What If The Dinosaurs Hadn't Died Off?

[@KevinRoboticsEDU]

Last winter I visited the Dinosaur Resource Center in Colorado. They told me how most dinosaur species have only ever been identified by their teeth (usually the hardest bones in any animal.) A lot of the skeletons we saw on display were the result of 3D scanning what bones we COULD find to extrapolate the shapes of those missing (i.e. mirroring the left arm to make the right.) Most of their exhibits are at least partially 3D printed, and they sometimes color-code the filament so visitors can identify which pieces weren't unearthed naturally.

[@mikescholz6429]

Jurassic Park 3 in 2001 was probably the first time a large number of people were exposed to 3D printing.

[@nickkorkodylas5005]

Vast majority of dino teeth fossil are considered undiagnostic for below subfamily status and therefore labeled as nomina dubia. The number of valid dinos species known only from dental remains can be counted in one had.

[@83shaunam]

My cat usually pays zero attention to the TV, but he watched this video with rapt attention for a solid 20 minutes. Lol

[@shoutingfactory3694]

Had he been for a procedure? The one time my cat watched a program with rapt attention, he was high as a kite having recently been sedated for an ultrasound lol

[@TheOriginalKayo]

These comments were great on so many levels 😂😂😂

[@ravenlord4]

Harry Harrison wrote an interesting sci-fi series called the "Eden Trilogy" that explores the scenario of the K-T meteor never hitting, and a dinosaur species achieving sentience and advanced technology through chemistry and biology rather than mechanical or electrical. And they have to deal with isolated humans who have only made it to the hunter-gather stage. It is a well thought out "what if" alternate history :)

[@TheArklyte]

If that's the author of Stainless Steel Rat and Deathworld fame, then I have always called him Garry Garrison and never knew it spelled like that... woops😅

[@BooksRebound]

Oh cool. I was thinking of the K'Chain Che'Malle from Malazan Book of the Fallen. It's an epic fantasy series about the Malazan Empire and it's wars and their effect on the people caught up in them. It's incredible. The best and largest epic fantasy I've ever read (and I've read a lot). But the world has 4 founding races: Jaghut, Imass, Assail, and the K'Chain. K'Chain are hyper intelligent dinosaurs that built massive cities and have gravity manipulation magic. They don't feature THAT much in the series cause they were driven nearly to extinction like 300 000yrs ago when they had a civil war between the K'Chain Che'Malle and K'Chain Nahruk, then the survivors got clapped when the Tiste invaded this world due to their own civil war between Mother Dark and Father Light back in their own world. If you like epic fantasy and enjoy a challenging read that doesn't spoon feed you every little detail, I highly recommend Malazan. It's like this beautiful puzzle to figure out, and it has the best characters and the most devastating deaths I've read in fiction. If you think the Red Wedding was bad, just you wait lol.

[@b.g.5869]

Achieving sentience? Do you honestly think dinosaurs lacked sentience? It isn't necessary to have human type intelligence in order to be considered "sentient". Sentience simply means possessing some degree of awareness. Dinosaurs were vertebrates with brains similar to birds and alligators; it would be absurd to imagine they were not sentient.

[@ravenlord4]

@@b.g.5869 Thank you PETA, and re-read the ENTIRE sentence. And try context rather than cherry picking next time. Cheers, and have a better day, and throw another steak on the barbie 😄😆😂

[@BooksRebound]

@@b.g.5869 you know what they meant...

[@Pasha-dd7te]

Surprised, Dinotopia wasn't mentioned.

[@JetfireQuasar]

Underrated series

[@ShayDeeYT]

Thank you for all the work you and the team do on videos; i watch them to fall asleep... then three videos later am still awake. I appreciate the thought-provoking entertainment.

[@michaelporzio7384]

What do you call a Dinosaur from Houston? Tyrannosaurus Tex.

[@skateboardingjesus4006]

Isaac's joke should have been, "What do you call a dinosaur demolition derby"? "Tyrannosaurus Wrecks".

[@sailornaut-2014]

What do you call Dinosaur food in Texas? Texanosaurus Mex

[@floridaman4073]

Tex-Rex

[@wesleyhoward5599]

Someone needs to ask Chat GPT what it would be like if Isaac Arthur went into standup comedy.

[@morwickchesterham3875]

What do you call a female dino from Lesbos, Greece... who hunts other female dinos, and eats them? A Lesboraptor.

[@kataseiko]

If you look at birds, larger doesn't always mean more intelligent. If you make a crow bigger, it doesn't automatically become more intelligent. An emu or a nandu is about as tall as we are, and while there's some intelligence in there, they are easily outwitted by crows.

[@TheWhitefisher]

If you make a crow bigger you don't get a ratite; you get a bigger corvid, like a raven, which is smarter. You're correct that overall size doesn't correlate with intelligence but your reasoning takes a wrong turn in that comparing two very different groups of birds doesn't mean anything.

[@ericvondell5157]

@@kataseiko It's NOT so much How Big Your Brain Is, Or How many Neurons Your Brain Has That Matters Most. It's How Well You Use What Brain You Have!🦖

[@0cujo0]

They had a documentary about this - It was called the Flintstones

[@4124V4TA-SNPCA-x]

Good content! 😂 And also Denver the Last Dinosaur.

[@4Fixerdave]

I think the Flintstones was a documentary about our future. You know, when we de-extinct some dinos and the AI then decides we aren't smart enough to play with technology. Yeah, we're never going to make the Jetsons... no flying cars for us. Nope.

[@bobinthewest8559]

@@4Fixerdave… Look at our roads, traffic and accident statistics. Do you REALLY want flying cars???

[@4Fixerdave]

@@bobinthewest8559 Yeah... that's EXACTLY what the AI is going to say. You.... you PEOPLE.... no fly for you. You get pedal power and that's it. ;) Sigh... we'll probably be better off.

[@shawn092182]

​@@4Fixerdave A flying car did exist in the Flintstones. Barney invented one.

[@karatekan2182]

The idea that dinosaurs had less advanced thermoregulation than modern mammals is looking increasingly less likely. Numerous dinosaur fossils have been discovered in areas that would have been very close to the poles, which even with the warmer climate would imply the ability to survive extremely harsh winters. Additionally, like birds, dinosaur physiology might have even presented advantages in terms of thermoregulation. Air sacs and pneumaticized bones enable birds to have much greater respiratory capacity than mammals, and appear to have been common even in large dinosaurs, like titanosaurs.

[@TheRezro]

First of dinosaurs didn't extinct. They literally are birds. Dinosaurs in fact look closer to them then the lizards.

[@karatekan2182]

@@TheRezro “Dinosaurs” weren’t birds, birds are descendants of certain dinosaurs.

[@TheRezro]

@@karatekan2182 It is literally the same argument like that humans aren't monkeys.

[@karatekan2182]

@@TheRezro …We aren’t monkeys, we are apes

[@formes2388]

@@TheRezro Humans are NOT monkeys. That is a full stop truth. The last common ancestor for modern humans and monkey's died off some 25 million years ago. The last common ancestor for gorilla's - is something like 15 million years ago, and the last common ancestor for chimps is something like 8 million years ago. Humans, ARE categorized as Great Apes, we are NOT monkeys. We good with that? Good. This being said: While Avian species find ancestry back to that of dinosaurs, they themselves are typically NOT dinosaurs. They are not a fossilized reptile - by nature of still being alive, and largely... not fossilized. They are not outdated, nor obsolete (by fact they are still in existence). More to the point - Dinosaurs typically refer to creatures that existed from ~252 million years ago, to about ~66 million years ago. If you want old, still in existence species the list is something like: Horsehow crap, jellyfish and... maybe sharks? In terms of a species - sharks first evolved something like 380-420 million years ago.

[@rjoshb]

As a geologist that likes to S-Post I need to say that this was when flowering plants first started to flourish. I think the dinosaurs all sneezed to death from hay fever.

[@octoscorpion2506]

Most people don't realise how badly allergies can affect you. There were many days of suffering that made me wish I was 💀. I like your hypothesis.

[@NIKIOKADA]

Thanks!

[@isaacarthurSFIA]

You bet!

[@LuDux]

There's this short story: aliens make a stop on moon for minor repairs and in free time zoologists visit Earth where they witness fight between dinosaur and humanoid. They kill dinosaur, spread anti-dinosaur virus and leave. But it was dinosaurs shooting movie about evil humanoids

[@mathewdruggan8877]

Boy does this episode bring back some memories Isaac. Many moons when I attended elementary school in Columbus I did my 3rd grade science fair project on the impact hypothesis and connected it with use of nuclear weapons detonated far enough out in sequential "shells" around the earth to deflect them. I ended up getting 2nd place as it was deemed "science fiction" and not actual science ... at the time 😂. The person I lost out 1st place had made a cast with bottle caps all over the cast to allow for someone to poke and prod their mending limb in case they needed to scratch an itch 😒

[@andrewstrongman305]

The primary reasons no (therapod) dinosaur could have evolved a humanoid body are that they were already bipedal, their shoulders were not adapted for climbing or swinging, and they could not pronate their wrists (required for climbing without claws).

[@KuraKekoa]

What do you call a dinosaur accident? Not covered by my insurance.

[@isaacthedestroyerofstuped7676]

Too real...

[@lukehahn4489]

lucky if they'll pay for a tow

[@bobinthewest8559]

@@lukehahn4489… I doubt they’d pay, even just for the Dino’s broken toe. 😉

[@echothegecko2875]

​@lukehahn4489 A Towrannousarus for all your Rex

[@yamsyamsevolution9712]

I think it would have been much easier to hack computers if the dinosaurs hadn’t gone extinct. There is no way a Tyrannosaurus rex would have a complicated password with those arms.

[@lukehahn4489]

clearly you do not know the Sleestak

[@TheRezro]

Dinosaurs literally didn't extinct. They fly outside my window.

[@10aDowningStreet]

KFC wouldn't exist without dinosaurs and meteors.

[@cosmictreason2242]

This comment is accidentally true but the logic is wrong lol. At face value it's true even though the world is 6000 years old

[@tomtom7955]

idk if its true but i always heard kfc made it big in ww2 , something about the japs liking the secret herbs and spices , it help conceal the the fact their chicken was spoiled. it tasted better than horse meat.

[@ericvondell5157]

@@10aDowningStreet Of Course IT Would.... It'd Just Be Kentucky Fried Crocodile! Or Kentucky Fried Catfish! (Remember The Bird Flu epidemic?!) 💖

[@projectarduino2295]

T-Rex moon landing would be like: “One big step for a t-Rex, and, uh, a bigger leap for t-Rex kind.”

[@joshuaperry4112]

How to you console a hungry T Rex? A-pat-asaurus on their back and There-Therapod.

[@brick6347]

I dare you to tell a cassowary to his face that dinosaurs are extinct!

[@marsar1775]

i saw that joke in the intro coming a mile away and couldnt do anything to avoid it much like the asteroid

[@roberthofmann8403]

I would love to see Gandalf vs Palpatine.

[@wesleymiller6674]

I oftenly wonder how the earth would be by now in alternate timelines. It would be fascinating to see how many things--culture, religion, languages, video games, fashion, their own speculation about life on other planets, etc--would be if dinosaurs or other species evolved into intelligence.

[@SomeKindaSpy]

There is a fantastic speculative evolutionary project by C.M. Koseman and Simon Roy called "Dinosauroids" where they explored this very topic. Basically: asteroid did not happen, but heavy climate change and some die offs did. Some mammals evolved to fill the ecological niches, but most niches still belonged to the remnant dinosaur species; in particular dromaeosaurids, pterosaurs, and some ornithomimidae. Ecological pressures caused a group of troodontids to evolve that heavily resembled crow or raven-like therapods into something analogous to early human-like intelligence but with a bird-like twist.

[@craigwright8216]

I can guarantee you if the dinosaurs were still around they won't be as big as they was because the oxygen was double back then.

[@TehOmnissiah]

I guess it depends on the dinosaur, trex or bront or something sure but something smaller like a chicken size velociraptor or something bigger like a 2ton Utah raptor is still smaller than an elephant but would absolutely destroy a person lol

[@stoop25]

They had over 100 million years to get their shit together. They missed their chance.

[@SomeKindaSpy]

I know it's a joke, but this isn't how evolution works. There's a difference between needing intelligence to exist and intelligence giving an advantage to survival. Humans ended up getting the former and got "lucky" when our resources ran out early on (from hunting mega fauna and over eating it) and we had to get smarter or go extinct. We lucked out hard in fact when that one perfect mutation got us the brains we needed.

[@ericvondell5157]

@@stoop25 NOPE! 🦖🦅 Let's See IF The Psychotic Apes can Manage A 100+ Million Years Of Ruling The Planet. Shall We?! 🙏🕊️☮️💖🛸💫✨😻🙏 🤔Dinosaurs Are NOT "The Big Losers" ! Quite To The Contrary; Of ALL Land Living Vertebrata, Dinosaurs Are The Biggest Winners, EVER! 🦖🦅🕊️😸

[@thecoolbyzantine24]

more proof that humans are the prime lifeform

[@meeponinthbit3466]

Click-bait title here... Us nerds all know they evolved into delicious chickens and stuff.

[@murderedcarrot9684]

A couple of lucky survivors did.

[@sagethelemur]

mmmmm chicken

[@uncleanunicorn4571]

Best we can do for a modern t.Rex.

[@dingo4530]

I just realized dinosaur shaped chicken nuggets are kind of an evolution joke

[@4124V4TA-SNPCA-x]

And extinct non-avian dinasurs also tasted kinda like chicken and fowl (and somewhat between them and alligators) according to some studies on the taste of various extinct non avian clades.

[@Cap-Archer]

This reminds me of the Silurian hypotesis that was explored in Star Trek: Voyager with the Voths or even the Dinosaurs from Rick and Morty.

[@jamesanddanielthiel]

that very thing just entered my mind as well.

[@notmyproblem88]

then, of course, there were the....Silurians in Doctor Who

[@Cylle]

I loved that Star Trek episode :)

[@michealnelsonauthor]

…as Issac Said in the episode you didn’t watch?

[@4124V4TA-SNPCA-x]

Doctor Who, Start Trek and tons of other sites and movies have explored it. Not to mention graphic novels, novels, short stories and games. I wonder why shows never use other clades apart from theropoda dinosaurs. What if almost all tetrapods have died off long ago and only one of our non-ancesteal synapsids clade, or extinct early Triassic archosaur out even just amphibians have survived and hundreds of millions years later earth world be totally unrecognizable. And we would meet an intelligent species from that alternate Earth? Like a support different and extremely alien (from our POV) Neanderthal Parallax by Sawyer type of situation? Without a real chance to understand the others psychology or language. That would be awesome.

[@petersmythe6462]

Rex probably hunted in groups but I wouldn't necessarily say they were hunting in packs. Based on isotope ratios, T. Rex of different age were going after different kinds of prey. Something that would not make sense if their kids were getting an allowance rather than having their own job.

[@wanderingron90]

Lmao author that was the worst dad joke ever 😂😂😂

[@michealnelsonauthor]

Which One? Lol.

[@colonelgraff9198]

Get Rex.

[@prophetofthesingularity]

They did not completely die off, Birds are dinosaurs. Ravens are extremely smart and I think that a 10,000 lb walking Raven would have been pretty terrifying so we might have never evolved past ground squirrels if this extinction event did not happen.

[@badabing3391]

its weird that tyrannosaurs were both the most intelligent megatherapod and the most robust.

[@levitateme]

Isaac, in a previous episode you mentioned a book by author Nivens called 'Bowl of Heaven' where space faring humans come across a dyson sphere like ship which is inhabited by evolved Dinosaurs which communicate with changing the color of their feathers. This trilogy got me into a whole new world of books. This reminded of that idea, and I want to thank you for giving me food for my imagination.

[@robertgraybeard3750]

at 1:13 the boundary layer has an elevated level of iridium but there are also elevated levels of other heavy metals including osmium, indium, platinum, gold, etc., etc.

[@wstavis3135]

I loved that your Nebula screen capture showed Up and Atom. She's another one of my favorite creators on KZbin.

[@JVDAWG1]

Anyone else remember the Animorphs Megamorphs book where the Animorphs are transported back in time when two alien species warred on earth and one of them uses an asteroid to destroy the other? And Tobias let it happen without warning the peaceful species so that history would not be changed.

[@LT.dans_new_legs]

Nah I don't remember I never read the books

[@delveling]

The Flintstones was my favourite version of dinos and humans living together :)

[@DaSwellian-vd3sc]

Star Trek Voyager deals with this concept in season 3 episode 23 'Distant Origin'! Dinosaurs evolved, to become space faring beings, millions of years ahead of humanity. Awesome episode. 🖖🏾

[@Jesse-zk9ge]

I like the idea that dinosaurs could got into space. You know in the old Outer Limits series. They actually came up with a really neat avian alien humanoid. The episodes called Second Chance. It's actually one of my favorite Outer Limits episodes.👍✌

[@locust334]

Love this one Isaac, I started here but have learned so much at event horizon. I appreciate both you guys more then you will ever know. Kindest Regards

[@efraim3364]

Star Trek: Voyager had an episode about this

[@sp00n]

As mentioned in the video

[@paulsmart4672]

Huge missed opportunity to add a dinosaur paleontologist to the cast. What were you even doing, writers?

[@ericvondell5157]

@@efraim3364 Doctor Who had "Dinosaurs On A Spaceship"!!!🦖🦕🛸💖

[@comentedonakeyboard]

People for the ethical treatment of Dinosaurs protest against the use of Bazookas for Dino-Hunting. Or at least they did before a T Rex ate them.

[@francescocarlini7613]

How awesome would it be if the Star Trek Universe had whole empires of Voth-descended dinosaurs (including the Gorn) who fought catastrophic galactic wars against the Progenitors when they first arrived from another galaxy. The Progenitors of course seeded thousands of planets with humanoid life (or maybe they were big into uplifting) in the hope that the newer humanoids would continue their genocidal war against the dinosaurs. I guess somewhere in the parallel dimensions of Star Trek that could be what happened...

[@sp00n]

Nice idea. Although I think they never really mentioned the Progenitors after that episode again, and never built up on that huge revelation, and I also haven't heard that the Gorn are connected to the dinosaurs at all.

[@rodClark717]

So excited for this

[@stingyblue8189]

The Voth, from Voyager’s “Distant Origin” episode, were fascinating. I don’t know how you didn’t like that episode. Dinosaurs evolving into higher life forms; traveling the galaxy; and flying in city ships at transwarp speeds. It would be interesting to see other orders of animals evolve into sentient beings. Look at what happened on Xindus: insects, reptiles, birds, sloths, whales, and primates all evolved into sentient beings who travelled through space. I think we could’ve learned to coexist without the assistance of any sphere builders.

[@pll3827]

I remember someone asking Paradox for a dinosaur Earth spawn option in Stellaris and they said it is unlikely as it would make the invade Earth achievement even more difficult to achieve. A pity.

[@sarcasmo57]

Dinosaurs are always interesting.

[@mikescholz6429]

I’m going to keep pushing my theory that the great pyramid was built by velociraptors until it catches on.

[@rmeddy]

26:49 Wow , you brought back memories with that Mass Effect Dinosaur comic, it's a parody of an old SMBC comic iirc

[@Mattropolis97]

I’m in the army now but I wish I could’ve had you with me on deployment in Iraq last year just to hear you talk about things like this

[@PopCultureCat]

Woaaaa! This channel always delivers. I had *never* thought of the Chicxulub impactor as an alien planet killer to reset our evolution (for whatever unfathomable reason planetkiller aliens might have, I heard something about an expressroad). Did Ancient Aliens do this one?

[@aspiratedaloha2946]

Drinking and snacking

[@comentedonakeyboard]

Grab a drink and a mamal.

[@tattoohick]

Very impressive video !!!!! Keep up the good work bud

[@empireempire3545]

I would like to point out that Dinosaurs did not die off - not completely. The ones who survived we call birds : D Including my beloved parrots! *SQAWK*!

[@dazza8389]

Crocodiles still alive & well

[@batatanna]

​@@dazza8389 crocodiles aren't dinosaurs tho, they're reptiles and are much older than dinosaurs

[@thewaywardgrape3838]

​@@dazza8389 A common misconception; Crocodiles aren't classed as Dinosaurs. They share a common ancestor, yet aren't Dinosaurs.

[@iivin4233]

​@batatanna This is technically not true and technically true. Both crocodiles and birds branch off of "archosauria". Crocodiles derive from "psuedosuchia" which is one of the branches of "archosauria". Both dinosaur and crocodile family lines start in the same place in other words, along with more complexity that I don't want to burden everyone with.

[@batatanna]

@@iivin4233 having a common ancestor doesn't mean they're in the same category tho, it's true to say humans are boned fish than crocodiles are dinosaurs.

[@erichtomanek4739]

As a representative of the Yilane, I take exception to this episode! For further reference, please read the excellent trio of historical novels by Harry Harrison: West of Eden Winter in Eden Return to Eden.

[@rebeccawinter472]

Robert Sawyer wrote a great trilogy about dinosaurs that were rescued by aliens from Earth proper to the KT extinction and developed intelligence. The Quintaglio Ascention. It’s a fun read to look at their culture and society. A good pairing with/contrast to his Hominids series.

[@robertlathe2165]

Author and scientist, Thomas P. Hopp, wrote "Dinosaur Wars" series to cover the concept of intelligent dinosaurs. Interesting storyline and series. Well thought-out.

[@nicolasolton]

I read a story many years ago about this topic, it was called "Toolmakers Koan" by John Mcloughlin.

[@ScottBFree]

It’s a good thing this is a science fiction channel, because you started with science fiction right out the gate.

[@alexandercross9081]

🎵🎶Here I come, drop your jaws to the floor. I'm riding on the mighty laser shooting dinosaur. Here I come, can you hear him roar?🎵🎶

[@MalachiCo0]

I see you are a man of culture as well

[@alexandercross9081]

@@MalachiCo0 indeed

[@feartheoldblood]

Open the door, get on the floor. Everybody do the dinosaur.

[@alexandercross9081]

@feartheoldblood yours may have mine at the disadvantage what with yours being a classic, but it cannot compete with a monster from the acient times developed in Tokyo.

[@UltimatePerfection]

28:02 It's important to note that the grabby aliens scenario is not the only one that could happen even if dinos get into the space. For example, they may not be hell bent on space colonization and be perfectly satisfied with having just few colonies that just prevent them from going completely extinct. Additionally, there might be a treaty that prevents colonizing already occupied systems and we simply don't have data to know how common life in the universe is.

[@MsGaloreNails]

The funny thing is I remember an episode of Star Trek voyager. Where chicotae got abducted by dinosaur aliens who could talk, and they had spaceships, and they would not believe him when he said that their ancestors came from earth and fled earth before destruction

[@KatieWierzbicki-ib2ib]

Your videos and all of your content is absolutely amazing and appreciated 💗 that you for all the research and work you do to make this info easy for me to understand and follow along. I know I can trust your content cause some of the science based channels similar to yours are mostly nonsense click bait type of channels😡 Thank you so much!

[@viaromabandit5051]

They had millions of years and still never invented Pants. Soooo yeah, no.

[@Dadderall73]

This title had me instantly. After reading West of Eden and the Quintaglio Ascension Trilogies I’m hooked on the idea

[@JohnSagin-SimViDeLucis579]

Thanks for another great video!

[@JohnTaylor-bb5xg]

Nice episode. Thanks!

[@erichtomanek4739]

The New Dinosaurs by Dougal Dixon is a fun read with lots of realistic pictures.

[@Phoenix10_UK]

Another great video and interesting concept. When I think about how far we as a species have come with our technological advancements in such a short time. It's intriguing to contemplate, had they survived and continued for millions of years to the current day. What sort of civilization they would have created? Would they have technology we can only at present dream of? If we lived alongside them what would that world be like, would they be our protectors and teachers trying to assist us on our own journey? Teaching us about the wonders of the universe through there multi million year wisdom?

[@badmeatbrowniesthoughts1327]

Harry Harrison has a series of books. "West of Eden" I remember them being pretty frikin epic. And the entire premise is based on this concept..Y'alls need to check it out

[@panasclepias2937]

Dinosaurs simply had a monopoly when it came to the bigger niches. Mammals may have had many small advantages, but without something to clear away the huge amount of competition, they simply stayed in their niches. The same thing actually happened in the Triassic period. Rausuchians or Pseudosuchians (forgive me if I'm not quite up to date on the proper terminology, this is a very quickly changing field of taxonomy) were gearing up to be the dominant predators of the era. They were crocodile relatives. Dinosaurs were around, but they were more marginal creatures, small and specialized with better limbs and limb joints, but no way to break the monopoly of the Pseudosuchians. Until the climate began changing and making it more difficult for the Pseudosuchians to thrive.

[@make.and.believe]

Nice vid,I always enjoy thinking about this topic. I diverge from your opinion though on that episode of Voyager, in fact this take on the Silurian hypothesis is the one I find most fascinating and feasible. We see in the (notably limited) fossil record various species of raptors, which have most of the characteristics generally accepted as being necessary to develop technology- and if modern mammalian evolution is any example, we should expect wide diversity in these raptor species similar to the wide diversity we see in the various great ape families. It is arguable that home sapiens are not the only 'modern' species to attain intelligence at our present level, and I imagine there were likely several branches of raptor at various levels of intelligence and tool use as well. It really only takes one of those species to become space faring for the Silurian hypothesis to prove correct in the end, and it wouldn't surprise me one bit if humanity eventually met that species either out amongst the stars, or back here in our local Earth/Moon system as that species returns for a periodic visit to their homeworld for scientific and/or spiritual reasons. In fact, the zoo hypothesis as a Fermi paradox solution seems a lot more likely with the presence of an advanced species with a vested interesting protecting their homeworld in an effort to promote and/or uplift other species on that homeworld towards advanced intelligence and eventual acceptance into the spacefaring community. Anyway, it's fun to think about, and it will be exciting to see what we will discover when humans actually get offworld and can explore the solar system and beyond firsthand. Much love.

[@BuckROCKGROIN]

Sauropsids lacked the laminal pallium of synapsids, which severely limited the quantity of cytologically distinct cortical areas in the pallium and therefore their intellect. See "Could theropod dinosaurs have evolved to a human level of intelligence?"

[@nosuchperson284]

But given another 65 million years new species may have evolved overcoming those limitations. Especially once their higher levels of oxygen in the atmosphere began to decrease forcing changes.

[@BuckROCKGROIN]

@@nosuchperson284 astronomically unlikely. Sauropsid cognitive evolution was already at a severe disadvantage with only a nuclear pallium to work with, and even with the advantage of a laminal pallium human sapience is a single outlier resulting from a freak sequence of adaptations that were already highly improbable individually. Evolution doesn't favor intellect.

[@thomasrdiehl]

The existence of corvids proves this to be mere synapsid make-belief.

[@NeutroniousTemp]

@@BuckROCKGROIN Human success is dopamine humans have the highest concentration and volume of dopamine in their brains ma dude

[@KeegoonBarnacle]

Ok, but corvids and parrots are dinosaurs with intelligence comparable to primates today (birds can achieve a greater intelligence with a smaller relative brain size due to increased neuron density). I still think it is extremely unlikely that any dinosaur would ever have developed into creatures capable of building civilization, but I don’t think brain power is the largest limiting factor. I feel like the physiology of their bodies is a bigger limiting factor there, with the evolution of dexterous hands in humans for example being the result of descending from arboreal ancestors who needed to grasp branches to survive.

[@andrewcole4843]

The Turtledove series where saurians got into space before being wiped out on earth and thus rule another planetary empire that invades earth. Jack Vance's sci fi version of two rival human tribes making a comeback using specially bred combinations of dinosaur breeds to wage war only to have the winner attacked by a dinosaur space invasion....great genre.

[@DM_Curtis]

Dinos wouldn't have evolved into Sleestaks. The human form is the result of very specific evolution.

[@michealnelsonauthor]

Tree and cliff climbers, yes. But what forms would or Could other sentients* evolve in to? More raptor-like semi-horizontal body position?

[@4124V4TA-SNPCA-x]

​@@michealnelsonauthor I bet thousands of others. But limitations on budget and creativity/fantasy couped with stupid anthropocentrism days otherwise. Plus b all comic book and other artists can draw anatomically correct humans, but fewer artist can draw all kinds of animals convincingly.

[@manwiththeredface7821]

8:26 "You would have to kill off more than 99% of us to even have an outside chance of causing a significant loss in technological knowledge" But that knowledge wouldn't be widespread anymore (like literacy after the fall of Rome), much of it would belong to a select few survivors (governments, large corporations etc.) who before the disaster would have prepared by carefully selecting people into their group based on the expertise each individual could bring. Vast amounts of data is not enough to maintain knowledge, you need peoole who know what to do with it and others to whom that knowledge could be passed down.

[@noseyparker8130]

"...carefully selecting people into their group based on the expertise each individual could bring." does not seem to be a strategy currently employed by any governments or large corporations.

[@manwiththeredface7821]

​@@noseyparker8130Then humanity will AT BEST find itself on the tech level of the 1800s, and in some rarely populated places regress to primitive tribes the likes of the one on Sentinel Island, while having IT server vaults buried underneath them forever that nobody will know what were or what to do with anyway.

[@jrasealexander5480]

Did you officially coin the term "Killamajigs" Arthur? 🤔 Cause i just unabashedly love that.😄

[@jasonGamesMaster]

Really missed an opportunity to show Sonic & Knuckles when you talked about hedgehogs and enchidnas, lol

[@jmcenanly1]

@ 26:20 I remember that the Voyager crew determined that the Voth had evolved from Parasaurolophus, A plant eating dinosaur that preferred to go around on four feet.

[@stingyblue8189]

No, it was Eryops which was carnivorous and similar to the Dimetrodon just without the sail on its back. Then, the next closest ancestor was the Hadrosaur which was a bipedal herbivore.

[@mitchellminer9597]

I have an hypothesis that dinosaurs overall were weakened by the invention of flight by a few species. Before flight, dino diseases spread at the walking pace of a sick sauropod, and other dinos could see and avoid. After flight, a bird could pick an infested parasite off a sick T-Rex, and be halfway across the continent before falling in front of a hungry Utahraptor.

[@duckpotat9818]

Pterosaurs evolved flight some 220 million years ago, dinosaurs (birds and relatives) doing so wouldnt have made any difference. Not to mention insects, we know of dozens of insect spread diseases, none primarily by birds, not even in cattle where it would be obvious if an enterprising parasite evolved to hitchhike oxpeckers.

[@George_M_]

For the dinosaurs to not die off, we'd need the Himalayan Uplift to not happen. The cooling trend from that killed their domination more surely than the comet and Deccan volcanos that one-twoed them

[@knallpistolen]

Happy Arthur's Day!

[@ArnoMor13]

The star trek episide about this was one of my favorites, also one of the first ever seen.

[@Eldagusto]

Bruh everyone knows Doctor Strange would butcher Harry Potter, there is no significant avenue to victory for Harry in such a struggle!

[@MADGator]

Agreed. Doctor Strange doesn't use a wand, so Harry can't beat him with expeliarmus! Now Dumbledore or Voldemort might have a chance, but I'd not bet in their favor.

[@4124V4TA-SNPCA-x]

Agreed. But what if Constantine and Gandalf, Sabrina the teenage witch and Ged of Earthsee have joined in making it a six way battle? 😁

[@Eldagusto]

@@4124V4TA-SNPCA-x maybe if some teamed up, otherwise there would be some steamrolled early on hoho

[@blakewalsh9489]

Dr Strange's cloak could defeat Harry Potter lol.

[@mishapurser4439]

Avian dinosaurs still exist as Contemporary birds. Some corvids or parrots might even evolve to be fully sapient at some point in the future and start parallel civilisations.

[@zhcultivator]

A T-Wreck indeed.....

[@orbitalostrich2629]

This reminded me of the Astrosaurs series of books I read as a kid. Now that's some good nostalgia

[@floridaman4073]

It was a let down as a kid when I learned Humans and Dinosaurs didn’t exist together.

[@Netseer2000]

Today's subject reminds me of a manga titled " T-REX na Kanojo" in which dinosaurs survived but evolved into more human-sized forms and with some other human-like physical characteristics (hair and facial features). Humans and dinosaurs peacefully co-exist in our modern age. One night, the main male protagonist Yuuma Asahikawa meets the main female protagonist the feral T-Rex, Churio.

[@ramonpizarro]

You have confirmed that I didn't imagine reading that years ago

[@JamieAlice92]

What do you call a dinosaur that lifts? Tyrannosaurus Pecs.

[@kovi-kovi-viko]

You see, this is one of those moments where I wish I didn't have nightmares. I should've seen it coming, but now? I'll be getting a face full of muscle in my sleep...

[@danielefabbro822]

There's a certain discussion about if dinosaurs or even birds could actually evolve into sentient beings. While many of these creatures shows or have shown sign of such development, a recent study demonstrated how the reproductive system of birds and dinosaurs is actually an obstacle for that achievement. It was said infact that the fact these creatures have to mature closed inside an egg, such egg constrict the dimensions of the brain itself. So with a minor skull capacity and relative inferior number of nervous cells interconnections that are at the very (material) base of intelligence.

[@necrogenisis]

Link to the study? Archosaurs as a rule have denser neurons than mammals, and neuron numbers might often be correlated to intelligence, but higher neuron counts don't necessarily equate to higher intelligence when studying non-mammals. Also, the word used here should be "sapient"; most of these animals are sentient already. Some avians, like corvids, could easily be considered "pre-sapient" or "proto-sapient" int their development.

[@BuckROCKGROIN]

I want to see that study too

[@SirHeinzbond]

when i was a kid, i went once to a holiday/house sitting for relatives with my parents, and after i had done reading my books, i looked at the books that were there, and first book was west of eden / harry harrison and second rendezvous with 31/439 Arthur C Clarke, and i was into Sci -Fi and What if.... i think i know what you are thinking about the later, the first one would be interesting, especially with all that notion of an non fire and non/less metallic technology....

[@MrHellknightimp]

Im not aware of any fossils found above the KT line, wouldn't that mean the dinosaurs were already extinct before the impact?

[@MrFancyFingers]

No, they died and it took years for all the debris to clear from the atmosphere, covering the bodies.

[@necrogenisis]

No, dinosaurs, among other animal groups, were thriving up to the point of the impact. The impact was so catastrophic that most species of terrestrial life on the planet larger than ~20kg went extinct within a year. Most megafauna went extinct in the first few days. Marine life was also severely impacted, with almost all oceanic megafauna dying out. There are various other factors not related to size that played a role in the extinction/survival of various clades, but we'll be here all day if we get into that. It's important to understand that the impact was indeed apocalyptic. We literally have no reference point for something like this. A portion of the atmosphere caught fire near the impact site, the shock wave traveled for hundreds of kilometers vaporizing anything in its path, molten rock got flung into the upper potions of the atmosphere and fell back down as pieces of glass in some cases. We're talking nanoparticles that destroyed the lungs of everything that breathed them in, acid rain, loss of sunlight, mega-tsunamis, earthquakes and violent storms thanks to the particulate matter that filled the air. And, despite all that, dinosaurs, among other critters, survived. Not a lot of them, almost all birds went extinct back then (they were a lot more diverse; take the toothed Enantiornithes for example), but they did. There is no distinction between birds and dinosaurs after all, only in pop culture and the mind of the general public. They've been on the planet since the Jurassic, and a tiny portion of them managed to squeeze through the K-Pg extinction chokehold. A pretty similar thing happened to psudosuchians (the broader clade crocodiles belong to); they were incredibly diverse, with countless terrestrial and highly active forms, but they got stomped by the impact event.

[@sp00n]

I recently saw a documentary where they identified a fossil that died due to the impact debris. Can't remember what it was though.

[@necrogenisis]

@@sp00n Dinosaurs: The Final Day with David Attenborough perhaps?

[@sp00n]

@@necrogenisis Could be. It was German dubbed though, so not a "real" iconic Attenborough documentary. But the images look very familiar, so I assume it was actually the same.

[@bradpotts1747]

hey was that story with the bird aliens preserved on their planets moon part of a plotline or playlist like some of your other slow boat stories? as short as it was, it was really good?

[@Gillemear]

My biggest issue with dinosaurs in space is where did they get the fuel from?

[@feuerling]

Why wouldn't they have fuel?

[@Gillemear]

@@feuerling Oil creates most of the fuels we currently use. It takes millions of years for an oil field/ reservoir to develop. Would there be enough time for sufficient deposits to mature for intelligent dinosaurs to exploit? Not to mention plastics, which also need oil!

[@floridaman4073]

Decaying plant and ocean life still would decay.

[@duckpotat9818]

@@Gillemear oil is mostly plankton while coal is mostly trees. By mostly i mean 99%+

[@Gillemear]

Most oil deposits formed in the Mesozoic (70%) which was the time of the dinosaurs. Only 10% were formed in the Paleozoic, the time before the dinosaurs. At most, an intelligent species of dinosaurs would have had only 10 to 80 precent of the oil we have today... and that's being super generous. Would they really have had enough to get a space age up and running?

[@Cranberrie123]

How do you spell that mammal he mentioned? Sounded like 'barrowlamda' but that doesnt give any Google results.

[@Cranberrie123]

Nvm its Barylambda

[@mbarrow360]

They would have developed interesting biological changes like perhaps thermoregulation and mammalian reproductive gestation

[@doltsbane]

You should check out Larry Niven and Gregory Benford's Bowl of Heaven trilogy for an interesting take on this concept.

[@erniemajor]

Their main concern , as with all (non human) creatures would have been to reproduce. They would only be fighting pursuant to mating, or finding food. Mindless aggression 'for fun' or to show off is apparently mostly a human pastime.

[@LaikaLycanthrope]

Big critters also tend to reproduce more slowly than small ones, and have fewer babies per pregnancy.

[@feartheoldblood]

Interesting you mentioned mass effect, the closest dinosaur species in that series would have to be the Krogan. They're probably the most resilient species in the galaxy according to the lore. Makes me wonder how earth dinos (namely raptors) would look had they continued to evolve to our level of intellect.

[@bryanrisso7508]

How big must an asteroid of pure iridium be to create a layer across earths surface? A whole layer? Im kind of skeptical that if it was an asteroid that it was just one. Could Earths core maybe had an amazing geological upheaval event? Ejecting a great amount of iridium?