What Parts of C# Are Obsolete? Should I Even Learn The .NET Framework?

With .NET 6 coming out, the question is coming up again about which versions of .NET are obsolete. Is the .NET Framework relevant? How about older versions of .NET Core? These are the questions we are going to answer in today's episode of Dev Questions.
Website: iamtimcorey.com/
Patreon: / iamtimcorey
Sign Up to Get More Great Developer Content in Your Inbox: signup.iamtimcorey.com/

[@joeyf9826]

A related idea for a future video, if you haven't covered it already: when is it time to move on from a technology and embrace the new thing, even if it means leaving a job? You talked a bit here about how companies with a lot of existing code usually don't rush toward the cutting-edge, which is definitely the case. However, then they start to lag behind, and your skills as a dev start to fall behind too. At what point should a developer decide to move on to keep their own skills current, maybe to a greenfield project, even if the pay and team are good at their current job?

[@nasarahalhassan]

As usually, very informative and helpfully. Thank you for giving that great knowledge for free.

[@IAmTimCorey]

You are welcome.

[@CRBarchager]

17:50 I totally agree. I started a blazor project in .Net 3.1 in january 2021 and had I been able to go back I would have started it in .NET 5. The amount of components that I had to create from scratch is insane due to them not being included in 3.1 but are in .NET 5. This woul have saved me alot of time not having to develope these myself. The only good thing about it is that I learned alot from develope them myself and not just adding a NuGet package. Most of which wasn't possible due to those packages required .NET 5 to work.

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

Thanks for sharing from your real world experience.

[@UmanPC]

as usually, very informative and straght to the point. Tnx Tim

[@IAmTimCorey]

You are welcome.

[@nicholaschua6248]

Thank you Tim for clear explanation

[@IAmTimCorey]

You are welcome.

[@dirkschannel5817]

Think .NET Framework will stay for many years. I make good money maintaining and upgrading WebForms (even 3.5) applications - there are still lots of low hanging fruits like introducing async stuff to improve them… it’s old tech, but some people are surprised how well it scales if done right. New stuff is created in .NET Core. For me it’s the right mix that makes fun in the job.

[@IAmTimCorey]

Great perspective. Thanks for sharing.

[@rakeshpanigrahi577]

Thanks Tim for the great suggestion

[@IAmTimCorey]

You are welcome.

[@reyrrob]

I like your approach on most things you say... Thanks

[@IAmTimCorey]

You are welcome.

[@GameDevNerd]

The words C# and "obsolete" don't fit together in the same sentence. C# is growing and it's now cross-platform and running on every flavor of system. Even Apple couldn't fight it. And Java is on the decline. The language is just that beautiful. 😍

[@IAmTimCorey]

I'm glad you like it.

[@kinjiru731]

I am the sole in-house developer for the company I work for and have a lot of control over how development is done. I am mostly still working with .NET Framework 4.5.2 applications because development time is more important than anything else and it's the most common environment I work with. That said, I have a couple of brand new major projects I've chosen to do in .NET Core and I used some of your classes to help me dip into .NET Core. I'm still very shaky in Core but I've been able to get a new .NET Core web application off the ground and continue to add features to it.

[@IAmTimCorey]

Great! Keep pushing forward. You will get it.

[@harag9]

Great talk. I'm still working in .NET framework 4.8 WINFORMS - spend so much time on this during work hours, I don't even have time to learn Core - at one point was planning on learning Core 3.1, and now it's up to v6... arrh time flies.

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

It's a moving target to be sure. If I may, try just learning small chunks at a time. Small goals like 3 x 30 min training/practice sessions a week at lunch time. that works for some folks, maybe you?

[@joeyf9826]

I was in the same boat and eventually decided I needed to move on to a new job. I was spending too much time learning the nuances of WCF, .NET Remoting and other outdated technology that the current tech was passing me by. Realized it would be a far better investment of time to work with something current. If I'm going to spend 40 hours/week practicing something, it might as well be an investment in the future.

[@harag9]

@@joeyf9826 I think I'm just too old and lazy now to switch jobs, The old rubbish software at work still needs someone to care for it, so might as well be me. Wish I was 30 years younger.

[@pierreplourde]

I’ve gone through all your KZbin videos from the oldest to this point, and through most of your level 1 courses on your site (almost done Getting Started with Azure), and except for a couple of small, specific, issues (like manual Docker with .NET using .NET Core 2.2 (your video) vs .NET Core 3.1 (what I tried) where there was a breaking change), I’ve not had a problem following along. The biggest changes have been in the Azure UI, where Microsoft keeps making major UI changes and moving things around, making it a challenge sometimes to follow the older videos.

[@IAmTimCorey]

Unfortunately, Azure is a rapidly moving target. They don't make it easy to keep up.

[@Dotnetexplorer]

Thanks that is great as always

[@IAmTimCorey]

You are welcome.

[@adolfomedina1774]

This is honestly an awesome channel

[@IAmTimCorey]

Thanks!

[@thiruvetti]

I am currently architecting a project where we are replacing VB 6 components interacting with Mainframe backend. Had to dust off the VB/Cobol skills lying in the darkest shelves in my brain. Its fun but damn frustrating with financial restrictions. So am also writing itsy bitsy utilities for code conversion etc. We are ALT+TABing 2 technologies that are generations apart. Its like chatting with the Grandfather, the father and the son in parallel.

[@IAmTimCorey]

That can be frustrating. It is great that people can do it, though, since it is such a common thing to need.

[@thiruvetti]

​@@IAmTimCorey yup. I heard abt strong demand of Cobol developers due to the no of Mainframe projects being migrated to new tech.

[@thiruvetti]

The major challenge in these Covid times is that big customers are pretty tight on the financials. So arent allowed to hunt for Migrations tools

[@peanut-d-cat]

Thank you so much.

[@IAmTimCorey]

You are welcome.

[@Balgoriusis]

None. I'm part of a bigger team on a large corporation and we are maintaining projects ranging from VB6 to .Net5.

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

Pretty typical in large corps.

[@refactorear]

I feel you lol We bought an annual license for a conversion software to migrate 1.2m of lines of code in VB6 to C# on NET 4.7.2, it worked amazingly well and we had this software up and running in 3 months (over 200 projects). We still have several in VB6 that we are not going to migrate but we wanted to update this one since we could no longer load the whole project group, it had made debugging a nightmare.

[@paultannenberg4432]

They might be obsolete for new development but not for maintenance.

[@IAmTimCorey]

Yep, that's basically what I was sharing. It is easy to get caught up in learning the cutting-edge technologies and forget that a lot of businesses are stuck with 10+ year old technologies.

[@goodoleme747]

Same here. We have applications written in VB6 that are running strong.

[@oligreenfield1537]

Like alway great advice from Tim To sum some keys points -Foundation in C# is the same for all .Net version -Avoid WCF, Web Form because they are a very niche way of doing web -For new project start in .Net 6 I will also add .Net Framework it’s a must to know why ? Because it’s shipped in every windows computer. Trust me you don’t wanna start a fight with pc administrator to ask them to deploy anything on a computer

[@IAmTimCorey]

You can deploy a .NET Core app without installing .NET Core.

[@Papyszoo]

I would really love a series where you are reviewing some github open source code and show good practicies and ideas.

[@IAmTimCorey]

I did that in the Exploring C#: Blazor WebAssembly course: www.iamtimcorey.com/p/exploring-c-blazor-webassembly

[@michelchaghoury870]

gr8 vid I would like to see Data Structures & Algorithms in C# series can you do it or something similar

[@IAmTimCorey]

I will add it to the list. Thanks for the suggestion.

[@michelchaghoury870]

Tnx i believe that it only knowing cutting edgetechs is enough as q dev we need to understand how to think and data structures and algorithm as the foundation and not anyone can teach that but you, you are the best so thx u@@IAmTimCorey

[@RobertNicholas]

Pretty much on point. A table showing the different versions compared to scenarios (long term support, new project etc) might be beneficial. re: WCF What a nightmare of a component. I have to support a complex project, for a large Govn department, which uses 2004 SOAP standards. I've ended up overwriting much of the WCF framework just to make it work. For me, getting rid of WCF with some replacement is just not an option. That's real work scenario stuff. Thanks again! :)

[@IAmTimCorey]

The issue with visuals (which we are still thinking about) is that this is a podcast. We can't do things that listeners would need to see to gain the full value.

[@thiruvetti]

Thanks a lot Tim. Can you also share your thoughts about where F# would help improve the quality of an application. I hear few different versions, one of the common ones being "replace all your math based algorithms with F#". A short video to describe its real world usage would be helpful

[@IAmTimCorey]

I can add that to the suggestion list. Thanks!

[@thiruvetti]

@@IAmTimCorey Thanks

[@thiruvetti]

@ghost mall Yup me too. May be F stands for 'Funky' 😉😉

[@warlockCommitteeMeeting]

love u tim

[@faicalammisaid3705]

Nice haha 😄

[@IAmTimCorey]

Thanks!

[@Brofbrofs]

Great and important topic

[@IAmTimCorey]

Thanks!

[@Brofbrofs]

@@IAmTimCorey I have a question about this topic, what if somebody isn’t doing it to get a job would it be okay to stick with .net framework or you would also recommend to use . Net? Thanks

[@IAmTimCorey]

Well, there are a lot of benefits to .NET Core including incredible speed improvements, better security, and more modern features. However, for personal projects, it really is up to you.

[@Brofbrofs]

@@IAmTimCorey Appreciate it thanks

[@ayotundeayoko5861]

Excellent video Tim. Maybe not related, but this usually bugs me when developing a new project in .NET Core, I usually make my class libraries/assemblies in .net standard, just in case I need these in a legacy project. Is this a good practice?

[@IAmTimCorey]

That can be an excellent practice if it is a possibility that you might need to use them in a legacy project.

[@metaltyphoon]

This should be 100% something every boss should think about. If you stagnate you will pay with finding people that WANT to work with legacy tech. This is a huge risk that is often overlooked.

[@IAmTimCorey]

It really is. Decisions made today will have an impact for years to come. Unfortunately, that impact isn't felt right away so it is often ignored.

[@mbriandunson]

Thanks Tim. Good stuff as always. If you were starting a new Windows desktop application and needed to use the Microsoft stack, what path would you pursue?

[@IAmTimCorey]

Probably WPF if sticking strictly in the Microsoft-produced templates. If you were opening things up to third-party systems that use the Microsoft stack (and you should), I would check out Uno or something similar to see if it might meet more of your needs compared to WPF.

[@mbriandunson]

@@IAmTimCorey thanks. I’ve been a Winforms developer for many years and have several custom Winforms apps in use at a couple of clients. I’ll check out WPF and Uno! Thanks

[@blackjack2150]

I thought about this as well. WPF is the newer Framework, but it's pretty quiet now. WinForms, as old as it is, seems more robust and better suited for long term support. Just my impression, though. Curious to read more options and arguments for either.

[@PierreH1968]

This has been a great frustration, the obsolescence of features in the name of novelty. WPF developers have been victims of the continuous visual downgrades for the benefit of adherence of new standards. From tool to tool, we got less and less development features and performance increments that hardware overcame faster.

[@LarryPeteet]

FYI Senior Developer at a major bank: We have full Microsoft Technology Stack currently. We recently started converting/upgrading our UI/UX to Angular which they call Modern User Interface (MUI). Fairly new there so not sure about other conversions.

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

Good luck on the upgrade!

[@beater6967]

20 years of .Net. We finally had enough of the Microsoft mess and are converting to Angular also.

[@larsp5109]

@@beater6967 Good luck with that (JS crap)…

[@ml_serenity]

@@larsp5109 it's not JS and definitely not a crap. Just get some clue

[@larsp5109]

@@ml_serenity So, Angular isn’t JS…?! Indeed, get some clue!

[@quicktastic]

Truth. I've been working in a high tech industrial field for 25+ years. There is lot of machines doing important jobs and do it very well and the code is from whenever. Plenty of it running on software from the 90s. Windows NT based control screens are not uncommon. It just works. Anything new uses the latest of course. I've seen disasters where they try to rewrite some code on a newer platform and the drivers won't work etc.. Everything would have to be redone from scratch. Not happening.

[@IAmTimCorey]

Agreed. A rewrite just to get it in a modern language is almost impossible in a lot of cases. There will always be old code running somewhere, which means there will be someone maintaining that old code.

[@joeyf9826]

SCADA systems, airline and hotel reservation systems, medical software, banking systems, phone systems - so much critical software that is working fine and is not being changed anytime soon. The software running nuclear power plants is not using the latest version :D

[@cubbucca]

We use sign writing software that supports win10, its still compiled with VB4.

[@IAmTimCorey]

Ouch.

[@aperezNWO]

Thank you very much sir.

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

Thanks for watching

[@freddycastelblancomacias6082]

There are always something new to learn even if you have route that path before

[@IAmTimCorey]

Yes there is.

[@Jamiered18]

My company's problem is that all the SQL interfacing code is still written in the old LINQ to SQL. To upgrade to .Net Core and beyond, we must migrate to Entity Framework. However, most of the LINQ code migrates without syntax errors, it's at runtime that it fails, which is much harder to resolve - and we just don't have time or resources

[@IAmTimCorey]

I would look into seeing if you could upgrade your queries to Dapper calls one at a time. Then, when you are done, you can upgrade the project. Even if you don't have the time to redo all of the queries all at once, if you redo a few at a time, eventually you will get there.

[@saadali5906]

omg linq to sql (rofl)

[@AdamsTaiwan]

I still need for a Web service to return a DataSet to a WPF app and for a DataSet to be sent to web service with changes to update a DB. Last I checked, .Net core does not support this.

[@S3Kglitches]

Can you do video about why gRPC does not and will not fully replace WCF? I have just started doing .NET Core gRPC Server and sample .NET 5 client & .NET Framework 4.8 client (Grpc.Core - the C library wrapper) For some reason, the .NET 5 client with the package from James Netwon-King takes 60 to 70 ms for roundtrip vs 1 to 2 ms in .NET Framework version client on localhost and I could not figure out why is that. The funny thing about .NET 5 gRPC client (Grpc.Net - the C# gRPC implementation) is that it doesn't even have channel status querying (e.g. via public property). But at the same time it's been presented in every dotNet/Visual Studio video.

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

Topic suggestion noted and have added to Tim's list of viewer requests, thanks.

[@jhbonarius]

From experience I can say that you should know all versions of C#... because some old developers cannot mentally process modernization, and keep writing code in their C#0.1beta style, even if the project is .NET 6. 😫 ...., enough complaining. Thanks for the video.

[@IAmTimCorey]

You are welcome.

[@AlThePal78]

so MVC Core goes where Should I not worry about that or is that part of asp.net

[@IAmTimCorey]

MVC Core is part of the .NET Core web project types (collectively called ASP.NET Core). The projects in ASP.NET Core are Razor Pages, MVC, API, Blazor Server, and Blazor WebAssembly. The collective web projects of the .NET Framework were called ASP.NET and they included ASP.NET MVC and ASP.NET Web Forms.

[@AlThePal78]

@@IAmTimCorey thanks for clearing that up for me :)

[@mk553]

I've heard that Microsoft isn't recommending starting new Core projects in MVC. Is that true, and should I avoid MVC for new projects? If so, what is the (better) alternatives?

[@IAmTimCorey]

Here you go: kzbin.info/www/bejne/j5nSm4KffM96rLM

[@mk553]

@@IAmTimCorey Thanks!

[@JohnSilvanus]

So, noticing that your shows are pretty much just you talking, I'm wondering if I can get these as a podcast from some place?

[@IAmTimCorey]

Yep, this is a podcast primarily. Check out iamtimcorey.buzzsprout.com/

[@baibhavkumar6031]

I was just getting hang of dot net framework after handling some projects and then came dot net core. Now, it's like I know somewhat dot net framework but I need to get to know dot net core. Should I still pursue framework or jump to core.

[@CRBarchager]

Jump to .NET Core/.NET 6 since this is the future. If you know a bit of .Net Framework this knowledge will still help you in .NET.

[@baibhavkumar6031]

@@CRBarchager yeah, right

[@AliMustafa-xp8ih]

it is really confusing especially for someone who doesn't have enough knowledge about it BUT may i ask Can i find a job in a company that will hire me based upon my Experience in C#. net framework .....NOT ASP , NOT .NET CORE

[@IAmTimCorey]

You probably can. It is a shrinking field in terms of developers, but there is a LOT of code out there that is still in the .NET Framework. The thing is that your business might want to move to .NET Core at some point and you should be willing/able to help them.

[@malcox5218]

yo can you make a tutorial about ienumerable and iernumerator in c#

[@IAmTimCorey]

Thanks for the suggestion.

[@AlThePal78]

this is so overwhelming while learning mvc core

[@IAmTimCorey]

I can understand that, but don't try to learn the language plus how it has changed over the past 20 years all at once. Just relax and focus on modern C# like you are doing. Once you get up to speed, then look at how it is different in the .NET Framework so that you understand, but don't do that yet. Wait until you feel comfortable with your knowledge in C# in .NET Core first.

[@AlThePal78]

@@IAmTimCorey Thank you it gets frustrating made me quit twice. .Net java all that stuff is updating so fast. Javascript CSS all of it LOL I quit come back quit come back gets overwhelming. Thank you for your feedback :) I am trying to use a DTO with my database so I can make my front end safer so confusing lol I will try that next :) .

[@petropzqi]

If possible please talk about business that seems to be stuck. I mean they are to big to shift. My current client want all these new features but it's more or less impossible with their current stack.

[@tcortega]

I suppose it is a great topic, and that's because this is pretty much the majority of the market that tries to hire c# devs. Most of them are still stuck in .NET Framework and if we get lucky, we find a job for .NET Core 3.1 :(

[@Balgoriusis]

@@tcortega Yeah... If an HR asked me what we want from developer, among the things would be Soap and WCF - which is not even supported by .Net5 anymore.

[@androumeda9538]

@@Balgoriusis not supported because in Microsoft they are a bunch of opinionated nerds. Standards are there to last and Soap is not going to die any soon, Microsoft like it or not. Dropping technology invented only 15 years ago is like saying that because cars will all be electric from now on, car makers won't build spare parts for older cars...great vision indeed ;-)

[@tcortega]

​@@androumeda9538 Not supported because we should be always updating and evolving our system, they shouldn't be accommodating us to using something this old.

[@androumeda9538]

@@tcortega In my vision Soap is not old, nor is Wcf which was way more than one of the many soap implementations around. Building intranet network services in .Net is way more difficult without Wcf, .net core rest services are only a small subset of what is needed for efficient and fast bi-directional communications between peers in normal businesses not exposed on the internet

[@_incarnate]

What parts or concepts of C# are always used in web development, that one should learn as a bare minimum?

[@IAmTimCorey]

If you are going to be a C# web developer, you need to learn C# itself really well (all parts except desktop UI).

[@_incarnate]

@@IAmTimCorey Okay. I will figure that out. Then a request, could you please show us how we can route from a client app, say MCV, to a service, say Identity service, for auth purposes in a microservice architecture. I would like to understand the communication

[@richie7425]

If your working with old dotnet it will make you obsolete. That's the issue with working for companies with true legacy code. There is a limit to when you are still in a career as opposed to just getting paid money.

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

You are right. I got complacent by developing expertise in a single set of tools that frankly aged off. I was happy with the paycheck but that eventually ran its course and it left me in a major bind. Its best to think Career, not just job!

[@user-mw4yp3jm1v]

C# is the king of kings.

[@IAmTimCorey]

I think you misspelled Jesus.

[@DanielNistrean]

I'd recommend learning .NET Core 2+ and .NET 5, 6. You should refuse a job where the tech is so old.

[@IAmTimCorey]

That's going to definitely limit your job opportunities. I totally get the sentiment, though. Just be aware that companies need people to help them migrate eventually as well. Also, it isn't always so cut and dried. Some companies are doing new development in .NET 6 but still have old applications that need to be maintained in the .NET Framework.

[@tesses50]

I do it as a hobby (cant use .net core on my platform (the wii has PowerPC)) so I use .net framework in mono I use Simple-Http nuget package as server (cant use asp.net core, this library was easy enough for me) I wrote some winforms on .NET Framework 4 (works on XP, I know XP is old and not supported 2014, Its my favorite win version) I use linux now

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

Thanks for watching

[@TioPew]

I am obsolete

[@IAmTimCorey]

Nah, you are just vintage.

[@abj136]

Tracking 9 is ridiculous. Know Core and Framework. Everything else is a web search for the right docs.

[@IAmTimCorey]

I didn't say learn 9, I said there were 9 important ones that you might need to work with. When it comes to learning the differences between versions, I said .NET Framework 4.8, .NET Core 3.1 and .NET 6.

[@paulbaker78]

The core versions listed were right on. 2.1, 3.1, 5.0, 6.0, nailed it. For framework, 3.5 (old and crusty wcf) and framework 4.7,4.8 are pretty much right. All those minor 4.x versions should be avoided.

[@CharlesOkwuagwu]

Moved away from .net framework and C#. Much better frameworks and languages out there.

[@willinton06]

What did you move into? Rust?

[@prezadent1]

What languages do you prefer over C#? I don't wanna hear anything about functional languages cause that's bunk.

[@CharlesOkwuagwu]

Moved to Elixir, and I'm really Enjoying development again. I'm able to choose the language and platform I use to deliver services to my clients, so have since dropped C#, and .NET

[@IAmTimCorey]

I'm glad you found something that works for you.

[@iosaroj]

*Title is misleading.* I came here for _What Parts of C# are obsolete_ but no clear information provided on this.

[@IAmTimCorey]

I answered that question. The title is the questions I was asked. The video is the answer I gave to those questions. It sounds like you are looking for specific code bits that are obsolete. This is not a very frequent occurrence. There are things that are deprecated but it isn't common to actually mark .NET items as obsolete because then things aren't backward compatible. It is more likely to see this on 3rd party libraries. This is especially true since an item might be marked as deprecated in a version of .NET but that just means that in new versions it is not recommended to use. However, it is still supported in previous versions.

[@PatricksDad]

Don't learn Silverlight either

[@IAmTimCorey]

True. Support for it ends next week.

[@wilsono2940]

What's the deferent between .Net Core and .Net Framework?🤷

[@windowsbuilderthegreat3121]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/bWq4iKmIbJhnras

[@mrrafiki4429]

Mr. Corey has a video on this: check ".NET Confusion"

[@mooglegiant]

Core is the replacement to framework. Framework is < v4.8, Core is a complete rewrite in it implementation, so it's really hard to migrate.

[@wilsono2940]

Thanks guys, really appreciate your response🙏🙏

[@IAmTimCorey]

This video will help with the confusion of .NET versions: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aqDPgGyLn7ecrdk @Mooglegiant - the .NET Framework goes up to v4.8. As for migration to .NET Core, it is not that hard to do so. I did it with the TimCo Retail Manager project and I have a course on doing so with the Tournament Tracker application (WinForms, WPF, ASP.NET MVC, and a class library). The code is mostly the same. It is just the csproj files that are the big change. After that, it is about the third-party dependencies and if they are supported unless you are using a technology that did not move over to .NET Core like WCF. Even then, though, you can move the rest of your code to .NET Core and use .NET Standard 2.0 to support both .NET Framework and .NET Core at once.

[@dcuccia]

This was 100% about runtimes and libraries, nothing C# at all.

[@IAmTimCorey]

This answers the question asked. WCF, WF, etc. are C# project types.

[@user-sz3nn2lb6u]

Second

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

Thanks for watching

[@user-sz3nn2lb6u]

@@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597 Thank you! I learn a lot from your videos. Really appreciate it.

[@annab1855]

Please stop using the term 'manhours' people 🤦🏻‍♀️ it's cringe

[@chandankumar-kr4vh]

First

[@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597]

Thanks for watching

[@prezadent1]

@@tomthelestaff-iamtimcorey7597 Why do you encourage such childish behavior?

[@IAmTimCorey]

@PowerMad - what does it hurt? They watched the video and they commented. Because they did those two things, they are promoting the video more than just watching it. The more interaction a video gets, the more KZbin shares it around. If something isn't actively hurting you, I don't see why you should complain.

[@chandankumar-kr4vh]

@@prezadent1 its not a childish behavior I have learn a lot from Tim video so i want around my developer should know what real content is

[@prezadent1]

@@chandankumar-kr4vh Wow, that's exactly what I thought you meant by 'first' 🤣

[@saadali5906]

the best thing is to learn java and get away from ms stack ... ms realeases crap web form which even does not look like web framwork even though it was web develooment framework

[@IAmTimCorey]

It sounds like you might have missed an update or 20. WebForms came out about 20 years ago. The web was a bit different then than it is now. Today, we have five web project types (ASP.NET Core Razor Pages, MVC, API, Blazor Server, and Blazor WebAssembly) to address almost any situation you would want. Instead of trying to tear down C# because you like Java, go watch Java videos and support what they are doing. Or, if you want to watch C# videos, do so with an open mind and realize it isn't an "us vs them" with programming languages.

[@saadali5906]

@@IAmTimCorey web form spoils the concepts of web . do you ever see in web form post or get http method ?? ... or how ms implement ajax using script manager update panel and view state ... cannot get worst then this things. where as if you see servlet and jsp how beautifully they implement mvc and do seperations of layers ... where as web form bound tighly to class cs file ... how shitty this thing is because u know only.net c# stuff thats why u argumenting without thinking

[@IAmTimCorey]

I don't think you heard me. Web Forms Is Discontinued! Why are you arguing that a technology that originated 20 years ago is somehow inferior to a newer technology that isn't an equivalent? If you are going to compare jsp's implementation of MVC, why wouldn't you compare it to...ASP.NET MVC? Or better yet, listen when I say that your information is two decades out of date! We now have ASP.NET Core MVC, ASP.NET Core Razor Pages, ASP.NET Core API, Blazor Server, and Blazor WebAssembly to choose from. Teaching moment here: if you want to grow, you need to have an open mind. Willfully ignoring what someone says to argue a bad point identifies you as a fanatic. Software development is about making the best call for your client/company. Fanatics cannot do that because they are unwilling to listen to opposing points of view. Software development isn't a religion. It isn't a war. Stop fighting silly battles. You are holding yourself back and you are endangering your career.