What If There Were No More Sponsored BMX Riders?

[@byc1013]

social media has ruined bmx. it's obvious.

[@Brant_Moore]

Yep, social media and the internet have ruined a lot of things. The internet is the best worst thing ever invented

[@mead813]

Well Free Agent and GT were both owned by soulless mega corporations that we all hate. Thats why noone buys their bikes. The closer we get to home grown, family-owned, local companies, the better it is.

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

Don't forget haro premium and some others. Mongoose. Basically all the old legacy brands. Besides like t1 s&m odyssey and I think SE bikes.

[@PunchingCacti]

Vote with your dollar by supporting brands that put on events and sponsor riders you like Most people do this subconsciously anyways tho because marketing works.

[@RealityBubbles]

I'm riding cause I love how it feels like + agility + strenght. It's like gym, but much more interesting.

[@StoneyBaloneyUSA]

The opposite will happen. Only core brands with actual followings will survive like the 90s. Any bmx brand owned by a mtb or road bike company will pull out, prayers for Haro. Cult and sandm are not dropping their teams anytime soon, I see a lot of cult, fit, sandm, bsd frames out there, I have never seen a (modern) Gt bmx bike[being riden at street spot or skatepark], I have never ever ever never seen a “free agent” bike anywhere outside of a Rick Thorn ad in my entire 32 year life.

[@Brant_Moore]

I don’t see any core brands dropping entire teams either. What I could see are brands dropping some riders who don’t move the needle and not picking up anyone new unless they really are going to be able to help the brand.

[@BMXFU]

@@Brant_Moore please don’t say move the needle. Not every team rider needs to be a salesman bmx news personality like yourself.

[@frankthetankct]

Honestly wouldn't know what to buy if there wasn't a team rider to base my riding style on. It's a necessity. Like I'd know to buy a frame for street or trials because so and so runs it and that's what they ride mostly. Or that I grind a lot like Butcher, so I buy the Butcher pegs. I see your point though.

[@2smokejoke]

Yup, literally the main motivation for everyone I know/knew or ride and rode with basically watched videos of edits and has a favorite pro or two they look up to. Aswell as what you said style wise which rider you can relate to

[@BitterSeth]

37 minutes of the hottest air.

[@Brant_Moore]

Can’t win em all I suppose

[@BMXFU]

@@frankthetankct fax! Brant just wants everyone to be Brant’s lol

[@frankthetankct]

@@Brant_Moore It was just theoretical. Would be a crazy extinction event if it ever did happen. Right now we got MTB, big BMX and scooters to compete with so maybe a bit more effort is warranted.

[@pauljames1978]

Say you are sponsored rider and your sponsorship, come to an end because of age or injury you can still support BMX companys by buying their products 👍🚲💨

[@kenevans7286]

Fortune favors the bold, any you have shown that you are bold. Keep it up Brant.

[@Brant_Moore]

I don’t need a fortune but man I would love to not worry about bills anymore! Haha Thank you!!

[@HeyImKevin]

I’m not saying that it would have been the saving grace of the entire industry, but I know I would have went to some bike shop I’ve never been to in order to have seen Tom Justice in the GT Air Show, and I would have brought my kid. Like imagine if you were a kid, and you saw Tom doing superhero shit, and you also saw Albert and Tate doing some creative shit. Like…that would probably make BMX look cool and approachable.

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

Facts. Pro team meet the fans tours used to do work.

[@pierrematthieu6256]

That’s what Tree did at the beginning. No team just quality. Taj, Garett Byrnes, Sergio layos, Ruben had their sprockets on their bikes and it got so popular.

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

Tree also had a weirdly unique time to pull that off. I think me doing maraging steel stuff at close to 4130 price points before rnc hops on board(hoping he does other wise idk if his price points are manageable) is probably the only other thing that could pull that. Also bringing better aluminum stuff to. And I've still got a team in the works. With some big names. Crumlish on brakes with chi via marks carbon brakes and some other stuff. Mike varga and Chris silva on core team with a 26 dj dude who rides street that's a local crew leader. And still looking at others. You really do need riders these days. Many kids just buy the same shit every time and don't even pay attention to geo weight or other factors as much. Like my 4lb frame is gonna be 48 percent stronger than a Sunday. And I'm still not even sure if pre order crowdfunding and no team would work. Let alone a sprocket stem hub shell alloy stronger than titanium at the same weight. By almost 30 percent.... and in price line with 7075.

[@kenevans7286]

I wouldn’t be too concerned about RNC. I bought a titanium crank set from him, and had issues with it on the installation. It took well over a month and getting Patrick at flatland fuel involved to get him to replace the bolt which happened to be too big to flush mount into the spindle. I have other friends who have made purchases from him and have had similar issues with his customer service. I believe his customer service is hurting him, and I don’t think he’s willing to improve it. Other than that, he does make a nice product if he would improve his customer service game, his sales would most likely increase as well. As for me, the experience, I had soured me on his brand. I rode the crank at for about six months and then ended up giving the crankset to a friend.

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

@kenevans7286 uhm....my cranks in the same steel as his legends are going to be half the price. I've talked with him. I know roughly what he's paying for his steel. I'm getting it a whole hell of alot cheaper. He loses a decent product he invested development in since nobody will pay double the money for his cranks when mine are half the price. His ti cranks maybe. They'll be around a similar price as my maraging steel cranks. Albeit. Youd be paying a bit more for a slightly weaker crank that's the same weight.

[@bikestuffcomua]

Interesting and rational thoughts. Been thinking about that two years ago, after trying to convince our team riders to learn some marketing basics. But they just wanna ride and have fun. So the idea burned out very quickly.

[@cra1gt]

The problem is youth development and introduction when I started riding bmx there were many entries into the sport, video games, big contest on tv, recognizable stars, magazines, bike shops etc. The industry has to innovate on it’s introduction to kids, can’t rely on social media and KZbin for everything especially when the sport was last to the party

[@Brant_Moore]

🎯🎯🎯🎯🎯🎯🎯

[@DaveWasThereMan]

Every little kid on a scooter who sees me turns and stares. Kids love bikes. Or maybe they just like watching me miss my rear peg and roll around moaning for 5 minutes.

[@photosbydarrencouk]

In the bodybuilding/fitness industry, they used to give these huge contracts to their athletes, competitors etc in order to sell their products. Now they save all that money and use social media influencers instead. Why give all that money to a few people, when you can just ship your products and clothing to hundreds or thousands of influencers for a fraction of the cost. Not saying that's what should happen, but it's going on in many other industries

[@Brant_Moore]

Which is exactly why the guys who are getting paid now gotta pay attention to this stuff and make sure their value is undeniable.

[@photosbydarrencouk]

@Brant_Moore couldn't agree more. The more effort a rider puts in (riding, marketing, promotion), the more they'll get in return through money, signature parts, and even securing different brand deals etc. It's a win-win for both parties

[@jonasang9676]

Only flow no real pros? It seems the companies pays too little to survive on anyway. Some pros seem to work inhumanly hard.

[@JustVictor72]

IMO, sponsorship isn’t the problem per se. It might actually be a chicken and egg issue. Increasing the base and popularity of bmx, getting more kids to ride bmx is one thing to build the pipeline of talent. Another thing is to raise the profile of bmx as a desirable sport amidst the backdrop of a myriad of popular alternative sports. Maybe the development of the industry shouldn’t just fall squarely on bike brands or biker owned brands. The big financial owners with marketing dollars could allocate a larger proportion of budget to advertising bmx. The sponsorships can then follow from there. Maybe I don’t make sense who knows? 🤷🏼‍♂️

[@Brant_Moore]

In order for bigger financial owners to do that, they have to see the value in it. That’s why they always pull out of bmx. They put more money into it than they make back and find out that it doesn’t make sense. I’m trying to figure out why I’m the bad guy and why I’m “wack” for worrying/warning about the future of supported riders in bmx. I’d love for people to be able to just ride their bikes and make a living from it, but we’re in a time where everyone has to help get the water out of the sinking ship.

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

This is what some brands should have been doing all along and claimed they were gonna do. But just pulled money out of bmx.

[@rowdrowd5738]

Group sessions are wat motivated me

[@davidsharp3110]

Spnosored riders have always been a basic element of BMX since it's genesis. I hope this never changes. I was introduced to the sport because of the personalities of riders first and their sponsors second. That's where brand loyalty entered the picture for me. Riders are the face of the product. I hope this remains cost effective because it works. Great points Brant.

[@Brant_Moore]

I don’t think it ever will stop

[@thundermidget4395]

love the show Brant,your awesome bro

[@pinkmadcow]

Im not sure about FBM. Wasnt there a period when they didnt have sponsored riders?

[@BFELLY]

I can truthfully and honestly say I would never ever in 1 million years ride a pair of shadow forks. I’ve seen so many broken pairs of those it’s incredibly unsafe.

[@matthewsilvia7939]

Yeah man!! I get it, this crosses over to "who" should pay for pro purses. Right now, USABMX is paying out pro riders, sponsored or not. Question... is it the sanctions responsibility? I think not, and pro riders should be thankful they get anything at all. Question 2, where does the "pro purse" come from within street / park?

[@Brant_Moore]

The pro purse typically seems like it should come from working with outside sponsors that can see value in their name being on an event like whatever it is. I have no idea how it actually works but that’s what would make sense to me and if it’s not already, bmx should be figuring out how to appeal to those larger non endemics to make events happen easier

[@Edgar-t5l]

Could that mean bringing down the costs for bmx parts

[@Sinisterbio360]

Wishful thinking. Ain’t gonna happen

[@Edgar-t5l]

@ try again

[@WilliamKass]

Depends if they can find a cheaper way to market their products or not. I assume good sponsorships are an efficient way to market, otherwise it wouldn't have stuck for so long. TV ads for example usually don't have a good return on investment and that's why you only have bigger companies going that route, it may bring in enough for them. So most-likely parts already are as cheap as possible, but maybe it is such a big part of the culture that companies have been willing to take a loss there to do something good for the community? Think we've all heard of certain CEO's still keeping some OG's on just to support them. I guess only the masterminds behind the companies know the answer there.

[@Edgar-t5l]

@ I mean they damn near got rid of cassette hubs

[@oldpunkrocker]

It's over, kids ride e bikes. I ride the only BMX aroundmy town and am old.

[@StoneyBaloneyUSA]

We are the roller bladers now.

[@Brant_Moore]

It doesn’t seem like it’s over for a lot of areas

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

​@Brant_Moore but this is what some riders do vs moving huge sales. They draw a scene together and help it grow directly and indirectly. And get sales directly and indirectly. Shops. Distros. Pros. And more. Toronto scene died after 2 shops closed. It was scattered before and after those shops.

[@WilliamKass]

100% agree with everything in this. Sponsoring riders is just one type of marketing, basically even just one type of influencer marketing. Fact is, a sponsored rider = an influencer. As Brant stated, it often even makes them straight up lie about the quality or parts to get the monthly check. On the other hand, word of mouth from a friend or an unbiased video, blog post or social media post is going to be of more value to the buyer. For example I've come to trust and buy Odyssey products because of the way they actually make their stuff stronger, have explained the process on the websites and offer a longer warranty to go with that, plus trying my friends bikes who say the parts last. I honestly don't really watch or follow any or the team riders. I may have even seen the name of the brand from a google ad somewhere. I don't care who can do the gnarliest trick down el toro, but what I do want is to see, hear and read about the product, what makes it special, what it's built for and how it could improve my personal riding with the geometry. For example, knowing that Logan Martin can win the olympics on his 20.5 frame is not going to help me if I am 30cm taller than him. I wanted my first bike because I saw local guys ride at a contest and have now seen kids buy their bikes because of seeing me ride at the park. Don't need a pro team to influence kids to get into the sport. It obviously helps, but isn't necessary. It's cool that some guys can get paid by the bike companies for their influence on sales, because of their skills or brand, but this is not and should not be the only way to make a living in the scene. For BMX to really thrive, we need to reach outwards because that's where the money is - drinks, protein powders, clothing, health food, cars, toys, whatever else. Make yourself a brand, a freelancer creating cool content, showing up to all sorts of events, getting tv time, organizing jams, coaching, doing shows, start a yt channel or blog, or whatever else you can come up with where you create money, good times and value for others. We have this awesome thing that people admire, we can even give speeches about finding your passion because many people haven't found such a thing in their life. Being the best rider in the world means absolutely nothing if you're a jerk and nobody likes you as a person. ✌️

[@BMXFU]

No one’s upset or enraged, you’ve just become wack lol

[@Brant_Moore]

If caring about bmx and wanting to see it grow is wack, sure

[@BMXFU]

@ we all want that, you’re saying there’s only one way for that to happen and talking shit on other approaches. Bmx is dope cuz everyone can do their own thing with it. We don’t want an army of Brant’s , and just because riders don’t do what you do doesn’t mean they aren’t growing the sport in their own way. You don’t need a discount code to grow the sport.

[@Brant_Moore]

I’m not saying anyone should do anything super specific as if I want everyone out there doing exactly what I’m doing. I have literally said there’s a million different ways to do it. What I’m suggesting is that whatever people do has to help out the companies more than it costs to do it.

[@BMXFU]

@ by doing that you’re suggesting that riders aren’t already trying. It’s not all on them. When you’re done drinking the kool aid hit me up for a real discussion

[@Brant_Moore]

Don’t mistake this focus on the riders as me saying it’s all on them. I even mentioned exactly that in this video, but I know you didn’t watch it. You don’t want a discussion, you want to tell me why I’m wrong and you’re right without actually giving what I have to say a chance. A discussion requires both sides to actually be heard and considered. You see one sliver of what I have to say and just want to shut it down without even listening to hear the whole point. That’s why you’re here commenting without even watching this video.

[@johnnyraekes]

Let’s talk

[@Brant_Moore]

Hit me up

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

So the 90s? Wed get by. Id still try and do my frames and parts. More basic versions. But still maraging steel. Still quality. And post weld heat treated. Brands would be dead at that point. So prices would come doen and less competition. Work with whoever is left. Wed each do certain parts and split the profits and sales around. And make sure everyones bikes are solid AF. Probably do steel rims at that point since we could make em last forever. Spokes will always be available. Hubs with kff the shelf bearings like g sports. Tires we can get from kids bikes and other shit.

[@Brant_Moore]

We’d get by because sponsored riders don’t prop up our industry as much as the people who just enjoy riding their bikes do. People can hate on me all they want for videos/conversations like this, but if bmx keeps struggling and things keep getting worse, companies aren’t going to risk going out of business just to keep paying riders.

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

@Brant_Moore eh sponsored riders can prop up a scene more than many realize. I've seen Chris silva do it with a single non pro dude who did it for the kids named Mike Heaton. I've seen others do it. We had chris taylor. Shop owner. But also sponsored mtbmx rider by norco caude he invented mtb flatland. Lol. And helped push dj bikes forwards. The toronto scene was tiny before and has shrunk since. The 90s and shit going on then also helps prove it. Some riders weren't getting paid but still getting parts back then. Back than sponsorship was just parts. It truely is a 5050 imo. I get crumlish side. But I also get yours and Joey. I gotta defend crum a bit tho. I've seen riders he knows and is friends with getting treated like shit industry side. Same with others. S&M isn't one of those sponsors. But there are brands with overly large marketing teams that don't do shit but soak up cash flow and put out terrible ideas. I feel the problem is the change between the old guard and new guard of bmx. Some of us want it to get 80s level again and people to be eating off it. Others are still in that anti mainstream punk mindset. Even Gerber brings it up dude. And we both know Gerber tuned into so shit the rest of the industry isn't. People said the same shit about me. In fsct crum silva chi and all the others. Literally told me I was wrong about the huge bar take over certain influences gonna dominate street and coasters take over. Some people see aspects others don't. Crum silva chi and others all correct on some other bits of bmx I didn't realize back then. Think about what happened in certain eras. And more recently. When certain riders or industry people had support. Growth. Cause they actively grow the market. And while grumpy at times cause the industry. Still show case the younger riders coming in the true vibes of bmx. We don't ride to get paid. We ride to have fun. We ride to progress. But to do what brands what without serious financial risks. We need some cash flow. Why I've already decided. Certain brands tube sales side. They're either doing it themselves for maraging steel. Or paying commercial rates and killing the greedy owners incentives. Some never gonna get it from me. Go sell mass market to box stores and get low margins and same profits from high margins via volume and get more kids on chromo bikes. Or go back to mtb road and tech industries. Or cars. Unless certain brands can convince me why they deserve shit. I'm using American legal rules I don't even agree with to push them out. But the reverse. Giving the little guys the discounts and preferential treatment. Giving the legit brands that help. More sales. More money. Less brands. More sales. More volume lower cost. And putting money into riders and contests and jams. And parks. And spots.

[@bmxriderforlife1234]

@Brant_Moore just wanna say I do respect what you do tho. I get your point. But I've also felt like bmx is going back towards the 90s for awhile unless we do shit. I'm all for every model we can go about that's at least not too toxic and temporary vibes. But I do also understand how some others are gonna take it. Alot of people feel some kinda way when I say certain brands should just stay out of bmx. They don't offer enough but a legacy name these days. Or at the least switch owners.

[@ryancarlson5644]

Boo whoo. Sell it back it.