What Happens to Rich People Under Socialism?

[@SecondThought]

Howdy, friends! I hope you enjoy the video. If you appreciate the work I'm doing and would like to help support the channel, consider signing up for Nebula with my link! As a little thank you for watching, this link also gets you 40% off: go.nebula.tv/secondthought

[@foryou7673]

Lovely video, like always!

[@prod.arcsyne2990]

I’m doing well, hope you are as well! I really like your content. It feels like a dream though ever being free of capitalism.

[@Tygertec]

socialism + meritocracy, the perfect combo

[@ClassicalTraining]

@SecondThought Hey dude, I have signed up for Nebula a while ago... but it doesn't have Thumbs Up, nor comment. What's up with that? 🤔 How will we bicker?

[@patrick7742]

I disagree with the message of this video. If we want these rich cunts to stop exploiting us and raping our world... We must take it from them, they will not give it up without a fight. To quote Malcom X: "Tactics based solely on morality can only succeed when you are dealing with people who are moral or a system that is moral."

[@CarloEPean]

People always wonder what will happen to the rich under socialism. No one seems concerned with what happens to the poor under capitalism.

[@Praisethesunson]

We are sometimes troubled when we hear how the poor die. We are conditioned every single day to not care how the poor live.

[@goosewithagibus]

Please remember rule 13.5b under chapter 18 of your capitalist rulebook: poor people are worthless and no one should care about them

[@peternicholas3719]

Damn 😔

[@mat3271]

Damn

[@braedenmclean5304]

And socialism is always better if you ignore all the horrible things that happened because of it. But Kids starving because their mothers can’t get enough food to eat is better then everything else. I’m before the “nuh uh, it’s only real socialism when it works”

[@erikkennedy8725]

"Nothing happens to wealthy people except they become less wealthy." Wealthy person- "Nope, that's a fate worse than death."

[@RedRabbitEntertainment]

"Then perish" **soviet anthem blares**

[@kakahass8845]

@@RedRabbitEntertainment Союз нерушимый республик свободных

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

Consider how the wealthy react to the concept of estate taxes. They're literally already dead by the point that comes up, and they still value the money that their dead corpse has legal rights over more than the health of the society they left behind.

[@grayscal3692]

“They want to hunt me for sport?”

[@nathansmith8883]

tbh I evil laugh when I think about the ultra wealthy living among the common people because they will get to see how much better the world is without them in power. Though if we remove the ultra wealthy from there positions we might have to actively protect them because someone will be out to kill them and them being killed wouldn't be the best thing for us even if they are enemies of the common people. For them that's still a kick in the ass.

[@josue.ortega]

They'd go from absurdly, cartoonishly rich to just rich. But that's a hellish nightmare for them.

[@LeahIsHereNow]

That’s because they aren’t very smart. Insane that we exult these people to sainthood and they are idiots. I remember seeing a quote from Jennifer Lopez when she was at the height of her absurd career and she said “I wake up every morning, afraid that I’m going to lose it all.” Then may I suggest you use some of your hoarded resources to go see a psychiatrist because you are bat guano bananas. 🙄

[@CraigKeidel]

What's more hellish is the loss of power removing the profit motive from the system. It's not that they're gonna miss those billions: they're gonna miss being able to live a lawless existence.

[@skyblazeeterno]

Same for the middle class where it's simply a nightmare that they may not be able to afford a new car this year or a second lavish foreign holiday

[@CraigKeidel]

@@skyblazeeterno The middle class is not your enemy, they're trapped in this with us, it just hasn't hit them as hard yet.

[@МихаилЛеонов-э3ъ]

@@CraigKeidel all that is needed is to wait until capitalism begins to strangle the middle class in favor of the rich, when the middle class becomes impoverished, mass movements will begin

[@yaboibobby7776]

I rarely get pushback when I say that the wealthy deserve healthcare, housing, education, personal identity, and freedom; the only time people disagree with me is when I say that the poor deserve the same

[@danielt8727]

Who really pushes back against that?? You might need to find better framing or there's more to your message than just that lol

[@overanalyzing]

I often hear, “why should they?” “Why do they deserve x,y,z?” …and don’t get me wrong I get where they come from, they feel as if some others may feel entitled to greater livelihood or wealth etc. but until they put in the work to get there, it’s just that; self entitlement. But my whole thing is, the minute a human is born into the world they truly are entitled to a fair chance at a balanced life. Stability. Many options to choose from, and overall happiness and contentment. I get that this world is a fallen world and is bound to bring struggle, especially with free will. Free will is a tricky one. Slippy slope if I may lol. Point is, regardless of the laws of natural existence determining that so long as you exist in this world you will struggle to some degree-I personally believe everyone should have an equal balance and experience of struggle. Currently, some folks biggest struggle or sorrow is they can’t close on a 1.2M deal, so they go back to their penthouse and wallow in their misery. Where someone else just down on the ground outside is struggling to obtain a decent place to call home. That’s what’s so bizarre to me and needs to change.

[@cryptomaster278]

I think everyone deserves that problem if it's comes from taxes. There should be a way for government to fund that things like government make a company and the company get profit use it to pay for it

[@estacion7386]

Dont cry man, they already do. The best hospitals money can pay just like any person like you and me 😂

[@chrissolace]

@@danielt8727People that say “oh we don’t want to give handouts… they need to work for it” (even though we could establish a program to assign people to jobs that are needed). I guess the people who are against it are those that don’t like giving away their wealth (taxes) to others for “free”, since they are “lazy”.

[@SeanLumly]

It should be noted that even the rich benefit HUGELY from more equal societies, as the world around them becomes significantly better (eg. lower crime, happier people, cleaner communities, etc). The reduction of desperation should be a PRIORITY for all. Only narcissists (or those under their spell) would argue otherwise.

[@swifts6879]

People like Putin shouldn’t be allowed to benefit though. That’s where violence is genuinely justified.

[@scottandrews947]

@@kingmannar69 Nonsense. They were either handed money from their parents or they exploited people to get where they are. The majority of wealthy people are not great innovators.

[@SeanLumly]

@@faustinpippin9208They most certainly are, as they frequently have to pass through it, hear about it, and worry about it bleeding into their spaces.

[@Draconicrose]

The rich don't care about that because their wealth isolates them from those problems. As in, they rarely even see people suffering from that.

[@endcaps1917]

@kingmannar69 emerald mine

[@modestproposal9114]

Thing is, the oligarchs aren't going to give up their power without a vicious, underhand, and bloody fight against anyone trying to bring about change.

[@yotimyodoggggg]

I was waiting for somebody to make this point. The 1% will unleash hell itself to hold onto power.

[@gianlucamattos8684]

Like a kid with it's toy, they don't want to hand it back, even if it wouldn't be the end of the world for them, i think they may live just as much as us in the so called capital realism

[@adomelka]

Thing is, if enough people stand together they can do nothing about it.

[@modestproposal9114]

@adomelka a few things they have done over the years: divide and rule, infiltration and internal sabotage, bribery and blackmail of leaders, smears and propaganda, fabricating crimes, subverting elections, proscribing groups or activies like protest, prison, violence, assassination.

[@kaitlyncarey3269]

There’s a lot of people willing to die for this cause though i feel

[@poenpotzu2865]

What I fear is that in times of turmoil and revolution; the ruling class will do many horrible things to prevent it. Such as mobilized assault, unjust imprisonment, and more. These kind of acts may inspire more drastic measures and make people more willing to be violent. But overall I agree the key virtue and ideals socialism is that everyone gets their fair share and due.

[@grant3583]

They literally already do-the police, military, and PMC are all lackies of the capitalist class. The capitalists have sooooo much blood on their hands.

[@SnowTerebi]

Oh totally, they'll show their true face.

[@biharcourt]

They would deserve the retort in that case.

[@MLCommy]

Aren't they doing that now? When companies have an argument, "Does curing cancer help us make a profit," to sicking the police, national guard, and military on protestors, they're showing ugly every day. The best way to prevent this is to get support from the police, military, and National Guard to see our side. When that happens, what "force" do the wealthy indeed have? Do you really expect Bezos and his billionaire/millionaire friends to fight us?

[@Maleriandro]

that is why almost every revolution had to be violent. The ones in power will not give it up easy. They will lobby, they will ban, and they will ultimately kill, in order for the status quo not to change.

[@shigshug8581]

Would be great to see an episode about adult children living with parents because wages are preventing them from renting a decent apartment.

[@AB-ee5tb]

😅

[@punkysnarks]

I'll star in it.

[@kolossis8283]

​@@punkysnarks same

[@redlady222]

As a parent of a teenager, I am 100% preparing for this. He has no chance if we don’t help him come up with a realistic plan for after school. This notion of ‘kick your kids out when they’re 18’ is ludicrous. I expect him to work on his career, but my job as a parent is to provide support. It’s a different world than when I grew up.

[@JuniorWA]

this is how i live and thank god i have asian parents who embrace it

[@ashmarten2884]

As some bloke once said: “The very concept of "revolutionary violence" is somewhat falsely cast, since most of the violence comes from those who attempt to prevent reform, not from those struggling for reform. By focusing on the violent rebellions of the downtrodden, we overlook the much greater repressive force and violence utilized by the ruling oligarchs to maintain the status quo, including armed attacks against peaceful demonstrations, mass arrests, torture, destruction of opposition organizations, suppression of dissident publications, death squad assassinations, the extermination of whole villages, and the like.”

[@jason59k55]

those who make peaceful revolution impossible make violent revolution inevitable - JFK (which is ironic)

[@EclecticoIconoclasta]

In Colombia they murdered thousands of people of a whole leftist party (Unión Patriótica) in the 80s-90s and in Indonesia in the 60s with the help of the US they murdered between 500,000 and 1 million leftists. It clearly shows socialists have an interest in preserving human rights

[@rickb3650]

The bottom line is that Frederick Douglass was exactly right when he told us that "power concedes nothing without a demand". Violence is the sole prerogative of power, and the powerful will always resort to it when threatened with the real or perceived loss of power. It doesn't matter which brand of power is in charge because power is all that matters to the powerful.

[@t.7124]

Funnily enough, the transition to capitalism was not bloody and didn't involve anything more than institutional changes in governance and the introduction of a market economy. In fact, it was probably the most peaceful and natural transition of human society in history, which may contribute to why we still live under capitalism many hundreds of years later. This channel, which aligns itselfwith Marxism-Lenninism (the Bolsheviks, infamous for overthrowing a democratic election and going on a killing spree to gain and maintain their power) advocates for the exact conditions highlighted in this video: police violence, artificial poverty, imperial wars, and hierarchical structures in society. Conveniently, he phrases his arguments as "socialism doesn't involve regularly killing rich people" but omits that it is necessary for a Marxist-Lenninist socialist revolution. He never goes into specific details on what his idea of a socialist system would actually address and replace the issues that capitalism does currently. On a global scale, there is not enough resources for everyone to share. And in the West, where we do live in post-scarcity for many resources, the biggest issue that capitalism addresses is that of distribution, which may also be why Amazon is so profitable. The revolution he advocates for definitely will be a bloody one, but who is to say what will happen after that revolution? Will we have a Stalin, a Mao, a Pol Pot ruling us? Edit: Read 'The Origin of Capitalism' by Ellen Meiksins Wood. She is a marxist but details a critical look into the malignant growth and spread of capitalism. Check out this lecture series on pre-industrial society and the economic transition into the industrial revolution. The man behind these lectures is a capitalist economist but most of the points he ends up making advocates against our current economic model: kzbin.info/aero/PL_w_qWAQZtAYqD1KnrMdZ5vpxyNUlq_rr Just because I am critical of grifters and misinformation doesn't mean I am not a socialist, and yet to Marxism-Leninists, I may as well be Thatcher. If you want to replace capitalism, you must replace the necessity of human labour and provide strong social welfare.

[@mickeyg7219]

@@t.7124 If you mean feudalism evolving into capitalism, then it's nothing similar to capitalism transitioning to capitalism. Many western countries still have nobles and monarchs, why is that? Because capitalism is not a polar opposite of feudalism, it merely add a option for people to become the ruling class without limiting them to bloodline. Nobles and monarchs still keep their power because they're already rich, so they persisted because they're already a proto-capitalist before the transition (don't you know that Saudi and UK royal families, for example, own many businesses?). So of course transitioning from feudalism into capitalism is relatively peaceful because it doesn't threaten the ruling class, and that's why western powers traditionally supported monarchies during the Cold War.

[@inyobill]

Hence, the empty promises of Supply-Side Economics.

[@vladdumitrica849]

​@@mickeyg7219But wasn't the transition from feudalism to capitalism during Cromwell's time violent? What about the transition in France? The transition from monarchical absolutism to the republic was generally bloody

[@mickeyg7219]

@@vladdumitrica849 Yes, but make no mistake, anti-monarchism is not a mandatory aspect of capitalism. We know UK eventually returned to monarchism, but it's still capitalist. Also, French Revolution have a strong working class radicalism in it, which is why there's another revolution about a century later. Republicanism predated capitalism and is a whole different concept, it's wrong to equate both as one and the same. Capitalism can and do thrive under monarchy.

[@shybard]

Imagine only owning two mansions and one yacht. The horror.

[@kingking-ci1gf]

landlords doing the hard decision to raise rent on a single mother with four mouth to feed so he can buy another yacht

[@LeahIsHereNow]

The notion that ANYONE deserves to hoard resources when children are dying due to a lack of food, shelter and clean water is criminal.

[@aryangowda1551]

These are the billionares though, what about the modern millionares? Won't it affect them much more(i.e standard of living). Since billionares can pretty much retain they're same lifestyle the life of milllionares are more to be impacted I think.

[@Nicole_Gumm_994]

Ben Shapiro would never!! 😯😂😂

[@bluebird5173]

I can only dream of owning half a mansion.

[@nemiloszorka1162]

Talking about rich and poor, when I was a kid, growing up in socialist Yugoslavia, my parents were working in a bank. Back then, there were laws that prohibited that the difference in income between highest paid person in a company, and a lowest income person was not to be more than 4:1. So, if a cleaning lady (let's say) makes 1.000 USD per month, a CEO can make no more than 4.000 USD. On the other hand, 1.000 USD was quite enough to make a living: pay the rent, bills, purchase food, clothing, and even leave some small amount on the side (my parents were getting 1.500 USD each month, and we went to the seaside each summer, and sometimes spend winters in some mountain lodge or something like that). Now this difference of 3.000 USD/month was enough that you could purchase a two bedroom flat each 2 years (around 60-70.000 USD per unit). So, if you are a CEO of a big company for 20 years (let us ignore 15 years of work to get to that position), you would be able to own 10 two bedroom flats by the time that you retire. And the cleaning lady could, maybe, purchase 1 flat. Now, of course, you were not allowed to own that much property, but it gives you an image to understand what were the "theoretical" differences in Socialist Yugoslavia. I have to mention that Yugoslav socialism was nothing like USSR, or Chinese socialism, since in this model companies were owned by the workers working there, and not the state. They were actually shareholders of a company, and the company had freedom to decide what to produce, where to sell it, to determine the price etc. Of course, government did intervene, but there was much more economic freedom than in USSR. The point of this is that even under socialist rule you can still make much more than some other participant in economy, but not billions times more. Yugoslav government was setting a limit on how much you can be rich. Some other democracies today regulate that with progressive tax. And in the end, is it really so important to own 3, or 5, or 10 billions more money than some poor sod working at you plant? Owning 10 times more is really high enough.

[@ender_z4nd3r83]

what if what the CEO does made the company make more than 4 times what the cleaning guy makes the company make, the CEO should then deserve more than 4 times what the cleaning guy earns

[@duckyduck2108]

​@@ender_z4nd3r83the ceo only makes the decisions. The workers are the ones doing all the work, thus the ceo doesnt deserve as much pay as he gets in a capitalist society.

[@iwansays]

​​@@ender_z4nd3r83 Workers are called WORKers for a reason. The credit should not only go to the individual who has the idea, but also to the people who run the idea. Otherwise, they'd just be running the standard issue bad practices of capitalism; putting profit above everything Edit: And let's not pretend becoming the "cleaning guy" is a simple task.

[@ender_z4nd3r83]

@@iwansays I didn't say workers dont deserve recognition, and I know cleaning is not easy, I survived 2 years of my life by cleaning apartments 24/7

[@master_spike]

@@ender_z4nd3r83 This is the 'marginalist' theory of value and it is one of many 'theories of value' that Marxists reject. The labour theory of value, as originally posited by Adam Smith and expanded upon by Marx, determines that the value of a produced commodity as the socially necessary labour time it takes to produce them. In reality, 'value' cannot be quantified, and is only done so for trade purposes (exchange-value), and the only true values of a commodity are use-values (i.e. what a commodity is used for) and is a qualitative trait, not a quantitative one. The labour theory of value holds true when we observe statistics of the price of various goods and the total labour hours worked to produce and distribute them, only breaking from this trend on certain natural resources (oil/gas for example) that form natural monopolies, which can be explained by the Ricardian theory of rent.

[@choops321]

When I went to Cuba earlier this year, I went on a tour through a neighborhood full of mansions. My tour guide said this is where rich people used to live under the former dictatorship. I asked what happened to them after the revolution? Were they thrown out of their homes? I was told of course not. Everyone kept their homes. If they left the country, their servants were given the home.

[@asscheeks3212]

Mansions are usually owned by the government hierarchy, replace one with the other.

[@alexmorrison3442]

How does one go on this tour?

[@AssBlasster]

*Cubans from Miami are typing away in the chat*

[@choops321]

@@alexmorrison3442 best bet is when you reserve an Airbnb in Havana, tell your host you want a walking tour and a driving tour. They will arrange it. They all have connections like that. Driving tours are even easier to find. Pick the classic car of your choice and negotiate a price.

[@asscheeks3212]

@AssBlasster "opinions from minorities living in USA don't matter, unless they put X after Latin" -Americans.

[@AmbasingKam-dr6yu]

When people think they are fighting for their country, but they actually doing all that for the rich and greedy politician😭

[@Donkor640]

You’re dead on! Just about every war has been about rich people asserting their power. They sit out of harm’s way and come out of it even richer! In the US it’s been happening since the Mayflower landed, they forced the Poor to go west and fight the Native Americans with the promise that they too could own land. The rich sat on their asses until the coast was clear and then moved in and hustled the poor uneducated out of their gains. Then they just kept repeating the process.

[@jcgongavoe337]

2 replies: null

[@Donkor640]

@@jcgongavoe337 you’re so insightful. Maybe you should write a book?

[@jamesrocket5616]

Basically the Sinophobes and warmongers from my country right now

[@UNIVERSEGINAHAND-t3e]

It's easy to bash politicians it's for lazy minds fact is politicians like trump lost money according to the general accounting office when in office

[@cluelessmango768]

I mean, "nothing will happen" is kind of incorrect because if rich people were held financially responsible for their mistakes they would very quickly become very very poor people...

[@goatfish480]

I mean. They'd go from billionaires to millionaires and still be fine. I wouldn't know what to do if I made a 100 million a year let alone a billion

[@nathanmcbow158]

Probably would not go that far, chances are their assets would more than cover for their transgressions, after all most of them have plenty of skeletons in their closets and in order to compensate, they have funds squirreled away just in case they are exposed. A stupid thing really, they could just use those funds to clean up their act but no... They would prefer to keep the money and only spend it when there is no other choice.

[@unconsistentone5385]

define "poor", if you mean not a billionaire anymore then yes, but if you mean they won't be able to afford living then no. Everyone gets a relatively equal size of the pie and nobody gets to take 90% of the pie

[@Stlthangs]

This is the thing tho. Most rich peoples mistakes can be financially tied to corporate institutions meaning those institutions will pay for the mistakes minimizing the overall personal responsibility one person or a family may have to bear.

[@grahamflorida5942]

While going from a few billion (or dozens of billions) in assets to a few million might SEEM like becoming poor to them, the current ultra wealthy would still end up with relatively more than the rest of us, even with asset redistribution. While they may not have liquid billions, billionaires have enough liquidity to live a few lifetimes over if all of their assets disappear.

[@mtaus7337]

the problem is we are to affraid what would happen to rich people under socialism, that what is happening now with poor people in capitalism. There arethousands of people die each day of hunger and curable diseases just so that a few people can be filthy rich.

[@HamzaTalksFootball]

I heard somebody put it perfectly in a video recently. In response to somebody posing this as a challenge, he said something along the lines of, "when we say eat the rich, we are not talking about people with a big house or a fancy car. We're not talking about people who have a few million dollars. You can't even comprehend how much even one billion is. You wish you were who we are referring to when we say eat the rich". In reality, people who ask these questions, are, like the rest of us, closer to poverty than they are being a billionaire. Then again, it does make that Steinbeck quote about socialism not taking route in America due to people viewing themselves not as an oppressed class but as temporarily embarrassed billionaires.

[@VecheslavNovikov]

You're right, but our family mill and home was still taken away. There's reason to be wary and dangers in the ambiguity, so this stuff needs to be discussed more.

[@JohnBham]

No guillotines? No mass trials? No gulag? Where's the fun in that?

[@UTKETCHUP]

lol yes

[@Nota-Skaven]

Do we have to kill the wealthy? Of course not, it's about sending a message :3

[@piccalillipit9211]

We all know there's going to be some guillotines and gulags. He's just trying to reassure the rich people.

[@matthewvicendese1896]

Yeah I'm out.

[@Whocares512]

Man, I was hoping to remove them through, ahem, "the French" way.

[@johannageisel5390]

Oh, they'll receive the most imhumane treatment! They will be limited to a two bedroom apartment, have to work a normal job and will even have to take public transport! It'll be atrocious!

[@poenpotzu2865]

So basically still better than my life😂

[@oneofthegoodonesok]

Good. They'll know what it's like to be less materialistic and back to where they came from.

[@TheCrazyCapMaster]

@@poenpotzu2865precisely, except you’ll have all that too by default 🤣

[@johannageisel5390]

@@poenpotzu2865 The good news is that you're getting the same if you don't have it already! :)

[@Praisethesunson]

​@@oneofthegoodonesokThey come the Hamptons.

[@Guilherme-nv5wq]

Fico muito feliz de ver um KZbinr tão expressivo falando honestamente sobre socialismo.

[@wearytraveler-x6t]

Bom dia, camarada!

[@nathanmcbow158]

A functional socialist society has always sounded as a much more ethical world to live in. Capitalism has proven time and time again that it does not work for most of us in the long run, hell even the people on the top have everything but at the same time they have not learned a damn thing.

[@wickedpanik8304]

​​@aluisious I mean, the prize for them is living vicariously as they watch others ☠️ while on their yacht yachts and ISS escape pod. Then write a long winded sympathy note they'll call "History".

[@Matzu-Music]

It's not cancer, it's stage 4 cancer!

[@saxor96]

​​@@cberg2655484Oh my... What would be a "True capitalist society" in your eyes?

[@Greatkingrat88]

Capitalism has seen an unprecedented, dramatic rise in quality of life, education and political rights. It has _absolutely_ worked out well for most people across the world.

[@saxor96]

@@Greatkingrat88 > Raise in quality of life For a few people, the rest be damned. > Education Student debt says otherwise. > and political rights ..... No??? Political rights were born because of fierce *opposition* to the then capitalist status quo. A compromise in spite of capitalism doesn't make those rights "Thanks" to it, quite the opposite.

[@Kamrat35]

I agree that bonking billionaires is not the solution, but I also think it's important to understand that bonking billionaires is going to be an inevitable part of socialist revolution. Most of the time, they are not going to let go of their ownership and power voluntarily, and there are imperialist states who are more than willing to fund their fight to retain power. It's all well and good to reintegrate them into society whenever possible, but that's not going to be the case most of the time.

[@lowkeydemodest8381]

Indeed and I bet a shit ton of millionaires are probably hate watching this video lol

[@Spyrothecat]

Yes I don’t usually disagree with JT but any attempt at socialist revolution in the global north would culminate in full on class warfare - which would make bonking the rich a focus to achieve the goal

[@musclestruts5032]

​@@lowkeydemodest8381probably explains the "debunking" points against socialism that have been countered numerous times before, many on this very channel.

[@coolioso808]

What if we beat them at their own game? That would be brilliant! We don't have to 'bonk' them, but we can persuade them, maybe even shame them a little for their egregious insane wealth. But I think the ultimate system change would be where some conscious millionaires and billionaires see investment into innovative community co-operatives as the best choice for their future because they will get gratitude, respect and contribute to a healthier future that way. Just see how the One Small Town Contributionism structure is set up to keep at least 60% of the co-operative projects co-owned, while also giving space for investors to get tokens of appreciation as well.

[@ronintage]

what happens if people within a socialist economy decide to puruse capitalism through democratic means?

[@aliceputt3133]

Rich people would have to pay their taxes. That’s it. They also will have to quit bribing Officials and actually pay their employees a living wage. This means that they won’t be profiting like they did before but they will still be incredibly rich. I currently believe many of them to be somewhat mentally ill that they are trying to overthrow our democracy just to avoid taxes and regulations.

[@Pandora234able]

I partially agree with this one. I don’t think people in their position are going to easily concede power. I think, as a last resort, being punitive might mean saving humanity from annihilation. It’s not a pleasant or optimistic approach but it’s a conversation that needs to be had, too.

[@birdiewolf3497]

See where he loses me is that the people in charge will not concede power, use members of our class as pawns to keep it. Those people are the ones that are gonna face the harm. The rich are shielded from the violence and the consequences of said violence. And if they lose, they get to live in peace? What? That doesn’t sit right with me.

[@sebastiangorka200]

@@birdiewolf3497 well the point is that the ones who will not go peacefully will face the consequences

[@birdiewolf3497]

@@sebastiangorka200 How are we defining “going peacefully?” Again they aren’t directly involved in. They’ll call on the government to “uphold the law and order.”

[@sebastiangorka200]

@@birdiewolf3497 well lets take a historical example. in the october revolution, taking over the central government and local governments was a mostly peaceful affair. the refusing to go peacefully part came with the counter revolution of kornilovs uprising then after that failed the subsequent gathering of reactionaries in southern russia where they all met up to plot a full on violent revolt. as you can imagine thats a thing that costs money. giving money and instructing such actions is refusing to go peacefully. we can shift that analysis back too. calling for "law and order" and doing nothing else? meh. calling for "law and order" and then giving money/resources/manpower/intel/etc to the government to do that? thats calling for some consquences. not very peaceful. are you taking this on board?

[@birdiewolf3497]

@@sebastiangorka200 That’s fine. As long as it includes execs backing lobbying efforts, funding initiatives for cop cities, if they are donating to (buying) certain candidates to back antisocialist policies, etc.

[@Kite403]

It's pure sociopathy to NOT want the world around you to be a better place, even if it doesn't benefit you. Because, fun fact, when everyone does well, EVERYONE does well!

[@podemosurss8316]

A nitpick: the one who became member of the Chinese National People's Congress wasn't Puyi but his younger brother Puchie. Puyi became a contemporary historian, writing books about late Imperial and post-Imperial China, including an auto-biography called "The Last Emperor" (which is a must-read for anyone interested on the China of the era).

[@billyma6]

i’m assuming you mean Pujie?

[@podemosurss8316]

@@billyma6Yes, in my version of Puyi's memoirs his name was transcripted as Puchie.

[@RoanShip]

⁠@@podemosurss8316 I think the only thing wrong he said is that Puyi didn’t had any power at all when he became emperor, first he was a child and that when he became old enough the Dinasty is already dead

[@podemosurss8316]

@@RoanShip Yeah, there was a Regency under his father and the late Emperor's Queen Consort, which surrended in 1912 to the revolutionaries. It was a mess. Puyi tries to explain things a bit in his memoirs.

[@RoanShip]

@@podemosurss8316 they made a film about him, which was more of a “showing pity of Puyi” cause he had everything since as a child and then had to learn everything such as tying shoes and putting on clothes, also he was the only emperor to have to pay to go to his house

[@forcastfascistfuture]

This is a really important point and one that is particularly useful to your audience. A lot of socialists don't seem to really grapple with this concept very well as it's such an emotionally provocative topic. An unfortunate reality of KZbin is that a lot of content really only reaches those already converted, and it's just preaching to the choir. But this is a message that is equally valuable to both the left and the right, so it has more power to legitimately change minds.

[@memerminecraft585]

This is something I've become concerned with as of late. We can't make any significant changes in order to solve the big problems (climate change, salt cycle destabilization, etc.) because nobody gets the same information. Since nobody gets the same information, nobody agrees. If nobody agrees, solutions are out of reach. And it's a result of these machine-learning algorithms designed to increase watch times, which drive profits for incredibly powerful tech companies. So how are we supposed to tear down these digital walls?

[@CommieApe]

If at some point there is any powerful socialist presence in the US at all it would always be met with violent suppression. Weve seen that time and time again in the past. Any conflict that ends with a principled socialist government in charge implies billionaires and corporations having been suppressed.

[@alexjeffrey3981]

Yep, Allende tried the fully peaceful approach. The revolution, even if achieved democratically, has to be defended against counterrevolution.

[@derpherp1810]

In the long run it won't matter, we die or we win the billionaires will always loose because in the end we will be free one way or another. Should they salt the earth and bring this world to ruin they will be the last to survive and they will come to terms with their crimes as they starve on a world they destroyed. We will all be smiling six feet under whilst they learn the true meaning of agony and suffering. It will be all their fault.

[@KarlSnarks]

The only suppression should be making sure billionaires have no access to the systems they used to stay in power. If they don't have access to exorbitant wealth they have no power. They might still have fame and connections they could use to get things done though, not sure how to tackle that issue

[@patrick7742]

Yup, I disagree with this message of this video. If we want these rich cunts to stop exploiting us and raping our world. We must take it from them, they will not give it up without a fight. To quote Malcom X: "Tactics based solely on morality can only succeed when you are dealing with people who are moral or a system that is moral."

[@alexjeffrey3981]

@@KarlSnarks study socialist history, dozens of movements have had to deal with these exact problems and much of that conflict is documented

[@carnigoth]

We eat them of course

[@gpwnedable]

Ewwwww

[@macomputersuck]

Do millionaires or billionaires taste better?

[@icemanstrange6185]

​@@macomputersuckyes.

[@carnigoth]

​​@@macomputersuckwe will find out. I have a feeling they all taste disgusting

[@Anonymoose66G]

@@macomputersuck Definitely billionaires, their a more exotic cuisine.

[@sonja5215]

omg under socialism billionaires might have to pay for the consequences of their own actions 😱😭😰

[@sophiepooks2174]

Why do you think they loathe the idea of democratic socialism.

[@bavingates2502]

​@@sophiepooks2174I understand what you're saying but remember socialism and democratic socialism are labeled as 2 different things. Like I said ik what you meant but democratic socialism is the "socialism" most of Europe functions under currently.

[@mo-s-]

​@@bavingates2502No, they're both socialism. What you mean is social democracy not Democratic socialism

[@badart3204]

@@bavingates2502Europe uses social democracy not democratic socialism. The state does not own the industry. Modern Europe is more of a New Deal offspring than socialism

[@ashkitt7719]

That's social democracy. @@bavingates2502

[@jacksonduruy4303]

Perhaps an important note about Puyi, the last Emperor of China part of the reason he was able to be "rehabilitated" was largely because all sides of the political spectrum in China hated the institution of Emperor at that point. The Imperial House had collaborated with the Japanese making them universally loathed, there were no "Whites" in China, unlike in Russia, desperately trying to reinstall him.

[@stevensines7026]

You're forgetting one key element that got the ultra-rich where they are. Personal ego. Most of them exploited subordinates simply because they value themselves far higher than anyone else. They feel they earned it and deserve it, every time. Even in cases of foolish self-glorification they still value their own efforts far beyond others. That is not given up lightly.

[@Praisethesunson]

Exactly. A rabid dog cannot be convinced. It can only be caged or put down.

[@elijahculper5522]

Even people who inherited everything they own think they deserve it more than the rest of us. Wealthy people are all narcissists. They’re antisocial people who are a threat to civil society. Something has to be done about billionaires and I’m not confident that we can re-educate these people. Leftists have a hard enough time convincing working class people to vote in their own self interest. I’m not confident that we are gonna be able to convince billionaires that we don’t owe them anything.

[@cosmefulanito5052]

You're kidding, right? Ego don't got them where they are. They have an inflated ego BECAUSE the position they are in. The material conditions one is born into shapes your ideology and not the other way around.

[@musclestruts5032]

​@@cosmefulanito5052agreed, we need to treat them as psychologically unwell people

[@ronintage]

@@cosmefulanito5052 let's act like genes and neurobiology has absolutely nothing to do with that

[@kieranobrien9067]

I was hoping we would get to eat them, I was kinda curious what caviar raised human tasted like.

[@johannageisel5390]

Salty, mostly.

[@nathanmcbow158]

I have heard from a few sources that it is like pork, or veal. Still the mental anguish would warrant a flavor of it´s own I reckon.

[@valerietaylor9615]

Long pork.

[@gatube2362]

they taste like chicken

[@badart3204]

In China they did that to them and their families along with torture and gang r@pe of the children as well. One instance I read was a daughter of a landowner being assaulted 47 times then cut up and eaten alive. I don’t believe any moral person would support this and hope you are being hyperbolic because this is what you wish for looks like because people aren’t going to descriminate.

[@tonydupinnyc6830]

Hi there, Second Thought! Just wanted to let you know that I've been listening to your content for some time now (incredibly informative) and that I've just signed up for Nebula with your special deal. Thank you for all that you do; I'm doing what I can to support your important work. Cheers!

[@LoudSunshine]

Honestly, I think the rich would prefer die, because becoming a worker is a fate worse than death for this kind of people

[@jasonrobinson401]

They'll use half their wealth to keep the other half theirs. The only "peaceful" way is to make their money worthless, so they can keep the money, but not the power or influence. They'll still get so mad they'll shit their pants, but they won't be able to do anything about it with worthless Weimar bucks.

[@Praisethesunson]

Finally! A wish from the rich I am willing to grant.

[@dabigboss8191]

Most billionaires worked their way up to that wealth by working harder and longer hours than your lazy ass, who has no ambition to take any risks. I do agree that the rich are often corrupt, but to say that they are lazy is stupid@@Praisethesunson

[@softpucks9642]

Nooooo i need to spend a billion dollars so I can eat dinner in space instead of using my money on something useless like “saving the planet”

[@JassonCordones]

nothing a trip to a reeducation camp in Siberia cannot fix

[@DanGartman]

Watching these videos and listening to your podcast has put me in a place where I constantly see the problems with capitalism in a new light. Now I spend much of my time dreaming up how our society could be different and trying to find ways to make it happen. It's torture in the best possible way.

[@thecutebearslaboratory111]

me too man

[@coolioso808]

Here's one way you might really enjoy: One Small Town Contributionism with Michael Tellinger. A simple, yet smart way to use cooperation, collaboration and co-ownership to the collective advantage of the people, for the people, in a community of willing volunteers.

[@sydneyjackson2962]

Same

[@Zayden.]

What about getting organized to actually bringing about socialism?

[@thecutebearslaboratory111]

Bro, i live in Denmark the least corrupt country in the world and one of the leading social-democratik nations. Also i'm 15, the most i can do is join the youth socialsts, which i'm currently trying to @@Zayden.

[@grahamflorida5942]

I love your videos, mate. They're clear to the point of what should unite leftists. Talking about what occurs at protests and trying to point out that it's a response to police brutality is a hard balance to achieve, especially when the various news channels want to spin it like the police were responding to protest violence. They fired tear gas into a coffee shop where people were being treated for tear gas on South Grand here in St. Louis, but it was the "violent protesters" that were condemned by our local media. I know officers that were bullied into resigning because they tried to raise awareness to the lack of accountability post-protest in Ferguson. Sadly, I fear capitalists will do their best to undermine any and all attempt at a peaceful transition to the future, and things will get worse before they get better, and we will carry the brunt of the blame in the eyes of the public as the capitalists own the ability to propagandize movements on a massive scale.

[@carrieullrich5059]

They own that news channel, stop watching it. They don't deserve revenue for ads shown to you.

[@lana-jg4ho]

@@carrieullrich5059 but everyone still watches it!!!!!!!! even the most "anti-fake news" people ;__; it drives me insane!!! across the entire political spectrum, the news is just there to make us REACTIONARY as fuck (left and right and "in between")

[@Mitjitsu]

5:50 - Completely neglecting how all his other associates were treated. He was only spared for politically motivated reasons by his successors. He was also given highly preferential treatment in terms of the roles he was given and where he was allowed to live compared to the rest of the population.

[@laguerilla_proletaire]

we [redacted] them- kidding we introduce scientific socialism and seize their assets to fund publically own environmental reconstruction projects also all sorts of workers endeavours, non-profit innovations etc

[@transsexual_computer_faery]

what do you do when their private security personell comes after you.

[@joedavenport5293]

That's why I like credit unions over banks. Credit unions can only earn 1 percent profits. Anything over that has to be given to the members or re-invested

[@WanderingExistence]

Cooperatives are the way ✌️

[@clearrighttoknow4775]

I am down for that

[@justaname2422]

Really good video. Honestly clears up a lot of misconceptions.

[@Caitlin_TheGreat]

Many of the ideas of violence come _from_ the Capitalists / super-wealthy who'd be losing their method of wealth accumulation and hoarding. And that makes sense, the methods of exploiting workers for the personal gain of the Capitalist is inherently violent in nature and often involved more violence than strictly necessary as Capitalists aren't just unfeeling robots using "logic" to get ahead. They are people who will want to assert their superiority over workers in addition to just extracting as much of the wealth for themselves. And part of asserting that supposed superiority is in causing unnecessary harm to workers in any of a number of ways. Refusing work-from-home isn't super profitable, in many ways it'd be more profitable to allow it... but then they may not be able to insure that a worker is being fully exploited, and worse still a worker might be able to enjoy themselves -- and nothing makes a capitalist more angry than a worker being happy (even if that would net the capitalist greater income). The rest of the suggestions of violence will come from those who are understandably very angry about how they've been cheated and mistreated by the capitalists, but who haven't learned much of socialism or the generally connected tenets of humanism and generally want the best for all people... and that's typically because the capitalists have used their power to prevent that sort of education... instead favoring more violence-oriented media, often as a way to desensitize the public to the sorts of violence committed against other members of the populace by Capitalists and/or the agents of Capitalists: the police. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- And while I can't say it's necessarily a primary element of Socialism itself, it's usually deeply intertwined that Socialists will want for all people to primarily receive every opportunity at redemption, at reform rather than any kind of punitive action. But... I'm sure most Capitalists and those who'd happily serve as their fists know that they would almost certainly engage of extreme acts of terror and extreme violence against socialists. Lying, cheating, stealing, and harming/killing (usually with a lot of plausible deniability for such crimes) are all common tactics used by Capitalists now with almost no threat to their power. If they thought they could wind up on equal footing and expected to do any actual work for the common good... yeah, they'd be flipping out and war-criming all over the place.

[@chrisparsons2791]

We need more people like you J.T. your no nonsense explanations are the best way to educate others. Keep up the good work bro!

[@diegolar]

okay but the real question is: would we still have youtube ads under socialism?

[@xanderjames8682]

Probably but less

[@1May1312]

When new leftists ask where they can learn more, I always send them to your channel. Those of us who have experience organizing and studying dialectical materialism sometimes lose sight of what's like to be a newbie. Thank you for remembering the newcomers and meeting them where they are!

[@DokesConspiracyNetwork]

I wish leftist and right wingers would wake tf up and realize all this red vs blue, black vs white ect is just Hegelian dialectic. The 3rd party never wins. All this is rigged in every form of government. Voting doesn't matter. I don't got a answer but I know the problem. The problem is buying into the idea of there only being 2 sides and you can only choose one. None of that's real, wake up

[@Spobbles69420]

Then where do you send the rural Americans who work for what they own and who are lambasted by elite liberals and called racist and idiot for wanting to own a pistol to shoot snakes.

[@CraigKeidel]

​@@holdencaulfield9470wat

[@frohnatur9806]

If billionaires get to keep (most of) their money, how would we make sure they don't use it to corrupt the system again and slowly lead it back towards capitalism via lobbyism?

[@WolfHagenSdW]

Always remember: The last drop of fuel, won't go to riding to work, but to warm up the bosses home.

[@mrping2603]

Please keep making these videos!! I'm actively using this information to reform my workplace in ME, USA

[@bpnation37]

This channel is truly excellent. Every video you post directly addresses any issue that a person could have with socialism directly and comprehensively. These damn videos should be streamed internationally, by force if need be

[@jsnx9067]

"by force" spoken like a true socialist

[@theonlymegumegu]

9:36 this part reminded me of a quote that lives very near the top of my mind, and i really wish i remember where i got it. "A protest agreeable to the oppressor will not end oppression."

[@glomman]

I'm glad that you continue to be a voice of reason in this debate, very good video, JT

[@ronintage]

what debate? he's not debating anyone this is a video essay lol

[@mksmike]

I guess the only difference is that they become less wealthy and have less control over the government. So they'd still be rich, just not untouchable.

[@brandontrammel4581]

Exactly

[@Chris-ey5cu]

- What's considered shameful and worthy of mockery if you're poor but cool and worthy of global praise if youre rich? - Being an adult and relying entirety on your parents for financial support.

[@davidmays8974]

Hey SecondTh, there is an incredibly important topic that has barely been covered by the media lately. It's called project 2025. Most people don't know anything about it but this project, if succeeds could restructure the entirety of America and shift power into the Republican party. America would change as we know it. I'd love to see your take on this, as well as explain it better because right now it's hard to actually understand the situation and what the project is. This project could be absolutely devastating to America and it's democracy and yet barely anyone knows it exists.

[@zeuschronos446]

do a wikipedia search on "project 2025" it describes it without the MSM spin. Actually wikipedia will define a lot of concepts "socialism" , "Wealth/Inequality", "Degrowth", "Doughnut Economics", "Adgenda 47" (trumps platform) etc,etc...

[@bertbaker7067]

It can be hard for me to shake the thought that we should treat the rich as well as they treated the workers. However, you're probably correct, revenge wouldn't be fair. Thanks for sharing, great video.

[@cosmefulanito5052]

Exactly. Communism was born as a response to capitalism and its flaws. We have an obligation to be better.

[@ellicurus]

The thing no one seems to get is that socialism isn’t against people being rich, socialism is against getting rich by exploiting other people.

[@towardcivicliteracy]

As well as stupidly assuming that "exploiting" has an objective meaning, in this context.

[@thespeculativemusician]

So you say really high taxes don’t work against getting rich?

[@bract6262]

You can't get that rich without the exploitation. The furthest you get without exploitation is well off. Not rich

[@bendover-bz4bc]

How do you explain exploiting? first world countries need to shutup and watch how they treat others in third world countries.

[@jackieAZ]

Socialism is absolutely against people getting rich, being rich is inherently a contrast to being poor. The whole point is raising everyone’s lives. The “Nordic model” is capitalism with a shine, not socialism- and it still exploits the poor greatly particularly in other countries.

[@animefurry3508]

I think this is the most important video you have made yet! Dispelling the basic misconceptions and common fears is Soooooo essential to the changes we want! Great work Comrade! Keep it up!

[@Ryanisalive]

YES! WE WILL DO IT

[@elijahculper5522]

Does it dispel fears when most of the people in the comments section, myself included to an extent, are calling for the streets to run red with the blood of billionaires? If your primary qualm with socialism is “won’t somebody please think of the billionaires” you’re never gonna be an ally of the revolution. And most people who are on board with revolution nowadays hates the capitalist class so much that we could not possibly care less if a horrible fate befell them.

[@transsexual_computer_faery]

it's actually a terrible, terrible video.

[@theairaccumulator7144]

​@@transsexual_computer_faery American talks about communism while he grew up in a middle or upper class American family, having anything he ever needed or wanted forgets about the horrors that "socialism" brought upon eastern European families. He runs his mouth all day without knowing what he's supporting.

[@Ryanisalive]

@@transsexual_computer_faery pfp??

[@hawkward957]

As someone genuinely trying to understand a socialist's point of view, here are my points of skepticism/criticism that popped into my head as I watched this video: - 1:30 / 2:45 This fear is largely due to the reality of what happened in places like Russia, where people, rich and poor, were killed for standing in the way of socialist ideals. It's not just baseless "red scare" propaganda. - 1:56 It's my understanding that environmental destruction is in large part caused by farming and the development of infrastructure and housing. I don't understand how these things (and many of the other major contributors to environmental damage) wouldn't still exist or even significantly decrease under socialism. Maybe I misunderstood you're point here. - 3:16 True, but poverty and hunger have existed in all nations with every economic system that has ever existed. In the worst examples of socialism, people suffered tremendously from mass famines. At this point, because instances like the Soviet Union and Venezuela run contrary to many of the points you've made so far, I think you might argue that these examples are not examples of true socialism or that they missed an important step that would have subverted the pitfalls they fell to. - 3:30 This part just feels straight-up dishonest. Are they being brutalized for simply complaining about their conditions? Or is it because they're being destructive? I've seen many police vs protester clashes happen due to the protesters burning and destroying property or generally causing significant disruption to the public. In other words, it's not WHAT they're protesting, it's HOW they're protesting. I'm suspicious that you're framing it in a dishonest way. - 5:50 This is one example of the rich not being "eaten", but it would be very easy to come up with a list of examples to the contrary. - 9:10 This part bothered me the most. You can't dismiss these sentiments as nothing more than some "edgy slogans" of "just a funny quote." I myself had a conversation with a socialist on Instagram who unironically said he wouldn't care if a rich person died a violent death, with the justification that "there's no such thing as an ethical billionaire" therefore, they'd deserve it. He essentially placed blame on the rich for every human in the world they could have saved with their vast surplus of capital. Barrels of blood on their hands. You've insisted multiple times that it's not about the rich as individuals but rather the system. However, from what I've seen, there are many socialists who absolutely attach these individuals to the system. They don't see the rich as morally neutral people who just found themselves at the top of the totem pole and acted unethically as ANYONE would in their position. Rather they see them as real-life supervillains that should be punished for their immeasurable crimes against the world. Hell, you yourself referred to Elon Musk as "evil" early in this video. That's about it. I think you make some good points. I like the idea of smaller government and more individual freedom and prosperity, which obviously makes me critical of the current state of the US, but I'm also quite skeptical as to whether or not socialism is the solution. It appealing in ways, but appalling in other ways.

[@waynetables6414]

I think the best way to answer some of your valid concerns and critiques is to start from a basis of comparing socialist countries not to empires like Britain and America, but rather it's only logical to compare socialist countries with the feudal/capitalistic governments they replaced in the same geographic area with the same people and resources. Compare Communist China to Feudal China because that's what it replaced. The transition from feudalism to capitalism in Europe was violent and "authoritarian" in all the same ways any revolution was.. but we just don't talk about it. People were killed and forced off of their land all over Europe in the transition from feudalism to capitalism. That can be true and it can still be true that capitalism was a better system that raised living standards as a whole and was objectively better than feudalism. So first you have to appreciate that you're comparing apples to oranges if you compare Britain in 1917 to Russia in 1917 or America 2023 to China 2023.. especially if one state is having a Revolution and literally overthrowing a government, the other is at the head of a global empire like was the case with 1917 Russia and 1917 Britain . The better comparison would be to compare Britain during it's transition to capitalism to Russia's transition to communism.. but I wouldn't even do that either because Russia was forced to "modernize" in order to fight off invasions from Britain, France, America, and Germany.. modern Britain was never under this sort of foreign threat and therefore the stakes were not nearly as high and they could act accordingly.. or you could compare Russia in 1917 to Britain or America during their Civil Wars.. when different factions are fighting over control of the government, a lot of people die and that's not unique to any one system. Anyone who wants to change the status quo is going to have to fight for it, that's the harsh reality western leftists think they are above as they vote for the corporate democratic party and think they are radicals lol. Britain's mainland was under no foreign threat whatsoever in the 1600s and still they did a genocide against Ireland deliberately to lower the Irish population and starve them out to make them easier to colonize.. yet, in the English speaking word, we never refer to that oppression as a "genocide", Western media and academic institutions (owned by oligarchs) give it a cute sounding name "potato famine". Britain committed genocides all over the world for profit.. but those things are never characterized as "capitalist deaths"... they are just "mistakes". Yet, the entire language and word choices change when the subject changes to the Soviet Union or China, all of a sudden all of these deaths are "due to communism" and the word "famine" changes to "genocide". There is no evidence whatsoever that Russia deliberately starved Ukraine, there is mountains of evidence and quotes from British aristocrats and MPs that they starved Ireland on purpose.. yet guess which one is labeled a genocide (shocker, the communists). *The famine in Ukraine was absolutely caused by communism and collectivization, but you can't just narrowly condemn one 1930s communist famine and ignore the hundreds of capitalist famines that occurred under the Czarist Russian Empire which led to the people wanting to revolt in the first place.* All we ask for is a consistent standard be applied.. we refer to people like Elon as the enemy because he advocates for invading other countries to steal their resources. He represents everything we want to end. Elon wants his company to be able to loot South America of their lithium, and that is what the role of the American/British military has been historically.. the propaganda is "make the world safe for democracy" but the reality is that they make they kill entire civilizations for power and profit. It's not about the individuals though, anyone in Elon's position ends up advocating for the same genocidal policies.. the emphasis is on dismantling the system.

[@sneakysnakesullytv8444]

This is something I’ve always wanted to know, thanks for this one

[@vincentbuscarello1357]

Speaking from the other side (hi downvotes), I can say the beginning of me returning to socialist thinking is definitely not feeling like I'm going to beheaded for participating or even being "good" at capitalism. I'd be curious to hear an extended cut of what the transition to socialism looks like for you, perhaps including various options and degrees? more stages? maybe new versions of market socialism?

[@CraigKeidel]

So the thing with socialism is it's rooted in materialist thought. That means that each iteration of socialism will both transition and look very different because of the material conditions of the people and the state.

[@etep878]

We should seize and nationalize their corporations and assets.

[@vixen878]

that's what happens ^^

[@derpherp1810]

@@JohnT.4321 But where would they get the mercenaries from if eveyone's personal needs were met under a socialist society?

[@derpherp1810]

@@JohnT.4321 But why, if there basic needs are met they literally have no good incentive to leave what they have behind? Most humans aren't that dogmatically willing to do that, the only people I imagine becoming mercenaries are disgruntled former millionaires getting brainwashed by some billionaire. We only cling to capitalist dogma because we think it works and maybe we might win a lottery but if everyone won the lottery someday and capitalism clearly shows how inept it is at meeting people's basic needs, most would abandon that dogma.

[@LucianCanad]

@@JohnT.4321 If by under force you mean "beating the privilege out of them", then I agree. If you mean they shouldn't be coerced into attending re-education, I disagree. I'm speaking out of my butt here, but re-education can be anything, from courses tailor-made to make them rethink their privileges to honest, base-level labor to acclimatize them to life as a functioning member of society.

[@poopoo-dk4hu]

I prefer the gulag option but this humane approach and realistic approach is objectively better

[@Bryzerse]

Funny as soon as I saw the title, my brain immediately said "nothing". I've also never heard that story about the last Chinese emperor, if that can happen in China of all places, it does give a bit of hope for our future.

[@annakamvla]

this video made me think about how there’s this idea within american society that makes the average person see themselves as a “temporarily embarrassed millionaire.” i think that when people use phrases like ‘eat the rich’ or call for violence against the rich, these people tend to have a visceral reaction - because they feel like one day, THEY will be the rich ones being ‘eaten’. i never thought about this before, but now i realize that using phrases like eat the rich can be more harmful in our efforts to push for change (even though i personally have never used the phrase bc i find it to be corny)

[@Donkor640]

It’s amazing how the rich man’s plight resonates with the “paycheck to paycheck “ folks. Insanity!

[@bramvanduijn8086]

The rich have forgotten that taxes are the nice option. phrases like "eat the rich" and "let's bring out the guillotines" are reminders that the people can be violent too, we just haven't wanted to do so for a couple centuries because the rich used to accept taxation. Now the rich are refusing the nice option of getting taxed, so we have to remind them what the alternatives are to socialism. You see, "eat the rich" isn't a socialist claim, it is us telling the rich what the alternative to socialism is.

[@annakamvla]

@@bramvanduijn8086this exactlyyyy

[@gianlucamattos8684]

Man, i don't want to be a part of the so called poverty cult but, is it that nice to be rich ???, imagine, what could you do ???, own a nice car ???, travel in plane ???, get expensive clothes ???, all of those things seem like a route to just never ending appetite and desires, and even guilt knowing that said fortunes came with the exploitation of workers, the fuel of that plane was paid with wars and blood, the materials of that car were extracted at the expense of the land and environment, and the making of that suite with the sweet and exploitation of workers, it's not like those goods couldn't be made ethically, but still is worth it in any way, to have and ever growning hedonistic lifestyle ???, looking at it the millionaires are still slaves to the system, just they are the ones living in pretty cages

[@cogspace]

As one of the angrier socialists you're likely to run into... even I'm willing to admit that I'm just frustrated. If we actually do accomplish this project in my lifetime, all I really want to do to Elon Musk is give his workers democratic control over his companies.

[@fieryrebirth]

If it's any solace, Musk is basically doing what a lot of billionaires and millionaires like to do.

[@targetfootball7807]

Yeah it's not really about playing soccer with severed heads, but getting billionaires the help they need to overcome their illness.

[@PhedelCastro]

Socialism sounds like a hellscape of corruption and authoritarian control

[@cosmefulanito5052]

Spoiler Alert We won't achieve it in a life time

[@Tone775]

​@@fieryrebirthThe funny thing is Elon is in debt

[@rafaelvilas4230]

Spoiler: the wall.

[@richardbetances9096]

I have to admit since finding your channel I have been tantalized, but after this video, I am intrigued, please continue and hopefully, you can provide direction to ensure you are putting your best foot forward and providing proof against the negative stream as if so, this is what I believe our society should be working towards for all.

[@kisuz9853]

Right wingers always individualize, even the leftists arguments. Socialism, as even the name implies, isnt about individualizing at all, is against a system and its about collectivization. Like you said, the problem is the system, not the jerks. Absolute banger, as always uwu

[@ClassicalTraining]

uWu

[@connorgautreaux9747]

I believe the biggest issue isn't individualizing the ideas. It's simply that socialism hasn't ever worked. You may have programs that worked but the governments as a whole haven't. The idea works if there is no corruption in the government. "Seize the assets" works great until you realize the money seized goes back into government's pockets. By all means this economy isn't working for the people. However socialism has shown over and over to not be the solution.

[@kisuz9853]

@@connorgautreaux9747 kzbin.info/www/bejne/pHe4dGOLjMyXfbssi=DJTQORB1iUl7UmXp

[@ClassicalTraining]

@@connorgautreaux9747 learn the definition of socialism before writing such nonsense.

[@connorgautreaux9747]

@@ClassicalTraining Name a country that has worked under socialism. By all means id love to change my opinion. You just haven't refuted it. Some social programs work great but the government as a whole has yet to show it works.

[@PurposefullyIneloquent]

I absolutely ADORE your channel! Please keep doing this as long as you can!!

[@anglo-irishbolshevik3425]

Brilliantly explained comrade. You're videos really get to the ❤ of the matter.

[@Will140f]

A rich person would rather have 1 dollar and everyone else have zero dollars than everyone (including themselves) having a million dollars. It’s like they can’t enjoy what they have unless they know that others don’t have it too.

[@grant3583]

Imma be so real JT-I would argue *all* billionaires are consciously aware of their destruction. They do in fact deserve to not breathe this air. They were complicit with all the pain they caused to gain their wealth, they don’t deserve the same air to breathe as us.

[@zachweyrauch2988]

Well.... I see where you're coming from but when you get down to real results we may want to achieve for a socialist society, we need to make fairness a part of that. I'm not sure where you stand on punishment principals but we probably shouldn't make the first justice we socially levy have a violent punishment.

[@bri1085]

But we're aiming for restorative justice, continuing some of the violence of the previous power structure would only reinforce said structure.

[@emilygordbort7300]

yeah, priority one should be fixing the problem. No use being vindictive. Personally I feel like the whole concept of punitive justice is a barbaric holdover from the violent cultures of our ancestors. It's nothing short of enshrining revenge as a pillar of society. True justice is reformation where possible, and seperation where someone truly cannot be redeeemed. Billionaires are human too, and they deserve the same human rights as the rest of us once they're no longer in the position to exploit and torture the working class. If you kill them, you're just perpetuating the violence.

[@lawrencehan463]

You cannot work and make a billion dollars by yourself. It’s functionally and physically impossible.

[@Draconicrose]

I agree with the sentiment, but it's an impulse borne out of anger and pain that we must acknowledge and let us pass. Killing people who are billionaires would not materially improve society. The thing that would, seizing and redistributing their wealth (killing billionaires, the concept) does not require the termination of human lives.

[@NathanTarantlawriter]

Thanks. Rich people have ZERO problems living in a socialist society. In fact, they do better. They don't have to pay a lot of benefits because society helps its own survive, which is how it should be.

[@dobrenkijbog8805]

A friend of mine in 80s in USSR was a son of powerful parents. They had 1 million dollars (equivalent in roubles) in deposits in a state conrolled bank. No questions asked. In 90s when "capitalism" came in Russia, all those deposits vanished. So, here's your answer. Under "socialism" the deposits were safe. Under "capitalism" money were gone in an instance.

[@valerietaylor9615]

@NathanTarantlawriter But it was so much more fun when they could oppress the peasants.

[@bramvanduijn8086]

@@valerietaylor9615 What makes you think the Current Russian peasants aren't oppressed? And they most definitely were oppressed before the USSR. Why do you think Russians tend to be depressed fatalistic alcoholics? Because they know from experience that oppression is a permanent part of their lives, no matter what they try. Tsars? Oppressed. Insane mystic? Oppressed. Communism? The freedom lasted about three months and then the oppression started again. Capitalism? Oppressed.

[@Boguardis]

Lmfao.. the reason they lost their money was because the money they made from state sponsored socialism was wrought with corruption.@@dobrenkijbog8805

[@silproost6635]

I just want to say that I think (not exactly sure) I’ve been watching your videos for over four or five years. Almost always start your videos thinking I’ll disagree. I end up agreeing with a few, sometimes a couple of your points. It’s helped me appreciate ‘the other side better’. This video was absolutely great!

[@RichardHarlos]

That's a long time to be watching his content. Where does your perspective find itself these days? What do you consider the best society _for everyone concerned_ (that last bit in italics is **hugely** important so please keep it in mind if/when you reply)?

[@Effective_tool_of_Satan]

I don't know if it's just me but JTs hair seems to get better with every video, it's incredible.

[@Johnnystiletto-ri8ht]

A major problem is that greed is a drug and people are addicted but won't admit it...

[@cosmefulanito5052]

My dear comrade please don't fall for the libertarian lie of human nature.

[@Johnnystiletto-ri8ht]

@@cosmefulanito5052 no lie... have wittnessed this...

[@mister_chispa]

People often imagine that being rich is not contingent, but ontological. So they think that "eliminating the rich" means to literally eliminate the person, as is somehow once you are rich, you never stop being rich, when it really means to take control of the means of production accumulated by years of exploitation.

[@sasho_b.]

On this one im going to side with the liberals. They want a society that kills of billionaires? Sure thing! All who talk of capitalism with any degree of positivity are sent to the mines? As you wish! Everything is given a soviet makeover? Love it! This is more so in the realm of fantasy than reality, but by god with how annoying red fearing libs are i really wish their misconstrued view of socialism comes about just to spite them. Just have everything else be proper socialism except we send anti-communist libs over to like Siberia or the Australian wilderness. And ban Harry Potter and 1984 with how much brain damage these books have caused me and others.

[@dylandavis4539]

We SHOULD NOT have to pay for needs (education, health care, essential food, essential housing, etc.) - we SHOULD have to pay for conveniences (TV, cars, bigger house, gourmet meals, recreational learning, etc.)

[@dylandavis4539]

To extend this comment, people shouldn't die or be inhumanely miserable because they can't afford a decent life - no matter how unfortunate or even "lazy" they are. There's a skill to be found in everyone. However, there still needs to be incentive to work hard, which for some people will be wanting that 1 million dollar yacht and for others it will be making the world a better place. I've worked at a few companies now and all I hear about and see is their obsession with their continued growth in sales. If every company is sponging up as much money as possible every year, then what's happening to the global pool of wealth?

[@techtutorial9050]

Agreed

[@Praisethesunson]

But artificially restricting your access to the things you actually need is how our overlords maximize their profits.

[@jadaw644]

​@@BenjaminWalburnDon't leave us in suspense, explain. Google is a friend for learning what things mean, by the way.

[@seekingabsolution1907]

Tbh I'm in favour of abolishing money as soon as possible.

[@sluggknight7130]

00:25 searching `` jeff bezos´´ inmediately followed by searching ``guillotine´´ is pretty funny

[@Mariobrownio1989]

I feel like the unions such as the UAW is making history as we speak. It could turn out to be one of the defining moment of human history!

[@Praisethesunson]

I like your energy

[@musclestruts5032]

I hope they don't just rest on their laurels after this. The 1970s proved definitively that "reform" in capitalism is only temporary. Capitalism has to be, to steal and modify a certain neoliberal quote regarding government, "reduced and shrunk until it can be drowned in a bath tub". @@chickensandwich8808

[@JohnTaylor-fh4et]

They should have to live in abject poverty, like people do now.

[@seamusoflatcap]

What happens to rich people under socialism? They become Labour MPs, get a knighthood even though they were useless at,say, being DPP, and become the leader of the Labour Party. Then they live in a big house in London, talk to just a few people and pretend they understand and are representing the poor and working class.

[@DarkPuppy9]

Describing taking away a lot of what the rich see as things they are entitled too and pretending it won't be violent is a kind of optimism I aspire to

[@DarkPuppy9]

@@BenjaminWalburn you utterly missed both what i said and the point.

[@elijahculper5522]

The rich will be violent though. It should be a foregone conclusion that if we elect a socialist government, the rich will do everything in their power to subvert that regime. They’ll hire goons into paramilitary forces, they’ll hide their wealth overseas or in bunkers. They’ll try to flee the country, they’ll build walls around compounds and become warlords if we let them. I like non-violence just as the next leftist. But I’m not gonna get bent out of shape if the revolution decides not to give the rich the opportunity to martial their forces and stage a counterrevolution. If the revolutionary regime imprisons or kills billionaires to keep them from undermining the revolution I don’t find that morally objectionable. If eggs must be broken to make an omelette, so be it.

[@DarkPuppy9]

@@BenjaminWalburn your inability to comprehend a sentence is a you problem. You missed the point instead of asking for clarification you made a very poor assumption. It's on you and nobody else.

[@bretthansen3739]

Your comment at about 11:30 was really touching. You pointed out that billionaires would still be free to pursue the initiatives that they currently fund if those things are real passions of theirs. I honestly think that would be great for someone like Musk. I don't care for the person he is now one bit, but I believe that many of the issues he focusses on are genuine passions of his.

[@transsexual_computer_faery]

i'm sure an adulterer and transphobe has a passion to help society. i'm sure of it.

[@noflexzone2.055]

@@transsexual_computer_faery don't forget, he made electric cars and modern independent money transfer systems possible. Also, adultery and whether a person is a transphobe should be irrelevant in an economically socialist society. An economically socialist society can be achieved with little bloodshed... a culturally socialistic society is the real dangerous sh*t.

[@bretthansen3739]

@@transsexual_computer_faery The passions I was referring to were robotics and space, not helping people. He's never shown any passion for that. I think Elon Musk is a terrible person, but I also think he deserves a chance at rehabilitation just like any criminal/"bad guy".

[@CraigKeidel]

​@@bretthansen3739His passions are robots and space because that's the only way billionaires survive when the water wars begin

[@bretthansen3739]

@@CraigKeidel I don't think that's why, honestly. I think he's an autistic nerd who thinks robots and spaceships are cool, and that's the least objectionable part of him. (I'm not bothering him here, I'm an autistic nerd who thinks robots and space are cool, and I'm also a leftist who isn't rich)

[@LarsaXL]

Speaking of things happening to people: I can't find you on Nebula anymore, what happened?

[@BioChemistryWizard]

Nebula creators demanded JT "both sides" ethnic cleansing and apartheid. That company should go down in flames, they are defeating the entire purpose they made and marketed it to begin with.

[@generaljellyroll8737]

* puts down pitchfork he bought at Amazon “Ya, you’re right” Furthur (spelled wrong on purpose, GD bus name)

[@cluesagi]

Off-topic but have you considered offering paid channel memberships? It seems like creators get a better cut from it than from Patreon

[@SecondThought]

I haven’t looked into it yet, but that sounds promising!

[@luistorres6594]

Very insightful, keep up the good work!

[@marcocappelli5124]

The one thing that bothers me about the socialist movement, being a socialist myself, is that they assume this won't turn into a cyclical thing. We've seen how socialists had major victories in the early 20th century, only to be slowly eroded away by capitalists. Now we see a resurgence of socialism as an alternative because capitalism is becoming unbearable. What's stopping this cycle from repeating again?

[@andresaofelipe]

Us. We must learn from the past and assure it doesn't happen again. Our shoulders bear this weight, comrade, let's never forget it

[@ashkitt7719]

That and also what is stopping those who are technically workers but make more than 100K a year from getting purged? Talking about IT professionals, doctors, etc. I say 100K a year because that is what one terminally online "socialist" said was their upper threshold for avoiding physical removal. Another terminally online "socialist" I encountered said that the criteria for being purged was having any amount of money invested in stocks/bonds whatsoever. That is, if you got an IRA or a 401(K) you will be purged. I wish more socialists would realize that asceticism/suffering isn't a sign of virtue. That's not even bourgeois propaganda but flat-out feudalist and clerical propaganda. And that under socialism they will be the "rich" folks they despise so much because they will not have to suffer financially.

[@kevinli8487]

I agree! I find it naive to believe this time will somehow trump historical precedence, especially with no plan of action and preparation for resistance. That's compounded with the fact that there's no viable, and certainly no exciting, vision for the future in the public consciousness.

[@boltstrike2787]

What we need is stronger regulations to prevent the wealthy from exploiting the loopholes that they did. We need to pass laws, or in the U.S.' case a series of amendments, that impose term limits, limit campaign donations and lobbying, outlaw propaganda and misinformation, and guarantee worker rights. That would make it tougher for them to repeat the same things they did to get us into this mess. Now it's possible the cycle may still repeat if the wealthy find new loopholes to exploit. Even in an ideal case this may end up being similar to the relationship between hackers and security experts, where hackers come up with new ways to exploit systems and security experts find new ways to stop them creating a sort of arms race. But at least then we'll have made it harder for the cycle to repeat and if they try to roll things back they have to be even more clever about it.

[@RichardHarlos]

marco wrote, _"they assume this won't turn into a cyclical thing."_ What it may turn into is of no concern. It's speculation... conjecture... it may be cyclical, or it may not. Rather than focusing on the potential negative outcomes, we need to focus on the present-day negative outcomes and do what we can to remedy them. If the problem is systemic, then systemic reform is what we need. If the outcome of our best efforts at reform don't do what we had anticipated, then we repeat the process of identifying problems, attempting solutions, ad infinitum. The idea that something has to work perfectly the first go-round is a specter. It's unlikely that anything is going to be perfect first time around. But that's not a reason not to do something. We get more than one chance to make things better. Some would argue that that's the best we can expect: to remain aware, and to solve problems as effectively as possible, as soon as possible, and to keep doing that. If we all agreed upon this as a strategy, maybe our generation doesn't live long enough to see the outcome but... the outcome is something that each successive generation has the opportunity to get closer and closer to. In my view, that's a goal worth investing in. Ongoing, incremental refinement is a process, not a destination.

[@nattraser8996]

They wont accept It, Billionaire's worst nightmare is to be one of us

[@golfila3872]

guillotine

[@VentureHolly]

We can’t even joke about guillotines because the opposition doesn’t comprehend satire 😂

[@VecheslavNovikov]

Satire? Jokes? Nah, fam, the necky chop chop is serious business.

[@marcusnguginganga2829]

Awesome video. Definitely learnt a bit. Obviously, leftists will take the nonviolent route if it's possible but unfortunately so far revolutions have been violent. Basically, we hope for the best but prepare for the worst. The main thing is accountability and facing the consequences of your actions

[@FaithflNdscreet]

“If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.” "Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.” - Jesus "For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.". - Paul

[@DeneuveYT]

I think plenty of younger people would be open to the fine content such as this channel and are already in some way or another realizing the failure of capitalist hegemony. Nobody dreams of the kind of dangerous action necessary in times of change but for the time being it will go far to spread this information and in essence grow the base of class conscious people now while the waters are still calm.

[@ericherman5413]

I agree with 95% of your position. But what do we do with people who are just plain dangerous? Murderers, rapists, etc.? They certainly cannot live freely to continue hurting people. Abolishing prisons seems like a thing that would result in much more volatile living. Do you happen to have a video addressing that?

[@travisutrecht1542]

Yea, more clarity here would be great. If there was even one thought that such dangerous people would just be allowed to roam free then you’ll never convince me or most people affected by such criminals. It hurts now seeing said criminals allowed out only to reoffend and ruin another family’s life, all because we are just a bunch of loving people.

[@andrewcliffe4753]

All systems are games The rules are written by the rich The goal of all games is for the rich to win all assets When they achieve this goal the system collapses A new game begins.

[@travisutrecht1542]

But it will be different this time. We have learnt from the past. Lol

[@BrianFace182]

I disagree with the premise. Billionaires end up billionaires because they actively believe in capitalism and actively seek money and power. They have personality disorders. I don't think it's fair to the overwhelming majority of people to say we'd do the same in their position because the premise is wrong. We'd never end up in their position because we don't seek it. Billionaires are billionaires because there's something fundamentally wrong with their psychology and they cannot take no for an answer. They spend every waking moment actively seeking more wealth and power BECAUSE they can't take no for an answer. They have massive egos and believe that they have some special talent for "decision making" and this cannot ever be questioned, no matter how shit they make society. Billionaires don't even think space is worth studying unless they can go up there themselves and gawk at it. Getting any kind of weight into space is already a huge challenge and yet billionaires don't think its worth investing in unless they can be dead weight that adds nothing to the mission. All for what? So Jeff Bezos can come back down and do an interview where he clearly didn't even know what he was supposed to be feeling. He's got the psychology of a newborn. They all have the psychology of newborns. Look at the state of Elon Musk's behaviour. Systems theory can only get you so far. There are people demanding this system stay in place. The problem is psychological and you need to be more prepared than this because a shift to socialism is likely to result in large scale acts of terrorism by capitalists acting out because they can't have their own way. Chairman Mao did what he did because feudal lords spent 4 YEARS ordering their private armies to commit acts of terrorism against the Chinese people following the revolution. I'm starting to think the USSR had so many people in Gulags for similar reasons. Genocide and mass imprisonment are obviously not going to be workable solutions but we need to have SOMETHING prepared for the mass terrorism that capitalists will commit when they're told no, they cannot have their own way and no, they're not superior. There is no bell curve for "intelligence", there is no bell curve for "decision making talent", because these things are entirely subjective depending on what we want to achieve. Having a small group of billionaires that are really good at making decisions that benefit themselves in charge of everything isn't really helpful for society but here we are, in a society where billionaires deem themselves really really good at "making decisions". The irony is that the overwhelming majority of humans are exceptionally intelligent, and the idiots are the ones in charge because they cannot understand even the most basic facts of reality that they are not in fact "creating wealth", they're simply demanding it then expecting that we'll all fawn over their amazing ideas for the wealth they wanted us to make for them. They cannot perceive of the basic fundamentals of responsibility, agency, consequence. An individual person takes action A and real world consequence B happens is something that billionaires seem completely incapable of perceiving of, demonstrating they are in fact the only stupid people on planet earth. They incorrectly attribute responsibility for outcomes all the time, hence the term "wealth creator", demonstrating they are in fact the only stupid people on planet earth. They think "creating jobs" is a good thing, because they cannot perceive of the fact that we already have enough work to do as it is and making their dinner and cleaning their homes for them, not even considering all the other wasteful labour they demand for the million and one ideas for services they have, is piling more on top of it all, demonstrating they are in fact the only stupid people on planet earth. You're leaving yourself open, what these deranged weirdos need is HEALTHCARE, not to be labelled as normal people. Their individual actions are their own, not the result of a system. They act of their own accord, actively seeking wealth and power and they support capitalism because capitalism enables them.

[@RadicalSoup]

Billionaires who directly profit from war and destruction of the planet are definitely going to need to he held accountable for their crimes. Obviously most rich people will be simply re-educated and some specific billionaires will need to be kept from having any political power, but there are those who really do need to be punished for their crimes. Restorative justice ≠ having to forgive genocidal shitbags

[@VecheslavNovikov]

"will be simply re-educated" ...in some sort of camp?

[@swifts6879]

5:54 in fairness the Kuomintang and CPC both wanted to kill him and it was one of the few things Mao and Chek actually agreed upon.

[@swifts6879]

This also completely ignores basically everything the Bolsheviks did under Lenin that was completely unnecessary and very much not socialist, like murdering every other leftist party or committing acts of ethnic violence against Ukrainians and Finns.