What is DUAL-CLASSING in Pathfinder 2e?

[@KalaamNozalys]

So you do get 2 class feats every 2 levels, damn. I thought it would be a single one from either class.

[@Nonat1s]

Yes! I actually forgot to say that directly, but you do still get a class feat from both classes!

[@KalaamNozalys]

@@Nonat1s That might be the most "OP" part of dual classing xD

[@polarisjos]

OOOOOR, a class feat from your "main" class, and a dedication/archetype feat from the second one (who needs cleric feats, anyway?)

[@reddragon9064]

this is just Gestault or how ever its spelt which been a homebrew thing for a long time (did a gestault 5e game once was fun being a barbarian fighter) but i don't think it ever been a official variant rule least in any system i played before so its interesting to see

[@OverlordLem]

@@polarisjos There's another variant rule in the dm guide called free Archetype, which is basically that. Every time you get a class feat, you also get an archetype feat.

[@camerondyer4859]

The biggest problem with dual class? Getting too used to it. When you're used to building dual class characters, it gets hard to feel satisfied with a regular single class character

[@sacredbeastzenon]

True. This happened in 3.5, Pathfinder 1e, 5e to me too.

[@phantomprince4278]

That's good to know. I have not tried it but want too.

[@sacredbeastzenon]

@@phantomprince4278 Honestly, I hope you do. One of my favorite characters I ever played in Pathfinder 1e is Azryn Melris Vandwyn. He's a human vampire Arcanist (Blade Adept) and Fighter dual-class aka gestalt. It was so fun running around spell striking. He killed a many a foe using disintegrate with and without spell strike. His favorite punishment to dole out was bestow curse. One time there was this troublesome noble that he taught a lesson by cursing him with blindness. I can't wait to reboot this character in Pathfinder 2e.

[@ShadowAraun]

Gestalts too fun, and i love to dm it so i am far too used to it lol

[@saw8108]

Nonat in his last video: "I am not a vampire" Nonat in the next video: "Don't worry about me looking suspiciously like a vampire"

[@UKHaiku]

😂

[@charliecole7414]

If you were a vampire, you'd deny it too - that's just basic survival. He should have found a subtler, more clever way to do so.

[@rileymcleran2895]

The trick is not to make the encounters harder, but to make the adventuring day harder. Dual class characters can do the same amount per turn, but have more tools to deal with more encounters.

[@FirstLast-wk3kc]

That is a good way to put it into words

[@philopharynx7910]

They generally have hellacious endurance. I saw this in the 3.5 version as well.

[@criminalmatrix6]

The eye-liner to once again prove that he's a vampire.

[@leimmortalraven3246]

1:20 People hate being asked to subscribe on channels they're already subscribed to. When it's a channel I'm not subscribed to, it helps me remember to subscribe if I'm enjoying the content

[@helenacrispim3744]

I LOVE dual-classing! Even in a big group, it's so much fun to see all the crazy/weird combinations everyone comes up with. And even if everybody has every skill trained, it's easy to make only expert level skills to work in certain situations to counter that. I love doing a salad of spell-casters classes and archetypes so I'll have access to most traditions and be extra flexable on what I can do in my turn, and I still don't feel "more powerful" as a character cause I still can cast only one spell per turn (two with quicked, but that's limited to once a day). It's super fun and luckly I never played with someone that abuses this rule making a much stronger character then everyone else. As a bonus, Champions Oaths become less weak since it's basically "extra feats" instead of wasting a feat that you might only make use of once or not at all. Even the spell slot number doesn't seem so broken, that mostly means you need to rest less times because of the "I'm out of spell slots" reason - which in a dungeon that is supposed to be dangerous... the idea of sleeping 8 hours to be able to replanish that is a little immersion breaking. So to me, having those extra spell slots are a big plus on that point. ♥

[@toodleselnoodos6738]

It’s kinda amazing how well the system works together. So 4 players dual classing, you could just treat the encounters as if they are 6-8 players instead and budget it accordingly. Super intriguing.

[@helenacrispim3744]

@@toodleselnoodos6738 not really, cause they don't get extra actions. It's very important to know they are not extra bodies that will act more than usual. And on PF2 actions economy is usually way more important. You should make it a bit harder, but as Nonat said... Just A LITTLE BIT and not double on difficulty, cause every player still has 3 actions and most of the time they just get more options for what to do with them and that's it.

[@gozmit97]

He is becoming more vampire:p

[@FirstLast-wk3kc]

Then why his cheeks are so red (i don't recall how that reddening the skin id called)? ... Or is it to mask hid pale vampiric nature?!?!

[@queenannsrevenge100]

Next video: Red contact lenses. Calling it now. 😉

[@hrafnkol1404]

I mean, have you seen those fangs?

[@charliecole7414]

@@FirstLast-wk3kc Some vampires can activate the stolen blood in their rotten veins to mimic the blush which the living possess.

[@FirstLast-wk3kc]

@@charliecole7414 wtm lore, right?

[@philopharynx7910]

We did Age of Ashes with four dual-class characters. Fighter/Rogue, champion/Bard, Sorcerer/Oracle, investigator/Witch. The fighter/rogue was pretty terrifying. She used dual fighting fans. One of her signature moves was to get swallowed whole so she could kill them from the inside. The champion was mostly championing, and used his spells for utility. The sorcerer/oracle played pretty normal except for flexibility and endurance. As an investigator/witch, I'd see what I was going to roll and choose to go up with my rapier or to stay back and cast.

[@sacredbeastzenon]

This sounds epic! The champion/bard dual-class sounds perfect as a follower of Shelyn.

[@philopharynx7910]

@@sacredbeastzenon And Shelyn it was. By the way, his character married the fighter/rogue. And in P2e, there's a marriage ritual that gives telepathy! Just what every relationship needs.

[@variantrules370]

Thanks for the great explanation! We use the Dual-class, free archetype, and Ancestry Paragon variant rules in all of our games, and the way we adjust the balance is we count the party as one level higher when calculating the encounter, but we don't use monsters higher than 4 levels up on the party's actual level. It works really well for us.

[@Qedhup]

One thing to note however; is that despite being stronger less PC's means less Action Economy. And Action Economy is arguably one of the biggest factors to determine how effective a PC/NPC is in the game. Sure those 2 PC's have the power of 4, but they still only have the Actions of 2. So for anyone doing because you have a small group, keep this in mind.

[@alextrollip7707]

Action economy is always wild to think about. It's how even low level players can team up and destroy a big bad with way more stats.(in 5e it's even more noticeable)

[@tristanmitchell1242]

Point of order: If you have to spell-book using classes with the same tradition, you can use just one spellbook for both. This is especially useful for a Magus/Wizard dual-class. There is no rule saying that you have to have a SEPARATE spellbook for each class, merely that you have to have a spellbook. Each spellbook only holds 100 spells, anyway.

[@crestk507]

Play with all extra variant feats active at once. Abp Free archetype Ancestral paragon And dual class. This is the true mythic path

[@badonkamonk9531]

Playing a dual class campaign. I'm playing a witch/monk focusing on the hair feats from witch as my main unarmed attack. It's been great fun to play grappling and tripping people with my hair.

[@camerontaylor612]

I'm currently making a zero to hero homebrew campaign using a bunch of variant rules, my group has a couple campaigns to play before that giving me time to build it up. I'm using level 0, dual class, FA, and Ancestral Paragon variants all together because the very end they are fighting the heralds of several gods. If they succeed, I'm granting them homebrew God hood where they can make their own Deities for future campaigns. The story is they're themselves playing dnd 5e that get pulled into Golarion through similar portals that brought Stasian tech. The same magic changes them into their characters and drops them directly into Starstone Cathedral for Starstone Challenge. If I remember I'll come back and tell y'all how it goes.

[@Tsurunen]

Ah yes, "the isekai campaign". But jokes aside, that does sound hella cool!

[@PurpleCyanideTube]

God I wish I had a DM that had the time and motivation to do the work to make this happen. This is really cool.

[@liamcage7208]

Good presentation. The GM book doesn't give enough detail on this subject. I figured most of it out myself but it was very valuable to have you confirm my thoughts on Dual-Classing. I know how you feel about the Fighter being broken but the thought of Banning one of the 4 original character classes is sacrilege. 😉 Also, if I may, you extoll the virtues of high level characters when a huge percentage of players rarely get beyond 7th level. After playing TTRPGs for decades only 2 campaigns got as high as level 11. High level stuff is worth mentioning but the sales pitch needs to be at the beginning and middle levels for most players and GMs to see the value, IMHO.

[@tefranger]

I feel like fighter/magus or magus/psychic are just crazy strong. And because the magus is a niche build it gets around the whole pairing with martial or spellcaster because hes already kinda both.

[@rayclawicefire2503]

Gunslinger/magus is pretty neat

[@robedshadow3775]

​@@rayclawicefire2503 my friends and I have been looking into pf2e and this is the build I was most excited to try at some point. Wasnt gonna touch archetypes or dual class till we got used to the system but one I watched both of those class vids I rly wanted to try a sniper magus ​

[@IronicCliche]

Looks like Nonat's vampire transition is progressing well

[@kaibaumgarten6856]

I love watching this 2 mo later. With him now at 44k subs. Absolutely beautiful how life works.

[@ericpfauser5721]

My wife and I have had consecutive duet campaigns running since the 1e days. We've always used dual class mechanics ( or gestalt as it used to be known.) It's lead to many good times, and a good amount of epic heroes in our own continuity of the Lost Omens setting.

[@Soliprem]

Did you also use a GMPC?

[@blevenox1916]

One caveat with character creation is with key ability boosts. It doesn’t say it in the dual classing rules, but you can’t use the same type of boost to boost the same ability twice. Like with your ancestry and background. If you have two classes with intelligence as a key boost, you only get 1 boost, not two. Pathbuilder made me realize that since it wouldn’t let me do that with a wizard/witch character.

[@PatricioINTP]

I solo GM my own games. As such I like doing two dual class characters. The primary is a Magus Champion Dragon (from the Battlezoo product) with a Thaumaturge Cleric for a sidekick who is usually a kobold, but for Kingmaker I opt for a Leshy. Early on they might require making certain encounters easier, but after gaining two levels, they often have no trouble with encounters as written. In Kingmaker, I got away with as written, earning extra XP, but when they faced an encounter with a single creature (A11), Linzi had to chip in and later Amari. After that encounters was more on the easy side except for those you might expect. OWLBEARS.

[@Hughes81]

I'm playing a Witch/]Monk Dual Class in a game and it's been really enjoyable. Of course we're using the neat stuff out of Fist of The Ruby Phoenix.

[@elementaryelknone6854]

13:07 fighter + Champion = Legendary proficiency in both armour and weapons.

[@camerondyer4859]

Another fun way to balance, and throw your players off the first time it happens, is to have the bosses and important npcs also be dual class.

[@Zanatos42]

D&D 3.5 had this variant too, called gestalt

[@Relisysification]

I am planning on using this for NPCs in my game coming up, my first thought is a Rogue Alchemist, who uses smoke sticks, tanglefoot bags, stealth, and deception to evade the party (intended use - crashes a wedding, 'kidnapping' the bride, who didn't want to go through with the wedding and hired him, but it needs to look real. Supplies Cheetah'a Elixsr for each if them, has laid hazards for those who give chase in advance, drops a smokestick when picking up the bride, bride leaves a trail as she isn't the stealthy one for the party to follow)

[@VoicesOfChaos]

Hey NoNats1, I wanted to share my experience with Dual Class. I am playing PF2 for the first time with my dad and my brother as the GM but also playing a character. Playing Agents Of Edgewatch. My dad is a Swashbuckler/Rogue. Brother is a Champion/Cleric. My first character is an Alchemist/Wizard and later I asked if I could play a second character because even starting a level higher Agents Of Edgewatch is still really tough on 3 dual-class characters LOL But also I really wanted to explore more character options in PF2. So second character is Gunslinger/Ranger. We are almost level 15 and afterwards I will take over as GM running Outlaws Of Alkenstar with each of them playing 2 characters. They refuse to ever play without Dual-Class haahaahaa So can't exactly compare to normal PF2 as I have never played without Dual-Class or even Free Archetype. Only my brother has who played in a campaign with an infamous GM who TPKed them. So he wanted us to be more powerful since he knows how hard PF2 can be and this was just a small family campaign. I would say though that is feels like they are not that much more powerful than base classes. You get more options and more variety in what you can do but a lot of stuff doesn't stack well together. You need to pay extra attention to if bonuses are circumstance bonus, status bonuses, and so on as a lot of feats that sound like good mixes actually invalidate one another. That being said, I don't think Fighter's higher accuracy would actually unbalance much. Being a Gunslinger I don't think my higher ATK has made any of my ranger abilities that much better that they are unfair. I will say that I think combining martials with spellcasters are the best dual-classes as it gives you a good mix of limited spells and unlimited powerful strikes. Dual-Martial doesn't feel like it gives as much extra. Next campaign will probably have dual-spellcaster so we will see how that goes.

[@Nonat1s]

That's so awesome to hear!! Hope the Alkenstar adventure goes great!!

[@sacredbeastzenon]

Well, I can't say I blame your dad and brother. Dual-class aka gestalt is an addictive drug.

[@VoicesOfChaos]

@@sacredbeastzenon we are all power gamers that just want to feel powerful and unstoppable 🤣

[@sacredbeastzenon]

@@VoicesOfChaos Yeah, I know what you mean and then some. My favorite character I played years ago in Pathfinder 1e is Azryn Melris Vandwyn. He's a lawful neutral mythic human vampire Arcanist (Blade Adept) / Fighter dual-class aka gestalt. He slaughtered countless foes across many battlefields with his adamantine katana named Woe of the Damned. My favorite flavor spell for this character is transmute wine to blood. The spells just turns a rather expensive bottle of wine into 1 pint of animal blood. Azryn being a noble didn't drink anyone's blood, but only certain individuals peaked his appetite. Foe and companion alike, but if you're an enemy it won't be pretty.

[@shiranuiraccoon7521]

the guyliner spooked me for a sec, i was like "holly shit my guy you need to sleep!!!"

[@zenvariety9383]

Now combine dual classing with free archetype.

[@abesinister3686]

Oh hey! I was in that game! 😁 Dazing Blow for the win! I haven't had the chance to use the dual class feature yet. But very interested. Just with free archetypes it can get intense. I can't imagine how dual class options can get.

[@Nonat1s]

That dazing blow just closed that fight down!! What a crazy critical!

[@MPDcaw]

One day i'll do a dual class+free archetypes+ancestry paragon+Gradual Ability Boosts+automatic bonus progression in a solo adventure just for the sake of experimentation.

[@WeHaveBurgersAtHome]

My group is using the dual-classing rule and I'm playing a Monk/Swashbuckler. It's gonna be great fun.

[@zacharyharwell351]

It sounds like what you get with Dual-classing isn't POWER but Versatility and Endurance

[@LordPelayoGG]

I'm playing and DMing martial/caster dual classes for 1 or 2 players and it feels great. Not broken at all mainly because you still only get 3 actions, versatility is what skyrockets and that's great.

[@Westongb]

My wife and I play a Duet game each Friday on twitch and have played duel class characters for over a year and we can dominate even with only two players. She is a Fighter champion and I am a Sorcerer Cleric. I have more healing than I know what to do with and I never get even close to using all my spells.

[@Zoetic2]

I wanted your opinion on this, as I'm working on a campaign that will use dual classing. But as far as spellbooks between two, same-tradition casters, for example magus with wizard, magus states in it's spellbook feature that if it's *multiclassed* with wizard dedication, you can use the same spellbook for both. This does specify multiclassing, but this could be just because dual classing isn't a core rule. What are your thoughts on how that would work?

[@sacredbeastzenon]

I believe this character will have two spellbooks. Why does it matter? Regardless, if you want other peoples input. You should make a post on Pathfinder 2e subreddit.

[@treyduggan696]

My group has played the Dual class & free archtype for almost 2 years. It is a little more powered than normal, but really not. 3 actions are still the limiting factor, and a severe encounter for a group of 5 single classes PCs is still severe for dual class/free archtype This has a HUGE advantage in diversity. AND, that one guy that is always the sacrificial healer can dual class into something more unique....or that normal tank can dual into cleric for secondary support. Or, a party of 5 fighters with 5 different dual classes for variety. It all works well....and still 3 actions each

[@sacredbeastzenon]

I really like that idea of playing an order of knights that dual-class fighter with whatever.

[@notcherbane3218]

You can also allow them to do a fighter/ thief combination If they don't want to deal with spells, fighter/ monk dual class doesn't break the rules there are characters and all kinds of different games spell swords a paladin is basically a fighter cleric, And if you're that worried about doubling up on magic user building up on fighters You just simply add a couple minor penalties in there to balance it out. This all comes down to an issue because Pathfinder and d&d as well as others don't want to use a skill-based game system they want a force everybody to use classes they could make it a lot simpler just by giving the basic classes to begin with and then allow them skills with minor penalties after that

[@a.z.pantera5577]

This reminds me a bit of Final Fantasy 5, where you can add features from mastered Jobs onto another Job. For example you could transplant the Spellblade ability from the Mystic Knight over to the Samurai, or give Blue Magic to the Red Mage for even more magic versatility.

[@louisbabycos106]

In 3.5 we had a group that needed a cleric and i wanted to play a monk . One of the players ( not me ) talked the DM into allowing me to play a cleric fighter gestalt . Karate chops and Healing in one package.

[@DonkeyDoormatDrive]

Great vid, honestly I found that treating duel class characters as if they had 1 additional party member in combat and just adding 1-2 small enemies per fight, and setting my expectations appropriately, when I didn't, works just fine. Even with the Fighter/Investigator

[@ReaperGrimm5594]

My favorite combo has to be the Rogue-Alchemist. Being able to cosplay Durzo Blint from the Night Angel trilogy is very fun.

[@phantomprince4278]

Great reference there!

[@phantomprince4278]

Also I'd love to see that character build.

[@Solrex_the_Sun_King]

Could you dual class summoner twice with two different eidolons?

[@rafasiqalv]

Dual class sounds amazing, but I'd really need some time to get used to it, since it increases your possible actions by a lot! But boy, would I love to go crazy and get an Invetor Alchemist, Swashbuckler Rogue or Monk Barbarian

[@icholi88]

Swashbuckler/Rogue... You will never say it isn't a direct power increase again. 13d6+7 finisher at level 10 with Analyze/precision debiliations and upwards of 3 strikes as reactions at full MAP with Prep + opportune backstab + riposte and/or Attack of Opportunity.

[@GrimmDichotomy]

I would love to play a Dual-Class character, having enjoyed Gestalt in D&D3.5/1E, but as it is our group's GM and even at least one of the players is very much resistant to even just Free Archetype T_T I honestly don't feel like it'd be -too- awkward to have a compromise on the Fighter, by limiting them to ONLY being allowed to pair with a full caster class (to avoid the INSANITY of a Fighter/Magus xP). Flurry Rangers are still rather dangerous, but they don't get an immediate accuracy boost, rather they benefit from better iterative precision (which is nothing to scoff at, agreed!) IF, in an ideal scenario, I could play a Dual-Class character, I honestly would LOVE to run a Wizard/Inventor. It wouldn't at all be an optimal choice (for start, both get Int as their boost and they don't stack) but thematically it would be so cool to play someone who employs both magic and technology (ala the D&D Artificer) to come up with clever solutions, and they would play quite well off of one another mechanically to boot ^_^ Alternatively, a Ranger/Cleric of Erastil that picks up some Eldritch Archer archetype feats would also be a lot of fun =3

[@nessesaryschoolthing]

It's funny how little some things have changed. In 1e, multiclassing martial classes was viable, even recommended, because it would continue to progress your BAB AND give you whatever early level goodies the second class has to offer, while spellcasting classes got pretty much nothing out of it because it wouldn't advance their primary caster progression, nor could they even use pool their different spell slots. It seems like the same relationship exists in 2e dual-classing.

[@brianschroeder3336]

I was really hoping you would cover this. Thank you.

[@tomraineofmagigor3499]

I didn't worry about the eyeliner. I'm worried about the crime scene that is that missing mustache

[@einkar4219]

I didn't played PF2e yet and I already have idea for magus - gunslinger dual class aka gun wizard

[@MichaelSchell-yb7sh]

I'm interested in this in remastered Pathfinder. I was using this before to build a Druid-Ranger. And the idea of limiting this to a martial and spellcaster is one I actually use.

[@NRMRKL]

Maybe you should make another dual class tier list for the summoner - poor thing always gets bashed in ranking videos. It could be cool to explore all the ways to make it better.

[@naroe2001]

Ive had a player rouge mage from 5e use dual class for pf2e. I allowed full selection at 1st, then made him choose one feat from his choice either a mage feat or rouge feat. I found the Dual class as listed was too strong , but free archetype didnt work for my campaign. This is swapping from 5e to pf2e at 7th level with existing characters in my campaign. Looks good so far.

[@SheppiTSRodriguez]

Im currently playing a dual class campaign (level 14 currently) and I have a Fighter/Flurry Ranger and a Magus/Rogue... those are super strong, and can pull some amazing rounds. But Overall, depends on the players, and can still face danger on the system without making changes. I just use the normal encounter rules, and we have had some close to tpk moments. We have never go above +3 difficulty for a single enemy. We had a fight with a dragon +2 level, and I used that thing to its absolute max, and it was an incredibly close and exciting fight.

[@ObedientMammal]

Well shit.. this "fixes" the summoner. I love the summoner as is, but this helps alleviate a lot of the gripes a lot of people have with the summoner.

[@AceOfSerberit]

Pathfinder is sounding better and better for each thing I learn about it

[@phantomprince4278]

Has anyone tried a dual-class variant campaign? What are your thoughts? I am a GM considering running this some day soon.

[@batwafflz970]

Could you make a video about your favorite duel class combos? I was thinking of making a Rogue/Alchemist Ratfolk character and trying to make them a Plague Rat of sorts

[@Nonat1s]

I don't have a video about my "favorites", but I do have one all about rogue dual-classing specifically! kzbin.info/www/bejne/n2PLe6l6oNt2fqs

[@leviangel97]

I've played a dual class game for 10 levels and we weren't as much stronger as you'd expect

[@jamesdominguez7685]

I have to say, this sounds like it'd be a heap of fun in the right group of players, especially if it's just a GM and 2-3 players. It would feel a bit like those alternate universe comic series, like Marvel's Ultimate Universe: things look kinda the same here, but they're very different in some fun ways. Definitely a sometimes food, though.

[@hanshansomahammau]

Between the option of dual-classing vs. getting an extra archetype/multiclass feat every even level, which one do you prefer? what are the pros and cons of the different approaches? love to hear your opinion on it! you've been my deep dive into PF2e the last 2 weeks, keep on making good content mate!

[@webbowser8834]

So Dual Classing is without a doubt stronger than free archetype from a mechanical standpoint. Archetypes tend to function on a ~2 level delay when it comes to getting any given feat or class feature, and 2 levels is a big deal in Pathfinder (or really most TTRPGs). That being said, Free Archetype also has less potential to just completely throw out the balance of a game while still giving players more options to work with, so it's easier to just "throw it in" into a campaign that's already balanced on paper, especially for less wargamey groups. I personally enjoy Free Archetype more just because it feels less like I'm trying to manage two character builds in a trenchcoat, but that's my opinion. Both of these variants have their place at different tables.

[@seanmcmannamy4375]

This is a fun variant rule that I am using for a full campaign.

[@matiasduarte2418]

My trick for balancing the fighter its simple. At level 1 the player is only trained if they dual martial and the restriction is removed at level 3 only for 1 group of weapons. At level 5 all restrictions are lifted. I have a Ranger-Fighter in my campain and they did just fine up to level 6 when we took a break from the game.

[@zacharymelvin6669]

Fighter plus Sorcerer/wizard = Eldritch Knight. Could you do a 2E Eldritch Knight please?

[@sacredbeastzenon]

Hey! Don't forget Magus.

[@Twigggggy]

is there somewhere on the internet i can watch this jaspers game day i can't find anything recent

[@Zzyx_Rising]

I thought magus could use the same spells if dual-class with either wizard or arcane sorcerer ( if said character chosen arcane evolution at 4th level)

[@zidarose]

Always fun learning about variant rules

[@flameloude]

I would go cleric champion purely for smiting.

[@fitzgeraldlimisella4393]

So can you dual class and still take multiclass archetypes (eg dual class fighter/wizard and take cleric dedication at level 2)? Or can you even do free archetype with dual classing?

[@Audiotrocious]

From what I understand, you can still do Archetype/Dedications

[@PurpleCyanideTube]

As much as I would love to play in a game with this, I struggle to find a DM/group in general. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I should look for a group?

[@knightghaleon]

I really like this style of play. When I heard there was no multiclassing in 2E I was getting nervous.

[@jake05131]

These are excellent points. Inspires me to let one player dual class, but one class must be a heal bot. No one at my table ever wants to do it haha

[@Nonat1s]

An interesting idea would be to bless the party with a deity's divine font, but given the to entire crew. Give every player one Heal spell per day they can use at the highest available spell slot. That way no single person is a heal bot, but everybody has the chance to help each other out daily!

[@jake05131]

@@Nonat1sI like that! that is similar to another fix I proposed, an estus flask that refills at rest. A reskin of elixir of life that has a few daily charges

[@abjak2026]

This is a really cool rule for someone who plays a lot of 1 on 1 games with my girlfriend. It lets us make interesting dynamic characters without feeling like we’re suffering too hard for playing alone.

[@threadscore]

3.5 had a similar rule called gehshtalt(sp) classes.

[@reddragon9064]

Hey Nonat1s i came by to say great video keep up good work i got one of my dms to run this system and i enjoying it we had our first session like last night im playing a half orc Dragon Instinct Barbarian (i know real original lmao) it real fun though there is a interesting thing with my character in that his mother is a Kitsune not a human anyways i been watching your videos for a wile now and been using them to get ideas for characters and help me understand system better they been great help so thanks i actually have like 3 other characters ready in case my current one dies or we run a new game so should be fun to get to them eventually on to topic of this video Barbarians/Rogues are some of my favorite classes consistently so im curious if you will continue the dule class tier list and do one for some other classes like which classes do you think are best paired with Barbarian or Sorcerer or Inventor so on so forth particularly im interested in barbarian im sure barb fighter not best one but its really good at doing its one job of being a martial menace so many crits and good ac despite rage is lovely lol anyways just wanted to say ty for all the hard work and looking forward to next video you upload and ill be keeping a eye on this channel for a wile as i plan on playing P2E for a wile

[@Nonat1s]

Thank you for the super kind words! I definitely want to make a few more of those dualclass tier lists! I don't know if I'll do EVERY class (since it'll get more and more redundant every time) but I'll definitely do at least a couple more at some point!

[@nargileh1]

Sounds like the gestalt rules from way back (I dont remember which edition)

[@louisbabycos106]

I wish they had brawler strangler and Tetori monk in PF2 . Imagine a Pathfinder 2E legal strangler brawler Tetori monk .

[@deadmaster058]

there it is, i would love to see more "build" videos :D

[@BestgirlJordanfish]

Honestly the Fighter is just kinda awesome with every dual class except maybe gunslinger as far as I can tell.

[@braqqam]

Is this correct: Bonuses Types: - Item - Circumstance - Status - "Un-Named" Each roll is allowed only one bonus from each "named" bonus and an unlimited number of "un-named" bonuses. Meaning, each roll includes upto three "named" bonuses, one per each "named" type and as many "un-named" bonuses that apply.

[@Nonat1s]

Yes, but unnamed bonuses are incredibly rare in PF2. I Don't think I could even name one off the top of my head.

[@charliecole7414]

@@Nonat1s Yes, that's why they're unnamed bonuses.

[@pontchristophe3938]

Great editing for this one. Also I'd like to try dual class but my players aren't experienced enough at the game 😅 Hard enough to push Free Archetype :P

[@florianmahr5000]

Actually I did completely forgot to Sub because I am so used to have content creators remind me of this. Done now! Long Time DND DM here now switching to Pathfinder 2e to give it a try. Your videos make my life so much more easy! Thank you a lot for that.

[@notcherbane3218]

Some dual class options don't make any sensors or are difficult to allow such as a paladin lawful good combined with a assassin If it's an evil paladin yes but a lawful good character wouldn't be assassinating people, and a barbarian wizard wouldn't make any sense either but a barbarian /shaman or witch might or barbarian /cleric or a monk barbarian while possible would be very difficult to make sense. I love dual classic and multi-classing it allows ability to customize a character I hate straight classes unless they allow for a wide variety of skill adoption. It's me it makes sense if you're a fighter you might want a few spells protection from evil healing magical defense I spill that enhances your physical strength and speed and endurance those are spells that would make sense for a fighter to use or a thief and invisibility spell for a levitate spell or a C in the dark spell this is all magic that would make sense for these characters to want and to deny that ability to them doesn't make any sense because you're going to want everything you can to help you to survive. Now yes there are magical items that they can get but to be able to have the magical ability yourself is a more practical and you don't have to worry about somebody stealing them

[@thomaseasley6053]

I have a character that is a giant instinct barbarian dual-classed with the weapon inventor for maximum dmg

[@josephpettit8572]

I like to dual class my main villains. It gives them an unexpected punch against my players. Example- the villain is acting like a rogue with sneak attack, then bam! Fireball!.

[@ethosterros9430]

Isnt that what a gestalt is?

[@DenisLyamets]

Lol, welcome to 3.5e geshtalts

[@mahmoudshihab]

Never played Pathfinder, so this may come off as a simple or stupid question... but do they level up at the same time, or do they choose a class to level up each time?

[@shrimpisdelicious]

Alchemist/Fighters would be very good bomb-throwers.

[@sacredbeastzenon]

That sounds like they'd be the sentient artillery platform.

[@sirkillian]

How much stronger are they? 1,2-1,3-2 times as strong?

[@okagisama]

That depends which classes are selected, and who's playing. As their strength resides in more specific things they are good at. In the hands of a well-planned player, a dual class character may appear as if it has everything to counter what a GM may throw at them. Honestly though, i played and GMed with this varient rule a few times, and it allows to reate fun concepts, more than powerhouses. As a GM, the best way to see where they are at is to run the beginning of an adventure as written, then see if the difficulty needs to be ramped up.

[@DareXIII]

On average I'd say if they are mixed between martial and caster, 25-75% stronger, if both martial I'd go with 40-75% (75% is definitely for fighter), and 25% for dual casters. Casters become more versatile but they still get 1 spell a turn most times.

[@KodyaxDerschrecken]

I like using this variant to create Druid-Ranger

[@sacredbeastzenon]

Yep. It's very thematic.

[@withintheshyness]

Me starting to calm down after realizing being at a 2000% stress level realizing I can actually have my spells if my group switches to pathfinder (been playing as a Paladin in dnd and as a champion I would lose a lot of my spells)

[@leimmortalraven3246]

I use dual-class for if I wanna play with 2 or 3 players since the game is mostly made for 5

[@WilliamWizer]

dual-classing it may not be as OP as it seems at first glance but, can we triple-classing? I hope not because that would be quite a power-up.

[@louisbabycos106]

I want a PATHFINDER 2E supplement to play monsters .

[@tylerhodson7325]

Laughing Shadow Magus + Rogue = lots of sneak damage 😈 and all you gotta do is flank

[@wintterdior7442]

Eyeliner... So you are not turning into a full vampire (yet)?

[@warlocksunited2e580]

VAMPIRE

[@suraikou7432]

Forget about balance and embrace the dual class free archetype ancestry paragon:D