What If Kakashi Had Trained Naruto in the Timeskip

[@DygoKnight]

How stronge would Naruto have become?

[@markclinton9088]

Pretty stronge Great vid. Always like hearing your opinion on smaller changes to the story. Looking forward to the next chapter of the rewrite

[@SunlightGwyn]

He would be less strong. Kakashi was a bad teacher for Naruto. He taught him almost nothing.

[@flamephantom248]

Video idea: what if minato was trained by oroochimaru. Love your vids

[@wisequigon]

@@SunlightGwyn did you even watch the video, or you're an idiot by default?

[@RicardoKoei]

He would be stronger probably, but in the end he would accomplish less because jiraiya gave the building blocks to master talk no jutsu. If kakashi trained naruto the timeline would probably be a lot darker

[@markonikolic4028]

Naruro legit had 3 training arcs that progressed his powers nore than a 3 year timeskip and that lasted only a couple of days/weeks. First it was the Rasen-Shuriken training, then Sage Mode, then KCM.

[@justinarzola4584]

Jiraya wasted those 3 years with Naruto by sealing up the nine tails chakra which didn't even matter much once Shipudden started since Naruto was constantly losing control,could have spent that time reaching his jinzo, barrier jutsu needle technique or toad Oil Naruto would of been super stacked in early shipudden and probably stronger or equal to Sasuke( depending on if you consider orochimaru or Jiraya the strongest sannin).

[@nightdrivenen7909]

@@justinarzola4584 The reason why Naruto was losing control so much, arguably was because Jiraiya was trying to teach Naruto KCM - but the two were failing at it horribly. And it got to the point where the Eight-Trigram Seal on Naruto eroded more than half by the time Naruto came back. Which was why Jiraiya was so worried about Naruto doing ANYTHING after getting back to Konoha and why Yamato was needed to be dug up to help him control it.

[@netero1682]

The problem is that they didn't know what they were facing, it was a bet and they lost, because the approach was never the right one and Naruto was not interested in the Kyubi. The other problem is that Kishimoto didn't work well on the relationship between Nsruto and the Kyubi. Even so, I think that all of this was essential for Naruto to become friends with the Kyubi later on, and that was Kishimoto's real intention.

[@nearj2421]

Naruto got better at chakra control during those 3 years. That is the reason why he got good results in those 3 training arcs (Specially sage mode since you need amazing chakra control and know how to balance the energy)

[@gojothehonouredone]

Every mc gets stronger off screen Mean while Naruto

[@qwirkt]

Only thing I disagree on is on Kakashi fully dedicating all his time to training Naruto - Kakashi clearly took his time training himself during the timeskip and got A LOT stronger, so I imagine he’d need time for that too

[@ThyDrash]

[@Draconianoverlord55]

Or maybe Naruto could be one a worthy training partner and both become stronger Just like in real life martial arts

[@HalfBakedRamen]

if naruto used the shadow clone training method from the beginning he could've caught up to kakashi's level relatively quickly and then kakashi and naruto could be basically training each other

[@golum247]

@@HalfBakedRamen Bad comparison, your comparing Naruto's growth speed in Shippuden in comparison to Naruto kid. He still needs to grow in order to reach his growth speed in shippuden, he also had motivation to get stronger in Shippuden after he saw the gap in strength between him and Sasuke. Training Naruto Kakashi would be weaker and probably wouldn't be able to use Mangekyo which would lead to mayor plot changes.

[@Nah_Id_win_6942]

He can use shadow clones to monitor naruto's training

[@aweiz6265]

The problem is that I don't think Kishi ever expected to create the power scaling he ended up with when writing the timeskip details

[@coolguy7461]

Same thoughts lmao, bro didnt want more op characters but thats what he needed

[@DiamonDust]

Wdym? Naruto learnign Rasen-Shuriken did not even surpass the scaling present in OG where we saw crazy stuff like Gamabunta vs Shukaku and Orochimaru vs Hiruzen.

[@ayhamahmad2277]

He didn't plan the entire story you can really tell he was making things up as he went it's not his fault though a lot of mange face this problem

[@jnrosenb]

One thing I found to be a massive lost potential thread was that Jiraya's training could have aimed to make Naruto better handle Sage mode later on. During the sage mode training, little flashbacks to Jiraya's apparently useless training could have popped, and showed that he was planting the seeds for future naruto to be a beast in sage mode. Now, this happened anyways (him being a beast), but it felt really rushed. And it would also have been an amazing moment, given that during this arc Naruto was grieving Jiraya. So imagine, same thing that happened in the arc. Naruto suddenly rises as a kage level ninja against pain. But instead of it being the result of a rushed 1 month (I think?) training where Kakashi's kage multiplier was the most useful, it would have been the culmination of the techniques and discipline planted by Jiraya during his time with Naruto.

[@___________0Z0X]

This would’ve been amazing.

[@Meekmillan]

So many missed emotional bank account withdrawals That would’ve been great.

[@dylanmccreary2164]

Yeah, that would have been great. I was thinking they could have done the basics of wind transformation as flashbacks too, but this is even better. Show flashbacks of weird training things that Jiraiya says is to practice balance, but was prepping him for the chakra control and stillness he would need.

[@ayhamahmad2277]

That would work in The manga in the anime remember the anime has flashbacks issues they put a lot of flashbacks still better than anything comes form boruto and second kishimoto came up with sage mode way letter

[@Darknesschronicle_1]

He would likely be strong after 3 years he wouldn't even need sage mode.

[@Churras_8]

I understand that people get frustrated by naruto not developing that much with Jiraya but a very important part of the teachings Jiraya gave naruto is his philosophy and the bound they created together, that i believe to be a integral part of the story and of naruto's character development. What you did on the rewrite, giving naruto a better arsenal after the Time-Skip is exactly what i would change about it.

[@rhuonaChanel]

But Naruto already has his philosophy or his nindo down since the Wave arc..he used his philosophy against neji & gaara in part 1. In fact, kakashi added more to that philosophy than jiraiya with the whole "don't abandon your friends" nindo.

[@sirnetflix7162]

@@rhuonaChanel Exactly, Jiraiya was not needed for his philosophy. Kakashi taught him that since the start of the series when they met. Jiraiya simply was just close to Naruto due to their time spent together, but Kakashi could easily fill that void anyway

[@tgdb-ace]

Absolutely nothing was passed to Naruto, He didn't learn to suppress the Nine tails chakra better, didn't improve in fighting, The kid literally fought a Bijuu before the timeskip. Don't get me wrong, Jiraiya got dynamics but the kid was already a gem before he went on Jiraiya's training and they wasted it doing rubbish. The Philosophy side was done in a DAY. After his nine training failed with Naruto, He didn't even try to make him stronger to be able to avoid using the tail beast chakra.

[@randomchannel609]

@@tgdb-acehe learned actual fundamentals

[@SuperSky9]

TALK-NO-JUSTU is just annoying way to reuse scene and pad out the run time of the anime. You can remove Jiraya from the story and nothing would change. Better teachers would be his own Father's and Morther's chakra and the Nine tails living inside him training him in being better warrior then Fruitcake Jiraya. Ever watched Bleach and his own battles with his spirites? Something along that line was needed. Not to mention Jirayan didn't even taught Naruto Sage Arts properly.

[@rajaryan-fe1oy]

Finally someone appreciating Kakashi's teaching, he's the GOAT

[@justinarzola4584]

Kakashi is kinda op with all the jutsu he has learned,Sasuke in particular would have been so powerful if he had learned more than the chidori.

[@themister.s-1st]

And how much time did he need to teach him that? Less than a month right? And the wind release for Rasengan for Naruto? Kakashi knows his shit…. Pity he didn’t help Sakura with fat. But hey!!

[@ektran4205]

kakashi was to obsessed with training sasuke

[@EternalBrightness3]

There is no teacher in the verse as great as Kakashi. Don't let anyone sell you any lies. In just 2 weeks he had Sasuke master Lee's natural speed Taijutsu, unlock his second nature element & learn A-rank Chidori. No sensei in the verse has trained their student as effectively in that tiny interval of time to that degree. No one. Naruto is another prime example. In just a few days Kakashi had him on the tail end of Kage tier by having him learn his nature affinity, how to utlize Shadow clones optimally, gave him an estimate of the dense Kyuubi chakra he was inundated with & planted the seeds for Naruto to integrate wind chakra into the Rasengan to invent a variant that even the 4th couldn't. Again, no sensei has accomplished anything remotely as impressive with their students. Not Orochimaru, not Jiraiya, no one. So anyone calling Kakashi a "bad Sensei" is simply at odds with the attention he gave Sasuke which was warranted due to the threats that were on his case. The comment above ^ is exhibit A.

[@velocitycreatz]

Yeah

[@sansukanaka]

Jiraiya also used the clone strat maybe by accident. Before the chunnin exams. Every day before practicing the summoning jutsu to learn to extract kyubis chakra. He made Naruto drain his chakra by fighting against all of his clones. Naruto literally trained to counter neji without knowing. He made himself a tank with that training. Thats how he could take all nejis taijutsu head on, be without chakra and then using kyubis chakra. The genius neji with a byakugan i can imagin him not taking many hits in his life. His resistance is pretty low, thats why a good hit decommissioned him.

[@___________0Z0X]

Man, Jeriah is a good teacher. I never thought about that before.

[@rhuonaChanel]

That hit was on neji's jaw. No matter how strong you are, it's a fact that if you strike at the jawline hard enough to rattle the brain, the person could be knocked out or temporarily lose motor functions (what happened to neji). It's not about not taking hits but where was hit

[@everybodywalktheDinosaur]

I've always liked that theory, but in the manga Jaraiya had Naruto deplete his Chakra everyday by doing the water walking training

[@danielsepulveda5852]

Man the clone training was not even in Kishis mind by the time that happened lol Jiraiya dind do anything thinking about that since his own creator wasnt thinking about that.

[@___________0Z0X]

@@danielsepulveda5852 that’s the boring answer.

[@Arcticgreen]

What bugs me is that Naruto never learned any intermediate wind techniques. Like, he never perfected the wind-chakra infused kunai, which could punch through trees. Or the wind powered shuriken like Danzo throws. Both would have been useful, easier to learn, easier to control, and less risky for him to use.

[@m.r.r.2636]

I think this problem extends to many if not most of the Naruto cast. During the chunin exams we see Rock Lee having attained the 5th gate, and by the end of Shippuden he can unlock the 6th. That's likely an error on the author's side to progress Lee that much so early but the perception is that Lee haven't progressed/changed much. The vast majority of the main Naruto cast only ever uses upwards of 3 jutsu, not counting what is essentially base jutsu like substitution, transformation, and I would argue clones (which so many characters can do). That's also the most positive thing about the Boruto's series - that the MC actually utilizes their chakra nature, both creatively and in general.

[@ayhamahmad2277]

​@@m.r.r.2636don't compare boruto to Naruto or Shippuden boruto is trash and not cannon and boruto fight are the same and the villans having the same ability over and over again and they are op and not well written like Naruto villains

[@xtremeblazer3468]

@@ayhamahmad2277 Nah timeskip boruto is great

[@Sadpotatoirl2010]

Yeah ....wind realease is intimidating af like Danzo and Orochimaru (flash back when he got trapped by Hiruzen's team).

[@f.gmondr5140]

​@@ayhamahmad2277 boruto time skip(3 years) is a way for kishimoto to rewrite what should naruto be after time skip. Boruto learnt his sensei/grandfather jutsu.

[@ryzenn9693]

Im kind of disapointed that naruto never learned his parents signatures (Kushina's being adamantite chains and Minato's being flying thunder god). It would have been pretty cool if he learned at least one of those 2

[@GondoMan21]

it would have been but now boruto has it

[@wonderingheart]

​@@GondoMan21 I need proof what episodes show that

[@GondoMan21]

@@wonderingheart oh sorry manga spoilers

[@wonderingheart]

@@GondoMan21 but he does use flying thunder god

[@Emil-wt4go]

​@@wonderinghearthe used flying thunder god, chidori nagashi, chidori blade, purple lightning, raikiri and uzuhiko rasengan

[@Marta1Buck]

Not only he would train naruto, he would also train Yamato at the same time.😂

[@erikburzinski8248]

maybe he would be hashrama level by the end

[@rurumaekawa8944]

​@@erikburzinski8248hell naw

[@EternalBrightness3]

Naruto would return knowing his belonging chakra nature. How to use his Shadow clones effectively (i.e creating trap Shadow clones & using them to gather information mid-battle) He'd likely be skilled in the art of espionage tactics. He'd return with the Rasenshuriken already apart of his arsenal of Ninjutsu (assuming Kakashi summoned Yamato to keep Kyuubi subjugated). His Taijutsu & use of weaponry would be much more refined. He'd be a level-headed fighter. He would learn sealing jutsu. He would learn adequate Genjutsu. And his knowledge of the shinobi world would skyrocket. Safe to say baka Naruto would cease to exist & Kakashi would make him a monster.

[@justinarzola4584]

I still think it was weird how Jiraya didn't even teach basic chakra nature to Naruto.

[@EternalBrightness3]

@@justinarzola4584 Especially knowing that an Organization comprised of several S-rank renegades well versed in mortal combat had Naruto (who finished training not even knowing his chakra nature) on their hit list. Jiraiya is hilariously stupid for that.

[@naamadossantossilva4736]

And he would also have learned Hiraishin.TBH it's kinda strange Kakashi didn't try to tech him that in OTL,Minato thought it was easier than adding element to the Rasengan.

[@TheBillhs]

well...i see you re a kakashi meat rider

[@Grammulka]

Maybe not rasenshuriken. Fuuton rasengan is already a big deal

[@ObiClon]

I do so enjoy seeing "What If" videos like this. They always give one fun insight to what could've been if things went on a different path than they did in the series normally.

[@israelmatulimubalama1496]

One thing for sure is naruto will be more versatile not just shadow clones and rasengan variants

[@kattSendo]

i think one of the main reasons for naruto not learning anything spectacular during the time skip is so that kishimoto could show naruto’s potential and progression in the actual show, if naruto came out the timeskip using different nature affinity’s like wind, earth and fire jutsu, or even being able to use sage mode or control kurama as chakra everyone would feel like the missed out on the growth of the main character

[@tomasguilherme263]

Thats a fair point, but again he could just do a flash-back to during time skip and show naruta learning and trainning that with jiraya so he wouldnt reallt feel thay way.

[@eye-chan1711]

That’s not true to an extent imo. If Naruto could use sage mode/control kurama’s chakra that would definitely be too much… but to basically learn nothing is ridiculous. I think him learning wind style would have been pretty good. It would give him ranged attacks and a more diverse kit than just clone and rasengan spam. Imagine having a firing squad of Naruto clones using wind bullets. Would have been really cool to see.

[@razorr_o]

Jiraiya taught Naruto to control 3 tails of Kurama!

[@eye-chan1711]

@@razorr_o Yeah… no. He still went out of control even with one tail or two tails. If he could control three tails he would use it without going crazy.

[@jr5034]

but the guy learned nothing at all, maybe he could have been taught how to infuse chakra onto his punches and kicks like Tsunade, maybe not to a big extent but enough to deal a good amount of damage, could have given him wind style attacks like wind cutter like in pokemon or shii I don't know, the Toad Oil Flame jutsu, maybe some sealing techniques of the Uzumaki, atleast make him Jonin level at base level , he was kage level as a kid with some power ups

[@treytison1444]

The really funny thing is just how long it was before someone bothered to teach Naruto nature transformations. Like learning rasengan and shadow clone jutsu before nature transformations which are later retconned to be in almost any ninjas arsenal is hilarious.

[@naamadossantossilva4736]

Even before that in part 1 we have Sasuke throwing fireballs and dragons around.

[@KrzysztofJarzynaZeSzczecina0]

Ten-Ten, Rock-Lee, Kankuro, Shino, both Hyugas, Ino-Shika-Cho, and many more people in Konoha didn't show almost anything connected to chakra natures before Naruto learn about it. And after that too, they still focused on their unique abilities giving em advantage over "normal" shinobi. We saw how popular it is just in war arc. So we can defend that with this, Naruto uniqe ability giving him advantage was 9-tails, and Jiraya focused on making Naruto used to 9-tails, which later helped him a lot mastering his most OP form. Also, mastering it needed KIND HEART, which u develop kinda different way, than constantly chasing for power. Jiraya taught him what is friendship, love, bonds, and how to be a good friend and human. THAT HELPED NARUTO BECOME BROS WITH KURAMA.

[@ferpiopiogm]

Jiraya's main training and goal was based on making Naruto able to control Kurama's chakra, not teaching him ninjutsu, gentutsu or fancy stuff. I think he did a pretty amazing job at it. Of course we expected him to make more technics and stuff, but c'mon! He grew at combat experience, taijutsu, how to deal with genjutsu, make a bigger rassengan, and last but not least controling 3 tails bijuu's chakra without losing consciousness.

[@segalman]

Don't forget that in just a week Naruto mastered his affinity n create an S-Rank jutsu from it (rasenshuriken), now imagine an intensive training under kakashi's tutorship in 2.5 years

[@ektran4205]

naruto did make the rasengan better and he didn't create a new jutsu

[@AnimeALX]

He also did that with Asuma's help.

[@thegremlinfan]

@@ektran4205 Fuuton: Rasen Shuriken is a new jutsu , so yeah, naruto created an S-rank jutsu

[@ektran4205]

@@thegremlinfan naruto made rasengab better like minato made hiraijin better

[@aeth4190]

Something to consider about Jiraya's training, and the Ninetail interfering with Kakashi's training Jiraya also spent these years trying to teach Naruto to use this chakra, but it also weakened the seal. So teaching Naruto using the army of clones would have probably been much less dangerous, albeit maybe longer

[@silvertongue.242_99]

I could see kakashi teaching him basic wind style techniques after succeeding with the rasen shuriken. Then using his high chakra reserves to boost these simple jutus and Naruto coming up with unique wind style jutsus on his own as well as shuriken jutsus

[@silvertongue.242_99]

Then I think him going to o jiraya after that to learn sage mode and giant rasengan and maybe massive rasengan too

[@Sadpotatoirl2010]

He learn rasengan (spiralling chakra) & kuchiyose without knowing his nature chakra in part 1. Jiraiya is just flexing at the time lol

[@stefanocremonini2656]

I partially agree with you. Kakashi is definitely good teacher BUT the best solution is the combination between Jiraya and Kakashi. Jiraya will gave him the basis for his overwhelming chakra considering that he has huge amount of chakra. Meanwhile Kakashi will teach him technical aspect. Possibile he would become a powerhouse with incomplete adamantine chains,mastery Over rasengan and kage bunshin,master Over frogs,mastery Over wind AND possibily a second alteration but not creating the two rasenshuriken. Possibly only an elemental rasengan. Finally he will have an incomplete frog sage mode.

[@marzipancutter8144]

It would even be ok to have Jiraiya teach Naruto if he, like... actually taught him something? Imagine Naruto returning from the timeskip with a large array of needle-hair and oil bomb techniques. In combination with the clones, the amount of offensive pressure he could exert over a large area in insanely short time is insane and there'd be almost no dodging him, even for some higher-level opponents much later on.

[@naamadossantossilva4736]

@@marzipancutter8144 I think wind style jutsu would be better for area attacks.Just look at the damage Atsugai did.

[@marzipancutter8144]

@@naamadossantossilva4736 I agree. I didn't mention that because it doesn't seem that's the kind of Training Jirayia would give. I was more trying to get into the techniques he actually tends to use. Jirayia was built up to be someone who specializes in a huge variety of Ninjutsu for every situation, and it we never actually get to see that variety because his setpiece fights were a Kaiju battle and one where Ninjutsu straight up didn't work so he had to pivot off them long before he got to show off his bag of tricks.. But you're correct too, the same goes for Wind style. As I see it, the only time we actually see how versatile and strong high level wind style can be was ironically the Danzo fight of all places, and even then most of the battle revolved around the Izanagi gimmick and otherwise being one-sided instead. Meanwhile all the other wind style users fall flat. Asuma mostly just uses it to make his one knife sharper and then dies long before we see the peak of that potential (His smoke isn't even a wind style but a fire style). Temari is supposed to be the strongest but all her attacks are just waving her fan to shoot a projectile. Lastly Narutos entirety of wind style only consists of one powerup to his Rasengan and nothing besides that. With all the variety we get in People fighting with other elements, this really sucks.

[@stefanocremonini2656]

@@The_Average_Ragebait_Borutard i agree with you on the powerscale but...WTF? It wasn't necessary and related to the video and discussion.

[@julianthedude12]

Jiraya's training was mostly about chakra control and manipulation and learning how to use kurama chakra without suffering the massive drawbacks he originally endured before the time skip

[@lordtt3984]

Glad somebody gets it. He'd be a completely inconsistent mess like he was in part 1 if Kakashi trained him but no people just wanna see Naruto come back and do big jutsu

[@rhysjonsmusic]

If Naruto had been able to achieve the primary goal of his timeskip training which was to become a perfect Jinchuriki he would've been goated at the start of Shippuden

[@vishwathayumanavan8777]

Naruto didn't get much better at chakra control because he still needed a clone to form a rasengan. The only argument you could make for him is that jiraiya spent all 3 years solely focusng on kurama's chakra and nothing else which is again a big flaw in his plan to invest everything into the nine tails.

[@secretly_ur_dad8702]

Naruto didn’t suffer much in part 1, he mostly suffered at the beginning of Shippuden and if I remember it was due to Jiraiya slightly loosening the seal as stated by the frog key himself. Of course, I understand where he was coming from… if Naruto could’ve mastered KCM that early on it would’ve been game over

[@KrzysztofJarzynaZeSzczecina0]

@@lordtt3984 exactly. And then he would end up twisted and focused only on power, like... Everybody else considered evil in this manga xD Orochimaru, Sasuke, Nagato, Obito, Madara. The whole story was about not becoming that, not forcing 9-tails with pure power, becoming his friend like Bee with 8-tails. Whole anime is about "friendship power and be yourself" beating "chasing power and loose yourself" characters.

[@goldietoocold2119]

Loving The Content Keep It Up Bro💯

[@DygoKnight]

Appreciate it

[@RickyBBlessed]

Jiraiya should have taken Naruto to learn sage mode. Imagine if Naruto pulled up after the timeskip and had sage mode in his back pocket. Maybe not perfect sage mode probably a form akin to what Jiraiya had would have still had him leagues above what he displayed at the beginning.

[@RickyBBlessed]

Actually on second thought Naruto should be able to master sage mode during the time skip and then would be able to pull off Odama rasengan and other variants easily also his taijutsu and sensory abilities would be greatly improved. He would not as be as versatile as he would if Kakashi trained him but it would have its own benefits.

[@netero1682]

​@@RickyBBlessedYes, but that was not Kishimoto's intention, but rather that Naruto would try to control the power of the Bijuu. In addition, Jiraiya's training was based a lot on Chakra control and that helped him later master sage mode. Kishimoto's final failure is that he did not know how to develop the relationship between the Kyubi and Naruto well.

[@AlteredNova04]

This is probably just me coping, but I like to believe that Jiraiya spent a lot of the time skip preparing Naruto for sage mode. Teaching him chakra control and meditation techniques and whatnot. He just wasn't planning to tell Naruto about sage mode until he was ready to visit toad mountain. That's why Naruto was able to master sage mode so quickly, because he already learned the basics from Jiraiya.

[@tman1669]

Nah. Perfect sage mode if filler has anything to say about it. The Minato being alive filler episode. What could've been.

[@tsasterwilliams5806]

Then again, spending time gaining worldly maturity and wisdom of outlook with Jiraya probably laid the path for his development as a sage,and gaining the resolve that fuels talk-no-jutsu

[@Tosj_879]

I was always dissapointed that he always used the same jutsu. I would have loved to see him master different jutsu and using them in battle

[@wem_iii]

He used transformation Jutsu a lot and nobody else really did that.

[@blacklivesorblackvotes2985]

@@wem_iii that’s still not much nor does it make for a diverse moveset. Naruto fights are honestly the least interesting because of this.

[@jdubbs69]

It's a difficult thing, because Jiraiya improved Naruto's base line enough to be equipped for that kind of training.

[@___________0Z0X]

Honestly, not enough people realize that.

[@naamadossantossilva4736]

How much of that was just Naruto growing up and getting his testosterone levels increase 50 fold?

[@masterkc]

naruto's base line would have improved just as much if he stayed behind in the village during those 3 years. Every other genin improved and they didn't need any special training from a sanin/ hokage level ninja.

[@wem_iii]

@@masterkc None of Naruto's teachers understood that Naruto was rotating his Chakra the wrong way. I don't think they would have took the time to figure out how to improve his base line because they never took the time to figure out if he was rotating charka correctly.

[@rhuonaChanel]

Which base line? Boy did not even know about elemental nature. 😂😂😂 Meanwhile might gai worked wonders with rock Lee in 1 year

[@monkeyXmonkey]

Jiraiya: Naruto...don't use that jutsu...Naruto: The slightly larger Rasengan? Jiraiya: Yes...

[@sirnetflix7162]

Let's not forget that Kakashi himself also could not infuse his lightning nature into the Rasengan either, which is what gave way to Chidori.

[@bogsilogs]

Probably late to this but I was rewatching Naruto and noticed that when Naruto asked Kakashi to train him for the upcoming Neji fight in the Chuunin exams, Kakashi said that Naruto's fundamental skills like basic chakra control etc. is what holds him back to getting stronger. Which is why Kakashi hired Ebisu (the dude with the sunglasses and in a bonnet) to hire Naruto to improve on his basics. This is the time Naruto and Jiraiya met, and Jiraiya taught him how to walk on water. This is probably what Jiraiya noticed as well and decided to train Naruto on how to master his basics. After the timeskip Naruto basically never runs out of chakra quite as fast compared to part I Naruto. If Naruto didn't train under Jiraiya, he probably couldn't handle all the other training arcs in shippuden.

[@jpcsdutra]

Because Kakashi only had the idea for the Bunshin training post time skip, I don't think it is fair to assume he'd get to the same conclusion before. Kakashi is also a mid teacher before timeskip. He taught the kids some chakra control to do the climb and water walks and a couple other things, but this is something we see all other notable genin being able to do, so it isn't much. It also sticks out like a sore thumb that Kakashi only taught an elemental jutsu to Sasuke, despite supposedly knowing them by the hundreds. Don't get me wrong, I think he'd probably prioritize helping Naruto figure out wind style jutsus because that's Kakashi style of fighting. And maybe he'd teach Naruto to summon dogs too. Seeing Naruto actually profficient in ninjutsu would be dope; but without Jiraiya's training we can't have Sage mode as a payoff. Also, since we see Naruto learn the Rasengan, we know that controlling chakra into a shape like that is hard and we know that "just bigger rasengan" is a massive improvement in chakra control that is something that Naruto needs (and uses quite well, he massively increses the amount and lenght of his Kage Bunshin, you know, the thing that makes the bunshin training possible). I get that people like to meme on Jiraiya's training, but Naruto was a very low tier ninja that solved problems by throwing himself at them and hoping things would be fixed somehow. The fact that he comes home an actual ninja like he actually learned everything he should have before turning into a genin and got caught up with everyone else despite being dense and a slow learner was always a point in Jiraiya's favor.

[@___________0Z0X]

Seriously

[@PureGaming1845]

Kakashi chose sasuke because sasuke has the sharingan and he could more easily use the chidori and learn it by copying the technique. Which made Sasuke literally learn chakra manipulation....You can't do rasengan without chakra manipulation, so that would just go hand and hand. Not to mention sasuke had lightning affinity so obviously he was a better choice for kakashi. Jiraiya literally didn't even BOTHER learning narutos chakra nature. When it was as simple as having a piece of paper and determining what your chakra nature is.....This would already be leaps and bounds above of what jiraiya was teaching him. Even IF naruto DIDN'T learn rasen shuriken naruto would learn other wind-style techniques that would have been a much better edge and diversity than his simple rasengan. Teaching naruto better taijutsu would have been huge too, which wouldn't make naruto get blitzed so hard by sasuke. Sage mode would most likely stay the same remember jiraiya never taught naruto sage mode. So Naruto still would have gone to MT Myoboku regardless whether he was with jiraiya or not. Chakra control would easily be taught to naruto by kakashi. if you're going to learn your element you're going to need to learn chakra control and chakra manipulation. As for the little things to teach kids about water climb and water walks you can't teach kids that have no idea what chakra manipulation is and very little knowledge of what they're capable of. He also, practically brought kids to a A-rank mission that had no business being in and they all survived.....that shouldn't be possible for genin at all. Yet they passed expectations and did well. Everybody improved as characters in terms of strength not counting sakura. The little time sasuke had with kakashi, he became as fast if not faster than rock lee, and was able to learn the chidori which by the flashbacks was VERY hard for sasuke to learn. lIke you're making out chidori as some fodder jutsu when it's a A rank jutsu, oh yes let's have sasuke learn other lighting style jutsu's while sasuke could barely use a single chidori let alone two at the start.

[@Sasukeis6-0againstNaruto]

Kakashi was setting the foundation. Jiraiya mentioned how tree and water walking were important to master Rasengan (chapter 150, page 18). Had the Sanin not stepped in he would have taught them more. He said focusing chakra into your feet is difficult even for masters but it was important to learn because in theory with chakra control you can master any technique (chapter 18). Chidori is an A-rank technique that Guy, Orochimaru, & Hurizen were shocked Sasuke knew. One of the best moves he could teach & in the manga Team 7 are the only genin we see walking on water.

[@jpcsdutra]

@@PureGaming1845 You have to pick a lane when making an argument, buddy. Kakashi can't be a genius for doing one thing and someone else be incompetent for not doing 'genius thing'. Same way he can't be credited by something literally anyone else could, would or should have done. The Chidori being A-Rank and Lightning infusion can't be Kakashi's merit if you're gonna say the bulk of it was done simply by Sasuke having the Sharingan and copying it. Kakashi "teaches" (and teaches is used very loosely. He gives an one sentence explanation at the 3 and leaves them at it for the next week) tree climbing in chapter 18 of the manga, which is absurdely early... and is about the extent of what he trains Naruto and Sakura on. Which is abysmal. We also know even that training didn't go forward because Naruto was shit at walking on water until Jiraya steps in and messes with his seal some 30 chapters later. Kakashi didn't teach Naruto any of the 3 jutsu types, Kakashi could have figured out any of their chakra types right after coming home from the fight with Zabuza, he gave only Sasuke preferential treatment. And it's not like you can say anything about time crunches. Part 1 takes anything between 6 months and a year and all 3 mastered infusing their feet with chakra in a week. The whole "didn't even bother giving Naruto a piece of paper" applies to just about every teacher Naruto had until that point. The academy didn't, Iruka didn't, Kakashi didn't for 300 chapters, Jiraiya didn't. Heck, it's the kind of thing that even Sakura as a ninja nerd could have brought up in casual conversation. Not only that, but Naruto learns more from Asuma's tip on how wind infusion works than Kakashi's cryptic talking... and mind you... Telling Naruto to infuse the rasengan with wind is STILL THE ONLY THING KAKASHI "DID". He didn't pass a single other form of jutsu after that. I don't know why people think he would have bothered doing more when he never did. Kakashi is a mid teacher because he was always good at figuring things out on his own. You also can't dismiss Jiraiya's involvement with Mt Myoboku. Jiraiya and Minato were the only two characters to have a toad contract. Naruto would have never gone there without learning from Jiraiya. It is something that would be physically impossible to any other character. The only reason people dunk on Jiraiya is because Naruto *had* to fail in bringing Sasuke back otherwise the conflict of Shippuden would be over in the first month. Compared to everyone else in the Leaf, Naruto not only caught up but surpassed most of them. He had a glaring knowledge gap in ninjutsu, but compared with part 1 where the only thing he did was outlast everyone, he is leagues different. Jiraiya effectively put him Naruto back on track where the entirety of Konoha failed to teach him anything.

[@jpcsdutra]

@@Sasukeis6-0againstNaruto I believe that the implication was that "it was easy to do but difficult to master" not that it was hard even for masters. Because otherwise the thing Jiraiya says about how walking on water becomes second nature that you can even stop paying attention to what you're doing is a lie. The "jutsu shock" is also pretty much a trope. People at first get shocked at Naruto learning Shadow Clones. They also get shocked at Lee learning the gates. They're all kind of impressive sure, but the Chidori is far from the only instance where someone learned something early, and Naruto's generation was full of amazing people that not only could but did learn a lot early. The thing with only Team 7 doing the water walk might be true, I can't be bothered to check right now, but the tree climb is done in Sasuke's retrieval arc by just about everyone, and in Shippuden this kind of thing is already considered common knowledge to just about every shinobi we see.

[@Lootwurst]

No big Naruto KZbinr seems to get this. The timeskip wasn’t just about making Naruto stronger-it was about guiding his character. Jiraiya was the perfect mentor for that, more like a father than just a teacher. He taught Naruto respect, gratitude, love, and wisdom, giving him a sense of purpose without rushing him or exploiting his Kyuubi chakra. Jiraiya knew Naruto needed more than raw power-he needed to understand who he was and what he wanted to be in the world. This made Kakashi’s later training truly effective; without Jiraiya, Naruto wouldn’t have had the discipline or the drive to push himself the way he eventually did. Naruto wasn’t like Sasuke; he needed love and a mentor who believed in him. Jiraiya understood that better than anyone, and that’s what ultimately unlocked Naruto’s potential.

[@gracenote108]

You just made this up.

[@Dave-gk6si]

@@gracenote108Correct. It’s sad what lengths these fanboys go to defend trash writing.

[@abongilezolanipeterson5588]

It would have been exactly the same as with Jiraiya. Kakashi only trained Naruto after he got his ass whooped. When there was no immediate threat, he was happy to ignore completely his training and read his icha icha series. Naruto did not even know tree walking for Pete's sake after months of being in Kakashi's team, and he only taught em after they almost got killed by Zabuza. Then he neglected their training again and had them go into the chuunin exams without ever teaching em a single jutsu and with them still not knowing what the hell water walking was. The fact is this foo was not interested in training Naruto unless he absolutely had no choice. Jiraiya is exactly the same

[@Sasukeis6-0againstNaruto]

Kakashi said focusing chakra into your feet is difficult even for a master. So he gave them advanced training early on in their Genin days. Setting the foundation for jutsu mastery in the future (early chapter 18). The Chunin exams caught him by surprise. He had them enter by chance (last page of chapter 34).

[@rhuonaChanel]

To be fair, the other jonin sensei weren't handing out techniques to their students either.

[@JoGoat20]

​@@rhuonaChanelwell most of konoha 11 other than team 7 (except rocklee and tenten) were clan kids who focused on their clan techniques than training with their jonin sensei Rocklee was trained properly by might guy. Only tenten was a non clan person who wasn't trained by might guy.

[@rhuonaChanel]

@@JoGoat20 I see your point with the clan kids. And with might gai & rock lee, I think he was more of an apprentice. Apparently, that makes all the difference in Naruto world (understandable since it's based on an older era). Kind of like, tsunade & sakura, orochimaru & sasuke (I think kakashi was going for sasuke to be his apprentice at the start too), after all Gai didn't teach tenten about the gates either. Still, I agree, kakashi had lesser interest in training Naruto till crap hit the fan.

[@JoGoat20]

@@rhuonaChanel Kakashi was only chosen for team 7 becoz he was only one able to teach sasuke utilise his sharingan and keep Naruto in check with his sharingan in case if he ever loses control of nine tails. He was more like their baby sitter until all three went the sannin way with Naruto becoming toad sage , Sakura becoming a renowned medic and Sasuke in his twisted dark path becomes a versatile slick fighter like orochimaru. Sasuke was originally meant to be taught by Kakashi only but he only taught him his signature jutsu before he went orochimaru in his faster quest for power.

[@inesatt1313]

I agree!!! Kakashi should have taught him more!!!

[@halfbee7886]

I believe that the training with Jiraiya consisted more of a training of mind and heart, not necessarily of strength. Jiraiya wanted Naruto to develop what was the most important aspect of becoming a person, a good ninja, in a world full of people with egos, agendas, and tensions among different nations. The ninja world at that time was fragile and it actually needed more people with good hearts, not good strengths. Of course Kakashi could have trained Naruto for strength, but look at how it ended up for Sasuke. Sasuke became strong, but he was still lost as a person. Perhaps Kakashi realized that, so instead of taking Naruto under his supervision, worried that he would repeat the same mistake with training Sasuke, Kakashi let Jiraiya teach Naruto instead. Now after the time-skip, Naruto had develop better mind and heart, Kakashi saw that it was the right time to further develop his skills, from raw strength into actual strength that can win in battles. So by that point, Naruto would have the best in all aspects; mind, heart, and strength. Strength was the last priority because strength alone cannot always end up in good results. Look no further than Orochimaru, Madara, etc. They were all gifted individuals who sought after more and more strength, and the most contribution they made for the world was destruction.

[@razorr_o]

Nice observation!!

[@kibauno]

So everyone else gets a teacher who actually can train them in every aspect that they need and Naruto spends 2.5 years being held back because everyone feels like he's too much of a "child" to be taken seriously. Even Sakura got better training then Naruto did because she was given opportunities. No one ever gives Naruto a chance.

[@carlos.daniel.santmaria5477]

Your chanel is seriously underated. You deserve a lot more subs

[@TheEldarie]

16:54 Actually, wind style is the only basic nature transformation that Kakashi lacks.

[@kenjones9326]

And it's also a rare nature in Konoha.

[@Problemsolver434]

I mean Sasuske could use multiple nature transformations. So could Kakashi. Who says Naruto can't use something other than wind. Other characters in the story can

[@SRVaris]

Actually no Kakashi is also a Master of Wind Style he is noted to be a master of all 5.

[@Mika-me3og]

I actually find that timeskip to be a good one, he may not came out with multiple new skillsets for fighting, but it matured the heck out of him, he also stopped fighting like a clumsy goofball and began to be more serious, which is the perfect tone for shippuden in my opinion

[@MJ-bq6hh]

Naruto should have Also learned through the story… 1) Wind Style Jutsus, 2) Uzumaki Chain techniques, 3) Sage Mode: Needle Jizo and Toad Oil Bullet technique, 4) Raijin Kunai jutsu 5) Kunai Shadow Clone jutsu.

[@hadinasiri1871]

Naruto didn't increase his quantity he increased his Quality

[@justthefacts6902]

I’ve personally always argued that Kakashi was a FAR better teacher to Naruto than jiraiya ever was. Jiraiya trains Naruto for 2 and a half years and he literally makes zero progress. Kakashi trains Naruto for like 3 days and he instantly jumps to kage level. It seemed like jiraiya made it his life’s mission to NOT make Naruto powerful lol. Bro doesn’t even mention sage mode to Naruto and to this day I still cannot figure out why.

[@nightdrivenen7909]

You are ignoring what JIraiya was trying to do for those years: almost two whole years were spent trying to help Naruto begin to master Kyuubi Cloak/ Kyuubi Chakra Mode. The vast majority of that training was in that. With what little time they had left after Jiraiya nearly dies against Naruto; he spent helping Naruto refine himself mentally - physically with basics - and spiritually so that one day Naruto CAN overcome Kurama if needed in their battles. The seal was also so weak by then that Jiraiya was afraid naruto would lose control if anything more harsh was implemented. That is why Yamato was needed to help Naruto learn the Rasenshuriken, his seal was practically 70% broken by then. Hanging on by threads.

[@netero1682]

​@@nightdrivenen7909Totally agree with you, the fandom completely leaves out the fact that Kishimoto's intention was for Naruto to control the Kyubi's power and fail.

[@justthefacts6902]

@@nightdrivenen7909 i get that but it’s pretty insane that Naruto arguably came back after the time skip even weaker than he was when he left. Jiraiya couldn’t also teach Naruto some meaningful jutsu or fighting tactics while also helping Naruto “refine himself mentally” lol why was it one or the other? Just admit it jiraiya was NOT trying to make Naruto more powerful when he trained him.

[@ConsoleSoftaim]

@@justthefacts6902even weaker then when he left is the most ignorant shit I’ve ever seen 😭

[@nightdrivenen7909]

@@justthefacts6902 If you consider trying to help Naruto gain KCM earlier than in the story as not making him more powerful, than sure. I guess you can have that limited view. And continue to ignore that when Naruto's seal was breaking new jutsu and techniqies were almost out of the question due to its instability. Just...sure. Keep ignoring all the context.

[@MisaelMatute76]

So hear me out, because I hear this argument alot - Most people seem to forget or not realize what Jiraya was actually trying to do with Naruto. Naruto was not the average student, that could learn and progress with time. He knew he had very little time for Naruto to have to be able to fight Kage level opponents. Jiraya beleived the way for Naruto to do this, was for him to control the 9 tails. His training was mainly focused on this and he was able to get a few tails, four or five if I'm not mistaken, before loosing control. This was the actual Jiraya training. The whole giant rasengan was never intended by Jiraya, that's actually Naruto's idea. He wanted to create an even more powerful jutsu to his rasengan and did this as a side training. Kakashi then continued the training, but with Yamato helping out. This way they could go past the limit that Naruto could control of the 9 tails. In other words without Naruto first receiving the training from Jiraya, the Kakashi training would not have been possible. And the intention was always for Naruto to learn to control the 9 tails, because having that, he wouldn't need anything else to fight against Akatsky members. So Jiraya didn't fail at training him, it's just that, that was never his focus.

[@JoGoat20]

In this scenario Naruto learns better and faster taijutsu likely with body flicker, better genjutsu resistance, rasenshuriken and many Windstyle jutsus that danzo uses. He also gets promoted to Chunin since hes in the village and gets to participate in Sand chunin exams with his friends. Then at start of shippuden for kazekage arc Naruto would blitz Deidara in first arc and kakashi won't be fainting as he would barely use his ms. For Tenchi bridge mission Kakashi will be present there. Naruto and Kakashi will fight a near sick orochimaru and actually manage to kill him narrowly while getting extremely tired while sakura and yamato fights kabuto to a stalemate. They then find sasuke but he defeats an extremely tired naruto/kakashi and fairly tired sakura/yamato with mid-high difficulty and escapes with kabuto. Sasuke betrays kabuto as usual and organises team hebi to find Itachi while kabuto retrieves orochimarus dna. The original rasenshuriken training arc will now be sage mode arc where naruto after his fight with orochimaru and Sasuke realises he needs to become stronger and more energy efficient as hes not only fighting one but multiple s rank shinobi at once. He can beat one of them but still is weak against a group of them. So he with jirayas help learns sage mode and speed blitzes kakazu actually killing him. This is the arc where he specifically trains properly under jiraya to learn sage mode The filler three tails sealing arc remains same except Naruto taking the lead on sealing three tails in place of shizune due to his knowledge of sealing under kakashis training giving spotlight to Narutos sealing expertise as an uzumaki which will barely be used in non filler arc. The Itachi pursuit arc remains same with Naruto putting good fight with Obito but still unable to stop sasuke. Jiraya dies as usual. Naruto learns of jirayas death and gets cannon sad as he taught him his signature jutsu and made him extremely strong using sage mode. He would still train under toads to further improve his sage mode increasing his time limit, more clones gathering nature energy and more precise and fast frog kata taijutsu. The pain arc mostly remains same except naruto is much stronger with better and efficient sage mode and more versatile arsenal of jutsus. He wont need hinatas intervention and kuramas chakra in this timeline and destroys all bodies of pain by himself with high difficulty. The five kage summit arc - kcm mode training arc remains same except naruto learns of Minato as his father during kcm training than pain arc. The war arc mostly remains the same as kcm mode is too op for normal jutsus to make any difference in outcome of war except he have better sage mode timelimit and experience which leds to neji surviving as he wont have to jump to save a sage mode drained naruto and unguarded hinata. Naruto won't be drained of his sage mode until sasuke and orochimaru squad arrives this time. Outcome of war will remain same with survival of neji. Also naruto likely gets promoted to jonin after war instead of having to study for it as hes already studied everything a jonin needs to learn under kakashi during his training period. The timeline becomes similar to cannon from here no changes.

[@kibauno]

This would have been much better for Naruto then what he actually got.

[@hahayayak3620]

I agree that his post timeskip power was really underwhelming but it was probably for the best because if not, then the viewers would feel like we missed out on a lot of the experience and training. It wasn’t like One piece where we got several episodes to see how the Straw hats trained during the timeskip

[@omarhossamsamir]

You have to remember that rasen shuriken was probably not possible for pre time skip Naruto Naruto's improvement as a Shinobi allowed him to start working on harder things like rasen shuriken which would have required a lot more chakra control than pre time skip Naruto and remember him making the rasengan bigger taught him the basics of altering the rasengan this training with jiraiya also improved him mentally which opened his mind a bit which allowed him to start working for sage mode confronting kurama and learning the rasen shuriken so a lot of Naruto's development happened because of that three year time skip with jiraiya I just doubt that Naruto would get that with kakashi

[@jonathanwolfe2692]

Kakashi would have ABSOLUTELY taught Naruto Minato's Flying Raijin Jutsu, and likely fire chakra nature as well so that he could synergize with his own shadow clones (and toads) to use incredibly powerful wind (and oil) enhanced fire style jutsu effectively by himself. Enhancing even the weakest of fire jutsu to insane levels via numbers. Made even MORE effective if he spends some shadow clone training time on his chakra control (which they kind of skipped due to his insane amount of chakra, but with better control he would increase both the efficiency of such large scale jutsu, and of his shadow clone training method), preventing both jutsus, and the shadow clone training method from being as exhausting and/or stressful, and/or allowing for longer, and/or even larger (with more clones) training sessions in the future. Frankly I would have had him shadow clone train chakra control first and foremost from day one as it would lead to a cycle of exponential growth. He would grow his control quickly due to the clones, which would only make the clone training more effective, speeding the growth of his control even further until his mastery surpassed even Tsunade's and Sakura's. Then I would start teaching him jutsu, easily making up for time lost in control training as the process could only but increase the speed and efficiency of the shadow clone method of training with other jutsu, and of his sage training later due to his level of chakra control mastery.

[@JohnMezzo]

Naruto should've figured out the shadow clone experience transfer exploit, during the time-skip (at the latest), because he uses it more often and creates more clones than the entire rest of the cast combined, rather than having minimal progress for 2 or 3 years, then needing Kakashi to spoon-feed him an explanation for this hilariously overpowered ability to learn difficult techniques in record time and instantly refill his Sage Mode meter by using shadow clones like videogame consumables.

[@JoGoat20]

Actually shadowclone training came into kishimotos mind much later when he realised Naruto is too weak and far behind and wanted a way for him to rapidly catch up in power gap

[@JohnMezzo]

@@JoGoat20 I assumed the real world reason was Kishimoto hadn't thought of it yet, and somehow didn't recognize how overpowered it was. And what in-universe justification could there possibly be, to explain why Naruto isn't still using it? Hokage Naruto should know almost, if not every non-bloodline technique in the village, and have the largest, most versatile moveset in the series.

[@JoGoat20]

@@JohnMezzo i think he likely does. Naruto also gains access to all five chakra nature's and 3 kekkeigenkai releases (boil, lava and magnet) after the war. He's already shown using earth style twice. It's just that his signature move like Kakashi and Sasuke with chidori are. He doesn't even use rasenshuriken in boruto even tho it's his most powerful jutsu but rather a spirit bomb version of rasengan. I think he did learned multiple jutsus with handsigns during the period between war arc and last movie. The last movie version of his was likely strongest one. He does becomes a bit rusty once he gets married and becomes a father.

[@turningintoacrazydolphin1211]

Also, if Naruto stayed in Konoha, he can continue to go in missions, so he could gain actual fighting experience

[@kghd2647]

It's honestly so disappointing how small Naruto's offensive arsenal is for most of the show

[@ovidiuvergil]

The issue that is quite ignored is that Naruto actually grew a lot in he timeskip. He did not learn new jutsus BUT: He went from someone who was the bottom of his class and needed multiple clones to defeat Kiba in a mele fight to being a taijutsu user capable enough of facing off against S level ninjas like Pain, Granny Chiyo and Kakashi(obviously I mean in a taijutsu fight). He went from having one of the worst chakra controls in the series to the point where he could manipulate the size and shape of his chakra rapidly, so it was Jiraiya's training that didn't just allow him to learn the Odama Rasengan, but also the other rasengan variations that he used against Pain and during the war. So he really mastered 2 of the most important basic skills of a shinobi and without them he wouldn't have been able to properly use all the powerfull techniques that he developed later. Without Jiraiya's training achieving the tailed beast bomb in such a short time would not have been possible and he wouldn't have been nearly as capable against Pain or during the war. So Jiraiya was the one who helped Naruto go from an unskilled genin whose only redeeming qualities were his huge chakra level and his tenacity to a high tier shinobi.

[@loliH9]

I'm not saying this just because Jiraiya is one of my favorites but the important part of Jiraiya's training was ideological and philosophical. Without his teachings, he could've never made Nagato and Obito turn to his side.

[@haro6025]

Yeah i agree his training was mentally more then physically

[@nightdrivenen7909]

Probably because two years of their training was Jiraiya trying to help Naruto get control over Kurama and nearly died a couple of times for it. Nearly destroyed Naruto's Seal - but the goal was to try and get Naruto to unlock KCM even if not mastered. But that failed horribly because the balance between Naruto's Chakra and Kurama's was too great at the time and Naruto did not have the mental fortitude or spiritual balance needed yet. So - thus one year was spent on a lot of softer training.

[@airimatsu]

Naruto was already good at talk no jutsu before time skip tho

[@haro6025]

@@airimatsu his talk no jutsu wasn't strong enough to make someone suicide for him

[@loliH9]

@haro6025 He got Zabuza to do that on his first try, but Zabuza didn't have convictions as strong as the higher-ups of the Akatsuki. Without Jiraiya's philosophy, he would never get through to Nagato and would've never bothered to save Obito. Kakashi himself gave up on Obito, even after absorbing his personality as a homage.

[@thegamemingk4933]

I think they did it this way is to avoid the "I did some mining of camera and now have 6 chest with only full diamond stacks" stuff

[@Jared39480]

My biggest problem with Naruto's character was that he didnt have a diverse arsenal. Like you said, he would spam shadow clones and rasengan. I thought he needed more tools and jutsu before reaching sage mode.

[@ccore__]

his skillset was always more of a quality based and how he was tacky and intuitive with the moves he had in his arsenal rather then quantity and having a large share. due to his nature and personality of being kind of a smart idiot having it that way fits his persona you know

[@yahboyx]

Jiraiya may not have given naruto the best skills but he put the ground work for naruto and also his philosophy was the most important thing he gave to naruto

[@adrian_veidt]

Right. Kakashi would've teached Naruto something really useful like the nature manipulation and breaking genjutsu. Jiraiya wasn't necessarily a bad teacher. The problem is he focused on the wrong subject to study. I believe he's not actually qualified to train Naruto how to control his bijuu. He lacked the knowledge, facility and tools. Bee was a perfect jinchuuriki so it made sense he's the one to train naruto on that. This is why I prefer when Togashi wrote Genkai as Yusuke's teacher in Yu Yu hakusho. She really made yusuke physically strong and slapped him(a slacker) into maturity.

[@vannieuwenbergwilliam7792]

1) Kakashi did not teach Naruto rasenshuriken. He gave a vague idea about infusing Naruto's element into the rasengan and since Naruto's affinity was wind, that only Danzô and Asuma are known to have in Konoha in the canon, he told him to ask Asuma. The shadow clone training was a plot device to catch up after the atrocious results of his training up to this very arc. For sage mode, he only used 2 clones and finished the training in under 2 weeks, completely atomizing the learning speed of ANY sage mode apprentice EVER (even with cumulated time, that's 6 weeks max to go from needing PIS to hit Kakuzu and blitzing most of Pain's bodies and destroying them with ease when Kakashi was struggling with a single one and couldn't get the main one even with assistance). Past that point, Kakashi taught Naruto nothing at all, and the last thing he taught him before kage bunshin plot device was literally tree walking in the 1st arc. Naruto CREATED rasenshuriken BY HIMSELF out of some vague instructions. Kakashi failed to do the same with lightning. Naruto owns. 2) Fukasaku was the single best teacher Naruto EVER had. Took a rock out of a pile and turned it into a diamond. In under two weeks. Respect the toad elder, give credit where credit is due. From generic weakling jônin with a powerful but unusable ultimate technique, he made Naruto completely outclass Kakashi in every category except versatility. Give Sage Naruto Danzô's wind slicing AoE technique and he trashes Akatsuki except for Tobi due to his invulnerability. Put Sage Naruto in Minato's place in the 3rd war and instead of wasting chakra teleporting tens of times after throwing his kunai, you'd have Naruto summon a few clones and using a multilayered slicing wind technique and instantly make sliced ham out of the enemies on the battlefield without ever being in range for a counter attack. 3) Being in Konoha means being able to ask Temari if she can help him learn wind style. Considering he's got 10x her chakra pool, he'd be able to throw attacks of the level of her summon from the Sasuke rescue arc. Also being able to see Lee and Gai more often, he'd be able to get a little hyped by their physical performance and start training with weights, improving his base stats, as well as learning to take their hits (and they hit hard). Being in Konoha means improving his friendships and developing him as a person instead of coming back completely out of the loop and not knowing anything new about his "friends" he abandoned 2 and a half years ago. If he trained with Kiba, he'd think about teaming up with his summons more often. 4) Not being on the run means he can take time to learn his summons better and get good at fighting with them. Which improves his affinity to toads and increases his chance of learning about sage mode. So maybe he'd get to the beginning steps of learning it early and get Fukasaku to teach him the toad katas, the best martial arts style in the verse. Forget about academy derived styles, toad katas stomp. 5) Kakashi could teach him to use shunshin, something he doesn't seem to use much (hard to tell when the characters never say when they're using it and the only telling is the smoke cloud Kakashi leaves behind him). Hiding like a mole and the head hunter technique would make for good techniques after his Neji fight in the finals of the chûnin exams. 6) In Konoha, Naruto could pass the CE and be promoted before the end of the time skip, have access to a lot more resources, from money to teachers and scrolls, but he'd also learn some responsibilities. So a grown up Naruto wouldn't be constantly trying to do everything by himself and act childishly, he'd be responsible. 7) Rivalry with Neji>Neji becomes a jônin>fuels Naruto's motivation. So he gets more resources, more opportunities to develop as a character and as a shinobi, promotion opportunities, strengthens his bonds...he'd get better in every single aspect of his character, instead of coming back as the same attention seeking child we got in part 1, with less emotional control than Anakin Skywalker when he learned his mother had been kidnapped and tortured by Tusken raiders. From there, he'd be more stable to develop his relationship with the 9T instead of the rage ball we saw up until sage training in the canon story.

[@zzzxxx7294]

Doubt it's a matter of jiraya being a bad teacher, it's just bad writing in that segment.

[@GGBGameplays]

My disapointment after the time skip is that Naruto didn't learn any real new ability. I was expecting Naruto to use different styles of jutsus during battles (before knowing about chakra nature afinity), or at least using his shadow clones in smarter ways. Jiraiya could have teached Naruto to use his chakra nature in combat, for sharpening weapons, or creating some long range attacks. I also could see Naruto using some clones around the enemy to infuse wind chakra and creat some kind of vortex. The vortex could cause some damage to the enemy inside, or could be use just as a prision, making it possible to come from above with a rasengan attack. Releasing wind chakra from the foots could also be used as form of impulsion, Naruto could be very fast in battle, and could do suprise rasengan attacks more easily.

[@wem_iii]

This isnt a fair comparison because Kakashi was able to train Naruto after he became a better shinobi due to Jiraya already training him. Before that Kakashi failed Naruto as his teacher.

[@Iruka1991]

13:00 Not even that. There was no rush to train Naruto. If in the original canon they felt like they could waste two years with shitty training with Jiraiya, then with two more years they could easily take it easy, at a greater peace than normal training.

[@4dojo]

His number of jutsus didnt increase much, but sometimes how you use your abilities is even more impotant, and Naruto definitely became a much more competent fighter during those three years. Before the time skip he was still kind of a immature and not very good at using his own abilities. Afterwords he was argueablely on a Jonin level.

[@Sadpotatoirl2010]

yeah... he was too spoiled with his highly ranked justus like shadow clone and rasengan and just spammed it every damn time. And his tailed beast chakra is literally a cheat code. Kakashi is so skilled young trainer.

[@silentfate]

Man... traveling with jiraiya naruto was wandering and his location was relatively well hidden. If he stayed in the village the enemies chasing him would need enough force to fight their way through the village or even destroy it if need be... man, I hope such a bad guy doesn't exist... especially under the name of an emotion.

[@SRVaris]

Well actually the Akatsuki wasn't after Naruto at the time they would only start hunting him Three Years after part one as said by Jiraiya in Chapter 237 "When I Was Investigating Orochimaru's "Immortality Jutsu" Information Concerning Akatsuki Came To Light. They Won't Be After You For At Least Three Or Four Years From Now."

[@justinarzola4584]

Jiraya is a great chatacter but it was a shame he didn't teach naruto much of his teqniques in the time skip.

[@prince_sharma___]

After his training. He was an elite shinobi. An elite jonin level He accompanied Kakashi as a partner not student. There's was no one better than jiraiya for Naruto

[@Sreehari_ns]

He was chunin level then

[@nik700]

5:06 Well... that was the one thing he did learn with Jiraiya, as shown in their second test against Kakashi when he returns. Also, Naruto wouldn't be able to fully master the Rasenshuriken without Sage mode due to the damage to his arm

[@SRVaris]

"Naruto wouldn't be able to fully master the Rasenshuriken without Sage mode due to the damage to his arm" Naruto still could still train and fully master it as he could just use a Clone instead of his real body(yes it would pop the clone but he could still train with it somewhat and over 3 YEARS of training I have zero doubt he would find a way to make it effective)

[@JoGoat20]

he doesn't need sage mode to master rasenshuriken. Few months of throwing rasenshuriken by using clones would do it

[@jermelhooks4558]

Did you forget in the 1st part of Naruto Jiraiya taught Naruto summoning jutsu that's how he defeated Gara

[@godlotus8329]

Things Naruto should have learned during timeskip: 1. Understand basics of 5 elements 2. Learn one Wind style jutsu he can use 3. Actually control the 1-3 tail mode. (Like naruto literally lost his shit at 2 tails) 4. Combination jutsu with Gamakichi (Not that filler combo jutsu)

[@KDawg92801]

5. SAGE MODE. Then he could’ve gotten KCM against pain.

[@ZayTh3God]

@@KDawg92801how tho? The old toad dude didn’t make a prediction until 5 kage summit and kcm destroys deva path and sage mode Naruto would’ve dog walked shippuden up until the pain fight

[@serkanlunkaya1896]

FINALLY! Someone had to say this! Thank you!

[@cloudyven39]

The early parts of the timeskip will probably have to cover for Naruto's shortcomings before the timeskip same as in canon. The difference would probably be with his Nine tails training with Jiraiya. I think instead Kakashi would train Naruto proper chakra control eventually leading to Naruto learning his elemental affinity (and maybe another element?). Kakashi probably would teach Naruto a lot of jutsus to deal with various situations and reinforce the need to diversify over relying on only a single jutsu but I think at some point work towards the Rasenshuriken will take place. So in the end, we could see a versatile Naruto well-equipped to deal with any situation who's DEFINITELY promited to Chunin-rank by the time the series continues.

[@Grivian]

Jiraiya is like the tutor who spends hours every day to ensure that a student understands and masters everything from the fundamental to the advanced. Kakashi is the type of teacher who gives one hint during a phd thesis then disappears yet everyone gives him credit for the revolutionary research. In short Jiraiya is a much better teacher than Kakashi. Jiraiya taught Naruto all the vital things that you take for granted and Naruto relies on. Skills that were absolutely necessary to learn the rasenshuriken, KCM, sage mode. Yet people only care about the "cool" results. Kakashi didn't even teach Naruto, he just supervised the training process and Naruto taught himself. In fact Kakashi is like Steve Jobs in that regard.

[@i.q.1979]

Since Jiraiya trained Naruto, shouldn't Naruto know at least one or two things about spying and espionage?

[@Dave102693]

This

[@i.q.1979]

@@Dave102693 What?

[@christianjensen9174]

This

[@i.q.1979]

@@christianjensen9174 What does 'This' means?

[@christianjensen9174]

@@i.q.1979 Oh sorry, it means that we're agreeing with your comment. It's a like short way of saying 'This needs to be pointed out more', because in anime it does seem as though the spying and espionage part of Naruto's training was overlooked. Have a nice day my friend!

[@doctor-jw]

It can be argued that Kakashi was able to move Naruto forward only because Jaraiya spent roughly 3 helping him build a stronger foundation. Having a powerful base was essential to Naruto learning his advanced techniques.

[@alter6243]

Naruto coming back not insanely op is very appreciated in retrospect. Naruto is often bashed for how cliche it is but Naruto is probably the only shonen MC to not come out of a training time skip stupidly op. Tell me one shonen where the MC comes out of a time skip and doesn’t immediately body people. That was the benefit of having the two main characters separate. Sasuke could bring the power fantasy you wanted to see while Naruto brought the emotion.

[@GenJuhru]

Ichigo too, as he kept getting a reset as Tite Kubo "tried" to conclude the series.

[@internetjerk2839]

Except Sasuke is an unlikable edge lord so him being OP isn't power fantasy it's just frustrating cause before the timeskip the two were dead even plus you don't need to make Naruto OP to show growth that's jumping from one extreme to the other a middle ground would have been better

[@jasonmoukala8909]

@@internetjerk2839how’s he an edgelord

[@andremarques3317]

doing worse than the cliche is not the way to solve the problem with a cliche. And its not even a bad cliche, its just how things work in real life when you lose track of someone's development during a long training period and then suddenly see how they are after that time lol being anti-cliche here is pretty pointless, it adds nothing to the story by being different

[@Grayson-Winchester]

Since there wasn't really something going on during the timeskip Kakashi could have also moved outside the village

[@justinarzola4584]

Kakashi in the anime was spying on rain village and helped organize the chunin exams,the manga though didn't really explain much of what happened during the time skip.

[@gruntfrostwolf]

Minmaxing in theory is easy, but storywise I think Jiraiya is more of a relatable father figure to Naruto than Kakashi, I think it's alright for the story. You can't always make the optimal choice in a story.

[@SunlightGwyn]

Kakashi was Naruto’s worst teacher. He didn’t teach Naruto and Sakura any techniques besides running up a tree. Kakashi knew Rasengan and didn’t even bother trying to teach it to Naruto. Kakashi allegedly knows 1000 jutsu and none of them were taught to Naruto or Sakura. He didn’t teach Naruto about chakra natures until Shippuden but he taught Lighting style to Sasuke in Part 1. Jiraiya and Iruka weren’t good teachers either but they taught Naruto far more techniques (clone jutsu, walking on water, summoning jutsu, rasengan, giant rasengan) in less time than Kakashi.

[@justinarzola4584]

Kakashi did make up for it by teaching Naruto the rasenshuriken.

[@SunlightGwyn]

@@justinarzola4584 He didn’t teach him the Rasen Shuriken, he helped him invent it. So Naruto did half the work if not more to invent it.

[@Sadpotatoirl2010]

If not by Kakashi's favouritsm. He could make Naruto a real beast much earlier.

[@charlesreed7935]

He had less than a year with them and they were forced to go to bad missions before the chunin exams Then during that time they all went their own ways and strayed away from him

[@TheSleepyProdigy]

He only took Naruto to protect him from the Akatsuki in the first place, the training was just a little extra he was pretty much buying time.

[@ivanbluecool]

Expectation: Naruto gets strong and wise while the seal stays tighter and more secure Reality: Naruto tries to make a shidori rasensgan fusion

[@LukeP-k8g]

I'm just imagining Naruto using an improved wind style chidori nagashi just blowing away all of Sasuke's bolts 😂

[@flamephantom248]

Rewrite part 34 please

[@junierose3917]

word 😭😭😭

[@jag-hw7wd]

The only good content on his channel atm ngl

[@MoonS4444]

34? o_O

[@qwirkt]

Let him cook, it’s these what ifs that feed his thinking for rewrites

[@jag-hw7wd]

@@qwirkt He already covered this in his rewrite tho 😭

[@Xzilesenju]

This is something I legit never thought about, mainly at the fact that Jiraiya didn't do much for him. When it comes to his skills.

[@Naven251]

If Kakashi had trained Naruto in the timeskip then he would die to Naruto going Kyuubi and Kakashi being too weak to stop him lmao.

[@justinarzola4584]

Kakashi put that seal Jiraya gave him on Naruto when he went one tail against Deidara,he wouldn't stand a chance doing that with a four tail Naruto or six tails.

[@ayhamahmad2277]

To fix the issues is to aid more arc and give him more jutsu but that work in the weekly manga and the editor didn't allow kishimoto to aid more arc like he wanted and just look what happens to side characters because kishimoto didn't have enough time to give them and he didn't want to deal with too many jutsu

[@giannixx]

Gotta respect Gamakichi, it was thanks to him that Naruto and the others figured out that Senjutsu was effective against Juubito.

[@NerdishGeekish]

I think Jirayia was all sensei'd out after taking care of the hidden rain orphans and was like "Welp, taught him Rasengan. Job done!" with Naruto.

[@SuperKamiGuru831]

We don’t see the power up we wanted for Naruto until he gets sage mode halfway thru shippuden

[@morganshifflett4994]

This is what happens when you have incredibly good genetics and a literal demon inside you. You become very strong Shinobi.

[@VitaminDealer]

When I imagine Kakashi training Naruto during the time skip, I imagine it's like Jiraiyas train as in the two of them are on there own outside the village

[@brendanbonus3211]

Kakashi trains Naruto for the first time since the bell test😂 I guess he technically trained him to run up trees but still

[@law244]

Minato for sure added his Nature (Fire) to the Rasengan and the reason he doesn't use it is 3 fold it's 1. it's forbidden meaning it harms the user 2. it takes too long to launch 3. it would be overkill most of the time.

[@SRVaris]

"Minato for sure added his Nature (Fire) to the Rasengan" UHH Minato is a Lightning Nature.

[@TylenArcher-c1e]

If Kakashi trained Naruto than Naruto would be a Chunin.

[@Prince_Luci]

Idk i feel like the orochimaru Jirayia teacher comparison kinda misses the point. Sure Sasuke learned a bunch of cool jutsu and stuff, but Jirayia taught Naruto how to be a good man who values his friends above all else. He passes on that a true hero puts his life on the line to save what matters to him. He further instills a love and respect for the leaf and even its people. It’s why Sasuke eventually looses and Naruto eventually wins. All the powers and abilities in the world won’t help you in a fight against someone fighting for what they love and will die to protect. And thus passing down that love is what enables Naruto to break the cycle of hatred and saved the ninja world. Being able to summon a wider variety of toads wouldn’t have helped much on his path to world peace. That being said, Kakashi training Naruto in countering sharingan jutsu would genuinely be useful for Naruto and that one should’ve been canon.

[@winstonstrange6732]

Congratulations on over 100k iv ben here fore theups and downs hope i can be on your level one day

[@Theatriman]

this hypothetical naruto might already be ready for pain if he learned flying raijin

[@koalteufel7947]

I attribute Narutos lack of power post-time skip to bad writing. Jiraya would've definitely taught him a lot more IMO.

[@muhammadsubhan6051]

I agree with dygo. It really was very disappointing seeing Naruto after time skip.

[@American-Neenja]

nah, what if Naruto was kidnapped and trained by Orochimaru after that fight with Sasuke...that would have been a hell of a thing

[@watcher314159]

I always say people underestimate just how much Naruto's taijutsu improved under Jiraiya, and how much his fundamentals being improved laid a foundation for his future training. Rasenshuriken would have been worthless without Naruto's base speed reaching a jounin level standard, for example. But even so, the opportunity cost of not having years of shadow clone training is insane. And Kakashi's version of shadow clone training is insanely inefficient, but over 3 years he'd refine it to something way more effective. The actually efficient way to use shadow clone training, btw, is surprisingly simple and actually works (to a degree) for anyone who can maintain at least 2 clones, so Kakashi would also get exponentially stronger once he helped Naruto figure out the trick. And the trick is simply to stagger the dispelling of the clones. Let's say you have enough chakra to maintain 1 clone for 3 hours or 3 clones for 1 hour to keep the math easy (it gets more impressive the more clones you have). Naruto obviously does the 3 for 1 hour style of training, so let's compare that with training with 3 clones, dispelling 1 every 30 minutes (or when the past runs out of chakra). Naruto and his 3 clones get 240 minutes of training done in 60 minutes, and he has to deal with 180 minutes of mental strain from processing clone memories. Staggerto trains for 97.5 minutes and gets 420 minutes worth of experience out of it at the cost of only 187.5 minutes worth of mental strain. Naruto would have actually done better just training with 1 clone for a total of 360 minutes of experience in 180 minutes and 180 minutes of mental strain. But let's try Staggerto (ie same total chakra) doubling the clones to 6 and dispelling 1 every 6 minutes (and the last when it runs out). That's 60 minutes of training (vs Naruto training for 30) and gaining 2292 minutes worth of experience (vs Naruto gaining 210) for only 150 minutes of mental strain (vs Naruto with 180). And yes, Naruto did accidentally use this more efficient method a couple of times, when one clone had a breakthrough. But it wasn't a formal part of the training method he was assigned and his efficiency suffered immensely for it. And yes, I could make this even more efficient with a little calculus to determine the optimal dispelling interval. Or by having clones make a new clone before dispelling. And so on and so forth until waste energy and overhead costs dominate the process and further optimization becomes counterproductive.

[@jhardi_official366]

Stronger doesn't necessary mean better teacher

[@junkmail1336]

The fact that Naruto didn’t use the shadow clone strategically is how he beat Negi. Naruto’s lack of strategic awareness was how he always surprised more experienced opponents!