What if the Prosecution faces Penalties too?

[@gradualdecay]

Von Karma's only stain on his perfect record was a penalty. It must have been especially humiliating if he's the only prosecutor who's ever received one.

[@potsdam28]

Judge didn’t give it though his boss did

[@Mathilde_Bruhn]

@@potsdam28 No it was the judge, but afterwards the chief prosecutor was like "You gotta stop forging evidence, man. You were too close to getting caught this time". Ace Attorney Investigations 2 actually gives us context for what happened during the trial, as during one of the cases, you play part of it as Gregory in the past, with Edgeworth solving the case in the present. Turns out the reason why that trial went on for a year and Von Karma got that penalty, was because the victim's body disappeared from the crime scene, and Von Karma had covered it up

[@toshinoriyagi1887]

​@@Mathilde_Bruhn no Von Karma didnt get the penalty because of that even he wasnt told anything about the disapperance of the body and that the autopsy report was forged The Chief prosecutor has told the lead detective to not tell him about it And he got his Penalty because Edgeworth showed the court a recording of Karma and the detective forcing a confession out of the Defendant

[@joaolima7131]

​​​​​​@Zalkovayou know forced confession is forged evidence too right? The forced confession alone was on Von Karma. Also, everything was covered up, if the Chief was a suspect, he would've been caught a lot earlier, Edgeworth only started to suspect him after Kay was kidnapped, you are basically expecting everything to be laid out in the first game, also it was the first game of the franchise, they weren't even expecting to be successful nor have sequels

[@thebrightdiamondtp7871]

It’d be actually interesting to see prosecutors with a penalty gauge of their own ingame, with the bar/badges decreasing as you progress through the case and beat them.

[@royalfool0230]

Isn't this what happens in the Investigations games?

[@thebrightdiamondtp7871]

@@royalfool0230 It is but that’s only there because you’re playing as Edgeworth.

[@134AAb]

but how would that work if they are programmed it cant be 2 player or else the case idea wouldint work

[@thebrightdiamondtp7871]

@@134AAb Maybe like a standard boss health bar?

[@GHOSTRIDER-nu6fb]

I mean unlike the defense the judge cannot give penalties to prosecutor ,only the chief prosecutor can do that, that's why prosecutors have more power in the court.

[@RikouHogashi]

When the Judge is BEING A ACTUAL IMPARTIAL JUDGE and not a Prosecutor Simp

[@Heather_exe]

We're all Prosecutor Simps, to be totally fair.

[@RikouHogashi]

@@Heather_exe well I wasn't I like my justice to be accurate and fair (call it boring if you want this is just my opinion)

[@Heather_exe]

@@RikouHogashi no prob! If you're not, you're not, if you are, then you are! :DDD

[@CitrusRex]

“Phoenix is the main character! He can just reload saves when he messes up!” i actually backed myself into a corner where i thought i had to present evidence to further the case, but instead i had to NOT present evidence, so i reloaded after presenting the wrong evidence like 30 times… finally i clicked through the penalty and realized i was wrong

[@jeffbenton6183]

This was the Lana Skye case, wasn't it? (If I'm wrong and it's not in the Phoneix Wright trilogy, or if it's case 5 of Trials and Tribualtions, no spoilers, please)

[@CitrusRex]

@@jeffbenton6183 yes, it was! spoilers for that case ahead: It was where you had the option to present evidence to try and incriminate Damon Gant, but the actual correct answer was to just wait to present evidence. I kept reloading onto the present screen before I found out you actually have to not present anything.

[@vatsalyasobjections]

i think you should've used a walkthrough/guide or something at this point

[@CitrusRex]

@@vatsalyasobjections i think i actually did… usually i hate using walkthroughs as i want to do the game myself, but at that point i had almost exhausted all my other options

[@Speakerman420]

​@@CitrusRexBro fr i thought i had to present smth to Gant but all you has to do was spam press on him 💀

[@55alegria]

The real reason why the judge decided to change the rules was probably because he got tired of the prosecution's abuse (more precisely, of Franziska's whip)

[@user-el9ve6kl2n]

The Judge mentions giving penalties occasionally to the prosecution, we just dont have a visual indication of it. I definitely remember him saying that to Franziska during a case

[@joshuawillis602]

You’re correct. He threatened to penalize her when she tried hiding important photographic evidence.

[@techno1561]

Von Karma (elder) famously did a murder because he got a penalty

[@joshuawillis602]

@@techno1561 actually the Chief prosecutor gave him a penalty then not the judge.

[@memenumnoscopus]

Penalty for whipping? Franziska won't last 5 minutes in the courtroom.

[@TheLastRaven6]

Blackquill: *Breaks his cuffs.* Judge: DOUBLE PENALTY! BlackQuill: *Cuts bit of wrights or Apollos hair* Judge: PENALTY! Taka: *Attacks someone.* Judge: FFS! Double Penalty!

[@rylade475]

Godot: This trial will be over after my 17th cup of coffee. Judge: 17 cups of coffee?! In that case, how about 17 penalties?

[@vatsalyasobjections]

destroyed 💀💀

[@kellenfox587]

*spits out a waterfall of coffee, presumably all 17 cups*

[@skiller5034]

Spitting out coffee everywhere is also a penalty! And throwing your coffee mug at the defense? You bet that's a penalty!

[@kellenfox587]

@@skiller5034 Looks like the one getting the unlimited penalty is Godot

[@kieranashley119]

Bringing Coffee into Court? That's a penalty!

[@catabolicusagi]

I like the small texts that appear sometimes. They're like talking to the voices in my head

[@vatsalyasobjections]

Finally I found someone who appreciates them 😭

[@rockincradilyyyy8489]

This could honestly make for an interesting case, here’s my idea At some point in the investigation the killer out right admits the entire case to phoenix because they know that there won’t be sufficient enough evidence, so instead to win the case phoenix has to somehow get the prosecutor to rack up enough penalties to automatically lose the case

[@notherapy4u]

Wouldn't that make the judge find the killer innocent if the prosecution loses?

[@vatsalyasobjections]

The defendant will be declared innocent, not the killer. He didn't mention that the defendant was actually the killer

[@edwinkjellzahn]

Considering how completely free of oversight prosecutors conduct themselves with (at least in the US), it probably would be good idea implement penalties

[@vatsalyasobjections]

Agreed

[@potsdam28]

I hear Japan is worse

[@magnusprime962]

They do exist IRL, but how often they’re enforced varies. A lot of the stuff the prosecution gets away with in this series would never fly in US courts though. An updated autopsy report that wasn’t shared with the defense would be enough to get a case thrown out.

[@doctorwhat779]

Can you imagine how our boi Wright's life would be easier? He could end cases just penalties instead of an actual defense

[@PuppyOrion]

Considering how many times the prosecution has knowingly concealed evidence from the defense, this seems absolutely necessary

[@PhoenixTrite-yc7fn]

Amazingly done work.

[@vatsalyasobjections]

Thank You!

[@k.w.pillsbury4070]

Goddamn. The Von Karma’s would earn so many, SO fast.

[@CM006yt]

The fact that the objection 2004 Mario sunshine version came on by ikiwi genuinely caught me off guard, real good

[@kinopiko01]

I find it conflicting how Mitsurugi couldn't handle having penalties when he literally has them in his spinoff game 😂

[@R2121]

Isn't Edgeworth acting as a Defense Attorney in the Investigations games?

[@vatsalyasobjections]

Only as an assistant in GK2(I think?), that too after losing his badge. According to the timeline PW trilogy comes before AAI so it would be his first time gettig a penalty.

[@DarknessXxMaster]

So then...throwing coffee, hitting people with a whip, false evidence and interrupting the defense during a cross examination would all be penalized. That would make the game far too easy😂

[@Gogo-zv4hy]

This is what would happen in a spin-off where we kept the accusation during the trials

[@narudyholmesie]

This is absolutely amazing work! But might I ask: How the hell did you get that GBA gallery complete with the actual gallery people and sprites for the prosecution and defense?

[@kyaksachan502]

The ultimate karmatic bitchslap of the century and I live for it. Idr which case it was but it cemented my hatred the absurdities that Prosecution gets away with.

[@ensndkdndne-Eusjsnsns]

Even better, witnesses.

[@tylerhrunek]

Now it’s the prosecutions’ turn to be trolled.

[@FierySprites]

Oh god, that's my old crusty custom penalty gauge in the thumbnail. I can't believe someone actually decided to use it.

[@marsplague6140]

Franziska would straight be put in prison for several assault

[@DARS_04]

If any of the two parties present a witness, the other party has the right to cross examination

[@reeman2.0]

Yeah, I always thought it was bullshit that I had to point out the lies in my own client's testimony. Couldn't I just lie and say my client's telling the truth? Lol.

[@dylanzlol7293]

​​@@reeman2.0 imagine if it was phoenix wright having to shoot down the prosecution's objections about YOUR witness's testimony with evidence or dialogue choices.

[@reeman2.0]

@@dylanzlol7293 I think that would be pretty fun. It reminds me of that one civil case in Apollo Justice(?) where Phoenix is the plaintiff suing your client for theft or something similar, I wonder what it would have been like if we played as Phoenix during that case.

[@moon4236]

Reminds me of PLvsAA since you can receive a penalty as the prosecution there lol (and Phoenix is very enthusiastic about it)

[@vintprox]

Justice will be served! xDDD

[@KirbyLinkACW]

Considering Ace Attorney started as a parody of Japan's legal system, you might've actually solved a nationwide issue with this.

[@Potatooknight]

Imagine ace attorney PvP 💀

[@Scythr2s]

You know it would be great battle between defense and prosecutor in showing evidence. Whenever the defense shows the correct evidence then later as the prosecutor messed it up earns a penalty as a health bar.

[@k.w.pillsbury4070]

I love how the Updated Autopsy Report can always just be defeated with one word “Why?” Why did you ask to have it updated? What purpose did that serve? Is this just an attempt to get evidence that only serves you, or is this a complete and total fabrication?

[@ChloekabanOfficial]

actual justice: ace attorney

[@bruhmomentum404]

winston payne gonna get disbarred now lmao

[@hauntedmedic373]

I love the idea of this!

[@erhanjpg1467]

Now this is just.

[@MinorLife10]

Hey, cool done music. I haven't ever heard the 8-bit Objection 2013

[@aishutoon4553]

Wait I recognize that music. It’s from a video where Phoenix defends Mario in Mario sunshine

[@MinorLife10]

@@aishutoon4553 That sounds cursed enough to make ma check it out

[@jamesmacleod1212]

how about what if Ace Attorney follows the US law system? Having both DA's and prosecutors learn about discovery will have me in stitches laughing

[@juiyersh3668]

That would be nice. In defense, you always have the burden of proof on whatever bs theory the prosecutor throws at you, and the judge tends to end the trial everytime, even when the prosecutor doesn't have definitive evidence.

[@FishProductions64]

Where did you get the judge with gavel sprites

[@qiufenzhong5156]

1:55 bro broken the fourt wall

[@rjfrost7090]

My idea is that winning the case via getting enough penalties for the prosecution let's you get a Not Guilty verdict sooner. Though the trade off here is you don't solve the case's mysteries or catch the actual killer leading to a sort of neutral ending happening. For example: Pheonix manages to clear Maya's name for Turnabout Sisters without ever finding out about Redd White's involvement in the case. Maya is safe, but Redd White can still go on to blackmail and drive people to suicide. Ace Attorney would have to be a different game for this to work, I think. Maybe one with branching routes and endings to it.

[@vatsalyasobjections]

I agree with your point here! Have you tried playing Aviary Attorney? It has three(?) different endings and a mechanism somewhat similar to what you described. Although this video was just made for fun, not really a suggestion or something 😅

[@cheezemonkeyeater]

"Two colas please!"

[@eldonmariano781]

Yay someone who uses gba sprites/size

[@vatsalyasobjections]

gba fan 🤝

[@SoraFan23]

Yeah you know why is that the Defense gets Penalites yet the Prosectuors don't get it?

[@badrinath5306]

Penalties were handed to prosecutors in game. The most important being Manfreds only penalty in his career. Miles got a penalty in case 5 of the first game for being negligent (not finding the weapon in his cars out valve and not listening to Meekins report). In the same case his next penalty was for apparentally using forged evidence in the case with Lana Skye however both never solidified as he was excused for the first one and the was found innocent of the second one. Frnasiska was abt to get penalized for whipping but didn't cause the judge didn't dare. After that the second Payne (Winston forever) was accused of forgery as indicated in the ending of dual destinies and Edgeworth penalized him and then removed him from service leading to his re-location, conversion and promotion in Khura'in. I doubt Sebastian got out scott free exactly after his fathers shenanigans. Though t was violent and law breaching Godot was never even considered for penalizing over the cups of coffee on Wright. Gavin was also not penalized nor was close to until he decided to admit regarding the shady data given by his brother however it doesn't seem to have really affected him at all as he was fine by the time of dual destinies. I am not that good at the new games but I think black was almost penalized for his bird sitting on the judges head but was able to manipulate his way out of it. Samdhadi was sort of penalized I guess but it wasn't exactly a penalty either. He was only blackmailed theough out.

[@bandicootsmwcentral2950]

fun fact: in the Phoenix Wright vs Professor Layton crossover the prosecution can also get penalties during a certain segment of the game. spoilers: . . . . . . . . . . . . . . During the final trial when Layton is on the Prosecution side facing Phoenix on the Defense side Also there's a hilarious dialogue between Phoenix and Maya when that happens where Phoenix is happy for being the one pointing the other side mistakes saying he always wanted to do that xd

[@robertlupa8273]

Dat Objection 2004 remix tho

[@josselinlouis6538]

It's from a video about phoenix defending mario in super mario sunshine. It's from the KZbin channel ikiwed.

[@DaTealikMan]

Pizza tower

[@ConstantineCatacuzenos]

nice objection lol

[@Awelbeckk]

Didn't mr von karma got a penalty once?

[@baki-son-of-ogre]

Finalmente justiça Advogados são muito injustiçados em Ace Attorney

[@addisonfung5009]

Unless you add a PvP case, otherwise its just impossible.

[@archivist_13]

Very nice

[@Lou-yf1jo]

wtf why are you placing comments during the video?

[@KyalinaTheNotable]

I believe it's supposed to be the gallery speaking

[@WarHelmetCombine]

I would love to see something like AI Generated Trials and the further you push through, the more the prosecutor's bar lowers.

[@cheezemonkeyeater]

Interesting fact: every aspect of this game design is meant to be a critique against the judicial system in Japan. The reason the prosecutors don't also face penalties is because the game is meant to feel like it's biased against you because Japan's judicial system heavily biases against the defense.

[@joaolima7131]

It's worse considering Japan still have the death penalty even when having a biased judicial system

[@tailsfan11westandwithukraine]

Did you really have to put in a fourth wall break there? 🤦‍♂️

[@capital_of_texas]

But...but prosecutors literally have special immunity for their performance...