progressing and advance, but I do understand why everyone is so disappointed about sh2 tho.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Thanks for sharing your perspective here. You'll have to let me know what ya think of the rest of the game

[@gosukuma9369]

@@HallowedBeThyGame the first 6 hour of the game is fine, still the farming dungeon that you know love like in Nocturne and p5r, still the character depth and stories like Nocturne and p5r. Overall the game itself is not really bad and the story is literally what actually saved the game but it not enough to make it memorable like the same with Nocturne and P5R tho

[@marcuscheong]

Most likely because it's not Persona 5. The west only wants Persona 5 and when Atlus actually released a game that is not related to Persona 5, they get pissed of. Sure the game is not as good as Persona 5, but the game is not that bad. Release a game with Persona 5 in it's title and the west will go crazy about how good it is. It's also probably the reason why Atlus hasn't made Persona 6. Because people will complain about how it's not as good as Persona 5 and the fact that they could milk the fans of Persona 5. It's also why I think Persona 5 is overrated only because it has now made Atlus unwilling to take risks and make games unrelated to Persona 5. Then, there's also Nintendo fanboys which are angry that the game did not come to the Switch which is really stupid. The game's graphics and gameplay would suffer if it was brought to such an inferior hardware.

[@aceghostrus122]

As someone who bought SH 2 and played a bit of persona 5, I think the bar was set too high! The comparisons are not in favor of SH 2 and people bombed the title with bad reviews, when it didn't deserve it. After 4 playthroughs, I am sure this game is so much fun. For me it's more fun than P5 royal(I cant get myself to finish it, but i will!), but that's me. I love Soul Hackers 2!

[@smartmouthriveria]

I mean, hundreds of hrs of grinding sucks .

[@finnewar]

Persona 6 will have 1 day dlc.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

It sure will.

[@RetroMythologist]

So, is it otherwise a good game?

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

Sure is!

[@allyrose9494]

Only finding this video now but yeah, the not very interesting dungeon design and the god awful dlc practices are the main downsides of the game to me, everything else was good to great

[@frankallen3634]

I hate persona games so I'd never consider this. Especially with the lead character having a terrible figure. Turn based games are just too grindy and slow with stories i find stupid at best

[@ystevenxu]

I think the dungeon design was a major reason why people had such mixed reaction. Especially, considering you need to get to level 5 in soul matrix to get the true ending. They needed more variety in dungeon design, most of it is just bunch of connected hallways. Having said that I still think its a great game 8.5/10. Also, I don't know if famitsu is reliable reviewer considering that they gave ff13 39/40 and ff15 38/40. these games are not on the level of persona 5 which also got 39/40.

[@nr2676]

P5 is not even a best game in series, is not masterpiece.

[@ystevenxu]

@@nr2676 That just your opinion, not the general consensus. Even if you don't consider a masterpiece, it's certainly on different level than Final Fantasy 13, which near perfect score is the reason why I think famitsu is not reliable reviewer.

[@nr2676]

@@ystevenxu FF13 score is a joke

[@ystevenxu]

@@nr2676 famitsu is a joke

[@Miyakolover]

I think Famitsu is more reliable than most western websites when it comes to reviewing Japanese games at the very least...not that I agree with everything they review. Also you have to keep in mind the four reviewers who reviewed FF13 are different from those who reviewed FF15 and from Persona 5...so it's normal to see scores you won't agree with.

[@awdrifter3394]

5:00 Tales of Arise wasn't a good game even playing with all the DLC. If this game is like Tales of Arise, then I'll skip it. Arise changed so much from the previous Tales game that it doesn't even feel like a Tales game anymore. The constant racism talk and shoehorning in Dohalim is such an obvious attempt at pandering to the West, it just put me off as a long time Tales fan.

[@Kozmo-Kamuy]

Trails is better than persona combat

[@Solidreality]

does this game has the same pacing as persona 3 and/or 4? cause thats what made great p3 and 4,going to school,doing social links, cause if is just dungeon crawling i think thats what the issue is

[@Ty_Jac]

The game's pacing is one of the highlights for sure. There is always a perfect amount of story to stay interested before being thrown into dungeons. Sadly soul matrix specifically with its subpar dungeon design puts the game down hard for me. Most everything else is quite alright but not amazing. Better than smtv at least.

[@AnakhaSilver]

"Is this non-Persona game like Persona?"

[@Ty_Jac]

@@AnakhaSilver its a game that tries hard to be more unique in the franchise

[@lanalewis6982]

For me not really loving this game is Ringo herself. The makers of the game ( who also made Tokyo Mirage Sessions FE ) said that she would be relatable and I don't find her to be as such because her personality and things she does in game is a lot to be desired. Also, the Ringo is better than Joker debates online just because she speaks is lame. I heard that she wasn't supposed to be the main character from the developers and they were going to go the Soul Hackers original game route but scrapped it at the last minute. Also the true ending pissed me off. The normal ending made more sense because Ringo is just so not what I want to see in a protagonist from SMT / Persona / Devil Summer, etc. I wished we got more of a sequel than whatever this was supposed to be. But yeah it's weird to not hear too much about the game. I like the game at parts and Saizo is cool but even he can't carry this game which is sad from a certain point. Anyways, it's mid tier like people are saying and the bad DLC practices and other things ( I heard they didn't have a good budget too ) is what really hurts it. Well besides Ringo of course.

[@AnakhaSilver]

"I wished we got more of a sequel" But... Outside Persona and Raidou I think, the SMT games are never "true sequels." They're more or less to denote what to expect from the game. Like, SMT2 and SMT3 have maybe a single point of connection. I'm sorry Ringo being a sassy gremlin (which I'd expect from someone literally born of the Internet) and not a demure waifu is apparently bad???

[@mickeymickey9914]

I can't comprehend the dislike for this. Better than 3 and 5, which are bare bones games.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

There's some legit dislike for this game in the West. Pretty wild.

[@TrueLadyEvilChan]

I find it really disheartening that there's such a legitimate hate for this game. At best, it's mediocre which is fair. It's trying a lot of stuff,new and old. In my opinion, it's not enough to raise red flags. A mediocre game may be disappointing but it's not a complete wash like a terrible game that you can barely play. That's when it'd be more "yikes". I actually am concerned for the future of SMT releases in the west at this rate, due to the (warranted) issues of SMT V and SH2. Persona is fine probably, but we all know how Atlus asks the west constantly if they still want games translated and brung over. At this rate, is it likely that Atlus may reconsider the west as potential profits? That Has some frightening consequences to think about. And the potential and discussion of such perhaps may warrant a video from Hallowed to be honest. Maybe titled "SMT V, Soul Hackers 2 and the future of Atlus"?

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

@@TrueLadyEvilChan thanks for sharing your views on this and I sadly agree, I am concerned I may never see Devil Survivor 3 at this rate.

[@cyberangel9967]

@@TrueLadyEvilChan i don't understand the hate too...at this point Atlus could just refuse to translate any other Atlus game except the Persona games...until the fan base will find reasons to hate the new Persona games too then Atlus will refuse to translate any game to the west period...i hope it doesn't come to that thou...

[@mickeymickey9914]

@@TrueLadyEvilChan It has a great story and really good characters. Better than 3 and 5.

[@omensoffate]

Gee I wonder why famistu scored it a 38/40 hmmm

[@3nderoX]

I actually think it deserved that rating. It doesn't surprise me though that people over here in the US are shitting on it so many people were butt hurt about the day one DLC.

[@Anon9729X]

Of all the SMT guys I trust, you’re the only one praising the game, it’s change’s and it’s terrible dungeon designs. Yeah, imagine comparing it’s copy paste dungeon design to a game released back on the ps2, the damage control is strong 🤦‍♂️

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

So let me get this straight, a great game on PS2 is only good bc of the time period it was made? Persona 3 was good then, and now.

[@3nderoX]

@@HallowedBeThyGame Ps2 was the golden era of JRPGs imo it had some of the best and Persona 3 is arguably the best Persona game including p5 and p5r.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

@@3nderoX ps2 owned then and still crushing it. Great games endure.

[@battleangel8903]

A note about the dungeon discussion and how due to P3's praise and its dungeon design, that invalidates the criticism people have with this dungeon. Persona 3 was about two decades ago. Persona gradually improved on that for a reason and introduced engaging puzzles. SMT V had a stunning overworld design and many things to do throughout it. In terms of modern SMT game design, Soul Hackers 2 is a downgrade and that comparison serves as an unintentional admittance that its two decades outdated in concept. I do not blame people for being disappointed for Soul Hackers 2 for at least trying harder to bring something new to the table in that area since its the expectation set by the latest franchise revitalizations, and this game clearly is an attempt to do the same. That's the area where it fails and why so many take issue with it, and I wanted to clarify that.

[@HallowedBeThyGame]

And what I’m saying is Persona 3 is praised in spite of it. I don’t think just because a game is 2 decades old it can get a pass for having terrible aspects. I played p3 for the first time relatively recently, it’s still good. I’m saying people are hyper inflating criticism and allowing it to paint the whole game of sh2 in a negative light. P3 was good then and now.

[@battleangel8903]

Soul Hackers 2 is two of the three modern revitalization of the SMT series. Specifically regarding the dungeon design, Persona 5 and SMT V improved upon these flaws of its earlier entries, while having room to improve on what's been established. Despite being the youngest of these revitalizations, Soul Hackers 2 suffers from the same flaws the other two games have sincee learned and surpassed regarding the dungeon design. Therefore its the weakest revitalization so far regarding this area, and an important area this is due to the dungeons taking up a majority of the gameplay I will judge it as such. It is not a bad game and is even a good easy going entry point to an extent, but falls flat on the expectation set by modern revitalizations.