What Pragmatism Means - William James

[@mikebelliston]

Thank you for this! The only video I have seen thus far that gave me somewhat of an understanding of pragmatism!

[@RealNataliaT]

So helpful! I'm reading about activity theory and trying to sort out the links between Dewey and pragmatism etc. Really appreciated both the little doodles, and the images, and the video of bread. So helpful for us visual learners. My takeaway was, even if the meanings are the same practically, the meanings that humans believe in, and the resulting human behaviour might not be the same. Someone who believes there's an evil spirit in the bread won't eat it, or will feel scared if they ate it and possibly become ill (whether or not there's an evil spirit); versus a person who feels comforted by eating the bread with the good spirit in it (whether or not there's a good spirit). So even though the practical outcome on the *bread* is the same, the outcome in terms of human behaviour can be very different.

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Many thanks for the positive remarks about the video! I've always taken James to be equivocal. On the one hand, we might include the psychological effects as part of the practical effects. So, our meaning of "bread" would include the physical effects of bread but also how we behave based on how we understand bread. On the other hand, there is the more Peircean reading of the pragmatic maxim since Peirce seems to assert that the practical effects are those that come from the OBJECT of the idea. To illustrate: (1) there is the idea of "bread" and its effects are the effects that come from the bread and then there is (2) "our beliefs about our idea of bread" and its effects are the various behaviors we have (as you mention at the end of your last sentence).

[@RealNataliaT]

@@LogicPhilosophy Thanks for your reply!! I will look further into this Peircean reading: I think that might be the direction that leads a little more obviously towards the aspects of activity theory I'm interested in. The focus on the mind and the epistemic consequences seem like they might link up with the (2) "our beliefs about our idea of bread" part.

[@LogicPhilosophy]

No problem! I don't know much about activity theory. I have a video on Peirce (The How to Make Our Ideas Clear video) which gives Peirce's view of the pragmatic maxim (at least his view in 1878). There he makes a distinction between our "subjective apprehension of an idea" and the "meaning of the idea itself". It is useful since he says we often confuse the two when we act. Best wishes!

[@cameltube-vk7el]

@@LogicPhilosophy & Natalia, the epistemic [had to look that up] or i.e. "cognitive" peek your taking 1st I will interject a word "manifest [-ing?]" & for a number 2 I toss in "LaCK"......can you see how they work & affect or effect? Also I had no clue of →Activity theory→ Sooo it is a theory in psychology that seeks to understand human behavior by examining the social context of the behavior and the motivations of social or peer pressures on people as they engage in activities. By: pressmaster. Activity theory can be used to develop better approaches to teaching in the classroom, among many other things. [ /;^) ] lol...... Ok the manifest you can get. Also find it working in PLACEBO effect hmmmmmm ??!! The word use of "LaCK" is referring to result of the bread evil or good, humans will eat no matter. As they are "squeezed like a grape" results happen. No matter the past social etc's the results are very much predictable. The human 9 of 10 will eat the bread if hungry no matter if 1000 yrs ago or last week. That is no theory that is fact. These things I just mentioned are used ad nauseam on humans daily....for a long time. Want to believe I contributed to your points Natalia, &\or was clear in my info points ! LoL....... Ok, I am back quiet.....I am a product of my MIC\MIL affiliation history. ANd to be clear the top of those ranks are eViL just so you are clear who is baking the propaganda bread he he...yeah so there is that. Always Forward ~ Godspeed

[@cameltube-vk7el]

@@LogicPhilosophy kind of brain over gut thing maybe yes ??? !!!

[@sujo8678]

and here I am sitting here in 4AM and Stressing about god existing and death. watching you explaining pragmatism allowed me to not care that much about these questions and move on with my life!

[@LogicPhilosophy]

No need to stress so late at night, at least I hope! Glad the video helped!

[@noahmackenzie1956]

I think one idea that is somewhat missed in William James' discussion of the pragmatic method is the practical psychological difference of belief i.e. although the difference between a simulation or a non-simulation being truthful as an idea does not have any practical effect, believing in either idea will have practical difference. For example, if you believe you are living in a simulation, you may be more likely to become a social outcast or go on further logical improbable thoughts or tangents, based of a unjustifiable assumption, one which isn't practically useful. I would say the same of religion in some senses, and I think it would be practically very hard to not go on further tangents or extrapolation of basic religious belief, which disagree with more empirical facts, which is talked about later in the second Lecture in the book.

[@ashsteepingtea]

I'm so glad I kept watching I was wondering what being round the squirrel meant and turns out that's the linguistic error that causes the debate.. language causes a lot of tension lol

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Many thanks for watching. Yes, it all depends upon what we mean by "going round"!

[@alpacino1917]

such a great explanation ..thank u so much

[@musick4288]

Thank you for letting me understand it. I can't comprehend the book at first. I subscribed.

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Glad I could help. Good luck!!!

[@kidmyn]

Just wanted to say this was an awesome video, and it was great listening to your voice. It was very organic and natural and that made it enjoyable to watch. Thank you

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Many thanks. Appreciate the comment! At the end of it, I also had a pizza to eat! Best wishes!

[@carlshoemaker5935]

I was just reminded of the Essay on Radical Empiricism by William James

[@lalgerielibre9519]

A beautiful video

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Many thanks

[@tenda9965]

All I can say is thank you.

[@krumbergify]

Great and very attractive presentation

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Many thanks!

[@raghu_yadav_yt]

Nicely explained. 👍

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Thanks! Appreciate it.

[@liam7765]

The dough example was great, other videos explained it poorly in contrast to this. Solid video!

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Thanks. I appreciate it. Might as well incorporate your pizza making into your online videos. Best wishes!

[@benquinneyiii7941]

Canberra it make money?

[@naomitorres6758]

Great Video! I had to read this for my philosophy class and I did not understand it this helped a lot thank you

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Oh good. Of course, there is much more that could be said about this piece but I'm glad this video could be a useful starting point for you. Good luck and best wishes!

[@jimmyfaulkner1855]

Does William James argue in favour of free will because it is simply pragmatically useful?

[@Erika-id9tn]

okay, - if you believe the world is a simulation or maybe an illusion contrary to the belief the world being a case limited to materia I think james would argue if you're being happier or you do experience the world differently and act according to it- then there is actually a pragmatic differency. James talked a lot about the individual experience and the acts that follows from this.

[@Erika-id9tn]

but yes, if you do believe the world being an illusion and there is no difference in your experience and act because of this - it serves no value.

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Yeah, I agree. Take two people A and B. If A's belief that the world is an illusion leads to A being happier while B's belief that the world is an illusion leads to B being sadder, then there is a practical difference here. The pragmatic effects for James include one's individual experiences (as you mention)!

[@busyfoldingdishes]

thank you for this video

[@LogicPhilosophy]

You're welcome.

[@JimmyDThing]

THanks for this! It's a great book. Here's a question, though. If one group of people believed that bread rose due to good spirits and the other evil, wouldn't the one who thought it was good spirits have the benefits and costs of eating bread and those who believed it was an evil spirit get the benefits and costs of avoiding eating bread?

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Interesting question! The idea here is that if we can explain O with hypothesis X or Y, but X and Y have the same practical effects, then there is no meaningful difference between X and Y. But in your example there would be a meaningful difference between X and Y since each hypothesis would involve additional features, namely with a belief that the bread will harm or help the body.

[@stoplayin21]

@@LogicPhilosophy and regardless of any features or beliefs the bread will still rise?

[@pedram598]

@@stoplayin21 Yes but each would have a different effect on society so I guess there will be a pragmatic difference in this case because I think pragmatists do count societal (and psychological) effects as meaningful ones. James thought the idea of the absolute (God) does have a pragmatic effect on society and personal life as I recall.

[@darknightofthesoul7628]

The problem I have with the pragmatic reasoning is this: consider the notions of whether God exists or God does not exist. According to pragmatism, we look out at the world and ask ourselves if this world changes by having a notion that god exists or having a notion that god does not exist. While it is true the that world has remained constant as we engage in this debate, we cannot know whether this world is exactly this way because god exists, or is exactly this way because god does not exist. We only have one version of this world to examine. The existence of the world in its current state tells us nothing as to whether there is or is not a god. This is far different than asking how one's life might change, depending on whether one believed in god or not.

[@FletcherHillier]

Religion doesn't teach you how to manipulate your environment to produce tangible results, but it does act as a psychological deterrent for the population when it comes to ruining people's lives through immoral behavior. Most people aren't smart enough to grasp complicated philosophies, so it's easier to teach them to fear an all knowing, all seeing God. When used for the purpose of moral enforcement, it is practical for some, while being impractical for others. It becomes impractical when people believe that God will stop someone from hurting people, and fail to act as a result of their belief.

[@darknightofthesoul7628]

Once again, with the matrix example, indeed there is no practical difference TO the world AT THAT MOMENT, when one either believes we live in a matrix or does not believe that. But...to the person holding either belief, THEIR world (their life) will be different because of their belief. One might adopt a flippant, I don't care sort of attitude towards life, why even bother since it's all just a matrix we're trapped inside, whereas another person who does not believe we are living in a matrix, might strive to effect changes in her own life or the lives of others in order to make the world she perceives a better place. So yes, a belief by itself has no practical difference on that momentary state of the world, but if EVERYONE suddenly believed (and acted as though) we are living in a matrix, the world most likely would change. I suppose it would also depend on WHEN this decision became concrete in one's mind that they were living in a matrix. As soon as the belief is adopted, then THEIR world may well change because they may well change it, based on their beliefs. Belief in God might have the very same impact. The world, at this very moment, is not affected by whether one believes or does not believe in God. But over time, as one belief or another take hold, then the world does change - even if there is not actually a god, or there really is a god. My head hurts.

[@mattmarkowicz]

Pragmatically speaking, Joseph Smith helped the world, for some.

[@JM-ty6uq]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems that there is a practical difference between 'simulation' vs 'not simulation' - if the world is a simulation then we may be able to construct an experiment to probe outside, we just don't know about it yet! Which I think is what you were alluding to with the 'unless you wake up' comment?

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Agreed. To be more precise, it would be something like "there is no practical difference between the world being a simulation for which there is no way to probe outside AND a non-simulation"

[@carlshoemaker5935]

It comes down to a quibble over the meaning of words rather than what is verifiably true.

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Yes. That is the sentiment. Of course, even when people are arguing, and they know it has something to do with the meaning of words, their arguments persist. The thought then is that mere definition is not enough, but once the practical consequences of those words are unpacked (what we would expect to see in the world or experience), the quibble is now seen as pointless.

[@carlshoemaker5935]

@@LogicPhilosophy Yes true.

[@cameltube-vk7el]

you know ideas like the "sim in a sim" & many other pearls of thought are found in the "RiCK & MoRTY" cartoons ....I did not get or have that perspective the first time around watching the series. BUT "new information" or TRUTHS came into my wheelhouse, suggesting some things about the creators etc. AND bam boom bam they were all over it & many different topics [some not so pleasant]. I luv the show only now I see a lot more when watching......guess thats one other type of W A K E U P !! ?? p e a c e ~ out

[@LogicPhilosophy]

I still haven't watched that show. Although it has been recommended to me a few times. Is it good?

[@alimohammadi8878]

well done!

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Many thanks!

[@aguiladplata]

Is he wearing glasses so that it is not so obvious that he is reading, but still the notes on the table are seen reflected on his shades?? That would be funny.

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Good observation! I definitely had notes. I'm so forgetful! I remember I tried to read what I wrote verbatim but it sounded completely unnatural, so I just used the notes as reference for what I was going to say. Much respect to people who can write convincing dialogue! I wore the sunglasses because I wear them all the time (I think I have a light sensitivity).

[@rylexautumn3766]

9 👎means 9 people did not understand the premise.

[@parac0sm0naut26]

Is the glass half empty, or half full? Me: Where's the spigot?

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Lol! Yeah, doesn't matter so long as you can get more water!

[@soulofjimi]

You could also Incorporate the “genuine option here... that it must be living, forced and momentous..

[@LogicPhilosophy]

I thought about that, but decided to cut it out as I thought it might add another 5minutes to explain all those terms and James's examples. Also, I've always been a bit puzzled by what James means when he calls an option / choice "momentous". I have a vague idea but being precise about it has always been my problem.

[@soulofjimi]

@@LogicPhilosophy I hear ya! Man, I used to have a fairly succinct way of putting it but it has been so long now that it slips my mind! I absolutely loved James’ philosophy! Especially how he’s write with a hint of satire or sarcasm in how he used terms.. Really like C.S. Peirce

[@soulofjimi]

@@LogicPhilosophy I wanna say that for momentous I pulled a bit from Bergson (Vital force) and whitehead (actual occasion) not a lot of my stuff ever made much sense though...

[@audie9240]

bruh ita verbal flaw?

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Ya, that is the gist.

[@dusty_artichoke]

Thank you, Ethan Hawke. Great video!

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Haha, wait! Who is Ethan Hawke? William James or me?

[@dusty_artichoke]

@@LogicPhilosophy With those sunglasses you kinda look like Ethan Hawke, Before Sunset-era I would say.

[@cameltube-vk7el]

Brother I dig yo style-0-presentation, aLL worked very well for me......NOTE : I think you & I, as in we resonated at 12:15 [not in a GaY WaY] and must admit that I am still experiencing some POST "b-w-w-h-h-h-a-a-h-h h-a-a-h-a-a-a-h-h-hhhhh dam-it-man [I got it 12:15] laughter" spasms of after chuckling as I am typing......thank you for dat'brother !! Although I am unsure as to any legal ramifications for subliminal word insertion &\or fractal idea planting !! ?? IDK, used to be criminal. So there is that /;*) Thanks also for a educational & entertainingly engaging mind theory stimulation exercise in P R A G M A T I S I M William JAmes METHOD as a...... AlwaysForward ~ Godspeed p.s.→ were you & anyone that made it to this p.s. lol aware that→ PRAGMATISM ← is an AMeri-CaN MaDe thingy hmmmmm ?? I did not know until this week, how cool and one of the main attributes of this say vs LOGIC is this pragmatic thing yields to too A C T I O N !! crazy Ameri-CaNS !! p e a c e ~ out

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Glad you liked that little bit at 12:15. A lot of these videos were fun videos made for classes during the pandemic so I tried to add a bit of fun here and there. In some cases, people enjoy those fun parts, in other cases not so much! Pragmatism is sometimes said to be the first original contribution that America has made to philosophy, but the pragmatists often said it was a new name for an old way of thinking. Best wishes!

[@cameltube-vk7el]

@@LogicPhilosophy someone said→ "Nothing new under the sun" ......something like that he he Fun videos really ?? Well I enjoyed & learned. Reminds me of like on the level of that cartoon that explained how a "BiLL" is passed etc. I believe →"Schoolhouse Rock"! ..... ....oh simple days /;^)

[@cameltube-vk7el]

@@LogicPhilosophy what was not to enjoy ?? Wait wait, ok I get it......like the 'social narrative police" or 'correctness whatever.......' So many so sensitive so PROGRAMED rrrrrrrgggggggrgrgrgrgrgrg I am out !! ALso I am 60yr old fyi & for your / a demographic look~see ........what grade level are your classes ?? ...curious ...

[@LogicPhilosophy]

LOL. The video was for a college-level course in philosophy. There were the typical Zoom lectures (again during the pandemic) but I thought the video would be a fun way to introduce the text before diving deeper into the particulars. Students enjoyed the video so criticism came from making it public.

[@cameltube-vk7el]

@@LogicPhilosophy to be clear man, I meant that as a compliment the SHR[SchoolHouseRock] parallel. For me, it worked & I am not a child he he....well a guy & we never really grow up do we he he! Again, I had no clue & now I am learn-edd & laughed. You seem like a proper educator bro, haters going to hate, & lovers luv right !?! AlwaysForward~Godspeed teach !! p.s. Love & Laughter are the best teachers for memory imo

[@danielmeegan6259]

Procedure

[@juanpaoloignacio5251]

UNLESS YOU WAKE UP 😆

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Lol yeah thought I'd throw that in there. 😆

[@Sazi_de_Afrikan]

Man, I love pragmatism!

[@LogicPhilosophy]

Clarifies those ideas through the conceivable practical effects! I don't have any plans on doing videos on Dewey. Maybe you should create some!

[@Sazi_de_Afrikan]

@@LogicPhilosophy 😳I'm too nervous for that haha

[@LogicPhilosophy]

I agree with the idea that nervousness isn't a bad thing. Maybe excessive nervousness, maybe. I've always interpreted some nervousness as a sign that the person cares and is genuine. Excessive confidence as a sign that the person is compensating or trying to sell me something.